Ask A Different Question...

Ask a different question and you'll get a different answer - that is my take on Mitt Romney's latest alleged "flip-flop".  Both the interesting Jon Chait and the invaluable Byron York tells us that Romney has changed his view on the wisdom of the Iraq invasion.  Mr. York:

In an appearance on "Fox News Sunday" a few days ago, Mitt Romney was asked whether, given what we know today, the 2003 U.S. invasion of Iraq was the right thing to do. Romney wouldn't say.

...

Wednesday morning, in an interview on MSNBC, Romney got the question again.  This time, his answer was not only different but definitive: No, the U.S. would not have invaded Iraq had officials known there were no weapons of mass destruction there.

"Well, if we knew at the time of our entry into Iraq that there were no weapons of mass destruction -- if somehow we had been given that information, why, obviously we would not have gone in," Romney said.

"You don't think we would have gone in?" asked MSNBC's Chuck Todd.

"Well, of course not," Romney answered.  "The president went in based upon intelligence that they had weapons of mass destruction. Had he known that that was not the case, the U.N. would not have put forward resolutions authorizing this type of action. The president would not have been pursuing that course."

Romney's statement on MSNBC is not only a change from what he said on Fox a few days ago.  It's also a change from his position during his first run for the Republican presidential nomination in 2007-2008.  In a January 2008 GOP debate in Florida, Romney was asked, "Was the war in Iraq a good idea worth the cost in blood and treasure we have spent?"  Romney answered: "It was the right decision to go into Iraq. I supported it at the time; I support it now."

Here is the actual debate question from 2008:

MR. RUSSERT: The Wall Street Journal/NBC News poll today, the highest percentage ever of Americans -- six in 10 -- said that the removal of Saddam Hussein from power was not worth the price we have paid in blood and treasure. Every Democratic -- (applause) -- excuse me. Excuse me, please. The Democratic nominee will go to the country and say the war in Iraq is a bad idea not worth the price in blood and treasure, and we should get out.

I want each of you to take 30 seconds. Will you go to the country, Senator McCain, and say the war was a good idea worth the price in blood and treasure, and we will stay?

And Romney's answer:

MR. ROMNEY: It was the right decision to go into Iraq. I supported it at the time; I support it now.

It was not well managed in the -- after the takedown of Saddam Hussein and his military. That was done brilliantly, an extraordinary success. But in the years that followed, it was not well -- we were undermanaged, underprepared, underplanned, understaffed, and then we come into the phase that we have now. The plan that President Bush and General Petraeus put together is working. It's changing lives there.

And perhaps most importantly, it's making sure that al Qaeda and no other group like them is becoming a superpower, if you will, in the communities, and having a safe haven from which they launch attacks against us.

It's critical for us. When we think about debating the Democrats, they might want to go back and talk about what happened at the beginning. But the most important issue is what do we do now, and their just run and retreat regardless of the consequences is going to be a real problem for them when they face a debate with a Republican on the stage.

It strikes me that there is a large difference between retrospectively describing the likely play of the political process, as Romney was doing recently, and assessing the fundamental desirability of removing Saddam.

Comments

[NK]

TomM-- "Occupy Darien" story makes it into Instapundit-- will JOM comment? Not much of a story, 10 oldtimers from Woodstock/No Nukes days and one kid holding a placard. They plan to pay train fare for an army to travel from Manhattan, maybe better luck today. Story in the link: http://www.thedailydarien.com/news/first-day-occupy-darien-draws-small-crowd

[steve]

I don't see any inconsistency in what Romney said (in fact, it's my position as well).

Had we known there were no WMDs, there wouldn't have been an invasion. But since we didn't know, invading was the right thing to do. And, having invaded Iraq, the aftermath could have and should have been handled a whole lot better than it was.

[Jack is Back! (Tintin for President)]

I agree with Steve and see no conflict between the two Mitt statements on Iraq. Now, if someone can find where Mitt said invading Iraq (WMD or not) was a bad idea and he would not have taken this action regardless, then that would be flip-flop.

[Full disclosure: Mitt is not my first or second choice currently but his judgement here I can fully agree with].

/Wonder what he thinks of Tintin movie?

