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January 24, 2008



Thanks Tom!


live feed link for a legal gringo immigrant in Mexico?


I think McCain hired Hillary's makeup artist. :)


Very observant Ann!


nevermind got it


McCain is already grouchy, it shouldn't take long for him to erupt into flames.

JM Hanes

Huckabee thinks a highway to somewhere will save America.


Why is Ron Paul on stage instead of Fred? I miss him!

hit and run

How many voters in FL are staying up this late to watch?

Not many of McCain's supporters...they ate dinner at 4 pm and probably were headed for bed right after the local news.

JM Hanes

Romney puts McCain on the defensive, but also gives him a chance to hit his anti-pork message.

hit and run

Why is Ron Paul on stage instead of Fred?



Sheesh I was blogging it over in the Tiger thread. What a drag!


Thanks JMH for the heads up.


McCains economic policy

no more bridges to nowhere!



I miss Fred too! Damn.

hit and run


The Economy:

Romney - are you bummed out that the President didn't follow your plan?

Romney wishes he went further. He notes his permanent tax cut and a savings plan. Talks about capital investment, and jobs, and the FHA crisis.

McCain - will you vote for the compromise?

Yes, and I'm disappointed that it didn't make the tax cuts permanent and cites uncertainty in people who are planning their 2010 budgets. Slams income tax and says it is important to not add pork - (good). He emphasizes tax cuts and spending restraint.

Rudy: Do you think it is a mistake that tax cuts are not in the package?

It doesn't go far enough. My tax package is better. It will make America more competitive. We are running business out of the country because of regulation.

Economy has taken precedence over national security. McCain you admit you don't know the economy very well.

McCain: Not true because I was at the Reagan revolution. I'm very well versed in economics and lots of economic savvy people support me, like Jack Kemp.

You are all tax cutters. Huckster, do you trust Romney?

That's up to the voters, I was great, and made great tax cuts (watch his nose grow) I'm concerned that we are borrowing from the Chinese and we will buy Chinese goods with the rebate. Instead, let's make I95 2 lanes wider and used American workers. I say that because I made a highway in Hope Arkansas and now it is the best place on earth.

Romney do you trust Mccain and Guiliani?

Yeah I trust them. We all want to see spending go down and taxes down. I did it in MA without raising taxes. (It's all changed Mitt, we are once again Taxachusetts.) Criticizes McCain's vote against tax cuts. He spent his life in the private sector and will create jobs.

McCain is raising fees the eqivilant of raising taxes. I voted against tax cuts because of spending. (These poor guys have to repeat everything over and over and over and I'm getting sick of it.) But he's proud of his record. And he's consistent and he will stop pork (YAY)

Paul: Should gvt have any role? We should not get involved in the funds rate. Gvt should lower taxes and get rid of regulation. And now his voice goes up another octive. The war is bad, bad bad bad.

JM Hanes

I like Giuliani on the global economy, don't know if it will sell in Peoria though.


Straight Talk! Drink up!

hit and run

Interesting take from the Corner:

Russert's Provocations [Stephen Spruiell]

The harder these moderators try to start fights (Williams and Russert, both tonight and last week with the Democrats), the more genial the candidates are toward each other. The debate in which the moderator played the smallest role (Monday night's Blitzer-moderated Democratic brawl) was also the nastiest.


I'm going to be drunk before the night is over. Everytime I hear the words "my friend" and "straight talk" I take a shot. Loopy already!

hit and run

My straight friends talk....

JM Hanes

I'd like to see one of the other candidates decisively counter Huckabee's economic stance, because that's what they're going to have to do when they get to the general and face an admitted Democrat.


Doesn't seem to be a lot of energy on the stage so far.

The democrats have and 18 point advantage in public opinion in dealing with the economy and he cites all the bad stats none of the good ones.

McCain - the democrats will continue spending. then says they won't give us enough entitlements.huh? Then on to pork, music to my ears.

Huckster: I wasn't in Washington, so it's not my fault. I was the only one saying the economy was bad, but I knew it was bad for the poor. Goes into healthcare, waitresses, bag handlers, talks about "trickle up" economy, single moms and he predicted it, and understands the totality of the pix.

Romney: I'll run on my record. Washington is broken. Talks about washington failures. We are the party of change and fiscal responsibilty. When republicans act like democrats America loses.

Rudy: I'm the only one who turned around an economy.


From the NRO Corner:

The editorial board of The New York Times is endorsing
Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton for the Democratic
presidential nomination

and Senator John McCain as the
Republican nominee.

