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October 17, 2006

Comments

clarice

JMH..Not trying to start an argument with you. Certainly there is no reason why we can't work well together even though we have disparate views on things. It's just that in my heart I think I could devise a better worded quiz and on such a quiz, Jane, Cecil, Rick and I would share a single blot on the chart.

Larry

5.63/-0.15. Too wierd!

Larry

So, why do conservatives support "school vouchers?" Posted by: anonymous | October 18,2006 at 02:37 PM

In every case of which I'm aware, vouchers are funded by the states, which can get along nicely without federal interference.

TCO

OMG. THe Republicans are gay. I'm voting Libertarian. Hope those guys don't smoke pot.

Rick Ballard

Clarice,

I dunno. I keep getting "insufficient graph space" on this one. Who's Hulagu Khan, anyway? Usually these things come back with Scipio Africanus or "I surrender, have mercy".

clarice

We could use Hulagu again, wiseguy.

anonymous

In every case of which I'm aware, vouchers are funded by the states, which can get along nicely without federal interference.

Posted by: Larry | October 18, 2006 at 03:33 PM

I remember how nicely the southern states got along "without federal interference" in the days of Jim Crow.

Larry

I'd have thought we were several years beyond Jim Crow, anonymous. Here's one for you:

Amendment X

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.


anon

Where is Tom, on vacation?

The Wheldon story looks rather like another Democratic black bag op.

The Justice Dept and FBI rarely, if ever, announce investigations into a Congressmans affairs three weeks before his election, because it's tantamount to defeating him.

It seems likely that they did not intend to do so here either, until some anonymous source spilled the beans to AP, at which point they had to move quickly. They probably would have held off until next year if not for the leak. At this point its not important if Wheldon is innocent or not - he's going to lose his seat.

It seems that Democrats in the FBI, just as in the CIA, put their party before all else.

Sue

I remember how nicely the southern states got along "without federal interference" in the days of Jim Crow.

Then you also remember the unwritten laws of the northern climes that produced the slums of Harlem, where the black entertainers at the Cotton Club were not allowed to sit at the tables, where Hollywood awarded an Oscar to a black entertainer as long as she sat at a table by herself in a restaurant that no black had ever entered as a guest, where cemeteries were reserved for whites only and she was not allowed to be buried where other stars rested? The south merely put into writing what the north practiced by default.

Extraneus

I don't recall any questions related to, for instance, campus speech codes to protect the feelings of minorities. Such questions would seem tailor-made to detect authoritarian liberals; though I'm not sure the authors of the quiz would realize that.

I was thinking the same thing. And I was also thinking this test probably needs another axis, something related to national security. Tendencies on issues like pre-emptive defense or willingness to support political correctness at the expense of security don't fall so neatly into the 2D economics and social axes, and probably skew the social axis by not being separated out.

anonymous

Amendment X

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.

Posted by: Larry | October 18, 2006 at 04:05 PM

A good and wise amendment. But the states do not have the power to take from their citizens "certain unalienable rights" not granted by any government.

And the only reason we have begun to get beyond "Jim Crow" is precisely because of federal interference in the unconstitutional activities of certain state governments.

anonymous

" ... merely ... " ? Well, then, no harm, no foul.

And how typical a Republican excuse for wrongdoing: 'The Northern states were being mean to the Negroes too.'

I swear you people can excuse anything.

Sue

How typical of you. The entire country treated the African Americans badly. But 50+ years later, because the north didn't put it in writing, they are able to take the high road. I'm sure you have read Martin Luther King Jr. You of course already know that he complained of the worst treatment he ever received in any place was Chicago. Not hardly a bastion of the south. But no Jim Crow laws so they get a pass?

Larry

"...we have begun to get beyond "Jim Crow" is precisely because of federal interference in the unconstitutional activities of certain state governments." The supremes performed their function, schoolwise, well in advance of the Department of Education. Are you a member of the professional victim class?

anonymous

Nobody but you said anyone gets a pass for racial discrimination.

The point above was the conflict between federal/constitutional issues and states rights.

