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May 18, 2006

Comments

clarice

TM, you think that extra redaction is Powell, don't you, you sly devil? He whose name may not be uttered. HWNCBU (TAc sters)

topsecretk9

Clarice

I was thinking about Walton and Libbys lawyers discussing Wilson and Walton not wanting them to attack what he said to the papers and they agreed they did not want to do that...later I thought a fantastic response to Walton

" Yes your honor, we do not intend to attack the claims mr. wilson was making, incredible waste of time in light of the SSIC report debunking those claims long ago..so we are really talking about mr. wilson communications with reporters regarding his wife's employment"

clarice

Sue, is the word you are looking for "discovery"?

Lurker

"hey're relying on geniuses like Sheuer who thinks OBL is an admirable chap and Pillar thinks terrorism is not a problem we should just learn to live with it."

And Larry Johnson who said back in July 2001 of the declining terrorist threats...

Sue

Nope. I'll think of it. It is a case name. Like Jenks or something.

PeterUK

Clarice,
"Pillar thinks terrorism is not a problem we should just learn to live with it."

Wasn't it John Kerry who said something to the effect that,"Terrorism should be reduced to thelevel of nuisance"

clarice

Sure. And that everything we did in foreign affairs should pass an International Test--which is a swank way of saying we should no nothing and pay a lot to the UN for providing us with cover for doing nothing.

patch

" 4) Related to (3), it is my understanding that what has been blogged here is pretty much common knowledge inside the Beltway."

Oh no, not again, more inside info, just like Valerie Plame-Wilson's job, work location, classified/covert status, etc.

Isn't anything secret inside the Beltway?

Let's call Andrea Mitchell-Greenspan for confirmation.

clarice

**we should DO nothing"***********

Specter

I just emailed the following to Marc Ash:

Marc,

Have you locked me out from participating in the discussion groups? What is up with that? Not a very nice thing to do for a group that calls itself TruthOut. Or is it some form of technical error? Just thought I'd ask.

Specter

Let's see if the TO director has the integrity to answer.

Lurker

"And that everything we did in foreign affairs should pass an International Test"

And they couldn't define the word, "terrorism".

This is exactly what the lefties want to do - turn over our military to them.

topsecretk9

FYI Bellsouth demanding a retraction

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - BellSouth Corp., the No. 3 U.S. local telephone company, on Thursday demanded USA Today retract claims in a story that said the company had a contract with a U.S. spy agency and turned over customers' telephone records.

link at drudge

PeterUK

Clarice,
No need for corrections,I understand you perfectly,we share similar typing skills.

clarice

Heh! Here's a JL piece narrowing Woodeard's source to either Armitage or Hadley and saying why it's Hadley. (Remember, possums, who his sources are!)

Sara (Squiggler)

Bell South (and Verizon too soon I expect) is demanding a retraction from USA Today. Has anything that has come from sources on the left ended up holding water on any front? Doesn't seem like it to me!

clarice

JL(Wilson) says it's Hadley

Lurker

"Heh! Here's a JL piece narrowing Woodeard's source to either Armitage or Hadley and saying why it's Hadley. (Remember, possums, who his sources are!)"

Clarice, where????

Rick Ballard

Sue,

Brady material?

PeterUK

" Nicollo Pollari, who was implicated in pushing the bogus claims that Iraq had sought uranium from Niger."

It appears that Lybia got uranium from Niger,which is just down the road so to speak.

clarice

Just above your post, lurker.

Lurker

Thanks, Clarice, it gets even more interesting. Is Hadley listed as the second witness on Libby's list?

clarice

I don't have the pleading handy but I think not. I think the first two are Armitage and Powell.

Sue

Rick,

Yeah. I think so. Isn't Brady material evidence that is exculpatory?

Sara (Squiggler)

Can someone tell me who Stephen Waters is besides being the vocabulary police?

Sue

I'm on dial up and it takes forever to open a pdf file. In the last hearing, where Wells is talking about the classified emails, Fitzgerald says something about turning them over in accordance to Brady. If someone wants to check the transcript and post the actual language, it might prove I've lost my marbles.

topsecretk9

from sweetness and light: on Wilson:

...9/11 conspiracy theories

US Representative Cynthia McKinney led a Capitol Hill hearing on July 23, 2005 into “what warnings the Bush administration received before the terrorist attacks of September 11, 2001.”

Panelist and former CIA official Melvin Goodman was quoted as saying “Congresswoman McKinney is viewed as a contrarian and I hope someday her views will be considered conventional wisdom.”

Many 9/11 researchers testified at the hearing, including Michael Ruppert, Peter Dale Scott, Wayne Madsen and several others.

Sue

Squig,

Where did you run into this person?

