Toward A Unified Theory Of Hillary Hatred

Jason Zengerle, writing at The Plank, poses this:

                Is a Unified Field Theory of Hillary Hatred Possible?                

...Hillary's obviously a deeply polarizing figure, but is she in some ways helped by the fact that so many people hate her for so many different reasons? I mean, it's hard for a candidate to craft an anti-Hillary message that doesn't wind up alienating a good number of Hillary haters.

Hmm.  Stop Her Now splits the suggested attack themes between the primaries and the general election (if it turns out we have to stop her later.)

I think the generic "You can't believe the words coming out of her mouth" would rally all of her opponents.  And it has the added benefit of being true.

Comments

[Other Tom]

I hate her because her Tradesports number for the nomination remains steady as Gibraltar at 71 cents, right where it was before the debate, before the planted questions, and etc.

Will that do?

[Jane]

Ahhh finally a topic I can really get behind.

How do I hate Hillary? Let me count the ways...

[centralcal]

Oh, goody - a how many ways to hate Hillary contest! I wanna play.

[kim]

Seventy Million Ways to Hate Hillary.
==================================

[Clarice]

Jason was in my son's cub scout troop. I feel it inappropriate to comment.

[kim]

Denmother? Otherwise, fair game.
=========

[Porchlight]

Left and right seem to agree that the media is in the tank for Hillary (though they differ on the reasons why). Challenging her "anointed" status might carry weight with both sides.

[Clarice]

Good point, kim. I wasn't the denmother. The argument he makes is ridiculous.

[MayBee]

It's like The Simpson's Mr. Burns. While he appears perfectly healthy, he is actually so riddled with different illnesses that it all balances out.

Many people hate Hillary, but for so many different reasons you can't sustain a rally against her. I can see it, even if it is ridiculous.

[Ralph L]

The problem with not believing what comes out of her mouth is that most people believe that about most politicians. Years of her husband's mendacity have paved the way for hers.

[dick]

I like the idea of a general purpose reason. In my case the umber of ways approaches infinity. I don't trust her now, I didn't trust either of them before 1992 and I have seen no reason to change my point of view in either case.

[dick]

I like the idea of a general purpose reason. In my case the umber of ways approaches infinity. I don't trust her now, I didn't trust either of them before 1992 and I have seen no reason to change my point of view in either case.

[dick]

I like the idea of a general purpose reason. In my case the umber of ways approaches infinity. I don't trust her now, I didn't trust either of them before 1992 and I have seen no reason to change my point of view in either case.

[Ralph L]

dick manages a triple penetration.
Sorry, couldn't resist.

[Elliott]

The debate should begin shortly. I'm rooting for lots of stumbling.

[Elliott]

Wolf Blitzer tells us we'll have questions from undecided voters. They are bringing the candidates onto the stage one at a time.

[Ann]

Thanks for doing this Elliott. Great pick for the debate site, by the way. :)

[Elliott]

Enter Hillary: "Hello, Wolf. How are you? Good to see you."

The photographers are snapping away and CNN goes to its analysts. Whose idea was this intro?

[Elliott]

Thanks, Ann. I thought it appropriate.

[hit and run]

Three cheers for Elliott!!!!

Plus 2 more!!!

Times 2!!!!

Squared!!!

ONE HUNDRED CHEERS FOR ELLIOTT!!!!

[Elliott]

Now Wolf is going over the rules. First hour questions will be from John Roberts and Campbell Brown.

CB Q1: Hillary wasn't at best. Opponent says. Politics of parsing.

Hillary: Asbestos pantsuit. People have known where I've stood for 35 years on all kinds of issues. I've got specific proposals. It's an important elections and we need a president who's tested and ready to lead. I'll leave it to American people.

Wolf: Obama says Hillary running standard campaign.

Obama: Americans want straight answers to tough questions, which he haven't gotten from Senator Clinton, whose political skills I admire. Two weeks for straight answer on licenses for illegals. Disagreements on social security. People feel Washington isn't listening to them. We need to listen.

Clinton: Obama talks about stepping up. But he doesn't support universal health care, his plan leaves out 15 million. My plan covers everyone. I've been fighting on this for many years. I'll fight the Republicans. I'm tested and ready to lead.

Obama: I provide universal health care. People can't afford health care. That's the problem, not that it's not mandated.

Clinton: Most important thing is to level with the American people (gag). Obama doesn't cover everyone. Everyone will be able to afford health care.

Obama: She wants to mandate coverage, but she isn't garnishing wages. Not enforcing this mandate. Americans shouldn't be forced, they'll buy it if it's affordable.

