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September 13, 2017

Comments

jimmyk

Primero!

JimNorCal

Sorry, off topic already.

An intro to the upcoming independence vote to separate Catalan from Spain.
Mish is a Ron Paul style economist. Not an issue for this report.
https://mishtalk.com/2017/09/13/catalan-independence-vote-october-1-why-whats-at-stake-what-do-the-polls-suggest/#more-47958

2 minute duda

God bless you Mr.President.

JimNorCal

From the prev thread. Is this something intentionally put into law? Accidental historical side effect? Dem connivance, perhaps aided by GOPe?
I do remember a big push to get the word out to illegals to let themselves be counted, perhaps in Obamacare first term.

"Representative Steve King (R) of Iowa just said this to Tucker re: illegal aliens:
King: ...another point is that we count them (illegals) in the Census, in the United States Census. Legals and illegals, and citizens and non-citizens, are all put into the same batch, and then when we redistrict, the members of the House of Representatives have members of Congress that are representing Districts that have a high percentage of illegals in them."

Ralph L

That means a state (CA) with many illegals can get more congressmen than it should have based on citizens.

JimNorCal

Yes, of course, RalphL.
And that's not good.

I assume this happens because historically they counted "people" for purposes of allotting representatives: males, females, sane, insane, registered to vote, not registered, kids, back in the day they counted 3/5 per black person and so on.
Doesn't cause problems once you fight a war to free the black slaves. No problem until you stop enforcing immigration laws. Then things go downhill.

JimNorCal

Probably posted earlier by someone. I don't remember Congress going on record to force a President to denounce, oh, say, Islamic fundamentalism and intolerance.

Good thing they're on this and not wasting time on a balanced budget, or military readiness, or simplified taxes or ....

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/12/us/congress-trump-hate-groups-charlottesville.html

In a rare show of bipartisan unity, Speaker Paul D. Ryan of Wisconsin and Senator Mitch McConnell of Kentucky, the majority leader, introduced the measure as a joint resolution, which requires a presidential signature. Two Republican congressional aides involved in the process said the intent was to put the president on the record calling out white racism by name.

daddy

Here's what I don't understand.

Since Sally Quinn has the power to Hex people to death why hasn't she murdered Donald Trump?

I can only conclude that she wants Donald Trump to live, therefore she must secretly be a closet Trump supporter. No other explanation makes sense since she has told us she believes she has the power to Hex people to death, having successfully murdered 3 people so far by witchcraft.

2nd Question---Can we prosecute her for those murders? Surely that falls under some penumbra of The Constitution and Tobin's Spirit Guide.

daddy

RalphL,

A quick goolag search shows California has more illegals (2.35 Million) than we have citizens in our entire State (740,000) and that 2.35 Million number is more than the populations of 15 other individual States. That certainly seems unfair on its face to US citizens to be redistricting using Illegal Alien numbers.

Ralph L

OTOH, CA is stuck with only two senators.

Jane

NC , SC... intermittent rain

Barbara

With a Democrat Governor and Legislature, sanctuary cities and a huge illegal underclass that has expanded under Moonbeam Brown, California is no longer the state it was under Ronald Reagan, Pete Wilson and George Dukmejian. It will take some political cataclysmic event to turn this state around.

It could happen if people see President Trump delivering on his agenda and the courts back up his program to secure our borders. That's a long shot at best because of so many factors only one of which is DACA.

I was reading the comments of Californians who are fed up with the high cost of living in this state. Most were just biding their time and had plans to leave. Very few wanted to stay because of the great weather, beaches, and mountains.

The state has become prohibitively expensive for young people starting out and the government is unresponsive to the wishes of the people. Those are the main reasons before you even touch the issue of how much the illegal alien population has effected the economy of the state.

Change could happen if the President is successful in securing the border and enforcing our immigration laws. Without those two items limiting the flow of illegals into the state, California will become a rogue state within the Union dragging the rest of the country down.

Ignatz Ratzkywatzky

--Two Republican congressional aides involved in the process said the intent was to put the president on the record calling out white racism by name.--

OK. So who cares that that happens? Certainly not everyone who is not a prog and is sick unto death of being called a racist by the scum sucking peaheads. Progs only care.
So who do Ryan and McConnell actually represent?