Kate

Read Madsen's archieves (very strange stuff). But on the Plame case, it is striking how much his theories and timing align with JL, LJ, and Shuster.

They all had a focus on Hadley and predicted his indictment many times.

Sara (Squiggler)

They sent me an email correcting my use of "seed change" to "sea change." Apparently, in other parts of the country it is sea, where I grew up it was PA Dutch for change of season planting and seed, both mean the same thing in context. Just thought it odd that someone would take the time to write me an email that I take as being snark.

clarice

Worked the first time into persuading the prosecution Libby and Rove were the way to go. Problem with these dummies is they thought they could pull it off a second time. At some point or another their friends were going to be outed as the snakes they are.

Sara (Squiggler)

They should be He sent

Kate

Anyone aware of why the hostility toward Hadley. I can understand Rove, Libby, Cheney, Bolton...don't know what in Hadley's background would make Wilson single him out as a guy to take the fall?

xrayiiis

"They should be He sent"

Not to worry. Hardly a seed change.

clarice

If it's Hadley or Armitage and you're Wilson you want the finger pointed at Hadley (the WH not DoS).

Sue

Squig,

Wow. Someone has too much time on their hands...for what it's worth, I've never seen it used as sea change either.

xrayiiis

Hardly a seed change, smile!

Kate

Yes, but they kept pointing at Hadley back in October before Woodward indicated he had an earlier source. They wanted Hadley, perhaps because he was a very senior official and it would look good.

And I wonder if Matthews is another one of Joe's friends. He was very excited on Friday morning and said he might have to refilm his show because something big was going to happen re Rove. Now poor Chris should be jealous because he did not get all the colorful details the Leopold did, but maybe he did and wasn't allowed to run with it.

clarice

Couldn't happen to a more deserving jerk.

sbw

Sara, it was me, and I thought I was doing you a favor discreetly, by email instead of public post. You mistook one phrase for another and I thought you might prefer not to do it again. Aparently I might have been mistaken.

sbw

Let's not make this a tar baby! ::grin::

PeterUK

If this coup succeeds,do the perpetrators not understand that they have injected something so toxic into your body politic that they will be unable to rule?

Tom Maguire

FWIW, Hadley's elevation to NS advisor did *not* require Senate confirmation; neither did Armitage's resignation.

Hadley is a better target for the Wilso-philes because he was a member of the White House Iraq Group and was deeply involved in sorting out the 16 Word debacle with Tenet. Consequently, his participation ion a brutal, shameless conspiracy to punish Joe Wilson and strip America of its ability to monitor Iran's nascent nuclear capability was pre-ordained. Well, unless Armitage was the leaker.

clarice

For what it's worth "sea change" is how I've alwasy seen it, and I don't think sbw was in any way being unkind.Sometime though email doesn't always convey intended tone..

sbw

Word origins:
"This term, meaning a type of metamorphosis, is yet another one coined by Shakespeare. It is from Ariel's song in The Tempest (I,ii):

Full fathom five thy father lies;
Of his bones are coral made:
Those pearls that were his eyes;
Nothing of him that doth fade,
But doth suffer a sea-change
Into something rich and strange."

And I really don't have too much time on my hands because I spend too much time lurking on JOM. I apologize if it was taken as a snark. Not intended that way.

Kate

PUK: the Left has been successful in criminalizing policy disputes and politics because the legal system is leftist for the most part and the media is 90% Democrat. That's how Clinton was able to survive impeachment. Mrs. Clinton wasn't impeached because the DC jury system is so Democratic.

If Rove's indicted Bush should look into the camera unsmiling and say:

I will leave it to the prosecutor, Mr. Fitzgerald, to sort out who forgot what conversation about what bureaucrat, I have to worry about the American people.

Sara (Squiggler)

SBW ... well I didn't take it as being kind or helpful, just rather anal. I also call rubber bands gum bands and some times say Worshington instead of Washington, and I always call a purse a pocketbook. Those are regional dealies and so is "seed" vs "sea" but I will be sure to use the version acceptible here, although I can't quite conceive why it should matter anyway.

Sara (Squiggler)

acceptible = acceptable

Tom Maguire

FWIW, we are striding ahead of Raw Story as if wearing seven league boots - so far, all they have is Clemons, but no Drezner.

And hre is the infamous INR memo.

clarice

Sara, I'm sure it wasn't meant to criticize you. Regional English is so interesting. My husband and I always call water fountains "bubblers" and in the Dictionary of Colloquial English we learned for the first time that that term is used only in 2 cities:Milwaukee and Boston and that is because both cities bought them from a company which coined that word for them.

owl

Hint to Fitz....many times I have said I thought you had to indict Rove because "what's a SP to do" to get their tail out of this bind? Fairly obvious you do not want to go into Powell's office sooo..

