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September 23, 2011

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Danube of Thought

I am making the same prediction.

bolitha

TM, I'm afraid you are right.

Extraneus

The Chris Christie bandwagon is a lot like the Obama bandwagon: people projecting their views onto someone who doesn't necessarily share them.

If Perry fades, only Sarah can save us from Mitt.

Porchlight

I don't consider Palin a re-tread in the manner of Romney or Paul or Huckabee. She ran as McCain's VP and had to do it his way. If she runs on her own terms for the top of the ticket, it will be a different story.

Too early yet to crown (or practice crowning) anyone.

centralcal

I think too many of us still bear the scars of having to vote for McCain and aren't quite ready to concede that we will have to do it again (Romney).

I hope Sarah jumps in and at least gives it a go. Nothing ventured, nothing gained.

TC might have known him.

Years ago my brother said that Officeholders should appoint their replacements. Years later, when I reminded him of his remark, he denied remembering saying it, but said it wouldn't be much different than what we have.
===============

Ignatz

--By way of contrast, Dems are also in search of the next JFK.--

They're searching for a tax cutting, anti-communist, defense building, NRA life member?
He'd just be another bigoted Tea Bagger to the Dem nomenklatura these days.

Jack is Back!

I'd love to see a comparison of positions between Romney and McCain but most importantly, once you become POTUS the big difference is that person's values and how that affects their judgement. The Won/Odummy/Barry Soetero/JEF suffers severely from mature judgement based on the American value system. I believe McCain, despite all the noxious positions he may have had, would have used much more mature judgements based on our shared values than the current occupant or Hillary.

That is why despite being right on so many issues, Ron Paul does not share the most basic of American values which is the national security, interest and survival of the Republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice of all.

Jack is Back!

::suffers severely [from not having] mature judgement::

/Brain fart

So far, a compelling Solheim Cup from Killeen Castle, County Meath, Ireland. Looks like we are going to be one down after the first 2 rounds. LUN

Tune in and cheer on our gals. Golf Channel today.

Benjamin Franklin

Well, Mitt is 'the'Devil you know'. It's those dark horse candidates
which should give us pause.

Hawkins

Sorry, if we're holding our nose to vote for Romney, we're going to be holding the ballot at arm's length if Christie runs

Jane

It's tea party v republican squish party, and it looks like the squishes are winning.

Boatbuilder

What do you mean, "us," Paleface?

Jack is Back!

boat,

Ben is our own version of Joe McGuinness.

Rob Crawford

Ben is our own version of Joe McGuinness.

But more drunken and verbally violent.

peter

Holy Christmas! Bob Dole-- then George Bush--then John McCain, now Romney. My nose is starting to get dents from being squeezed so much in the voting booth.

bolitha

Neither Sarah Palin nor Christie will run--in my opinion. So, who's left?

jimmyk

So, who's left?

Whatever happened to John Bolton and Jeb Bush?

bolitha

Nobody that I know of wants another Bush right now. John Bolton has said he will not run. Ditto, Jeb Bush--and also, all of Jeb's buddies are on Mitt's bandwagon. So, again, who's left?

Texas Mom 2010

I refuse to hold my nose again and vote for Romney. I first voted in 1980 and have held my nose in 96, 2004, 2008 and I will not do it again. Especially for a candidate so horribly flawed. Seriously, a vote for Romney undercuts our ability to get rid of the budget busting monstrosity called Obamacare. I dislike Perry on immigration but he is educable by the public and will be convinced by a good argument to change his position. He has called for more manpower and especially drone coverage on the border. He has also deployed the Texas Rangers and more recently National Guard troops to beef up our border. He has also requested assistance from the Feds to in force the border. Although I like the idea of a fence, the Rio Grande makes a fence infeasible in many areas of the Texas/Mexico border. He has also pushed the Texas Legislature to stop sanctuary cities and force them to obey federal and state laws. Unfortunately, the governorship of Texas is weak by design of our state Constitution and he is in the position of being forced to advocate for change through the legislature. So, I can stomach voting for Perry but I just cannot destroy my liver function (forced use of excessive alcohol would be required) and vote for Romney. I do personally like the guy and would support him in any cabinet position...

jimmyk

Bolitha, obviously everyone else at this point (whether they've said so or not) is not running, so what is the point of your question?

