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April 13, 2008


Rick Ballard

e. e. cummings as interpreted by Allen Ginsberg?

James Joyce has returned?

I really do appreciate "I was just a rolling, raging river" for strring the memories of Hedley Lamar.

It's real purdy.

M. Simon

Obama? Pith on him.

Tom Maguire

Obama? Pith on him.

I'd have said that, if I could have found 3,000 words to do it.

Well, I guess that takes "We drink his pith. We drink it up" out of play.

Danube of Thought

I pith in the milk of his mother.

richard mcenroe

Maybe we can "hope for change?"

Reminds me of another great comment:

"We went to Washington, to demand justice for our people. And they took us to see the President. The President looked us in the eye, shook our hands, and said, 'Always remember to endeavor to perservere.'

"Always remember to endeavor to perservere. So we went away and we thought about that, long time, long time. And when we had thought about it long enough, we declared war on the white man."

--Cheif Lone Watie, "Outlaw Josey Wales."


Since this thread is pretty bare, we are holding the compassion forum here - where Ann will be blogging and I will be snarking.

For those of you who missed it, Trevor Immelman won the Masters today by 3 shots over Tiger.

I can't wait to see Hillary ooze compassion, and Obama simply ooze.


Oh dear, we are to hear "deeply personal" questions?

Hey bro how's your homey Reverend Wright?


Hillary goes first. (Where are you ANN?)

So Hill - you were mean to Obama when he said he was bitter - and all that clinging. So faith sustained you in "bitter" times. Oh that's low.

Obama is an elitist says Hill. I respect and understand all those non-elites because I'm just one of the masses. You made $109 million last year didn't you?


Campbell just called her Clinator. That may stick. Campbell says Obama says she is mean. Again she says he should speak for himself, but he's the stereotype democrat elitist. This would be a great speech if it were anyone but the Red Witch giving it. Let Obama explain himself.

So Hill, when did you feel the holy spirit?

YIKES (just yesterday when I was emptying the dishwasher)

Hill declines to get specific - the holy spirit is with her in good times and bad. Hill could not make her journey without being anchored in God's grace - but she declines to answer the question.


"So Hill, when did you feel the holy spirit?

YIKES (just yesterday when I was emptying the dishwasher)"

No that was Bill,he's been on the bottle again.


Her faith has given her the confidence to make all those stellar decisions.

Ahhhh on to Hillary's moments of grace. But Hill is too shy to answer specifically. She walks the walk of faith. Faith is grace, love, mystery, provocation, and everything that makes life purposeful.

Like when I said "politics is not a game" that was faith. huh? For Hill it is spiritual because she wants to give others the chance to live up to their potential. (Would that be the bitter people)

Oh dear, another story, that tomorrow we will find out is not true.


What are your first principles you fall back on to make life and death decisions.

This is a challange? (No really?) The process she uses comes from her prayer. (Now I lay me down to sleep. hoping that another 3:00AM phone calls won't prevent dreams to seep. Where is that maid to answer the phone, bleepedly bleep. Sheesh another promise I won't keep)

Iraq is bad. We must withdraw the troops (I'm a sheep)


Up on you Obama I will creep...


Sorry I'm late.

She hasn't mentioned how important polling is to her decisions and beliefs yet has she.

What's with the monotone voice?


And Hill of course does not answer the question. So far she is batting 100 on that score.

You can't leave things on the back burner. (You mean like Iraq?)

I won't get defensive.

DO you believe personally that life begins at conception.

I believe that the potential for life begins at conception. It's also about the other lives involved. Otherwise the government is too intrusive. Not like universal healthcare of course, that's not government intrusion. I've spent years and years and years making abortion rare.

Really? How so?

I was in China - it was a war zone, and I stopped their sterilizations. And I won't go to the Olympics.

I was in Romania - the home of nadia commenich. They force you to have children, and they mandate health care. Can you imagine. All those kids led to an AIDs epidemic - who knows how George Bush caused that.

HOw about assisted suicide? There were people of good faith on both sides of the Terri Schivo case. (Really? that's news). But I don't want to get involved with that issue. Let congress do it.


How did she get her make-up to match her jacket? :)


Okay, I had to run to the store and am just tuning in, haven't yet read the thread ....

but, who picked the pukey outfit that looks like a lemon going bad?


Boy she is really trying to thread the needle. I don't believe she has once said one word coming from her heart.


The gaffe thread Centralcal




oops - shoulda known, Ann is all over it. You are right, girlfriend, her makeup matches her jacket. Not good!

Barry will just wear basic black, like all guys do.


Jane you are on a roll. You don't need my help. LOL


Who said she had a heart?