Cecil Turner

And how typical a Republican excuse for wrongdoing: 'The Northern states were being mean to the Negroes too.'

Are you really so ignorant of history as to not know which party controlled the Jim Crow south?

I swear you people can excuse anything.

[Snort] We're quite willing to hold the Dems responsible for their performance on civil rights. Why don't we start by expelling former KKK Kleagle Sen Byrd?

anonymous

No, Larry, I am not a member of your non-existent "class." Are you?

Sue

ABC News carries the following headline...

The context, however, if you read Tom Friedman, had to do with stepping up violence to effect an election. I hate MSM.

anonymous

If you want to move to West Virginia and campaign to "remove" Senator Byrd, I wish you all the luck in the world.

As to who controlled the South in the days of Jim Crow -- that would be white people who owned and operated it.

Sue

Are you really so ignorant of history as to not know which party controlled the Jim Crow south?

Apparently. He seems to think things were just peachy keen in the rest of the country for blacks.

anonymous

Apparently, Sue, you are neither psychic nor very good with reading comprehension. I said nothing that would imply that I thought anything, anywhere was "peachy keen in the rest of the country for blacks."

I'm sorry that you could not follow the original point, but preferred to go off on a tangent you thought suitable for absolution of Republicans and indictment of Democrats.

Cecil Turner

As to who controlled the South in the days of Jim Crow -- that would be white people who owned and operated it.

Care to be more specific? Here, let me help you out:

Jim Crow laws were a product of the solidly Democratic South. As the party which supported the Confederacy, the Democrats quickly dominated all aspects of local, state, and federal political life in the post-Civil War South, right up through the 1970s. Even as late as 1956, a resolution called Southern Manifesto, condemning the Supreme Court's ruling in Brown v. Board of Education, was read into the Congressional Record, and supported by 96 southern congressman and senators, each one a Democrat. [emphasis added]
Now, wanna run that bit about "Republican excuse[s]" by me again? And do you still claim to be getting paid for this drivel?

anonymous

I have never claimed to be paid for anything of value, let alone wasting time and energy on you.

Sue

I said nothing that would imply that I thought anything

Well, you got that much correct...

anonymous

And if you insist on your strange view of American history, fine, have it your way. The evil Democrats held down the poor Negroes while the fine, upstanding, Christian Republicans fought tooth and nail for them.

Is that how you need to see it?

anonymous

You're very clever, Sue; I'll bet your Mom is very proud.

Cecil Turner

. . . preferred to go off on a tangent you thought suitable for absolution of Republicans and indictment of Democrats.

Oh nonsense, blather boy. You're the one who brought up a "typical [] Republican excuse for wrongdoing" and tried to blame Republicans for Jim Crow. (Best bit you've had so far . . . it's truly funny, in a pathetic sort of way.)

And if you insist on your strange view of American history, fine, have it your way.

Oh, how precious, you actually thought that revisionist nonsense was true? This just keeps getting better.

I have never claimed to be paid for anything of value, let alone wasting time and energy on you.

Oh, and here I thought you were professional entertainment.

Sue

You're very clever, Sue; I'll bet your Mom is very proud.

You walked into it. ::grin::

boris

So my comment on school vouchers has led to the white shame of Jim Crow. I didn't bother responding to the squeeking of a ninny mouse because it is pointless.

As pointless as pointing out that Republicans ended slavery, wrote a civil rights bill during the Eisenhower administration that was filibustered by democrats, and Republicans who provided the filibuster busting votes to get civil rights passed during the LBJ administration. Because Republicans love minorities? No beacuase they tend to vote on the basis of solid American principles more than some other political parties do.

Why bother, facts don't matter to a ninny mouse. How could they? A ninny mouse has no brain.

JM Hanes

boris:

"A close score on the self-gov quiz and a distant score on the compass quiz is suspicious."

It's also entirely possible that you might appear to be closer together in a less sensitive test. On the Political Compass quiz, you and Cecil (and Clarice) are actually very close on the economic axis. You diverge on the left/right social axis. In light of your extended analysis of the "religious" question, I'd note that the World's Smallest alternative doesn't touch on religious matters at all. Thus it cannot make distinctions on that basis, among others.