I don't think that is helpful for McCain.

JM Hanes

Good for Romney, taking on the Democrats on Iraq.

Rick Ballard

"and Senator John McCain as the
Demublican nominee."

There. All fixed.

One of these geniuses might mention the growth in GDP over the past seven years. It ain't a hidden number.

Giuliani is looking very good.


Paul : I'm not part of that crowd. I insert my earmarks and then vote against the bill. It's a new era.

McCain: Our army is on the verge of breaking, we can't sustain our troops and Iraq, how will you do it economically and militarily?

Ans: You are wrong. We can sustain our army. He raises Hillary saying we want to surrender. Defends the war. Rumsfeld yadi yadi. Ignores the economics. "Let us win".

Romney: McAfree says the army is too small and poorly resourced. How do you double the size of it, without a draft.

Mitt recommends that we add 100,000 troops. Puts an economic bill in to give education to troops, improve the deal. He also comments on Hillary's surrender comment. "We cannot turn Iraq over to al Qaeda."
How audacious and arrogant for the democrats to take responsibility of the war. It's Petreaus not General Hillary Clinton.

6 out of 10 Americans say removing Saddam was not worth it (applause). Will you say the war was a good idea.

McCain - it was worth getting rid of Saddam and it was all Rumsfeld's fault. Now we are on the right track. The war was a good idea.

Good for him.

Rudy: Says Hillary was in favor when the polls were in favor. I'm for it not because of polls but because America is in a war, and we have to succeed. You can't have polls push you around.

Paul - it was bad and not worth it, and al Qaeda wasn't there. The Clinton administration made the policy in 1998.

Huckster: I supported the president and we owe him that he had courage. He made sure Saddam would not attack us. When the president acted this country was not united and it's important not to back away when polls go badly.

Mitt - I supported it then and now. Had some bad times but now it is going well. Retreat is a bad thing.


Well I like the fact that Paul said it was Clinton's war. Hillary probably had a heart attack.

JM Hanes

Anybody notice that the Huckster is -- very politely, of course -- undermining McCain? Huckabee's not part of that Washington crowd, it's easy to second guess a president, etc.

JM Hanes

I find myself wishing the commercial break was longer. Sigh.

hit and run

Another Corner quote:

The war question revealed the key difference between McCain and Giuliani [Michael Graham]

Guiliani is always looking for the chance to fight Democrats.

McCain is always ready for a fight with Republicans.

JM Hanes

Interesting that Romney directs his question to Giuliani. Interesting in that it's not necessarily a hostile question, but a potentially informative one.


ooohhh - McCain is going after Huckabee. Whoopee Doo.

hit and run

McCain is going after Huckabee. Whoopee Doo

Sure, now that he's gotten Sylvester Stallone on his team, Chuck Norris isn't quite as scary.


LOL, Hit! Now Paul is going after McCain. No one has gone after Romney yet? Who's left?


When Huckabee loses, he should be the spokesman for the Fair Tax Movement. He understands it.


Chuck Norris isn't quite as scary.

I am so glad you are here tonight, you do make me laugh.

hit and run

No one has gone after Romney yet?

What? I thought everyone hated romney, jealous of his money and looks and wife and kids and smarts and success and optimism and...


Huck asks a very pointed question of Romney on the Second Amendment. Answer could have been more forceful.

hit and run

By the way, I'm not watching the debate, I am second hand commenting on what I read here and elsewhere.

Much more fun, for I have a very vivid imagination.

My debate is MUCH more entertaining than the one you are watching.

[VIMH: Good times!]
You said it.

JM Hanes

I'm surprised McCain didn't say the way to address catastrophic coverage is to invest in green technologies. McCain is just one long series of generalities.

JM Hanes

So Giuliani says it for him.


Hit: Thank you for injecting (very needed) humor in this very droll discussion (can't quite call it a debate!)

JM Hanes

vnj: "Answer could have been more forceful"

Not if you're Mitt Romney!

hit and run


Another correspondent just e-mailed me that this debate is, so far, "a snooze-fest." Go figure, all along, Fred Thompson was the zesty wild card of this field.



