Ask A Stupid Rhetorical Question...

The heroic Dan Riehl reads Andrew Sullivan's latest paean to Obama's dithering on Afghanistan and raises a scientific proposition:

Sullivan is so far down in the tank, there can't be any oxygen down there.

Could be!  But skipping over to Sully we find, in the midst of his praise of Obama's resolute irresolution, a bit of nostalgic Bush-bashing:

His insistence that the civilian branch truly control policy there and that empire not be passively accepted as a fait accompli are real signs of strength in the struggle to recalibrate American foreign policy. Can you imagine Bush ever holding out like this on the military?

What can we imagine about Bush?  A toughie!  I can imagine his Secretary of Defense grinding down the initial military numbers for an invasion of Iraq until we arrive at "too few troops".  Bush sure ignored the hell out of the Pentagon then, and how did that work?

Or, I can imagine Bush promoting a surge in Iraq at a time when nearly everyone, including the Joint Chiefs of Staff, were ready to march in a different direction.  That worked a bit better.

Of course, totally missing from Sully's praise of Obama's current hand-wringing is a recognition of the fact that Obama announced a new strategy last March, and appointed McChrystal to implement it.  Was that haste and folly, and has Obama grown in office so that he now feels comfortable delaying endlessly (the Times now says a decision is more likely in December)?

Whatever - Sully initially did not approve of the March decision, but that did not reflect badly on Obama; a day later, Sully had rallied:

The war-aim does seem to be focused more minimally on al Qaeda (I suspect Obama would love to capture bin Laden) but with maximalist means - civilian, military, diplomatic, regional, Afghan, American. This is either a brilliant compromise or it will fall between two stools. Still, since I failed to predict the success of the surge, I don't really have much standing to warn of failure. The strategy also seems somewhat front-loaded. The Obamaites are going to join the battle this summer using somewhat different tactics and tools, see how they fare and regroup as winter approaches. Obama does have some off-ramps. My skepticism remains; but a chance to see if a smarter strategy - and a Pakistan-inclusive approach - works is not crazy.

Now Obama seems to be changing his mind to a closer alignment with Sully, so he is a Leader of Men.

MORE:  My opinion?  I don't know if we can win in Afghanistan in any circumstances, but we absolutely cannot win if the US President is not committed to victory.  And Obama is not - he is looking for some magic strategy that doesn't exist and fingering his "WWKD" (What Would Kennedy Do?) bracelet.

So - given the character of our leadership I would follow Tom Friedman, focus on transforming Iraq, and let Afghanistan slide.

Even that won't be easy for Team Obama because it requires a recognition that all his posturing about Iraq as a mistake and Afghanistan as "the good war" was just, well, posturing.  On the other hand, a quick concession of quasi-defeat in Afghanistan may embarrass Obama into fighting the war in Iraq we still can win.

BRUTAL:  Jules Crittenden is unrelenting.  A snippet:

One bright spot, in the Vietnam avoidance agenda. Remember how they accused LBJ of picking targets from the Oval Office? Can’t accuse Obama of that. He’s actively not picking targets from the Oval Office.

Comments

[Uncle BigBad]

Tom, why are you wasting time on Andrew Sullivan's blather?

[creepy dude]

Tom Maguire writing in the comment threads at Anonymous Liberal on May 24, 2007:

"If I were a Dem strategist contemplating the prospect of Barack Obama v. McCain, Giuliani or Thompson, I would blanche - a 46 year old with no discernible resume versus guys with something that looks like relevant experience?"

Still completely out to lunch.

[Charlie (Colorado)]

I have to admit that fisking Sullivan strikes me as shooting fish in barrel.

Creepy dude, I think Tom was just over-optimistic, and forgot the Mencken Maxim: that no one ever went wrong underestimating the intelligence of the American public.

[Gregory Koster]

Any Sullivan writing since 2008 can be explicated by remembering:

a) Sullivan is HIV-positive
b) this makes him ineligible for citizenship or even permanent residency
c) his final temporary visa expires in March 2011
d) Sullivan can write from anywhere in the world. But:
i) being kicked out of the US would inflict the same hurt on him that he's been trying to inflict on Sarah Palin
ii) Sullivan is now in full grovel-and-surrender mode, but the terrorists have longer memories than 2004. Besides, he's gay, which would convict him in their eyes all by itself.
e) The Once is the only thing standing between Sullivan and exile.

