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July 15, 2016

Comments

rse

If Trumps is plural, shouldn't it be end?

Seriously, what a week.

Jack is Back!

It's not like Recip hasn't been warned by the same military before. At least 3 times by my count. Anyone who has ever done biz in Turkey knows all deals are subject to military approval. They have been patient as an oyster with this Islamist but ISIS and recent attacks broke their secular back.

Surprised it took this long.

I had a Turkish AF officer in my class at AFIT.. Ended up thier commander.

Captain Hate

Tammy Bruce said those 28 pages still have massive parts blacked out.

henry

Germany denies landing rights to Erdogan's plane....

henry

CH, the payments to the Clintoon foundation?

rse

henry-is he from the wrong part of me or are refugees supposed to be on foot or coming by train?

Captain Hate

Probably too early for that, henry, unless you're talking about trafficking in underaged girls.

henry

Did he play grabass with Merkel last time he was in town?

No explanation given, it was via MSNBC so it might be totally wrong, it's Friday and I have beer. (All of the above).

DrJ

Kerry apparently was in Moscow.

JM Hanes

Folks at the White House aren't the only ones caught flat footed by the coup. Fox News analyst: The situation is dire regardless of who gains the upper hand. No duh. Surely they could have rustled up someone who knew something about Turkey.

Janet the expert

Where is Samantha Power? Somebody check the local Charlie Chaplin film festival schedule!! STAT!

Captain Hate

Brian Williams in the studio with Andrea Mitchell, Chuck Todd and David Sanger of the Times on camera.

The Three Stooges *and* Shemp.

daddy on iPhone

Since Germany and turkey won't let him land maybe he should land in Obama's 2 Success Stories, Yemen and was the other one Syria or Iraq, I forget?

And in reference to yesterday's thread, add refusal to let Erdogan land as something else the Germans got right in the last 100 years

Michael (fpa Patriot4Freedom)

Erdogan's 'shabihas' are the armed thugs of the militia that is loyal to Erdogan.

They are suspected of being responsible for the fire bombings of the offices of the PKK and BDP/HDP parties after their victories caused Erdogan to lose his absolute majority in Parliament.

They are also suspected of being responsible for *some* of the smaller bombings launched against Kurdish demonstrators this past year.

Here's an older story on the Syrian shabihas loyal to Assad:

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-14482968


Janet the expert

Yemen and was the other one Syria or Iraq, I forget?

I think it was SOMALIA!...if you can believe THAT.

Miss Marple

Thanks for the info, Michael!

Ignatz Ratzkywatzky

Is Erdogan' plane aerial refueling capable?
He could be up there awhile.
I wonder if he escaped or if they let him go.

Captain Hate

As I stated at the end of the last thread, this administration has been very adept at burning Intel assets, ours and others. Nobody tells us anything because we have a president who is very experienced in getting the good guys killed. It will take a lot of time, effort and money to regain the trust that has been destroyed. And if Rodham is elected, it won't happen at all.

Janet the expert

"...This strategy of taking out terrorists who threaten us, while supporting partners on the front lines, is one that we have successfully pursued in Yemen and Somalia for years. And it is consistent with the approach I outlined earlier this year: to use force against anyone who threatens America’s core interests, but to mobilize partners wherever possible to address broader challenges to international order” he stated." - President Obama Sept. 2014

Janet the expert

Wretchard T. Cat on FB -
Kerry's agreement with Putin to go after Al-Nusra means what w/ Turkey in coup? Incirlik? Kerry is like a man with a canceled credit card.

Like a guy in a fruit shirt, a travel brochure and a missing wallet who's just discovered he's landed in the wrong airport.

Janet the expert

Retweeted Mahmoud Salem (@Sandmonkey):

Imagine Europe having to deal with turkish refugees as well. ‪#‎fml‬ ‪#‎turkey‬ ‪#‎coup‬

daddy on iPhone

SOMALIA!

How could I have let the success story of Somalia slip my mind?


Ai yi yi:(

Ignatz Ratzkywatzky

I wonder if General el-Sisi served as a consultant on this job. The Turks presumably have enough practical experience of their own.

Ignatz Ratzkywatzky

I imagine this will greatly reduce the flow of refugees to Europe, and Turkey.

Another Bob

If this ends up beginning a return to Kemalism, this is all good.

How can Obama screw this up?

JM Hanes

So far the folks taking to the streets seem to be celebrating, not protesting, the coup.

JM Hanes

He's trying to work that out himself right now, Another Bob.

daddy on iPhone

DEM Doug Schoen on Hannity Radio Show says Trump is beating Hillary. Says it is amazing trump is tied with her without having spent any money on ads and says ."Hillary is on the ropes."