McCain was opposed to the tax cuts in 2001 and 2003; and they contributed significantly
to the economy.Question, did he vote for the Reagan tax cuts when he was in the House.The New York Times floated some fellow named Berman, who figures, declare when tax cuts will fold; it will bring more income. This is the same brilliance that
cut the deductability of interest on real estate dependent S&L portfolios. (Hello, McFly; is anybody home) People say they care about earmarks; but that's because they want the other district's earmarks! His economic advisor in 2000 was Kevin Haskell, author of Dow 36,000! People say they want to balance the budget; but they really don't (unless it's in a area where the cuts aren't readily seen in the short run (like Defense and Intell.)Consequently, the Company had the smallest number of CTs in the mid 90s. Under Deutch, they closed CIA bases in Hamburg!,Dusseldorf, and at least a dozen locations in Europe, purged 1,000 Agency assets, reprimanded a half dozen high level CIA personnel forincidental
reasons (Ward, Bearden, Andersen, et al)On other fronts, it's not a coincidence that Clinton 'balanced' the budget, the same way and right around the same time Enron changed the way it accrued profits; using dodgy accounts .The subprime mess is going to so slow down and then crescendo around 2010(Which really makes you think why they would want this prize right now)Citicorp, Merrill, Morgan, all knew the game, but they bided their time. One has to throw Goldman in to the mix although it usually
provides the lion's share of economic and other staffers (Corzine, Rubin, (when he brokered the HNG/merger that placed Lay atop Enron, the Mexican deals predevaluation
and bailout, Bolten, Paulson et al)Soros of course, along with Buffett, is always betting against the dollar;the latter shattering currencies in South Asia that made it a haven for AQ (Abu Sayyaf, Gemma
Islamiyah)Jim Rogers among a whole host of speculators and institutional investors are
always betting on Chinese, Brazilian, anything but American stocks. They use GAAP rules there right; please.

JM Hanes

Cap and Trade, a.k.a., Voodoo Economics


Candidates ask other candidates stuff.

Romney talks about China. Rudy - as we compete with China, how do we make sure we compete equally, what can we do economically to level the playing field.

"The reality is" is getting to be an old phrase. We need to work with China, get the ability to sue in China, careful of imports, see this as an opportunity. We can sell energy independance, health processes, technological processes. We need to overcome bill Clinton's peace dividend where he cut the military.

Mccain asks Huckster about the fair tax. How do you answer the criticism that it wouldn't hurt poor people?

People want the IRS abolished, quotes Dr. phil. It encouages work. The poor come out best of all because everyone gets $$$ back up to the amount of poverty. No one is working under the table.

Tim interjects - 93% of americans pay 15% or less. Huckster says that doesn't include the embedded and invisible tax.

Paul: to Mccain: What is your opinion of some group (I missed it)

McCain is gonna rely on Sec of treasury and all the people who now support him.

Huckster to Mitt: Re: 2nd Amendment - you supported Brady and a ban on assault weapons.

Mitt: I support the 2nd amendment and I would have supported assault weapons ban that was embraced by pro- and anti gun people, but I don't support new legislation.

Rudy to Mitt:

Property insurance - do you support a national catastrophic fund? He invokes McCain who retorts.

Mitt supports some kind of national catastrophic effort. Invokes the "poor people who live on the coastline" who of course all have multi-million dollar homes.
but other than that... Mitt talks about his health insurance plan.

Mccain gets to rebut - it's a terrible problem and weather is violent, we have to address this issue - talks about a government and not a free market solution. Ahhh finally mentions working with the insurers.

Russert brings up global warming. Rudy you are against a mandatory cap on greenhouse gasses. Rudy talks about technology as a solution, nuclear power plants, coal, incentives, biofuels, etc. Need a major national project. Negative incentives would ruin American industry and China and India would keep polluting.

McCain you are in favor of caps. "No I'm in favor of capping trade". It has to be a global agreement. We need nuclear power. Climate change is real. It causes violent weather changes.


I think there was an agreement in the green room to be civil, therefore making the democrats look like useful fools.


We are missing "Ace of Cakes"


McCain: Manmade global climate change is real but just suppose it isn't.

Me: Okay. I suppose it isn't. Or I suppose it is real but not manmade.

McCain: I get to have it both ways. I can say it is real but I'm covering my butt in case it isn't.

Me: Straight talk.

Drink up!


It will be fun to watch Hillary hedge on surrender.

JM Hanes

"It causes violent weather changes."

Only when the change is bad. Otherwise, it's just weather.

hit and run

It causes violent weather changes.

Uh, like REDUCED hurricane activity.


How to increase the Army by 400k without a draft? I dunno, ask Reagan or HW Bush. The Army was 400k bigger during their terms.