JimNorCal

Excellent point, daddy. If Repubs were pro-American they would do something about it.

Speaking of the last power bastion of the Dem Party (namely, GOPe) let me repost the link to recent Codevilla that I think was posted 3 or 4 threads back.
https://amgreatness.com/2017/08/31/2016-election-not-reversible/
Today, the bipartisan ruling class, which the electorate was trying to shed by supporting anti-establishment candidates of both parties in 2016, feels as if it has dodged the proverbial bullet. The Trump administration has not managed to staff itself—certainly not with anti-establishment people—and may never do so.
... the ruling class’s dysfunctions and the rest of the country’s resentment had pushed America over the threshold of a revolution; one in which the only certainty is the near impossibility of returning to the republican self-government of the previous two centuries. The 2016 election is not reversible, because it was but the first stage of a process that no one can control and the end of which no one can foresee.

Barbara

ten intent was to put the president on the record calling out white racism by name.--

That would be political suicide.

JimNorCal

By the way, I'd say Codevilla is a Ledge guy if you argue any specific issue. He thinks Trump is faltering, or at least Trump is not gifted, not playing 4D chess.

But he also points out that it doesn't matter whether Pres Trump is just a guy from Queens or a savior anointed from on high. The point is that historical forces have been set in motion. And that's WAY more important than personalities. I think he expects a 3rd party to rise. In fact, as early as 2020 the GOPe party could finish third in the presidential election. That's quite a stretch, but I think he has his finger on the political pulse whether or not things move so quickly or decisively as he theorizes.

JimNorCal

The "gay cruise" ads on the sidebar are gone.
The NRA ads are gone.
The dating ads are gone.

Now I'm getting an ads for CRTV. Stop watching Fake News!
https://www.crtv.com/page/offer?utm_source=dataxu&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=fake-news

I've reduced my cable TV budget to $0, so a $10/month offer is not so appealing but they seem like the real deal. Does anyone watch them currently?

Ignatz Ratzkywatzky

The latest from Codevilla;
Establishment GOP Puts Cronies over Country on Missile Defense

Barbara

By the way, I'd say Codevilla is a Ledge guy

I'd say he's got one foot off the ledge.

If the President made any mistake, it was in assuming that the Republicans would work with him to implement his agenda. Filling every position with Trump-minded supporters is the ideal, but falling short of that isn't fatal.

As for shedding people like Bannon, I don't see that as a bad thing. General Kelly has proven his worth to this administration many times over. The leaks seem to have slowed to a crawl, if not stopped, and Kelly seems to be bringing order to the West Wing. That's all to the good.

WRT Codevilla's main concern, the truth about the Republican Party is out. How President Trump deals with that as he goes forward remains to be seen. But I don't quite see things as dire as Codevilla does.

Barbara

The Missile Defense Agency’s hottest idea nowadays is to equip drones with laser weapons capable of destroying missiles deep in North Korea while hovering over international waters

Not necessarily drones. The platform is is much more compact and ideally it could function in a number of scenarios including the upper atmosphere.

The focus veered off trying to "knock missiles down to destabilizing them quite awhile ago.

Jane

GA

daddy

Who Wore it better?

daddy

GA

James D.

If the President made any mistake, it was in assuming that the Republicans would work with him to implement his agenda. Filling every position with Trump-minded supporters is the ideal, but falling short of that isn't fatal.

I assumed it, too. I think a lot of people did. Once he won, I figured most of the GOP would more or less go along even if they'd opposed him right in until midnight on November 8th. Seeing the example of a winner, and seeing the psychotic mess the left has become, what choice would they have?

Boy, was that wrong.

Miss Marple the Deplorable

Donald J. Trump‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump 7h7 hours ago

China has a business tax rate of 15%. We should do everything possible to match them in order to win with our economy. Jobs and wages!

Miss Marple the Deplorable

Donald J. Trump‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump

Crooked Hillary Clinton blames everybody (and every thing) but herself for her election loss. She lost the debates and lost her direction!

Miss Marple the Deplorable

Donald J. Trump‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump 6h6 hours ago

The "deplorables" came back to haunt Hillary.They expressed their feelings loud and clear. She spent big money but, in the end, had no game!