John Thune has been discussed as a possibility. Yes, I know, he's not running.

Danube of Thought

I think Bolithacwas asking a rhetoriical question.

Taranto on Perry:

"Rick Perry was awful in last night's debate. Just awful. The swaggering Texas governor kept scrapping with the chipper Mitt Romney, and he kept losing. It was like watching Donny Osmond dominate John Wayne. Perry would say something, and Romney would respond dismissively with "Nice try" or 'I'm not sure exactly what he's saying' or 'I don't think he knows what he was talking about.'"

DebinNC

What's with Perry wilting in the latter part of these debates? What about that fugue moment during his flip-flop attack on Romney that prompted a Weekly Standard tweet asking if Perry had just had a stroke? Something seems to be physically amiss with Perry that more debate experience won't cure. And his worrisome crony capitalism record hasn't even been broached yet.

Carol Herman

Reagan was an outsider!

He enters politics for the republicans by doing a speech for Goldwater. (And, Goldwater thought Reagan was a jerk.)

To gain some "credentials," Reagan than ran ... in 1966 ... for Governor of California. And, the republican WINS! He does this again, and is re-elected.

After his 8 years in California are up, Reagan tries to enter the presidential field. And, is BLOCKED. How? Well, Nixon selected Gerald Ford. Who finishes off Nixon's last two years. And, Ford decides "he'd like to run on his own." SO HE LOST TO JIMMY CARTER!

Even in 1980, the elder Bush tried to block Reagan from the nomination.

The only thing, today, that comes close is Sarah Palin. Held by the insiders as "SOMEONE TO BE BLOCKED."

Meanwhile, the GOP is running a circus. None of those up there (perhaps except for Romney), have any claim to any great position within the GOP elite circle.)

Do you know why? Because the elites are few in number. They HATE the white christian base even more than other folk do. And, they don't have enough warm bodies to spread around a majority victory. So they're happy NOT to be in the White House!

Ignatz

--What's with Perry wilting in the latter part of these debates?--

I heard the plausible conjecture that his back surgery in July leads to his September swoons.
If he's like many folks I know who've had back surgery he may be in more pain now than he was before he had it.

Extraneus

It may not be worth the pixels it's printed on, but my prediction is that Sarah Palin is waiting it out while the game show contestants slug each other into submission, and all of her activities since 2008 point to a 2012 run. Perry's stumbles only make it more likely, and for all we know she took his measure a long time ago.

Judging by last night's debate, I think this is a smart strategy for all but an unknown. (Christie and Giuliani, neither of whom are unknowns, could be doing the same thing, and probably are, but it has already been pointed out that Christie has some serious problems when it comes to positions on issues that conservatives would enthusiastically support. Both are good fighters, but Giuliani's positions are better known, and probably less problematic.)

I also predict that whoever wins the nomination will be dealing with Hillary, not Obama.

Mark it: 9/23/11.

centralcal

My boss - definitely not a Palin fan, but a conservative - today for the first time said almost the same thing as you, Extraneus. That she is being smart and clever in sitting back and letting the pack maul each other.

I was shocked. I wonder how many others are giving Sarah a second look?

Extraneus

Marcia in Phoenix posted in the newer thread, after I did here, that Drudge is linking a Newsmax piece indicating that Christie is reconsidering, and will let donors know "within days." And why not? It ain't easy getting re-elected as a Republican in NJ. For that reason alone, I'd bet money he's getting in.

bolitha

Well, I like Sarah Palin very much, but I am definitely not giving her a second look. She just cannot win against Obama.

sickofrinos

christie is another democrat. Rubio/Cain?

