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February 01, 2012

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matt

it is a part of their war on private charity. Religiously affiliated hospitals have no place in the new world order.

Neo

RIVIERA BEACH— Authorities are seeking the public's help in identifying a man who robbed a McDonald's on Saturday while wearing a President Barack Obama mask.

Clarice

I cannot understand how this Administration could be so tone deaf as to start this fight --and especially now. I think rick Ballard is right, the Administration thought the church would simply take it to court where it would not be resolved before the election. In other words they simply did not anticipate the church's swift and hard hitting response. By last count 70% of the nation's bishops have openly stated they will disobey this federal law.

Ignatz

--SOB wearing an Obama mask robbed me too.--

LOL.

matt

Interesting how the NATO report stating that the Taliban are getting stronger with direct Pakistani backing seems to have fallen into a memory hole. LUN.

I guess the Ministry of Propaganda felt it was untimely.

Ignatz

--Kevin Drum explains that if Catholic hositals or schools want to take Federal money they should pipe down and play by the new Federal rules mandating contraception coverage in healthcare plans.--

Seems the easy solution would be for the Federal government to get completely out of the money dispensing business altogether.

NK

There truly is a place in hell for snark peddlers like Kevin Drum. I too am surprised that the Bishops have come out so forcefully-- pleased but surprised. Some people have claimed that 'Bam is smart and has a plan. I disagree, his only plan is to get re-elected. Making things tough for left-wing catholics and pissing off politically independent catholics is no plan to get re-elected.

NK

BTW-- I could see all Muslim hospitals and charitable entiies easily complying with the insurance mandate by only employing and treating fellow muslims.

cathyf

Well one reason that probably made a difference: in the Catholic Church, the bishops in each area of the world meet with the pope for what is called an ad limina visit. The US's 200 bishops are meeting in 15 groups for week-long visits that started last fall and will extend through most of 2012. (Are we the World's Oldest Bureaucracy or what?!? :-) ) The groups are regional, and one little effect is that the dozen or so bishops in each group spend time socializing with each other.

That probably made their responses more coherent and effective...

NK

The Lord said: "Render unto Caesar the things which are Caesar's, and unto God the things that are God's" (Ἀπόδοτε οὖν τὰ Καίσαρος Καίσαρι καὶ τὰ τοῦ Θεοῦ τῷ Θεῷ Matthew 22:21). So far the Bishops are living up to the goaspel. Let's see where this goes.

Rick Ballard

Rasmussen Reports Democrats Closing Ranks Now More Than Ever!!!

Dr. Dung Beatle must be astounded at the accuracy of his prediction.

MarkO

Obama has trouble with that very first amendement, not to mention most of the others.

glasater

Are there really Muslim hospitals in the US? I've not heard of such entities.

centralcal

Great question, glasater. I haven't heard of any either.

Rick, I am almost afraid to ask and appear really stupid, but who is Dr. Dung Beatle?

Porchlight

So far he's pretty good on the 3rd, MarkO.

Clarice

From Rick's link:

"The number of Republicans in the country inched up half a percentage point in January, while the number of Democrats dipped to the lowest level ever recorded by Rasmussen Reports.

During January, 35.9% of Americans considered themselves Republicans. That’s up from 35.4% in December and the highest number of Republicans measured since December 2010."

Rick Ballard

c-c,

That's his nickname with the inmates students at Pitzer Asylum for the Mentally Deficient College. He's been rolling the same ball of Marxist crap around the grounds ever since the issuance of his moron's credential 30 years ago.

Some of them noticed.

centralcal

O/T: For those interested in Fast & Furious, Issa has posted an interesting graphic to show the stonewalling by Holder and DOJ.

Old Lurker


I missed most of the action here last night just as JiB was starting the discussion about the Catholic Bishops. I have a question.

While the issue has been described as Obama ordering the church to provide contraceptive and day after abortion pills to employees, mechanically isn't it that Obama is ordering (technically removing an exception) that the health insurance policies that cover those employees contain those anti-catholic coverages, right? If so that is using Obamacare's new found federal power to dictate what is in and what is not in insurance policies, right?

Since that power covers all insurance policies offered in the marketplace, aren't the Bishops facing two choices? Provide the coverage, or in the alternative provide no coverage at all?

Bless the Bishops for standing up and fighting for something. As a life long Episcopalian, we have not stood for anything firm since I was an acolyte fifty years ago, so I am pleased to see this.

If I am right in my understanding above, it seems particularly stupid for Obama to use this time to draw yet more attention to the constitutional riskiness of Obamacare.

centralcal

Oh for crying out loud, Rick. I so should have known that without asking. Duh, face palm, as Narciso would say.