[Appalled]

If you get yourself a reputation as a flip flopper, this is what happens to you. I agree with TM's analysis, but in the long slog of a campaign, it is rather beside the point. Fortunately, the 2012 campaign will not depend on what either candidate thinks about Iraq.

[Kate]

interesting information. there is something to think about

[Danube of Thought]

Minus 14 at Raz roday; 49% somewhat approve.

[Appalled]

Minus 14 at Raz roday; 49% somewhat approve.

In a great moment of wtf, the GOP got itself on the wrong side of a tax cut issue, and the Prez is exploiting it for all it's worth. Is the problem in the House the Michele Bachmann caucus that cannot understand the political necessity of an occasional compromise, or did Boehner just screw this one up?

[narciso]

You do realize Appalled, that the two month plan, can't be implemented, right. Tapper had the analysis from a group that studies these
'things of this nature'

I recall, a more equivocal stance by Mitt, on the surge, but that is a good answer, as far as it goes,

[narciso]

As to the management, State relied to much on the likes of Eagleton and Bodine, who naturally deferred to the Baathists, their candidate was Pachachi, the UN envoy last seen
inveighing against Israel, at the end of Michael Oren's masterful book on the Six Day War. the CIA's best preference was Khazraji, a general who had been in the thick of the Anfal campaign before he turned, imagine what
a lead balloon that would have dropped. Their default was Allawi, whose INA, introduced the idea of using car bombs in Baghdad's against certain targets.

[Appalled]

You do realize Appalled, that the two month plan, can't be implemented, right.

I'm aware of it. But groups like that issue warnings like that all the time, and still the legislation gets passed. Then the IRS issues regulations, or non-enforcement announcements that make the thing workable. In any event, a further extension is likely and would be assumed in IRS guidance.

My question still remains -- did Boehner take the position he did because the no surrender part of his caucus refused to take a two month breather?

[narciso]

So the actual content of the bill doesn't matter, much as with Dodd Frank, the notion
is more important,

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2011/12/two-month-payroll-tax-holiday-passed-by-senate-pushed-by-president-cannot-be-implemented-properly-experts-say/

[Jane]

Everything is very depressing. At half time on the radio today, the producer told me to get more upbeat. All I can see is a corrupt media and massive voter fraud.

Bah Humbug.

[Above the fruited valleys.]

Saddam bluffed about his WMD to keep the Persians at bay. Everyone and his dog believed he had WMD. His bluff was working. He'd slamdunked it and the backstop was still shaking. Besides, didn't some envoy connected unusually with the CIA return from a trip to Africa claiming that Saddam had made commercial yellowcake inquiries there in 1999. Maybe I've imagined that; let me check the files.

Furthermore, it is shown that Saddam had the will to WMD and the way with OFF. Yet also possible he had an active nuke program, subcontracted for a coupla billion to our old friend Khaddafy.

So Romney is right so far, that had we known Saddam had so little WMD we might not have invaded. But knowing that he had the will and the way we should have invaded anyway. And this is not to mention the purple fingered majesty that is a relatively secular Shia regime, and a buffer state that Obama will soon allow to become belligerant.

I've a feeling Iraq will continue in the public discourse over the next year. Were Romney to grasp just a little more of the Bush urge to spread democracy, he could have a win/win strategy, particularly if Iraq deteriorates, or Iran gets crazier.

He's being very careful. I've a feeling his cautiousness is going to be what a frightened nation is willing to try, knowing that having survived four years of Obama, they can survive four years of anything.
============

[narciso]

It sadly will, Kim, because they are trying to implement that partition plan, that Gelb
and Biden, cooked up four years ago, one thing
I learned from Hitchens, whether it's Kashmir, Palestine, Cyprus, Kosovo, they never work.

[MarkO]

I'm not so certain we've survived Obama. He's introduced a virulent toxin in our system and the effects are only now beginning to manifest.

[Old Lurker]

Jane you are right to be depressed. The thing about the stupid payroll box is, as DoT, I, and others discussed last night is that no voices on the right have even hinted that they understand the Prog goal is to reduce FICA taxes as low as possible so the burden of the SS checks falls on the increasingly small group of citizens who pay income taxes. So the fight should not be about who can redistribute more, faster, longer... but why we want to go down that road at all.