Miss Marple the Deplorable

The above 3 posts were made AFYER the dinner with Schumer and Pelosi, and AFTER they misled the press and said that the he had given up on the wall, which the press secretary came out and corrected an hour later.

Miss Marple the Deplorable

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2017/09/no-deal-second-trump-official-refutes-democrats-misleading-statement-daca-border-wall/

Val

It hasn't happened yet.
Trump knows it would be political suicide.
REMEMBER...*who* is announcing this: Dems and MSM
Like they are so trustworthy.../s

anonamom

Jane, I better not find you on my OR list when I get in!! ;-)

Miss Marple the Deplorable

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/09/14/white-house-disputes-schumer-pelosis-border-wall-claim.amp.html

RattlerGator

Good morning.

I agree that Codevilla is a member of Lurker's Ledge, with this caveat: I suspect he sees a role he must play and that is to alert all of us to very real events that are looming on the horizon. If there is a six-in-one, half-dozen-in-the-other situation (or anything even close) he's rolling with the Ledge possibility as a probability.

I respect everybody over there and know damn well they could be correct. Just as we need Soldiers on the wall, we need OL and CH et al on the Ledge. Talking yang and delivering jabs -- at the opposition *and* (sometimes) at us.

Personally, when you're the 4th of six children, and the 2nd of three sons, in a strong-willed and opinionated family, with similar extended family types on both maternal and paternal sides, it's easy to see this.

However, those of us on the Portico have a role to play as well. We know that Trump almost certainly didn't make a "mistake" by trusting the GOPe would do X, Y, or Z. He made a prudent decision based on factual realities.

His is a position where it is wiser (much wiser) to allow people to continue underestimating you while you continue your initial march *and* allow them to further show their hand. Give them opportunities to do the right thing, or the wrong thing. Trusting that the American people will figure things out as you continue to control those things fully within your control. And no, the FBI is not fully within his control *or* that of Jeff Sessions.

I don't see a third party rising. That's a long, hard slog and counterproductive IMHO. It unnecessarily zaps all kinds of MUCH-NEEDED energy. No, we have to infuse the GOP with a new spine ALONG WITH some new blood. These lobbyists and special interests have influence that's a mile wide and an inch deep and cannot withstand real sunshine.

If it was not so, Donald Trump clearly would not be President.

Stay the course, Mr. President.

Faith and patience.

Miss Marple the Deplorable

Good morning RG,

It's amazing to me that people immediately believed Pelosi and Schumer, augmented by the AP. Thank goodness I went to bed and ignored Twitter, which apparently blew up last night over Schumer and Pelosi's little trick.

Coffee and Danish are being served on the Portico.

Miss Marple the Deplorable

Donald J. Trump‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump

No deal was made last night on DACA. Massive border security would have to be agreed to in exchange for consent. Would be subject to vote.

Miss Marple the Deplorable

Donald J. Trump‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump 4m4 minutes ago

The WALL, which is already under construction in the form of new renovation of old and existing fences and walls, will continue to be built.
9 replies 3 retweets 1 like

henry

Trump is taking bids. Now Ryan and Turtle are on the spot to do something. A good buyer has all the vendors thinking "my deal" until the final selection. (A smart vendor can tell anyway, but this is Schumer, Pelosi, and AP... suckers desperate to fool themselves). Wait for what Trump does,Minot what others leak.

Jane

Florida!

Miss Marple the Deplorable

henry,

I just got done going through the comments on Treehouse for the Presidential news thread (where I sometimes find links). Two pages of hysteria over this stupid Schumer-Pelosi trick, ginned up by Never Trumpers and lib trolls, and augmented by people who should know better, like Anne Coulter and the Breitbart editors.

I will say it again: get the information from the White House. The news media has become democrat propaganda and the alternate media is full of grifters, moles, and mercenaries looking to make money by clicks and angling for TV and book contracts.

Miss Marple the Deplorable

Donald J. Trump‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump 5m5 minutes ago

Does anybody really want to throw out good, educated and accomplished young people who have jobs, some serving in the military? Really!.....
9 replies 3 retweets 1 like

JimNorCal

Agree, RG, third party would be very risky!
Dems might win during the period where opposition is split. Realizing it might be their last win they would be sorely tempted to do something extreme.