Extraneus

Maybe not, but what if Obama drops another 5 points between now and the election? Would *any* Republican nominee lose to that clod? Seems debatable to me.

Put all of the Republican notables into the fray and let's see who wins. Including Rubio. Our bench is better than their first string.

Danube of Thought

Ok Ext., mark this too: Hillary won't run.

Extraneus

Heh. Let's hope not!

Chubby

after reading about Bristol riding the bull and afterwards confronting a swine who called her mother a whore, I find myself leaning toward Romney.

Bill in AZ sez it's time for Zero to resign

"Ok Ext., mark this too: Hillary won't run."

So who will run instead of Jugeared Commie? He is being eased out. Who else could it be but Hillary! The media is propping her up, what was that some stupid poll last week said she was a favorite something or other? One of the more headscratching headlines I have seen in a while.

The idiot muddle will fall all over themselves voting for her, not realizing she is a smart, clever, evil Commie compared to the stupid Jugeared Commie. We will be far worse off, and will have a hard time finding a candidate who can overcome the idiot muddle.

Chubby

((He is being eased out.))

I don't think so. Since he's been on the campaign trail doing his class warfare schtick, his poll numbers have gone up.

Extraneus

Is this the exchange you referred to, Chubby?

Bristol Palin had just been thrown from a ride on the West Hollywood's bar's famed mechanical bull when a guy in the crowd screamed, "Did you ride Levi like that?! Your mother's a whore!"

If she wasn't going to just ignore him, couldn't she at least come up with a less cringe-worthy comeback than asking him if he was gay?

A camera crew caught the whole thing as Bristol, at first still smiling, marched over to confront the guy, who later proudly identified himself as Stephen Hanks.

"What'd you say?" she asked him. "Your mother's the f--king devil," Hanks exclaimed. "She lives, she breaths," he retored, when Bristol asked what Sarah Palin had done wrong.

"You want her dead?" she asked. Hanks offered, "If there is a hell...she will be there...She's evil."

Then Bristol asked, "Is it because you're a homosexual?" Hanks said, "Pretty much," to which Bristol asserted, "And that's why you hate her."

When he asked why she thought he was homosexual, Bristol said, "Because I can tell you are. That's a nice wife you've got there," she added, gesturing to the man next to him.

I, for one, welcome people like Stephen Hanks if she gets in.

Extraneus
After a few more exchanges, with all the profanity coming from Hanks' end, Bristol and her group left the bar.
Chubby

that's it Ext. I watched the video and I admire Bristol's spunkiness in defending her mother. But I cannot abide the thought of four years of incidents like that distracting from the seriousness nation's business.

Extraneus

Does anyone think it's not going to get pretty dirty in 2012, no matter who the nominee is? I'm predicting violence before and after.

Chubby

seriousness **of the** nation's business

bolitha

Well, I like that Chris Christie "tells it like it is" and stands up to the media, but he is not a true conservative. At this point, I am beginning to think that to have a candidate to win, we --the conservatives--cannot run a true conservative. I, for one, am fiscally conservative and a liberal as far as social issues are concerned. I think states should decide whether or not abortion is legal. What to do, what to do?

narciso

probably one of those who 'hung' her in effigy in West Hollywood, or approved of it,
I figure about Mr. Hanks,

snarky

What about Cain? He'd need to hire a foreign policy heavyweight, but I can live with that.

Bill in AZ sez it's time for Zero to resign

His poll numbers have come up since football season started. Conservatives who might answer a phone poll are too busy watching college Thursday thru Saturday, then pro Sunday and Monday, then going to the kids games, going to practice, etc. Also, hunting season has started all over and will go through most of the fall. Who hunts?

The stock market also influences the idiot muddle greatly. The DOW was down 180 something Wednesday, then 391 yesterday, so that will cause a dip in a couple of days. But it was up 37 today, and the idiot muddle being the idiot muddle, up is UP! so the poll dip won't be long lived, especially if it goes "up" again for a day or two next week too. It's really hard to fool the muddle - they know which way is "up".