I thought the difference was worth a commenting on in Testing, Testing, Testing.


Clarice:

You can start an argument with me any time! In case you didin't notice, I was already arguing with you. :) I'm sure you could design a test which plugged you, Jane, Cecil, and Rick into the same slot, but are you really all that sure that you're virtually interchangeable or that such a test would be especially useful?

I would also like to pause for a Rumsfeldian moment, to say that we're working with the test we've got. If there's a better instrument that can be similarly charted out there, I'd be interested in knowing what people think it is, and if there's agreement on what it is!


Jane:

I'll pick some coordinates for "a little bit on top of Cecil - over the line" (and refrain from editorial comment on that position!) in the next revision, and you can let me know if they look satisfactory. It's not that hard to change 'em if they aren't.

anon

It's interesting to look at the "Shake This" thread where anonymous is also commenting like a jack-rabbit on speed. He's simultaneously tieing up multiple threads on this site.

Clearly one of the higher paid trolls.

Syl

As I continue to ::GAZE::.....

A bit OT, but I hope to not be around much for a while. Bryce 6 hath arrived with the usual OMIGOD I DONT BELIEVE IT deal from DAZ.

Need to spend time cleaning up harddrive, consolidating content from THREE versions of Bryce I have installed and...

render! render! render!

I'm still shaking from the excitement! I've been using this program for TEN years and STILL love it.

Might drop by on breaks.

Oh....I put a couple Happy Halloween pics up!

Enjoy!


anonymous

Republicans, like everyone else, vote on their self-interests. There are no principles involved.

And yes, slavery and Jim Crow are the eternal shame of White America. Deal with it.

anonymous

A political party that campaigns for torture, that celebrates the first suspension of the right of habeas corpus since the days of the corrupt Ulysees Grant, has no idea what "solid American principles" are.

boris

the World's Smallest alternative doesn't touch on religious matters at all

Since I am not religious that's not the explanation. The relevance of the question is questionable and it's wording was revealing of agenda.

"You cannot be moral without being religious."

IOW "There are certain people (we don't like) who believe that only religious people are moral. Are you one of them?"

My emotional response to that is "Do Re Mi Fa Q"

I am not one of them but I do know that enviromentalist "morality" is bunk along with the other existing PC alternates. Of course the enviromentalists would claim their morality is based on "science" rather than "superstition". A claim one suspects you have some sympathy for. My reply is "Wrong, enviromentalist morality is based on cargo cult junk science and religious morality is based on long term natural selection". Evolution may not be "intelligent" but it sure as frak aint stupid either.

boris

"squeek squeek squeek"

Whats that sound ??? Could it be a ninny mouse ???

Cecil Turner

And yes, slavery and Jim Crow are the eternal shame of White America.

Slavery? You do know where that came from, I hope?

Deal with it.

Ah, from the mouths of babes . . . (even those who can't bring themselves to admit error, or that their attempt to blame Jim Crow on Republicans might've been a teensy bit misplaced).

. . . the first suspension of the right of habeas corpus . . .

Usually: "suspension of the writ of habeas corpus . . ." (Just trying to improve the trolling quality.) And unless I missed something recent . . .

Clearly one of the higher paid trolls.

This is one of the better ones? Obviously a seller's market, eh?

anonymous

I am sure in the small circles you travel in, Mr. Turner, your recent comments pass for wit and wisdom. I suggest you do not venture outside those circles.

anon

Per the US Constitution;

The privilege of the writ of habeas corpus shall not be suspended, unless when in cases of rebellion or invasion the public safety may require it.

Since anonymous is not American he can't be held responsible for not knowing that habeas corpus is a privilege, not an inalienable right, and may be modified or suspended as the public safety requires.

anon

This is one of the better ones?

In the troll marketplace, "better" signifies "more annoying", or "more disruptive". I think you would agree that anonymous should command top dollar on that basis.

anonymous

Neither Soros nor Fenton is interested in quality; just quantity.

