Memeorandum


Powered by TypePad

« Obama Is Our President - Suck It Up | Main | I Pledge... »

January 22, 2009

Comments

centralcal

Good for Cheney in speaking out.

clarice

Bravo, Cheney!

TM what if that Powell blabarama included his BFF Andrea Mitchell. Without clearly understanding the case--ever--the Judge first thought he saw a name in her records that compelled turning her notes over to the defense and then, without explanation, pulled back from that. I'd bet my bottom dollar the name he saw bore the initials CP.

Topsecretk9

However, I have a strong recollection of having read that State Department phone logs were only preserved for three months.


I believe Grossman said this and it was in regards to Wilson calling everyone for months mad he was referred to as the low level he was.

Hayes says in his column that the CIA didn't have copies of the forgeries but at trial it came out that they did have copies (which illustrates how lame the CIA was that they would never look at them closely all that time and then that they would turn them over to IAEA)

boris

I stand by my waffling ...

Still maintain that is an inconsistent position. If Libby retained the Wilson wife detail from the first (re: Libby's notes), then all subsequent actions can only be attributed to staging the leak.

If the wife detail was irrelevant to their activities (pre op-ed) and Libby did forget, then his version of events is as credible as the conflicting and implausible versions from the other players.

The middle of the road positions are too flimsy. ISTM your waffle reads like "Libby's story too implausible ... therefore he must have had some motive ... hmmm ... maybe it was X." Of course X is going to seem plausible (to you) but actually it's just a prop.

Patrick R. Sullivan

The ball is in Bush's court. If he doesn't have a good answer to what looks like vile disloyalty on his part, Cheney will have put a black mark on the Bush presidency.

clarice

Oh, and I agree with Boris,TM..

narciso

The whole point of the story, was that Valerie, not Cheney, had been instrumental in sending Wilson; and it was because of her analytical status. That was Armitage
had relayed to Woodward and Novak; when he probably was being pestered by the INR boys
like the one who wrote the 'classified; memo on the subject and was sent to Karachi as Consul General as a reward.

kim

I agree with Boris. And I believe the truth was option B, in which both Cheney and Libby forgot the importance of Val from June until far later in July than everyone else. Libby had to remind Cheney that Cheney had first mentioned her to him in June.

So, innocent of lying, victim of a great miscarriage of justice. Unfortunately, now, the only good way out of it that I can see is for Obama to pardon him as a swipe at Fitz. I'm disappointed in Bush, and it's rare that he disappoints me.
========================================

sbw

If Bush wanted to live up to his wry sense of humor, he would have pardoned the journalists who dissembled to the Special Prosecutor and the Judge in the Libby trial.

Estocada

Maybe Libby shouldn't have dropped his appeal...

Why pardon a guy who threw in the towel?

Bush was right.

clarice

Luckily for Andrea and David G it is unlikely that we will run into eachother at some social occasion.
Just saying.

clarice

estocada, Perhaps you can take the chance of winning on appeal after already amassing millions in legal fews and having forked over a quarter million in fines, but most of us, having had the sentence commuted, would not want to take on that additional risj/cost.

In fact, i know someone who rather than destroy his entire financial worth in a similarly ridiculous suit involving a savings and loan when that was the witchhunt of the day (and when his pruported conduct was in fact done by another as he was too busy tending to a son dying of brain cancer) simply negotiated a sentence, served it, lost his bar license and made a good living at something else.

clarice

**legal feEs***
**purported***

Rick Ballard

Perhaps Libby will help Cheney with his memoir? He has the literary skill and they could actually put together two books if they choose.

I agree with Cheney's position but I'm unsurprised by the decision by Bush to not grant a pardon. It's consonant with his decision to retain the blundering jackass, Bartlett, to the detriment of himself, his party and the country.

If Libby writes a book (and I hope he does) then I'll be buying it and I rarely buy political dreck.

I find the fact that Libby breathes fresh air while the perjurer, Tim Russert, continues to rot to be of some consolation. Eckenrode being forced out of the FBI is somewhat less of a consolation but I still have the vision of Fitzgerald's future ruin and humiliation within my hope chest. I take it out and refold it from time to time - keeps it from creasing.

Topsecretk9

FYI


remember all that wailing by the likes of Emptynes that the Bush admin was circumventing the Sarbanes-Oxley Act and hiding their communications???

this comes in the Obama administrations whining about the tech state of affairs in the WH

and security regulations forbidding outside e-mail accounts.