Rocco

Following up from the previous thread, Newt has been for an individual mandate for twenty years. Here's a transcript from Meet The Press on May 15, 2011.

(Videotape, October 3, 1993)

REP. GINGRICH: I am for people, individuals--exactly like automobile insurance--individuals having health insurance and being required to have health insurance. And I am prepared to vote for a voucher system which will give individuals, on a sliding scale, a government subsidy so we insure that everyone as individuals have health insurance.

(End videotape)

MR. GREGORY: What you advocate there is precisely what President Obama did with his healthcare legislation, is it not?

REP. GINGRICH: No, it's not precisely what he did. In, in the first place, Obama basically is trying to replace the entire insurance system, creating state exchanges, building a Washington-based model, creating a federal system. I believe all of us--and this is going to be a big debate--I believe all of us have a responsibility to help pay for health care. I think the idea that...

MR. GREGORY: You agree with Mitt Romney on this point.

REP. GINGRICH: Well, I agree that all of us have a responsibility to pay--help pay for health care. And, and I think that there are ways to do it that make most libertarians relatively happy. I've said consistently we ought to have some requirement that you either have health insurance or you post a bond...

MR. GREGORY: Mm-hmm.

REP. GINGRICH: ...or in some way you indicate you're going to be held accountable.

MR. GREGORY: But that is the individual mandate, is it not?

REP. GINGRICH: It's a variation on it.

MR. GREGORY: OK.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/43022759/ns/meet_the_press-transcripts/t/meet-press-transcript-may/

Old Lurker

CC don't feel bad. I have often wished our host would install a code sheet down the side of this page. When Rick and CH (and PUK before) are on a roll, it is harder to read JOM than Harry Potter. :-)

centralcal

I have often wished our host would install a code sheet down the side of this page.

OL: ha ha. But, poor TM probably has less of a clue than we do! Rick and the Captain would have to write it and maintain it for him and us.

Ranger

The Arab Spring bears its true fruit:

Egypt football violence leaves many dead in Port Said

At least 74 people have been killed in clashes between rival fans following a football match in the Egyptian city of Port Said.

Scores were injured as fans - reportedly armed with knives - invaded the pitch after a match between top-tier clubs al-Masry and al-Ahly.

And how is this the result of the Arab Spring?

Police in Egypt have been keeping a much lower profile since last year's popular protests that ousted President Hosni Mubarak from power.

Egyptian fans are notoriously violent, says our correspondent, particularly supporters of al-Ahly known as the Ultras.

They have been heavily implicated in confronting the police during recent political protests, our correspondent adds. There is speculation that the security forces may have had an interest in taking on al-Ahly supporters.

And people thought English fans were rough.

Rick Ballard

"...it seems particularly stupid for Obama to use this time to draw yet more attention to the constitutional riskiness of Obamacare."

But it doesn't seem so stupid to a thin skinned hack with an unearned claim of 'Constitutional Law Professor' tacked onto an unearned HLS degree. Especially when he knows he's going to lose and is pretty sure that the Catholic majority on the Supreme Court is going to strike down the centerpiece of his failed administration.

Look at it as laying the foundation of the Dolchstoßlegende he (and all progs) are going to peddle after his loss.

MJW
The rule includes an exemption for certain “religious employers,” including houses of worship. But church groups said the exemption was so narrow that it was almost meaningless. A religious employer cannot qualify for the exemption if it employs or serves large numbers of people of a different faith, as many Catholic hospitals, universities and social service agencies do.

Though the issues involved are quite a bit different, it's interesting that the recent Supreme Court case Hosanna-Tabor Church v. EEOC also involved a religious exception that the federal government (the EEOC) argued should be narrowly applied. That case went 9-0 against the government's position, with Roberts writing the majority opinion.

matt

Our government has officially flushed Afghanistan down the memory hole. LUN

Old Lurker

thanks mjw

Clarice

There's no way in hell that the rule passes constitutional challenge.. It was a bit of candy for the base when the Administration thought the bishops wouldn't fight back as they have.

Not Sara

What on earth is going on w/Romney? Now he says he is for increasing the minimum wage!! We are screwed!!

Porchlight

I don't see posting a bond as being the same as a mandate. Isn't that basically saying you agree to be on the hook for the costs if you get sick? That is not the same thing as a requirement to purchase, as I read it.

Porchlight

Sorry, that was in response to Rocco upthread...

abad man

Kevin Drum doesn't know what he is talking about? The deuce you say.

