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June 01, 2017

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Jack is Back!

What about Catcher in the Rye? Or was that all hype?

henry

For people who are into the Foundation books, they sure didn't learn that the Foundation control via mathmatics didn't work. Idiots. (Although those types were calling Trump "the Mule" early in 2015).

henry

Eat it Buffett, Dakota Pipeline begins shipping product today. No more rail cars.

sbw

Welcome, new readers!
Link to last page of thread here.
Ignore the trolls or mask them with Killfile.
Credit sources for quotes.
Feel free to ask questions.
Try not to embarrass our generous host, Tom Maguire. [h/t JMH]

narciso

I think dune is more relevant, trump would be duke Leto. In this scenario. Bannon might be gurney halleck.

Captain Hate

Strangely enough, a lot of my prog friend liked Ayn Rand, perhaps because they were polemics posing as literature.

P. Kenny

I recently re-read Asimov's "Foundation", found its "science" of human civilization very very crude. That wasn't so in my teens, when I loved it!

narciso

Btw you want to hear the hot take on the it svabdak from my former rep?

JimNorCal

Echoing henry, note that the Hari Seldon math came up way short, in terms of saving the world.

The Foundation stories are good, but there's no pull to read them again every half decade or so.

henry

P Kenny, Foundation was written before we learned econometric models are total crap.

Jack is Back!

Just when you thought Al Franken was done:

The Hill‏Verified account
@thehill
Follow
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Al Franken: I'm not cancelling Kathy Griffin event because "she begged for forgiveness" http://hill.cm/C1lQXrZ

sbw

X degrees of Kevin Bacon. I knew Isaac’s brother Stan. Real nice guy who worked in management at Newsday.

narciso

One that is very hard to find is the stainless steel rat series by harrison

Beester

Krugman and Musk, a couple of would-be saviors making it on OPM.

rse

Interesting. http://thefederalist.com/2017/05/31/sen-mike-lee-on-the-founders-social-capital-and-the-role-of-government/

when i put up the link on the previous thread to lee's report i did not know the federalist was touting it today. its editor has a false narrative book on the common core bradley commissioned. when i followed up on lee's touting of something called the "mediating structures project" from the late 70s that involved aei and and the national endowment for the humanities, i discovered bradley had financed the seminar and publication of the 20th anniversary update in 1996.

i was only following it because the listed co-author, peter l berger, had previously been on my radar for his social construction of reality book from the 60s implicated in what competency actually means. that's what i mean about bradley cropping up repeatedly when all i am doing is following up on something troubling or false.

narciso

Yes I know the proper word is scandal but it's not cromulent enough.

rse

i also did not realize lee had a book published on may 30 until i saw that in the federalist today.

in my experience my history major and law school constitution classes keep getting in the way of most of these "the founding fathers said" narratives. that phrase seems as misused as 'conservative' once the surface is scratched.

Captain Hate

Since we're trashing books of our youth, did anything epitomize the triteness of the 70s more than the airheaded crap by Tom Robbins like "Another Roadside Attraction"? I once caught an otherwise erudite acquaintance immersed in that garbage and told him it was beneath him.

James D


I think dune is more relevant, trump would be duke Leto. In this scenario. Bannon might be gurney halleck.

If President Trump is Duke Leto, who's Paul? I almost think Trump fits that role better - the x-factor that everyone thought they could control, but ends up turning the whole Empire upside-down.

I don't think we need to ask who Dr. Yueh is; we have no shortage of candidates for that role.

narciso

The paradox in the twelve monkeys series is the apocalypse the heroes are meant to stop is provoked by their own actions.

Miss Marple the Deplorable

I read the Foundation books when I was in high school, along with a lot of Robert Heinlein's earlier books.

I suppose I could go over and get the Foundation series from the library and reread it, but somehow what I remember from it no longer has much of an appeal. At the time, though, I liked Asimov's writing.

narciso

Yes I reread then and they weren't as interesting Gregory Bedford did some follow up tales of seldom.