RichatUF

TSK9-

...which illustrates how lame the CIA was that they would never look at them closely all that time and then that they would turn them over to IAEA...

I remember the DOE email..."...However, when individuals attempt to convert those “strong statements” into the “knock out” punch, the Administration will ultimately look foolish - i.e. the tubes and Niger!"

Never did get an answer to who at the CIA dug up the forged documents and gave them to the IAEA briefer.

Cecil Turner

However, I do think Libby lied to the investigators of this non-crime, thereby committing a crime.

I wonder how much of your conclusion is attributable to the early formulations of the testimony (e.g., he forgot on Wednesday what he brought up on Monday) or stuff like this from the indictment (which conveniently leaves out the fact that all these conversations were months old at the first recall attempt):

LIBBY did not advise Matthew Cooper, on or about July 12, 2003, that LIBBY had heard other reporters were saying that Wilson’s wife worked for the CIA . . .
Once we are in agreement that Libby did not out anyone on purpose, there is simply no way to believe the minute factoids of these conversations would be memorable months later (which is why the lefties cling so stubbornly to their fanciful theories of "double secret probation" meetings behind OVP doors). And once we found out (from Woodward) that the story had in fact been "out there" for weeks before the critical conversations, the back-and-forth becomes impossible to reconstruct.

Compelling points are that Libby re-learned about Plame from his notes, and that he over-confessed to the Cooper conversation (the only plausible explanation being that he mixed it up with another). This makes zero sense as a legend, but is perfectly consistent with the "actually forgot" explanation (and all his "reconstructed" memories are as reliable as such usually are). Reading through the evidence at trial--and the wildly divergent versions of all conversations--this is the only believable conclusion.

Topsecretk9

Rich

I remember the DOE email..."...However, when individuals attempt to convert those “strong statements” into the “knock out” punch, the Administration will ultimately look foolish - i.e. the tubes and Niger!"

I don't recall that.

Never did get an answer to who at the CIA dug up the forged documents and gave them to the IAEA briefer.

The person who dug them up gave them to Powell at the UN to hand over IIRC.

clarice

Rick, you are a man after my own heart.

Topsecretk9

Murtha supporter gets raid by FBI


BREAKING NEWS: Local Defense Contractor Raided By FBI, IRS

Federal agents raided Kuchera Industries, an area defense contractor located in Windber.

LUN

Nonprofit Connects Murtha, Lobbyists Ties to Pa. Group Mutually Beneficial

...But Murtha has his defenders. "Jack Murtha is supportive of everything you can think of around here, from roads and sewers to defense contractors," said Bill Kuchera, chief executive of Kuchera Industries of Windber, Pa., and a PAID director. "But without Jack Murtha, there'd still be a Kuchera. We don't lean on Jack Murtha at all."

Murtha repeatedly intervened on behalf of PAID to help Kuchera expand.

After PAID's founding, Scialabba approached Kuchera to get involved. Kuchera jumped, not only joining the group's board but ramping up hiring of disabled workers, who now compose a third of the 200 employees in his company's defense business. The federal government picked up Kuchera's $7 million training bill. This year, Murtha earmarked $1.3 million for Kuchera's chemical and biological weapons detection research.

Kuchera employees donated more than $31,000 to Murtha in the past three election campaigns, according to federal election records. Between 1990 and 2000, contributions totaled $1,000. And congressional lobbying disclosure forms tally $140,000 in payments since 2001 from Kuchera to Ervin Technical Associates, whose chairman is former representative Joseph M. McDade (R-Pa.), a close Murtha ally.

The Kuchera experience is not unique. Ed Washington, another PAID director, hails from MTS Technologies, an Arlington defense contractor that recently secured $8.9 million in federal funds to expand its Johnstown facility. MTS's lobbyist, the PMA Group, has disclosed some $300,000 in fees from the company since 1998. And PMA has returned the favor: Since 1989, the firm's employees have given Murtha $107,500.

bad

I wonder who will be included in the small group of people allowed to communicate with PBHO via his Blackberry.

Bill Ayers
Bernardine Dorhn
Rashid Khalidi
Jeremiah Wright
Father Pfleger

Did I miss anyone?

Stephanie

Everyone above the "d" list in Hollywood...

They ARE the best and brightest...

at what I have no idea

h/t Rodney Dangerfield

bad

lol steph

JM Hanes

This is an extraordinarily sad epilogue in every way. Even if Libby were guilty, he deserved a pardon. I've tried to content myself with possible reasons that he might have asked the President not to do so, but Cheney makes it clear that there are no such excuses. Nor did Cheney suggest that Bush has some hard and fast rule about granting pardons that he simply will not break for anyone.

