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December 18, 2009

Comments

Dave (in MA)
Where is William Safire for a ruling, darn it?
Maybe you could consult Richard Lederer, the next best thing.
verner

See, Maguire puts out cutting edge, witty, intelligent commentary without either ghostwriters or a fat paycheck from the Atlantic.

Disenfranchised Voter.

Lieberman abbreviated; "I would rather see no healthcare reform, than cave to the opinions of my constituency."

Now, that's political courage.

Ignatz

Isn't asking whether Obama uses a word correctly like asking whether something is good because God does it or God does it because it is good?

interested

Where's William Safire when you need him? Perhaps he could explain, via seance, Obama's usage.

Danube of Thought

I think he meant "on the verge," and was simply sloppy with the language. He is sloppy--even ungrammatical-- much more often than one would expect.

Captain Hate

Well done Ignatz. My hope for the new year is that people like Medved stop irritating me by telling how smart and what a great orator Toonces is.

Disenfranchised Voter.

The only thing more counter-intuitive than a conservative Irishman, is a conservative Jew.

They're either freaks of nature, or collaborators.

Lord Whorfin

Well, one man's precipice is another man's threshhold.

Neo
Copenhagen: India and China have taken a united stand and walked out of the climate summit as Copenhagen talks fail.

Tensions prevailed at the climate talks at Copenhagen today, as Indian prime minister Manmohan Singh and China premier Wen Jiabao walked out of the summit along with their respective delegations, as talks failed.

Copenhagen .. one precipice too far.

Neo

Phrase of the day:

"common but differentiated responsibility"

Usage: Taxing the rich is an example of "common but differentiated responsibility".

Expect to see this used a lot in the future

Ignatz

--My hope for the new year is that people like Medved stop irritating me by telling how smart and what a great orator Toonces is.--

CH,
What it mostly boils down to is........he's a baritone. People hear a nice sound and fill in the blanks with what they want to it to mean.
His speeches are in fact some of the worst empty, repetitive, platitudinous bilge I've ever heard.
And to prove I'm non partisan on this, Bush's foreign policy speeches were for the most part 8 solid years of exasperating repetition.
As far as Barry's brains, he has a facile mind like all good flim flam men, in that he can sound authoritative even when talking through his hat about something of which he knows nothing, that is to say pretty much all the time.

Screw you. I got mine

"common but differentiated responsibility"

Shorter, "fair"

glasater

...how smart and what a great orator Toonces is

For sure Captain..

I get so tired of people--left and right--claim how articulate this bozo is.
He does not use language well at all but just has a nose in the air attitude which may give him an air of gravitas--to some.

Appalled

Disenfranchised:

Hate to to tell you, but there are probably as many voters in Louisiana (Landrieu) and Arkansas (Lincoln) who feel the way you do. Heck, I wonder if health reform polls a majority approval in Nevada.

I'm not sure why Lieberman is doing what he is doing. But he was clearly against the public option from moment one, and the medicare buy-in, as advertised, was simply another attempt at the public option. Reid has played his game for political reasons and his reelection campaign. I don't see how you fault Lieberman for doing the same thing.

The real outrage is that the country has been talking about healthcare since June, and we still have no idea what the proposal is, or what our representatives are supposed to be voting on before Christmas.

MarkO

All words are equal now. They shall have only the meaning the President intends. That Bush was so stupid. He must have said things like this and addressed the bankers as "you guys." Right?

MayBee

Toonces- oh, now that is funny.

MayBee

The real outrage is that the country has been talking about healthcare since June, and we still have no idea what the proposal is, or what our representatives are supposed to be voting on before Christmas.

April at least.
But otherwise, spot on.

jimmyk

Another language thread, always fun.

I don't think that proper usage should be decided by statistical sampling (especially from the NY Times archives). That a lot of people mangle the language should not become a justification for doing so.

So I'm going to continue to ridicule Obama on this one, the close count notwithstanding.

I Won

Somebody is going to be damn well over the precipice if I don't get my smokes back and I'm not talking verge, mother.

Appalled

I don't think this is going to be a terribly merry x-mas season for Obama. Copenhagen has clearly failed, and the health care whatchamacallit seems destined to alaways find itself a vote or so shy of 60.

Obama really needs to reflect on how he wasted the nation's time and patience with issues that were always secondary to the economy, and get out of the limosine with the New York/Hollywood liberals who are just as out of touch with the concerns of America as those dreaded neocons of a couple of years back. I don't think his presidency has to be a lost cause, but I'm not sure how he's going to avoid that fate given his predelictions.

bgates

Lieberman abbreviated; "I would rather see no healthcare reform, than cave to the opinions of my constituency."