Charles mccarry in 1979 was so on point with better angels, in ways I thought fanciful in the 80s.

Captain Hate

Al Franken: I'm not cancelling Kathy Griffin event because "she begged for forgiveness

One unfunny stupid person defending another. What's to forgive? She knew exactly what she meant to do and is now upset by the reaction to it. Too damn bad.

I'm no fan of Eldrick but at least I can excuse him for not realizing how badly he was hammered by the pain pills and meant to get home safely. He still will pay a penalty and so will Griffin.

DrJ

Your (almost!) daily Wretchard:

https://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2017/06/01/when-no-one-knows-the-answer/

James D

Beasts, has your state gone completely mad?

http://abc3340.com/news/local/business-license-required-for-teens-to-cut-grass

Ignatz Ratzkywatzky

Never warmed up to Asimov...or Clarke for that matter.
Story and real characters first, guys, then you can stir in some goofy pseudoscience.

rse

jimmy-have you read this?

https://www.city-journal.org/html/not-quite-rational-man-15130.html

this is something i have been working on--the ties between k-12 standards and behavioral economics because it keeps coming up. i did not know gintis and bowles started as behavioral economists. i have their book from the 70s calling for a marxian revolution in the US using education so it need not necessarily be violent.

interesting too as yesterday brookings and princeton put out a guide to social and emotional learning and after i read it i immediately recognized it was tied to kahneman's work even though there is no mention of him explicitly.

we have a uniparty and a uninarrative below the surface of terms and phrases designed apparently to obscure that reality.

Jack is Back!

I think the first SciFi I ever read was "Stranger in a Strange Land". I was in college and everyone in my ROTC unit were talking about it and I really liked it back then. I never read Foundation but did read the I,Robot and Nightfall short stories but can't remember any other Asimov.

Then for some reason 20-25 years later, having read no SciFi, I can think of, I was told about Dune and loved it. Disappointed in the movie but I thought the book was great.

I can't think of any other SciFi I have read. Don't think I have ever read any Arthur Clarke but really enjoyed the movie: 2001.

henry

For CH and the Ohio contingent: JobsOhio is a racket.

Ohio's year-over-year job growth rate has trailed the national average every month since November 2012.

Kasich strikes again.

Clarice Feldman

Never warmed up to them, either, Iggy.

Gentlejim

Is something going on with Twitter? I've checked multiple pages and all I get is the stupid blue bird. I blame Trump. ;)

JM Hanes

Ha, sbw!

No need to credit me. Maybe next time, a hotlink for Killfile?

Miss Marple the Deplorable

Threadkiller!


Mícheál Breathnach‏ @dkahanerules 3m3 minutes ago

The Black Widow, having killed Fox News, moves on to @NBCNews
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4562436/Megyn-Kelly-makes-NBC-debut-forgets-greet-Hoda-Kotb.html
0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes

Ignatz Ratzkywatzky

Stranger in a Strange Land is Heinlein at his absolute worst.
IMO, John Campbell and Jack Vance were the masters of genuinely compelling stories and characters that seamlessly wove in sciencey speculation and alien cultures.

Janet the expert 🚬

THis segment on PBS yesterday was pretty good - http://www.pbs.org/video/3001412780/

Phil Kerpen of American Commitment did a good job.

It was emotion vs facts.

Janet the expert 🚬

skip to around 3:30 to get to the Q & A.

Ignatz Ratzkywatzky

"If You Want To See Inflation In Action, Then Financial Asset Prices Are Screaming “Danger, Danger".

JimNorCal

JiB, consider giving Mote In God's Eye a chance. Authors Pournelle and Niven. A large SF allegory of the world's strategic balance of a decade or two ago.

JimNorCal

I know that it reflects badly on the Narrative but I am absolutely puzzled how this story evades MASSIVE coverage.

http://dailycaller.com/2017/05/31/wasserman-schultz-admits-hill-it-security-violations-blames-house-administrators-for-not-stopping-her-video/#masthead

Police are investigating Wasserman Schultz’s longtime information technology (IT) aide Imran Awan for theft and funneling congressional data from members of the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence, Committee on Homeland Security and Committee on Foreign Affairs.

