Loved The New Harry Potter Film

My older teenager, who loves the books but has not liked a Potter film yet, raved about the latest.

And for folks trying to get clues on the impending resolutions in the soon-to-be-released Book Seven, plot points that seem vital in Book Five were dropped from the movie.  This may mean something since Ms. Rowling consults on the scripts and presumably guides the director on Important Clues.

Two examples - in Book Five, Ron, Harry et all pretty clearly (OK, clear if you are an obsessive fanatic, and I have several in the household) find the horcrux recovered by "RAB".  The movie skips right past that, which *might* make one wonder whether that point is being de-emphasized for Book Seven.  We will know soon enough, but I don't doubt there was a horcrux at Grimauld Place.  (But did Kreacher abscond with it?)

And my pet theory about Snape's motivation took on water - Snape's memory of his worst day included his snarl at Lilly Evans (eventually, Lily Potter) that she was a mudblood.  Since Snape and Lily were two of the best potioners in the history of Hogwarts, I am betting they had some kind of a bond, and that Snape had a huge, mostly unrequited crush on her.  Consequently, when Voldemort killed her he became a Dead Wizard Walking (or apparating, or whatever) and Snape has just been marking time until he can whack him.  Snape is not really "good" or "evil" in the sense of being on either Dumbledore's side or Voldemort's - he is on Snape's side, but that will be fine for the good guys.

This theory also explains Snape's troubled relationship with Harry, who is the son of the woman he loves and a man he hates.  Awkward.  But Snape won't be letting anyone kill Harry; Snape's issue is whether he can kill Voldemort before Harry does (bet on Harry).

SINCE YOU ASK: No, I can't wait.  Even though I have been waiting since July of 2000.

Comments

[mgarbowski]

Nice post generally, but I think you're wrong about R.A.B. It was a feature of Book Six, Half-Blood Prince, not Book 5, Order of the Phoenix. It would have no place in this move.

[maryerose]

I can't wait to see this new movie and my book is on order at Borders. I agree with your assessment of Snape and I think at a crucial point he will intervene to help Harry.My question is will Hermoine and Ron end up together and will Dumbledore return?

[Granddaddy Long Legs]

"We will know soon enough, but I don't doubt there was a horcrux at Grimauld Place."

Get a hold of yourself man! And please refrain from using such ugly stereotypes as "mudblood." People like Hermione Granger and Lilly Evans bring a very useful streak of diversity and multiculturalism to traditionally-pureblooded places like Hogwarts.

[Porchlight]

Nice post generally, but I think you're wrong about R.A.B. It was a feature of Book Six, Half-Blood Prince, not Book 5, Order of the Phoenix. It would have no place in this move.

I think TM is referring to the "heavy locket" found by Harry and pals when cleaning out Grimmauld Place in Book Five. This may turn out to be the Horcrux made from Slytherin's locket that R.A.B. (presumably Regulus Black) stole from the cave, as described in Book Six. TM's links make that case pretty well (I love that Beyond Hogwarts site).

I also believe Snape will be redeemed (but I'm biased as he is one of my favorite characters). Snape is ambivalent about Harry, but he will come through for him in the end.

Ahh...the days are just creeping by until July 21.

[memomachine]

Hmmmm.

1. It's been repeatedly stated that either Harry or Voldemort has to die in order for the other one to live. I seriously don't think it could possibly be any clearer.

2. Neville Longbottom could have been "the boy who lived" but wasn't chosen by Voldemort for some reason. But Neville has transformed from a cautious nobody into a very strong-willed fanatic desiring to kill Voldemort for what he did to Neville's parent.

Since Harry and Neville were both equally potential anti-Voldemorts, and that by definition an anti-Voldemort has to be the equal of Voldemort, that means that potentially Neville actually has power and ability equal to Voldemort. But what's held Neville back for so long as been a combination of fear and despair.

So I think we'll see Neville do great things in book 7 before he dies in the same book.

3. Frankly I'm surprised at TM. I thought it was very obvious that Snape felt something for Lily Potter, particularly in the flashbacks. Above all else Lily Potter was a kind person who admonished James Potter continually for his scrapes with Snape.

[memomachine]

Hmmm.

Sorry but Snape is rotten to the core.

1. He maneuvered what's-her-name (I forget) into forming an Unbreakable Vow with Snape that would allow Snape to kill Dumbledore.

IMHO it's pretty obvious that Dumbledore required Snape to form an Unbreakable Vow with him in order to be accepted into the Order of the Phoenix. And that this Unbreakable Vow was the reason why Dumbledore and the others were so confident that Snape wouldn't betray them all.

