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July 08, 2008

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BR

Larwyn, Yeoman's work! Wow!

PS - Don't be disappointed if Geraghty chickens out like he did during CBSgate when he and I shared proof of DNC/McAuliffe having the exact wording of the CBSgate fake docs BEFORE the show aired.

Your actions alone are causing wide ripples.

Helen

Charlie (Colorado) re: "What Mr Obama failed to mention is that Europeans require people who work in their countries to speak the language of that country."
"Uh, Helen, that doesn't correspond to my experience when I lived in Europe."

Well, Charlie I can only speak from my eighteen years there, 1987-2005. Did you work for a European or an american firm?

centralcal

Larwyn: I saw links to Cary and Feldman on Powerline this morning! Good work!

Charlie (Colorado)

Well, Charlie I can only speak from my eighteen years there, 1987-2005. Did you work for a European or an american firm?

German Government; what do you mean by "require to speak"? Among other things, they didn't require me to speak German when I moved there.

clarice

Larwyn--I forgot to ask, what's your cut for the p.r. work? (Smooches)

K T Cat

So just what was the point of all our hard work to become the world's only economic and military super power if we have to kneel down before the gardeners and maids and learn their language? I mean seriously, do you suppose the illegals are all hoping to someday be able to talk to us in Spanish? Heck no, the ones with gumption and ambition are all learning English. And why in the world would we learn Spanish instead of Japanese, Chinese or Hindi? Good jobs at good wages aren't exactly coming from working with Mexico.

Obama is an idiot. He's a one man gaffe machine. The longer the campaign goes on, the worse he sounds. His campaign manager ought to just have him recycle his thunderous "Yes we can!" speeches and lay off anything that requires him to connect the deeper parts of his experience-starved brain to his vocal cords.

Extraneus

Wasn't the entire Obama statement simply a double pander, first to the Hispanic vote, and then to the Europeans, who love him so? I don't think we should take it seriously otherwise, except as a recital of yet another negative American stereotype, as JM Hanes noted.

He really doesn't seem to like us very much.

Pofarmer

He really doesn't seem to like us very much.

Which of course begs the question.

Why does he want to be our President?

Daddy

Seems to me that what Obama ultimately wants is for European's to like us. Not gonna' happen through crash language courses or anything else than just being American and proud of it.

Sue

He really doesn't seem to like us very much.

He is embarrassed. His wife is proud of us for the first time. I see a pattern

JFP

Jim C: "But where can you learn Arabic without being indoctrinated in a whitewash of Islam? From Christian immigrants from the Middle East?"

I've spent the last three years learning Arabic. I tried to learn it on my own the first year, because of worries about the very problem you mentioned. Unfortunately, the self-learning materials are rather poor (except for Pimsleur, and they don't go far enough for one to become proficient).

So, I broke down and took a class, and I got lucky. My instructor is a very domineering Palestinian woman who fortunately is mostly interested in teaching the language and not indoctrinating us. I've heard that the Middlebury immersion is filled with indoctrination, so I refuse to sign up. Plus they teach the formal language, for which immersion is pointless since no one uses it for conversation.

I also took a month-long class in Cairo which was solely devoted to learning Arabic.

So, it is possible to avoid indoctrination, but maybe try to get some info on the instructor before you sign up.

Rob

I went to college in Europe for a while and have travelled a bit. My ok German gets me around and some compliments from the locals but:

1. My friends in Germany laugh at me because their perfect American English is 1000% better than my semi-fluent German.

2. Based on current demographic patterns their might not be many German speakers left in 50 years.

3. Maybe we should start the kids on Arabic at age 5 so they will be able to read the fatawhs better in our new multicultural paradise.

Neo

Obama goes outside the US and decries US citizens lack of language education.

It's no wonder when education reform in the US, like the Chicago Annenberg Challenge, is such a failure.