Miss Marple the Deplorable

Donald J. Trump‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump 26s26 seconds ago

...They have been in our country for many years through no fault of their own - brought in by parents at young age. Plus BIG border security
27 replies 6 retweets 10 likes

Captain Hate

Just as we need Soldiers on the wall, we need OL and CH et al on the Ledge. Talking yang and delivering jabs -- at the opposition *and* (sometimes) at us.

That's my job. Nobody wants to destroy those GOPe handmaids of the Gas Chamber of Crony Capitalism who've lied to the base for years more than me. They did their best to neuter the Tea Party and figured that we'd just slink away like beaten dogs. Fuck that shit. Trump was Plan B and we've got the rest of the alphabet to use if that's what it takes to MAGA.

Miss Marple the Deplorable

I am fascinated in watching the Art of the Deal in real time.

Thomas Collins

Putting together what Pelosi's people and President Trump are saying, it sounds as if there is a deal: Dream and Wall. However, Dems are pushing Dream first, Wall later (meaning never). Prez is saying Wall needs to get funded before he signs Dream.

Jack is Back!

There are some who want stuff and Trump has a plan for them.
Then there are some who don't want the other's to have stuff and Trump has a plan for that, also.

McTurtle and NotWhoWeAre are mismatched in this game.

narciso

Heh daddy ghost busters reference.

Heck there needs to be a second party besides the uniparty, yes its a concern, the liberal party romped around till the reform party got going, their first candidate Stockwell day boy the sort of treatment the huntress received.

Jane

So you guys are now for DACA?

RattlerGator

Welcome back to the Great State of Florida, Jane!

* * *

Of course RG's head would explode.

Posted by: Old Lurker | September 13, 2017 at 02:33 PM

I'm taking this early morning moment to read the threads in reverse-chronological order (start of thread to last comment, then next earlier thread to last comment, etc.) and I tell ya, I just can't wait to see what the heck this comment relates to -- y'all feel me ???

I could make a males-only joke right about now re my head exploding but I shan't.

Miss Marple the Deplorable

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/09/14/new-normal-trump-tackling-issues-hurricanes-with-few-distractions.html

narciso

Yes Mr. President, otherwise the law isn't worth what it's printed on.

RattlerGator

Isn't Obamacare already a black hole?

[that's not an allusion to skin color, incidentally]

Posted by: jimmyk | September 13, 2017 at 03:22 PM

Mmmmm hmmmmm. Thass still ray-ciss, Cracker Man !!!

Miss Marple the Deplorable

Jane,

DACA has been ended. The problem is what to do with the people already here.

My opinion on this has pretty much been the same. Most of these people are here through no fault of their own. Vet them for criminal records. Deport those who have committed crimes. Give the rest a legal status which has no path to citizenship, maybe legal permanent residency.

The "deport them all" people are not realizing what it would be like to see deportations of soldiers who served in Afghanistan, young mothers with children, or young priests on live TV. It would be a PR disaster of epic proportions.

I doubt most people were even aware that this group of people existed before Obama wrote that executive direction or whatever it's called. Congress had an opportunity to act on this situation over the last few years but did nothing. Now that it has been dropped in the president's lap, it seems to me that he is doing the best he can to both honor his campaign promise to end DACA but to treat people humanely.

Miss Marple the Deplorable

Donald J. Trump‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump 13m13 minutes ago

Am leaving now for Florida to see our GREAT first responders and to thank the U.S. Coast Guard, FEMA etc. A real disaster, much work to do!

henry

Miss M, until some of the people get crushed by law as it is, we will keep getting more of them and rolling amnesties. This game started with Uniparty games under Reagan. Stopping it must be ugly.

Miss Marple the Deplorable

henry,

I see no evidence that the President doesn't know this.

Miss Marple the Deplorable

daddy,

Good news for you!

http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-alaska-dispatch-news-20170912-story.html?utm_source=CNN+Media%3A+Reliable+Sources&utm_campaign=6d4232a001-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2017_06_06&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_e95cdc16a9-6d4232a001-81558817

" The change is expected to shift the paper’s liberal editorial views as voiced by Rogoff to a more conservative approach by the Republican-leaning Binkleys."

Porchlight

I took it for granted since before the election that existing DACA recipients would be grandfathered in some way.

