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November 21, 2008



This is getting bizarre.


Benen features Hilzoy. That's enough for me.


McCain--Shadow president?


Good. General Jones is nobody's yes-man.

May the moonbats be as dismayed as I am pleased with this choice.


So, he's the head of the 'NATO War' spies? He did a bad job with the Harvard PC NGO spy thing(s). Did he have Shays send all that USAID CIA spy money to pals?

The Jones review was pretty good. It was smart how he got all their social security checks. Like Obama with our foreign aid and mortgages.


Anyone who was paying the least bit of attention knew Obama was not going to surround himself with "yes men".


Jor, I'm paying attention and I still don't know what the Hell. I agree there are cental enigmas.


So, I'm still left with unexpected talent at managing diverse inputs. How long before it becomes obvious that Obama is the face?


Or it could be Rahm's face.


It will be very interesting to figure out what is going on. Too bad the press won't help us to understand this administration any better than they helped us to understand the last one.


It's not doe, it's families keeping government jobs and tax money in the family. Obama expects his thing to be President like Bill's wife got to be Congressman. These people are all rich from our tax money, not work.


How essentially clean, that comment. 'These people are all rich from our tax money, not work.'


All these appointments are starting to make sense now. Obama hasn't got the slightest clue how to govern, so he's reaching out to anyone that will say "Yes".



Anyone who was paying the least bit of attention knew Obama was not going to surround himself with "yes men".
Thanks for maintaining levity here. How could we possibly do without you?


I remember a Wall Street journal profile of Jones, about a year back, when he retired
and was working at the Chamber of Commerce
saying Rumsfeld had offered him CENTCOM, but
it would entail too much effort; so he turned it down, we were left with Esquire poster boy Admiral Fallon; who talked his way right out of a job; which made it possible for Petraeus to step in. His other
positions on the Arab Israeli conflict are equally nuanced ;nee wrong. We were lucky to have Petraeus who had refined his counter
insurgency experience at Ft. Leavenworth. We're probably out of this kind of luck for a while.

On another note, from the sublime to the moronic; the media doesn't fail to disappoint once again, when it comes to Sarah. From the 'turkey massacre' (you mean it's not plastic) to David Letterman's innuendos to Katie Couric, whose 5th place
ranking, hasn't given her the sense to really tell the truth (why start now)So the bumptious boob from Ball State, possibly after looking at the Bauer/Griffin catalog
admits that Sarah 'arouses' him. That gave
Katie, all sorts of unconfortable feelings. I mean she's supposed to be the perky one, dammit. Yet another "Mean Girls" scene come to life. You know there's possibly a thesis that has yet to be written on the topic I think that Late Show appearance has been indefinitely postponed; if it was ever on to begin with. Hey if Chris Matthews can get the 'tingle up his leg, and Keith Olberman. . .Sarah's combination of beauty, brains, and self confidence, on display in the various interviews, and at the RGA conference is something they have yet to really zero in on. When they do, as Carney, Stein, Ruedrich,Renkes Murkowski, found out; they'll be in the rear view mirror.


I think the answer is "vitality", narciso, and there doesn't seem to be enough of it in the big three studios.


OK, because I need to clean up some comments as much as I need to hide some others, here's a successor to the troll blocker.

I give you: The narcisolator. It's amazing how much more readable narciso is without the
tags and the semicolons.


Ha! The 'br' tag showed up fine in the preview, properly escaped and everything.


Anyone who was paying the least bit of attention knew Obama was not going to surround himself with "yes men".

Yeah, he's not smart enough. Somebodies got to drive.


Whew! Thanks for the OpenLeft update. I was afraid the sinistros were all asleep at the switch or something. Wouldn't want to think that Obama could so easily pull the wool over their eyes. No sirree.


The Who's, "Meet the new boss... Same as the old boss" but in a good, non-sarcastic way.