Elliott

What could be worse than the ANWR protection battalion? I think I will find out anon:

The Saracen Song (Or the Mosilem song, if you prefer adding an extra syllable; it is of course, a parody of this classic)

Saracen: I'm a Saracen and I'm okay.
I sleep all night and I pray each day.

Religion of Peace Corps: He's a Saracen and he's okay.
He sleeps all night and he prays each day.

Saracen: I wash my feet. I don't eat pork.
I frown on usury.
On Fridays, I take my shoes off
and hear the Imam preach.

ROPC: He washes his feet. He doesn't eat pork.
He frowns on usury.
On Fridays he takes his shoes off
and hears the Imam preach.
He's a Saracen and he's okay.
He sleeps all night and he prays each day.

Saracen: I abhor free speech, and infidels.
I'd like to blow up cars.
I'd put on my sister's burqa,
And flee to Peshawar.

ROPC: He abhors free speech, and infidels.
He'd like to blow up cars.
He'd put on his sister's burqa,
And flee to Peshawar?!

Saracen: I abhor free speech. I detest the West,
and enemies of ummah.
I wished to be a martyr,
'til Allah willed H1 visas.

ROPC: He abhors free speech. He detests the West,
and enemies of ummah.
He wished to be a martyr,
'til Allah willed H1 visas.

Sister: What's this? Wishes he'd been a martyr? Oh, my!
And I thought you were so dedicated! Poser!

ROPC: He's a Saracen and he's okay.
He sleeps all night and he prays each day.
He's a Saracen and he's okay.
He sleeps all night and he prays each day.

Porchlight

Elliott,

Your superiors in the ANWR Protection Battalion think you should be very very careful with your clever parodies or Obama might throw you under this bus.

clarice

Heh, Elliott.
bgates I missed your first two posts which had me LOL.

Elliott

That was not an Obama parody, as far as I know.

Porchlight

LOL Elliott. Very clever. You better watch out, you are skating a thin line, buddy.

Jane

Why does he want to be our President?

To make us in his own image of course...

Neo

When did Obama do work for ACORN ?

The brother, Dale Rathke, embezzled nearly $1 million from Acorn and affiliated charitable organizations in 1999 and 2000, Acorn officials said, but a small group of executives decided to keep the information from almost all of the group’s board members and not to alert law enforcement.
ACORN must be using the old Catholic Church "crisis management" manual.
After Points of Light noticed financial irregularities in early June, it took less than a month for management to alert federal prosecutors ..

Clearly, "Points of Light" are working from the new Catholic Church "crisis management" manual.

Headless

You know, it's embarrassing when a 46-year old man speaks with a Valley Girl verbal tic. Let alone a major party presidential candidate with this habit. Right?

Helen

Charlie C, German government, me too, the theater system. All meetings, correspondence, publicity, resumes, interviews, auditions, union literature, Dramaturgie, and contracts were in German with no translations provided. Socially, speaking another language in the Kantine where others in the group were german was considered rude. One on one with co-linguists was naturally O.K. but all work results were translated.
I spoke very little german when I started but was up and running within six months, heavily encouraged by the necessity of communicating with my co-workers.

Eon Energy (for which a good friend of mine works) headhunted in America for skills unavailable on heretofore nationalized German market but paid for private total immersion lessons for the recruits and their spouses. The office language was/is german, even when my friend was still halting.

If there are little to no accomodations for foreign language in the workplace, I'd call it a requirement to speak the native tongue.

Now I have heard from a cop friend that foreigners charged with a crime have a right to a courtroom translator, but since they never caught me :) I've no personal knowledge of that.

What was your experience with them? Not a crack, I'm really curious as it seems so different from mine. Did your work entail a liason between Germany and foreign governments, or did you work internally? Were you there specifically to give an American point of view? Were you working in a field in which english is the technical language?

Ben (The Tiger)

I'll bite on the bonus:

"... as the rest of us rubes do." = correct ("rest" is the simple subject, "us" is the object of the preposition "of".)