ABC News (Radio) is the journolist primary propaganda outlet, and whatever they say early in the morning gets repeated all over. You see the memes start there. A couple weeks ago they really surprised me with their story about Obamas crappy numbers in the WaPo. A corner was turned there, and ever since then little chinks have been taken out of Jugeared Commies thin facade. Then the idiotic "poll" about Hillary's! popularity. Now, maybe this is just a lot of wishful thinking by a lot of Hillary! supporters, but a lot of them run the MFM, and if they decide Jugeared Commie isn't running, he isn't running.

bolitha

Trust me. Obama will run. Hilary will not run. Obama will have no one challenge him.

Sara (Pal2Pal)

Seriously, a vote for Romney undercuts our ability to get rid of the budget busting monstrosity called Obamacare.

Are you saying you think Romney is flat out lying when he says his first act as President would be to sign an EO giving Obamacare waivers to all 50 states and then set about getting the Act repealed by Congress?

mittromney.com:

Our next president must repeal Obamacare and replace it with market-based reforms that empower states and individuals and reduce health care costs. States and private markets, not the federal government, hold the key to improving our health care system.

and under OBAMACARE:

Repeal and replace President Obama’s health care law Mitt Romney believes that Obamacare must be repealed. On his first day in office, he will issue an executive order paving the way for waivers from Obamacare for all 50 states. Subsequently, he will call on Congress to fully repeal Obamacare, and advocate reforms that return power to the states, improve access by slowing health care cost increases, and make health insurance portable and flexible for today’s economy.
Sara (Pal2Pal)

I, for one, welcome people like Stephen Hanks if she gets in.

Well I don't. I don't welcome any man who yells to a daughter, "your mother is a whore," and when asked why, his only answer is because she lives and breaths.

Who needs jerks like that in the party? Who would even want a jerk like that around them for any reason?

Ignatz

--At this point, I am beginning to think that to have a candidate to win, we --the conservatives--cannot run a true conservative.--

Yeah, mushes like Ford, Bush the elder, Bob Dole and McCain have a sterling track record in national elections, while guys like Reagan and somebody who at least ran as a conservative, Bush the younger, had their hats handed to them.

Extraneus

Who needs jerks like that in the party? Who would even want a jerk like that around them for any reason?

Stephen Hanks is in Obama's party, and they need (and have) many more like him.

Bill in AZ sez it's time for Zero to resign

"Trust me. Obama will run. Hilary will not run. Obama will have no one challenge him."

He can't win, and any sane person other than Jugeared Commie and ValJar know that - but they aren't sane.

I really don't want Hillary! in the race. She will be hard to beat, so I am now an Obama supporter just to keep him in the race so he can be beat like a rented mule.

Sara (Pal2Pal)

Stephen Hanks is in Obama's party, and they need (and have) many more like him.

Exacttly.

Danube of Thought

"So who will run instead of Jugeared Commie? He is being eased out."

By whom, and what is the evidence?

Danube of Thought

"Yeah, mushes like Ford, Bush the elder, Bob Dole and McCain have a sterling track record in national elections"

Bush the elder won; Bush 43 ran as a "compassionate" conservative the first time and won a second term on a record that would not distinguish him from Romney.

As for McCain, don't gorget who else was on the tickrt.

glasater

Jeb Bush would never get in the race, I believe. And as far as Christy is concerned, I have a nightmare that he gets into the race, wins the nomination and then keels over from a heart attack.

Jane

I think Romney will repeal Obamacare, I just don't think he will repeal Romneycare, and that is my issue.

Sara (Pal2Pal)

I just don't think he will repeal Romneycare, and that is my issue.

How could he do that, isn't it up to your State Legislature?

narciso

The plot apparently sickens:

http://lockerz.com/s/31753803

centralcal

Narciso - is that the guy who confronted Bristol (I didn't feel any need to watch the stupid video)? So is he a plant working with Levi?

