Debate Thread

I did not see the debate - we are having some work done on the house and the workmen took down the satellite dish - but here is some MSNBC coverage.  Tell me what you thought.

Comments

[TimUSSRR]

Hey man. Who wants to think about the next president "Two Years Before the Mast" or Election?

The NFL draft was much more interesting.

The liberals disappointment with their Committee Hearing results is more entertaining. Still can't connect the dots to Karl Rove.

Britney is back in form and dancing again.

There are some good Soaps to while away the hours so you don't have to watch the debates. At least the women are hot.

[abwtf]

I think 1 comment = too soon, too many people, too little time, too much talk we already know

[Poppy]

I don't think Debate Night means much...need to tune in tomorrow night to find out who was voted off!

America voted and ........

[Jane]

I think Romney brought his A game to this debate. That is an improvement in Mitt's debating ability.

I think Matthew's goal was to point out Guiliani's ambivalence toward abortion, and he succeeded. While the democrats tingle at the thought of that, I think a lot of us are pretty ambivalent about abortion. Rudy is going to have to come up with a pat answer about choice.

McCain repeated a lot of his stump speeches, and he came across as old to me. He was great on defense tho and the importance of winning this war. Frankly most of the candidates were strong on the war and that surprised me.

Of the 2nd tier I thought Tommy Thompson emerged as a pretty interesting guy. I tend to listen to rather than watch TV and I was more inclined to look up when Thompson was speaking than anyone else.

[Sara]

Mitt Romney won going away. The Drudge Poll has him up by a 10,000 vote margin.

[Sara]

the questions were dumb. What do you hate about America? What kind of question is that? And should Bill Clinton be back in the White House? Yeah right, Rep. candidates are going to say sure. Liek I said dumb, dumb, dumb.

[Jane]

The questions were dumb, because Matthews is an idiot and that guy from Politico.com was just as bad.

[Jeff Dobbs]

should Bill Clinton be back in the White House?

My answer?

No, but Hillary should.

She will be part of my staff as president.

She will be in charge of cleaning under the rugs.

[Maybeex]

The questions were dumb, because Matthews is an idiot and that guy from Politico.com was just as bad.

It's interesting, becuase Jim VandeHei, the Politico guy, is often pointed out as a conservative-leaning journalist.
I think that's the peril of bringing the internet culture to the real world. I mean, I love blogs and their commentary, but that kind of question obvsiously looks like a good question only to someone immersed in the some parts of the blog culture, where hating America seems quite topical and important.

[Sue]

I didn't watch the debate. I was...uh...watching my Mavs go down in flames.

From the articles I'm reading, Romney did well. And the winner was Fred. Why on earth were republican candidates on MSNBC? They should have boycotted it.

[MarkD]

It's way too early.

The law should forbid everything having to do with campaigning until one year before the election. No ads, debates, primaries, fundraising... All races, everywhere. Get back to work, politicians.

[Maybeex]

Yeah, MarkD, you're right about that. I heard JFK announced 10 months ahead of the election that he intended to run for President.
This is pretty crazy. Then again, I already know who I love and who I'll tolerate. It seems for most of the candidates, moving up is going to be a lot harder than screwing up.

[Jeff Dobbs]

I didn't watch the debate. I was...uh...watching my Mavs go down in flames.

I am SOOOOO glad I stopped watching at half time.

No ads, debates, primaries, fundraising...

I admit that this is one of the reasons why I am cheering for a Fred late entry and success.

[Cecil Turner]

Didn't watch it. Too early, and too stupid, and by that measure the clear winner was Fred Thompson. Good roundups on the net (especially Kurtz's) where I see the most important difference between the candidates was on abortion, and that Rudy lost. I think Jane's right, above, and that's a lot more of a "gotcha" than a substantive issue.

With the exception of Peggy Noonan (who liked Mitt), most of the mainstream commentary seems to come from Democrats, which biases the result. Also, the stupid questions come from Democrats posing as disinterested observers, which degrades the process. (Too bad one of the candidates wasn't honest/quickwitted enough to answer the "what do you dislike most about America" question with the obvious: "our dysfunctional media.") In any event, the publicized debate responses (especially on proper conduct of the war) were laced with nonsensical premises and decidedly unhelpful.