I don't like it but I can live with it as long as the program is ended.

That said, it also doesn't bother me that existing recipients are having to sweat a little over the next few months. And I'll be furious if special consideration is given to their families.

Captain Hate

The "deport them all" people are not realizing what it would be like to see deportations of soldiers who served in Afghanistan

This means nothing to me. They are mercenaries and the same category of people who undermined the Roman Empire.

If they're going to stay, Trump has to play some real hardball on this. No expedited path to citizenship. No receipt of government payments at all. No inclusion in the census and definitely no voting. If they don't like it get the fuck out.

Porchlight

That's what I'd like to see, Captain. They can stay if they're not criminal beyond the initial lawbreaking of being illegal. That's all they get.

And if they're all so wonderful, why wouldn't Mexico want them back so they can help make Mexico great for the first time?

The larger problem is incentives beyond DACA. Universities have plenty of non-DACA illegals.

Another Bob

MM, as I'm sure you realize, so much of prog mischief is quite specifically designed to produce a victim group that can be exploited if the mischief is undone. (Hell, the victim groups line up to be so exploited.)

The "dreamers" ( I hate that term) may not be the hill to die on, but proper fixes to the various holes in the hull must inevitably remove a "benefit" from a beneficiary.

Miss Marple the Deplorable

Captain Hate,

Are you aware that ALL illegals are counted in the census? Not just these people - ALL of them.

And on the basis of those census counts, California gets more representatives that it really should have.

I would say this is a far larger problem than these people.

hrtshpdbox

The problem is what to do with the people already here.

Your stance on this has been precisely my stance since the beginning, as well.

Another Bob

This has probably been covered here and I missed it. Is there general agreement among the denizens of JOM that the H1B program needs to go too?

Miss Marple the Deplorable

Another Bob,

I would say it needs drastic revision. Too many abuses.

Jack is Back!

Mr. President, before you go all in on Dreamers, perhaps you should read Mickey Kaus first. And he is not some heartless right-winger. Waiting for Congressman Guittierz (D-Mexico) to call him "dispicable".

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/dont-buy-all-the-pr-style-hooey-about-dreamers/2017/09/12/adc246d6-9738-11e7-82e4-f1076f6d6152_story.html?utm_term=.4b7ae5757211

RattlerGator

How 'bout those Jags, so far?

Posted by: Jack is Back! | September 13, 2017 at 09:46 AM

I sat there on Sunday and COULD NOT BELIEVE MY EYES !!! The best thing, for me, was nothing looked like a fluke. They have a monster defense that loves to hit hard. When Mickey Andrews, later a famed defensive coordinator at FSU for years, was still just a DB coach at UF he used to talk about "dead cockroaches" out on the football field. Wide receivers on the opposing team, laid out on their back, face up and motionless. That's what he wanted to see. The Jags put a bunch of Texans in the concussion protocol on Sunday and it was quite a sight to see. Nighty nite nite!

If we can just beat the Titans on Sunday, we will be in tremendously great shape going forward to London in week three.

Now if my Gators can just . . . just . . . oh, what the hell. Bring on the Vols!

Captain Hate

Are you aware that ALL illegals are counted in the census? Not just these people - ALL of them.

And on the basis of those census counts, California gets more representatives that it really should have.

I'm aware that that's a perversion of the purpose of a census and undermines the benefits of being a citizen, all inflicted on us by the Uniparty.

Buckeye

Had an employee who was an H1B recipient after grad school. Excellent contributor to our organization. She ultimately became a US citizen

Nonetheless, it pissed me off that when her parents were here they lived in Section 8 housing.

No wonder entitlement spending is out of control.

Fuck that shit.

-peter

33 hours to NYC JOM meet-up. Exciting

Miss Marple the Deplorable

Buckeye,

Indianapolis has a large population of Chin refugees (Burmese Christians). They get sponsorship from churches and are n subsidized housing.

Big eye opener to my grandson when he went to pick a friend up in his used car and there were all sorts of expensive SUV's and pick-ups in the parking lot.

The Chin are good immigrants and in fact many qualified for college scholarships through academic excellence. They also are entrepreneurial, starting their own shops and such. Very little crime from that community.

However, they are guided in taking maximum advantage of all government programs and it really isn't fair to working white poor, who don't qualify for many of the programs.