Edwards: Nobody on stage is perfect. Can we have President who can restore trust? Questions to be asked of all of us. Clinton says end war but keep combat troops. She's voted with Bush-Cheney. She says she won't change social security cap in one venue and says she will in another. She says she'll change corrupt Washington.

Clinton: I respect all of my colleagues on this stage. We're trying to nominate best to win. I don't mind hits on my record, but when people start throwing mud I hope it's accurate and not from Republican playbook. I'm glad Edwards is for universal healthcare now. Need positive agenda for America.

[hit and run]

I do love Biden.

I mean, comparatively.

We are talking about dems.

[Porchlight]

This is pretty lively - the crowd is into it (so far).

Obama and Hillary are standing next to each other and his posture during that first exchange was interesting - he turned almost fully toward her and sort of stared down at her while she answered. I wonder if she'll complain she found him "menacing."

[hit and run]

"Hell no I wouldn't support any of these guys" --Biden

Joking of course.

I love Biden.

[Elliott]

Biden: American people don't care about what's going on up here tonight. Worried about things in their own lives, including whether their sons in the national guard will be killed in Iraq. About action, not experience nor change. Who will end war, who will fix Pakistan and Russia. I've got the experience, passed crime bill, violence against women bill.

JR Q2: Clinton says legitimate to take hits on record but Edwards has changed position (Yucca mountain, Iraq war). Why is it unfair for her to change?

Edwards: Fair to change based on new info. Wrong to say two different things at same time. The question is will America be fine, not who won the debate. 37 million live in poverty, 47 million without health insurance. Who do you believe will take on this corrupt system. This is about what America needs to be.

Blitzer: Dodd says Edwards has changed.

Dodd: Job is to unite party and attract independents to win both branches of government. Shrillness to debate but most Americans just want people who can get the job done. When a campaign is about who's angrier Americans tune out.

Richardson: By the way, I'm Bill Richardson. I'm the governor of New Mexico. Edwards wants class war, Obama wants a generational war, Clinton wants to continue war, I want to give peace a chance. Do our plans resolve the real problems affecting America (jobs, health care, energy). Let's debate the issues and be positive.

Blitzer: Will you support Democratic nominee?

Edwards: Is that a planted question. Yes.

Kucinich: Only if they oppose war as an instrument of policy.

Biden: Hell, no. I wouldn't support any of these guys.

Everyone yes.

CR Q2: Benefits for illegals.

Obama: Bush has done nothing to control problem. Americans justified in being frustrated. Illegals exploited. Comprehensive reform. Border security. Go after employers. Get people out of the shadows, learning English, and to the back of the line so they don't get an advantage.

Blitzer: Support licenses?

Obama: Voted to require illegals to have licenses in Illinois. Problem isn't drivers licenses. Undocumented workers don't come here to drive. Let's solve problem Bush administration has done nothing about.

Blitzer: Support without comprehensive reform?

Obama: I'm not proposing licenses. (Blitzer slams for equivocation).

Edwards: No. Anyone on path should have license.

Dodd: No. Coming here illegally causes serious problems and makes America more attractive.

Obama: Yes.

Clinton: No.

Kucinich: Take issue with "illegal immigrants." They're undocumented. No "illegal human beings." Give people path to legalization and don't criminalize.

Richardson: Yes. I did it. Congress failed, in addition to President. LE told me it's a matter of public safety. (11% of New Mexico drivers are uninsured now according to Richardson). Comprehensive reform.

Biden: No.

[Soylent Red]

Seventy Million Ways to Hate Hillary.

The problem is all inside our heads
It seems to me
The answer is not related
To her biology
Hilly will make it a bigger struggle
To be free

There must be fifty ways
To hate Hillary

But since it’s really not my habit
To be rude
And since she might send out
Some big pipehitting dude
I’ll just restrain myself
While writing this etude.

There must be fifty ways
To hate Hillary

Fifty ways to hate Hillary

CHORUS:
She’s a political hack, Jack
She’s not tough on Iran, Stan
She can’t hang with the boys, Roy
And she’s lying to me
I can’t figure the fuss, Gus
You don’t need to discuss much
She’s dumb as a tree, Lee
And she’s ly-ing tooo me.

[hit and run]

The most minor of points....and understand I haven't watched all the debates...but....

I miss Gravel.

[Porchlight]

Soylent, good work. I agree with all of that, only she ain't dumb. I wish she were.

Biden is good value. I'll be sad when he isn't on the debate stage anymore.