On a brighter note, the links led to Rudy's continuing problems with "ferret-gate" . . . which I'd somehow managed to miss, and is definitely worth a laugh, but also not very important. However, the fixation from some is a pretty good indicator they're missing on a few cylinders.

[Jane]

They should have boycotted it.

They can't boycott it because it will ruin my favorite question to the democrats -

"How can we expect you to stand up to al Qaeda if you are afraid of Fox news?"

Or something like that.

After the performance of Matthews and Olbermann it is hard to imagine how MSNBC got any new viewers out of the debate. It simply reminded me why I can't watch them.

So typepad is driving me nuts. Anyone else?

[Jeff Dobbs]

On a brighter note, the links led to Rudy's continuing problems with "ferret-gate" . . . which I'd somehow managed to miss,

Whoa. For a second there I thought that was a referenc to a former commenter here.

[Jeff Dobbs]

Too bad one of the candidates wasn't honest/quickwitted enough to answer the "what do you dislike most about America" question with the obvious: "our dysfunctional media.")

My answer?

Rampant, unabated cynicism

And 2nd...

The rising costs of spa and salon services and the lack of universal hair/nail/skin care coverage.

And 3rd...

The lack of a beer delivery industry a la pizza.

[Other Tom]

I don't watch these things. Not the intra-party ones, not even the presidential debates between the nominees. They drive me absolutely nuts with their ridiculous questions and boring answers. The format precludes their being dignified with the word "debate." I think Fred would be wise to continue gathering attention by not declaring, and thus not diminishing himself in these fiascoes.

H&R, they've got to be bleeding down there in Big D. Can you imagine the ceremony where Dirk gets his MVP award? I would advise him to ask them not to have a ceremony at all. I doubt he will ever want to look at the trophy after he gets it. And I imagine Cuban must be catatonic.

[Other Tom]

Here is Beldar's very first bullet-point about the debated (from his blog):

"I am highly confident that over 90% of all viewers who cast ballots for a Republican candidate within the last 30 years will all agree on one thing in particular about this debate: To call Chris Matthews a "total bozo" is an entirely inadequate insult for him, but a vicious slur against clowns throughout world history."

[Jane]

It's good to see Beldar back

[Jeff Dobbs]

H&R, they've got to be bleeding down there in Big D.

Yeah. And this follows the Tony Romo botched kick in the NFL playoffs. And what the heck, glad to see the Yankees took two from the Rangers yesterday. Fitting.

[Sue]

My Gawd!!! Just take a knife and stick it in my heart and twist...

...you left out the Stars in your trip down ripping my heart out!!!!

[Syl]

I watched part of it, then caught more on re-run, and saw and read lots of commentary.

The commentary stunk more than the debate.

However, I've decided a definite NO to Romney, a maybe to McCain (though he's so old) and a big fat YES to Rudy.

I'm not sure what I'll think when/if Fred gets in the race, but right now those who talk with the conservative 'talking points' and toe a line leave me cold.

And I swear if I hear 'culture of life' one more time I'm gonna puke.

I don't think conservatives realize how tired this country is of the culture wars. Let them be fought outside of politics. Please.

[Laddy]

OT. Some of you Plame experts need to go over to Pattericos and straighten him and some others out about Comey. He's perceived over there as beyond reproach. He testified that all the fired USAs were stellar job performers. He and Tenent should get together. Wasn't Comey the one that granted unsupervised AG powers to Fitzgerald?

[Jeff Dobbs]

...you left out the Stars in your trip down ripping my heart out!!!!

Stars suck. I didn't start following hockey until the day we moved from Texas to Denver.

We were sharing a moving truck with another couple that was moving too. The guy was a big Avs fan. He pushed the pace the entire 13 hour drive in order to make it to Longmont in time for an Avs playoff game. His fever was contagious.

But I do apologize for any pain that I caused about the Mavs and Cowboys and Rangers.

[Other Tom]

Syl, I think you ought to take into account the extent to which the questions drive the debate. On one of the other blogs--I think it's Powerline--they make the point that the issue of abortion undoubtedly ranks very low on the list of things that are vital to Republican primary voters, yet Matthews kept hammering away on the topic. He succeeded in his effort to focus public attention on the candidates' abortion views (which were the subject of the first seven paragraphs of the Associated Press account), which is one of many reasons why I think these things are farcical.

