The Emerging Case Against Karl Rove

We have our thoughts marshalled on the big WaPo story which leads as follows:

Plame's Identity Marked As Secret
Memo Central to Probe Of Leak Was Written By State Dept. Analyst

By Walter Pincus and Jim VandeHei

A classified State Department memorandum central to a federal leak investigation contained information about CIA officer Valerie Plame in a paragraph marked "(S)" for secret, a clear indication that any Bush administration official who read it should have been aware the information was classified, according to current and former government officials.

Plame -- who is referred to by her married name, Valerie Wilson, in the memo -- is mentioned in the second paragraph of the three-page document, which was written on June 10, 2003, by an analyst in the State Department's Bureau of Intelligence and Research (INR), according to a source who described the memo to The Washington Post.

Quickly:

First, those reporters are two of the Top Guns at the WaPo.

Second, we have argued for years that reporters know a lot more than they are telling us about who is involved, and have begged for MORE HINTS.  Today, tea leaf readers will love this:

Several other administration officials were on the trip to Africa, including senior adviser Dan Bartlett, then-White House spokesman Ari Fleischer and others. Bartlett's attorney has refused to discuss the case, citing requests by the special counsel. Fleischer could not be reached for comment yesterday.

Of all the officials in all the Administrations in all the world to mention by name, why those two?

And finally, the case against Karl - it is outlined in the UPDATE to this earlier post; let me try for a quick summary here [and we are revising on the fly]:

The INR, which is the intelligence arm of the State Department, prepared a memo describing the background to, and findings of, Wilson's trip to Niger.  This memo has become a focus of the investigation because it mentions Ms. Wilson's CIA connection, and was circulating amongst Administration official while Colin Powell and George Bush were on a trip to Africa.

So, key questions - did the memo identify Ms. Wilson as covert, who within the Administration might have seen it directly, and who might have had it described to them?

We care because, in the case of Karl Rove, we all wonder how he learned about Ms. Wilson - his current story, as leaked by his attorney, is that he got it either directly or indirectly from a reporter, but he can't remember who.  Strong stuff.

The WaPo advances the story by telling us that the paragraph mentioning Ms. Wilson is marked "S" for Secret, but it adds that the memo does not explicitly say that Ms. Wilson is covert.  This is Not Good for Karl - he should not be leaking classified info.  And whatever happened to my preferred designation for this type of info, "STFU"?

So, can we connect Karl Rove to the document?  Well, per Newsweek, we see that briefing books were being prepared in Washington to aid the Sunday talk show push-back (see Newsweek, or here):

The book was primarily prepared by her National Security Council staff. It contained classified information—perhaps including all or part of the memo from State. The entire binder was labeled TOP SECRET.

My contention is that the NSC would surely have wanted to see that memo - Condi Rice had been asked about the ambassador's trip to Niger on "Meet The Press" on June 8, and had been woefully ignorant.  Is it a coincidence that the INR memo explaining Wilson's trip was put together on June 10?  Maybe.  But check Ms. Rice's performance in this July 11 press gaggle, where she tells the reporters to ask the CIA about Wilson's trip (and hat tip to Daxman of TPM Cafe).

Rove's e-mail showed he was talking to NSC staffer Hadley about this, Rove was also part of the White House Iraq Group, and Rove is hired to handle political challenges (which this "16 Words" debacle had become).  So we don't lack for reasons to think that the NSC would want this memo, and that Rove would get involved.

Now, Rove's defenders will note (wait, that's me!) that maybe it is something else in that paragraph that attracted the "S" designation - maybe, for example, the paragraphs described a CIA trip to Niger that, as of June 10, was still classified.  Following the publication of Joe Wilson's Op-Ed, which the CIA approved, that trip was no longer secret. 

Several commenters, with experience in handling classified documents (including the estimable Cecil Turner) assure me that (a) covert agents ("NOCs") are not not bandied about casually as in this memo, at least not knowingly; and (b) a classified doc should have an explanatory sheet noting just what component of each sensitive paragraph is, in fact, sensitive.  If her CIA role was not noted as sensitive, someone made a mistake.