RattlerGator

We shall see, but to pretend there is no smoke in the air indicating a possible fire somewhere doesn't seem to comport with either observations or the nature of the Swamp.

We may not be at the 'who you gonna believe, me or your lyin eyes' point yet but it's on the horizon.

Posted by: Ignatz Ratzkywatzky | September 13, 2017 at 10:33 AM

Well, the converse is even more true Iggy. All of that smoke? A pretty good indication a certain faction is losing a fight they deserve to lose and they are manufacturing smoke in a desperate attempt to get out a principal that is winning the battle against them.

The charges against McMaster are idiotic and make Trump out to be a fool, General Kelly and General Flynn as well. Clearly he isn't, and neither are they. A range of parties, good guys and bad guys, have been leaking. The leaks must stop.

They can scream about McMaster all they want but the Trump Administration seems to be well on their way to solving the historic leaking problem. Good, good, good. By choosing military men to be the tip of the spear for solving this problem, Trump has chosen wisely.

Miss Marple the Deplorable

RG,

I still would like to remind people that General Flynn knew McMaster and probably suggested him.

rse

Apart from the 15 yo driving a car incident I mentioned, having the Dreamers stand up at every higher ed function I go to about their rights to in0state tuition if public and a full-ride if private is not making me warm and fuzzy. Neither is their insistence that they will become political activists until they are given their heart's desire. It essentially enslaves existing citizens to meet the needs of any stranger who could make it here.

Miss Marple the Deplorable

From Chhitown Lurker:

McCarthy is on CNBC saying 25% not 15% on corporate rate and is laughing about notpassing Ocare repeal and no tax deal.

=========================

This guy is even worse than Ryan.

James D.

At what point can we expect AG Sessions to - however difficult his job, however little support he has beneath him at DoJ - to start doing his freaking job?

http://thehill.com/policy/national-security/350473-justice-blocks-fbi-officials-from-senate-interviews-on-clinton-comey

Janet the expert 🚬

So you guys are now for DACA?

Not me.
Every person that is in America illegally should be sent back to their home country. Every. Single. One.
We can give them info on how to apply to come legally, but every person must come legally.

If they need to blame someone, they can get mad at their parents.

hrtshpdbox

..having the Dreamers stand up at every higher ed function I go to about their rights to in0state tuition if public and a full-ride if private is not making me warm and fuzzy.

I can't disagree with this, it almost makes me think "just throw 'em all out". Janet Napolitano's, now University of California prez, is suing the administration because ending DACA will, she figures, eliminate tuition payments from all the illegals in the school system. I can't get behind goofy logic like that, or sympathize with illegals demanding their "rights". I think the realistic and fair solution is to end DACA and rigorously examine those already here on a case-by-case basis to make sure that criminals and troublemakers are shown the door. I can't see that being very complicated, or controversial.

Old Lurker

View from the Ledge, 8 months into One Party Control:


Jane "So you guys are now for DACA?"

Check.

Pretend Border Wall.

Check.

ObamaCare in place as-is.

Check.

Taxes going up for me.

Check.

Clinton Foundation Crime Cash Intact.

Check.

Spies leaking electronic data to foreign countries Scot Free.

Check.

Obama appointees still at their stations.

Check.

Koskinen & Lerner untouched.

Check.

Clapper and other Deep State liars untouched.

Check.

Spending passed by CRs, not Reg Order.

Check.

Out of control spending continues.

Check.

Debt Ceiling Thingy cancelled.

Check.

Rule of Law depends on one's class.

Check.

DoJ Rug covers up even past sins.

Check.

Obama cancellation of Civil Forfeiture reinstated.

Check.

Obama cancellation of Tanks for Cops Program reinstated.

Check.

Opposing Team Lawyers given SP Powers with unlimited scope and funding.

Check.

Oh this is just too easy...

Captain Hate

rse gets it exactly right. How bizarre is it that a bunch of illegal leeches get to lecture citizens about what they should do for them? What other country allows that? Granted, Western Europe is engineering something similar but they're doing it as a part of a legal suicide pact.

hrtshpdbox

If they need to blame someone, they can get mad at their parents

If their parents need to blame someone, they can get mad at the American business owners who invited them in to work their fields.