Dear gawd! Sleezeballs just get sleezier.

Jane

He can't. That is also my issue.

Captain Hate

The smartest boy from Hope Arkansas has amazing lapses of memory even when he's not under oath: http://yidwithlid.blogspot.com/2011/09/bill-clintons-lying-netanyahu-has.html

jimmyk

Bush the elder won

Basically on Reagan's popularity, against an awful candidate, and then failed to win reelection, something no Republican has done since Hoover (I'm excluding Ford, who was never elected in the first place).

I agree with Iggie: moderate Republicans make for weak candidates. The fact that Bush 41 snuck in for one term doesn't really change that. Bush 43 was widely viewed as more conservative than his father, even if he wasn't exactly Reagan. McCain, Dole, and Bush 41 all failed as moderates. And I don't believe for a second that Palin was the cause of McCain's loss.

daddy

If Todd Palin would just walk up and beat the shit out of Joe McGinniss and Stephen Hanks I'd vote for him for President.

Sandy Daze

jimmyk - Jusy so.

America is fundamentally a conservative nation. It was 43s lack of fiscal conservatism that led to the 2006 losses, from which we are still reeling.

In head to head contests Americans will not vote in sufficient numbers for Republicans when they are nothing more than a "lite" (low calorie) version of a democrat. Why have a repub when a dem is the real thing.

Christie is no conservative and tho he has had some good dust-ups in the fiscal arena, he is a GZM squish (can't we all just get along) and a man-made climate change adherent. He is no conservative.

Perry is increasingly less impressive. It is as if he believes he can "wing it" in the debates, he is ill prepared and the Texas swagger (about which I have no problem) is not a sufficient replacement for sound preparation.

Sarah Palin, otoh, is a conservative. As others have noted, she drives the debate and frames the discussion with her comments. She can (and imho) will win if she enters.

In January, Clarice posted "Palin’s appeal and why Her Detractors Rightly Fear It" saying, in part:


Writing in Big Journalism, Mike Metroulas brilliantly puts his finger on Palin’s appeal: the demonizing of her is motivated by her detractors’ knowledge that her nomination “would unleash a grassroots fury of support unseen on the right for a Republican presidential nominee in recent memory.”

In comment then which I'll repeat now:

Lets have it out. Cage match to the end. Does Palin more reflect American values, hopes and dreams or is it the Poseur, michael moore and their ilk?

In sum, in my view, if Palin enters, she earns the nom, and ultimately is elected the 45th President of the United States of America.

If she does not enter, I suppport
ABO - Anyone But Voldemort,
OMG - Voldemort Must Go.

Take good care,
Sandy

Zoom-Zoom
-- Blue Angles Air Show today !!!

pagar

Great comments, Sandy!


"America is fundamentally a conservative nation."

That is what the American leftists hate and are doing their best to change.

Cecil Turner

Get used to the sound of it:

"President Perry."
(IMHO, of course.)

Sandy Daze


CT --

I would not mind a President Perry. . .
please do not misunderstand me. Over and over I have stated very simply that until such time as Sarah decides not to seek the nomination or until she does and (in the highly unlikely event, imho) does not earn the nomination, all of my support is for her.

Should she NOT be the nominee I will support ABO--
joyfully, helpfully, agressively and strongly

. . . becasue at the end of the day, OMG.

Take good care,
Sandy

Sandy Daze

CT -

Please do not misunderstand me.

Over and over I have stated that until such time that SP decides NOT to seek the nomination, or in the (highly unlikely, imho) event that she seeks but does not earn the nomination, all of my support is for her.

BUT, should she not be the nominee, then I will support--happily, joyfully, aggressively and strongly--ABO

. . .because at the end of the day OMG.

Take good care,
Sandy

Sandy Daze

(oops - typhus seemed to have devoured the first, so I rewrote)

Cecil Turner

Sandy,

I too would prefer Palin over all the available candidates (except perhaps Perry), but believe she is actually unelectable.