Hence the frenzied ass-kissing and toadying. It's already starting to pay off as a fellow swine shows us. Let The Once fail to lift his hand and Sullivan will spin 180 degrees again. With luck, he'll be doing so in Britain, where the cops are completely ineffectual in protecting the citizenry against radical Islamists. No wonder he's constantly foaming. Yet what better way for The Once to show contempt for this nation than to welcome Andy?

[Janet]

((a 46 year old with no discernible resume))

That is right on the money describing Obama. A perfect description of him actually.
Maybe add "teleprompter reader extraordinaire"

[bgates]

"ever went broke".

Creepy, TM's comment still works with some slight editing:

"As an American contemplating the prospect of Barack Obama, I blanche - a 46 year old with no discernible resume?"

[hit and run]

In May of 2007 everyone could think of no issue other than Iraq that would dominate the 2008 elections.

By October of 2008 Iraq was a distant memory in the minds of voters compared to the economy.

[creepy dude]

Charlie: blogs are old enough now that people have records and its all searchable!

(Including my own: I recently looked at my old comments on this site-pretty impressive if I ay so myself)

I can pull tons of Maguire was 100% wrong quotes. He'a almost Dick Morris like in his ability to give the 180 degree to reality view.

Not that I care that much, it just tempers posts like this one to know Maguire's analysis is virtually worthless.

[BelieveWatUwant]

There's oxygen. And, there' unhappiness with the results to the war on terror. T. Boone Pickens points out that oil field contracts in Iraq went to China. We got played for being Uncle Sugar. And, who knows how many soldiers have been injured, because there were muslims who shared secrets with the enemy? The military's been blind, deaf, and dumb. One of the results of the unhappiness was the TRIFECTA in the 2008 elections. No one, yet, steps up to the plate to take any responsibility.

[anduril]

I once had the experience of hearing Medved interview Sullivan on the radio. Pathetic individual.

[Janet]

Okay, who should I listen to? T. Maguire who describes Obama as "a 46 year old with no dicernible resume" or a poster that describes himself as "creepy dude"?

[MarkO]

When does Obama institute the draft? It's coming, you know.

[narciso]

Has Obama been right about anything
policywise, the surge, the stimulus, this wretched health care plan that would Hippocrates himself drink Hemlock, the shutering of nearly all domestic energy
production, the simple etiquette of addressing the nation, in the midst of a
cold blooded slaughter or Americans.

[Janet]

LUN is the article on Andrew Sullivan's marijuana bust. Another example of the double standard for law enforcement. Media and Democrats - all is forgiven. Conservatives - hang em.

[Gregory Koster]

But for what, MarkO? The services sworn to protect and defend the nation and its Constitution? Or the "civilian national security force" that The Once warbled was needed. Why? So the Left can make all the lurid fantasies it had about Geo. W. come true.

[anduril]

I'd say fisking Sullivan rates lower than fisking David Brooks, but not by much.

[Janet]

((Has Obama been right about anything))

...no narciso, he sure hasn't been.

[Thomas Collins]

See LUN (via Instapundit) for an interesting take on Obama's Dithering as Grand Strategy.

[anduril]

Where's Captain Hate? Isn't he the one who said Bush's responsibility for the housing led financial meltdown was just "opinion?" Well, here's a Steve Sailer blog that goes into some of the details, riffing off a Steve Pearlstein column: Rick Perlstein almost figured out the Mortgage Meltdown in 2007. It's all good, but the money paragraphs come at the end:

I wish I had read Perlstein's series earlier. Despite his insightfulness, Perlstein got zero traction with this line of argument.

One obvious problem was that he didn't present any direct evidence of Bush sending secret signals.

And yet, Perlstein didn't need to speculate about secret signals from the White House to federal regulators about backing off on enforcing credit standards and to mortgage lenders to Go For It. Instead, Bush's messages were sent in the form of Presidential Addresses.

Heck, Bush had an official mural painted to get his message across, presumably so that his point wouldn't be missed by even potential minority subprime borrowers who happened to be illiterate.

So, why didn't Perlstein simply quote Bush's speech from the October 15, 2002 White House Conference on Increasing Minority Homeownership in which Bush said down payment requirements were the chief barrier to adding 5.5 million minority homeowners to eradicate the racial gap in access to the American Dream?