But if you're under an Unbreakable Vow and then enter into another Unbreakable Vow that offsets the first one, then do they cancel out? IMHO, yes they do cancel out but only in the specific circumstances where the latter Unbreakable Vow can override the earlier.

2. IMHO Snape didn't kill Harry because of Voldemort's standing order to not kill Harry. Voldemort himself wants to kill Harry in person. Why? Because Harry is the last Horcrux and if Harry dies by anyone else's hand then another part of Voldemort's soul is lost forever. But if Voldemort himself can kill Harry then he has a chance to recover that portion of his soul.

3. So why did Snape taunt Harry at the end? To draw Harry out and prevent him from going into hiding. To draw him out and make him vulnerable to Voldemort.

Considering how well Snape knows all of Harry's fellow classmates I think we'll see many of them operating under the Imperious Curse. Possibly what has Rowling so unhappy about book 7 could be that Harry is forced to kill friends from his classes at Hogwarts.

[Tom Maguire]

Nice post generally, but I think you're wrong about R.A.B. It was a feature of Book Six, Half-Blood Prince, not Book 5, Order of the Phoenix. It would have no place in this move.

Porchlight (above) has me covered - the "RAB" note (and horcruxes generally) don't appear until Book Six, bit it is in Book Five that a mysterious locket is mentioned.

My question is will Hermoine and Ron end up together and will Dumbledore return?

Hermione and Ron are automatic.

As for Dumbledore - Gandalf and Aslan made it back, as did JC himself; Obi-Wan Kenobi, not so much. Three out of four is good odd.

Plot point that may have prompted Ms. Rowling to want a do-over - if Dumbledore is dead, he can appear in the headmaster portrait at Hogwarts (and, presumably, other places) and provide all sorts of coaching. OK, Harry won't be at Hogwarts full time, but still - how dead is Dumbledore if he can reappear and chat?

I also believe Snape will be redeemed (but I'm biased as he is one of my favorite characters).

Do you think Alan Rickman knew when he got the part that it was the role of the century?

So I think we'll see Neville do great things in book 7 before he dies in the same book.

Bellatrix is a dead witch walking. The only suspense is whether she can manage to die sneering.

IMHO Snape didn't kill Harry because of Voldemort's standing order to not kill Harry. Voldemort himself wants to kill Harry in person. Why? Because Harry is the last Horcrux and if Harry dies by anyone else's hand then another part of Voldemort's soul is lost forever. But if Voldemort himself can kill Harry then he has a chance to recover that portion of his soul.

Good point about Voldemort wanting to finish Harry himself.

[Crunchy Frog]

I think it's pretty much a given that Neville is going to take out Bellatrix.

My pet theory is that book 7 will feature The Redemption Of Draco Malfoy. Look, Dumbledore was dying, and had a death sentence on him already. Snape is forced, by Dumbledore himself, to kill him, so that Malfoy does not have to. This preserves the little spark of good (see: Anakin Skywalker) that will ultimately lead Draco to kill Voldemort, while dying in the process.

[Walter]

FWIW, as I am not the Potter expert in the household, I understand that Ms. Rowling has stated that Dumbledore is dead (and buried in Dumbledore's Tomb) and that neither Harry nor his scar are a horcrux.

Great Potter-blogging.

[Porchlight]

Do you think Alan Rickman knew when he got the part that it was the role of the century?

I hope he knew it, or at least that he knows it now. He is perfectly cast, perhaps more perfectly than any other character.

I think the reason I like Snape more and more as the books progress (and as I myself become older) is that his motivations can be easily understood outside of the realm of magic. It doesn't take dark arts or wizarding prowess to understand the pain of unrequited love, fury at being bullied, or envy of a colleague or classmate. These are real, adult (dare I say Muggle?) emotions, which I find more compelling than the youthful magical exploits of the Jedi types in the Order of the Phoenix. Great writers make the villains as fascinating as the heroes.

[mgarbowski]

With the clarification, I withdraw the criticism of my first post. But, with the same clarification, I don't think the omission of them finding the locket in Movie 5 means that the later importance of the locket/horcrux in Book/Movie 6 is diminished. In other words, you can omit the Book 5 setup and not diminish the Book 6 setup, so there can still be a book 7 payoff on the locket.

On the other hand, I've read in different reviews that Neville's role in the prophecy is not in the OOTP Movie. If true, that does seem to have major implications about what might happen in Book 7.