It is enough to dirve DoT to drink. I'm pouring.

[bolitha]

Sometimes "careful" comes across as wishy-washy and trying to say whatever one needs to to get elected.

[Old Lurker]

The toxin was placed here by FDR if not Wilson, Mark. Obama has just injected steroids into it.

[narciso]

Some times memory is a curse, not a blessing;

http://justoneminute.typepad.com/main/2009/11/no-blood-for-oil-unless-it-is-for-democrats/comments/page/2/

[narciso]

I should add, only about the ostensible subject of the post, not the recollections of Peter,

[Extraneus]

Calling PD.

Madison settles lawsuit brought by the 'Culver's Five' in open carry incident

[Benjamin Franklin]

Funny how many run away from this subject NOW.......

History and wisdom through the HIND porthole is sobering, for those who actually have a conscience.

[sbw]

Slowly the press is beginning to tease out the real details about the payroll tax. We editorialized about (New York Sentator) Schumer's favored version being judged unworkable and asked AP to send more detail on the substantive disagreements, not the posturing.

Don't blame GOP when the press doesn't publish what congressmen like Mcclintock say.

[Rick Ballard]

"Don't blame GOP when the press doesn't publish what congressmen like Mcclintock say."

Hear, hear. If you have solid suggestions, the Speaker's blog accepts comments, as well as providing evidence that he's not just sitting there like a lump.

The MFM stonewall is just as nonexistent as the establishment.

Wrt topic - I believe that Romney has come very close to the Goldilock's Optimum on this one. A little more study of polling results and his answer should be jussst right.

[Extraneus]

Wave of Deadly Bombings Rock Iraq

Coordinated attacks across Baghdad on Thursday morning, left at least 57 people dead and injured nearly 200 in the Iraqi capital just days after American forces left the country.

[narciso]

Galbraith, I kind of liked because he was one who called attention to the Anfal and particularly Halabja, so it strikes me a little ironic when he penned books about Iraq being Iran's prize, when the Kurdish leadership were on as good terms with Iran,
who would they rather, the Turks, the Russians

[Jane]

Wherein I rename gay marriage and solve everyone's problem.

[jimmyk]

OT, via Tim Blair:
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-12-20/bankers-join-billionaires-to-debunk-imbecile-attack-on-top-1-.html

Money quote:

[Home Depot co-founder Bernard Marcus] said he isn’t worried that speaking out might make him a target of protesters.

“Who gives a crap about some imbecile?” Marcus said. “Are you kidding me?”

Then there was this tidbit:

“If I hear a politician use the term ‘paying your fair share’ one more time, I’m going to vomit,” said Golisano, who turned 70 last month, celebrating the birthday with girlfriend Monica Seles

What!? What!?

[narciso]

Of course what did Michelle say about a 300-600 tax cut;

http://weaselzippers.us/2011/12/22/obama-introduces-new-campaign-pitch-what-does-40-mean-to-you-pathetic-stories-roll-in/

[RichatUF]

Didn't the House pass the full year extension and the Senate tabled it so they could pass only 2 months? Just curious but are we getting "bested" by Dingy Harry on this.

Good grief.

[jimmyk]

And in the "What could go wrong?" department, installment #47:
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/22/business/a-central-bank-doing-what-central-banks-do.html

[ECB President] Draghi announced his intentions on Dec. 8, when the central bank said it would offer to lend money to banks for three-year terms, in unlimited amounts, at a very low rate....There is no limit on what the banks can do with the money. [my emphasis]

...In normal times, borrowing from a central bank is seen as a sign of weakness, and banks hate to do it for fear word will leak out that they had to do it. And banks have come under pressure to raise more capital in part because of their exposure to dubious government paper. Would they really line up to buy more, even with favorable financing?

The answer is yes. On Wednesday, the European Central Bank announced that 523 banks would borrow a total of 489.2 billion euros ($640 billion). That was above virtually every forecast.

Shocking! The ECB offers free money, and get more takers than it expected.

[Ignatz]

--In a great moment of wtf, the GOP got itself on the wrong side of a tax cut issue, and the Prez is exploiting it for all it's worth.--

Nate Silver argued yesterday and it was pretty convincing, that the payroll tax has little to do with Barry's polls, but is actually the economy as a whole and consumer sentiment.

