Don't Point Fingers Unless Your Hands Are Clean

On the enhanced interrogation question, Rep. Pete Hoekstra would like to figure out what Nancy Pelosi knew and when she started lying about it.  He would also like Congress to clean its own House before riding off in pursuit of justice elsewhere:

Rep. Pete Hoekstra (Mich.), the top Republican on House Intelligence, in an interview Friday said the document proves that Pelosi knew waterboarding occurred but has denied is because of political pressure from the liberal base of her party.

“Clearly her left wing is outraged that waterboarding was used,” Hoekstra said. “The bottom line is she and her key staff, they all knew about it.”

Now that these documents have been released, Hoekstra is calling for additional CIA documents to be made public including some that he has read that provide a more complete account of what was discussed in lawmaker briefings.

He is also considering calling for congressional hearings on what members knew and when they knew it.

“I wouldn't have a problem with the intelligence committee or the Judiciary Committee having hearings on this,” he said. “If [House Judiciary Chairman] John Conyers [D-Mich.] wants to have hearings, they shouldn't call in the Department of Justice attorneys as their first witnesses. The first people that should be called in and held accountable ought to be Congress.”

Let's go.

Comments

[Joshua]

Andrew Sullivan has posted a few sentences noting the knowledge of Pelosi and Rockefeller (compared with several hundred posts attacking Bush/Cheney), but privately expresses the view that torture went against the Dems better nature and that they were "pressured by Bush/Cheney to go along.

[Steve C.]

I'm still waiting for Pelosi and Reid to pass a law defining waterboarding as torture.

The Repubilicans would not fiibuster it and I'm pretty sure the President would sign it.

[clarice]

"Let's go" HEH.

The hearing will take place right after the fourth of never.

[Danube of Thought]

I guess we're doomed to continue reading what Sullivan has to say, even though the poor man apparently has AIDS dementia syndrome. If he doesn't, then how come he doesn't release his medical records and clear the whole thing up?

[matt]

The corruption in Congress rivals ancient Rome. The Democrats, the Republicans, the dog catcher and the mailman all knew. They were expressly told it was the Agent Mustard in the study with the waterboard. At least the Republicans have been honest.

When do the lies and theft and abrogation of the law stop with the Democrats? When do we converge on Capitol Hill with the and tar and feathers?

[Danube of Thought]

I'm intrigued by the existence of the documents Hoekstra says provide further details. I'd like to get Ms. Pelosi under oath before those dox are released. (Sure, it's a "perjury trap," but what the hell?)

[centralcal]

LOL matt!

I can't remember which of the gals here had dibs on Hoekstra, but way to go!

[Mark]

This is one game of chicken I am not so sure Hoekstra wants played out. Because the implication here is that Congress is too dirty to run the show. And comparing Fitz versus the US Attorney Hearings, it would be a much safer exercise working this out in the HJC or SJC than with a special prosecutor. The House Sergeant-at-arms doesn't have anywhere to jail the contemptibles.

[Topsecretk9]

Maybee had dibs on Hoekstra I am pretty sure.

[peter]

The wheels under the bus go round and round. Caldera sacrificial lamb over Scare Force One Gate. LUN

[Topsecretk9]

Allah Punditblows the nutroots pathetic and hysterical attempts at pretending Demcrats didn't know and aren't lying out of the water

"Two defenses of Pelosi’s lies circulating in the nutrootsphere today, one dumber than the other.."

That's Wheeler for you, though.

[clarice]

Yes, DoT..HEH

Mark--Conyers will never hold such hearings..but, you know the way leaks just seem to appear everywhere I wouldn't be surprised if those docs just turn up..At least i am sure Rockefeller and Pelosi know there are more shoes ready to fall any moment now.

[Dave]

Caldera sacrificial lamb over Scare Force One Gate

Burying embarrassing news on a Friday afternoon.