I'm profoundly disappointed for Libbly, and profoundly disappointed in Bush. There's a cruel, emblematic, irony in being left with such mixed emotions about our former Prez himself, at the very moment I had been overcome by unreserved feelings of gratitude and respect.

Bush has never felt compelled to explain himself. Perhaps in the fullness of time, he will. For now, however, I am reminded that our greatest stengths are often simultaneously our greatest flaws. I hope that Cheney will write his book soon (and attend to his security!). I would like to see him title it: You Will Know Their Names.

It occurs to me that those most committed to damaging Bush and his legacy have probably written their books already. Those most constrained to silence by loyalty to the President or to his office have not yet had their say. When it comes to writing the history of this administration, perhaps those who would defend it, or were a part of it, now have the advantage. I would also love to see an unauthorized political biography of Henry Waxman, because, of course, the most opportune publishing date for such a tome would be the opening of any show trials he might still have in mind.

Stephanie

I suspect that Lynn C. has been keeping copious notes for him and that the Cheney expose will be forthcoming much sooner than some think. I expect it to be footnoted, documented and damning. I don't think he will pull any punches. He's not built that way.

JM Hanes

Rick:

"It's consonant with his decision to retain the blundering jackass, Bartlett, to the detriment of himself, his party and the country."

Bush detractors would have us believe that he demanded absolute loyalty from every one around him, which flies directly into the face of observable facts. There were many who tendered it, but I see no evidence that Bush either valued loyalty or extended it. While he accepted the occasional resignation, he simply didn't fire people -- even when he should have. One can admire his refusal to speak ill of anyone, but that laissez faire attitude to management seriously undercut his effectiveness. His choices for the Medal of Freedom were utterly inexplicable. It was like a gold watch for service, without regard to excellence.

Pagar

"I wonder who will be included in the small group of people allowed to communicate with PBHO via his Blackberry"

I suspect there are a whole lot of people on that list, I suspect a good many of them are overseas and not Americans. Aren't we told that his first official phone call was to Abbas.

narciso

He brought the Texas crew, that was Hughes, Bartlett, McLellan, Mackinnon, and Fleischer
who was the only non-Texan in the group. In retrospect, they were all inadequate to the job, at least two defected to the drak side, MacKinnon, & McClellan. It took Tony Snow to really show how inadequate they were. He had a lot of egos in the Cabinet, like Paul O'Neil and Powell, Rumsfeld, et al; and it was like wrangling cats. Reagan certainly had similar problems with Don Reagan, most notably, but we weren't in a shooting war; back then, nad the media was less toxic. The Medal of Freedom winners was a bad idea. Tenet, the best of a bad lot that had been foisted upon us. Bremer,
the egotist, who I now concurr with the negative review of his performance in Jacobsen's hostage memoir. Franks is somewhat more defensible

bunky

Sucking up to the left really got W and R's alot of places.
That new tone really worked.

Rick Ballard

JMH,

I see a clear bifurcation between the political team of Bush, Rove and Bartlett and the policy team wrt loyalty. Cheney/Libby/Matalin (or her replacement) jumped the gun because of miscommunication or poor communication while the political team was on the trip to Africa. I put the botch on Bartlett but Rove and the President were lackluster in their speed of response as well - just like they were in the first 24 hours of Katrina.

If I were scoring at home, I'd give Cheney/Libby/Matalin (or her replacement) low marks for jumping on a flea bite a little too fast and Bush/Rove/Bartlett similar low marks for being too slow.

I will not be at all surprised if Cheney reveals a relatively high level of tension and disagreement in the decision making process.

matt

Bad;

you missed Scarlett Johanson.

As to the Libby saga, it is the worst kind of palace intrigue. Everybody/nobody knew, and the long knives were out for Cheney and Rove. That the reality was that the leak was made by several sources of what was a relatively open secret was lost in the attack dog tactics of the democrats and left. They smelled blood in the water and went into a manufactured frenzy.

Even today, I received an e mail from a liberal acquaintance who said "the right wingers are at it again" about an innocuous post by another acquaintance. The difference between the Left and right today is that the Left are rapidly transforming from the Progressives to the Mensheviks to the Bolsheviks. The far left is at the Bolshevik stage already and are rabid.