So, we have worked our way to the Supreme Court tie-in - original intent matters!  Special Counsel Fitzgerald has surely interviewed the author of the memo to learn just what it was he was attempting to indicate as classified, and whether the info still had that status come July.

Developing...

SPEEDBUMP:  Luskin, Rove's attorney, denies Karl saw or knew about the memo until investigators showed it to him.  Hmm.  Well, that is Luskin talking to us, not Karl talking to the investigators - do you trust Luskin?  Or maybe someone in Hadley's position passed the key tidbits to Karl without describing the memo as such. 

MEDIA CHEAP SHOTS:  The Wall Street Journal is supposed to get the Rove-friendly leaks - what's happening?  Is it safe to turn on Fox?  (Although one might say the WSJ were friendlier than the WaPo.  And maybe we are in a Supreme Court shadow for the bad news.  But shouldn't they wait until Friday?).

And Daniel Okrent of the Times decried the Times "Nor Reported Here" mentality - if a story is neither broken nor advanced by the Times, it didn't happen.

Well, after a week of front-paging Rove-bashers, the Times is silent on the Wall Street Journal revelations.  Silly.

UPDATE:  The Sign Of The "S" - The Captain is on board, wondering just what in that paragraph was classified; MacMind is a skeptic; and the Ace is a bit more nervous than I am.

Lots more reaction at Memeorandum.  I can't say I am finding a lot of insight amongst the usual suspects on the left - Josh Marshall reads the WaPo to us; the sometimes imaginative Kevin Drum is blogging on vacation, and doesn't add much either.

We welcome suggestions for other interesting posts (or use the trackbacks), but right now, we seem to be the World Headquarters for obsessive Plame speculation.

Comments

[Jim E.]

Nice post.

But I still disagree with the "original intent matters!" argument. I'm not sure if you're being sarcastic, but how in the world would the intent of the 'S' matter, unless Rove (or whoever) could prove their own due diligence on the matter before leaking it?

[DW West]

The "Case Against Rove" and a possible case against Libby are only public knowledge because of Matt Cooper and Rove's lawyer. You are right to point in the direction of Fleischer and Bartlett. Other officials from Cheney's office and Rice's NSC office will also surface as possible leakers. Some of them will have seen the June 10 2002 document, and others will have heard about it from those who did see it. You can bet that everyone in Cheney's office saw it - they had access to everything from State, Defense, the CIA, the NSC, every other department plus their own sources.

[Appalled Moderate]

If it can be proved Rove received a copy of that memo, he's in deep trouble. The trouble may be political, rather than legal, but it's trouble nonetheless. And, TM, I think a fair reading of Bush's earlier statement is that someone leaking of "classified" information would be fired.

If it can't be proved that he received the memo, then I'm not sure how this scandal continues.

What bugs me in this - why would the Dick Morris equivalent be getting classified info? The political guy really doesn't need to be knowing this stuff. I think the mistake/treason/ what have you was committed by whoever passed the information to Rove in the first place.

[Slartibartfast]

I think the mistake/treason/ what have you was committed by whoever passed the information to Rove in the first place.

I've been making a case for this possibility for some time now. We won't know for sure until the whole story comes out, methinks, and details are emerging at a snail's pace.

[Walter]

There is a lot of fuss about Rove and hardly a mention of Libby, Cooper's other source. Maybe it is because Libby's lawyer isn't making statements. But we do know that Libby and Rove were communicating by email about this.

When Bartlett and Flescher were travelling with the President in Africa in July 2003, it seems likely that the effort to discredit Wilson was being directed back in Washington by Cheney's office. It's a good bet that Rove got the gist of the June 10 memo from the OVP.

[Lion]

As I remember it from my days with Top Secret clearance, the use of unclassified information in a document (or paragraph) that is classified because of other information does not affect the status of the unclassified information in any way. If, in the course of document discussing the secrets of the neutron bomb I mention that K Avenue is a one-way street, all readers of the document are free to discuss K Avenue to their heart's content. The fact that Valerie's involvement in her husband's trip is mentioned in a paragraph designated Secret tells us nothing unless we know what else is in that paragraph.