I have a solution for you. Wilsons. It's big. It's bold. It will actually hold up to inspection. The Left is unhappy but more shocked.....shocked I tell ya.

All those reporters can start to breathe again. Plus the added advantage of truth.

sbw

Thank you, Clarice, for supporting the different possible interpretations. I'll retire back to lurking. At JOM, it's my area of expertise.

But, Sara, while you have been quick off the mark with your judgment, you shortchange the usefulness of my experience and wisdom. But that is of no matter. Back to our main feature...

Kate

owl-I think Fitz is a fan of Wilson. Can't figure out the gullibility.

Sara (Squiggler)

Clarice, SBW, et al -- I'm sorry for losing my temper. I'm still frazzled from doing my son's paper. Turned out he hadn't even started it and this paper determines his final grade, for his final class in college. Cultural Anthropology is not a subject I wanted to get into today, nor did I think I was getting myself into having to produce (from scratch) an annotated bibliography with a min. of 12 sources of which none could come from the Internet meaning finding reference books and changing subjects to make use of my own at-home library. The first thing I saw when I came up for air was SBW's email and it was just very bad timing. So I'm sorry.

sbw

Sara, we'll laugh at my bad timing and move on. 'Nuf said.

Regards/sbw

PeterUK

Kate,
Without Wilson as "Whistleblower" and Plame as "Super Secret Agent" Fitz would not have a case.

clarice

I know Sara and SBW stop lurking , we'd value your contribution.

sbw

No! I didn't mean "Move on." That's too loaded a phrase.

clarice

See, sbw,aren't you glad you came out of the shadows? I am.

Jim E.

"I'm still frazzled from doing my son's paper."

Why the f are you doing the homework of a 30 or 40 year old man? That's cheating. Sad stuff.

owl

Bingo! PUK...it's his perfect solution.

Sara (Squiggler)

Well, I managed to cobble something together. Who knows if it will meet the criteria, but at least he won't have to take an incomplete. I haven't had to do this kind of thing in 40 years. Sheesh, I had to go online and read about annotated bibliographies just to get the proper MLA format. And I only had about 2 1/2 hours to get it all done. I don't think I have my breathing back to normal yet. It is times like this that I wish I did drugs.

Neo

I seem to have come late to this thread.

Most of this Inman stuff flies in the face of the (much) earlier reports that Fitz was done and just waiting for Miller, then in jail, to fill in the last blanks.

The only thing really new since then is the Woodward revelation and UGO.

I keep getting the feeling that Fitz is extending the grand jury time just to keep some documents out of Libby's attorneys hands.

Sue

What is a CIA WMD manager?

Sara (Squiggler)

Jim E, because he doesn't type so I agreed to type it and do the editing. He failed to tell me that he also didn't understand the assignment and had nothing on paper. I would have told him to take the Zero, but darn it, this is his last class and I want him graduated so he can start earning a living again. Besides, I'm a Mom and a soft touch, I guess.

clarice

neo, the statements that Fitz was almost done were made BEFORE Woodward showed up.

sbw

Sara, it's a shame we didn't have our tiff earlier. My wife teaches MLA!

Neo

clarice: I thought I said that.

The only thing really new since then is the Woodward revelation and UGO.

Sara (Squiggler)

Last remark on my frazzle also to Jim E ... I agree that you could call it cheating ... I would too except I don't think in his line of endeavor there is a big call for being any kind of expert on Culturl Anthro. and the Migration of the Quaker movement across the U.S. so I don't think his lack of research on the subject will be any detriment to him or anyone else. I just didn't want him to have to take the incomplete and have to spend a whole new semester to take this one class over. Call me a softie or stupid, but that's the way it is.

SBW -- now you tell me. Part of my ill humor was the fight we (my son/me) had because he had not done the work I expected to be typing up for the paper.

PeterUK

Sue,
"What is a CIA WMD manager?"
Somebody who, because of marrying a high profile ex-ambassador,raising a family,having depression and has been outed twice before can no longer play Mata Hari.At the same time the CIA owes them because of a debacle where details were sent to Cuba.
No previous experience necessary,although a degree in physics,engineering,chemistry or bio-chemistry could prove helpful,but obviously not essential.

ghostcat

neo -

"The only thing really new ... is ... Woodward ... and UGO."

What do you mean "only" paleface?

maryrose

sbw:
Glad for your contribution and a little bit of the OLD BARD on this rainy Thursday evening.
Squig:
Have your son take you out to dinner for lending him a hand. Have fun at the graduation. It will be a great day for you both.

Sara (Squiggler)

More OT, re: Duke case. Has anyone else noticed that Seligman and Evans look like twins? I'm not sure that I could name them right even after seeing their captioned pictures plastered on the TV over and over again.

maryrose

NEO:
Bingo!

