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January 06, 2008




“We found that many of Edmonds' core allegations relating to the co-worker were supported by either documentary evidence or witnesses other than Edmonds. … With respect to an allegation that focused on the co-worker's performance, which Edmonds believed to be an indication of a security problem, the evidence clearly corroborated Edmonds' allegations. … With regard to some of Edmonds' allegations, the OIG did not find evidence to support her allegation or the inferences that she drew from certain facts. However, Edmonds' assertions regarding the co-worker, when viewed as a whole, raised substantial questions and were supported by various pieces of evidence. … Rather than investigate Edmonds' allegations vigorously and thoroughly, the FBI concluded that she was a disruption and terminated her contract. We concluded that the FBI could not show, by clear and convincing evidence, that it would have terminated Edmonds' services absent her disclosures. … We believe that many of her allegations were supported, that the FBI did not take them seriously enough, and that her allegations were, in fact, the most significant factor in the FBI's decision to terminate her services.”

Read the whole thing here:

A Review of the FBI's Actions in Connection With Allegations Raised By Contract Linguist Sibel Edmonds

January 2005
Office of the Inspector General



Obama is a tax leach. His dad is Kenyan and he claims Kenya through his church, which is African.

We dont' need a tax bum who thinks the US is a pain church.


It wasn't plastic, Jane.

Posted by: kim | January 06, 2008 at 04:46 PM


At the least, they're all on the same side, so this is a bit of falling out amongst thieves.

Perhaps this is why Emptywheel is holding the undisclosed email of Valerie's --recently (or at least a few months ago) disclosed that has her relating conversations with Marc Grossman-- so close to her sleeve.


"Thanks. So how do Grossman, scary Larry and Joe and Val fit in?"

Scary,Larry and Joe?

Other Tom

It's true that the Tradesports punters are unusually dialed-in politically, not representative of the general public. But that's irrelevant: you don't vote at Tradesports, you bet.

The oddsmakers who set the betting line on the BCS championship game as LSU by four over Ohio State aren't fans of either LSU or Ohio State. They're just trying to establish a point spread that will cause half the betters to take one team and half to take the other. As for the betters themselves, there are of course some who are such "fans" that they bet with their heart, but they are swamped by those who bet with their heads and base their wagers on what they think is the likely outcome.


Actually, I think it may be forwarded. One of the other two documents is an email from Valerie repeating what Joe said to Grossman. And the third may just be someone forwarding the email with a note to the effect that "CIA needs to speak with one voice on this."

Posted by: emptywheel | June 23, 2007 at 16:20

from this thread:



turns out the first email --ADDOPS executive assistant-- was by John Kiriakou, the CIA interrogator of the tapes brouhaha



So we have a whistleblower who is gagged but keeps dropping tidbits about people at State giving away nuclear secrets, and we are suspicious of her, but if she is right it most likely involves the VIPS.

Or we have a whistleblower who s gagged but keeps dropping tidbits about people at State giving away nuclear secrets because the VIPS want to pin this on someone in the administration?

Other Tom

Sara, it's halftime and thus far the Bolts are stinking up the joint as they always do in the postseason. Philip Rivers strikes me as an unstable hothead who can't be a winning NFL QB in pressure games.

But San Diego teams have been models of futility in all major sports throughout my adult lifetime. Must be the weather...


anduril, McCain was not candid about the z visas which did create an amnesty for illegals, BUT Romeny was less than candid last night in denying his ads accused McCain of supporting amnesty for illegals. He waffled when called on it, then denied it, but the ads are available and if the issue comes up again tonight, he will nto get away with it.


The second, Jane But INC (I'm not Cecil)


OT, will you please stop sending all those bad vibes across the Bay!

I do agree about Rivers, however. I can't stand him or Norv Turner. Not good that Gates has gone down.


The second

Oh great. Here we go again.


Wallace just grilled Romney on everything he said last night. Romney held his own quite nicely.


In addition to McCain's mean streak is his penchant for calling everyone "My Friend" that drives me crazy.

We should have a drinking contest on that this evening. Everytime he says "My Friend" we drink :)

After last night, I hate to ask Jane, Elliott, or Rich but would you?


He is doing the Huckster now, but the game is back on and I don't give a hoot in hell what the Huck has to say.


"I don't give a hoot in hell what the Huck has to say". -Sara

That makes another great campaign button!