[SamAm]

Uh-oh. Is it the "I can't tell the difference between the sensitivity of 'CIA stands for Central Intelligence Agency' and 'Wilson's wife may be a covert operative'" defense? Along with the "I didn't see it or hear of its contents defense before I went to the grand jury, even though I'm the 3rd ranking guy in the White House and even Ari saw it" defense? And the "I heard it from journalists first, but maybe not because I can't remember and it could have been someone I work with" defense?

Rove-a-dope indeed!

[Slartibartfast]

Maybe you should use smaller words, Lion.

[Miller]

Rove doesn't come across as the kind of guy who would need to actually read a memo. He would more likely pick up any useful information in a conversation and proceed to use it. Rove is not a lawyer but a political operative. His boss also is not someone who reads a lot, but relies on verbal reports. Rove engages in hundreds of conversations every day and sometimes forgets where he heard things.

[Tollhouse]

Exactly right Lion. I worked with TS SCI material and the content of that paragraph is what is classified and may not have anything to do with the sentences containing Plame at all. Seems someone is making more assumptions.

The irony here is that someone leaked part of (maybe the whole paragraph?) that paragraph to the Post's reporters and that would be a violation of the law as well.

[PS]

I don't see how this memo changes anything.

The memo contains the same information that we already know could have been gathered from a variety of sources. The problem is still one of connecting the dots between indviduals, and I see see nothing in this memo story that does anything on that front.

[Geek, Esq.]

I've been maintaining for a while that the IIPA was the starting but not ending point of this investigation.

My take on the new developments, trying hard as I can to be fair to Rove & Co:

1. It is unclear whether one could infer from this memo that Valerie Wilson was in fact Joseph Wilson's wife. Probably, but not a certainty without seeing the actual text.

2. As an aside, did Plame go by "Valerie Wilson" inside the agency? If not, why use her married her married name in this context--as a smoke signal to send up the totem pole?

3. The memo does not prove that Plame was a covert agent. It just doesn't. That factual determination will be made without reference to this memo.

4. The entire ballgame, with respect to this memo anyways, is INTENT.

5. As this memo doesn't prove that Plame was a covert agent, it follows that it can't prove that anyone reading it knew she was covert.

6. However, this memo arguably put all readers on notice that Plame and her participation in the matter were sensitive subjects that shouldn't be blurted out to the press.

7. That notice is probably not enough, by itself, to nail anyone on the IIPA charges.

8. However, this memo does provide solid support for an Espionage Act indictment and conviction:
http://www4.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/uscode18/usc_sec_18_00000793----000-.html

Whoever, lawfully having possession of, access to, control over, or being entrusted with any document, writing, code book, signal book, sketch, photograph, photographic negative, blueprint, plan, map, model, instrument, appliance, or note relating to the national defense, or information relating to the national defense which information the possessor has reason to believe could be used to the injury of the United States or to the advantage of any foreign nation, willfully communicates, delivers, transmits or causes to be communicated, delivered, or transmitted or attempts to communicate, deliver, transmit or cause to be communicated, delivered or transmitted the same to any person not entitled to receive it, or willfully retains the same and fails to deliver it on demand to the officer or employee of the United States entitled to receive it; or
(e) Whoever having unauthorized possession of, access to, or control over any document, writing, code book, signal book, sketch, photograph, photographic negative, blueprint, plan, map, model, instrument, appliance, or note relating to the national defense, or information relating to the national defense which information the possessor has reason to believe could be used to the injury of the United States or to the advantage of any foreign nation, willfully communicates, delivers, transmits or causes to be communicated, delivered, or transmitted, or attempts to communicate, deliver, transmit or cause to be communicated, delivered, or transmitted the same to any person not entitled to receive it, or willfully retains the same and fails to deliver it to the officer or employee of the United States entitled to receive it; or
(f) Whoever, being entrusted with or having lawful possession or control of any document, writing, code book, signal book, sketch, photograph, photographic negative, blueprint, plan, map, model, instrument, appliance, note, or information, relating to the national defense,
(1) through gross negligence permits the same to be removed from its proper place of custody or delivered to anyone in violation of his trust, or to be lost, stolen, abstracted, or destroyed, or
(2) having knowledge that the same has been illegally removed from its proper place of custody or delivered to anyone in violation of its trust, or lost, or stolen, abstracted, or destroyed, and fails to make prompt report of such loss, theft, abstraction, or destruction to his superior officer—
Shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than ten years, or both.
(g) If two or more persons conspire to violate any of the foregoing provisions of this section, and one or more of such persons do any act to effect the object of the conspiracy, each of the parties to such conspiracy shall be subject to the punishment provided for the offense which is the object of such conspiracy.