I don't mind the suit but the yellow scarf clashes. Very odd choice - why not a contrasting color?

Her hair looks better than it did at most of the previous debates, though.


Ann, the hushed, "sensitive" monotone indicates she's a Very Serious and Thoughtful Person.

Now she's getting back into her wonky tone with this China question.


LOLing that she has the balls to talk about China -- has anyone asked her about all the Chinese donations to her husband and his "Presidetial" liebrary.


We have missed many oppurtunities with China under the Bush Administration. We gave them nuclear secrets and they give us money for our campaigns. That Bush is such a loser.


Religion is too influential.

Yes I understand that. All conversations about religion must be inclusive (Allah Akba)

That's news: We want religion in the public square. Does that mean we can have Christmas trees this year Ms Hillary?

The rabbi wants to talk about China. They give weapons to Sudan. Should we participate in the Olympics.

Oh good, I was prepared for that. I told Bush not to go to the opening ceremonies unless the Chinese change their ways. As you can see I'm ready to lead on day one.

Bush has failed on China, and he should listen to me until the end of his term. We want to cause them loss of face, because that always works so well.

A baptist who sounds like Jimmy Carter. How will you ensure the poor get access to AIDs drugs. You know that disease the government spread.

Oh we have to do so much more. (And why do they always says HIV AIDS now instead of just AIDS?)

We need to take over pharmaceuticals. Bush did something, but of course not enough.

Why does a loving God allow innocent people to suffer.

"Well"..... laughter. "I don't know, I can't wait to ask him. I have pondered that endlessly"

Gobbledlygook that gets applause. Hillary tells us about the bible now. Now she is preaching.


oh brother! I never thought I would say this, but McCain is wise to have skipped this whole boondoggle.

Meacham (can't spell his name) asked the question of "the ages!"


Oh Lordy Jane. I thought he sounded like Jesse Jackson with a whole lot of Jimmah mixed in! LOL.


Can anyone picture much less believe that Bill and Hill read stories from the Bible to their daughter. Which ones Hill?


She has many favorite bible stories. She is completely indoctrinated in the bible, and so is Chelsea. That's what she and her friends talk about over tea. She's into Purim and Ester. She admires Ester. That's why she is the first woman running for President. She was named after Ester. She lived in Pennsylvania. She was shot in Bosnia.

Now the Muslim: How do we fix climate change. That's a big muslim value I guess. Pay for carbon offsets for Bin Ladan's weapons. Or just turn off lights. Same dif.

Ambassador Flynn is a drunk Hillary. Is he still in Rome He used to be the mayor of Boston. Sheesh.

NY Faith and Justice (never heard of that religion). Our military is stretched. Would you commit US troops to a humanitarian mission under a foreign flag?


I, Hillary have already started this process - we will school all kids everywhere, and free healthcare around the world.

We've lost our standing as peacekeeper. We need partnerships to show our best. You mean like Columbia, or Jimmy Carter and Hamas. No like Bill helping with the Tsunami. Just throw money at the problem and they will love us.

Rick Ballard

She likes to play Salome with Bubba as Herod - BHO gets to be John the Baptist.


This is a CNN crock! John Meacham's questions are really nauseating. I know, let's keep asking what God would do, as if he knows. As if the audience knows.

Good grief!


Does God want you to be president?

I could be glib and say we'll find out. I don't presume anything about God. Our mission should be on God's side. I've done that my whole life. I am motivated by helping other people. (What a crock - no one has ever been more motivated by self- interest)

I want to talk about the challenge of faith. We should not be complacent in our faith. For example I believe in the Woodstock Museum, and Norman Hsu.

The end of Hillary.


The Messaiah has arrived and I'm gonna go have a smoke and a cocktail! See you all in little bit.


The elitist ambles on stage. Now Obama, we will start with a question from Reverend Wright.


Note that Hillary got 50 minutes. Will Obama get 70?

Your remarks MAY have come across as elitist. I've talked about this before. Religion is a bulwark when other things are going wrong. I wasn't being demeaning. I'm religious GD it!

I meant really nice things - like guns. We all love guns. That bitterness thing was about the big bad Bush government. Now I've clarified it - and those bad people purposefully misconstrued my hallowed words. I have done good works. I'm religious. It's politics that is bad. This is a distraction.

Hillary calling me an elitist is the same problem - she tears me done instead of lifting the country up. I'VE BEEN WORKING IN CHURCHES SINCE COLLEGE except when Reverend Wright said bad things. I was not there for that.

Does God intervene in history?

Yes, but it's too mysterious. So I try to be an instrument of his work even tho I have no clue what the mystery is about.

He's putting me to sleep.