And the rest of his party says, "We would rather force a vote by Christmas Eve on a bill that will be 2,000+ pages but hasn't been written yet, than cave to the opinions of the American people."

clarice

I think using "precipice" as "on the verge" seems more common in sports and entertainment writing than in more serious endeavors, And Obama is not a serious man who spends a lot of time reading serious things.

His language is as sloppy as a pop star's for the same reason--cute and cool but DUMB.

MayBee

I don't think his presidency has to be a lost cause, but I'm not sure how he's going to avoid that fate given his predelictions.

I think he could be a good president if he gets at least one GOP chamber. He needs someone to save him from his instincts to just let someone else figure out how to go about things.
As far as whether is Christmas will be merry? I hate to be so cynical, but I think Obama enjoys being president. I think he loves the trappings, the plane, the motoracade, the house, the cooks, the parties, the fame. I don't think his policy failures now weigh on him all that much.
There is nothing in his history that makes one believe he's ever been all that invested in policy.

clarice

Look at his face,MayBee. He's crumbling and he knows it.

Jane

I hate to be so cynical, but I think Obama enjoys being president. I think he loves the trappings, the plane, the motoracade, the house, the cooks, the parties, the fame. I don't think his policy failures now weigh on him all that much.
There is nothing in his history that makes one believe he's ever been all that invested in policy.

That is my impression as well. It's all a bunch of freebees for he and Michelle. No heavy lifting.

PMII

Jane,

Dittos!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Appalled

MayBee:

Whatever Obama thinks of the trappings of the presidency, he is also highly (morbidly, pehaps) aware of his own press. I don't think it matters much if Hannity, Limbaugh, Ingraham, et al brand him a failure, but when the Deans, Krugmans, and Broders start getting in on the act, it wll bother him. And the historical storyline that could be developing -- a man with infinite possibilities and national goodwill squandering his chance at greatness (think what FDR, Reagan or even Clinton could have done with the situation presented in January 2009) has to scratch at him.

The great tragedy of Obama is that he thought the Stimulus was all he had to do, and then he could Move On with the move on agenda. This is a man who, alas, had far less situational awareness than he seemed to have in the campaign.

clarice

They are predicting 20 inches of snow in DC over the weekend--There will be no Capitol Hill debate--trust me on that. At the moment people there are dashing out for bread and milk knowing the city and surrounding area will be snowbound for days.

Appalled

clarice:

Given the amount of 38 degree rain we are getting in Atlanta, this storm shows every sign of being a monster when it hits colder air. Stay warm.

jimmyk

The great tragedy of Obama is that he thought the Stimulus was all he had to do, and then he could Move On with the move on agenda.

That's what his brilliant economic team was telling him. What galls me is that the number of seemingly intelligent people who credit the stimulus and the Fed for the recent not-so-horrible GDP and employment numbers. As far as I'm concerned Christy Romer could have stood on the north lawn and done a Native American rain dance and GDP and employment would have eventually stopped declining--in fact the dance would have been better than what they actually did.

clarice

Thanks, appalled. I'm in sunny Florida hoping my friends from DC who have reservations to fly in Saturday morning make it out of there.

Elliott

I blame wingers for fermenting this.

MayBee

I can see that, clarice and appalled. You both make good points.
He does want good press, and he is looking wan.

I think he is just baffled that people aren't agreeing with what he wants to do, and won't do it just because he wants them to. He expected people to be more about making him successful (which he's had a lot of, in his life).
So I think he'll merrily enjoy being POTUS for Christmas, but maybe he'll ask Santa for better, more supportive citizens.

Jim Ryan

There is nothing in his history that makes one believe he's ever been all that invested in policy.

Or in accomplishing anything.

Rick Ballard

"I blame wingers for fermenting this."

[checks Kendonesian style manual]

I'm on the brink of being 90 proof with you on that, Elliott.

DrJ

I blame wingers for fermenting this.

I'm for all things fermented, especially on a Friday. Or did you mean "fomented"?

Jane

Actually I suspect he is so insulated that he has no idea how fed up people are. And who's going to tell him? It's certainly not his fault if he is misunderstood.

Porchlight

He expected people to be more about making him successful (which he's had a lot of, in his life).

Affirmative action in action. It's cynical, but in this case I'm afraid it's true. He didn't get this far on his own actual accomplishments, but on other people setting him up for the win.