9. Note that the Espionage Act:

a. Covers both people like Scooter Libby (authorized possession) and Rove (unauthorized possession);

b. Addresses potential conspiracies, as a way of getting around a plausible deniability scheme; and

c. Has a much wider scope--anything related to the national defense (Plame's part in the CIA's anti-WMD activities certainly counts;

d. Has a much lower standard for intent--"reason to know"--thus making whatever notice the memo provided much more damaging to the defense.

10. In my opinion, this memo will be most damaging for perjury indictments. Why?

a. As noted above, intent and knowledge were likely to be major hurdles for any prosecution

b. Proving subjective state of mind is not only difficult for the prosecution to prove in cases like this, it is also an extremely easy thing for a defendant to lie about--without mindreaders it's hard to disprove someone when they say what they knew or were thinking at a moment in time

c. I would fully expect that Fitzgerald asked a few folks in the White House very narrow questions designed to elicit their knowledge of Plame's covert status or the sensitivity of the information about her.

d. The WH officials would have two compelling motives to lie and say they had no idea her status was sensitive and the revelation could damage national security:

i. Legally, that would be conceding a major and very hard to prove element of the prosecution's case; and

ii. Politically, it would have been disastrous. Admitting that they leaked information they knew could damage national security, well, that's a big "ouch!"

11. The fact that the material was marked "secret" and involved the names of CIA personnel trying to stop the proliferation of WMD's--something every person reading that memo had to know--would disabuse anyone of the notion that they had no reason to know leaking such information could have national security implications.

[Keith]

It seems as if Bartlett and Fleischer are the likely targets of the probe at this point. They both were on the trip; they both likely saw the memo; they both participated in the response against Wilson; they are likely the people who leaked it to the media and/or Rove.

Rove would seem to be a secondary figure: he never saw the memo or knew of the "secret" classification, and he heard the information secondhand--either from media or from Bartlett and Fleischer. Maybe that's why his lawyer keeps insisting that he isn't a target--he's just a one link in a chain of classified gossip that originated from someone else, and under the limits of the very specific statute, his involvement isnt' worthy of criminal blame.

[overtaxed]

It is becoming more clear why the CIA referred the matter to Justice, and why Fitzgerald has taken the investigation this far. Secret information was made public. The investigation is apparently a few months from being wrapped up, so all we can do is pick up tidbits from anyone close to the investigation who will talk, and weigh that meager information against the informed opinions of Minuteman and many of the commentators from this blog.

[Tollhouse]

The memo supports the narrative that she was a covered person. Most of the info that's been dribbling out has been that she most definitely wasn't but this memo gives a slim reed to hang on for the "she's a covert agent" side, i.e. "She's a covert agent because the paragraph was Secret, and we have some anonymouse quotes from some senior CIA guys that say that covert agent identities are classified (at least ;)) secret."

[SamAm]

Did they have to know she was covert for the IIPA to apply, or just that the government was taking steps to protect her identity? Because it seems to me that anyone who saw the document and would have to have understood her identity was being protected, at the least (same could go for those who heard details without reading the thing itself). And that itself suggests covert status, even if it mentions her as an analyst. Plus, 7 sentences are not that many. This is sentence 5 of this post, for example.