National hispanic christian league. Re: Abortion. soft ball on abortion. Can we find common ground. we must acknowledge a moral dimension to abortion. People of good will can differ. we have made progress reducing teen pregnancies. we need a comprehensive approach, focus on abstinence - oh I bet not. Give kids condoms in school. Applause.

Do you believe life begins at conception? If not,when does it begin.

I haven't decided. I've spend all my waking hours in church, but this never came up. There should be weight given the issue of life.

Is assisted suicide okay? (Did he listen to all these questions before). we must have living wills. It's a family and doctor decision, but not the doctor. Give them medicine. But it needs to be highly regulated. I'm gonna put John Edwards in charge of that.

Southern Baptist again: Back to AIDS. Oh I am so bored.


My comprehension skills are not great enough to type what these two arrogant elitists are saying.

Jane you rock!


I've been to Kenya multiple times, and I work with them, and we took AIDS tests - we were negative, the government hasn't gotten to us yet.

I blame Bush for all the good things.

We need to educate the whole world, give them condoms, and health care and free drugs. He's pretty annoying with that finger waving all the time. We have to empower women. Oh Pulease.

The man never says a thing.

You would not want your daughter punished with a baby. Can you explain that? Are these guys enough pro-Obama. The magic age is 12 or 13. That's a mistake.

DId God create the world in 6 days?

I believe God created the universe and the 6 days may not have 24 hours. Bored bored bored.


Obama believes in evolution. It's not incompatible. We should not get bogged down.

Watch his hands.

National association of evangelicals: HOw do you relate your faith to climate or stem cell. And once again I will say nothing about anything, but I will speak in lofty tones and make vast generalization. I think AL Gore won. We must take climate change seriously and my faith tells me to take an intergenerational view and make uncomfortable choices, none of which I will share with you, because I never say anything substantive.


Obama wants to leave the planet in tact for future generations! What a concept. He gets my vote.

Campbell previews the next question so Obama can come up with an answer in the break.

This is dismal.


Was that "Al Gore won" thing gratuitous or what? Even the audience took awhile to catch on that it was supposed to be an applause line.

I agree, Jane, this is dullsville. Your commentary is about five thousand times more interesting than their answers.


Since I missed alot of Hillary's questions, are they the same or different?


Dodge, duck, weave, obfuscate, lie, blame Bush, remind everyone Al Gore won....Sheesh, I need a drink.

The only thing great about this is Jane's snark.


The finger. Always the finger (index) slightly crooked with every answer.

Hmmm - what does that signify?



You beat me to it. :)


Doesn't matter what the questions were because the answers are the same....a big fat nothing.
This does make me realize how much I am going to miss President Bush, AGAIN.


Ahhh they named the college after Obama. How nice.

Let's talk about Jeremiah wright. HOw did he bring you to God?

Buy my book. Is Obama wearing a purple suit?

My mother was not religious because of segregation. Unlike my racist grandmother.

I joined the church when I got out of law school. He was not my spiritual advisor or my spiritual mentor - how long before someone finds him saying just the opposite. Now I don't agree with him on any of the offensive stuff. I made that great speech. So I'm off the hook on the Reverend Wright stuff - right Campbell?

How did your exposure to Islam shape you?
I went to Catholic school.

The brand of Islam in Indonesia was very tolerant and they had a secular constitution. It was not oppressive. Women were out? Huh?

Islam can be compatible with the modern world. And I will negotiate with them, so they will compat.

Rev. Jim Wallace from sojourners.

Let's talk about MLK and economic justice. Poverty rate in America is unchanged. One in 6 children are poor. We want a new committment like cutting poverty in half in 10 years.

Well first I'm going to raise the poor's tax rate from 10-15% so that should help. So don't you worry about a thing. I'm gonna raise everyone else's tax rate too, so more people can be poor. In fact I'm gonna make everyone poor, except me of course. My committment is with humility. Wages and incomes have gone down for the first time in history, or 1950, which ever came first.

Free taxi rides to job interviews, specific plans I can't utter here, cap and trade will make us millions. We will build windmills but not in Nantucket Sound of course. Oh and health care too.


Hmmm - what does that signify?

I don't know. I would like to see if his large feet are crooked, too.


Evangelicals for HUman Rights.

We are disturbed by the justice department and we use torture and we are SHOCKED! SHOCKED! about that.

We do not torture. We pay the terrorists off. We let them attack us. We don't ask them for information. We invite them into the fold and give them healthcare. We love the terrorists. My position will be clear when I come to it. We will lead with our values - any of you jihadists need an abortion?

Does religion have too much influence?

It's a false debate. Does this mean we can have Christmas trees Obama? Pretty please? Okay I used that one already. Sorry. You can have a religion and you can actually describe your religion without being shot, in an Obama administration.