Now you can see just how powerful was the juju that Bush and Rove were wielding. Here's Rick Perlstein, as fine a hater as you can want, and yet it's more important to him and his readers to denounce Republicans as racists than to denounce Republicans effectively. If Perlstein had tried to quote Bush's speech on "Increasing Minority Homeownership," his head would have exploded.

And here's a link to a Sailer blog, riffing of a WSJ article: WSJ: "Housing Push for Hispanics Spawns Wave of Foreclosures". Here's one paragraph out of many good ones:

If this had been merely a cynical re-election ploy by the Bush Adminstration, Bush could have pulled the plug on it the day after the November 2004 election. But, instead, this was a practically universal delusion among the Great and the Good. To Karl Rove, it was a permanent good idea that would bring about long-term realignment by making Hispanics into home-owning Republicans. To Democrats, it was pork for their constituents.

Ties right in to the DeLong article about the Special Interest State.

[Original MikeS]

I don't agree with the idea of easing up in Afghanistan. This asymmetrical war is not about crushing the enemy and signing a peace treaty. It's about eroding the enemy's support among the populace and his will to fight.

The McChrystal Plan aims to produce nearly 400 thousand highly trained Afghan forces in an 18 to 24 month time frame. That would seem to be the responsible thing to do. I doubt that the Taliban could defeat that amount of Afghan forces without the substantial support of the populace.

[clarice]

Did anyone mention this yet? via Lucianne re an AP article

The U.S. has filed suit to seize properties,
including mosques, belonging to groups with
alleged ties to Iran.

[clarice]

Has anyone raised this with Andrew yet?
Heh.Just like the pro-choicers, the Dems have thrown the gays under the bus.

http://legalinsurrection.blogspot.com/2009/11/did-dems-already-dodge-gay-activist.html>Next year in Utopia

[Rob Crawford]

I can pull tons of Maguire was 100% wrong quotes.

No doubt you think so.

*plonk*

[Sara (Pal2Pal)]

I'd be happy if our only mission in Afghanistan was to keep the Taliban from getting strong enough again to start enslaving women like they did before.

[Sara (Pal2Pal)]

Don't be so hard on TM. Remember that he is constantly under attack by those liberal CT babes and his thinking goes off from time to time. Hey, but that's why he has all of us. Right?

[Original MikeS]

I agree with you Sara. I think the total forces in Afghanistan now are about 200 thousand, with just over 100 thousand being Afghanis. McChrystal was critical of the capabilities of the multinational forces to work together, and emphasized the creation of forces with more sophisticated command and control.

My guess is that twice the present force levels would be a credible deterrent to the Taliban.

[Boatbuilder]

"Letting Afghanistan slide" is unfortunately not an option. Do you think it's going to go away? Do you think the Islamofascists will just plop themselves down in Kabul and confine themselves to enslaving and tormenting the locals? Do you think the rest of the world--the good, the bad, and the undecided--aren't watching this and waiting to see which way the wind will blow?
We've won in Iraq. If we abandon Afghanistan--a "quasi-defeat"--we will lose it back. And you can damn well bet that our enemies won't use the "quasi" modifier
to describe the result.

[Terry Gain]

So - given the character of our leadership I would follow Tom Friedman, focus on transforming Iraq, and let Afghanistan slide.

TM

Your lack of confidence in Obama is totally justified but with the greatest respect what reason is there to think that al Qaeda and the Taliban will stop at Afghanistan with Pakistan and its nukes next door? John Bolton doesn't think they will settle for Afghanistan and I agree with him.

It sucks when your enemy is prepared to fight for a hundred years.

Afghanistan is going to be extremely difficult to pacify but IMHO the choice here is between bad and infinitely worse.

[Terry Gain]

So - given the character of our leadership I would follow Tom Friedman, focus on transforming Iraq, and let Afghanistan slide.

TM

Your lack of confidence in Obama is totally justified but with the greatest respect what reason is there to think that al Qaeda and the Taliban will stop at Afghanistan with Pakistan and its nukes next door? John Bolton doesn't think they will settle for Afghanistan and I agree with him.

It sucks when your enemy is prepared to fight for a hundred years.

Afghanistan is going to be extremely difficult to pacify but IMHO the choice here is between bad and infinitely worse.