[narciso]

Mind you, Reid is the genius, as Sen. Harrison in Casino, who thought it was a good move to antagonize Frank Rosenthal and his
associate Tony 'the Ant' Spilotro, a real rocket scientist.

[Ignatz]

It's seems an odd argument to make that Barry is getting the best of the Republicans on this issue anyway given that the Repub bill extended the cut a year and the Dem one for two months.
How does that equate to better polling for Barry?

[Captain Hate]

jimmyk I'm in town and looking forward to meeting up.

[PDinDetroit]

Extraneus - I know I am not the PD you were calling, but being in the Open Carry Community in MI I have kept aware of the Culver 5 Incident.

From the start, Madison Leo's and Prosecutors were in the wrong and they knew it. The article linked is incorrect, the Culver 5 did get a judgement not just a settlement (judgement link is in the LUN).

I am so very glad that we have extremely few issues here in MI for OC over the past 2 years due to the efforts of Firearm Rights Activists. This is as it should be.

[Jack is Back! (Tintin for President)]

From Insty, this link to The Atlantic (of all places) and their Graphs of The Year. Lots of mythical balloons pop.

[peter]

Captain, you brought to NYC some great weather for the Winter Solstice. 59 degrees and sunny. Enjoy your night with Jimmyk.

[Ignatz]

Dodd Frank and the Volcker rule raise the costs of mutual funds, which small investors overwhelmingly use and dry up the market for smaller business credit.
Liberals help big business and large investors vs smaller businesses and small investors...again.
Surprise, surprise.

[bolitha]

Ignatz, the way the Dems are playing it is--the mean repubs will not extend the tax cut for two months--no matter that the Repubs want to extend it for a year, and the people hearing this think the Republicans will not give them a tax cut. Sorry, but that's the way it is playing. Pitiful that no Republican is clearing this up.

[jimmyk]

Likewise, CH. Hey, PDinDetroit, welcome back (if I'm not mistaken). How about those Lions?

[Captain Hate]

That's my gift to you, Peter; hope to meet up with you in the future. And happy shortest day of the year to all.

[daddy]

"All I can see is a corrupt media..."

Jane,

The overhead TV tonight in Shanghai was CNN International.

First up was a snarky host delivering a snarky story on Rick Perry being stupid for apparently saying "KIM Jong the 2nd" instead of "Kim Jong Il." Big snide yucks at Perry's stupidity.

Then was a story attacking Michelle Bauchmann for saying something like "North Korea was the Walmart of IBM delivery systems." Snarky host tells us Walmart says that to say that "is stupid" and that they are angry about it. Then they interview some Walmart guy who never says "it was stupid", but the host has already poisoned the audience with the "Bauchmann is stupid meme." Big snide yucks at Bauckmann's stupidity and lack of caring about Walmart folks.

Next up was close ups of crying illegal immigrant kids sending letters to President Obama to please not deport their momma's and papa's this Christmas Season. Obama as the Savior, and people wanting to enforce Immigration Law as heartless and evil.

Next up was White on Black Racism in sports.

Followed by their International Weather guy with obligatory AGW meme .

It was repellant, corrupt drivel, start to finish, until the snarky male host was replaced by a snarky female host and then the meme's were repeated again:

1) Repub's Stupid
2) President is Savior
3) Whites are Racist
4) AGW

Same as always. The day CNN closes it's doors forever is a great day for honesty on this planet.

[narciso]

Well there is a reason why Stuart Mill dubbed the Tories, the stupid party,

[narciso]

Hey that was a good line by Bachmann. idiots, then again they squandered their number 1 position,

[Jane]

Daddy,

That makes you understand why Fed Ex drivers are throwing flat screen TV's over fences.

(Or maybe you had to be there)

[Extraneus]

I know I am not the PD you were calling

Oh yes you were. (I don't know any other PDs who know anything about Open Carry.)

[Neo]

The Finnish authorities have impounded an Isle of Man-flagged ship bound for China with undeclared missiles and explosives, officials say.

Police are questioning the crew of the MS Thor Liberty after what were described as 69 Patriot anti-missile missiles were found aboard.