Would one of you drop by my living room and explain to me in person this whole Turkey thing?

Lets get Grossman in here and waterboard him for a while. Seems I'm late to the party. I would say that she might have been able to piece together something, but she just wouldn't have had the time or access to have done much else. Clarice makes a good point about vetting and anduril makes a good point that there is some fire around her story.

One of her allegations, about FBI foreknowledge of 9/11, is an interpertation of various aspects of known events-the botched "Phoenix Memo", in which the FBI burned a "source" [Harry Ellen?] involved with the PA and Hamas, over another asset [a Chinese Spy, "Parlor Maid" I think, but it might have been someone else in that ring]. It also includes not following up with another "informant" that the FBI had in San Diego when the Malayasia 2 flew in from Bangkok.

My take-she tapped into a rich vein criminality surrounding ATC [maybe like a Koreagate type operation] but is not [and has not been] in a position to make sense of it. She also appears to me to suffer from some sort of personality disorder, which makes her "valuable" for those who want to exploit her for a particular topic-this time, its nuclear proliferation.

Mike Dep

The CIA was blackmailing Plame over the domestic torture in Maryland? I'd think you'd need to be DIA to know that, but that was before CIA went to DOD and NSA agreed with the CIA linguists DOD.

Whistleblower is called No Fear legislation and Plame didn't qualify.


I'm afraid Anduril, that Libby can only tell that a large vehicle hit him. The color, make, and driver of the truck were indiscernable, to him.


'The second, Jane'. 'Oh, great, here we go again'. I think you've got it, Lady Jane.


And you were saying OT?


They'll get away with it if the Dems win. Our only hope is Thompson's correct attitude, maybe Romney, for rectitude.

Other Tom

Well, shut my naysaying mouth, Sara--Rivers is (as we sports insiders say) "en fuego" now, and the Bolts take the lead. Bet your boy is having a fine time right now.


Karch, Cohen, & Co.



After last night, I hate to ask Jane, Elliott, or Rich but would you?

Drinking Game, My Friend...I can't, I have something to do at 8, but could make it back to do the last 30 minutes or so.


Change pajamas everytime someone says "change".


OT, I saw him on TV right as the game was starting. They cut to the stands when it started to rain alittle and the camera zeroed right in on David. My d-i-l was jumping around like crazy with excitement.


Do we really want live-blogging? Isn't everyone planning to watch and post comments along the way. Do we need a script? I'll do it if necessary but I bet it's gonna be a hard hard hard discussion to blog. I felt like what I posted last nite was close to incomprehensible.


Jane, whatever you wish--I know these last two are hard.
Polling shows HC is falling faster than a rock--Obama ahead from 10-13 or 14 points in last three polls today.


How about we all do it. Someone can post the questions, we can all take a candidate and summarize his response. If I get the Huckster it will be nothing but snark.


I'll take Thompson.



That's fine with me. Like I said I was afraid to even ask after your heroism last night. Just promise to provide your usual hilarious snark.


I can't type very fast but I could try McCain since he talks slow and all I will have to type is "My Friend" :)


I'll take Thompson.

Good one, Clarice.

Ann, I'd be happy to liveblog and will also try to note every "my friend." If the format has them going too fast for me to keep up, I can always cheat and use the DVR.


Thanks Elliott.

I never learned to type and it shows in that format. I'll provide snark.


clarice, by quoting Hewitt I was not suggesting in any way that I'm a Romney guy--I'm not. I'd still like to see Thompson pull this out somehow.

kim, I believe Libby had to have learned one helluva lot over all those months, even if the thing came at him out of the blue initially.


Gawd, I love this place!

Jane with the Huckster (all snark, all the time).

Clarice with Thomson (*thwack* if he isn't sufficiently aggressive).

Ann with McCain (snarling through gritted teeth, "my friend").

I, like Other Tom, am pretty depressed about the state of our side, but here at JOM there is humor (sometimes dark, sometimes depressing) but humor, nonetheless.

(whispering: So there! Hit and Run! Whereever you are.)

JM Hanes


Every time I find myself thinking that if it has to be a Dem, maybe it should be Hillary, the idea of Bill back at the White House with time on his hands stops me absolutely cold. It's not just the sleeze potential; he's a dangerously narcissistic wild card, nursing grudges -- his recent rhetoric is notable for both venom and paranoia. Our former co-presidents probably make Nixon look like a piker in the enemy list arena, and the metaphorical finger jabbing has already begun. Things look even bleaker, though, when I contemplate future foreign policy, which is Hillary's putative strength.