"... as the rest of we rubes do." = incorrect, and a good way to find the sorts of idiots who say things like "between you and I" in an effort to show that they speak better English than their peers.

Neo

Speaking of Europe ..

Let’s not forget how Europe does wars.

Usually we wait and wait until the enemy starts attacking, then we let them win a bit, then we fight until we are tired, then we just call the US to come over to clean our mess.

That is what happened in WWI, WWII, and the Balkans.

Does this strategy, as applied to Iraq, sound vaguely familiar of any group in the United States ? They usually want the "mythical UN force" to replace the US.

Charlie (Colorado)

Aha. Different connotation of "require". Mine was exactly the same: my lease was in German, we mostly spoke German in the office, and they made accommodations for me by having someone translate the hard parts (for the first six months they were all hard parts.) And sure enough, in six months, I could talk about anything, at least with a couple of Schnäpsle. It helped that I was living in Sudbaden, where people mostly took French in school instead of English, so at least out of the office it was speak German or starve. It also helped that I'm a geek, so in the office a lot of the important words were English loan-words anyway.

I misunderstood you to mean "required" as in "it's a legal requirement to get work."

James Thompson

A true conservative would know, without a thought, that knowing another language is the mark of an educated, worldly person.

Of course, today's Republicans aren't true conservatives. They are angry rubes. And proud of it. Which explains the triple "heh indeed" endorsement from the chief yokel himself, Instarube.

Charlie (Colorado)

Ben, I agree with you" "us rubes", the pronoun is in the objective case. Cf "Rubes are us" vs. "Rubes are we."

Speaking of learning languages, I never caught on to any of this stuff until I started learning German. You just can't figure out the difference between "hatte" and "hätte" if you don't know what the subjunctive is in English either.

I"Ah'm frum Col'r'do, ma'am. We don't do the subjunctive mood here.")

Charlie (Colorado)

Of course, today's Republicans aren't true conservatives. They are angry rubes. And proud of it. Which explains the triple "heh indeed" endorsement from the chief yokel himself, Instarube.

Of course, in this very thread we've noted people like Helen and me, who speak German; several speaking various Romance languages; Mandarin Chinese, and Sanskrit.

One might infer two things: we don't necessarily think speaking another language is a bad thing; and we can tell an asshole when we see one.


James Thompson

I am proudly an asshole, especially toward rubes.

Sorry, Charlie, but try again. There is absolutely nothing controversial in Obama's remarks. If you think there is, you are either profoundly stupid or mentally ill. Under no circumstances would anyone consider you or any of the other rubes here "conservative."

Look, I am stating the obvious. You guys are some tiny percentage of the 28%ers. You're angry, upset, completely marginalized. Time to pack it in.

Jane

I am proudly an asshole

Self-reflection is encouraged. Good for you!

Barney Frank

A true conservative would know, without a thought

Actually it is libs know things without thinking.

As for this angry rube; seems to me the whole world is learning English. They're coming to us. If so, why waste my time learning a language that's probably going to croak anyway when I could spend that time doing something fun and productive, rather than tedious and unfathomably boring. There are certainly very good reasons for learning second and third languages, however I suspect the most common reason is to look suave in a restuarant or on vacation. Being an angry rube I have little concern over looking suave.

clarice

True conservatives have read theconstitution , James, and know that pre k-12 curriculum setting is not one of the powers or responsibilities of the chief executive.

Andie

Sorry, one or two people stood up for the Chinese, but there has to be more response to this:

"So why do we as a country not impose a requirement to learn Chinese"

Because there are less interesting things to do with a knowledge on Chinese. There are more interesting authors on French, Spanish, German and Italian. And there is also less magazines and news to read.

There are many reasons that Chinese is not required in the US, but "less interesting things to do with knowledge in Chinese" and a point to literature and news? Interest is highly subjective and often correlated with exposure. The US descends from European culture with more recent exposure to Asian and for the early decades that exposure was highly negative; think Yellow Peril and a number of anti-Asian policies in place.