Frau Hoffnung

clarice knew what she was doing when she headed south *early*. (How does she do that?)
Will the people's legally and illegally elected senators brave captivity in a frozen D.C. to finish off America's health? We'll see. Pres.Barry Baritone (D-B+) will be far away in Hawaii comfortably surrounded by his favorites and familiars watching "It's a Wonderful Life."

Elliott, my unisex voodoo doll is out but where do the pins belong? Which wingers do you mean?

peter

The precipice gaffe, if it be one, is Obama in a nutshell-- a guy who fudged his way through two Ivy League schools using words that he thought sounded impressive.

Changing to OT,

I wish I knew who to believe. Don Surber says Reid has 50 votes, and Krauthammer says Reid and Obama will buy Nelson's vote, and pass the health monstrosity.

How to repeal the insurance industry takeover, in the courts or in the next Congress? That is the question.

DrJ

I've returned from Toronto. One interesting tidbit is that the CBC and BBC coverage while I was there was entirely on global warming (guess the position they took!). Whether this was because of Copenhagen, or is the normal state of programming, I have no idea. No Fox news was on the hotel TV, and the signals were all analog.

Unlike the upcoming weekend in DC, Toronto so far has had one of its most mild winters ever. There was no snow on the ground at all, though there were flurries when I left. That's just odd.

Elliott

The genesis of my last comment is Cecil Turner's observation in this thread.

MayBee

He didn't get this far on his own actual accomplishments, but on other people setting him up for the win.

I think his pathetic back story helped, too. He was basically abandoned by both parents.

Have you noticed how frequently he's been bringing up memories of his father, lately? All to stir up those feeling that we must not abandon him, too.

DrJ

You have a much better memory than I, Elliott. I knew you knew better, but what the heck.

fdcol63

" ... He didn't get this far on his own actual accomplishments, but on other people setting him up for the win ...

Starting with the publisher who advanced a 6-figure sum to an unknown, inexperienced, no-nothing, fresh-out-of-Harvard-Law-School graduate to write his autobiography in Bali with his wife despite their student loan debts.

glasater

From Ellitt's link:

I shall speak to the leaders of Iran,North Korea and Venezuela.I shall speak unto Fidel Castro,"Pick up thy bed and walk honky".

Posted by: O'Barmy | May 26, 2008 at 01:54 PM



That was darling Peter B.

lonetown

Someone ought to take a flying quantum leap from the precipice.

Porchlight

I think his pathetic back story helped, too. He was basically abandoned by both parents.

True, but the pathetic backstory is sort of an affirmative action special sauce. People of color from intact, solid middle class families are much less likely to get favored treatment.

Sonny Elliot

(CBS/ AP) Updated at 3:59 p.m. EST

The U.S. reached a "meaningful agreement" with China, India and South Africa at the U.N. Climate Summit in Copenhagen, a senior White House official said.

clarice

Revkin ran that--from an email or something from the WH--No details and certain to be BS..Look at the pics of O and HRC as they headed home..Another disaster.

Fresh Air

"Meaningful agreement"? This is more teleology from the Peter Pan Party.

Fresh Air

Another disaster.

Others:
- Hug-a-Thug Tour
- Pissed Off the Queen Tour
- Pissed Off Gordon Brown Tour
- World Apology Tour
- Effed up in Normandy Tour
- Doing Sex to China Tour
- Chicago Olympics Effed Tour
- Dopenhagen "Snowbound" Tour
- ???

It's like he should just stay in the 57 states or something.

Danube of Thought

The stimulus gave us our first clue. Obama and his Econ team played no role in it at all; they simply outsourced it to Nancy Pelosi.

Now he's done the same thing with healthcare. Although it's convenient to call it Obamacare, in fact the executive branch has provided no input at all, and in fact congressional Dems are peeved that his utterances on the topic have been so opaque and contradictory.

It's all been a colossal failure of leadership.

PD

B+ Hussein Obama
mmm mmm mmm

clarice

Exactly,DoT. And here's the irony. If he'd held firm and had not given away the bank on the non-stimulus plan he might have had enough good will left to get a health care bill thru--(Or if I'm being overly optimistic in suggesting this oen willfail--then he might have gotten a far more grandiose one thru.)

centralcal

MayBee re-tweeted the following awhile ago:

westwingreport: The "deal" happened after Obama burst into a room where China, India & Brazil were negotiating. A Chinese diplomat reportedly "yelled"

westwingreport: U.S. official: After busting into the room, Obama said he didn't want China, India & Brazil negotiating in secret. So they let him join.

omg! President of the United States being a Chicago thug.