I sure love hearing him say this stuff. He also says what Hillary is saying about us defeating ISIS is killing her with the public since we know it is false. Yep

JM Hanes

In fact, wasn't the Prez scheduled to speak to the nation tonight, or did the voices in my head just make that up?

maryrose

TC
Well TM has obliged and Brady is the only one who didn't make the cut.
Of course that topic was done to death months ago.
Who did you have as the VP choice?
Comment on Nice- why wasn't that truck checked.?
Someone dropped the ball.

maryrose

JMHanes:
He spoke around 3:00PM
Mr irrelevant.

maryrose

JMHanes:
They are cheering.
Fox had audio.

JM Hanes

Ah, so I don't have to worry about missing it, maryrose. :-)

maryrose

"Kerry is like a man with a cancelled credit card"
Comment of the day Janet!
Burwell wants insurance company competition for healthcare law.
Repubs wanted it too and cross state lines but Dems vetoed it.
She even knows Obamacare is a loser.
Taking on water as we speak.

henry

I get breaking news that some coup leaders arrested, gunfire at Istanbul airport.

lyle

Not sure if this the appropriate time to divulge this but my surname is actually Turk. 😎

Lurker Susie


Wow if true

The faction of the Turkish military doing the coup is reportedly loyal to a US imam who lives in the Poconos http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/07/15/turkish-military-attempts-coup-of-erdogan-government.html
5:37 PM - 15 Jul 2016

Ignatz Ratzkywatzky

Wait, did TM place Brian Williams and Andrea Mitchell next to a sentence denoting any journalistic competence whatsoever?

daddy on iPhone

Maryrose,

He already told us Islam preaches peace. and compassion. .

CBS radio news calls Nice "a truck attack" and plays Obama angry at Republicans saying the attack was Islamic. Obama says language about Islam being violent and demanding scrutiny by police and the FBI, is ."repugnant."

Porchlight

Obama is losing it because Hillary is losing.

The wheels are coming off.

JM Hanes

On the other hand, via Drudge, a lot of people aren't cheering: Angry Turks drag tank commander out of turret and beat him as military coup leaves country in chaos. Things could go sideways pretty easily. I gather subduing the police may be a priority?

henry

The @pzf breaking news feed has all sorts of strange reports from Turkey. Jets shot down a helicopter (a pro coup helicopter?), 17 police dead after attack on special forces hq. Erdogan trying London next.

Dave (in MA)

Howie Carr, about as big a Trump supporter as you'll find, believes the story about him wanting to back out of the Pence pick last night.

Porchlight

It's certainly possible. I don't think there was a better option among the people discussed, though. Flynn was too big a risk because he's Dem/non-politician, Gingrich too much baggage and not enough contrast with Trump, we need Sessions in the Senate, and the rest are also-rans IMO.

fdcol63

There are going to be Islamists or supporters of Erdogan in the crowd who support the move toward greater Islamism within Turkey who will oppose the coup.

So, we shouldn't automatically assume sporadic and isolated on-camera events of "civilians" attacking coup forces is itself proof of massive opposition to the coup.

But, who knows .... maybe Erdogan enjoys wider support than we believe and the masses ARE opposed to the coup.

Time will tell.

Porchlight

Okay now this time I really can say in the crystal ball department that nobody predicted a coup in Turkey the week before the RNC.

Events, my dear boy, events.

Ignatz Ratzkywatzky

How incompetent do you have to be to be pulled out of a tank by an unarmed mob?

maryrose

Marlene:
If daughter is staying by the Clinic she is near University Circle where The Art and History museums are located.
Quickest way downtown is the Healthline Bus.
It is new, very clean and fast.

JM Hanes

Department of State ✔@StateDept
.@POTUS & @JohnKerry agreed all parties in Turkey should support the democratically-elected Gov't of Turkey, show restraint, avoid violence.

ZZZzzzz

Ignatz Ratzkywatzky

Erdogan engaged in an ongoing purge of the military since he knew they constituted the only real threat.
Remains to be seen how well he did at it.

Porchlight

I had forgotten that we had ordered evacuations from our Turkish bases back in March:

http://www.militarytimes.com/story/military/2016/03/29/us-military-dependents-ordered-leave-turkey/82377984/

fdcol63

How long before we see another coup in a European country with a history of military juntas ..... Greece?