China has one of the oldest continuous writing traditions in the world. If only for that unbroken thread, Chinese writings and literature is of interest to humanity.

So let's take a more literate stab at why Chinese isn't a higher American priority whether by govt mandate or not:

1) Business is getting done as is. Without paying much attention to Chinese, a lot of business is being carried out between China and the US. Chinese immigrants and their children are making the most of their linguistic capital and putting it to work.

2) From the China-side, there are hundred of millions of potential English speakers. You can scrape off your top 1% who speak English very well and have them facilitate business transactions. As many have noted, for China, it is obvious that they need a cadre of well-trained English speakers. And they don't have an ever present influx of English speaking immigrants. For the US, what language should be train people in?

3) There are several layers of social and psychological barriers:
a) past Sino-American history
b) the perception that Chinese is hard-- literacy is much harder than oral fluency
c) the degree of cultural difference between the "average Chinese citizen" vs the "average American citizen" as opposed to a European v American comparison

I'm not surprised that Chinese isn't being learned by more Americans, but I am surprised that anyone would think it has to do with Chinese literature or lack thereof.

Helen

Charlie in C : Ah, Baden! 2 years in Freiburg in Breisgau - gorgeous country, friendly people, exquisite cuisine, divine wine, almost unintelligible local accent. When the firemarshall spoke to us for 45 minutes without a consonant, I thought, "Well, if this place catches fire I'm just gonna die then." Hope you enjoyed it as much as I did. The area, not the potential for fiery death.

P.S. Would it not be as it were (triple axel subjunctive!) "Us'n rubes"?

P.P.S. Mr Thompson, wouldn't a truly educated, worldly person know that imposing your language on another country is the mark of a conqueror? Isn't that how spanish (and french, english and portuguese) got to the New World in the first place? Why did all the children in the East Bloc learn russian in school? (Yes, and the Wessies, english) Learning a foreign language is a good thing, but having to divide precious education dollars into a "separate but equal" school system when immersion would eliminate the gap is nonsense.

clarice

Hmm..is the proper construction "we rubes"---graphed as-- we [understood:who are] rubes...?

Barney Frank

clarice,

Since we're rubes wouldn't it be graphed as
we [understood:be] rubes...?

Sue

A true conservative would know, without a thought, that knowing another language is the mark of an educated, worldly person.

So, what you are saying is we are angry and clinging to our guns and Bibles? Now, where on earth have we heard that before?

James Thompson

Helen,

You are ignoring the purely practical aspects of this, which Obama was emphasizing. If I had a chance to do it all over again, I would learn Spanish or Chinese if I were interested in furthering my career. I studied French and Spanish to support my intellectual interests. Either way, it's what a sensible, educated person would do.

I say again--this is not a controversy, except among rubes. Virtually every American kid going into a decent high school is pushing to take Spanish or Chinese. French is still in the mix, German less so.

The knee-jerk, jingoistic reactions here are reflective of how marginalized you people are. Why don't you all just move to, say, Kansas--where they already don't believe in science--and you can add your non-belief in foreign language education to the list.

Take it one step further and then secede. We don't need you. The America of the very near future will be full of leaders who have a global mindset, for business and all other matters. (The global nature of business alone is reason enough. If you don't think so, you are truly, absolutely, amazingly clueless.) Seriously, take your bizarre, ill-formed ideas and secede. You rubes can eat dust for all I care. The rest of us are joining the 21st century.

clarice

[understood:are] no?

clarice

It's no we'be..it's we're.

glasater

Did someone every answer Neo's question on what Stierscheißekünstler means? May have missed that one.
The only thing I remember of my grandparents german is that one can pile up nouns like crazy:-)

And....Uh, oh,---Did James get a new computer and the spectre of eight nine is rearing its head once again?.........