[Sara (Pal2Pal)]

FYI: I posted over on No Blood thread, Danny Harman's addition to the PUK musical bio with some very interesting info we did not have before. Plus the very young PUK in a pic Danny from Danny. I think my very fav I've seen.

We need to be nice to Danny, he has unreleased recordings of PUK in his vault.

[Sara (Pal2Pal)]

Vanderleun:

Afghanistan: The Failure to Plan Is "The Plan"

He paints a frightening picture.

[Sara (Pal2Pal)]

MikeS: I think we have somewhere between 60-68,000 troops in Afghanistan, not 100,000.

[Jane]

It sucks when your enemy is prepared to fight for a hundred years.

In the words of Hasan: "We want to die more than you want to live".

[Dave (in MA)]

"Afghanistan: The Failure to Plan Is "The Plan"

or is the Failure the Plan? See Indo-China, early 1970s.

[Original MikeS]

I may have been rounding too enthusiastically. Still 400 thousand Afghan troops with Western air support should make the next 100 years pretty depressing for the Taliban.

[Porchlight]

creepy dude,

Still completely out to lunch.

Please. The prediction turned out not to be true, but a lot of smart Dem strategists thought the same way up until Hillary lost the primary.

[Sue]

creepy dude,

What is wrong with what Tom said? They did blanche. Read Plouffe's book.

[anduril]

The McChrystal Plan aims to produce nearly 400 thousand highly trained Afghan forces in an 18 to 24 month time frame.

Uh-huh. And what's been going on for the last, what, eight years? Is this a new idea? Sounds like the old idea, only this time we really mean it. The reality is that that plan is unrealizable without a remake of Afghan culture that, IMO, is unrealistic.

For your reading pleasure, I recommend this Stanley Kurtz book review from the Weekly Standard:

I and My Brother Against My Cousin: Is Islam the best way to understand the war on terror? Tribalism may offer a clearer view of our enemies' motivations.

by Stanley Kurtz 04/14/2008, Volume 013, Issue 29

Culture and Conflict in the Middle East By Philip Carl Salzman

[anduril]

Via Steve Sailer:

From CNN:

A second former medical school colleague of Hasan said several people raised concerns about Hasan's overall competence.

Even though Hasan earned his medical degree and residency, some of his fellow students believed Hasan "didn't have the intellect" to be in the program and was not academically rigorous in his coursework.

Hasan "was not fit to be in the military, let alone in the mental health profession," this classmate told CNN. "No one in class would ever have referred a patient to him or trusted him with anything."

The first classmate echoed this sentiment.

Hasan was "coddled, accommodated and pushed through that masters of public health despite substandard performance," the classmate said. He was "put in the fellowship program because they didn't know what to do with him."

Remember when the military was showing the rest of society the way? Sure has gone to hell under Obama. We need to get some GOPers back in charge to straighten things out.

[Original MikeS]

And what's been going on for the last, what, eight years? Is this a new idea? Sounds like the old idea

I think the "old idea" was to produce 130 thousand Afgan police and soldiers. That is pretty close to what is there now.

No doubt it is hard to carry out any war plan. The McChrystal plan is attractive to me precisely because I do think we are in a 100 year war, whether we agree to participate or not. If that is true, a two year commitment to train more Afghan forces doesn't seem like a reckless proposal at all.

[puditius]

Andrew Sullivan is the National Enquirer of blogdom. Why does anyone in the blogosphere pay any attention to him after his absurd and creepy posts about Sarah Palin?

He's not even smart enough to be dumb. And don't even get started on "ethical."

[anduril]

IOW, the old plan succeeded and has brought us to the brink of failure. So we do more of the same. As for recklessness, a study of how much we've spent on our GWOT is instructive. Our personnel are stretched thin, our equipment is being degraded and our economy is in one helluva hole.

Maybe it's time to bite the bullet, partner up with some of the hoods in the hood and also reinvolve the warlords. Let the Afghans worry about democracy.

[anduril]

One takeaway from the Kurtz article that you speed-read is that military effectiveness is much more a function of culture than of raw numbers. And that's where tribalism enters the picture. Having our faces rubbed in that in Iraq was the only thing that has salvaged that situation for the time being, but don't try holding your breath on that, either.

[creepy dude]

Actually looking back I see Maguire was right about a lot too.

Not surprising. As a northeastern Republican, he probably started with a sound basis in reality.