Yet Wasserman Schultz lashed out at investigators and changed Awan’s title to “adviser” instead of firing him after House authorities banned him from the network. She resigned as Democratic National Committee (DNC) Chairman in July 2016 after unidentified hackers accessed the DNC’s emails, which Wikileaks later published.

After Awan began working for Wasserman Schultz in 2005, three of his relatives, including a 20-year old brother, as well as his best friend, appeared on other House members’ payrolls at salaries on par with congressional salaries. They have collected $4 million since 2010 despite being rarely seen.

rse

henry-jobsohio was part of my expressed concern over kasich before the ohio primary last year as it was so clearly the dirigisme assumptions.

interesting timing.

that link above for jimmy and others led me to hidalgo's cv. he has a phd in physics and is originally from chile so of course began lecturing in public policy at the harvard kennedy school the next year. that puts him firmly if largely out of sight at the places where ed policy originates and then also at mit working in the area that hatched a desire for a holos consciousness.

he was also a visiting scholar in 2007 at the santa fe institute, which explains the references to bowles and gintis as that is where they are now.

i love online cv's almost as much as 'acknowledgments' pages in old books to trace out clear connections using people's own statements.

narciso

That is why jimnc, good gravy they have gone full grishenko at luce's lament and Esquire,

JM Hanes

My sister remembers me reading Kant's Critique of Pure Reason at 14, which rather fuels my vanity, but what I remember most was exhausting the local library's supply of historical fiction. Lots of poetry readings by candlelight with friends, drinking "malt liquor" and smoking cigarettes, not much sci-fi. Catcher in the Rye was the great American coming-of-age novel of the day. When I finally got around to reading it, I wondered what the hoopla was all about. Never did manage to slog all the way through Moby Dick or Ulysses, despite being an English major in college.

Miss Marple the Deplorable

I read "The World of Suzie Wong" when I was 12.

This proves that teachers are not necessarily good at supervising their own children. LOL!

Captain Hate

You might enjoy them now that you're older and wiser, JMH. Lots of good literature is squandered on frivolous yutes.

Miss Marple the Deplorable

Other trash novels I read while in my teens included Valley of the Dolls and The Carpetbaggers.

rse

jmh-i really did not care for james joyce either and the librarians kept insisting i was not supposed to be reading adult books and should go back to the childrens section.

Miss Marple the Deplorable

Captain Hate,

That might be true, but if Ishmael hadn't survived, I wouldn't have had to read about that damn whale.

Dave (in MA)

I read the first volume--or part of it, anyway--of Foundation when I was about 14. I really couldn't get into it. Maybe I could give it another try.




Kathy GriffinVerified account @kathygriffin
I am sorry. I went too far. I was wrong.
David Burge‏ @iowahawkblog May 30
David Burge‏ Retweeted Kathy Griffin
The abject fear in her eyes indicates she was either grilled by the Secret Service or her booking agent

Mikey Adams‏Verified account @MikeyAdams420 May 30

Mikey Adams Retweeted Kathy Griffin
Put on some makeup Todd Rundgren

DebinNC

After reading post-nuclear holocaust novels "Alas, Babylon" and "Malevil", we don't view "preppers" as nutjobs.

Miss Marple the Deplorable

Oh, I read "Alas, Babylon!" too, Deb!

sbw

rse’s reference: s there a future for this unwieldy, sprawling post-neoclassical field?

No. The premise is that economics is unshaped because one cannot know enough to shape it, and so we network. ... The author’s hubris is to believe he can do better by shaping what he says is unshapeable.

The author relates and rejects Milton Friedman’s dismissal of economic theory, saying you don’t have to know physics to play billiards well. The author argues, “for that argument to be right, we would have to reject economics as a science. I think that would be too much to lose.”

Heh! Maybe not.

Jack is Back!