Janet the expert

There goes the life jacket market. :(

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3204607/PICTURED-beach-shops-Turkey-cashing-Europe-s-migrant-crisis-selling-LIFE-JACKETS-desperate-refugees-crossing-Med-Greece.html

from Aug. 2015 - PICTURED: The beach shops in Turkey cashing in on Europe’s migrant crisis by selling LIFE JACKETS to desperate refugees crossing the Med to Greece

Shops in Turkey are selling life jackets to migrants planning to cross Med
Flying off shelves in Bodrum's souvenir shops, jewellers and supermarkets
Jackets are sold in all sizes including ones for babies and pregnant women
Tourist resort is full of refugees fleeing Syria and trying to reach Greece

Janet the expert

September 15, 2015 ·
Europe invaders...questions the "news" media don't ask -
"All the life jackets are new.
Where did they buy hundreds of thousands of brand new life jackets, tubes and inflatable rafts? Who carries that kind of inventory? And considering the demand, how much did they pay?" ~ Extraneus

daddy on iPhone

CBS Radio News says CAIR is furious with Newts comments and CBS editing of the segment seems to me to be an effort to damn Newt and portray CAIR as sensible.

Glad that I keep hearing on Hannity's radio show the repeating sound bite of Hillary blabbing last night and talking about how well we have been pushing Turkey to do great stuff in this terror fight, exactly when Erdogan is running for his life. Point to me is that once again "Gods gift to Foreign Policy, Hillary Clinton" is caught totally ignorant and off guard, same as all thegee whiz policy experts advising Nobel Peace Prize genius Obama

maryrose

RCP:
Says Erdogan landed in Tehran and might go to Qatar.

henry

Well, well. Obama supports Erdogan. The merde touch.

maryrose

Henry:
It is uncanny how everything Obama touches turns to dust.
He supports Hillary.
Well from now on I will refer to her as Lot's wife.

Ignatz Ratzkywatzky

Sunni Turk Erdogan, enemy of Shia Arab Assad flies to Shia Persian Tehran, supporters of Assad, and then on to Sunni Arab Qatar, which funds the Sunni loons fighting Assad.

Erdogan needs a new travel agent.
Either that or he used the Trivago guy.

maryrose

daddy
No wonder Hillary doesn't have any SOS accomplishments.
She never knows what the hell is going on.

henry

Maryrose, Hillary is fully prepared for anything. She takes her own bottle of hot sauce everywhere.

Porchlight

She's often confused.

Captain Hate

Point to me is that once again "Gods gift to Foreign Policy, Hillary Clinton" is caught totally ignorant and off guard, same as all thegee whiz policy experts advising Nobel Peace Prize genius Obama

In fairness to Uncle Jack, it was after happy hour in some country she visited.

Theo

So are we at JOM pro coup or anti coup? I mean this particular coup?

henry

Airplanes bomb parliament building ( Erdogan's HQ, which tanks were already firing at). Now the govt says it will shoot down all planes over the Capitol. (Including the one that shot down the "coup" helicopter?)

Then a big explosion.

Another Bob

A curiosity question for daddy...

I was once proposed for an expat assignment, and was offered the services of a contractor who allegedly specialized in the safety and security needs of an American abroad. I found their offerings remarkably perfunctory and mostly obvious, and told my employer that I hoped they didn't spend too much on it.

Your employer sends you to places that may not be the most stable. Does it supply you with a plan if something should occur that causes you, your right-seater and your many-million dollar airplane and cargo to be "unavoidably detained" by circumstances like those at IST at the moment?

I understand completely if your answer is a non-answer.

Sue

Someone on Twitter is reporting authorities have retaken TRT studio arrested soldiers and confiscated weapons.

Texas Liberty Gal

Good Lord! I spend all day with the grandkids and come home and all hell has broken lose!! Just caught up - am I right that things are looking good for Turkey but bad for Kerry and BO? I'm up with that!!!

henry

Theo, pro or anti coup? I don't know who the coup guys are, Erdogan is an Islamist who sucks, the army has traditionally been secular, the coup part of the army is reportedly (by Erdogan, wtf?) following some nut job imam in the Poconos. Until I know who is who in the zoo, im merely running low on popcorn.

Theo

Thanks Henry. I have no idea either.

henry

Sue, I saw a tweet with pictures of arms being stacked and guys in camo led away by police. So maybe.

Miss Marple 2

TLG,

Your guess is as good as mine.

Communications are iffy, competing statements from coup and anti-coup, American press doesn't know a thing about how Turkey works, hence total confusion.

Pretty scary to think this is a NATO member and no one knows anything.

Ignatz Ratzkywatzky

Except Gulen [who used to be an ally of Erdogan] in the Poconos has condemned the coup.