I will always commend TM for having an open comment section. OTHOH it was his eventual undoing since he ended up catering to the rightwing cranky grandparent contingent.

Good luck and God bless TM. I'llsee you shortly before the 2010 elections to tell you what's actually happening!

[anduril]

What I meant about Iraq is this: what saved our asses for the time being was not the "surge" but arming the Sunni tribes against the ethnic cleansing of the Shiites. Well, the ethnic cleansing was almost complete anyway, no thanks to us. Happened under our noses. Now the Sunnis are armed and trained to the teeth. And the tribes are still the true power centers.

[creepy dude]

Porchlight and Sue, it's not the prediction part: it's the complete underestimation of Obama's method.

TM had no insight into how Obama could win an election, and this post shows he still lacks insight into how Obama could be doing the best thing among a range of unpalatable options.

Time for a new paradigm already.

[anduril]

Another expansion. Al Qaeda was unable to protect the Sunnis against Shiite ethnic cleansing--the Sunnis turned to us just as we were turning to them. We both needed each other. But all this has already passed. Such alliances come together and fall apart, but the tribes remain.

[Original MikeS]

Maybe it's time to bite the bullet

Nope! Not time yet.

[Ann]

Have you guys seen this photo? It reminds me of Ibama on the bus given out stimulus funds and health care to all his rabid followers.

Clarice, I think the gay racoons either are under the bus or quit coming Out.

Bus Driver feeds racoons at #18 46th Ave bus in San Francisco.

[Jane]

he still lacks insight into how Obama could be doing the best thing among a range of unpalatable options.

The idea that "Obama could be doing the best" thing is truly the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard on this blog.

Try cutting taxes and stop spending us into the grave. Unless of course your idea of the best thing is 17% unemployment and a completely bankrupt economy.

It's no wonder you call yourself "creepy dude". If you think Obama is doing anything right, I question your motives.

[creepy dude]

Anduril is talking sense. The surge in Iraq worked. Yep. And we kicked ass during the Tet offensive, and all we got to show for it was a wall in DC.

The Soviets couldn't pacify Afghanistan and they were killing children with booby trapped toys.

History.It's not just for kids.

[Porchlight]

I'llsee you shortly before the 2010 elections to tell you what's actually happening!

LOL. Looking forward to that.

And yes, TM most likely underestimated Obama's campaign managers' skills at primary thuggery and illegal campaign financing, to be sure.

Time for a new paradigm already.

We've been waiting for 10 months now.

[Ann]

Here is another:

Do Racoons eat Acorns? Just a thought. :)

[creepy dude]

Jane, it's going to be long seven years and two months for you sweety.

Better go one of those Bush motivational seminars to keep your spirit up.

[creepy dude]

P.S. I realize you only read right wing blogs and hence know, well, not much, but Obama did the largest ant-terror asset seizure in history today.

[narciso]

I think the Salafi that they invited into their midst, probably had more to do with it then the Shia. AQ certainly sought to trigger a 'Civil War', in part because we were hunkered down in those massive bases,
while all hell was breaking loose. The SRM
for the large part missed the 'Anbar Awakening'.

[Terry Gain]

The Soviets couldn't pacify Afghanistan and they were killing children with booby trapped toys. History.It's not just for kids.

And it's certainly not for anyone stupid enough to believe deliberately killing children is a winning strategy.

anduril

Al Qaeda tried to impose it's will on the Sunni's in Anbar. This was the main reason for the Anbar Awakening which began long before it was reported in the American media. Bill Roggio reported in 2005 that Sunni brigades were fighting al Qaeda in Anbar.

[Dave (in MA)]

Obama did the largest ant-terror asset seizure in history today

He took away Ayers' Dreams from My Father royalties?

[Rob Crawford]

Time for a new paradigm already.

Most. Vacuous. Statement. Ever.

[creepy dude]

Ok, Terry, just keep killing their parents only and get back to me in another 8 years.

[bgates]

we kicked ass during the Tet offensive

Your side lost that engagement.

[creepy dude]

Crawford, that's a teabagger quote!

[bgates]

just keep killing their parents

Are we imposing the Obama/Pelosi plan on Afghanistan, too?

[creepy dude]

Good one bgates.

[Jane]

Jane, it's going to be long seven years and two months for you sweety.

Wow - you already have plans for stealing 2012? Do you really think America is as stupid as you?