[Tollhouse]

Not only was she supposed to be covert, but Rove had to have authorized access to the info for the IIPA to apply.

[Lamont]

Looking for Rove-friendly leaks? Rove's supporters have a problem because the Grand Jury is meeting in secret. They only know what Rove was asked and what he testified (and maybe the same for other White House staff).

The Rove people won't be able to mount a serious defense until the Special Prosecutor issues a report, or perhaps indictments.

Last Friday's leaks from his legal team didn't do Rove much good. The attacks against Wilson are old news and also don't seem to be very productive. Leaks against Rove will continue and Rove will be entirely on the defensive.

[Keith, Indy]

Much ado about rumors and innuendo.

Until the investigation is done, I wouldn't jump to conclusions. This who-dont-it isn't solvable on publically available clues.

[Keith, Indy]

Leaks against Rove will continue and Rove will be entirely on the defensive.

***********

Yeah, it is so bad, I may not vote for him next election!!!

[Greenwood]

It may be best for the White House that attention stays focused on Rove rather thn spreading to other senior officials. Rove probably doesn't face criminal charges and there is likely little more coming out against him. There are other cans of worms yet to be opened.

[TM]

What bugs me in this - why would the Dick Morris equivalent be getting classified info?

Good question, but - he did send that e-mail to Hadley, the Pres did have a brewing domestic political problem, and Karl was part of the White House Iraq Group:

Systematic coordination began in August, when Chief of Staff Andrew H. Card Jr. formed the White House Iraq Group, or WHIG, to set strategy for each stage of the confrontation with Baghdad. A senior official who participated in its work called it "an internal working group, like many formed for priority issues, to make sure each part of the White House was fulfilling its responsibilities."

...The group met weekly in the Situation Room. Among the regular participants were Karl Rove, the president's senior political adviser; communications strategists Karen Hughes, Mary Matalin and James R. Wilkinson; legislative liaison Nicholas E. Calio; and policy advisers led by Rice and her deputy, Stephen J. Hadley, along with I. Lewis Libby, Cheney's chief of staff.

Next, from Jim E:

But I still disagree with the "original intent matters!" argument. I'm not sure if you're being sarcastic, but how in the world would the intent of the 'S' matter, unless Rove (or whoever) could prove their own due diligence on the matter before leaking it?

Ahh, but if Slart, the Lion, and Cecil Turner are with me, who shall stand against me?

IN the Murray Waas comment thread, someone (Slart) said that a document with marks like "S" also includes a cheat sheet explaining wht it is that is sensitive in each paragraph. Maybe, as of July 7, the "S" was no longer operative - I hypothesized that the fact of a CIA trip to Niger was classified, until Wilson's CIA approved Op-Ed.

In which case, anyone familiar with that doc would know (arguably) that the "S" was (a) gone, and (b) had never applied to the wife anyway.

Am I right? Who knows? But I might be.

[The Unbeliever]

Is merely having her name in a paragraph marked "Secret" enough to infer covert status? What if the paragraph in question read like this:

"We think Sadaam's got uranium stored in Top Secret Site #5. After an investigation instigated by Valerie Wilson, we think that uranium came from Niger. Wilson's husband was sent on the trip. The reason we think it's stored at Site #5 is because our Top Secret Spy Satellite took pictures..."

And so on. Basically, do we know if the paragraph was referencing things that needed to be top secret (such as a spy satellite, a locations, or an informant) in connection with Plame/Wilson's report, instead of referencing Plame in a way that indicates her covert status?

[The Unbeliver]

Aha, I type too slow. TM asked the question 1 minute before me.

[Geek, Esq.]

TM:

This dead horse is getting sick of the beatings, but it's time to look beyond the IIPA/was she covert/did they know she was covert stuff?

I don't think they have the goods for the IIPA indictment--knowledge that she was covert is damn hard to prove.

The operative statute folks ought to be looking at is the Espionage Act, and the standard is "reason to know that it could be used to harm US national security."

Also, doesn't Rove's presence in the WHIG prove once and for all that the Bush administration treats national security and electoral security as the same thing?