All that matters to this GOP voter is who is most likely to win the general election (at this point, apparently Rudy), and the only reason that matters is Iraq. Unless we stay there, at whatever cost, until that government is able to sustain itself, we will have suffered an utterly unprecedented national disaster from which we may very well never recover.

[Jeff Dobbs]

I am foreswearing all sports.

Except Duke Lacrosse.

Go Blue Devils!

[Laddy]

Sorry, The discussion is not at Pattericos but at volokh's. I saw the link at Pattericos.

volokh

[Sue]

::sigh::

The Rangers are the biggest losers in the Mav's loss last night. Now attention that has been focused on the Mavs will turn to the Rangers and everyone will find out they suck too.

::sigh::

[Syl]

OT

I hear you and hope you're right. And at the same time I hope you're wrong. These things have a way of becoming self-fulfilling prophecies pushed by the press. Go back to last November and Missouri---it was like the entire election came down to stem cells.

(Which shows it was NOT about Iraq anyway.)

[clarice]

I'm only focusing on important things. TM says:"we are having some work done on the house."Were ever scarier words uttered?
We are having some work done on the house, too. If I am arrested for murdering the decorator or his contractors I hope you will think kindly of me--a woman driven beyond reason by exigent circumstances.

These things always start out remarkably civil and pleasant and quickly devolve into veriled threats and so on.

[Neo]

the questions were dumb. What do you hate about America?

I just came off 4 weeks of hosting some engineers from India.

Yesterday while we were eating lunch while CNN Headline News droned on and on a TV near us, one of them said that he couldn't believe that "in the US, where technological breakthroughs we being made daily, that the news consisted of endless stories of sexual predators, car chases and other stories that showed the worst of America".

It reminded me of a trip to South Korean, where there had been a jailbreak with a guard killed. My Korean host did about everything he could to avoid answering any questions that I poised regarding all the guys with M-16's at the parkway toll booths, who it turned out were looking for the jailbreaker. I only found out from another American, at the airport, just before I left.

[Rick Ballard]

Giuliani already has his marker down on the cultural degeneracy issues. He says he wants judges in the Scalia, Thomas, Roberts and Alito model (although there are significant differences between them) and social conservatives recognize that until the courts stop legislating the issues will not be resolved in their favor. He's pretty well innoculated there.

He's going to be clipped hard by his relationship with Kerik (who may be looking at another indictment soon). Giuliani's demonstration of a lack of either knowledge or honesty in promoting a grifter for a cabinet post isn't much of a political advertisement. He's carrying too much baggage.

McEgo is going to get nailed for both his baggage and for foot in mouth. Somebody is going to catch him on a day when the Thorazine isn't really working as advertised and the media will report rather than hide it.

We could easily see a Romney/Thompson matchup for the final round and a ticket with both men on it. That wouldn't be a bad outcome at all. I'm going to have to dig up a few Romney speeches and try and figure out what kind of a Q he generates.

[Other Tom]

I simply don't think Romney has a prayer in the general election, and Thompson wouldn't help and might hurt.

[topsecretk9]

Does not the intelligence committee turning the CIA into a global warming spies? or whatever in the WATimes seem like a story written just for TM?

HotAir...says

It ought to be humiliating for the Democrats. That they would even consider pulling our spies off of Iranian nukes and Al Qaeda networks in order to put them to work on Global Warming is damning. Clearly the Democrats prefer to defend us against their list of abstract, ideologically driven boogeymen rather than our very real, ruthless, proven enemies.

If this requirement should pass, the first terrorist bomb to go off on U.S. soil means the political end of the Democratic party. In the post-mortem hearings, the DNI need only point out that even a handful of field officers, analysts, and resources were diverted from terror assessments to work climate issues, per Congressional dictum. And thus the buck will be passed back to the Pelosi crowd.

[glasater]

Well Tops--That is a scenario I would truly want to avoid. If a terrorist bomb were to go off on U.S soil--the "nuts" would blame the President and shut down in every way this country.