The Right, on the other hand, have trended towards toleration, which is rich irony. I haven't heard of anyone who voted for McCain threatening to move to Canada. I fear that if the country tilts left, we'll start to see fractures in the social compact. With growing joblessness and a deterioration in the safety net, we may see the trend accelerate.

At some point comes the schwerpunkt, and I really don't think your average Main Street social conservative is going to rise in the streets like the looney left have threatened to do. The difference is that there are a lot more conservatives who actually know how to throw monkey wrenches into the works.Unfortunately, we're living in interesting times.

Jim Miller

Tom - You've said a number of times that:

"However, I do think Libby lied to the investigators of this non-crime, thereby committing a crime."

But what I don't understand is why you believe this.

There were discrepancies in testimony, but, from I have seen, those discrepancies in testimony were exactly what scientific studies of memory would lead us to expect.

But you have studied this far more closely than I have, so you may have some more reasons for suspecting that Libby lied. If so, I'd like to see them -- and I suspect that others would, too.

(This is a good time to say that I think that Clarice Feldman's post calling for Libby's pardon is superb.

And to say that I think that Bush didn't pardon Libby because of his unwillingness to interfere in judicial matters. I think in Libby's case he should have overruled the judge and jury, but he has been very reluctant to do so in any case.)

MayBee

I know many of you don't agree, but I think Libby sealed his fate by not telling Bush from the outset that he had, indeed, discussed Plame with reporters.
I don't think he did anything illegal, and I think the investigation was misguided.

However, had Libby and Cheney told Bush they might have contributed to the problem, rather than telling his (inept) spokesman they were clean, Bush may have handled things differently. As it was, the man-hunt for the non-criminals caused a lot of problems for Bush. I don't blame him for being irritated enough to commute Libby's sentence, but not pardon.

clarice

TThanks, Jim. MayBee didn't Libby say that when the issue was still who'd told Novak? And it was Libby and ROVE who told McClellan that and Rove, in fact, did tell Cooper when Libby had not.

JM Hanes

boris:

"Libby's story too implausible ... therefore he must have had some motive ... hmmm ... maybe it was X."

Now that's a hammer directly on the head of a nail. TM has taken the most comfortable position which need not be examined too closely for flimsiness. He can feel free to believe Libby is guilty of lying, because Libby has failed to prove the negative -- and neither could nor will.

I hate to say this, TM, but you are precisely where Fitzgerald wanted his jury to be.

That's why process crimes are a prosecutor's best friend. They save him all the time and effort that collecting actual evidence of any underlying crime and investigating an actual pool of potential suspects requires.

It is also precisely where Fitzgerald wanted his defendant to be.

The burden of proving a negative rests squarely on the defendant's shoulders. He is compelled to challenge both the initial, postulated, crime and the later process crime, while the prosecutor doesn't need to prove the former at all for his conviction. At the same time, the defense -- and the admissibility of any exculpatory evidence it might want to introduce -- is severely constrained to the very selective allegations the prosecutor chooses to lodge, and whatever minimal, selective, evidence he chooses to put on the table.

In short, TM, you have wasted a couple of years examining the underlying Plamegate crime. You would have convicted Libby, just as Fitzgerald's jury did, regardless. It doesn't look like you are still waffling, it looks like you are just making yourself comfortable.

I wouldn't be surprised if Fitzgerald is spending his current Chicago delay in search of an obstruction charge to include in the Blago indictment. The Senate seat sale conveniently obviates the need for further investigation of earlier crimes. I believe there's good reason to question the timing of the Chicago Tribune's decision to publish the "leak" of phones being tapped. The Trib's parent company looks like an interested party to me.

JM Hanes

Pagar:

"Aren't we told that his first official phone call was to Abbas."

His first four calls were to Mubarak, Olmert, King Abdullah and Abbas.

clarice

jmh, That is the most brilliant post ever.

Add to the obstruction/conspiracy process crimes, the ability to sway a jury pool by a lying presser and a myultiplicity of counts and voila you have (a) a case it is virtually impossible to defend against, (b) a certainty that the jury will be confused enough to ind guilt on at least a couple of the counts.
When you add that it is a Republican being tried in D.C. you have a lead pipe cinch of a conviction.

clarice

**multiplicity**
*Find guilt**

bgates

I haven't heard of anyone who voted for McCain threatening to move
Where are we gonna go? To Canada, to escape preening socialist anti-Americanism seems? May as well go up there because I'm pissed Florida temps have dropped into the 50s.