[matt]

This is getting curiouser and curiouser. There are @ 6 people who can authorize AF-1 to leave the ground. For something like this it would have had to go to Emmanuel at least. And the Air Force types would not have made the mistake of just showing up over the Staten Island Ferry. They have common sense. More bullshit and coverup.

[Topsecretk9]

I have to say, this comment at Ace's on the Pelosi is a liar non-news is quite teh funny:

This surprises nobody who has paid attention.
Democrats and other stupid people hardest hit.

[Bill in AZ]

“Clearly her left wing is outraged that waterboarding was used,” Hoekstra said.

I don't think anyone really even cares, especially the left wing. This is just standard faux outrage for them - comes in a can.

This is disappearing as we speak:
"Wall Street pushes higher on better-than-expected jobs data"

Painting brown shoots green...

and,
Oh, look at the shiny thong in the sky:
"Warning: Sunspot cycle beginning to rise"
('cept it's not)

[Bill in AZ]

err... *thing*

[hit and run]

Tops:
Maybee had dibs on Hoekstra I am pretty sure.

I'm sure MayBee doesn't want this issue brought back up, and I feel terrible about having to do this, but in the interest of the truth...http://www.flickr.com/photos/59013527@N00/3470169957/>let's let Hoekstra answer that one.

[centralcal]

Thanks for that reminder Hit! I remember it now, JM Hanes did win!

[clarice]

Personally, I prefer shiny thong.

[Topsecretk9]

Heh hit.

[clarice]

Mickey Kaus does a real number on Elizabeth Edwards who certainly deserves it:
http://slate.com/blogs/blogs/kausfiles/archive/2009/05/08/st-elizabeth-more-than-an-enabler.aspx>What is it with these sociopaths?

[centralcal]

I read the Kaus piece early this morning, Clarice. Isn't it grand!

[hit and run]

Clarice:
I prefer shiny thong.

Hottest Typo EVAH!!!

[Danube of Thought]

I think I posted this on another thread, but anyway--why isn't the ACLU aggressively seeking the documents Hoekstra is referring to?

[clarice]

And I repeat my answer --why, indeed?

If the ACLU ever actually was for civil liberties it was a long time ago. Now they are Soros and jihadi running dogs.

[DrJ]

Hottest Typo EVAH!!!

Dear God please let this not have been seen perched atop Broom 1.

[Dave]

Posted by: clarice

Personally, I prefer shiny thong.

Photos?

[Dave]

Anybody got a hi-res copy of the release Scare Force One photo? Curious whether you can see Soros and King Abdullah in one of the windows.

[clarice]

Not on ME,Dave..

[pagar]

For something like this it would have had to go to Emmanuel at least.

IMO, they would never throw Emmanuel under the bus, he's one of the relief drivers.

[verner]

Joshua, this is the second time we've seen a petit morseau from you, before you vanish.

Do you have any inside scoop on Sully? Or is this all disinformation.

[Dave]

Oh, well.

It was worth a shot.

[daddy]

My problem with this particular discussion of Pelosi and Waterboarding is that the MSM will portray it to the public as if Pelosi just fell off the turnip truck yesterday, and that she was completely oblivious of the practice until 1 specific briefing that occurred in 2002, and it's a "he said-she said" scenario troll morons like Olberman can rope-a-dope till the crisis dies down.

Some decent reporter first needs to find out whether she is ever on record as saying when she learned that we waterboard our on troops in training. An awful lot of that training goes on in her state, California, so even though she is remarkably stupid, she ought to at least have been aware of that for 30 years or so, and there ought to be some sort of records on that of fact-finding visits to SERE school etc during all the Base closing discussions in California over the last decades. Simply make a phone call to San Diego Naval Air Station North Island and find that out. That background ought to be completely nailed down, so that the discussion starts with her sitting down in that 2002 EIT briefing with the undeniable foreknowledge that we already routinely waterboard our own troops, and have done so for 40 years.