I don't quite know how to take that, does it work like Babelfish? Whole lot of trolls
out there though, actually nazguls and orukhai orcs, On "Turkeygate" one is reminded that one of the commentators linked on Tim Blair's blog, The LA Time's Elizabeth Sneed ( The Chandlers are doing 150 rpms in their graves) previously made a fool of her self when whe mistook the cracked open shotgun on the 1st Newsweek cover as a threat;( Palintology, get it's a dinosaur term, and she doesn't believe in them; ha ha) and the commenters let her have it with both barrels; metaphorically speaking. Yes, you're right, vitality is the thing about Sarah, that is hard to quantify. It's why she drew so many crowds
to her; as if she was the lead candidate.
along with her message of prosperity, security, energy independence. It seems even Begich is following her lead for the time being. It is rooted in her family and her faith, which keeps her grounded, when others wilt in the spotlight; re the sheepish Republican governors last week. It is wholesome, girl next door, unlike Dave's more unsavory implications, and some of the
outright bizarre impressions of the last campaign; Gary Kamiya's 'dominatrix, Erica
Jong's incipient riots, Naomi Wolf's true walk out to "where the trains don't run"

Thomas Jackson

I'm not impressed. What will impress me is Obama not taking defeat from the jaws of victory in Iraq. It will impress me if he doesn't reduce the US nuclear arsenal or cut defense spending.

I could care if the every member of the JCS were enlisted as his staff if he follows his promises to disarm the US military.

The guy who offers advice is no better than my mother in law whispering in my ear about what is the best power saw to buy.

peter jackson

Ah, Chris Bowers tears of frustration are like delicious candy on my tongue. Thanks for that sweet, sweet link.


Lets see........Is this the Obama administration, the third term of the Clinton administration, or is this the stealth administration of John McCain.........just not certain with all the picks that "O" is making.

JM Hanes

I sure hope its Jones, because if it's Zinni, per Salon's list, the world is in real trouble.



If you can't see your way through this labyrinth, what hope is there for the rest of us?

Mwalimu Daudi

All of the hooplah over Jones's possible appointment misses one disconcerting fact - the Messiah is still the President. And the Messiah is a Grade-A moron who thinks Janet Napolitano is a swell choice for Homeland Security.

Don't underestimate the ability of the Lightworker-in-Chief to make a fool of Himself - and anyone dumb enough to work in His administration.

Soylent Red

Man...that narcisolator makes all the difference in the world.


JM Hanes-

I'm looking around the net to see if Gen. Jones might have been a lower ranking staffer when the US picked up the Oslo Accords (one would think that failure would have tossed in the trash after seeing the cheering crowds in the West Bank on 911). Makes some since he might be because Emmanual was also a big believer in the process and might have seen him work. Can't really say much though, his tenure at NATO from 2003-2006 saw Europe weasle out of their committments in Afghanistan and a French push for greater EU interference in European and NATO defense policy. He seems to have agreed with Rumsfeld though regarding US defense posture in Europe and pushed to have US forces moved East and into SW Asia. A curious pick (and I'm thankful that Susan Rice didn't get the slot and worried where he's going to put her).


Rich, Susan Rice, shadow government


Susan Rice scares the shit out of me.


Susan Rice scares the shit out of me.

I think Susan Rice must come in the Soros President Creator Kit™. She was on Kerry's team too.

Cecil Turner

THAT'S MORE LIKE IT! Whinging we can believe in at Open Left.

Heh. This bit is priceless:

At least two of them, Gates and Napolitano, opposed withdrawing troops as recently as 2007 (although the new agreement with Iraq has rendered that debate moot).
The "new agreement," eh? Winning the war was just window-dressing, I'm sure (and whatever we do, let's not admit it happened).

On the main event, I don't know Jones at all (despite his being Commandant when I retired), and his career pattern appears a bit more political than I'd like. Still, I have a hard time believing we (i.e., hawkish conservatives) could do much better at NSC under an Obama administration. (I admit pro-jarhead bias, however.)


I don't quite know how to take that, does it work like Babelfish?
Sort of, and I really didn't mean offense. Your comments are just much easier to read without the extra line breaks.

Winning the war was just window-dressing, I'm sure (and whatever we do, let's not admit it happened).
Admit it? We're celebrating it.

Soylent Red

Still, I have a hard time believing we (i.e., hawkish conservatives) could do much better at NSC under an Obama administration. (I admit pro-jarhead bias, however.)