MayBee

MayBee didn't Libby say that when the issue was still who'd told Novak? And it was Libby and ROVE who told McClellan that and Rove, in fact, did tell Cooper when Libby had not.

As far as I know, Libby did not tell Bush that he had talked to any reporters about it. The situation spiraled out of control, but Libby didn't help Bush by not being forthright. I think Bush would have handled things differently had he known Libby's (small) role.
I agree that Rove did the same thing, but Rove is not now in the position to need a pardon.

clarice

As far as I know he didn't talk to any reporters about it except to wave them off the story--Unless you see something in the Miller bafflegab both I and Fitz (who never charged it) overlooked.

JM Hanes

MayBee:

Considering how the accusations were originally framed, it seems quite possible that it never occurred to Libby and Cheney that they had anything to do with it. By the time Fitzgerald came into the picture, the President had already taken a hands off position. At some point I expect he probably put the kabosh on anybody talking about it at the White House at all, and/or staffers, a la Panetta, felt that they would best protect him by not talking to him about it.

MayBee

His story was Tim Russert told him about it, right? And whatever really happened with Judy and Cooper.
I don't think he told Bush about that contact.
I'm not saying he brought her up, or he made a big revealing statement about her to any reporter. I'm saying Bush talked to reporters about the Plame "leak", and dealt with Ashcroft and Comey about it, without knowing exactly what the story was.
And when the story came out, it hurt Bush.

MayBee
Considering how the accusations were originally framed, it seems quite possible that it never occurred to Libby and Cheney that they had anything to do with it.

I can see that, and I believe it. However, the President was made to look bad and his VP and his VP's chief of staff were in the middle of it. I certainly don't blame Bush if he sees it differently than Libby and Cheney do.

boris

that they would best protect him by not talking to him about it

Yes, one thing Republican administrations has to avoid is conspiring to expose the truth or set the record straight. It's those "legal abuses" of power that really sets off the BDS crowd.

Pofarmer

Best I can tell is that Libby and 3 reporters had varying accounts of what Libby said. Matt Cooper admitted that Libby's version was probably more correct than his own, yet Libby got convicted on it. Nobody surrounding Russert was ever brought under oath to know if anyone around Russert ever actually knew or not. Eckenrode's "lost" notes play heavily here. Why isn't it just as plausible that Cooper or Pumpkin Head perjured themselves? And, what, specifically, did any of it have to do with what the investigation was about in the first place? Oh, Yeah, nothing, Fitz knew that answer from Day one.

boris

don't think he told Bush about that contact

Okay look, even Judy M did not remember that bit about "works at the bureau". Before the Wilson op-ed whatever Libby knew about the wife was not part of the story. If Valerie had slipped his mind pre op-ed why on earth would he be able to remember telling JM anything in order to warn W?

clarice

Yeah, they should have had an internal investigation wqhere they all talked together and decided what happened and wrote it up so everyone would have it...like Obama just did.

Pofarmer

Oh, and I hope that Cheney comes out with a 5 pound hammer of a book.

bad

Did Fitz ask for an extention on the Blago stuff to provide cover to BHO etc,. until well after the election?

Pofarmer

Yeah, they should have had an internal investigation wqhere they all talked together and decided what happened and wrote it up so everyone would have it...like Obama just did.

Clarice, you just deflated me a little further.

I feel like I'm in some bizzarro alternate universe right now. Like I woke up in Zimbabwe or something.

clarice

HEH--Well just imagine what would have been made of THAT had Bush done it.
Instead his dumbie counsel Gonzales fears to even ask the Dept of State GC what it is exactly that Powell has told Fitz.

Oh, and word is Tenet pushed the DoJ for an investigation because he was sure it was State sandbagging his people.
How it became a crime by anyone in the WH is another story.

boris

they [should have] all talked together and decided what happened and wrote it up so everyone would have it...like Obama just did

The TANG memos really should have put the admin into full partisan combat mode for the whole 2nd term. History probably will credit W with putting the country first by treating dimorats as "loyal" opposition.

verner

Gosh I'm going to miss Cheney. What an ole hard ass. Now all we have in the WH is a bunch of whimpy limp-wristed metrosexuals.

This nation owes Scooter Libby a huge debt. He did a magnificent job defending this country, in ways that we won't be able to know about for decades. Good for Cheney for speaking out!

The only good thing is that the nutroots are so over Val and Joe, and Hillary is too cunning to allow such a clown anywhere near State. Val's stupid book was a total flop as well. In the end, I think Scooter will come out of all this looking a lot better that those two traitors.