[overtaxed]

Could one of you experts about secret/not secret information please answer a simple question?

We have learned that Plame's cover was as an energy consultant for a CIA front company, Brewster-Jennings. Would not her employment at a front company by itself make her status "undercover" or at least "secret"?

Thanks very much. This has been bothering me.

[Seven Machos]

Downing Street Memo. Secret information was made public. Noble-good-proves-Bush-evil-must-get-Rove.

Current en vogue theory of the Left: Bush administration official read INR Memo. Secret information was made public. Craven-awful-proves-Bush-evil-must-get-Rove.

Also, one shiny dime to the first conspiracy-theory-minded person here who can actually explain the difference between the INR and the CIA, and how those two entities interact and gather and disseminate information, and to whom they give it. I will grade your answer liberally.

[Slartibartfast]

IN the Murray Waas comment thread, someone (Slart) said that a document with marks like "S" also includes a cheat sheet explaining wht it is that is sensitive in each paragraph.

Not accurate, but close. Any classified document will have information classified according to guidelines set down by the classifying authority. There may be a classification guide, but at a minimum there will be the equivalent of a DD254. The first thing to do, then, would be to track down the originator of this document and ask them what, in the paragraph portion-marked as Secret, is (or was, at the time of issue) classified. There are other steps, up to and including contacting the agency head whose authority classified that document. What you'd need is the part of the document that contains the stamp containing the "Classified By" and "Declassify On" information.

I suspect that this, too, will be a dead end of information. Unless someone's got a redacted photocopy of the document in question?

[Keith]

Also, doesn't Rove's presence in the WHIG prove once and for all that the Bush administration treats national security and electoral security as the same thing?

Not really. Given Rove's close relationship with the president as one of his key advisors, it makes sense that he would at least participate in these meetings so that he can be aware of what is happening--especially given how huge an issue Iraq was. How could a presidential advisor really "advise" at all if he's in the dark about the centerpiece of an administration's policies? It makes sense for him to be there, especially if the purpose was to "to make sure each part of the White House was fulfilling its responsibilities." It'd be another thing if he was drawing up plans for war or setting the timetable for an invasion, but that didn't happen...

[Seven Machos]

Overtaxed -- Plame's office was inside Langley. There's a Burger King in there. A gift shop. Is there also a small energy company? No.

If you want to be under deep-deep-deep-super-deep cover since 1997, you can't just say you are an energy consultant but show up at faithfully at Langley every day since 1997.

A good analogy in another part of the law is in tax law. To claim a home-business income tax deduction, you have to have a business at home. You need office space, a computer, or art supplies, or whatever. Suppose I tell the IRS that I have a home-business cutting hair. Then, I get audited. I have to produce some evidence that I have any kind of hair-cutting space or equipment at home.

If Plame wants to be under deep-deep-deep-super-deep cover since 1997, she needs to show evidence for it. A 9-to-5 at Langley is no such evidence.

Of course, RICO changes everything...

[Geek, Esq.]

Did Rove have a security clearance in 2003? Was it the same as Libby's?

[Lamont]

Seven, I'll accept the challenge. The INR is the intelligence-gathering bureau within the State Department. The CIA is the primary foreign intelligence-gathering organization (unless you count the NSA which is bigger but mostly involved with intercepts, not human intelligence). And there are about 5 other official intelligence agencies and some unofficial ones.

All of the intelligence goes to Dick Cheney's office. If he doesn't get the intelligence he wants sent to him, he goes directly to the agency to browbeat the analysts. He rarely needs to go himself because he has surrogates - John Bolton was at State, Douglas Feith at Defense, etc.

You don't have to believe me. As the reason the CIA sent Wilson to Niger points out, Cheney was running intelligence on Iraq in February 2002.

Now we have a Director of National Intelligence so Cheney will need to share the oversight of intelligence. That's not a big problem, but Cheney is used to sharing with someone more senior.

[Keith]

So there are reasons to think that the NSC would want this memo, and that Rove would get involved.