Jane

Where was the secret service? Do they let him "burst into a room"?

He's a joke

Thomas Collins

Barack's folks should cook up stories that are not so transparently made up for media consumption.

Fresh Air

So they let him join.

Anyone else getting the feeling the interpreters didn't give him the exact wording of what was being said? What's Portugese for "President Dipshit?"

Porchlight

OMG, he is such a choad. Sorry for the long excerpt, but it's just too precious:

Senior Obama administration officials describe quite a dramatic scene at Climate Change Conference.

Officials say President Obama was frustrated. The conference was in complete chaos.

At about 730 pm Denmark time – the president was supposed to have left an hour before -- he learned that Chinese Premier Wen Jiabao, with whom he was supposed to meet, was meeting with the leaders of India, South Africa, and Brazil – the main players holding up any sort of political agreement.

The president heard about this and said he wanted to go to the meeting.

“Four against one,” an official said to the president.

“No problem,” he replied.

A senior administration official says the president “barged into the meeting,” where he joined China’s Wen, Prime Minister Manmohan Singh, Brazil's President Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva, and South Africa's President Jacob Zuma.

The reporters’ pool note from that time said that President Obama walked into the room and called out from the door, “Mr. Premier, are you ready to see me? Are you ready?”

They talked for roughly 45 minutes and emerged with a non-binding political accord.

The even more hilarious part is that the WH put this out. Either they think this makes him look cool, which is pathetic, or there's something more embarrassing they're trying to cover up. Or both.

For what it's worth I think David Corn tweeted earlier that Lula had left the building in disgust.

Ignatz

--omg! President of the United States being a Chicago thug.--

Thug? Sounds more like the nerd who figured out where the cool kids were hiding to avoid him.

Thomas Collins

Four against one? C'mon! Barack's handlers can cook up more persuasive lies about what went on. Where is Ayers when you need him?

PaulL

Presidents don't negotiate anything.

Danube of Thought

I wonder where Webb stands. Three days ago he said publicly that he hadn't decided. I've seen nothing since then to indicate a change.

I've been following this stuff closely since 1963 and I've never seen anything as insane as all this.

Just imagine if this thing does pass: if we're right about its effects, then every single gripe any American has about health care for decades to come will be laid at the doorstep of the Democratic party. Either I have miscalculated all of this terribly, or they have. What in God's name are they thinking?

Ignatz

--What in God's name are they thinking?--

They're "thinking" in the same sense that a pit bull straining at the end of his chain is "thinking" about getting his teeth into the rear end of a passing postman.

narciso

What can be said about Webb that is printable on a site like this, from his all too vociferous opposition to Iraq, which included
a recommendation to partition, to his assent to the stimulus, his brief objections to the
Gitmo transfer, I don't even recall his view on Afghanistan any more, and his unwillingess
to commit one way or another against such an onerous bill, dissapointment is the most charitable view

peter

or there's something more embarrassing they're trying to cover up

I'm guessing the latter.

Ann

Porchlight:

The video is priceless! What a buffoon.

Loved this:

It is a modest achievement, officials concede, but they insist it is an achievement nonetheless.

Elliott

I'm not surprised Obama wanted to go into that room. As he indicated in London and Japan, it would be really helpful for him to know Wen Jiabao and when you don't.

Porchlight

Ouch, Elliott! :)

Porchlight

Totally, Ann. I think Tapper was having a some fun with that account. The bloom is definitely well off the Obama rose for him.

Porchlight

Posted this on the (other?) health care thread:
Lieberman splits DC:

With a major winter storm moving in, Senate staff is setting up cots in Hill offices to spend the night in preparation for an important procedural vote early Saturday morning that all 60 Democrats are likely needed for — except TPMDC has confirmed that Sen. Joe Lieberman has beat it back to Connecticut for the Sabbath.

Link goes to TPM, fair warning.

Melinda Romanoff

DoT-

Just a slight variation on the genesis of the "first" stimulus bill from my perspective, here in Chicago, I don't think Ibama had one inkling of what was being proposed. It was Rahm lining up the first salvo towards "permanent power". The bill was designed in the House while he was STILL #3, before his confirmation, which, as you might recall, took a while due to the Reczko/Blagojevich situation (BS!).

Now, to the terms, and this is where it has Rahm's fingerprints ALL over it, the lion share of the funds don't get released until after the 4th next year, with most of it to be spent by Labor Day. I call that a lot of "walking around money".

Gee, what would all those loyal Democratic constituancies be willing to contribute to a source of funding like that?