Pagar

"Aren't we told that his first official phone call was to Abbas."

And his first overseas telephone call, to Palestinian Authority president Mahmoud Abbas,

I believe calling our allies first would have sent a better message. I understand he called other leaders, but only 1 call can be first.

clarice

I miss you, verner. I hope you post more often.

Sue

I hope Cheney tells us, finally, the truth about Valerie Plame's covert status. You know he knows. He knows everything. He has the key to the machine, after all.

bad

Sue, if he doesn't know something it's because it's not worth knowing.

Pofarmer

I believe calling our allies first would have sent a better message.

What chu talkin' bout. He DID call his allies. Remember the Palestinian phonebanks???????

C'mon people.

Pofarmer

God, this is depressing.

Sue

Obama calls for Israel to open Gaza border. Depressing ain't even close, Po!

bad

Take a deep breath and think about Joe and Jill Biden. Those two are a laugh riot.

verner

Clarice, I'm going to try, cause you know I love you guys. Just a myriad of small things have zapped my time and energy...but things are looking better now.

Though in things political, as an historian trained in a diploma mill, I can't get over the feeling that I'm listening to the orchestra on the Titanic...ah well, screw it. Let's go down kicking and screaming if we must.

Barney Frank

Perhaps Libby will help Cheney with his memoir? He has the literary skill and they could actually put together two books if they choose.

As long Libby doesn't go into his 'the aspens are fluttering' code mode.
Cheney is married to no mean author already.

Even if Libby were guilty, he deserved a pardon.

Amen, JMH.

MayBee
I hope Cheney tells us, finally, the truth about Valerie Plame's covert status.

There is no doubt in my mind both Bush and Cheney knew she was not covert in any real sense. Perhaps on paper. There is no doubt in my mind they knew no crime had been committed against her.
The one thing they did not understand was that Comey had it in for them.
I heard on NPR the other day that Cheney and Comey had quite a feud going. The jist of that story was Cheney had kept that feud from Bush, and Bush eventually stopped trusting Cheney.
I don't know if the last part is true (I doubt it), but I believe that Comey wanted to get Cheney and used Fitzgerald to try to do it.

Mel

matt-

Why Mr. Fitzgerald bumped things down the road is ripe for speculation. Street opinion here says that there are bigger fish on the line. If you think he has an ego, we're just going to have to stay along for the ride and see where it takes us. There are five years of tapes, and still no Grand Jury seated. That's the mystery.

I, personally, think it snags Rahm, but I'm a minority of one.

Mel

oops! Sorry matt, that was an answer to bad.

narciso

The Libby affair, with the myriad agendas displayed by Armitage, the patron of Azeri oil, through the Alamoudis,with the their efforts with Delta Oil/Amerada Hess board
member Tom Kean b(yes that Tom Kean) who only got the job because the other business
partner, Henry Kisinger bowed out. Joe Wilson also tied to the Alamoudis through Rock Creek Partners, and to the Sudanese
regime, along with Jarch head of security
Larry Johnson, makes for a heck of a potboiler. Instead this thin film of illusion about Cheney outing Plame through
Libby became the narrative.

bad

Thanks Mel. Rahm is a fine fish...

Topsecretk9

Amen Nariso.

Oh, and word is Tenet pushed the DoJ for an investigation because he was sure it was State sandbagging his people.

So the scuttlebutt is that Tenet did know it was Armitage? IIRC blowhard Wilson was also making calls around CIA too very early on whining about low-level like thenational command authority little puss he is.

Jane

I miss you, verner. I hope you post more often.

I was just thinking the same thing.

Ya know I think the reason Bush didn't pardon Libby is he didn't want to set a precedent that Obama could use when all the chips start falling on Rahmbo and others. Lots of people know lots of things about him, and he stands to lose a lot if they talk. I think Rahmbo would give him up in a NY minute.

MayBee

Heh, Tops!

It would make sense for Tenant to figure out it was State. After all, State was at the meeting with Val, and was in on sending Joe.

Instead this thin film of illusion about Cheney outing Plame through
Libby became the narrative.

It's crazy!
But it happened because the press was upset with Bush for starting the war. They were looking to destroy him by that point.

narciso

That actually makes no sense, because the INR boys via the above mentioned memo, felt
they were being pushed around by CIA's WMD division. Tenet, if not in bed with Prince Bandar, was certainly in their pool as that Jeffrey Goldberg vignette illustrates. It's like the old "speak no evil, see no evil, and hear no evil". So the Saud gravy train was everywhere. McCain on "Is Larry Alive"
"somebody please make it stop" I don't want to see him ever again, he's the unwilling?
collaborator in these event, I know a tidal wave was running against him and Sarah, some
astrologers even say the stars were aligned
against them; but his refusal to take down names, symbols of the crisis.