If they were concerned with quality do you think they'd still be bankrolling Kos, Media Matters, Sheehan, and Greenwald?

clarice

Lovely, Syl--You'll be missed. Hurry back.

JM Hanes

kaz:

Consider yourself plugged in (and welcome in from the cold as well).

Cecil Turner

I am sure in the small circles you travel in, Mr. Turner, your recent comments pass for wit and wisdom.

Pointing out your poor grasp of high school history required neither. And after your little display here, you can hardly complain about the lack of substance in others' comments.

I suggest you do not venture outside those circles.

Oh please.

Since anonymous is not American he can't be held responsible for not knowing that habeas corpus is a privilege . . .

More to the point, the writ has not been suspended. I suspect he based the claim that it has on one of the recent unlawful combatant cases, which are of course based on WWII precedent, but in any event his "habeas" statement was nonsensical. And it would've been entertaining to point that up, but . . .

JM Hanes

boris:

"Of course the enviromentalists would claim their morality is based on "science" rather than "superstition". A claim one suspects you have some sympathy for."

Huh? I have no idea why you'd make any such assumption. You posed an objection to a specific question, which is why I've used it as an example in making a number points, not because the subject is religion per se. Last time around I was simply pointing out that a simple test gives you a lot less distinctions to work with.

"IOW "There are certain people (we don't like) who believe that only religious people are moral. Are you one of them?"

Pretty much. Was it really all that hard to say no and tick off disagree (strongly)?

arrowhead

"You cannot be moral without being religious."

In my view, one can have a guiding set of moral values or principles based on a belief in God without necessarily being religious - that is practicing a particular religion. So, I'd disagree with the question or statement as written.

hit and run

Well, the person to ask regarding moral questions would be Kos, no?

Who else has savored the sweet taste of moral victory as often and without the deleterious effects of experiencing actual literal victory?

clarice

Speaking of Kos:
[i]Two days before the 2002 mid-term elections, Zogby vs the result.

Mondale was cruising by 5 in Minnesota

Minnesota
Mondale 50
Colman 45

Too bad he lost by 3 points.

Mondale 47
Colman 50

Strickland was a lock by 9 in Colorado

Colorado
Strickland 53
Allard 44

Just two days and a 16 point swing later he lost by 5.

Strickland 46
Allard 51

Max Cleland, what can I say? Result in bold. Are you noticing a pattern here?

Georgia
Cleland 49 46
Chamblis 49 53

My, my .. the beat goes on.

Texas
Kirk 48 43.3
Coryn 49 55.3

Many are familiar with Thune, who didn't lose by the 5 Zogby projected. How many people stayed home on the margin? Your guess.

South Dakota
Johnson 52 49.6
Thune 47 49.5

Zogby had Lautenberg right in NJ, but under-polled Forester by 6 points.

New Jersey
Lautenburg 54 54
Forester 38 44

Carnahan by 1 but 2 more popped up for Talent and he won. The typos are via Kos.

Missouri
Carnhan 49 49
Tallent 48 50

And going back to Oct. 22, these pearls of wisdom from DailyKos via Charlie Cook:

Cook notes that Dems have a good shot at taking GOP seats in Arkansas, New Hampshire and Colorado, while the race in North Carolina has become unexpectedly competitive...Consider, perhaps the surest takeover bet is Arkansas, a GOP seat. And if the GOP loses New Hampshire, which I believe is likely, then forget it. There's no way the GOP can take the Senate.

Too bad Dems lost all of the above by 5 - 10 points.

MSNBC says Big Dem Wins Likely. Now where have I seen that before?

[/i]
http://www.riehlworldview.com/carnivorous_conservative/2006/10/a_unique_perspe.html

Sue

"You cannot be moral without being religious."

The definition of moral is, loosely, knowing right from wrong and practicing it. Each person's definition of right from wrong varies from one religion to the other or for someone who is not religious, their own personal sense of right from wrong. The way you answer that question, agree, disagree, strongly either direction, would determine where you place religion as a guide for what morals are to you, personally. And where you would place on the social scale of the compass. Which is probably why I fell slap dab in the middle instead of my usual slightly right of center.