[Ignatz]

Must read of the day:
Louis Woodhill at Forbes has what should be the last word on the worthless payroll tax cut.
Contains this keeper:

America has a two-party system. We have a Stupid Party (the Republicans) and an Evil Party (the Democrats). Every so often Congress does something that is both stupid and evil, and we call this “bipartisanship”.

[Extraneus]

(Actually, I don't know anyone else who knows anything about Open Carry.)

[Jack is Back! (Tintin for President)]

daddy,

Was the White on Black racism in sports the John Terry v. Ferdinand issue of Chelsea against Queen's Parks Rangers?

Peter,

Took a glorious walk on the beach this morning and it was more like spring than winter. Popular trees lining Gin Lane are budding. But then there is always tomorrow and Saturday - bundle up.

narciso,

John Paulson, who is referenced in the Bloomberg article, is here in Southampton and gave over $10 million to Southampton Hospital for the emergency room (which spends most of its time and money handling illegals). The kind of 1% I wish the 99% would act like.

[PDinDetroit]

How about those Lions?

I still refer to them as "stumblebums" in honor of my late father (JD). I just do not get why they wait so fricken long into the game to win it (probably the young quarterback). My mom is very happy with them, so I cannot complain too much (unless the Red Wings lose badly).

[narciso]

Weren't they the team that George Plimpton played for, one season, and doesn't that tell you everything

[Ignatz]

This guy at AmSpec wonders why Barry would try to recapitulate Teddy Roosevelt's speech at Osawatomie, in that shortly thereafter, TRs party lost 56 seats in the House and then Roosevelt waged the disastrous campaign of 2012, ripping his party in half and losing miserably.
Pretty strange optics when you think about it.

[Ignatz]

--Actually, I don't know anyone else who knows anything about Open Carry.--

All I know about it is that the delightful Governor Moonbeam signed a bill into law making it illegal in CA to open carry anywhere in the state.
Crime rates certain to plummet.

[PDinDetroit]

(Actually, I don't know anyone else who knows anything about Open Carry.)

Thanks, but I am not the only one who knows about it. Open Carry is legal in 43 States and each state has a forum on Open Carry DOT org where information can be found if desired. I find it "mildly amusing" that the Local Police Departments know less about it than those who carry this way.

Due to our work last year in MI, the Michigan State Police created Legal Update #86 which covers the legal aspects of OC pretty effectively (LUN - one of our members helped craft it).

Why carry a firearm? Because carrying a cop is too heavy!

[cathyf]

Fortunately, the 2012 campaign will not depend on what either candidate thinks about Iraq.

Well, if we're lucky.

If some Iraqi partisans of one side or another think that their interests would be served by bulk-mailing anthrax in official-looking IRS envelops, then we'll all be thinking about Iraq.

[Ignatz]

--If some Iraqi partisans of one side or another think that their interests would be served by bulk-mailing anthrax in official-looking IRS envelops, then we'll all be thinking about Iraq.--

And if Iraq goes up in flames, as it appears it might, by our premature withdrawal, then it may very well be a very large campaign issue as well.

[daddy]

Kadiddlehop?

Jane, have you run this thru Red Skelton?

No word yet from the company on the computer tosser.

"Was the White on Black racism in sports the John Terry v. Ferdinand issue of Chelsea against Queen's Parks Rangers?"

Yes JiB,

but then it evolved into a larger discussion of the long history of White on Black Racism throughout the last Century, America etc. When the female was hosting it had turned into a big round table civil rights discussion...I was sitting with a Welshman, a Scot, the Irish Pubowner (an Irishman) and his pretty Chinese
beer pourer. When they started discussing Racism in Rugby the Irish owner said something like "Bolix", and changed the channel asap:)

[Comanche Voter]

Romney is simply tiresome. I don't much care which way he flip flops. We'll get a technocrat who can get things done in an orderly way, but it will be about as exciting as rice pudding.

[PDinDetroit]

All I know about it is that the delightful Governor Moonbeam signed a bill into law making it illegal in CA to open carry anywhere in the state.

Definitely not with the National Trends where Firearm Rights are more and more recognized, not ignored or denigrated. I hear that some will be doing LGOC (Long Gun Open Carry) as a form of protest and political speech under 1A. Not sure about LGOC, but it does have its place and time and I support the right to do so.