But I am with Texas Mom above on the creeping socialism that a vote for Romney enables (and the undermining of necessary reforms by the confused messaging). I don't know if I'd hold my nose or not, but I sure wouldn't be excited about it. And I very much suspect the rest of the engergized GOP base (which tends largely to consist of TPers and fiscal hawks) would feel the same. His pull amongst the muddle had better be awfully good to counteract that effect . . . and I don't think it is.

Moreover, I think this is academic. My sense of the GOP is that there is a clear majority that demand fiscal conservatism and that Mitt, however slickly packaged, cannot win the nomination. And I for one am not going to be talked into him for the sake of an "electability" that I also consider bogus. If he wins the nomination, I might vote for him. (But he'd better hope there's something else on the ballot worth the trip.)

Paul

I believe that by the time the election rolls around the only one who will be unelectable will be Little Zero.

Palin will beat him like a rented mule. The media has used all their ammunition up, and she is way more canny than her detractors imagine. She is waiting wisely and patiently to make her move.

She is also authentic. The real deal.

Captain Hate

I too would prefer Palin over all the available candidates (except perhaps Perry), but believe she is actually unelectable.

You might be right, CT; and the price of my finding that out for sure would be a second BOzo term which would be horrible for the survival of the country. However I refuse to believe the public is that stupid and willing to be led by the same crew of idiots that shoveled out the garbage about the qualifications of El JEFe.

I'd like to think that a large portion of the muddle were gulled into voting for the jugeared fellow for what I would like to characterize as optimistic reasons; ie. they bought into the lies as presented thinking they were getting somebody very different from the dumbbell grifter from who knows where. I doubt that people like being lied to any less than I do.

Sandy Daze

Palin is a meat eater; the others are plant eaters. One-on-one with Voldemort and there's no contest really, she'll use and abuse him like the towel which is used to wipe the sweat up under the basket.

As to whether she's electable; I think my dead dog, George, could beat Voldemort.

My concern--in the fevered paranoid recesses of my brain--is will Voldemort willingly give up power when it becomes obvious he has lost. (It will be quite obvious well before the election, if not already obvious now.) Will he use a pretext of what, surreptitiously inciting riots ("we are your army" - Trumka) to institute MArshall Law, obviating the elections in a Castro/Chavez/Zeleya inspired autogolpe?

I do not trust the bastard.

He is a liar. PROVEN in the other thread.

Fundamental transformation.

He is a TRAITOR.

Take good care,
Sandy

sbw

"But I cannot abide the thought of four years of incidents like that distracting from the seriousness nation's business."

We have had four years of distractions from Obama, Reid, and Pelosi and you are worried about Bristol? How silly.

Sara (Pal2Pal)

My heart is also with Palin and if she gets in, I will support her. I didn't know much about Perry and decided to wait until I saw him in the debates and on the campaign trail before jumping on his bandwagon. I don't find much about him that I find likeable. He has been a disaster in the debates and hurt himself badly, especially in this last one, which is the most watched so far. Between Google and YouTube, it had a worldwide audience. He acts like he already has the nomination, so he can just dial it in.

Pat d

Palin is already within 5 pts on Obama and she hasn't entered the race, yet. She beats him among independents. That is a 20pt turn-around. Newt Gingrich and the NYT both took notice of her Iowa speech. Here's the NYT:

"Ms. Palin may be hinting at a new political alignment that would pit a vigorous localism against a kind of national-global institutionalism.

On one side would be those Americans who believe in the power of vast, well-developed institutions like Goldman Sachs, the Teamsters Union, General Electric, Google and the U.S. Department of Education to make the world better. On the other side would be people who believe that power, whether public or private, becomes corrupt and unresponsive the more remote and more anonymous it becomes; they would press to live in self-contained, self-governing enclaves that bear the burden of their own prosperity."

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/10/us/10iht-currents10.html?_r=4&src=tp&smid=fb-share

Beware the arctic fox. She's smarter than she lets you think she is.

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