Captain Hate

I just want to say that I consider it an honor to be included in the same discussion with Rick and PUK; even, perhaps especially, when it comes to confusing people. I just want to know how narc got excluded.

Ranger

I don't see posting a bond as being the same as a mandate. Isn't that basically saying you agree to be on the hook for the costs if you get sick? That is not the same thing as a requirement to purchase, as I read it.

How many middle class families happen to have $10k laying around to post as a helth care bond?

Not with our self-shackled press.

Romney needs to spice up his rhetoric and make it more palatable. The very poor already have as tightly woven a safety net as is affordable. It is the middle class that is without a safety net.

This is intuitively obvious and a great campaign point. Can he use it?
============================

Clarice

And how many serious health issues cost no more than $10k.

CH- I have no problem with you, Rick or narciso, but then I think it has some relationship to my poor (let's say, "creative")proofreading skills:I see what I meant to write and what I think you guys meant to write and it's all clear as can be to me.

He who can see through redactions.

MJW retains legendary status on this board.
=====================

Jack is Back!

cathf,

The Diocesan letters came out of National Council of Bishops - Canon Laeyers and Government Affairs but left it up to individual Bishops on sending and specific wording. I understand Dolan is the force behind "tough" non-compliance language. My parochial director for the school is a canon lawyer and agrees with your comment last night. The Regime put them in untenable position.

OT: Matt, did you see where they arrested a guy in Chile with 5 big blocks of Jorge Montt glacier ice in his truck? Very popular in tony Santiago bars for pouring drinks over.

centralcal

"Not Sara" didn't state it exactly accurately:

From The Hill:

Republican presidential contender Mitt Romney renewed his support Wednesday for automatic increases in the federal minimum wage to keep pace with inflation, a position sharply at odds with traditional GOP business allies, conservatives and the party’s senior lawmakers…

It'll be fun trying.

Yeah, CH. What, do I have to get more obscure in order to rate?
==================

Porchlight

How many middle class families happen to have $10k laying around to post as a helth care bond?

Not many have it in lump sum - although I've spent more than that on healthcare premiums in the last 18 months. But my point was that a requirement to post a bond is not identical to a mandate to purchase as a condition of citizenship.

Porchlight

Also, Gingrich added this qualifier:

REP. GINGRICH: ...or in some way you indicate you're going to be held accountable.

So it could be a bond OR another method of being held accountable.

I'm not necessarily defending Gingrich's idea, I just think it's a stretch to say that he's supported exactly the same kind of mandate found in Romneycare and Obamacare for 20 years, as Rocco suggested upthread.

Danube of Thought

If Ne.wt is a conservative, he's a "big-government conservative" at best, and in my view the term is oxymoronic. He believes that the government can and should solve all our problems. Plus he's nuts.

Old Lurker

I excluded Narc because he went pro years ago.

jimmyk

I don't see posting a bond as being the same as a mandate. Isn't that basically saying you agree to be on the hook for the costs if you get sick? That is not the same thing as a requirement to purchase, as I read it.

You can think of it as being given a choice between buying insurance or taking a free policy with with a $10K deductible. Technically not a mandate, but also a money losing proposition for the insurer.

Porchlight

He's too big-government for my taste, DoT. So is Santorum. But both less so than Romney imo.

Clarice

OL. You're my favorite. Don't tell the others.

Danube of Thought

Ah hell. I give up:

"Republican presidential contender Mitt Romney renewed his support Wednesday for automatic increases in the federal minimum wage to keep pace with inflation, a position sharply at odds with traditional GOP business allies, conservatives and the party’s senior lawmakers…"

Porchlight

Thanks, jimmyk. "Technically not a mandate" was really the only point I was trying to make.

centralcal

uh, DoT, could you scroll up to my comment at 6:47 PM?

LOL

centralcal

Porch had a really snort worthy comment about the minimum wage on the Mitt thread and it should not go to waste:

Automatic increases in the federal minimum wage?

Fan-freaking-tastic.

But Mitt said it so it must be a Sooper Great Conservative Idea.

No response yet from our #1 Romney Fan.

Danube of Thought

Sorry ccal--didn't see yours upthread.

God am I depressed.

Rick Ballard

"God am I depressed."

Listening to We've Only Just Begun might help. Or 12 or so Martinis.

Remember - he's the most electable. All the smart people say so.

centralcal

DoT - I think it is funny we had the exact same post right down to the ... (ellipsis).

Cheer up honey, Romney has only just begun to pander, pander, pander.