Jane

Stand up everyone, a member of the liberal elite has stopped by. He is going to tell us what's wrong with us. Thank goodness!

James Thompson

Oh, and Clarice, I would eliminate federal money for education in a heartbeat. I live in a blue state, where the education is excellent. I don't want it watered down by, for example, Kansas' demand that science not be taught. Keep your money and invest it in your schools of tire changing and Walmart greeting. Back here in civilization, we are educating children for the 21st century.

Do a little research and you will find that only a few select blue states do as well as countries like Japan and Singapore in math and science education. So, by all means, I will take my federal money back and not share it with the rubes.

Fen

They are angry rubes. And proud of it. Which explains the triple "heh indeed" endorsement from the chief yokel himself, Instarube.

Isn't it telling that the best argument an "enlightened" and "sophisticated" Lefty can come back with is ad hominem? Maybe you should learn a few more languages...

clarice

Dear James, that is exactly why education is left to local communities--each decides for themselves what the curriculum should be, who should teach it, etc.
If the parents of NYC want to spend money teaching their kids how to put condoms on cucumbers and the parents of Tennessee would prefer to spend that time on math, than so it should be.

glasater

........only a few select blue states do as well as countries like Japan and Singapore in math.....

I don't believe that carp for one second.

Sources James?

Sue

Isn't it telling that the best argument an "enlightened" and "sophisticated" Lefty can come back with is ad hominem?

Triple heh indeed.

James Thompson

Oh, and a point you rubes likely don't know or ignore, but the blue states subsidize the red states. Again, train your tire changers on your own dime, and I will keep my tax dollars.

Sue

and I will keep my tax dollars

Great news! You're voting for McCain!

bad

Deer Jimmy Tom,

Golly, you bee a site fer sor ayes. I ben serchin fer inlitemint and ya gone and dun provid hit. Thnky kinly for takin note of ma jingos butt usens dont ushally talk in mixt compny bout em. Ass for seaseedin, thanky again fer yer thawts butt im agona kepe plantin in the erth the way the Good Book sez.

yall cum bak now

clarice

I live in D.C.--talk about living off the fat of the land. I just saw a pamphlet comparing US metro areas..we are rolling in your dough--unemployment in the DC metro area is the lowest in the nation (3.3%)..and our schools are the best (of course, that's because everyone in Congress sends their kids to private schools here which are expanding like topsy and our suburban schools, like Fairfax County's Thomas Jefferson are very good).
So, tell us, James, what high level work do you do? Nanotechnology..? Let me guess, area studies at some university or college.

Barney Frank

Seems to me the only rube here who is angry is little Jimmy.

James Thompson

Poor glasater, covering her ears and declaring "I can't hear you."

http://www.air.org/news/pr/8thGrader.aspx

My memory was slightly faulty. I said select blue states, but actually Massachusetts is the only one on a par with the best foreign countries in mathematics.

Luckily for me, I live there and send my children to school there. Their math skills are excellent.

So, again, by all means, rubes, keep your tax pennies and invest them in hair dressing schools. We will keep our tax dollars and invest them wisely.

Oh, and glasater, be a grownup and do your own googling next time.

Sue

Y'all be nice to Jimmy Tom. He's voting for McCain in November.

Sue

Yep, ole 89 can't help himself. Heeee's baaack!

clarice

Bingo--Massachusetts home of J F***kin Kerry, The Driver Kennedy and the genius Patrick Deval.

Oh, yoohoo, Jane--here's a neighbor I know you want to meet.

James Thompson

Wow, Clarice takes a wild stab in the dark and misses wildly. I work in software development.

I had to google area studies to even know what it is.

I suppose your IQ of 87 took my remark about the global nature of business and turned that into "he must work in area studies." Wow. What bizarre, jingoistic, defensive--indeed, paranoid--reactions.

Once again, I am being very practical and obvious here Clarice. My company, a US manufacturer of software, translates the software interface, documentation, and supporting web content into 16 languages. We make more than 50% of our money through exports, which is just about the average for US companies today. (You and the lame glasater can google this too, I am not doing your homework for you.)