I obviously have no jarhead bias and I am feeling optimistic about this pick. USMC seems to be the least politically inclined of the branches, and I have never met a marine field grade or above who was not at an 80% or better common sense factor.

Having said that, Obama is still gonna be the boss.

Cecil Turner

I have never met a marine field grade or above who was not at an 80% or better common sense factor.

I've met more of the subject group, apparently. But I agree it's not a place where impractical types tend to prosper. And I think your bottom line is in fact the bottom line.

JM Hanes


As a layman, I'm feeling pretty good on the international front myself. Hillary can be pretty hard nosed about American interests (while simultaneously telling folks abroad what they want to hear), and taking her out of the universal healthcare arena domestically is a plus. Jones as NSA, and (hopefully) Gates staying on at Defense are about as good as any appointments McCain might have made, don't you think? Not a bad place for mentor/father figure types! I'd be interested in hearing what the Jones/Petraeus chemistry looks like though. Afghanistan is a real NATO testing ground, and the results so far are discouraging.

I'm not overjoyed by the idea of Holder at DoJ, but at this point I'm most concerned about who gets the education slot.

JM Hanes

Not to ignore the looming disaster that Daschle at HHS represents should his rumored appointment come to pass!



Thanks for that. I love Narciso posts but had to do the line breaks in my head. I had installed Greasemonkey but didn't know how to make it work and now it does! For trolls too, I guess.

Cecil Turner

Jones as NSA, and (hopefully) Gates staying on at Defense are about as good as any appointments McCain might have made, don't you think?

I'm no fan of Gates (and I don't support intel types running OSD, as they are generally clueless and impractical about actual military operations). Still, there is something to be said for continuity, and he appears to be growing into the job. Dunno if Jones is the best choice for NSC, either, but in both cases it's far better than I expected from Obama.

And on the political side (Hillary), I'm not truly worried that they will intentionally torpedo US national interests, but that they will ride their wrong-headed approach to national security into a losing war (as Post-FDR Democrats are wont to do).


I'm not overjoyed by the idea of Holder at DoJ
I hope Obama screws up and sends the foreign policy and Treasury nominees through first. He probably won't.

I'd like to see the Republicans get a chance to say, "see how bipartisan we're being? We approved his picks for State, and Treasury, and NSA." That gives us some credibility with Muddle types to say Justice, HHS, and (probably) Education are too left.

Probably instead he'll start with the First Ever Black Attorney General in History, First Ever HHS Sec from South Dakota, and some Ayers puppet for Ed, get them approved by better than party-line votes, and then he gets the storyline of, "bitter-ender conservatives have been beaten into submission, and are unable to offer resistance to Obama's genius picks for State, NSA, etc."


Iraq Warns Against Early US Pullout.

Which is weird, because I thought they were united in loathing us.

This must be one of those guys in the puppet occupation government, not one of the brave patriots who had such kind words for Obama.


So far, national security gives me more warm and fuzzies about the course they will take. Iraq can now be admitted to have been a success, and resources can be shifted more towards Afghanistan, Somalia, etc. O may even keep Gates around for a while.

Daschle and Holder concern me; especially Daschle. He's a known scumbucket. Geithner's possible appointment obviously has had an effect on Wall Street.So far, Obama's batting a respectable .400 - .500 at least.

I'm much more worried now about the loons in Congress. Giving free reign to some of these dingbats is scary.

We will see closer to January 20 what surprises Obama has for us, but so far, I am still willing to listen. It's not the unmitigated disaster we have been afraid of (yet). We can disagree honestly and respectfully.

hit and run

So far, Obama's batting a respectable .400 - .500 at least.

Perhaps a baseball metaphor isn't apt here, .400 is phenomenal and .500 is unheard of.

Though, of course, .400 - .500 is more than respectable for what we may have predicted for Obama.

So maybe...

Obama is hitting free throws at a respectable-for-Shaq clip...

Just throwing out ideas.


good point, hit....or maybe he kicked a field goal after a 90 yard drive or something...it's not as bad as we had feared, so far....