On second thought, I read a lot of Jules Verne as a kid. So, I guess 20K Leagues was my first SciFi:) Also, now that I think of it, H.G. Wells also as a kid. I remember the Time Machine and War of the Worlds being as fascinating as listening on the radio to The Shadow.

JM Hanes

JimNorCal:

I always wondered how on earth Wasserman-Schultz managed to keep her DNC position for so long, when she was so embarrassingly inept at the PR end of the job. The Daily Caller article seems strangely vague on this point, "Imran Awan is suspected of funneling sensitive House data offsite onto secret servers wholesale." Do we know whose servers those would be?

The reasons this is not a gigantic story can't be good, either. With the loan sharking thing coming up, though, I wonder if HMS W-S isn't beginning to take on water, despite the lack of MSM coverage?

sbw

JiB, Time Machine and War of the Worlds are too scary for young, and even old minds. It’s like listening to today’s “news”.

Buford Gooch

I find my taste in SF follows Iggy's closely. Vance and Campbell were marvelous writers.

Miss Marple the Deplorable

Well, I finally have a day which has neither rain nor wind and is sunny.

So I am going to go spray paint the porch furniture.

Captain Hate

Love Arthur C. Clarke's books but a valid criticism of him is that his characters are just stick figures that things happen to; but isn't that appropriate for big sciency forces? His prose is oddly appealing to me; i.e. I can consume large amounts at a time. Likewise Asimov but to a different degree.

Absolutely hated Strangers in a Strange Land as I've stated before.

Captain Hate

Trying to find my shocked face that MeAgain makes it all about her.

narciso

Yes I didn't even try strangers but moon and other tales.

Ralph L

I thought Mr. Musk was looking for courage.

henry

some find courage in a bottle, others find it in $billion taxpayer handouts.

Truthbetold

Debbie Wasserman Schultz’s Brother Steven Wasserman Accused of Burying Seth Rich Case

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2017/05/debbie-wasserman-schultzs-brother-steven-wasserman-accused-burying-seth-rich-case/

henry

from our Chitown friend: a href="https://twitter.com/rogerkimball/status/870276131022417920">real collusion, between intel community and Hilligula's campaign.

henry

the link from above

Man Tran

Re Asimov, I had some instinct that kept me from reading his early stuff which was confirmed years later that he was proven a condescending pedant much like the other 'scientists' like Sagan and the current crop of dweebs touted by the lefty crowd. Frankly, that's the vibe I got from DoT most of the time and why I never engaged him even when he sniffed something in my general direction.

JM Hanes

Captain Hate:

In this case, I'm afraid I gave both of them my best, last shot when I was in my older wiser forties. I was intrigued by Melville's observation that every road in town eventually leads to water, and that water is the finishing touch in every landscape painting, but that's about as far as I got -- which may be a matter of paragraphs -- before something somehow intervened.

Davod

WRT to Kathy Griffin. Who paid to set this up? Conspiracy calls.

henry

Tommy Steyer's butt hurt over the Paris Accords (treason if Trump pulls out?) is even more hysterical than Hillary's comments on who to blame for her loss.

sbw

Melville’s Moby Dick was the hole below the waterline for the 20th century bogus colonialism claim.

The book’s popularity among the British masses in the 1850s showed that colonialism is a two-way street, with radical ideas from the colony able to be absorbed by the homeland masses.

-peter

Has Krugman offered to cut his $400,000 salary to save some of the jobs of all the news room people laid off this week at the FAILING Slimes?

daddy on iPad at the Jet Lag

On topic. I am a tad inebriated but we JOMers have previously discussed George Soros struggling to understand Reagan's unpredicted ability to connect with the public and we have likened Soros's perception of the unexpected presidential victories of Ronald Reagan as Soros considering Reagan as equivalent to "The Mule," the unpredicted emotionally manipulative mutant in the Asimov novels.