Danube of Thought

OK--off-topic, but here's my exchange with SixApart, owners of the nightmarish TypePad:

From Me:

"Recent changes in your pagination procedures have utterly destroyed my favorite blog site, 'Just One Minute.' Because the threads there often run to several hundred posts, one must repeatedly scroll down to click on the 'next' page before coming to the most recent comments. Even worse, it is not possible to use the Ctrl+F function to find comments by particular posters, or to find particular phrases. It is an absolute disaster as seen by the readership, and it is definitely suppressing participation. Will you afford the site owner an opportunity to reject this unwanted and highly counterproductive feature?"

Their response:

"Hi there,

"Thanks for contacting us and for sharing your thoughts with us. Please encourage the weblog owner to contact us directly if they have not already done so, so that we can work with them on a satisfactory resolution to the issue.

"Thanks,
Laura
TypePad Technical Services
Six Apart Ltd."

So--how, exactly, is the best way to encourage the weblog owner to contact them directly?


clarice

Clinton set the precedent on Dem pardons, I'm afraid, Jane. Whatever Bush did would have no impact on what O does. I think he didn't do it because he doesn't ever want to loo like he's undercutting the judicial process..hence the commutations for Campean and Ramos, too.

He'll accept that a sentence might be too harsh but will never substitute his judgement for the judge and jury.

clarice

DoT I'll email TM, but I suggest people take turns and paste this at the beginning of each new thread where he's likely to see it because he doesn't always catch his mail.

Rocco

There were four different articles in May and June, all suggesting Cheney requested that someone be sent to investigate. All four articles cited an anonymous source that we now know was Wilson himself. Why wouldn't Bush and Cheney question everyone including reporters to find out why this anonymous source was lying!

And this was all BEFORE the media blitz on July 6, 2003 with Wilson's "What I Didn't Find In Africa" and his "Meet The Press" appearance.

I still think that INR Memo was given to Bush and Cheney as a rat note from State, the very next day, July 7, on a plane bound for Africa. Don't you think Bush was demanding to know why this guy Wilson was calling him a liar? Powell and Armitage produce the INR Memo with Douglas Rohn's name on it fingering Valerie as the one who recommended Wilson.

Sue

I never expected Bush to pardon Libby. Especially since he commuted the sentence instead of a pardon. I think, like our dear leader, Bush thinks Libby lied and got caught. I am torn between dear leader, JMH and MayBee. Somewhere in the muddle. I wanted a pardon, felt Libby probably was trying to kick the can down the road thinking it would never get as far as it did (I don't think Valerie Plame was covert, never did, never will) and know Bush typically stays away from judge/jury decisions. At the end of the day, Libby should have resigned and pled the 5th early, Rove should have been fired (I love you, you magnificent bastard, but you did talk to Cooper) and Cheney should be president today. ::sigh::

Oh, and Armitage should have been strung up on the public square along with Powell.

Thomas Jackson

Screw Cheney. Has everybody forgotten he said the two border patrol officers were guilty? When the war crimes tribunal headed by Obama and his band of politburo members don't be asking for no pardon there Chenney. If the Lord Obama says you're guilty it must be true. What goes round comes round.

You didn't have the good sense to stop your trolls from having a show trial despite the evidence so you'll pardon me if I wait for a new show trial.

MayBee

You all saw that Matt Cooper is a blogger with Talking Points Memo now, right?

narciso

Rohn, that was the name was on the tip of my tongue. Wilso flat out lied, as to the nature of the Niger mission, and who sent him. Rove & Libby were providing info; you know it's called a briefing to clarify the errors, Armitage was too, from his own perspective. I agree with the punishment for Armitage, but what's the proper one for Comey, the Martha Stewart dragonslayer or Fizgerald' if he had been an agent of AQ, would he have done things any differently

clarice

I did. Did the new business mag he took over, fold already?
He and his wife separated, too.

Karma.

Andrea better look out.

Topsecretk9

Fat Coopers is at TPM?

Topsecretk9

It's interesting that Empty said she was going to post another Plame email she had and then never did. I wonder why?