Ignoring ideology for the moment, Obama's gaffes (like the Anbar thing) mostly strike me as an indication of where he is on the learning curve. Unlike Hillary, I think he's smart as hell and can, in fact, learn. I can see him being set straight by Petraeus, for example, in pretty short order. In Hillary's case, I'm not sure anybody who isn't already a loyal Clinton insider, á la Sandy Berger, will end up getting a hearing (and let's not forget that Bill will be competing for her attention too). The only thing worse than seeing Madeleine Albright on the Clintonista dais in Iowa was knowing that Albright and Reno were handpicked for office by Hillary. That's a judgment problem, IMO, which we can't afford. She's already got a political compass where her moral compass ought to be, and she may actually equal Bill when it comes to narcissism standing in for self-respect.

I think Madeleine Albright was an even worse Secretary of State than Colin Powell by several orders of magnitude, so maybe I'm overreacting to seeing her front and center on the Clinton's "new beginning" stage. When Hillary turned from that last Iowa podium and I saw Albright mouthing a motherly "Good job" it just flipped me out. Albright's post-office performance disabused me of any notion she was duped into defending Bill during Monicagate; I think she was fully prepared to lie. Last week I also stopped seeing her as a beneficiary of Hillary's pseudo-feminist largesse. I think she's a mentor, I think she's one of the most viciously partisan "diplomats" I've ever seen; and I see absolutely no reason to believe that the pragmatism Hillary ostensibly brings to the foreign policy table will be anything other a continuation of the poll driven disaster that Bush & Co inherited from Bill.

What is every bit as dangerous in a Clintonian do-over is the continuation of deeply polarizing leadership, and I'm afraid I have to include the Bush administration's tenure on that score, regardless of where we might ultimately place the blame. The stakes are even higher now than they were 8 years ago, and those divisions could still lose us the war in Iraq before we get to the next inauguration.

Whether or not Obama can successfully work across the aisles is certainly debatable, but that's one place where the fact that he hasn't been in Washington long enough to be thoroughly entrenched may be a plus. Bill's baggage looks like an insurmountable obstacle to bi-partisan engagement, particularly when he still seems to have a lot to prove. The nastier the Clinton's get, the harder Obama will play the uniter vs. divider card. Let's hope he emerges from the primaries looking like the antidote to Clintonian divisiveness, because if he wins the general election singing that song, one can, at least, imagine him putting his money where his mouth is -- something that's quite beyond conception in a second Billary White House.

None of which is to say (at length, alas) that I'm the least bit sanguine about an Obama presidency. It's just that if I had to choose between the Democrats, I'm far less convinced that Hillary is the obvious pick than I used to be.


Chargers Rule!!!! Yes!!!!

Sticking tongue out at OT and saying, "nah nah nah nah nah." LOL.


So shall we unite in another thread for the round table? How about the same one as last nite? Up to you Elliott, I just hate to derail a conversation.


Every time I find myself thinking that if it has to be a Dem, maybe it should be Hillary, the idea of Bill back at the White House with time on his hands stops me absolutely cold.

I agree with you absolutely. But Hillary is very beatable, I'm not so sure with Obama.


Couldn't all this be cut down a little,MacCain is too old and Hillary is Second Hand Rose,I know this is democracy at work but a little pruning might help.


In Patrick Fitzgerald's indictment of I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby on October 28, 2005, Grossman is the Under Secretary of State mentioned as giving information about Plame to Libby.

Now, Marc Grossman has supposedly been fingered by Sibel Edmonds, the former FBI translator who has been under a Bush administration gag order for the past 5 years, for selling secrets to the Pakistanis via Turkey.


PeterUK, you rock too! I thought you were going to be Peter England. Are you a flip flopper?



I'll take Clarice's suggestion and go to the Turning Towards History Thread.


This whole conversation about Turkey, Pakistan and the State Dept. smacks of deja vu. I did a bunch of research on this way back when, but I can't find my notes, probably dumped them when I moved or when I got my new laptop and all I can remember is that in the end I was absolutely convinced (at least in my own mind) that the whole Pakistani delegation and anyone who touched them was dirty, starting with Grossman.

Rick Ballard

Here are Hussein's financial disclosure forms. His dough came from egregiously large advances from Random House.