That is the context her 2002 briefing needs to be viewed in. And with that as preface, then she needs to be grilled on this 2002 meeting. My guess is she didn't protest it and probably asked if it was tough enough for the reason that she already knew we routinely do it to our own troops.

She now pretends she wasn't briefed on waterboarding. Okay, then why get upset after finding out about it later if you already know we've waterboard our own troops for 40 years? And if she says it's because it was harsher than what we do in SERE school, then my question is where the hell did you first learn that it was harsher than SERE School if you claim you didn't learn it in your CIA Briefings, because nobody else is ever allowed to talk about it (The new Troll meme of the day by the way).

[clarice]

Ahem--some decent reporter would have blown the whistle on the corrupt deals she and her husband an=re involved in, This lie is just part and parcel of her whole life as a crook, daddy.

[Dave]

Steve C:I'm still waiting for Pelosi and Reid to pass a law defining waterboarding as torture.

[hit and run]

First the gay arab linguist http://blogs.dailymail.com/donsurber/2009/05/07/the-rainbow-rebellion/>Dan Choi, and now http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/2009/05/08/2009-05-08_white_house_aide_loses_job_over_manhattan_flyover_fiasco.html>Louis Caldera, sone of http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louis_Caldera>Mexican immigrants both on the receiving end of an Obama boot to the arse.

Why Does Obama Hate Oppressed Minorities?

[Topsecretk9]

She looks like she forgot that super special pancake make-up she is so fond of, doesn't she?

[bad]

AS's latest:

We should all reserve judgment on the specifics at this point, I suppose. But the emergence of the possibility of Pelosi's and Rockefeller's enmeshment in the torture program could have, to my mind, a salutary effect on the debate.

Responsibility for creating and perpetuating the torture program lies with Bush and Cheney - but if they brought in senior Democrats who did not complain or do all they could to stop it, then those Democrats bear some responsibility as well.

And that perhaps helps the case for accountability.

If the investigation includes the current Democratic speaker as a potential target, it can hardly be dismissed as partisan. And it isn't partisan. God knows I would prefer it if the president I supported in 2000 had not committed war crimes. God knows I wish people I respect had not found a way to ignore, defend or even praise thesm. But the truth is as it is. And we need to know all of it, in context, with time, with the chips falling as they may.

I went there so you don't have to.

[Captain Hate]

God knows I would prefer it if the president I supported in 2000 had not committed war crimes.

He didn't, you simple turd.

[Captain Hate]

Courtesy of Iowahawk @ AoS:

A STATEMENT FROM SPEAKER NANCY PELOSI

To Whom It May Concern:

In recent weeks I have stated that I was never briefed, nor had knowledge of, the use of so-called "enhanced interrogation techniques" on detainees by U.S. interrogators. Today, the Central Intelligence Agency released documents indicating they had briefed me on the use of these techniques in September 2002. I had no personal recollection of this meeting, so I asked my clerical staff to retrieve my meeting notes for the date in question.

After a thorough review of these notes, it appears I was unaware this meeting was with the Central Intelligence Agency. Instead I was under the impression that it was a coffee chat with the San Francisco Gay Men's Chorus. In their description of waterboarding, fuzzy caterpillars, etc., I simply assumed they were speaking of hot new Castro District trends in sexual foreplay. Had I known the real truth -- that these were the grim tools of a sadistic torture regime, beyond the worst imaginings of Mengele himself -- I would have strenuously objected, and would have never cheerfully told my briefers, "play safely!"

I am sorry for any confusion my earlier statements might have caused, and I hope this clarification puts the matter to rest. For future reference, inquiries regarding torture issues within the B&D community should be booked through my community outreach coordinator Julian Sanchez. All other torture-related issues should be directed to my National Security and Drag Queen Affairs Advisor, Lady Marmalade.