Centralcal - some questions were the same and some different.

Finally. The end


I don't know one more thing about Obama or Hillary that I knew before this started.


I tuned in just in time to catch one question and "answer" by Obama. It turns out that there are some people, primarily in the Republican Party, who believe there should be no line between Church and State.

Yeah, that's a fair characterization, isn't it?


John McCain was so right about not attending this forum. He would have been booed off the stage.

Candy Crowley (sp) just said that she is so proud that the Democrats have come so far in discussing faith. That's the headline for tomorrow: "Democrats believe in God".


" We will lead with our values - any of you jihadists need an abortion?"

Jane, I have to hand it to you, that was some of your best blogging, ever. Noone could keep up with that, Kudos!!!


It was an exercise in pandering, nothing more. And CNN sucks.


Too true, Jane.


Thanks, Jane. You made an otherwise worthless stretch of television worthwhile.

Bill in AZ

Went for a long bike ride today (it finally warmed up here, tried to snow last Wednesday, though it prolly would have been a warm snow, global warming and all), and I couldn't get this latest Brok stupidity out of my head. Well, both of them - the pie thing and the 25 years of no jobs. Now, I can't imagine anyone sitting and hugging their knees, rocking back and forth for 25 years waiting for jobs to show up again - but then, maybe libs are capable of just that. Capitalists would just "make MO pies"

So... the proposed debate question from a few threads ago was rolling around in my head:

Does your economic thinking identify more closely with Adam Smith or Karl Marx?

I took a brief stab at it the other day, but I'm going to do some "pre-debate live blogging".

Moderator Brit Hume: Does your economic thinking identify more closely with Adam Smith or Karl Marx?

Obama: uh... well... uh, you see, there is this pie... and the haves stole (thanks Rick) 3/4 of it, but I am Obama, and we will tax the haves for 7/8 of the pie and everyone will have pie.


Next debate:
Moderator Chris Matthews (Exact same question, but done with crayons and butcher paper): Senator McCain, see, we have this pie, and the haves stole 3/4 of it... how do you make things right for the havenots?

Senator McCain: Uh, is this a stupid trick question? You make more pie. If you make 3 more pies, the havenots have one whole pie to do whatever they want with it.

Audience: rumble, rumble, wha??? bu..bu.. but there's only one pie!

Senator Obama: I'm Senator Obama, and we will tax the evil corporatists 7/8 of every pie.

audience: whohoo, swooning, fainting, cheering, Brok! Brok! Brok! "the Obamessiah spoke!"

Chrissy: pounding the podium: Now, Senator Obama, I have a followup question: Every time in history when socialists started to improve the world, and taxed 7/8ths of the pie, the stupid capitalists whine and quit making pies and grumble there is nothing in it for them - as if they were entitled. Now, you wouldn't add evil capitalists to your entitlement programs - would you? And how would you ensure evil capitalists would continue to make a pie?

Senator Obama: Certainly not - no entitlements to evil capitalist pie makers - as if.
Now, Chrissy, you know that I am the candidate of hope and changiness. It's really simple to keep the evil capitalist pie makers making a pie. My buddy Hugo is doing this right now with great results. Since I am the candidate of change, I just change my shoes to jackboots, nationalize all of the evil pie corporations, and simply order the evil capitalists to make another pie. Simple, really.

audience: wild cheers, swooning, fainting, more Brok! Brok! Brok! "the ObamaMessiah has spoken - again"

Chrissy: "Lordy, I feel more tinkling going down my leg..."


Good one Bill! Mo Pie indeed.

I love the Brok! Brok! Brok!. Makes him sound like an alien which I think he is.

Barney Frank

The finger. Always the finger (index) slightly crooked with every answer.

Hmmm - what does that signify?

That he can't use the one he really wants until after he's elected?


Jane, outstanding, your best yet.

How you can stand to watch...


Great job Jane and Ann.

I am sure I would have lost my meal watching that exercise.

I am not sure which was more nauseating-the questions or the answers.

M. Simon

Jane, Ann, et. al.

Hilarious. On the floor Hilarious.

What we have before us today ladies and gentlemen is not an election. It is a comedy show.

Disagreement the Ds can handle. Ridicule? Fork 'em. They are done.



Thank you, livebloggers.

That was a terrific read. Bravissima, Jane.


The typo, in an article on the upcoming vice presidential picks due from McCain and Barack Obama and written by one of the top AP political scribes, Nedra Pickler, was soon corrected but can still be found viewed via Google at numerous news sites early this morning.


Welcome to our game world, my friend asks me to buy some Hellgate London gold .

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