Sara (Squiggler)

Maryrose -- he will be in class tonight and it is my daughter-in-law's birthday so I get to take her out for her favorite Shrimp Scampi. She has requested Red Lobster.

Sara (Squiggler)

Lawsuit by German man who was claiming torture at one of those "secret prisons" was dismissed today. CIA claiming the suit would reveal methods and sources or some such. Fox News report.

Sue

In re the INR and Valerie Wilson. The CW is Fleischer and others walked reporters right up to the wife and didn't step over, indicating they knew her employment should be kept secret. How about they walked them right up to the wife and didn't step over because it would look like a petty push back if the WH pushed the nepotism angle when the story was Wilson was lying?

Gary Maxwell

Has anyone else noticed that Seligman and Evans look like twins?


They just look not guilty to me.

Neo

If UGO == Richard Armitage (seems probable), then ..

if Richard Armitage gets indicted then Fitz is gonna have a lot of explaining to do to Judge Walton. His explanation of the withholding of UGO's name doesn't read like someone who is a target, potential or otherwise. The only possible exception is if Fitz had some sort of a "wink wink" clause, which Luskin et al would use to throw out the case on appeal.

Which brings me back to .. I keep getting the feeling that Fitz is extending the grand jury time just to keep some documents out of Libby's attorneys hands.

Sue

Another tidbit...Scary Larry refers to the 'cabal' in the WH as republican operatives. The word he says Novak wouldn't have used in describing Plame unless he knew she was an operative. ::grin::

xrayiiis

Sara,

I hope your son's professor does not read the comments on this blog. :)

Sara (Squiggler)

xrayiiis - He just called while on a class break. Said, "prof. said it looked fine and at least a B and maybe even better." Whew! The ol' gal still has something left, not all the brain cells have been fried since 1967.

xrayiiis

He owes you big time.

Sara (Squiggler)

The word he says Novak wouldn't have used in describing Plame unless he knew she was an operative. ::grin::

Oy vey.

Sara (Squiggler)

xray -- he is a baseball coach. When he gets that big major league contract, I expect to call in all the chits and have him support me in my old age in a manner I am presently unaccustomed to.

windansea

testing 123

windansea

where did everone go?

clarice

I'm here.*waving*

windansea

hey Clarice! no one posted for almost an hour...

topsecretk9

4) Related to (3), it is my understanding that what has been blogged here is pretty much common knowledge inside the Beltway. I am genuinely surprised that it hasn't appeared anywhere else in the blogoshere.

Blogged about? WOW, I am genuinely surprised no Beltway reporter has tried to...you know...R E P O R T on it.

Lurker

Just came back from walking 3 dogs and all.

Wanna bet that Fitzy will announce the Rove indictment tomorrow? Or next Friday? Or...???

Or Fitzy will announce an indictment of somebody else? Armitage?

Lurker

And has Specter heard from TO?

windansea

I am pissed off....I come up with the scoop of my JOM career....posted the Washington Note bombshell that Inman thinks Fitz is after Armitage early this morning when nobody was blogging it and Clemon's post had 3 comments...turn the whole plameworld on it's heels from obsessing on Leotard's frogmarch to a righteous discussion of the prime leaker....and what do I get?

bubkus! :)

clarice

Interesting Drezner assumes we will carry the laboring oar..Well I've done a small blog and when it goes online I'll post it..

clarice

windansea..I credited you in my blog ..I don't know what my editor will do with it but he rarely messes with my credits to others.

clarice

I respect you. I respect you like crazy--to borrow a line frim an old Elaine Mae Mike Nichols shtick..

windansea

gracias C

actually I just checked talkleft firedog and emptywheel none of which have addressed this in posts...perhaps it doesn't fit their narrative

topsecretk9

you are right Windandsniffer...in fact I did think today, wow...that was a super find, a truly super find!


Bravo, Bravo

topsecretk9

Talkleft has a new post up on Yorks post today...and ends with

I think York is correct and Madsen got spun about Gonzales. But none of this means Karl Rove will or will not be indicted tomorrow. The mainstream media is conspicuously avoiding the topic. Stay tuned.

Pretty easy to avoid a story if there is nothing there...and if there is no truth to it...staying conspicuously quiet about the topic means bloggers take a hit for it.

clarice

Consider this a lesson in pathological belief systems.

windansea

I do credit Jeff for an honest 1st post at the Washington note...don't know if he went there after seeing my post this morning but he was quite fair in analyzing the info

TS...you got me from the start...I don't have the total recall or legal expertise many here exhibit...just a good sense of smell

and FYI...I found the link to Clemon's post about Inman at......the DUmp!

:)

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Wilson/Plame