[Rick Ballard]

OT,

I was thinking Thompson/Romney as the ticket. I just don't see Giuliani or McCain (especially McCain) making it through the primaries. If Giuliani makes it, it will be on the basis of taking states that he may not carry in the general. Getting the nomination because you carried CA and NY and then not carrying either in the general isn't very helpful. Especially if he can't carry FL and could conceivably have a problem in TX.

[Jeff Dobbs]

If this requirement should pass, the first terrorist bomb to go off on U.S. soil means the political end of the Democratic party.

I think he's off on the U.S. soil part. The dems are hoping for an Iran-Israel nuclear exchange.

Operation Nuclear Winter to Solve Global Warming.

[Cecil Turner]

I was thinking Thompson/Romney as the ticket.

I suspect one of you is thinking "Tommy" and the other "Fred."

[Rick Ballard]

Could be, Cecil. I should have been more clear.

Fred

Fred

Fred

Fred.

There.

[Jeff Dobbs]

After mulling it over on the debate, I'm afraid I have to embrace the educational theory of promoting self-esteem over accomplishment and performance.

I think it would be highly unfair and counter-productive to declare one person the "winner".

In order to create a common level of self-esteem in all the candidates, I declare them all LOSERS.

And WIENERS.

[Jeff Dobbs]

Clarice:
If I am arrested for murdering the decorator or his contractors

You have no worries. Fred Thompson will pardon you.

[fschmieg]

A question above about Comey: Yes, he is the one we think is in league with Schumer over the Libby thing. Talk about politicizing the justice department!! How naive people can be to think this guy is a straight-shooter.

[Jane]

I was thinking Thompson/Romney as the ticket.

That's my prediction, and yes I am referring to Fred not Tommy.

Syl, I'm interested in what Romney said in this debate that made you decide he was a definate "no". I thought he won the debate hands down. And frankly altho I'm not inclined to like him, I like him more all the time in spite of myself. I think he's brilliant frankly.

[PatrickR]

I only heard excerpts played this morning on talk radio, and one of the best was Romney's answer to Matthews brain-dead question about what he would say to a Catholic bishop who refused communion to a parishioner who voted for a pro-abortion candidate.

Romney said he wouldn't say a thing to a bishop. We have separation of church and state, and it's no business of the government what churches believe or don't believe, or who gets communion.

[Goof]

At this point, were I a betting man, I'd bet that Republicans will behave like Republicans and nominate McCain.

[maryrose]

fscmieg:
Comey is so transparent in his obvious attempts to discredit this administration. Schumer is the one that sponsored his getting confirmed in the first place as one who would pass muster with his committee Then he hires runaway prosecutor Fitzgerald and provides no supervision. We are well rid of him and as soon as I found out who was defending these lackluster performers I totally discounted it.

[Sara]

From the sounds of all the wishful thinking here about Fred Thompson, some Republicans are going to shoot themselves in the foot again. Always wanting something other than what they've got to work with. Romney blew the field away last night. The last time I checked on the Drudge poll with over 65,000 respondents, he was up over 36% with Rudy way behind at 20% and Paul at 18%, McCain at 6%. I read on Wizbang that Paul had the anti-war crowd out hitting all the polls on his behalf, which explains why someone that noone has heard of polled almost as well as Rudy. A perfect ticket would be Romney/Fred T. ticket, not the other way around. Fred will bring in the far right base and super partisans, while Romney brings the brains and big business management experience. Fred Thompson has the creds as far as his politics but I don't see any experience running anything. Senators make notoriously bad candidates if the past is any way to judge. I see Thompson as a Dick Cheney type who is far more beneficial as an adviser than as CEO and as a liaison with Congress, where he has relatively good relations.

I don't like the games Fred is playing right now. If he is in, then get in and take the lumps everyone else has to take and let us compare him to the others. If he is not getting in, then he should stop dangling the carrot and get with the program and throw his support to whomever he wants.

[PeterUK.]

Clarice,
"If I am arrested for murdering the decorator or his contractors I hope you will think kindly of me--a woman driven beyond reason by exigent circumstances."

In this case it isn't murder,it's therapy.

Builders and decorators,they won't turn up and they won't go away.