This is very simple and practical folks. Talk to anyone on Wall Street and ask them the makeup of US manufacturing and they will tell you these same obvious facts. Business is global. Global success requires a global outlook. Knowing a major global language like Spanish or Chinese is a practical advantage.

The only question is, why does this upset you so?

James Thompson

Ha, poor Clarice, ripping Massachusetts in another kneejerk, paranoid reaction.

Yes, and Massachusetts, home to the second highest standard of living in the nation (second to CT), and home to students who outperform red state students by a country mile.

Sucks to be you.

Seriously, Clarice, let's get together and petition the federal government to abandon federal funding of education. Please keep your pennies. Please, please, please.

clarice

I'm keeping YOUR pennies. Remember, I'm in D.C.
Does Mass still have high tech companies? Astonishing that such smart folks haven't all fled to N H.

kim

Please don't put James Thompson in charge of my re-education camp.
======================

kim

Please don't let either of us near the tire machine.
============================

glenda waggoner

Centralcal-clarice-jane,sue,glaster-Nostravi! Will try to ignore the socialist
snob AKA James!

Helen

Frankly, if I were to go for a fifth language, (didn't tell you everything, did I?) it would be spanish because I'd like to be able to communicate with the monolingual rubes south of the border and see what all that costumed screaming on my cable TV is about.

But I see no point in continuing to attempt to communicate with Jackie One Notes on the internet. Blue good, red bad - got it. BTW, did you know that in the rest of the worldly, educated West the color emblem of conservative parties is blue/black, (yellow for the libertarian, green for well, duh the enviro-greenies, brown for fascists) and red for social democrats & communists? Trust the rubes at ABC/NBC/CNN/CBS to get it backwards, huh?

I've been reading & enjoying this blog for some years now, most of you are a delight. Back to lurking.

PS Stier= bull, Scheiße = sh•t, Künstler= artist It's not a phrase they use. "Quatch" seems to cover BS with an extra measure of "nonsense" thrown in. (G rated) "Quatch mit Soße" is BS with gravy -see Jack Rubie above.

Barney Frank

Jimmy is smart and honest like all enlightened and sophisitcated and polite liberals.
He's so smart and honest that he forgot to mention that in the link he provided Massachusets is only on a par with Japan but trails four other Asian nations in math. He also forgot to mention that Montana and North and South Dakota like Massachusets only trail students in Singapore and Taiwan in science. Of course the rube/scientists in those three states also score siginifcantly higher on tire changing and hair dressing tests than both Mass and the Asian tigers so we're left to wonder who the real multi tasking brains are, aren't we?

bad

deer jimmy tom

I be ever so preshativ of yer innerest an the like but im awarnin ya ta cleen up yer talk in frunta the latys. noids aint no subjec fer brawd daylite. an honey iffen ya jes tone down yer owtfits a tuch ya can be les obveus.

Ben (The Tiger)

Charlie -- high school Latin did it for me. My earlier French classes involved a lot of teachers ranting about the "le subjonctif" and making not a bit of an impression on my thick skull.

College Russian and Czech then helped cement it.

***

I'd lay down dollars to donuts that a majority of the people in this thread are as bilingual as Senator Obama is. (Which is to say, as much foreign language training one gets in a typical liberal arts education including time spent abroad, with allowance for a person forgetting stuff over a career spent mainly speaking English.)

We just don't like the cut of his jib.

centralcal

Glenda: I won't even have to try!

Great Banana

This is very simple and practical folks. Talk to anyone on Wall Street and ask them the makeup of US manufacturing and they will tell you these same obvious facts. Business is global. Global success requires a global outlook. Knowing a major global language like Spanish or Chinese is a practical advantage.

The only question is, why does this upset you so?

Who said it upset anyone? Learning a foreign language is a great thing - we should encourage it and support it.