We JOMer's have had this conversation before, and Insty is catching up. Trump is as aberrational to the Soros contingents false read of humanities trajectory as was their perception of Reagan as the "The Mule." The Left will continue to consider Reagan and Trump as aberrational characters, possessing nothing but some aberrant mutational ability to control others thru emotional bending and the madness of crowds.

Just posting this for reference, but I do recall Krugman explaining his teenage fixation to this Sci-if novel as his motivating factor of wanting to be the real world Equivalent of Hari Seldon, a sci-fi character who simply by equations could lead us to the glorious Marxist end of history.

Asimov whom I loved died way too early:(

Miss Marple the Deplorable

Well, came in after getting the chairs done and Sally Kohn is going on and on about how coal isn't coming back and those people need to be retrained and we can use clean energy which is cheaper and other BS.

It's amazing to me that someone who no doubt has a poli sci or womyn's studies degree fancies herself an expert on energy.

matt, deplore me if you must

SciFi was big; Verne, Bradbury, Stevenson, Wells, Heinlein, Asimov, and the Brunner and the like. It sort of turned off like a faucet at @20 or so. With the "we're all gonna die" of Schumacher and Toffler and especially Rachel Carson, Brunner's dystopia offered clues in avoiding the potential horrors of the brave new world they were predicting.

Sci Fi inspired us, it caused us to consider alternatives, and it raised interesting questions. A lot of it was responsible and coincided with our dreams of the stars and the potential of space. Besides, who doesn't want a phaser?

Sometime around then, pop became an expert on environmental issues and so we had all of the literature around the house. He said that environmental "science" was complete horse manure sometime @ 1968-69 when the first discussions of forming the EPA began. He said they were quacks and charlatans and there wasn't a real scientist among them. Just because one can measure parts per billion doesn't mean that it has any effect on overall water quality was one of his points.

Today, some of the environmental movement is science fiction. Especially at the intersection with progressive politics.

Davod

"i have their book from the 70s calling for a marxian revolution in the US using education so it need not necessarily be violent."

Herein lies the similarity to Islamic conquest. When 9/11 happened, and Al Qaeda took the blame, my first thoughts were that this will surely p..s off the Muslim Brotherhood and like minded surrogates around the world.

Why? Because these organizations were going to great lengths to introduce Sharia law into the laws of countries by legal means. They were/are succeeding.

Oh! 9/11 slowed down the process, but as can be seen in Europe and the UK, and to a lesser extent, here in the USA, the inculcation of the masses is proceeding.

henry

MissM, like particle physics, energy must conform to social justice or perish.

Ralph L

radical ideas from the colony able to be absorbed by the homeland masses.
You mean like pajamas and curry?

I'll bet my college roommate was the only one in his class to finish Ulysses.

Miss Marple the Deplorable

Large explosion in Vatican city. Video at link.

https://twitter.com/TrumpTrain45Pac/status/870312202577858560

Miss Marple the Deplorable


Jared Beck Retweeted
Breaking News‏ @BreakingNLive 14m14 minutes ago

BREAKING; Witnesses reports hearing an explosion before thick smoke rises above Vatican City in Italy

matt, deplore me if you must

The Pope exploded?

James D

JMH @ 11:27

I agree completely. How this isn't THE biggest story in the news is itself a massive scandal and indictment of the MSM (as though we needed one at this point)

henry

CH: WI Article V bill moving forward.

I have problems with this.What do we do when the GOPe/unitparty enshrines cronyism?

Dave (in MA)

Reportedly a garage fire.

Gentlejim

Is that a lone wolf garage, Dave?

rse

henry-that's why it matters when i read the book by the prog law prof who originated the idea for the concon and discover a blurb from robert george, who just happens to be on the board of the bradley f as well as other think tanks pushing this.

it becomes the vehicle for the communitarian vision i have been warning about as it was intended to do. this civil society vision bradley and others have been pushing needs a new constitution.

i had never even heard of that foundation until it kept coming up as the common denominator.

Dave (in MA)

Not the usual smoke at the Vatican scenario.

Davod

"Former CIA Director James Woolsey said the federal officials who are leaking national security information about the Trump White House are "traitors to the country," and defended the administration's reported outreach to the Russian government."