Janet the expert 🚬

Putting together what Pelosi's people and President Trump are saying, it sounds as if there is a deal: Dream and Wall. However, Dems are pushing Dream first, Wall later

So it is the SAME as always. Amnesty & then nothing.

Donald J. Trump‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump 5m5 minutes ago

Does anybody really want to throw out good, educated and accomplished young people who have jobs, some serving in the military? Really!.....
9 replies 3 retweets 1 like

Yes. I do. Are they legal?...if not, they need to return to their HOME COUNTRY & apply for citizenship.

RattlerGator

Well, I don't think I have an exact source for the exploding head comment but I presume this series of comments is "it" as much as anything:

Jokes going to be on RG when every one of the Royals skate on all matters from the CCF on down to DWS and the DNC, leaving some poor Commoner to take the fall for all of them, and spit on the graves of the dead soldiers, spies and diplomats who sacrificed for us because of these crimes and idiocies.

Posted by: Old Lurker | September 13, 2017 at 11:06 AM

* * *

I don't like this for one minute. A deal with the Awans to get an obsolete player like DWS?

Looks like we get a dog and pony show again.

Posted by: Threadkiller | September 13, 2017 at 11:57 AM

* * *

The Awans were in with all the Dems in DC. You pursue that, there is nothing remaining of the swamp or uniparty. Maybe life breaking rocks with get them turning on each other.

Posted by: henry | September 13, 2017 at 11:59 AM

* * *

I'm not confident that Ms. Awan is any big catch, immunity or not. She probably likes living in the US better than living in Poke-ee-stahn, and got a "good deal" to return. Not saying she isn't a criminal, just saying she may be in the dark about her hubby's espionage. She gets immunity, and he gets tagged with theft of services and equipment - BFD.

Posted by: cboldt | September 13, 2017 at 12:45 PM

* * *

Look, isn't it time we admit on this board the Awan thing is almost certainly some sort of a ODNI/CIA op? An out-of-control ODNI/CIA op where Clapper & the Obama Administration abused all manner of laws? And Comey was either in on it or *had* to cover for them for national security reasons?

There are necessary tools our intelligence community need, if used properly, and the craziness of the Obama Administration -- if fully exposed & admitted -- puts the continued use of those tools in jeopardy, right?

This is probably why Mueller was brought in to see the President before being named special counsel. They *have to* walk a really slippery slope here and they need to figure out how it's going to be cleaned up, and then presented to the nation.

That's the way it looks to me. Now, back to my Honey-do duties. Later, Gators.

Captain Hate

And about this dreamers in the military crap:

"llegals can't join the military but some use stolen
ID's to get in. When we catch those we kick them out and notify ICE. I
admit some do get through despite all of the checks, and some go on to
serve their entire enlistment without getting caught but the numbers I
saw discharged for being an illegal was tiny less than a half dozen that
I can remember over 22 years.


Posted by: The Great White Scotsman"

So the illegal Dreamers that served in the military are most likely guilty of identity theft and probably thrown out? Great. The only thing that surprises me about this is that I actually bought that part of the lie, even though I already know just about everything we are told about illegal immigration is utter BS.
Posted by: Ripley at September 14, 2017 08:27 AM (MxEKc)

hrtshpdbox

Are they legal?...if not, they need to return to their HOME COUNTRY & apply for citizenship.

That's obviously not going to happen.

Old Lurker

Trump "Does anybody really want to throw out good, educated and accomplished young people who have jobs, some serving in the military? Really!....."

More than forty years ago as I was getting to know my MIL, it used to drive me bonkers that having a "political policy" discussion with her ALWAYS resulted in her coming back at my argument with an anecdote about some person somewhere she knew who "disproved" my entire argument.

Thanks Trump. MIL would be proud of your argument there.

Miss Marple the Deplorable

I am not going to argue about this, since NOTHING has been passed, and no one is paying attention to how the President operates. Go back and read his books again, if you haven't already.

I am going to be absent for a while as I have errands to run.

Old Lurker

RG, I thought your head would explode if I had been able to get MM to move in with us in return for her laundry skills. Especially if I offered to build her a veranda on my Ledge.

henry

Just in case you wondered about Equifax, all that data "protected" by admin/admin userid/password on web. Long jail terms, use SarBox to get officers and directors jailed too. That is inexcusable.