What will be interesting will be the future court cases where the guidance delivered this year by the US 9th Circuit Court of Appeals will come into play. Under Nordyke TS v. King, the US 9th Circuit Court stated that the "Substantial Burden Test" be applied to Firearm Laws, Rules, and Regulations. I seriously doubt that the Open Carry Ban, especially with the Defacto "May Issue" Concealed Carry System, would stand up to Legal Scrutiny under the "Substantial Burden Test".

LUN for more on the recent US 9th Circuit Court Decision.

[NK]

Daddy--
what's CNN?

[daddy]

Off to work.

Have a good time tonight in New York boys.

And from narciso's link, I saw mention of Kerry's DD-214 still not being released yet. Anyone know what the tally of days is now from when he told us he was going to release his DD-214?

I'm guessing 2,000 days off the top of my head.

We ought to make it todays contest. No cheating.

How many days since John Kerry told us he was going to release his DD-214?

Get your bets out there. Winner gets a free beer tonight at JimmyK's Keely Pub. Don't yet know who's buying.

I'm sticking with 2,000 days.

Bye.

[sbw]

Weren't they the team that George Plimpton played for, one season

A couple of plays in one game, and pre-season at that.

[matt]

actually, depending upon the point in time, Iraq can be seen in many ways. It is an evolving process And that is where the fallacy of the "gotcha" folks is apparent.

In '03, Saddam was doing his best to be the bete noir of the West and showed absolutely no regard for his own hide, frankly. It's pretty stupid to call down the wrath of the world upon oneself which is what he did.

In '06 it looked bleak.

In '09 it looked much better

Today, not so good....

The historians will be writing the history of the Middle East and the Ummah in 100 years. We have no clue how it will all turn out.

I fear though that our legacy from Iraq and Afghanistan will be worse than from Vietnam with deeper consequences.

[NK]

JimmyK/CaptH-- enjoy beers tonight, hopefully Keeley's has an outdoor bar. Spectacular day in NYC.

[matt]

This Finnish thing is bizarre. How do 60 Patriots get out of the Raytheon factory to Germany and then onto a ship bound for China without being manifested? 60 of them?

There are a lot of them knocking around Europe.I wonder which government sold its soul to the Chinese. This does not look good.

[narciso]

It stands at the intersection of Arabia, Syria and Iran, although I figure Qatar will play a larger role there, with or without us,
as we've seen in Libya.

[Ignatz]

PJ Media and Hans Von Spakovsky detail the story of a career civil rights lawyer at Holder's DOJ openly
admitting to three counts of perjury.
She is a fanatical left winger and has been neither disciplined nor fired.
Is anyone surprised?

[narciso]

That provided an avenue to go after Delay, so it's all good from their point of view.

[cathyf]

So, daddy, last night the FedEx driver left my (correctly-addressed) amazon package on the neighbor's porch. (The neighbor's address is different from mine.) Fortunately it was still there this morning.

[Rocco]

I finally figured out what to get my wife for Christmas. Does anyone know how to wrap a lawnmower?

[matt]

has anyone heard from clarice?

I can imagine her next post, "Clarice among the Lions".

[sbw]

cathyf, cut daddy some slack. I'm sure it was not him but one of the 20,000 temps. ;-)

[Danube of Thought]

Did the GOP one-year proposal include "paying for" the tax holiday through a surtax on mortgages over $200K?

[cathyf]

Not sure about the lawnmower, Rocco, but does how to wrap a cat for Christmas help?

[cathyf]

The true irony of the package is that it contains mom & dad's Christmas present, a new GPS. So it wasn't just anything that went astray, it was a GPS that got lost!

[Frau Argwohn]

... why Barry would try to recapitulate Teddy Roosevelt's speech at Osawatomie...

It's a subtle kiss to Billy the Bomber just like Bent Willie wore the tie Monica gave him. The public will appreciate the Teddy Roosevelt touch and not know about the sinister "Prairie Fire" connection.

[Ignatz]

--Did the GOP one-year proposal include "paying for" the tax holiday through a surtax on mortgages over $200K?--

I don't believe so.