I believe a person can be moral without being religious. So I strongly disagreed. However, I believe religion played a part in man determining what was moral to begin with.

kaz

JMH:

Thanks. Sorry to quibble, but the A/L score was a negative [-]0.46, not a positive. My score is very slightly left of HIT. [Sad to say, but in the group I seem to encounter day to day, I think this is the first time I've used the phrase "to the left of" in a lonnngggg time.]

kaz

TexasIsHeaven

Well, once again I did the test and scored about the same. Econ r/l 1.50 and social lib/auth is 0.10.

Mr. Hanes - does this mean I am not as conservative as I thought? I've been reading this blog for the last 3-4 months and Clarice, Slim Guy, PeterUK, Rick Ballard, and Cecil feel the same way I do about most things - I just can't articulate facts and ideas the way they do.

S. J. Reynolds

JM Hanes

boris:

BTW, my "Pretty much" above referred to your paraphrase; it was definitely not meant to confirm that I'm one of the folks who agreed with the statement. Wouldn't want any confusion on that point; I disagree emphatically.

Sara (Squiggler)

JMH -- Just looked at your graph and if SSQ is me, I think it is charted incorrectly. My score was +2.00 Economic and -.46 Social which put me two clicks to the right and slightly BELOW THE CENTER LINE. I think you missed the minus sign.

JM Hanes

kaz:

That's not a quibble, that's a correction which I'm happy to make. Afraid I transcribed it incorrectly, but it should be in the right place now. Had a laugh over "to the left of"! In some of my earlier forays on the web, even my sinsiter location was still considerably to the right of everyone else.

Also, in case folks notice their names moving around, it usually just means I've added a point and needed to reposition the labels for clarity.

Sara (Squiggler)

Sue, I also disagreed that you need to be religious to be moral, but for slightly different reason. I think we all are born with or without a conscience. I liken in my own mind the conscience to be what religion calls the "spirit" of God. I call it the spirit of good. Those without a conscience, I believe to be the definition of evil. I think this is internal and that religion is an outgrowth of this and not the other way around. But then it is the very arbitrary rules that religions want to foist on me that drove me away from any organized religion.

Some relgions think dancing or singing is immoral, how stupid is that? I say to them, read the Psalms where God tells David to make a joyful noise. It is full of song and dance. Look at how people are judged for all kinds of purely social behavior and looked down on. Jesus wouldn't do that, all were welcome. Even babies have a moral sense because they understand love and respond to it almost instantly upon taking their first breath. Children with zero religios training still grow up to be good and moral people because we are built to be sensitive to others. You can see it in the great apes. No religion there and yet their is an order to their communties and those who break the rules get punished or ostracized.

Sue

Sara,

Not arguing religion, just saying that man (or some woman?) decided what was right or wrong. Based on something. A greater being? A need to control baser tendancies?

And how do you know the great apes are not religious? Not answering to a higher being? ::grin::

The question didn't bother me or cause me to pause. People can be moral without being religious. However, I do believe morals came from organized religion. Even if that religion is not what we recognize as religion today.

JM Hanes

Sara:

That's so weird, because you & kaz both had -.46, and I missed the sign both times! Yours is fixed now too (and yes, you're SSQ if it suits you. That too, can be changed). Maybe tomorrow, I should post my list of #'s and people, to make sure I've got everybody else pegged correctly.

I'm suddenly reminded of my 8th grade Algebra teacher's comment: "She understands all the concepts perfectly, she just can't add and subtract." LOL! Damn if I can't estimate like crazy though.:)


TexasIsHeaven:

It may just be that we haven't really discussed a lot of economic issues at length, which is the axis where the distance between you is most noticeable. Afraid I'm no expert at interpreting any of this in any detail though; it just happened to be the test that I group I used to post with used. I'm a little surprised at how far left I end up on the economic scale myself. OTOH one of the points folks occasionally make around here is that the "center" is a lot further to right than most of the media establishment, for example, recognize. [Actually, it would be Mrs. Hanes, but I'm fine with JM, if you are.]