[DJ]

I missed the fearful reaction Mrs. Weasley had to the Grimmald place bogart, and the full extent of the masterful wizardry of Gred and Forge. I want the swamp back.

[Tom Maguire]

I don't think the omission of them finding the locket in Movie 5 means that the later importance of the locket/horcrux in Book/Movie 6 is diminished. In other words, you can omit the Book 5 setup and not diminish the Book 6 setup, so there can still be a book 7 payoff on the locket.

I agree they can cross that bridge when they come to it on the horcrux, and certainly tell us about the Snape-Lily potion connection in Movie Six.

It does make me wonder whether Ms. Rowling herself is backsliding or reorienting the story however - e.g., in Book Two, as Dumbledore explains what happened to Harry he says that Voldemort transferred a bit of *himself* into Harry when he tried to kill him as a baby.

But in Movie Two, that becomes "transferred a bit of his power", which makes the "Harry as horcrux" a bit less likely.

Good point about Neville and the prophecy getting short shrift in the movie.

[goddessoftheclassroom]

Okay, my prediction is that the Mirror of Erised and the fragments of the mirror Sirius gave Harry in OftP play some role in Book 7. A mirror held up to another mirror reflects infinitely.

If I'm wrong, I'm going to have to write my own book just to use the idea!

[Walter]

Goddess,

As Ms. Rowling says:

...it is relevant to books six and seven. ... The mirror might not have helped as much as you think, but on the other hand, will help more than you think. You’ll have to read the final books to understand that!

[Walter]

I'll try to dig up a link to Rowling's Harry horcrux denial. In the meantime, here's a Newsday story that cites Rowling's confirmation of Dumbledore's death's permanency. But note that Fawkes may return!

The author buys into Tom's theory of the locket at Black Manse. But she adds the permutation that Fletcher, who stole many a treasure from the house, has sold the locket to Albus's brother.

[Walter]

And durned if the locket isn't on the UK book jacket.

[CAL]

I don't think you can take the movie not emphasizing the locket as foreshadowing for Book 7. The Horcruxes have to be central to the finale and Kreecher pretty clearly has that one. The reason the movie skips certain plot points has more to do with trying keep the thing under four hours.

Seriously, the directors cut of the the 1st book is pretty much 3.5 hours with commercials on ABC family and that was the shortest book of the bunch. Books 2 and 3 are each a bit longer but reasonable then 4,5,6 are ginormous. I advocated a Kill Bill approach to Goblet of Fire. As it was they cut tremendous amounts from the book to make it fit and Book 5 is longer still.

[tryggth]

Yeah, I think you have Snape's number.

[JJ]

The original plot line was between Dumbledore and Voldemort and so that plot line needs somehow to come to a better ending than Snape offing Dumbledore.

Additionally, Dumbledore *is* Hogwarts through most of the stories and it will be blow to Hogwarts rep and the entire wizarding community -- at least as the stories have unfolded -- if Hogwarts disappears into oblivion in such a way.

I still get the nagging feeling that she-who-wrote-these-books somehow lost the story lines in the last book. The whole episode of chasing the locket at the lake was a little too out of context.

So I scratch my head and wonder just who is Dumbledore? Is he smarter than Voldemort or was he a fumbler? He was certainly Harry's mentor and protector from the very beginning. Was he so unaware of Voldemort's scheming or Snape's problems?

I buy the romantic touch between Lilly and Snape, but I don't know...

Maybe we need a bold prediction from the Potter expert in the house, eh?

We need a prediction, young Maquire!

[Porchlight]

...has sold the locket to Albus's brother.

Lots of intriguing speculation about Albus' brother
here. I'm hoping he'll appear in Book Seven and take some of the sting out of Dumbledore's demise. If so, I predict Aberforth will share his brother's dry wit, but will be considerably more eccentric.

[sylvia]

Speaking of children's books, I noticed a lot of the childrens book I read are not really around any more. For instance, 'The Great Brain' book series. Did any of you all read those books based on a true story about a young boy and his family in Salt Lake City in the late 1800's? What happened to them?

I suppose they are not considered PC anymore because the main character's brother was basically a junior sociopath because he spent all his time manipulating people and his family to get out of chores and out of trouble and getting away with it. So not a very healthy message of course but they were fun books. Actually, I think there was a little bit of a lesson in the books because the nicer narrator and younger brother learned that sometimes you just can't win agaisnt certain people and you just have to keep keeping on. So who kows how fashions change and whether maybe the Wiccans or so will ban the Potter books in the years ahead, so enjoy them while you can I suppose.

[sophy]

Welcome to our game world, my friend asks me to buy runescape .