Sincerely,

Nancy Pelosi
Speaker of the House of Representatives

[Fresh Air]

Actual contents transcribed below:

May 7, 2009

Memo to WH Staff
From: David Axelrod
Re: Marching orders
VIA ELECTRONIC MAIL

IXNAY ORTURETAY ISCUSSIONDAY! ASMUSSENRAY OLLINGPAY NOTAY OINGAY ELLWAY. OROSAY ULLINGPAY OUTAY FROMAY AMPAIGNCAY.

I'm going off to my mustache appointment now. Until then, please consult Alinksy Rule No. 7. Please Twitter @chiccorrupt with any questions regarding the foregoing.

DA

[Fresh Air]

TS--

Nancy's neck has a strange resemblance to Clint Eastwood's.

[verner]

"If the investigation includes the current Democratic speaker as a potential target, it can hardly be dismissed as partisan. And it isn't partisan. God knows I would prefer it if the president I supported in 2000 had not committed war crimes. God knows I wish people I respect had not found a way to ignore, defend or even praise thesm. But the truth is as it is. And we need to know all of it, in context, with time, with the chips falling as they may."

Doesn't the boy know that the only reason they like him is because he's the token gay ex-conservative who used to like Bush? If he starts getting all up in Pelosi's face, well...

[maryrose]

President Bush did not commit war crimes. He and Cheney kept us safe for 7 years and the dems better pray to God that Obama does the same. We know Obama won"t pray for it because he is the first president to ignore The National Day of Prayer and celebrate quarto de Mayo instead. What a colossal doofus. Remember this is the same person who said people in Pennsylvania cling to their religion; it"s a pattern of his this disrespect for religion that's going to eventually bite him in the a@#

[JM Hanes]

hit: You are the VIMH!

daddy:

"My problem with this particular discussion of Pelosi and Waterboarding is that the MSM will portray it to the public as if Pelosi just fell off the turnip truck yesterday,"

What's strange is that this is all being presented as though it were "new" news. The first stories about this appeared ages, maybe even a couple of years, ago and an enterprising googler might actually be able to dig out more details. The only thing that's different is that the CIA itself is not letting the Dems bury the story.

It occurs to me that Jane Harman may have been the one who originally confirmed the briefings, which would certainly be a reason to attack her credibility now, when there's so much more at stake, no?

Given Panetta's political bona fides, it's also occurred to me that perhaps he's trying to preempt the issue with a report, vs. a document release -- a release which would also make for an awkward precedent where the Cheney request is concerned. Panetta did include a convenient disclaimer (preemtive cover again?) about possible inaccuracies in the underlying documents. He could conceivably be sounding a cautionary note to Dems about mounting a full scale hue & cry too.

It's Panetta's prominent involvement here that gives me pause about the CIA revenge meme. I'm reserving judgment on that one till damaging info starts leaking from the Agency,

[bad]

Marc Ambinder is excusing Pelosi, laying blame on "Bush muscle-flexing" and Pelosi's stupidity:

CIA officials and intelligence committee staff members will tell you that members rarely, if ever, object to anything in these briefings. Imagine the multiplier effect of 9/11, when most Democrats were intimidated by the muscle-flexing of the Bush Administration.

__________________________

But back in 2002, when more Americans (probably) supported those techniques than they do now (and most Americans support at least some of the EITs), and when Pelosi herself did not have the means or the legal knowledge to perform her own analysis of the legality of the techniques, and when the climate of dissent was quashed -- her reaction is understandable... maybe not, from our current perspective, excusable, although there is a range of opinion on that question.

LUN

Mistress Pelosi, the shrinking violet who lacks analytical skills....

[matt]

1 - What did she know and when did she know it?

2 - If the CIA releases the other memos, do we get to call them the Langley Papers?

[matt]

too funny, Captain!

[Captain Hate]

when the climate of dissent was quashed -- her reaction is understandable...

The Baltimore mafia princess, Freeda Corleone, was too used to just cooking the pasta and letting the family thugs and goombas get their way.