Porchlight

DoT,

I got a nearly identical reply from Laura at SixApart. We just have to keep plugging away at TM to contact them, I guess.

MayBee

It's interesting that Empty said she was going to post another Plame email she had and then never did. I wonder why?

I've noticed that too. After the book came out and Plame turned out not to be a Plameologist, Empty kind of dumped her.

Except yesterday, she was still trying to sell the idea that by not pardoning Libby, Bush was protecting himself. Her thinking is Libby, if pardoned, couldn't invoke the 5th in an investigation against Bush.
The stupid problem with that is Libby didn't invoke the 5th before. There's no reason to believe that if pardoned, he wouldn't just continue to tell the exact same story he'd already told.

belle

DOT and Clarice: In TM's defense, I received a response to an email I had sent to him pleading with him to address this new format. He seems to be aware of the discontent and on the case. I was not expecting a reply, and was frankly surprised. It remains to be seen what exactly he can do about it. As a lurker, I was aware of a drop off in comments by the regulars here, in frustration I'm sure. One night it seemed like "radio silence" had been ordered. Hang in there. I'm depending on you guys to keep me sane in these insane times.

clarice

And MayBee, I suppose her genius argument is that if he had pardoned Libby he would NOT have done it to protect himself? Idiotic.

I, too, got a response from typepad asking TM to contact them to resolve this.

TM, DO YOU HEAR THE CRYING OF THE LAMBS?

Pal2Pal (Sara)

I got the following response from Typepad re: next/previous:

Hi Sara,

Thanks for contacting us and for sharing your thoughts with us. If the blog owner has not done so already, please encourage them to contact us directly so that we can work with them on a satisfactory resolution to the issue.

Thanks,
Laura
TypePad Technical Services
Six Apart Ltd.

Topsecretk9

I've noticed that too. After the book came out and Plame turned out not to be a Plameologist, Empty kind of dumped her.

I thought it was that AND that she wasn't asked to write the afterword of Plame's book.

Topsecretk9

And MayBee, I suppose her genius argument is that if he had pardoned Libby he would NOT have done it to protect himself? Idiotic.

Heh.

Sue

If TypePad isn't pulling their hair out yet, they soon will be. Invest in hair plugs.

Jane

He'll accept that a sentence might be too harsh but will never substitute his judgement for the judge and jury.

Clarice,

I can't disagree with that sentiment, particularly from a non-lawyer. I didn't expect him to pardon Libby . I still was hoping he would - simply because the prosecution was such a sham.

clarice

As fate would have it Joe and Val are now out of it in Santa Fe--I am persuaded that this was a Clinton job, then Joe went to New exico to work, he said for Richardson, But I don't know that Richardson wanted him. In any event I don't think he did work for him. Then Richardson double crossed Hillary for Obama and finally he was bounced for obviously beng up to his eyeballs in political corruption.
End result..they have nowhere to go with Hill who now works for Obama; Richardson needs a lawyer not the Wilson-Plames and i can't see any reason why they'd be of any use to Obama.

Finito.
The moving finger having writ moves on.

cathyf
And to say that I think that Bush didn't pardon Libby because of his unwillingness to interfere in judicial matters.
I agree, and I think Bush is utterly missing the point. I think that the whole point of the Appointments Clause decision is that as far as the judicial branch is concerned, this is an executive branch cock-up, through and through, and they refused to "rescue" the president.

Fundamentally, the Appointments Clause ruling said that Bush is responsible for Fitzgerald's behavior. Prosecution is an inherent executive function, and prosecutorial discretion is executive discretion. As far as the judicial branch is concerned, it's Bush who is ultimately Captain Queeg looking for the strawberry thief, not Fitzgerald. If Bush did not exercise his authority over Fitzgerald, he has no reasonable expectation that the judicial branch is going to save his butt.

MayBee

Agreed, clarice.
I don't see any further movement on the movie that was supposed to be made of her life, either.
The fictionalized Judy Miller movie about it (starring Kate Beckinsdale) is trapped in distribution hell, too.

clarice

OTOH there surely has to be a movie made of a group of obsessive bloggers from all over the world who came together to winkle out the case..LOL

boris

movie made of a group of obsessive bloggers from all over the world who came together ...

Pretty sure Hollywood would make it a vampire horror flick.

clarice

Niters--I'm a reverse vampire who sleeps at night. PUK on the other hand is perfect for the classic vampire role. I don't think he's seen daylight for years and years.

boris

Well vampires or zombies.

The comments to this entry are closed.

Wilson/Plame