Sara (Squiggler)

Sue -- the great apes may very well answer in their own way to a higher being. I agree with you completely, but I separate "religion" from "sprituality." I don't think you need to be religios to be spiritual. Religion is an invention of man, spirituality comes from the Higher Being.

Sara (Squiggler)

I don't know why I keep mistyping religious.

Sara (Squiggler)

So JMH, does the person closest to the blue diamond get a prize? LOL. The tip jar is open.

anonymous

I do.

boris

Was it really all that hard to say no and tick off disagree (strongly)?

Why strongly? I don't happen to be one but am skeptical of the "morality without religion" argument. Religious or not, people who behave morally tend to use the "gold standard" religion based morals rather than the new age anything goes if it feels good stuff.

topsecretk9

the first 2 comments at TigerHawk, especially #2 (JOM commenter vnjagvet )...are chilling...

(But VOTE Dem. cuz Mama's? Dems. don't want your babies near GAY people!)

Yes but the left portrayed it as the end, Walter Crankcase and his Oh no it's a disaster newscast comes to mind. The blood on the lefty's hands is the millions that died after we 'redeployed to Okinawa'.

Never again.

By bill, at Wed Oct 18, 09:59:21 PM

I was stationed in Nha Trang during Tet as an SJA in IFFV. IFFV was the Army II Corps HQ. I lived in a house in town with a group of MI interrogators, and we had partial advance notice of the NVA's intentions. IOW, we knew "something big" was going to happen that evening. The attack in Nha Trang began at midnight, and our gang was unable to get to our duty stations for about 10 days. I went to an artillery unit in Pleiku, hopping a ride there in a Huey.

After things died down in the next two weeks the reports were in. The VC cadres were wiped out and the NVA took almost 90% casualties in most cities including Nha Trang. A big victory for us, we thought.

In May, when I got home, I found out what everyone thought in the "world". The thing couldn't be won. It was truly a shock to my system, but I was so glad to be home that I began to let that shock fade from my memory.

This war brings it back.

Keep up the good work, Tigerhawk.

By vnjagvet, at Wed Oct 18, 10:27:52 PM

JM Hanes

Sara:

I tend to think that we are all born with the capacity to do great good or great evil and that in the long run, it behooves us all to encourage the good wherever we can. I also believe, mostly from experience with my own children, that we are born with innate personalities which are exceedingly difficult change in any fundamental way, but that our characters can be shaped both by circumstance and by others.

JM Hanes

Sara:

Doesn't Liz Taylor have the blue diamond? (There is still a Liz Taylor, isn't there?) The JOM diamond is a moving target though, as new scores are added, although it's missing its lastest SSQ/KAZ update. I guess you're still in the running for Ms. Average JOM incarnate, (if ya want it!), but I must admit, there's a certain congnitive dissonance in that idea!

JM Hanes

boris:

I put "strongly" in parentheses in what I thought was an efficient way to indicate an available option instead of writing out "disagree or disagree strongly."

Sara (Squiggler)

No, average is not an option, JMH. I was thinking more in line with perfection. Ms. Perfect JOMer. I'm laughing so hard I can barely type. Actually, I think I'll stick to a label bestowed on me years ago over on Compuserve's Legal Forum -- Princess 'tude or a.k.a Princess with an attitude. Curtsey!

TexasIsHeaven

JM - my apologies - just a habit to address someone as Mr. or Mrs. when I don't know them personally - and I typed Mr. without thinking.

And while I do believe that it is a good thing if big corporations and big companies contribute to communities and do good works and all that - I find myself constantly defending companies like Haliburton to some of my liberal friends who think they are the source of all evil in the world.

Thanks for the reply.

S. J. Reynolds

clarice

Corporate boards have a fiduciary responsibility to their shareholders to maximize profits,but that doesn't mean that they are barred from contributing to the welfare of the communities where they are located and where their products are used...it's good business.So my answer was they should concentrate on their profits. It doesn't mean they cannot take broader issues into consideration--those do affect profit.