[Ignatz]

--It's a subtle kiss to Billy the Bomber just like Bent Willie wore the tie Monica gave him.--

Well yeah, but the public propaganda was regarding TR, and that presaged electoral disaster for TR and his party, whether Republican or Progressive.
I guess there testing George Santayana's hypothesis?

[Ignatz]

I guess "they're" testing.......

[Ignatz]

--Daddy,

That makes you understand why Fed Ex drivers are throwing flat screen TV's over fences.--

Well they're supposed to deliver one today so I hope it lands on the right side of our fence.

[Chubby]

((I finally figured out what to get my wife for Christmas. Does anyone know how to wrap a lawnmower? ))

lol, when my dad bought my mom a sit-down lawnmower, it was her favorite gift. Seven acres of field to mow and she loved every minute of it.

My dad was a practical joker, especially when it came to "wrapping" gifts. One year he bought my mom a painting that she had admired at an art show, but instead of wrapping it, he got up way early Christmas morning, removed a painting from the dining room and hung the new one in its place. We were all in on the joke, and my mom didn't figure it out for literally hours. It was funny as heck, but probably a bit cruel :)

[Chubby]

*the whole seven acres wasn't field. She didn't mow the surrounding woods...

[Frau Argwohn]

I had to leave the room when the financial news was interrupted for Pres. Farce and his newest political theater. At least he brought transparency: It's blatant bravo sierra.

[Chubby]

Ranger, the news about the bombing in Iraq is dreadful

[centralcal]

matt: Clarice posted earlier this morning on yesterday's thread. Sounds like she and Wolverine are having a ball.

[Jim Miller]

According to this AP story, a German official is saying that the missiles are a legitimate shipment from Germany to South Korea.

Seems kind of careless to put top-secret missiles on an ordinary freighter, especially one headed for China.

[hit and run]

In USPS news,we were expecting one last package on Tuesday. Didn't come. mrs hit and run got on line and the update on its status was "delivery not made because no one home to receive".

Well. We have eight adults here and by golly there were never fewer than four here at any time on Tuesday.

So mrs hit and run called the post office and the lady told her,"well,the driver probably just decided not to deliver it. It's here if you want to come pick it up. Oh, wait. Actually there are four packages waiting for you here."

Maybe neither snow, nor rain, nor heat, nor gloom of night will stay the carriers from the swift completion of their appointed rounds.

But postman apathy? Yeah,that'll do it.

[Rocco]

Cute cathyF, the cat didn't seem to mind.

[Jane]

Kadiddlehop?

Jane, have you run this thru Red Skelton?

I ran it thru Amy who immediately announced she would like to Kadiddlehop her wifw.

WE just had our Christmas lunch of 3 cocktails so forgive me if that is too graphic.

[Jane]

Matt,

Clarice posted at the end of the last thread.

[Jack is Back!]

Hit,

Whenever I buy online I make sure that shipping is by other tha USPS. Too many apathetic non-deliveries. Not much choice though when I am dealing off-shore so am resigned to trudging down to the P.O. and picking up with a pink slip even though we were home at time of delivery on the note. Also, several cases of placing mail in mail box with the flag up for pick up that never get delivered.

As soon as that archaic albatross is off or neck the better.

[PDinDetroit]

This Finnish thing is bizarre. How do 60 Patriots get out of the Raytheon factory to Germany and then onto a ship bound for China without being manifested? 60 of them?

Damn! I thought the CheaperThanDirt website was wrong when it listed the Ship To Address as "China" on my most recent order.

Wonder if I can cancel and not have to pay the shipping and restocking fees? I just knew I should have stuck with the "Personal Touch" and ordered more rounds of Hornady Zombie Max Ammo for my Springfield 1911A1...

[Chubby]

cathyf, that youtube about wrapping the cat was a hoot!

it led me to "cat with a watermelon addiction" also a hoot LUN

[Janet]

Did Bo Return From Hawaii For Obama's Photo Op?

[Chubby]

oops wrong link above

"cat with watermelon addiction" LUN

[Frau Argwohn]

Janet, it's Bo's non-union body double "Doh" who stayed behind and does the cheap shots.

[Frau Argwohn]

Jane, you obviously need to have the holiday cheer *before* your radio show.

[Janet]

Well, either the newspapers that said Bo's in Hawaii will be embarrassed or Obama who flew Bo back will be...so it's all good.