[hit and run]

I must also say, watching Silky Breck Pony Girl, that Rabid Gerbil is an unexpected but not unwanted and certainly not unwarranted addition to his list of names.

It probably won't stick, just as Pink Sapphire did not stick.

But it could, and be as accurate as any other name.

[hit and run]

Do NOT watch Hillary's forehead when she talks. It doesn't move. Unless she REALLY raises her eyebrows.

But don't look at that.

You might miss her hokem.

[Elliott]

JRQ2: Should good teachers get more money?

Dodd: If define excel, by having students do well in good schools in good neighborhoods I'm against it. Education is the most important issue, need best educated generation ever. Should spend more money on education at federal level. NCLB is a disaster and needs reform. I started children's caucus. Early screening legislation. One quarter of population, one hundred percent of our future. Need a debate on education alone.

Blitzer: Disagreements with unions, Dennis?

Kucinich: Union movement essential to upholding human rights. Renegotiating trade deals will improve working standards for workers in all countries. Only candidate from the working class. Don't want to drill in Alaska, unlike Teamsters.

Richardson: I want to be the education president. $40,000 minimum wage for teachers. Pre-school for everyone. Full day kindergarten. Better science, arts education. Help reduce burden of student loans (national service scheme).

Blitzer: Merit pay, Senator Clinton?

Clinton: I support school based merit pay. Need to get teachers to go into under-served rural and urban areas. Students each year have multiple teachers. Weed out the teachers who are doing a bad job. Our education system has served us well but need to re-imagine it in 21st century. Need to figure this out with teachers at the table.

Biden: My wife, the teacher, earned two master's degrees. Who decides on merit. More continuing education, more after school participation. Salaries for teachers lower here than in other countries. 30 billion dollar plan.

CBQ3: Pakistan.

Biden: I spoke to Musharraf and Bhutto before the president did. I told him to take off his uniform. I have a detailed plan on Iraq. Increase economic aid. (I got interrupted so I didn't get it all).

Blitzer: Cut off military aid to Pakistan? Bhutto says that might undermine US national security. Can it get worse?

Richardson: We forgot our principles. We said security is more important than human rights. I would make aid conditional on restoration of constitution, elections, supreme court. Better job rooting out terrorists. Islamic parties get 15% of the vote. Moderate forces can win.

Blitzer: Human rights more important than American national security at times?

Richardson: Yes. Show world it's not just about what Halliburton wants in Iraq.

Edwards: Control extremists in northwest Pakistan. Elections. Control nuclear weapons. Ad hoc policy on dealing with nuclear weapons will not work long term. Rid the world of nuclear weapons.

Obama: Human rights and national security complementary, not contradictory. Democracy in Pakistan will strengthen America's fight against terrorism. I will ensure that nukes don't fall into hands of extremists. Shouldn't prop-up tyrants.

Dodd: Bush is telling Turks not to invade, and Musharraf to restore constitution. How ironic! National security more important than human rights. President uphold constitution. Extremists would win. Shouldn't condition aid.

Clinton: Agrees with Dodd that most important thing is to protect and defend US. Having democratic societies helps US. But, Bush has failed in Pakistan and we're all suffering. White House didn't send the high level envoy I wanted earlier this year.

[RichatUF]

The Kook spoke-our problems in Pakistan started after the Iraq War. Riight-do the democrats think we are idiots [maybe drunk]?

[hit and run]

Do not compare Obama's ears vs Kucinich's ears.

For the love of all that is good and decent, do NOT miss out on the claptrap.

[Soylent Red]

Holy smokes...

Is Dennis Kucinich a Jim Henson creation?

[hit and run]

Rich:
[maybe drunk]?

Maybe? MAYBE?

Are you questioning my drunkeness????

Listen. There are lines that should not be crossed. It is a thin, but well-defined line.

Tread carefully.

[Elliott]

JRQ3: Is troop increase bringing security to Iraq?

Richardson: One American death is too much. Surge isn't working. 65% of Iraqi's say it's okay to shoot an American soldier. Physical and mental wounds for our troops. We need to get political compromise. Arab-Muslim peacekeeping force. Donor conference. $500 billion on war should have been used here in America.

Blitzer: Is surge working?

Kucinich: Occupation is fueling the insurgency. Bring troops home now. Shouldn't give Bush more money. Our aggression against Iraq is destabilizing Islamic countries like Pakistan.

Obama: There is no doubt that more troops in Iraq are doing a magnificent job and succeeding in certain neighborhoods. But, no political solution so we're failing. Withdraw and talk to our enemies like Syria and Iran. 3-4 tours of duties, highest casualty levels in both Iraq and Afghanistan this year. I'll end it.