Rove apparently denies ever seeing this memo until the prosecutors showed it to him during his testimony. If there is no witness saying, "I saw Karl reading this memo," and if Karl says that he heard the info secondhand, is there any way for the prosecutor to use the "[S]" classification in this memo against him?

In other words, if you can't prove he read it, then Rove becomes just another secondhand source--one who can legitimately say that he never knew that the Plame info was secret.

[Geek, Esq.]

Keith:

"If there is no witness saying, "I saw Karl reading this memo," and if Karl says that he heard the info secondhand, is there any way for the prosecutor to use the "[S]" classification in this memo against him?"

Yes. Welcome to the world of federal conspiracy law. If Libby tells Rove, and Rove tells reporters as part of common and illegal scheme, they're both guilty.

"In other words, if you can't prove he read it, then Rove becomes just another secondhand source--one who can legitimately say that he never knew that the Plame info was secret."

The Espionage Act covers anyone "with reason to know" that leaking the info could damage national security. That's a low bar to hurdle.

[weldon berger]

Thanks for the nod, Tom. Regarding what was classified and what wasn't: the memo was apparently in response to Wilson leaking the info about his trip and his conclusions in the months since the State of the Union speech, so he'd probably be in jail if the trip itself or his thoughts about it were classified before the memo was written.

Since his wife's name seems to have come up most often in connection with how he wound up being selected for the trip, maybe the paragraph mentioned other CIA and intelligence personnel by name as well. Both WSJ stories — here's a link to a copy of the October, 2003 one — say the memo dealt with the meetings prior to the trip, including discussions about who would pick up the tab.

One reason the NYT may not be jumping in on this is that their sources seem to be mostly from the Rove camp, and those will have clammed up to keep him off the front page. I still think the WSJ story was a Rove-friendly leak, and the Washington Post followup was a response from someone on the other side.

Anyway. It's fun to watch.

[Keith]

If Libby tells Rove, and Rove tells reporters as part of common and illegal scheme, they're both guilty.

But if Rove tells reporters what he has heard from other reporters, then he can say he's not really part of a scheme. That may be what he's trying to argue.

The Espionage Act covers anyone "with reason to know" that leaking the info could damage national security.

I have my doubts that Rove would ever be convicted under this statute, given his argument that he heard the info from reporters, didn't know she was covert, and never saw the memo. In other words, if he can cast sufficient doubt that he was part of some grand scheme to leak this vital piece of intelligence, then he can probably dodge conviction.

[Martin]

Plus I don't think Fitzgerald has utilized the newly appoved coercive interrogation techniques yet.

[Geek, Esq.]

Rove's "I heard it from reporters" line has been granted entirely too much respect. It's not credible. The man is known as "Bush's Brain" and was in the WHIG--do people really think that Libby and others would tell Matt Cooper or Robert NoFacts or The Queen of Iraq but not Karl Rove?

Puh-leaze.

Btw, isn't it more than a little fishy that he can't remember which journalist told him? Novak and Cooper both say they heard it from Rove, not the other way around.

[Keith]

Novak and Cooper both say they heard it from Rove, not the other way around.

Novak heard it from another source, then confirmed it from Rove who had "heard that, too." Cooper called Rove after Rove had already talked to Novak, and Rove told him what he by then knew was known by at least one reporter--Novak. It's pretty legitimate to say that, at the point he talked to Cooper, Rove thought the info was known by people outside of top secret circles--casting doubt on how much of a "leak" he was really giving.

[Geek, Esq.]

Not if he and Libby were co-conspirators.

[ArminTamzarian]

Espionage Act? What happened to the "R" word? That theory was too stupid, so now we're moving on to stupider theories?

[Maynard]

Minor correction, Rove actually claims not to know which reporter he FIRST heard it from, rather than not knowing who told him. The implication is that he heard it from several reporters and doesn't recall who told him first. Also, I've yet to read Cooper or Novak claim that Rove outed Ms. Plame to them. They have consistently claimed him as a confirming source for their information however. In fact if you recall Novak specifically called his primary source "no political gunslinger" and if Karl Rove is anything, he definitely IS a political gunslinger. In addition to this, we know that Walter Pincus received specific information on Plame/Wilson prior to Novak or Cooper getting confirmation from Rove. So who told Pincus? And who is Miller protecting by sitting in jail? She never talked to Rove, could she be protecting the same source that talked to Pincus? The source that is probably the ultimate goal of this investigation? A source that will likely turn out to be either in State or the CIA, much as I predicted over a year ago.