Just like making sure English is and remains the official language of the United States is a great thing.

Despite your attempt, the two issues are exclusive.

We can pass an "english only" law that would allow Local, State and Federal gov't to operate only in English, and which would allow companies to require employees be able to speak english. This a) cut down on local, state, and federal gov't costs and b) provide incentive for immigrants to learn the language.

At the very same time we can still teach and encouraging people to learn a second langauge.

So, what exactly is/was your point?

GMax

Hey my kids math skills here in Texas aren't very good. No way they are as good as the great and glorious Taxachusetts. Nope my first two out of college had to settle for accounting degrees, and stranger yet the accounting firms here just scooped them up and put them to work! How can that be? Why such a event in a backwards Red State is equivalent to a double back flip.

And funny my kids seems to understand that the job offers in the NE needed to be filtered through the taxation at multiple state and local levels and then a cost of living haircut, but with no State or local income tax here and a low cost of living, that they could make more here than there.

I wonder why folks are moving here every day and out of Taxachusetts. See all the projections for loss versus gain on Congressional representation. Are all of these folks just unaware of the utopia that is Blue Heaven?

kim

That he should talk like that in full awareness of the disaster that is public education in the bluest of urban areas. Have you no shames, James?
=====================================

bad

jimmy tom

imma losin ma pashends wit ya in reegardz to the noids talk. cleen up yer mowth. bet yer reel pridefull of yer kids runnin a cuntry mile.

bad

jimmy tom

how much lawnger is a cuntry mile then a city mile?

Barney Frank

Bad, arr yoo fixin to commens feudin with Jimmy Tom?

MikeS

When I went to school in the People's Republic of California, 3 years of a foreign language were required just to get a high school diploma. Is Barack talking about more courses than that?

To be honest, I think my poor English has been more of a problem than my poor Spanish. If I had it to do over I would take more English courses and pay better attention.

Aaron

Obama speaks Indonesian, which he learned as a kid there, so I guess he knows what he's talking about in terms of early language learning.

What that has to do with an official language is beyond me, but I do confess that as my Chinese is mainly verbal, I do like when the Taiwan government has forms and documents in English. Maybe its not the end of the world if we do some reciprocation, eh?

MayBee

We don't need you. The America of the very near future will be full of leaders who have a global mindset, for business and all other matters. (The global nature of business alone is reason enough. If you don't think so, you are truly, absolutely, amazingly clueless.)

Next you'll be telling us free trade is part of a global mindset, and "outsourcing" is inevitable. And we'll be as upset as we are about learning languages.

James Thompson

So GMax replaces a quantitative analysis of math skills around the world with his anecdotal evidence of his two children in Texas.

Question to the rubes--which logical fallacy has GMax fallen victim to?

Two tickets to a NASCAR event to the first rube who can provide the correct answer.

GMax

Apparently a grassroots campaign has been successful in putting an initiative on the ballot in Taxachusetts to end the State income tax. I wonder if they just fail to realize the prog heaven they are living in, surely if there was a provision in the state law to allow progs to give voluntarily to the State the coffers would be overflowing ( what there is such a provision and no one gives? ) Whoa maybe I have this all wrong.

bubba

BONUS QUERY:

"or do they also embarrass him as the rest of us rubes do?"

Corrected:

"or do they also embarrass him as much as we'uns do?"

"You can be part of international business."

Does Barack Hussein (Oops!)Obama not realize that English IS the language of international business. What a rube!

GMax

James, last one out of Taxachusetts please turn out the lights. You wont need them to huddle in your cave anyway.

bad

Mr. Barney Frank

les jest say Imma cleenin the shotgun rite now. i don mine the educashon an sich but i don cottin to no off culler talkin in frunta the lateys. Me an him gonna go rown an rown iffn he dont cleen it up. i askt polite like an all.

kim

MikeS, it's been said of the English language that it is the easiest to learn, but most difficult to master.
===================================

kim

Uh tar and weel flying off the axel for the first moron who can see the hypocrisy in James Thompson's mirror as he wide-eyed gazes for logical fallacies.
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bad

jimmy yer gettin ma dander up. now yer talkin bout fallic. aint ya got no desenz atall?