Pagar a bacon, ham and sausage supporter

07:36. Isn't that what Comey said ? That she never knew what was going on?

Captain Hate

Is it any wonder Zippy likes these clowns?

http://tammybruce.com/2016/07/blm-activists-dead-white-people-in-france-stealing-our-limelight.html

Ignatz Ratzkywatzky

I'm fearful this will eventually be discovered to have been a last gasp play by the few remaining Kemalists in the military to try and end the Islamification of Turkey before they were completely purged.

Frau Tee oder Kaffee?

Atta Boy, Atatürk

Miss Marple 2

And... <---note ellipses WHY is there a guy in the Poconos running this coup?

Is he using borscht belt comics as intelligence gatherers or what?

JM Hanes

Theo:

"So are we at JOM pro coup or anti coup?"

What are you?

Ignatz Ratzkywatzky

Erdogan is the most talented and therefor most dangerous Islamist in Turkey.
+ coup.

Another Bob

Theo, I'm with Henry.

There are always wheels within wheels in these deals. If there are any public statements or reports that can be believed, nobody has any way of knowing with ones they are.

All I know is I've been to Turkey recently, found it an interesting place, and hoped they could stay out of the Islamist yoke. Whatever moves things in that direction, I'm good with.

Another Bob

But Ignatz@7:51, I fear you're correct.

Theo

JMH --

On this, I just don't know. My sense is that Erdogan is an Islamist dick, but I don't know who the rebels are. Military coups are usually not a good thing but I think the one in Egypt worked out. I need to know more about the situation here. That is why I asked.

Sue

Theo,

If Obama and Kerry are against it, I'm for it.

JM Hanes

Ditto that, Ignatz.

Lurker Susie

So much going on

Tammy Bruce
Tammy Bruce – Verified account ‏@HeyTammyBruce

Prayers up for police: "FBI issues ‘credible threat’ warning to South Florida law enforcement" http://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/crime/article89923272.html

Another Bob

MM, for reasons mentioned above, I put no credence in that report about the imam in the Poconos.

Though the thought of the imam in a heart-shaped tub sipping some champagne makes me chuckle a little.

Theo

Iggy's analysis makes sense but too soon to know for sure.

Sue -- Roger that.

Ignatz Ratzkywatzky

Hotair updates looking grim for coup success.

lyle

Welp, in spite of my upthread surname confession, if Zippy and Jawn are against the coup, I'm all for it. We've never had a FP crew this incompetent and arrogant in my lifetime so in spite of my utter lack of knowledge on what's happening I like my betting odds. You?

buccaneer morgan

but he was just some crazy guy, my foot,

https://twitter.com/paulsperry_/status/754091329366306816

this is what ali soufan and coleman and co, told shane, and isikoff and warrick

fdcol63

In this case, even though I would agree that if Obama and Kerry make public announcements opposing the coup and supporting Erdogan, there are probably very good reasons for the US to "officially" do that while secretly hoping the coup succeeds.

But in Obama and Kerry's case, they probably secretly hope America's greater enemy wins .... Whoever it is.

Theo

I guess it all comes down to the Butch Cassidy question:"Who are these guys?"

RattlerGator

I'm fearful this will eventually be discovered to have been a last gasp play by the few remaining Kemalists in the military to try and end the Islamification of Turkey before they were completely purged.
Posted by: Ignatz Ratzkywatzky | July 15, 2016 at 07:51 PM

I am too. I think we're getting a steady stream of misinformation and hopeful claims. No one really knows right now but we could be facing something of a further descent into hell in that region and there are *no* good paths forward. Turkey is jockeying for power, Russia is jockeying for power, Iran is jockeying for power.

Another Bob

The really unfortunate part of a failure (if there is one), is that the brakes will be off for Erdogan and the other islamists.

Another Bob

Is it possible for NATO to eject a member state?

Miss Marple 2

Brett Baier says no one knows what's going on. Government says it's in charge but there are explosions all over Ankara.

buccaneer morgan

seeing as they are bracketed by hubs, at nice and cannes, you betcha

http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/662294/ISIS-daesh-threat-terror-holidays-spain-france-italy-jihadi-targets

Miss Marple 2

Ralph Peters on saying this coup is the last chance for Turkey to avoid descending into Islamic authoritarianism.

Points out military is trying to save their country. Now Peters is pointing out how Obama is on the wrong side.

Ignatz Ratzkywatzky

There has been speculation the coup is a false flag operation by Erdogan to consolidate power; his grip on which had been loosened in the last elections.

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