And re the social security question--if the question was welfare for those in need versus private charity, my answer would have been different. But the question was charity or social security and I think it a bad idea to expand that program which is already in trouble.

topsecretk9

OT...but about Sue

I just realized something on Safari...the "grin" is an actual hyphen - hyphen - spelled out g r i n hyphen - hyphen - most browsers interprets as an emoticon smiley face like symbol!...is this right?

Su-z-q

No wonder Mr. E is so vexed about your ::grin::...and, if unwittingly so?I love you even more.

topsecretk9

I shouldn't have said about Sue...as in the topic was aboutSue...just my tourettes realization concerning tangentlly Sue ::grin::

topsecretk9

Crap

I TOPPED the thread. Sorry.

topsecretk9

little missed moment of clarity, but establishes frequent contact...

"I'm not a politician, but Heather Wilson is a very special person," Scowcroft said in a telephone interview from Albuquerque. "She's been an outstanding congresswoman regardless of what you think of the administration."

Wilson worked on Scowcroft's staff in the White House of President George H.W. Bush.

"She did a brilliant job, and she was just a kid there," said Scowcroft.

Two phone calls brought Scowcroft to Albuquerque, he said. The first was to another veteran of the first Bush administration, former Ambassador Joseph Wilson and husband of former CIA agent Valerie Plame, after Wilson campaigned for Rep. Wilson's opponent, Democratic Attorney General Patricia Madrid.

"I said, 'What the hell are you doing?' " Scowcroft recalled.

Scowcroft said he didn't blame his former employee for her vote because the intelligence about Saddam Hussein's alleged weapons program was "screwed up."

He then called Rep. Wilson.

"I asked how she was doing and she said she could use some help," said Scowcroft.

Wilson's...best bud and all.

http://www.abqtrib.com/news/2006/oct/17/scowcroft-endorses-wilson/

danking70

That's just great TS9.

We also have James Baker coming along with a Nude Erection(tm) for fixing Iraq.

Are Bush I's friends trying to bury the son?

Sara (Squiggler)

Seems a bit of a come down for Mr. New York Times-Vanity Fair-Correspondent's Dinner Wilson to be reduced to campaigning for some obscure democrat for attorney general in New Mexico.

Sara (Squiggler)

Did I read it wrong? It sounds like Scowcroft was jumping all over Wilson for working against Heather Wilson. Sounds like Scowcroft thought Joe Wilson's loyalties should have been with Heather, maybe due to past association working together. Why are saying "buds?"

Bob

"Neither Soros nor Fenton is interested in quality; just quantity."

seems like anonymous can be added to his own list.

It's truly sad when someone can only attract attention by being obnoxious. But like a most liberals, I'm sure "it's" momma let him get away with this repugnant behavior, thinking they were just being clever.

Jane

JM,

Can you post the link to the quiz again if it is not too much trouble. For some reason I couldn't locate it last night.

boris

This one?

kaz

JMH:

Not to worry. As my physics professor put it "In all calculations involving more than one number, the odds of the decimal point roaming or the sign changing on its own goes up in an expotential manner." :-)

kaz

boris

JOM results

SunnyDay

Iowahawk at his best!! A must-read. :))))

Howard Dean reaches out...
BWAHAHAHAHA

Sue

No wonder Mr. E is so vexed about your ::grin::...and, if unwittingly so?I love you even more.

I love you too, Top.

It is not my intention to vex anyone. Even Mr. E. He is easily vexed with me, whether I use the ::grin:: or not.

::grin::

Larry

Heck, I thought strongly agree to legalize marijuana would automatically buy me a place in libertarian heaven. Not trying to beat the test, I do strongly agree, but -.15? Sheesh!

maryrose

If the public schools are no good school vouchers should be an option-only don't tell public school teachers-they get really mad when this option is mentioned.
In Ohio we have had much success with vouchers in the Cleveland area.
As for Republicans - we are the party of Lincoln -nuff said.

topsecretk9

--Did I read it wrong? It sounds like Scowcroft was jumping all over Wilson for working against Heather Wilson. Sounds like Scowcroft thought Joe Wilson's loyalties should have been with Heather, maybe due to past association working together. Why are saying "buds?"