CBQ4: Chinese toys. Are people who voted trade agreements culpable?

Kucinich: Yes. Same with Iraq, Yucca mountain. China doesn't have unions, workers rights. Edwards voted for China trade. A trial lawyer should have known better.

Edwards; America's trade policy has been a complete disaster. Powerful, corporate interests have taken over the government. Good example is the failure to pass universal healthcare in
'93, while NAFTA passed. Don't replace corporate Republicans with corporate Democrats. Shouldn't allow China to operate unfettered. Hold them to WTO obligations.

Blitzer: NAFTA debates. Was Ross Perot right?

Clinton: All I can remember from is the charts. All that is a vague memory. Need sensible trade policy. Giving worker and consumers rights around the world. Need third party investigatory agency in China.

Blitzer: NAFTA mistake?

Clinton: Mistake to the extent that it didn't work out as we had hoped. "Trade Timeout" as President and enforce labor and environmental obligations.

Dood: Global economy, need to expand markets. Should have had moratorium on Chinese trade.

Obama: Vote for trade agreement with Peru since it has labor and environmental agreements. Opposed to CAFTA. Japan has food inspectors in China. Why doesn't US do that? Should have reviewed China's WTO membership every year.

Biden: President won't enforce the law. We have power under the WTO agreement.

[hit and run]

Soylent:
Is Dennis Kucinich a Jim Henson creation?

Oh, you are BEGGING for it....

B-E-G-G-I-N-G

[Jane]

Okay, I'm back. what did I miss? Can I join in?

[Rick Ballard]

"Is Dennis Kucinich a Jim Henson creation?"

Henson's work was much more realistic. A quick recall of Kermit and Miss Piggy squelches that question.

Great lyrics.

[clarice]

Hi-Jane--It started with a kickline or something! What color is Hillary wearing tonight?

[hit and run]

From the Elliott liveblog:
Blitzer: NAFTA debates. Was Ross Perot right?

I. Have. Been. Vindicated.

More ears to compare!!!!!

[hit and run]

Hit mute. That's what I did.

[Jane]

Oh now Hillary is competing in the old boys club, and we go into the triangulation while Hillary smiles. Hillary demands she is not playing at anything. She is playing at EVERYTHING. Absolutely EVERYTHING. And she feels comfortable in the kitchen and she can laugh at everything and they are so diverse and it's all to her credit, and the cheers are deafening.

What did you mean when you referred to the "boys club"

From time to time there have been some impediments. She's the best qualified and the audience is completely stacked with Hillary supporters. Gross.

[Jane]

Is Hillary playing the gender card?

Gawd yes, but the candidates won't admit that because they never ever ever say anything that is true.

Edwards is not part of the system.

My gawd is this audience stacked with Hillary supporters. Who did Bill pardon to get that?

[Elliott]

JRQ4: Where store nuclear waste?

Obama: Not fair to send it to Nevade, which isn't producing it. Need to store it with sound science. Nuclear power should be part of energy mix. Cap greenhouse gasses. Fine polluters, clean coal technology.

Blitzer asks where he should store it given technology isn't where Obama is hoping it will be yet. Obama says Blitzer is too negative with all his questions about "assuming this can't happen." Obama is running for President because he believes we can do things.

Richardson: Future is renewable. Energy revolution to shift to renewable sources. Sacrifice from American people.

CBQ5: Are you exploiting gender, Senator Clinton.

Clinton: Not trying to play gender card, trying to play winning card. Attacked because I'm ahead. If can't stand heat, get out of kitchen. I like it in the kitchen. Look how diverse our field is. I'm proud to be running to be first female president. Impediments for women, from time to time. Has been progress. Not running because I'm a woman, but I am inspiring people.

Edwards; Every candidate should be held to the same standard. Good people running, we need a strong candidate. There are differences and voters are entitled to know what they are. Need to give better lives to our children. Clinton is the candidate of the lobbyists.

Up next: Voter questions.

[Jane]

Clarice,

I think she is in gold and black checks. I really haven;t looked because I just had dinner.

[Ann]

Jane,

How did auntie like the boyfriend?

You didn't miss much, except the best part of the debate is Soylent Red and Hit are here!

[Elliott]

Hit and Run:

I repeat, kalliplokamos.

[Jane]

Kucinich and Dodd embrace. What's that about?

[Jane]

The boyfriend is still here and really quite fabulous. Best one so far. Long story.