[Tollhouse]

As soon as it became apparent that Plame was likely not covert they switched to the Espionage act, which is even more unlikely to bear convictions. The point I think is to just play up the "Bush lied" about firing someone angle since they are out of ammo on the Plame issue. They will claim that the Espionage act was violated, and that no one was prosecuted because Bush protected Rove and it will go down in history as recieved wisdom that Bush was corrupt. Tied up all in a neat narrative to put in a new edition of Howard Zinn's book.

[David]

Long ago I worked on a project that I could access materials that were secret only if I could prove I needed them (pretty low level clearance). What I worked on eventually was put in a document (and my name mentioned) that I would never be able to see. Me being in the document is not relevant to my clearance status. You need to prove that Valerie Wilson by direct evidence not indirect evidence, and if the CIA could prove it, the special prosecutor knows it. I suspect that Judith Miller knows who could get into deep trouble over this and doesn't want that to happen. That being said, I believe that it isn't Karl Rove, she would out him in a heartbeat.

[Geek, Esq.]

Maynard:

You missed the boat on Matt Cooper's testimony:

"So did Rove leak Plame's name to me, or tell me she was covert? No. Was it through my conversation with Rove that I learned for the first time that Wilson's wife worked at the CIA and may have been responsible for sending him? Yes. Did Rove say that she worked at the "agency" on "WMD"? Yes."

Is Libby considered a partisan gun-slinger?

[TexasToast]

Downing Street Memo. Some one gives British journalist internal British government memo in an apparent attempt to discredit WMD justifications for Iraq war. Secret information of the embarrassing kind - the status of the Iraqi WMD program made little difference in our decision to go to war - was made public.

“Noble-good”? I guess that depends on whether one believes revealing facts that tend to discredit the reasons advanced in public for the Iraq war incident to a debate on the war’s merits is a good thing or a bad thing.

Plamegate. Bush administration officials call six reporters in calculated, deliberate attempt to discredit Joe Wilson for daring to embarrass GWB on the “sixteen words”. Secret information of a potentially criminal kind – the identity of a covert insert favorite word for SPY here - was made public.

“Craven-awful”? I guess that depends on whether or not one believes that revealing the ID of intelligence assets incident to political “revenge” is a good thing or a bad thing.

Criminality aside, it seems to me that the President and the PM, respectively, should be upset that secrets are being leaked and would be clearly justified in firing the applicable leakers, if they chose to do so. I suspect that both have political and practical reasons for not firing anyone. However, from the purely ethical perspective suggested by your comment, I’m not having much trouble distinguishing these particular ethical dilemmas.

[Marianne]

Seven writes that Plame needs to prove that she was undercover (in July '03). What good would it do to have her publicly discuss what she has been doing for the CIA these past several years?

Her husband is a grand-stander who doesn't deserve much sympathy, but he has been unfairly criticized in one respect. When he went public with his story in July '03, he could not reveal that his wife was CIA or he would have been the one responsible for outing her. Many of his detracters claim he was dishonest for not pointing that out himself.

[Crank]

Geek - You should keep up with your reading on the Espionage Act. I still think you need to show that Rove or whoever (1) knew Plame was/had recently been covert and/or that her disclosure as CIA would be otherwise harmful to the national defense; and (2) knew they were breaking the law by making that disclosure.

[Tommy V]

Wow, this is complicated.

I wish there was a federal investigation working on this so I could somehow get all the facts at the appropriate time.

[Tollhouse]

Which is what alot of people suspect Marianne, that Wilson used privileged information in his Op Ed to smear the President and he and his wife hoped to hide behind her supposed CIA status to allow him to get away with it.