Sound familiar?


Sibel probably knew what she was doing with Gross Man. I' a FDL conspiracy.


England is a tractor company.


I just read something via Drudge that said Hillary shipped in all the supporters for her rally today, from MA and NY and paid all their expenses.

I'm shocked she didn't call me.


"all" the supporters is an exaggeration...

Carbon emissions from visitors' air travel to New Zealand equal total emissions from the country's coal, gas and oil-fired power generation, say University of Otago scientists. Physics researchers Inga Smith and Craig Rodger say the greenhouse-gas emissions from visiting tourists are far greater than had been thought.


Other Tom

Sara, this fair-weather Bolt is dancing a jig right now. On to Indy!

Rick Ballard

Gee, I wonder who in the world could be helping the Obama campaign by vacuuming up all the regular Dem advance people?

Bill in AZ

"His dough came from egregiously large advances from Random House."

So Soros will have another warehouse full of useless books to give away at Christmas, along with every other Bush bashing book written in the last 8 years. Would hate to be his acquaintance.


OT, I hope I live to tell about the game with Indy. Half my family lives in Indianapolis and they are as rabid about the Colts as we out here are about the Chargers and they have a Trojan Horse in our midst in the form of my d-i-l.


Aaah, poor John McCain

McCain camp claims smear


No,I cleared all the personal details off my computer,also ran Adaware,this is pure laziness.


Other Tom,
You realise that if Hillary Holler's Tramp fails all her troubles will be behind her?

JM Hanes


I haven't really followed Edmond's story, she just turned up when I was scratching around for info on Grossman. One of the few articles that dealt with Grossman directly was definitely written from the neocon octopus perspective you describe though! I still found it interesting in terms of information worth pondering or follow-up.

The mistake that lands folks in truther territory fastest, it seems to me, is trying to tie everything up into one vast conspiracy, when the reality is usually a lot of smaller webs that overlap. I don't mean to suggest that anyone at State is dealing nukes, but I've always felt like there are some real but elusive links we're missing that could make the big picture clearer. The recent prominence of Pakistan has just had me thinking about the State Dept. in general and Grossman/Armitage in particular again.


I suspect Armitage, not Libby, is probably the go-to guy info wise.


I think the Turkish recalcitrance was mostly a massive screw up that Powell's State Dept might have anticpated if they had been paying more attention and doing less butt covering triangulation in Washington. The pro-sanction/anti-war/Turkish ties are something I hadn't really thought about though. It also occurs to me, given Clarice's observation about State Dept alums on the Saudi payroll, that I have no clear impression of how the Turkish Saudi relationship shakes out.

Higher Spheres

I think the INR and Shays wife is interesting. Grossman may have found his file there, but someone already did and she got CIA to DIA.

Didn't Armitage do the space gate thing to higher spheres travel general in chagr?

Pakistan is a problem after he bombed it.

M. Simon

Kim says:

Social conservatives and fiscal conservatives will compromise on a Thompson/Romney or vice versa ticket which will attract moderates

That is my hope. Although I'd rather see a Thompson Giuliani ticket. In that order.

BTW I'm a fisc-con, neo-con, anti-drug-war-con.

No one seems to pay any attention to the American Gulag or the war On Minorities not even their leftard "champions".

Higes Fruit of The Loom

Fission is the answer to fusion.


JMH, A friend active in Turkey who understands it much better than I, swears more deft work by DoS would have easily won us landing rights there when we needed them for the invasion and Powell (deliberately or clumsily) botched his task there.


Romney/Thompson would be the perfect ticket. Romney to handle the Presidential stuff, Thompson there as his attack dog and liaison with Congress or to tell the press off.


Obama OKenyan Church of Africa in America and Hucakabee VP.

Turkey wasn't needed. NATO doesn't do much bribing. Turkey got N. Iraq anyway, they just had to wait a.

Other Tom

Magnificent lead from the New York Times, of all places:

"DURHAM, N.H. — Is this what it would have been like had Elvis been reduced to playing Reno?

"Former President Bill Clinton has been drawing sleepy and sometimes smallish crowds at big venues in the state that revived his presidential campaign in 1992. He entered to polite applause and rows of empty seats at the University of New Hampshire on Friday. Several people filed out midspeech, and the room was largely quiet as he spoke, with few interruptions for laughter or applause."