Fool them once and all that.

BTW, didn't you say tata about 20 posts ago? A creepy dude of your word I see.

(This is when I miss PUK the most)

[clarice]

I'm getting out my pistolas..

[bgates]

Creepy, what do you think reflects worst on Obama - dithering during the war, the gigantic deficits, the utter failure of the stimulus, the 30-year high in unemployment, the pointless alienation of allies, the numerous lunatics and petty criminals appointed to important positions, or the bullying of small friendly democracies?

[creepy dude]

I said bye to TM Jane. I'm free to torment you mouthbreathers until the guy finishes delivering the pizza in the video playing in the other window.

Meanwhile, don't even make me laugh with 2012. You're delusional.

[Terry Gain]

Why would I bother with some anonymous person who pretends we're intentionally killing anyone but Islamists who are killing innocent men, women and children. Something tells me you wrote off the mission in Iraq in the third week of March 2003, if not before.

[bgates]

Obama did the largest ant-terror asset seizure in history today

Bigger than the total asset base of Iraq and Afghanistan combined?

[daddy]

Todays China">http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2009-11/13/content_8961615.htm">China Daily Newspaper has a few long stories on a massive Winter Storm. The print version in a sub headline says "Some places in Hebei and Shanxi experienced the most severe snowfall in history--Hundreds of thousands stranded, students die as Canteens collapse."

Haven't seen that on Drudge etc, but fully expect that this bit of Global Cooling will be covered by the traveling MSM corps when The Prez visits China in the coming days to discuss Global Warming.

[bgates]

don't even make me laugh with 2012

We won't. We'll make you cry with 2010, though.

[creepy dude]

Hold on. This is a good part of the video.

BRB

[clarice]

daddy, How nice to hear from you wherever you are. I miss not seeing Louth any more in the locations on the site meter. But when I see an exotic location in Asia I know you are there and with us.

[Melinda Romanoff]

An asset grab from Iran is a bit of low hanging fruit. The Chicago team is very familiar with asset grabs, just so long as they're domestic in locale. Ooooh, they flexed their legal muscles.

I'm in awe, just as you must be. Such heavy lifting for such a big man, dude.

[Original MikeS]

largest ant-terror asset seizure in history

Gotta love that Patriot Act!

[Sara (Pal2Pal)]

John Edwards $400 Haircut Tip Came From Obama Campaign.

[clarice]

Where are those bullets? They were here just a ,minute ago...

[Melinda Romanoff]

Back to the game.

G'night all.

[narciso]

So Obama is inheriting the Al Gore
blizzarding skills, on his way to Tokyo and Beijing. I wonder how the Chinese hide their
contempt for him and Geitner with a straight
face, he is afterall devaluing their investment

[Dave (in MA)]

on his way to Tokyo and Beijing

Chi-Com visits the Chi-Coms.

[clarice]

They have only themselves to blame. Instead of funneling all that illegal campaign finance money to Dems...........

[Sara (Pal2Pal)]

Obama manages to insult every world leader he comes in contact with in one way or the other. What will happen with the Chinese who put so much stock in "face?"

[Terry Gain]

Back to the game

More scores here.

[Sara (Pal2Pal)]

Oh great, breaking news: They just blew up the Pakistani spy agency. 7 dead.

[daddy]

I'm with Comrade Creepy Dude on this. Today's China Daily says that the Chinese are very pleased that President Obama is ">http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2009-11/13/content_8961691.htm"> acting just like Abraham Lincoln would have acted by refusing to meet that Tyrant, The Dalai Lama. Lincoln was a Republican President, so since Obama's acting just like him, that must mean that it's we mouthbreathers who have strayed from the path of Freedom and Human Dignity, and it's Obama who's picked up the banner of tradional Republicanism. And the dissing of the Dalai's earning America praise from all the ususal suspects, so it must be a good thing, right?

Elsewhere Obama is also cautioned by the 'Enlighted Autocrats' not to mention a word about the Tianamen massacre so I think they will be dropped down the Memory Hole as effectively as Obama and Hillary dropped Reagan down the Memory Hole in Berlin the other day. Take that mouthbreathers---if you don't know history as Creepy Dude cautions us, simply change it. "Hope and change" is I think what George Orwell called it!