What a steaming pile. Maybe Ambinder is used to speaking to a bunch of clueless douches to whom you can claim victim status at the drop of a sex toy. What ever happened to the "courage of your convictions", assuming these tools have any convictions other than the pursuit of raw power.

[bad]

Interesting nuance from Ambinder. Maybee has speculated in the past that Obama releases his talking points through Ambinder.

[Mike Huggins]

Semanticleo??

[Captain Hate]

LOL, Ambinder's comments seem to originate from somebody with problematic gender identity so it could be either of those two.

[Charlie (Colorado)]

This is disappearing as we speak: "Wall Street pushes higher on better-than-expected jobs data"

??

On my planet the Dow gapped up about 100 points, dever dropped much below +50, and ended the day +168 and the week +300-something.

[glasater]

< img src="http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3366/3513408423_4424d77d81_o.jpg">

[Charlie (Colorado)]

IXNAY ORTURETAY ISCUSSIONDAY! ASMUSSENRAY OLLINGPAY NOTAY OINGAY ELLWAY. OROSAY ULLINGPAY OUTAY FROMAY AMPAIGNCAY.

Hey, you leave Elway out of this.

[glasater]

Well Dave--that didn't work:-) For the Air Force Won photo!!

[verner]

Bad, the ATLANTIC has it's snoot right up the High one's nether regions. The owner even has high class schmooze sessions with the likes of Rahm and the cream of jourondom.

I no longer pay one bit of attention to a word written in that rag. There are a multitude of writers on this blog that are much smarter and more entertaining than anything that they publish.

[Charlie (Colorado)]

Hmmm.

[centralcal]

Am I the only one noticing that for every Tapper post at Political Punch, there is a counter post from one Yunji de Nies, adoring and in full adulation mode for the Obamas?

Is that ABC's idea of fair and balanced?

[Charlie (Colorado)]

glasater, you needed to close the IMG tag. Either

<img src="..."/> or
<img src="..."></img>

[matt]

That is one piss poor publicity photo, and why did they fly 2 Alabama NG planes up specifically to take it?

There is information being withheld here.

[glasater]

Charlie--I think there was a space in there that shouldn't have been.

How did you do it?

[glasater]

Thanks Charlie--there was another way that showed closing the tag with but that didn't look right to me.

[Bill in AZ]

On my planet the Dow gapped up about 100 points, dever dropped much below +50, and ended the day +168 and the week +300-something.

Painting brown shoots green?

Underneath those rosy numbers tech has been dropping this week like I have been expecting it to for a while now based on things going on in the industry. It has lagged, has actually propped up the market for several months where everything else has been going into the toilet. Banks are the only thing disguising the tech drop today, and I doubt that will last.

[hit and run]

Captain:
What a steaming pile.

Amen. What Captain Hate said.

But I'll go ahead and take my turn as well.

Listen. If you go to great pains to give someone like Pelosi that much leeway because of some "climate of dissent" being quashed, which is nothing else but a purely selfish political consideration of protecting her ass, national security be damned -- but you can't give the Bush admin any leeway in the "climate of ground zero" laying in ashes, in what for President Bush was a purely national security desire to see the nation protected, because it is his first and foremost responsibility that he took seriously first and foremost, his own political considerations be damned knowing his ass would be left open to attack from the likes of Pelosi and the media -- then f'you and the turnip truck you just fell off of, which has a tail pipe you should be sucking.

[glasater]

should be--closed with " < / a >"

[clarice]

I heart Iowahawk..MMmm

Maryrose, Cinco de quarto.. not Quarto de Mayo..though you might make a lot of potato salad with that.

[Elliott]

I think cinco de quatro is his approach to the budget.

[PeterUK]

Aahhg! She shares a plastic surgeon with Michael Jackson.

[clarice]

Wasn't he the poseur complaining about how few Americans could speak a second language? Heh--all his pretenses are being exposed..