Dear Mr. and Mrs. Clinton: We've seen your act. We know you. Please get out of our lives forever.


The pressure on Turkey was coming from the EU -- basically the French and Germans told them that if they cooperated with the invasion they would never get admission to the EU. It's not really clear whether this was just general-purpose sabtoge, or whether the French, Russians, and/or Germans were sneaking incriminating documents out over the northern border and really didn't want to have to head out through the 4ID coming in...


As has been pointed out before, the August 2001 PDB is a pale generalized copy of the December 1998 one; which had the same title.
Which proceeded out intervention in Kosovo;
whose KLA was receiving logistical support
(ahem) from the likes of AQ's No. 2's brother Mohammed Zawahiri, Abu Zubeydah among others. The Phoenix Memo, the result
of Ken Williams running of Harry Allen, a
Hamas agent, is a curious issue; as it details the flight training protocols that began with Akbar Murad being 'debriefed' by Phillipine National Police, and ending with
Zacarias Moussaoiu, an adept of the Finley
Park Mosque along with Richard Reid, the Jamaican jihadist. Moussaioi was carrying s letter of introduction, from Khalid Sufaat, the leasor on the Malaysian condo where Al Midhar and Al Hamzi along with Waleed Attash ,planned the Cole bombing and any number of plots. The fact that Marwan
(al Shehhii's)name had been forwarded by the BND from their intercept from Yemen, also didn't make into the report which raises suspicions. As did the fact that the FBI retained as an asset, a fellow who was living with the 'fabulous Mecca boys' at the time. How this ties into Sibel's neo-Ottomanist ravings is kind of beyong me.
Her specialty was Turkish, not Arabic not a priority language in the Near East cue for foreign translation, The one link was that
London Times story about a Turkish national convicted of bombing the British consulate,
who was part of the Iraqi resistance and
suggested he was in on the planning.

Armitage, si an interesting character in this regard. His preexisting connection with
the Baku Chamber of Commerce, and the Azeri
International Company,(which is why I dubbed him 'Kingsley' after the malevolent Caspian oil broker in Season 2 of '24)depends on the pipeline, running through to Ceyhan on the Black Sea Coast. Grossman would as former ambassador to Turkey? would
be on this. Valerie Plame, is she was any kind of energy analyst would likely be on
this angle as well. The interesting wrinkle in this; is Azeris are predominantly Shia; much like the Iraqis (in fact, Grand Ayatollah Khameni is Azeri) This whole trend surfaced with Clinton's negotiating concessions on behalf of Roger Tamraz, the onetime partner of Saudi spymaster and BCCI
bigwig Kamal Adham and former Iranian national Farhad Azima (who was tied to both
Clinton and peculiarly at one point, Fred
Thompson)The story became conplicated as both Bob Baer (yes, that Robert Baer)and onetime Near East Ops chief William Lofgren
were contacted on behalf of the pipeline.
This pipeline was much more plausible than the pipedream that some UnoCal executives
thought they could arrange through Taliban
controlled Afghanistan; the muse behind Michael Moore and Ted Rall's more deranged
musings on the need for intervention in Afghanistan.


Bill Roggio has an interesting new post up.

JM Hanes


Apparently Hillary Clinton now has a Facebook page where folks can put their questions in a hat for a video answer sometime down the (pipe)line. Although she’d never touch it, somebody should ask her about that ’98 PDB, just for grins if nothing else!

I am soooo out of my depth when it comes to connecting the necessary dots of the ilk you supply, but I do remember how absurd the Afghan pipeline accusations were at the time, when the Caspian route had so many enthusiasts. “Pipedream” is too perfect. I’d have thought that only the Russians were paranoid enough to believe it – but then maybe that’s where the rumor originated. Any time you lift the corner of a carpet (Persian or otherwise), it seems Armitage is there, doesn’t it? Except, apparently, when it came to moving troops through Turkey. Maybe MayBee is on to something.


OK, I am just giggling at the Sibel Edmonds story and the lefties going banana's over it...Sibel, on her "just a citizen blog" or whatever has just posted a bunch of pictures of I guess all the actors in this Turk/Khan nuc spy ring, including Marc Grossman and Brent Scowcroft, Perle, a bunch of dem and gop congress, yada yada and all these speculations about the Plame outing comments at Emptyies.