Posted by: Sara (Squiggler) | October 19, 2006 at 12:40 AM--

Sara

You read it right and they are also buds.

Jane

Thanks Boris.

Here is where I stand: Economic Left/Right: 4.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 0.21

JM Hanes

Jane:

Let me know if I put you in the right spot. From your description, I assigned you an Economic -0.88 and Social +0.15.


MJW:

"I notice the quiz results tend to group around a 45 degree line, which was also true of the previous results. If it were a random sample of test-takers, this might indicate that the axes aren't independent, and the independent underlying variables are near lines at 45 degrees and -45 degrees (recalling the discussion awhile ago about Michael Mann's (mis)application of PCA to climate proxies)."

Of course, we're not a random sample by any stretch, but the distrubution has become less diagonal as the number of particpants has grown. Assuming that -10/+10 would represent a totalitarian communist, I'm not surprised that the uppper left quadrant remains relatively unpopulated, are you? As you also suggested, it would be interesting to see where some of the Kos crowd would land.

JM Hanes

Jane:

Cross posted. I'll plug in your real scores which will shift you out of the communist block [::grin::]. I know Clarice will be pleased to find you migrating in her direction!

Jane

Oh dear. I am so not a communist.

boris

Rush just had a great ad parody that still has me laughing, "Cut and Run Conservatives" ...

JM Hanes

kaz:

I think I would have really liked physics (my uncle taught thermodynamics), but I discovered that you can't actually cram for a calculus exam the night before the test -- a discovery made just in time to drop the course without incurring penalties, which (alas!) seemed like a good idea at the time.

topsecretk9

Here's me

Your political compass

Economic Left/Right: 3.88
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 0.67

JM Hanes

Jane:

"I am so not a communist."

LOL! Apparently nobody else around here is either. So much for diversity!

hit and run

Hah! JM - I took calculus twice in college. D both times.

Boy did I learn my lesson regarding cramming for tough courses.

I changed to a B.A. program in the social sciences. Problem solved, no more tough courses. lol

kaz

Four semesters of calculus and a useless math minor here - all just to get through physical chem and thermo. Useful skills at the time, but I haven't used hardly any of it in twenty plus years of real world [paid] science and doubt I could do anything beyond basic algebra without a month long refresher.

Bob

http://www.reviewjournal.com/lvrj_home/2006/Oct-19-Thu-2006/news/10311815.html> Group files FEC complaint against Reid over use of campaign funds

Reid has demonstrated "a pattern of extremely questionable behavior that requires a full investigation by both the FEC and the Senate Ethics Committee," Bossie said.

On Monday, Reid said he would reimburse his campaign committee for the money paid to staff of the Ritz-Carlton Hotel where he lives in Washington, D.C., and disclose more details about his land transactions.

Reid spokesman Jon Summers called complaint baseless and politically motivated.

"As Senator (Charles) Schumer (D-N.Y.) said (Tuesday) the Democratic caucus remains supportive of Senator Reid," Reid spokesman Jon Summers said Wednesday.


Once the typical suspects supporting the criminals!

cathyf
Assuming that -10/+10 would represent a totalitarian communist, I'm not surprised that the uppper left quadrant remains relatively unpopulated, are you?
I guess I'm not following this -- are you claiming that the test does not identify any communists as being totalitarians? Because in real life, all of the communists turned out to be totalitarians...
maryrose

I am pro-life,pro-gun , against the death penalty{ let them rot in jail} against stem-cell at government's expense,against cloning, against pork projects. for a strong defense vigorously fighting the war on terrorism, against high taxes{attention Ohioans Brown will raise our taxes if elected Senator} and fiscally conservative. I don't need a test to tell me where I stand.

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Wilson/Plame