[hit and run]

Charlie:
Hey, you leave Elway out of this.

Pheh on Elway...http://justoneminute.typepad.com/main/2007/08/they-cant-mean-/comments/page/3/#comment-79480339>Elway's a dirty, dirty man

[clarice]

HEH--we really wanted to read that story again, Hit..NOT

[centralcal]

Well, I have looked at as many websites as I can to view the One Photo that was released.

There are varying resolution qualities at each of them to the One Photo.

Isn't it interesting that you can barely make out the Statue of Liberty in any of them?

What a great photo op! (Betcha they had to search long and hard to come up with one that had Lady Liberty actually in the photo.)

[Charlie (Colorado)]

Pheh on Elway...Elway's a dirty, dirty man

"At Duke, we teach people not to pee on their hands."

[Charlie (Colorado)]

glasater, it should look like this:

<img src="http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3366/3513408423_4424d77d81_o.jpg" alt="Look, they're cheering! I *think* they're cheering..."/>

The space doesn't matter, but you *must* either end it with a "/>", or include the whole closing tag so it looks like "...></img>".

The "alt" part is what you see if you're using a text only browser or screen reader, you aren't required to have it.

[Charlie (Colorado)]

There is information being withheld here.

Impossible. This is the Most Transparent Administration Evah.

[Captain Hate]

but you can't give the Bush admin any leeway in the "climate of ground zero" laying in ashes, in what for President Bush was a purely national security desire to see the nation protected, because it is his first and foremost responsibility that he took seriously first and foremost, his own political considerations be damned knowing his ass would be left open to attack from the likes of Pelosi and the media

Well stated, hit; the easy way out on this would've been the Slick method of lobbing a few Predators at targets (after going through all sorts of blah-blah to make sure an innocent in the vicinity, assuming anybody in the area could be so categorized, wouldn't be harmed) after which there would've been another major attack and people like Freda Corleone and Les Nessman Reid would've justifiably teed off on GWB for not doing more. Given that Freda and Les would be attacking either way, the best thing to do was the risky thing to do politically but best for the county's security even if we're a nation of ADD infested ingrates (at least 52%)

[hit and run]

Charlie:
"At Duke, we teach people not to pee on their hands."

Uh, ok, but what about Stanford?

BTW -- what do you think of Oracle's latest acquisition? (that's way off topic and it's just been on my mind...consider it rhetorical if you'd rather not go into it here)

[PeterUK]

"Nancy's neck has a strange resemblance to Clint Eastwood's".

Clint Eastwoods what?

[PD]

Wow. O'Reilly has on Nancy Skinner (a lib talk show host, I gather), who's making this argument: "Torture has never resulted in the end of a war."

Now *that's* moving the goalposts! A technique isn't useful or justified unless it ends a war.

[hit and run]

"Nancy's neck has a strange resemblance to Clint Eastwood's".

Clint Eastwoods what?

You know, normally that would give me nightmares.

But Clarice's shiny thong comment is now seared, seared in my memory, leaving no room for any unpleasant images.

[DrJ]

At Duke, we teach people not to pee on their hands.

As an aside, that's how you can tell a chemist from a biologist. A chemist washes his hands before, a biologist after.

[Elliott]

Uh, ok, but what about Stanford?

Unfortunately, I am able to inform you that you can find the answer on page 44 of Brush with the Law by Byrnes and Marquart by searching the book for the word "precarious." Not for the squeamish or anyone who plans to eat in the next 24 hours.

[Crew v1.0]

A recent headline at the NY Times discussed the issue of whether Pelosi knew of "Harsh Tactics" used in interrogations.

When the issue is what Pelosi knew and when she knew it, the subject is "harsh tactics." When the issue is what Bush and Cheney knew, the subject is a word that begins with a T and rhymes with Shmeborture.

[bad]

Excellent catch, crew!!