Clarice

FNC is reporting Newt is challenging the Fla result as it violates the party's own rules:

"The Newt Gingrich campaign is gearing up to challenge the results of the Florida Republican presidential primary based on the Republican National Committee's own rules which state that no contest can be winner-take-all prior to April 1, 2012. (See RNC memo.)

It was assumed that Mitt Romney, who won Tuesday's contest, would gain all 50 of the state's delegates. But the Gingrich campaign plans to challenge Florida's allocation and demand the delegates be divvied up proportionally. (See Gingrich memo.)

Fox News has learned exclusively that on Thursday, a Florida Gingrich campaign official will begin the process of trying to have the RNC rules enforced so that the Sunshine State delegates are distributed based on the percentage of the vote each candidate got.

RNC Chairman Reince Priebus warned Florida Republican Party Chairman Lenny Curry of the violation in a December letter quoting the rule, "...'winner-take-all' states cannot hold a primary or caucus before April 1, 2012."

Tuesday night's Romney victory in the Sunshine State awarded the former Massachusetts governor all 50 Florida delegates (the state was already docked half its delegates for moving the election up on the calendar). "


http://politics.blogs.foxnews.com/2012/02/01/florida-primary-might-not-be-done-deal#ixzz1lB6n1qH6


In other hot news--apparently Trump will endorse Newt tomorrow.

centralcal

Oh, shoot, now I am stepping all over Rick's musical commentary. LMAO

centralcal

Clarice: Before the Florida vote was held I read somewhere (no, I can't remember) that however it turned out, the suit should take place. The article I read said any qualified Republican voter could even bring the suit.

MarkO

Again I say, "Doom." Those who scorned me as being, well, too doomy, may now worship me.

Let's vote for Ron.

Jane

God am I depressed.

Me too, and I also give up. Romney did so many stupid things today. Maybe we should go without a president for a few years.

narciso

"Untergang' Mark, this is what you wanted, right, forget about principles, only the chill billy believes in that,

Porchlight

centralcal, maybe #1 Romney fan will come back and accuse us all of being ghouls who don't want poor people to make a living wage.

Clarice

Jane, that's brilliant. Let's start a No President party.

Jane

What the hell is this about? I never in a million years would have predicted this. What on earth is going on? From Insty

A startling number of Japanese youths have turned their backs on sex and relationships, a new survey has found.

The survey, conducted by the Japan Family Planning Association, found that 36% of males aged 16 to 19 said that they had “no interest” in or even “despised” sex. That’s almost a 19% increase since the survey was last conducted in 2008.

If that’s not bad enough, The Wall Street Journal reports that a whopping 59% of female respondents aged 16 to 19 said they were uninterested in or averse to sex, a near 12% increase since 2008.

Who doesn't like sex at that age?

Rick Ballard

"Who doesn't like sex at that age?"

I'd bet on someone who has been hammered in the face with degrading porn since they were old enough to recognize it.

Jack is Back!

Jane,

Sushi?

Bad Seaweed?

Pokemon?

Too many Tsunamis?

Porchlight

My bet would be the same as yours, Rick.

Appalled

Let's review.

Romney wants to index everything more aggressively than current law, blowing a hole in the budget.

Per Clarice and Fox, Gingrich is doing one of his patented poor loser stunts, hoping to make his defeat seem more deserved, and look again like the red faced angry nasty man that is already his stereotype.

I'm not big into doom, but much more of this and I'll start sounding like squaredace.

Appalled

Please narcisolate my previous comment. Still don't like what Romney is doing, but at least I should get what he's indxing right (minimum wage). Give me one of DoT's martinis, and I'll make more sense.

Rocco

In 2008 Video, Gingrich Is Passionate About The Mandate

“The one loophole I’ll give them is, if they don’t want to buy any insurance, post a bond,” Gingrich said. “And we can figure out the value of the bond, but probably if you posted a $100,000 [or] $150,000 bond, you wouldn’t have to buy insurance because you’d have a pool of money available. Most people would discover that’s irrational, I think, and they’d buy insurance.”


hit and run

Appalled:
I'm not big into doom, but much more of this and I'll start sounding like squaredace.

You'll start hating on our recipe exchanges?

Clarice

Back to Fla: It's my understanding that
RNC Chairman Reince Priebus warned Florida Republican Party Chairman Lenny Curry of the violation in a December letter quoting the rule, “…’winner-take-all’ states cannot hold a primary or caucus before April 1, 2012.”

That when Fla went ahead anyway, the RNC said only half their delegation would count..that is, if the RNC doesn't budge from that position, the present differential between the delegates for Romney and Newt is much smaller..Either the state goes for proportional delegates or the RNC rule of a 50% cut in the delegation makes the margin of victory far smaller.