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/clinton-cia-director-anti-trump-leakers-are-traitors-to-the-country/article/2624557

Ralph L

The new Pope is yuge.

Account Deleted

CH: "Roadside" was the philosophical treatise which killed my first marriage in its infancy. The first Mrs. Kid was a Billy Jean King vs Bobby Riggs era feminist.

Robbins' novel had as one of its tenets the following which I'll paraphrase (as it's disgusting and I'd never own a copy of that POS).

It held that feminine odor was known only to females in the world who'd had the unfortunate experience of being inseminated by a male sex partner.

At 22, my ex was less impressionable than she was a blooming mush headed liberal fascist "organizer". 40 years later she's leading the fight for "food security" (code for driving Big Food companies out of business and turn the US back to a subsistence agrarian economy with "local control"--- which, as you know is code for unelected regulation by "smart" people.)

Kev

PS: Elon Musk is a megalomaniacal crony capitalist drowning in delusions of grandeur and overcomplicated financing. He's extorting the wrong President.

Account Deleted

Islam is the perfect organized cultural force for the Deep State's advancement in controlling the behavior and thought of the US population.

Islam encourages the grassroots spying and subjugation to non-compliant behavior by all whether one is muslim or not.


Until our President re-establishes Islamic fundamentalism, not as an idea, but as an invading force in this country (by identifying its published priorities and its agents-like the MoBros), Islam will continue to use First Amendment protections under law to shield its nefarious intentions and "lone wolf" asymetrical warfare.

It's all laid out how our government and our military have been had to this point where the camel's ass is now in the tent one and one half decades following the 9-11 takedown.

Read: Catastrophic Failure by Stephen Coughlin.

Please forgive me in advance if I'm coming off as a know-it-all. ;)

James D

Elon Musk is a megalomaniacal crony capitalist drowning in delusions of grandeur and overcomplicated financing. He's extorting the wrong President.

I think that's fair assessment.

Dave (in MA)

Maybe Pope Che's head exploded because of the climate covfefe.

Account Deleted

Hear hear, James D.

Musky Boy has a PR firm from hell scenting his larcenous behavior. You'd think he's the second coming.

Account Deleted

Sgt. Schultz is going to lady jail.

Her case will be the capstone coming off the Congressional sewer of pay-to-play "representation.

Bout friggin time.

AG Sessions is loading a lot of cannister shot for imminent firing into the Deep State's exposed flanks. (They never thought they'd lose. Kind of like a political Maginot Line. See ya.)

sbw

Spam folder had in it an email professing to recover from ransomware ... Click here.

Miss Marple the Deplorable

http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/gage-cohen/department-education-ig-reveals-6-billion-improper-payments-2016#.WTBC0qlabik.twitter

Account Deleted

6 billion buys a lot of loyalty. Time to follow the money and put people in federal prison--- solitary. "How ya like us now, public servant?
"

No possibility of parole. Sorry.

Captain Hate

Sometime around then, pop became an expert on environmental issues and so we had all of the literature around the house. He said that environmental "science" was complete horse manure sometime @ 1968-69 when the first discussions of forming the EPA began. He said they were quacks and charlatans and there wasn't a real scientist among them. Just because one can measure parts per billion doesn't mean that it has any effect on overall water quality was one of his points.

I took an Earth Science course around that time and of course your Pop was correct. It was like a science elective for Philosphy or Pre Law majors where a huge bullshitter like Slick could ace without knowing anything. Like a social science.

I suspect that a higher percentage of male readers like Moby Dick than female.

Account Deleted

Why should government defrauders and embezzlers get any better than Bernie Madoff With Your Money?

Miss Marple the Deplorable

A billion here, a billion there, pretty soon it adds up to real money. - Senator Everett Dirksen


I always here the mocking from the NeverTrump people about how waste and fraud are not enough to balance the budget. Seems to me we should be figuring out how much of this shady accounting was going on and where the money went.

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