JM Hanes

How about he hasn't actually screwed the landing before the take-off? Maybe the fact that he can't afford to be seen with most of his old friends is not such a bad thing after all.

JM Hanes

"Still, there is something to be said for continuity, and he appears to be growing into the job."

He did make me a little nervous at the beginning. Looking back, I wonder if perhaps he saw the political wisdom of establishing himself as his own man, not just window dressing on a Bush/Rumsfeld DoD -- maybe even made being given the maneuvering room to do it a condition of accepting the post. He has undercut the Prez from time to time, but he does seem to be in relatively tranquil/effective control of his department, don't you think?


Obama is hitting free throws at a respectable-for-Shaq clip...
Oh, sure. The white Presidents get the baseball metaphors, but for the black President it has to be basketball. Where - surprise! - the standards are higher.

Angie Smith

I can go along with Jones as National Security Advisor since he doesn't appear to be a "yes" man. I'm glad Wes Clark wasn't chosen--I wouldn't trust anyone who is on the board of George Soros' International Crisis Group and his band of illuminatis, but my concerns are about Daschle. I thought when he wasn't re-elected I had heard the last of that moron!

JM Hanes


Thankfully, it seems that virtually everybody is over Wesley Clark! I'm not thrilled to see Daschle back in town, but I do find it preversely amusing that Harry Reid actually manages to make his predecessor look animated.


Blackhawk has this about General Jones:

"General James L. Jones is widely rumored to be Obama’s preferred candidate to be White House National Security Adviser... Jones prepared a report on Israel’s policies in the territories... The World Tribune said it “blasted Israel’s role” for “hampering the movement of PA forces, blocking plans for weapons shipments and technology to the Palestinians and resisting coordination.” ... Obama said this about Jones: “Let me tell you who I associate with... If I’m interested in figuring out my foreign policy, I associate myself with my running mate, Joe Biden or with Dick Lugar...or General Jim Jones, the former supreme allied commander of NATO.”


Its over Iraq wants out!
Iraq: Iranian detained by US has been released
Associated Press Writer
Posted: Saturday, Nov. 22, 2008
BAGHDAD An Iranian detained by U.S. forces at the Baghdad airport has been released, the Iraqi government said Saturday.

The U.S. military said earlier this week that it suspected the man was a senior member of Iran's Revolutionary Guards' elite Quds force, which it suspects of funneling weapons into Iraq.

But Deputy Foreign Minister Labid Abbawi said the Iranian was released Friday.

"We contacted the Americans and asked them to release him because his presence in Iraq is legitimate," Abbawi said.

The U.S. military declined to comment on the release, referring questions to the Iraqi government.

In an earlier statement, it said the Iranian was using a job building and repairing religious sites in Iraq as cover to smuggle weapons into Iraq. He was detained Tuesday at the Baghdad International Airport while trying to leave the country, according to the statement


The notes of surprise on this board remind me once again of what children right-wingers are. I guess you all really expected William Ayers to be named secretary of defense, right? You actually believed all of your own BS. The right wing is paranoid, impulsive, immature... it is such a relief and a joy to have an executive branch populated with people who value rationality, deliberation, pragmatism, and judgment over the half-baked emotionalism and ideology of the past 8 years. Really. I hope some of you stop sucking your thumbs and realize that Obama isn't going to swoop in and kill your fetus and snatch your handgun while doing a muslim witchcraft dance. I'll give any fool a chance to learn.


Actually, frango, it appears to me and almost ewvery honest person that hamsher and kos were the suckers. We considered him an opportunistic cipher.


Yeah ha ha ha, Kos was a sucker. Ha ha ha, what a dummy whose stated goal is to increase democrat majorities and who supports conservative democrats in places like colorado so that the majority increases. What a sucker! Now that Democrats are in the majority and have a chance to pretty much crush the right wing for a generation if they pass health care legislation that works, I'm sure Kos is crying in bed right now.

Ha ha, Obama has gotten away with the farm, that opportunistic cipher! It's all more of the same except it's completely different and only more of the same if you erase the past decade from history. He's such a cipher, appointing people with government experience to run the government! I bet the left-wing netroots and peaceniks are just steamed! Which is why right wing blogs have to post about this non-existent steamed-ness. Because it's all gotten so steamy, what with that hopey-changey turncoat blowout election winner in office, with his competent management decisions and reassuring even-handedness and such.