Pofarmer

So, what exactly is/was your point?

Why, that Mr Thompson and his blue state buddies are superior to a bunch of backwards midwesterners, obviously.

Barney Frank

Question to the rubes--which logical fallacy has GMax fallen victim to?

I done reckon he caught fire to his straw man by settin it too close to his categorical syllogism and his post hoc ergo propter hoc. Is that there the right answer Mr Ad Hom?

susannac

The "us rubes" vs "we rubes" has to do with subject vs predicate. If you drop the "rubes", which one is accurate? It would be "We rubes should learn more languages" or "The elite who know more than one language are clearly superior to us rubes who do not in ways far beyond linguistics".

As for other languages - I can say "I don't speak (insert language)" in three languages, including Yankee. I used to work in Jersey City, where (according to its mayor) "more than 50 languages are spoken in its schools". Wouldn't it be discrimination to emphasize one over the other, for any reason other than practical ones such as its general use in business?

I will also point out that my monolinguistic condition has not prevented me from learning about other countries and cultures. Surprisingly, information about those countries can be found in English.

Finally, when Obama can function effectively and respectfully with all sectors of society in Alabama, where I live, I will begin to care more about his stance on foreign countries, languages and cultures. Personally, I don't think he could live for long in, say, the Black Belt area without tripping constantly on his ivy league, northern elitism.

bad

most folks cepttin maybe fer perverts and sicj jes keep ther fallics in ther pants an don talk bout em.

MayBee

Does Barack Hussein (Oops!)Obama not realize that English IS the language of international business.

Probably not, because he knows nothing about business let alone international business.
There are many great reasons to learn a language, and many great reasons for the President not to act as Superintendent in Chief.

I don't like him being embarrassed about Americans on vacation in Europe being unable to speak the language. I want people to travel where they wish and not be limited by fear they should be embarrassed by not knowing the local language. Learning a language is a way to expand your horizons, but so is travel. 'Take a risk!' he should be saying, not 'stop embarassing me'.

Barney Frank

Miss Bad,

Iffn yoo do commens to feudin wit jimmy tom, att lees yoo no he aint totin no smokepole hisself, ass they dont beleef in such up in machachuchets.

Barney Frank

most folks cepttin maybe fer perverts and sicj jes keep ther fallics in ther pants an don talk bout em.

LOL. Comment of the day, or maybe rubric of the day?

glasater

Thanks Helen for 'splaining Stierscheißekünstler:-)

bad

Mr. Barney

hit shor is a cunnundrem how we one the amercan revulushun wifout guns. imma thinkin themthar massachoosuts folks jes blathert the englesh folks to deth.

bad

Miss Jane

Exceptin yer fine self frum the likes of jimmy tom acourse. ment no disrespect to ya. jes the likes a him an his elk.

PeterUK

"A true conservative would know, without a thought, that knowing another language is the mark of an educated, worldly person."

In this part of the world,"worldly" is a euphemism for somewhat degenerate.

clarice

bad, you be the mistress of dialogue on JOM.

clarice

PUK, I see the NCB funded lavishly by your tax dollars is alerting nursery school teachers to the fact that kids who dislike spicy food might be racists.
We'd send you all rifles if we had a mailing address.

Sue

most folks cepttin maybe fer perverts and sicj jes keep ther fallics in ther pants an don talk bout em.

Oh my gawd! I have never laughed so hard! ::grin::

bad

thanky rite kinly Miss Clarice but truth to tell is I be married all proper like. y ma husban aint even much related.

Sue

such up in machachuchets.

I have a friend in New Hampshire who refers to it as Taxa2shits.

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Wilson/Plame