Old Lurker

MM, we are beyond arguing about it as you mentioned the other day. Either your view will prevail, or the Ledge view will, and only time will tell.

The value in our constant "bickering" is that it measures the status of the rock hard believers (you), and the Trust but Verify cynicism and skepticism of the Ledge rats - all of whom want you to be right, we really do, but we fear we have seen this movie before. Trump was elected by and needs both of us, so it is of some importance how each of us (groups) are viewing things.

Captain Hate

Don't worry, henry; Mr. Peepers Sessions will get right on that. The only problem is that every time he starts reading the regs it's zzzzzzzz time. To be completely fair, that's not an uncommon reaction.

Appalled

Trump can do a Nixon goes to China deal on DACA because he can carry enough of the folks Ryan and McConnell can't rely upon. The details on the deal, however, are important. If he gets the Dems to swallow a real wall -- he's delivered on his key promise. If he gets a fake wall -- I'll be interested in how that turns out. Iggy has the Arnold Swarzanegger experience, so he can probably tell us...

This is one where the details are important, and I am curious how well Trump will do on that. (This is Trump's Big Thing, so he has no excuse for getting rolled. Let's just concede, though, that he has not been rolled yet, and he has Trumped the usual dynamics of the GOP majority that has made deals impossible since 2010 or so.)

James D.

If they're going to stay, Trump has to play some real hardball on this. No expedited path to citizenship. No receipt of government payments at all. No inclusion in the census and definitely no voting. If they don't like it get the fuck out.

I agree, but even if President Trump gets that deal, it won't last, because there will be a full court press to reinstate everything dealt away, one piece at a time. And anyone who disagrees will be cast as heartless - just as those who want to deport them are being portrayed now.

First it'll be the benefits. Then local/state voting rights. Then a path to citizenship for military service. Then citizenship for working in "public service" jobs more generally (which means working as prog activists will be a ticket to citizenship).

That's how this kind of thin always goes.

Old Lurker

That poll yesterday which reported that 40% could not name more than one of the three branches of government shows you the ghost of Christmas future. As damaging as we Baby Boomers have been to this country, when our cohort is gone, the last group of people who at least were exposed to Civics and Western History as we were being taught to read, write and add and subtract, then no one will remain to pass it down.

Poof.

Janet the expert 🚬

Are they legal?...if not, they need to return to their HOME COUNTRY & apply for citizenship.

That's obviously not going to happen.


Why? Come legally or get sent home. Why is that an impossibility?

All the ideas about checking if they broke other laws...who is gonna do THAT? More government workers?

Trump's huge issue was stopping illegal immigration. THAT was the spark that lit the fire.
Waiver on that & he is done.

Old Lurker

WashTimes just now:

"President Trump said Thursday that he is working with Democratic leaders on a plan to legalize illegal immigrant Dreamers, and said he won’t insist on funding his border wall as part of it, saying that “will come later.”
The president also said GOP leaders in Congress are “very much on board” the deal he’s working with Senate Minority Leader Charles E. Schumer and House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi.
The two Democrats emerged from a working dinner at the White House Wednesday to say they’d all reached a framework, which would speed a bill to grant Dreamers full legal status, coupled with more border security. But they said the president agreed the wall wouldn’t be part of that security.
White House press secretary Sarah Sanders disputed that version later Wednesday, but Mr. Trump on Thursday agreed with the Democrats’ reading, saying that the wall will not be part of the deal.
“The wall will come later, we’re right now renovating large sections of wall, massive sections, making it brand new,” he said as he departed the White House en route to Florida, where he was to look at hurricane recovery efforts.
Mr. Trump said he will insist on “massive border controls” as part of the Dreamer bill."

This is bullshit of the highest order.

Femall.

Old Lurker

Janet "Waiver on that & he is done."

"waiver" implies still standing. I see a total cave to the dark side.

henry

Yes, the same fake "immigration control plus a wall to be named later" that fooled Reagan.

henry

Also, of course the Turtle and Ryan are on board with Schumer and Pelosi... same Chamber funds them all.

Old Lurker

I am moving from wondering how the entire MAGA agenda will get done to wondering if any single element of it will.

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