In other news China Daily has ">http://app1.chinadaily.com.cn/appdesk/vote/surveypre.shtml?mmid=448&LanType=en&RType=v"> this online Poll, asking:
What kind of power plant should China develop to meet the massive growth of electric power and the pressure of environmental protection?Related reading

Fossil-fueled power plant
Nuclear power plant
Hydropower plant
Solar power plant
Wind power plant
Biofuel power plant
Other

Currently with 29 Nuclear Power plants under construction I would have expected Nuke power to come in first, not second. I must be as clueless as TM.

Results are at the link.

[Terry Gain]

I swear I had no advance notice of this:

They just blew up the Pakistani spy agency.

when I posted this at 8:20 pm

...what reason is there to think that al Qaeda and the Taliban will stop at Afghanistan with Pakistan and its nukes next door? John Bolton doesn't think they will settle for Afghanistan and I agree with him.

[daddy]

Hi Clarice,

It's a wet and chilly Shanghai today. Sadly I missed the opportunity to boo the Abraham Lincoln of our times yesterday in Anchorage, but hopefully I'll get the chance to boo him in Japan tomorrow.

[PaulL]

Obama made one of his worst moves yet today, when he claimed that he had saved or created 1,000,000 jobs. Does anyone in the world believe he is telling the truth there? Out of touch, out to lunch, just plain lying, an idiot? There aren't any good explanations that people can make for Obama's claim.

Several weeks ago the stimulus was supposed to have created 60,000 jobs. Then only the other day it was 300,000. Now it's a million? What's it going to jump to next week?

[Terry Gain]

Obama made one of his worst moves yet today, when he claimed that he had saved or created 1,000,000 jobs. Does anyone in the world believe he is telling the truth there?

Does anyone include Chris Matthews?

[anduril]

Terry, I understand what you're saying and I don't disagree. However, there's more to it. One very underreported aspect is the ethnic cleansing that took place in mixed areas, and especially in Baghdad. Al Qaeda, for all their terrorism, was unable to defend Sunnis from Shiite ethnic cleaning--in fact, they provoked it. Thus, the traditional Sunnis found themselves pressured from two directions--by al Qaeda, which didn't respect traditional tribal culture, and by the Shiites. By the time the Sunnis turned to us in earnest and were armed and trained, most of the ethnic cleansing--a true civil war--had been accomplished and the Shiites had won. In return for helping us against al Qaeda, we armed the Sunnis against the Shiites. Anyone who thinks that either side has forgotten its grievances is likely to be very disillusioned in the future. Tribal culture demands revenge. I'm reading reports now that say the Sunnis feel abandoned by us once again.

[daddy]

"...what reason is there to think that al Qaeda and the Taliban will stop at Afghanistan with Pakistan and its nukes next door?"

This">http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2009-11/11/content_8946579.htm">This story tells us that the swift trials and executions of Islamic radicals in Western China (which shares a border with Afghanistan) continues apace. Unlike our Islamic DC Sniper, from arrest to trial to execution in China is taking on average about 3 months, not 8 years.

[Ann]

Sara:

Do you have a link? I can't find anything.

[We worried.]

Katrina creep't that dude.
===============

[narciso]

I found this link with picture, it happened in Peshawar, which was one of the major outposts during the Mujahadeen campaign in the LUN

[Sara (Pal2Pal)]

Ann: When I first posted, I'd only heard it as breaking news on Fox, but since then Gateway has it:

Premier Intelligence Building Blown Up in Pakistan

[Towering Barbarian]

CreepyDude,
And now the year is 2009 and Mr. Obama *still* doesn't have any discernible experience! As shown by the fact that Iraq is a victory while the Democrats are turning Afghanistan into a defeat. Sucks to be Obama! :P

But then again, what else can you expect from a Chicago Democrat whose supporters are so retarded that it's a matter of public record that they cheered him merely for blowing his nose in public? Who can doubt that the poor fool got his "Nobel Prize" in precisely that same spirit? ^_~

[anduril]

daddy, the chinese understand the islamist threat and they will not sit still for it.

[EBJ]

There's definitely something creepy about a bragging Obamabot in the midst of O's popularity implosion. Yeah, he's so smart. He's so cool. It's that whole results thing that he's not doing so well with.

[Mike G in Corvallis]

"Letting Afghanistan slide" is unfortunately not an option

... for anyone who cares about the integrity of the United States.

In other words: It's an option.