MarkO

I think my horse and I hunted down the outlaws known as the "Untergang' in the badlands.

I have a new idea for the primaries: coin flips.

Clarice

If we're doomed, I want to be doomed with hit and bgates so I can laugh thru eternity.

jimmyk

Who doesn't like sex at that age?

Japan is rapidly playing out like "Children of Men." Very gloomy--DOOM for them.

Threadkiller

Clarice, I read that article to say they have already cut the amount of delegates in half. Now they have to divide that smaller amount.

narciso

Doh, why do they keep doing this, it was only four years, do they have 50-100 delegates to spare.

Jane

Are you here Hit?

In case you are busy tomorrow I wanted to make it know that TOMORROW IS YOUR BIRTHDAY! I can't wait to celebrate it with you!

Clarice

TK I missed that last sentence and reading it again, I think you're right. If Newt prevails, it'll be a teensy victory for Mitt, won't it?

Clarice

Happy Birthday Mr H & R!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

jimmyk

"Technically not a mandate" was really the only point I was trying to make.

Ok, but there's a risk: As discussed earlier, Obamacare gives you a choice between buying insurance and paying a fine. Technically not a mandate? There's a lot of hairsplitting, while losing sight of the fact that there would be no case at all for these non-mandates but for other government intrusions.

Threadkiller

Clarice, no wonder Newt didn't congratulate Mitt.

pagar

Why we don't have all the greatest people running for public office. Warning, throwing bricks thru your computer will not help.

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/radio-host-loses-it-with-female-gop-candidate-get-your-stupid-a-out-im-scared-your-whiteness-might-rub-off-on-me/

This one is really really bad!

As if they know how to live.

Well, prepare for endless propaganda about a 'living wage'.
=======================

hit and run

Jane:
Are you here Hit?

I'm here!

In case you are busy tomorrow

I will be starting around 2:30.

TOMORROW IS YOUR BIRTHDAY!

Thanks! But remember,tomorrow,today will be yesterday.

sbw

Too many Tsunamis?

...

Too many surveys?

Appalled

If Newt prevails, it'll be a teensy victory for Mitt, won't it?

If Newt prevails at the convention floor, it will be after he has (1) scored an improbable victory or (2) lost.

In other words, it's Newt looking like he's whining about losing. Again.

narciso

happy birthday, Hit.

sbw

If I were at a Mitt press conference, I'd like to ask him if he would articulate the countervailing reasons why increasing the federal minimum wage would be a bad idea.

Threadkiller

In all honesty, if Newt's campaign is correct on Florida, Mitt comes off looking like a complete idiot. "Whaa! Whaa! He didn't call!!"

Newt, on the other hand, shows he is a lot more in tune with running a campaign that can defeat Obama by just paying attention.

"Romney... you magnificent bastard, I read the rule book!"

Clarice

Here's a better explanation which suggests that even after the vote was whittled to 50 delegates, Fla could still be forced to proportional delegations.


Jim Rhoads a/k/a vnjagvet

Having been in and out since the weekend, I was unable to keep up at JOM (blushes with shame and embarrassment). Now that I'm caught up, I am planning to emulate Rip Van Winkle, awake on election day and vote for anyone who is against the worst president evaaah as the lesser of two evils.

The rent seekers have invaded both parties. It is only a question of where those seekers will find their rent. The Tea Party was the first political movement in my lifetime that might have turned our fiscal disaster around. Sadly, it had neither the money nor the organization to succeed. Scott Walker's bold plan for one of the more "progressive" states in the union is the only thing now that gives me some hope. But we won't know for a few years whether his ideas and actions will wake up the country.

I have 10 maybe 15 years left max, and I am going to do the best I can enjoying it. Martinis are helping.

Not Sara

It just amazes me as to how the Republican Party can screw this election up! It was ours for the taking. No wonder all of you seem so depressed.

Appalled

Threadkiller:

"Romney... you magnificent bastard, I read the rule book!"

Go back to the Fox article and the memo that is linked there. Gingrich is initiating a process of formally challenging the Florida slate of delegates. These kind of disputes get resolved by the convention. Meaning, forget it as being a game changer, because of the timing of a final decision. This is going to be a footnote.

narciso

I think only hard liquor will do it, Jim.

Old Lurker

As Appalled says, Newt is becoming caricature of of himself which was already a caricature. Romney took men by 5% in FL, but women by more than 20%. The ladies have spoken so he is toast.

Take Romney, hope for a good VP but as others have said, fire up the TP to deliver a second wave into Congress. Repeat each two years.

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