Like Maybee mentioned, the Sibel "story" has morphed quite a bit, but so has Plames. She was in charge of Iraq WMD, then tracking Iran was added to her portfolio, and now in an interview after her book was also on the team that nabbed Khan! Busy B, that one! She's a virtual WMD Superwoman!

When Sibel's story first came out, it was that Plame was working on the Turkey angle, Brewster Jennings network was in Turkey and she was outed because she was supposed to have been to close or however it goes. Sibel knew all this in 6 months

But it just doesn't seem to dawn on these lefties the conundrum this poses.

I mentioned above, Joseph Wilson called Marc Grossman in 2003 to complain about being referred to as low-level and Valerie recounted this call to her superiors at CIA -- odd person - a dude selling our Nuc secrets! that Valerie was supposedly investigating-- for Wilson to be calling and Valerie to be relating to her superiors as no big deal?

I mean, if you wanted to whine about being referred to as low-level would you call your good friend, college bud who was Turkey's ambass while you were in Iraq, fellow ACT party goer, who was SPYING for Turley et al to complain?

And Brent Scowcroft. Remember this:

Politics of Truth Page 283: Valerie Plame is smitten with Brent Scowcroft. The former national security adviser's "one extravagance is a silver Mercedes convertible. Valerie has a not-so-secret crush on him—not for his car, but for his charm."

oh and Wilson and Scowcroft do still talk...Scowcroft called him in Oct. 06

Two phone calls brought Scowcroft to Albuquerque, he said. The first was to another veteran of the first Bush administration, former Ambassador Joseph Wilson and husband of former CIA agent Valerie Plame, after Wilson campaigned for Rep. Wilson's opponent, Democratic Attorney General Patricia Madrid.

"I said, 'What the hell are you doing?' " Scowcroft recalled.

Awfully strange person, a traitor, for Wilson to be so friendly with, and Valerie to have such a crush on, no?

Why would she have a crush on a man who she was tracking his Nuc secrets trading or allow her husband to be in contact with as late as 2006?

Oh, it's all so troubling! LOL.


How this ties into Sibel's neo-Ottomanist ravings is kind of beyong me.
Her specialty was Turkish, not Arabic[,] not a priority language in the Near East cue for foreign translation,

and 6 months, no less.


Letter to the NYT

To the Editor:

Your Dec. 31 editorial “Looking at America” does a great disservice to the men and women of the C.I.A. You describe the lawful questioning of hardened terrorists as “sickening behavior.” The interrogation methods the C.I.A. has employed over the years have been closely reviewed by lawyers and others in the executive branch, and they have been briefed to our oversight committees in Congress. That is a fact.

It is absurd to suggest that the C.I.A. has an interest in any process that would produce bad intelligence. To dismiss as “barbaric acts” a small, carefully run effort that has disrupted terrorist plots and saved innocent lives — and done so in accord with the law — is wrong and unfair.

The officers of the C.I.A. who put their lives on the line to gather intelligence on the terrorist threat — and are as committed as anyone to protecting American ideals — deserve better.

Mark Mansfield
Director of Public Affairs
Central Intelligence Agency
McLean, Va., Jan. 3, 2008

JM Hanes

And up jumps the very devil I detailed above: Madeleine K. Albright steps up to bat in the Washington Post. My favorite part of the article was written by the paper's staff:

The writer was secretary of state from 1997 to 2001. She is the author of the forthcoming book "Memo to the President Elect: How We Can Restore America's Reputation and Leadership."
Sorry Maddy, but I'm happy to say you don't know who you're talkin' to.

JM Hanes


And here we go: Sibel Edmonds’ State Secrets Privilege Gallery! It starts to look like a board game as you scroll, doesn't it?


Note Mansfield's 'briefed to our oversight committees', and 'and done so in accord with the law'?


Note, too, his nexus of useful and lawful referring to waterboarding, er uh, carefully run effort.


Like our decoding ring specialist, I wish Sibel knew what she knows.


Fred Thompsons the only leader on the campaign trail, all the others are hand raising followers.

Personally, if a Dem wins(they're all the same) I can survive four years of a high Misery Index because I don't have children to feed, a car to fuel or high property taxes to pay and I can always divest my investments until safer days.

Moderates and Independents need to ask themselves if they are prepared for four years under a high Misery Index.


The growing awareness that I am never going to have have to watch Madeline Albright dance the Macarena again has got me so excited I could poop.