Why not a segment where the candidates ask the moderators questions?
"Tim Russert, Andrea Mitchell said Valerie Plame's CIA employment was well-known. Did you know about it? If not, why did you never challenge her on that statement?"

Rick Ballard

Well, Voodoo Economics is probably the best approach to a nonexistent problem. I'd rather see a lot of spells cast and incantations recited than money spent.


Incantations are the best weapon against harridans, witches, harpies and the like, aren't they Rick?


Drink up!

Done! All I have is half a bottle of crappy organic wine (don't believe the hype) but I'm drinking. Please keep the drink cues coming, I can't watch the debate. My husband refuses to turn it on.

hit and run

On the reduced hurricane activity strength, PLEASE read this post on the Corner...

David Freddoso called the reduced hurricane strength -- as a joke! -- six weeks ago, before the real report came out.

JM Hanes

Did McCain, in fact, get a majority of Republican voters? We're waiting for states without Democrat & Independent crossover, for that test. I can understand why McCain won't address Republican objections point by painful point.


Nothing like a glass of Port to polish off for the debate. Warms the innards.

hit and run

My husband refuses to turn it on.

In today's republican campaign, the question is not whether the debate is interesting, informative or entertaining.

No, the real question is, when you turn the debate on, does it return the favor?


Thank you all for sparing me the agony of actually listening to this.


Mitt is suddenly the focus. Russert and Williams knows who to address the hard questions too? No?


Any of these guys could win a lot of votes taking a shot at Tim Russert.

JM Hanes

I do think Romney is dominating this debate.


Oh, Hit, that has to be the worst ad on the air right now!


Rudy: Latest polls say you are losing. What has happened.

This is a very competitive race and I'm going to come from behind like the giants. (uh Rudy they are gonna lose next week) I've lulled everyone into a false sense of security.

McCain: Your mother said the republican party will have to hold its nose and vote for you.
How will you unite the party?

I'm proud of my record on Judges. I won the majority of republican votes. National security is the biggest issue and I can fix the economy. Conservatives are concerned about climate change. I can keep Israel independant. Rumsfeld again. Pork. I pout my country above my party.

Romney: Hillary is a team with Bill. How would you run against that.

I can't imagine Bill in the WH. I'm not running against Bill. Hill is so out of step with the american people, she's bad on taxes, healthcare, her approach to Iraq, just get out. She is exactly what is wrong with washington. That's the last thing America needs. Change.

How much of your own money have you spent on this race this far.

We will report that when it's due. Russert perseveres, I've raised more money than anyone else, and I haven't spent as much as Corzine, Bloomberg or Forbes. I think it is important to invest my own money and I don't owe anyone.

Are you trying to buy the nomination.

I care deeply about this, and I've been succesful enough to save this money and I want my kids to inherit a great country.

I think he knocked it out of the park.

Back at him. A mormon would have a hard time uniting the country.

Mitt: I don't believe that Americans will choose a president based on his church.

Paul: Social security - he wants to abolish it. Get the young people out, end the war.

Yada yada yada/


What has NBC done to threaten the audience if they respond in any manner? Is there an audience?

Not good!


That is why NBC - MSNBC tanks in the ratings, month after month!


Thanks Hit, I watched that while Ron Paul was talking and increased the volume enough so I didn't hear his answer. Darn

Bill in AZ

I can agree with McCain on something for a change: "Conservatives are concerned about climate change". Damn right we are. It's a bunch of nonsense invented by the Goracle. I drove my pickup a couple extra miles today to help reduce hurricanes.

JM Hanes


Williams has admonished the crowd not to clap etc.

hit and run

Did McCain, in fact, get a majority of Republican voters?

CNN entrance polls in SC, Huck 32, McCain 31 in registered republicans.


Y'know what guys. Even the worst of the worst of our candidates are better than the Democrat options!


Clarice, I was just going to post that I wished Clarice was here. Good to see ya, as always.

Rick Ballard

If they have the brass to go after Mitt on the Mormon question will they ask McCain what brand of walker he prefers? I'm betting no.

JM Hanes

Russert has a truly obnoxious manner.


oh, JMH, usually I agree with you. But, actually he has much more than an obnoxious mannner. He IS obnoxious personified.


Thnx, Ann. I am grateful that Jane and Hit are here. Jane, for the facts. Hit, to keep me awake.

JM Hanes

The audience doesn't care for the New York Times. Who'd a thunk it?