[Danube of Thought]

Darling Mrs. Danube recently read a book called "I Feel Bad About My Neck" by Nora Ephron. She enjoyed it, but because of Ms. Ephron's past connection with Carl Bernstein I took a pass on that one.

[clarice]

Well, I must say that on the pic of Nancy posted here, it does look like something's wrong with her neck--it's so out of proportion. (Maybe she's a python and swallowed someone though.)

[Danube of Thought]

Seen this? David Feherty, the CBS golf analyst, said this in a magazine article he wrote:

"From my own experience visiting the troops in the Middle East, I can tell you this, though: despite how the conflict has been portrayed by our glorious media, if you gave any U.S. soldier a gun with two bullets in it, and he found himself in an elevator with Nancy Pelosi, Harry Reid, and Osama bin Laden, there's a good chance that Nancy Pelosi would get shot twice, and Harry Reid and bin Laden would be strangled to death."

Given that CBS fired a golf guy for saying the greens at Augusta National looked like they'd been bikini-waxed, I'd say this guy may have a problem.

[clarice]

HEH--That is some quote DoT..

[Extraneus]

Deserving of a caption contest.

[hit and run]

Elliott:
Unfortunately, I am able to inform you that you can find the answer on page 44

Why does that not surprise me, coming from you, Encyclopedia Elliottanica...

Oh and, how's your boy doing?

Phil Mickelson is thankful he gets to play for two more days. He struggled with his putting most of the round and shot 1-under 71, making birdie on the last hole to make the cut on the number.

He joins Sergio and Padraig tied for 61st heading into the weekend.

[hit and run]

Holy moly, speaking of golf ... what a quote, DoT.

[Captain Hate]

Given that CBS fired a golf guy for saying the greens at Augusta National looked like they'd been bikini-waxed, I'd say this guy may have a problem.

Eh maybe not, DOT; CBS is as protective of the Masters as Yobama is of his embarrassing transcripts. Although they fill themselves with as much glory there as they do by having that witless hairball Couric do they're evening news, by having Jim Nantz do the breathless, oh-so gravitas laden announcing for it. Although better that for Nantzy boy than something fast moving like football, where he embarrassed himself last season by speculating on why a team didn't spike the ball to stop the clock when it was fourth down.

[hit and run]

http://www.dmagazine.com/2009/03/23/Welcome_Home_No_43.aspx>Feherty's Article

[Captain Hate]

their evening news

[hit and run]

(eh, scroll down to get to it)

[Charlie (Colorado)]

Hit, honestly, I'm happy to tlak about it but I don't know much about that anyone else doesn't, except that they're once again screwed up my ability tp get back to work there by once again freezing hires while the acquisition sorts out.

The word around the street is that it's either really smart of really really dumb, and that it either means Sun/Oracle will be a power player again or that Oracle is going to rape, strip and abandon Sun.

[hit and run]

I used to work for J.D. Edwards in Denver, but left before PeopleSoft bought them, before Oracle bought PeopleSoft.

I don't know anybody from my JDE days that still works for Oracle, but my circle has dimished considerably over the years.

I do have one old JDE friend that now works for Sun, she mentioned a big layoff (that didn't affect her) right before the Oracle announcement.

All of which to say that I know nothing of anything that's going on there -- I just watch headlines from a safe distance now. But I do follow it.

[narciso]

Isn't the real point that these folks in the 'reality based community' like Pelosi, a phrase that always struck me about as solidly as docudrama. don't notice the facts even when it's pointed out in front of them. Witness Andrew Sullivan, who has consistently and some would say even obscenely missed the point of the whole exercise. There was a brief moment in time, when even liberals with the possible exception of Barbara Lee, realized the threat we faced, and more importantly the possible backlash of the voters. That regretfully passed much too soon.

He must be spitting up pea soup today, because who's position did the administration end up affirming, wait for it, the Governor of Alaska, in her NY Times Op Ed, the one Katie Couric's researcher didn't bother to look up.