Well, yes TNR is probably lying:
""He wasn't sanctioned," seethed Markos Moulitsas, founder of the Daily Kos. "And Senate Democrats trying to make that claim are dishonestly trying to cover up the extent of their betrayal of the American people's vote for change."

Given the intensity of blogger rage over Lieberman, one can understand how their defeat at the ends of their own party would lend itself to hyperbole, but when did the "American people" appoint Markos Moulitsas their spokesman? And while there are many ways to interpret the outcome of this year's presidential and congressional elections, that voters across the country wanted Joe Lieberman to be stripped of his committee chairmanship is not one of them.

Indeed, the only people who seemed to give a fig about Lieberman were the "Netroots." Along with abandoning Iraq to Iran and Al Qaeda, punishing the "traitor" Joe Lieberman was their paramount concern (know that in the minds of Netroots, Lieberman hasn't only committed treason against the Democratic Party; a quick perusal of the more popular liberal blogs will also find the words "Zionist" and "Likudnik" attached to his name). Most Americans probably recognize Lieberman as the guy who ran with Al Gore in 2000. But to the Netroots, Lieberman is an obsession, an individual who inspires mania. He is the worst thing possible: not only someone who disagrees with them about foreign policy, but a liberal who disagrees with them on foreign policy.

"No matter what Joe Lieberman does," wrote Jane Hamsher, proprietor of the popular liberal blog Firedoglake, "the people who are protecting him hate you much more than they hate him." The Netroots are all about hate; its denizens are incapable of seeing shades of gray. (And Ms. Hamsher knows a thing or two about hate, having doctored a photo of Joe Lieberman in blackface during his primary battle against Netroots favorite Ned Lamont two years ago.) "



Sorry, fs, except for the many obvious criminals, his choices don't make much sense. You are too genuflected to see what is going on.


jeez, fs, that is just what most of us like to hear . . . a rational discussion of where things stand now. snort. oh boy.

Have you ever tried cocktails to soothe the savage beast within?


Ah yes Kim-- when you lack strong analytic faculties, it can be hard to understand situations. I.e., if you're dumb, stuff can be hard to understand. Maybe don't try?


Oh, yeah, marvelous talent for analysis you are demonstrating.


Heh, I see you are just as analytic in a response to Byron York's DC Examiner article. Characteristic was your closer "Shut up".

Giles Kyser

I did not vote for our current President elect, but I am gratified and impressed with his selection of General Jones as candidate for his National Security Advisor. General Jones constitutes a superb choice as National Security Advisor. His experience as a military leader, combat veteran, international leader as the Supreme Allied Commander, Commandant of the Marine Corps, and as director of the Chamber of Commerce Institute for 21st Century Energy, round out a pedigree that also includes undergraduate studies at Georgetown and a degree in National Security Strategy from the National War College. I doubt one would find someone whose credentials include the breadth and depth of his practical and academic experience that exist with this fine man. Unlike some of the others mentioned as potential candidates for the position, General Jones also exhibits the qualities of a true gentlemen and diplomat whose ability to "gracefully wear power" place him squarely at the forefront among leaders the nation requires to restore its international standing while maintaining its influence. I personally watched General Jones in multiple venues develop instant rapport with every person he dealt with regardless of station or nationality, and take complex decisions that proved visionary in retrospect. He is one the people I've found most "comfortable in his skin" regardless of his position and possesses the temerity to question his seniors on decisions with which he disagrees. He is a man of integrity, unimpeachable intellect, and possesses moral courage that finds its foundation in a well developed ethical compass that served this country in multiple capacities for more than four decades. I challenge anyone to find the level of experience, measured intellect, and statesmanship resident in this man among the partisan politicals that typically find themselves asked to serve in such positions of responsibility. General Jones earned the confidence of a nation through action and steady application of excellence...not partisanship. He will do magnificently. I wish him fair winds and following seas.


Please do not hesitate to have wakfu kamas . It is funny.

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