Spelling Gestapo




Huck: "McCain doesn't lack rigor"

Give it a couple hours, that fades.


ooh spelling gestapo - puhleeze give me some slack. I am drinking coctails and trying (with handicaps) to type at the same time. whew!!

JM Hanes

Huckabee doesn't want to impose his faith on anybody -- he just wants to bring the Constitution in line with God.



I've come to a conclusion on McCain. McCain is a doofus. There, now I feel better. Global warming, bah. Go after Bin Laden, bah. All Rumsfelds fault, Bah. A pox on McCain. If McCains on the ballot in November I'm writing in Fred. In fact, I'm writing in Fred on February 5th. Damn the Torpdoes and all that.


oops. cocktails. It is getting harder and harder to type.


HUckster - how will you save social security - first he attacks Mitt and his money and he looks like a jerk.

The fair tax will fix it. (Russert - that's unlikey) Huckster - we have to talk about what we can do not what we can't do.

Romney: will you do what social security what reagan did (we hear someone whisper - "raise taxes") who was that. Romney won't raise taxes.

You can have personal accounts, you can change the benfit calculation for wealthy, you can push out the retirement age.

Rudy: Immigration plan calls for all people to learn English why do you have a spanish ad.

"The reality is"

Stop people at the border. Teach new behavior.

Rudy - the wet foot dry foot policy - why should a cuban be allowed to stay here but not others.

The policy came in the 60's, Castro is bad, there is a presumption in the immigration law that you are fleeing a bad dictator, otherwise you have to prove it.

Huckster; Chuck Norris said McCain was too old. Do you agree or disagree. I didn't disagree with him because he was standing next to me. Boy he can fling it can't he?

McCain - now I have Stallone he will take care of Norris. What's the deal with McCain's nose?

Rudy: NY Times endorses Clinton and McCain, they say you are narrow, secretive vindictive man, how can you defend?

I probably never did anything the NY times wanted and if I had I wouldn't be a conservative republican. Good answer.
"The reality is" we haave serious ideological differences"

Another campaign faxed us that Mitt changes positions like the wind. NY Times said you were most disliked.

I'm not going to DC to make friends with politicians. Look at my record as governor.

This is great they are getting their questions from the NY Times. No bias there.

McCain: LA Times says you have a temper.

It's not an impediment. He praises Rudy.

Huckster said his use of faith in the campaign gave him a queasy feeling.

That's his problem. It's who I am.

Paul: You won't stick to your party and might launch a 3rd party. (No one is worried about that I don't think). Good riddance.

Paul: I'm not leaving. We don't act like republicans yadi yadi yadi. We stopped the vietnam war that the democrats started. WOW

I assume this is the end.

JM Hanes

Oh please. Did they really have to end the debate on Ron Paul?


Huckabee's good on the religion answers. Scares me. Are they listening to anything else he says?


Well from my perspective Mitt won hands down. He was good tonite. The moderators sucked of course.


Is anyone else doing analysis besides these bozos?


Go Mitt! Down with NBC. Macacca!


This is what I got out of this debate, I still want Cindy McCain's wardrobe and Ann Romney looks like a first lady.

I know....HEH!!

JM Hanes

Oops, channel surfing here, posted these on the wrong thread:

Andrea Mitchell thinks McCain was reassuring to Republican conservatives? She'll probably deny that's what she meant tomorrow.

I love Mitt's opener on the Billary question, btw. Probably because that's exactly how I feel. Russert was hoping for something juicy when he asked "What does that mean?" -- like we don't know exactly what that meant? -- a question Romney wisely ignored

Huckabee has been running against the Clinton machine in Arkansas all these years!

JM Hanes

Muchas gracias, Janeo!

JM Hanes

Oh Lordy, Chris Matthews & Tim Russert as simultaneous talking heads -- Yikes!


I don't know if I know how to link a youtube video but here is a link if you guys want to cleanse your palate. I found myself wanting him to run for president. And he's a Canadian. ::grin::

http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=6n3SdV2cwn4&NR=1>Kickin' Ass and Taking Numbers

If you don't know the background on this, google Mark Steyn and Canadian HRC.

Rick Ballard


Thanks again. I agree with your assessment concerning Mitt winning. I would also note that Mario Cuomo's PR flack targeted Mitt with the toughest attack while tossing softballs to the geriatric. The NYT endorsement today of McCain was a lovely touch - a go to source for every Republican as they make their decisions.


Yeah, the NYT endorsement is like the curse of football teams on the front page of Sports Illustrated.

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