You know, her Daddy was Condi Rice's mentor at Denver University. He convinced her to switch from a music major.


It all depends, Daddy.


MSNBC just reported that Bill Clinton told one of their reporters that he couldn't make her any taller or any younger! ( Referring of course to his wife)

Clarice, you were so right about this guy!!!!!!!


Andrea Mitchell is the reporter.


Was she drunk, or something?


Who will Hill kill first--Mark Penn or Bill?

Posted this from Kaus on another thread:
Monday's Must-See Event--The Train Wreck Tour: The reporters I talk to are looking forward to the final pre-election joint Bill and Hillary Clinton rally Monday evening with the same lascivious delight you might encounter before a Britney Spears/Amy Winehouse double bill. Everyone expects it to be a gruesome night for the Clintons; their aides have been lashing out at the press uncharmingly. Anything could happen! ... 1:30 A.M.



The full statement from Bill was: I am sorry, I can't make her younger, I can't make her taller, I can't make her male!


It's always somebody else's fault!



Sirens are up on Drudge.

Mon Jan 07 2008 09:46:28 ET


Dorothy Rabinowitz has an interesting opinion piece in the WSJ about McCain. Her view, and I have great respect for her, is that there is something special about McCain--a truly heroic figure with a great deal of cross party appeal.


Well, as much as, I snarked about him last night, I would agree he is a truly heroic figure and a patriot.


We might just get to watch The Red Witch melt. More bad news for Team Clinton.


Ah yes...Scowcroft...those aspens all turn together-It amazes me that you have so much of the Plame narrative at your fingertips. I'm agnostic on the Edmonds story. Think about the 9/11 Truther movement and the anti-Iraq war movement in the same vein as the JFK conspiracy movement and the anti-Vietnam War movement.
The Mitrokhin Archive shows Mark Lane's conspiracy books were shaped and guided by the KGB. The current stable of disgruntled former government officials, hedge fund operators, and foreign governments could all have reasons to exploit the current environment, and those gruntled officers would be easy prey to exploit. Edmond's is one of those exploited, disgruntled officials [nevermind the fact that she was only employed for 6 months].

Other Tom

From the WaPo"

"AMHERST, N.H. -- He's no kid anymore, and it's his wife who is attempting the comeback. But former president Bill Clinton looked and certainly sounded Saturday like a politician whose legacy is on the line."

It is, Bill--it is. In a hundred years you'll be ranked just above, or just below, Millard Fillmore. And it is great fun for all of us to watch that realization dawn on you.

Rick Ballard


I think Rasmussen gets the independant move better than Zogby did. Obama may clip McCain to the extent that Romney picks up a win.

citi zen log

Plame did Snowcroft?

You know she was Russian since 95 and probably went bad when Ames got arrested. Plame had a longer run than Ames; she was teaching an old dog new tricks?


I was in college when Mark Lane toured the campuses with his dog and pony show. Never realized the KGB played a role in that, but as with the Fair Play for Cuba crowd, moving thru the groves of academe at the same time, I remained unpersuaded.


JMH, Armitage lacks the motive at this point to write a tell all--he would come out looking not so good. That was my point about Libby: he, at least, has a motive to tell as much as possible. Unless you believe he really did commit perjury.


Oh boy, I went to bed last night sick as a dog. Bad pizza I think. Anyway, fell asleep with the TV on and woke this morning hearing a discussion on Fox, but before I got my eyes open they cut to commercial, so I don't know who said this, maybe Tammy Bruce. But the woman in the discussion made the claim that Obama has not done a single sit down interview with anyone since declaring his candidacy. Is this true? I don't pay that much attention to the dem side. If so, why is he allowed to get away with this? They raked Fred over the coals for refusing interviews for a month.


Cut and past from Rasmussen:

Forty percent (40%) of Likely Democratic Primary Voters view Obama as politically liberal while 49% see him as moderate. That places him a bit to the left of the other candidates, at least in terms of voter perceptions.

Clinton is seen as politically liberal by 30% of the primary voters and moderate by 59%.

For Edwards, the numbers are 38% liberal, 51% moderate.

Note these are democrats and their rankings. Forget their claims on moderacy, simply note that Democrats put Obama slightly to the left of Edwards and both of them more significantly to the left of Clinton.

For all of you hyperventilating, the last few times the Dems picked the most liberal candidates it went over like a lead balloon in the general election. BS floats, lead? not so much.

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