No, Ibama's in charge of the ink dispenser, in my opinion, and is told when and where the teleprompter is going to be. These clowns telegraph their punches from where I sit.

Oh, and the over/under on Blagojevich "suiciding" is 8 months, via the trading floor, FYI. It was 14, before the break-in at his lawyer's office.

Ann

Let it snow, let it snow, let it snow, Porchlight! :)

PaulL

Guess who said this:

I try to avoid hyperbole, but I think Obama is possibly the most dangerous and destructive president we have ever had. . . . If the American people have their health care paid for by the government, depending on their age and their condition, they will be subject to a health commission just like in England which will decide if their lives are worth living much longer.

. . . I am beginning to think that this guy is a phony. Obama seems to have no firm principles that I can discern that he will adhere to. His only principle is his own aggrandizement. This is a very dangerous mindset for a president to have.

Q: Do you consider Obama to be worse than George W. Bush?

Oh, much worse.

. . . Bush was led astray and we were led astray. However, I never thought that Bush himself was, in any sense, "evil." I am hesitant to say this about Obama.

. . . So all in all, Obama is a disaster.

Melinda Romanoff

PaulL-

I'll go with "Who is Dr. Krauthammer?".

Ignatz

--Guess who said this:--

Anduril?

PaulL

Nope.

narciso

That's a tough one, Paul L, I assume it's someone you wouldn't expect

Porchlight

Ann, the weather outside is frightful, but the CT homefires are so delightful...

(swear I already posted this but it never showed up!)

clarice

Let me guess--Nat Hentoff ( I admit I cheated.)

clarice

Porch, I'm sorry--I just posted that Lieberman, too--so many threads so little time...

MarkO

Nat Hentoff

[Using Google is just not fair]

Melinda Romanoff

PaulL, Good one. I had forgotten the reasons that he was released from the Voice.

Melinda Romanoff

dinner.

Jane

Porchlight,

Lieberman leaving pre-blizzard seems huge to me.

clarice

To me, too. Obama and his party are going from one farce to another.

Dying to see the GBO report.

And wouldn't it be cool if all those guys camped out in the Capitol are stuck there thru the storm and Pelosi's Air Force caravan has to land in Louisiana or something.

sbw

Obama is such a student of history he must remember what happened to President Wilson when he took it upon himself to negotiate the treaty for the League of Nations. He thought he could negotiate an agreement with foreign powers independent of Congress. If I recall, Congress was so snarked at being left out the treaty was never approved by Congress.

clarice

**CBO report**

Why go back so far, sbw? Clinton agreed to Kyoto and the Senate told him to stick it in his drawers.

Danube of Thought

The news about Lieberman is simply wonderful.
And how the hell would they get Sheets Byrd in there to vote anyway?

But hell--when they miss this "deadline," they'll just set another one.

PaulL

The Hentoff interview is at RealClearPolitics.

Old Lurker

97 to zip in the Senate, Clarice, and then Bush let them blame him for eight years for not agreeing to Kyoto.

Barry Dauphin

Four against one-- This has gone from WWF to WWE!

clarice

I think it's particularly cute that Chavez and Castro have turned on the Won and China and Russia are stiffing him.

Soylent Red

His language is as sloppy as a pop star's for the same reason--cute and cool but DUMB.

His language is, on one hand, designed to convey the appearance of education and erudition. On the other hand, it's also fairly typical lazy DC-speak. A lot of medium-wattage Beltway intellects use language imprecisely as a way of making themselves sound smart.

My recent travels to Versailles-on-the-Potomac have also clearly taught me that certain words or phrases, once used in the right circumstances or by the right people, go viral among morons in that person's sphere of influence.

For instance:

"effectively", as in something is "effectively" something completely different. Sometimes, in its most irritating form, it comes at the beginning of a sentence. E.g. "Effectively, black is, in this case, white."

"rice bowls", used to be "stovepipes". I guess "rice bowls" sounds greener. E.g., "Everyone at the conference was protecting their own rice bowl, so nothing got accomplished."

"holistic", used to mean comprehensive, but always makes me wonder whether a "holistic" approach will involve deep tissue massage and aromatherapy. E.g., "We need to come up with a holistic approach to Afghanistan."

/rant

narciso

One suspects he's not really aware of all this history, I mean he's unclear about the major event in his own state, so the gap is probably quite wide on that front

Old Lurker

BTW Clarice, I'll bet your friends don't get out of DC tomorrow. I'm on the way to the airport in an hour to get the S-I-L who got the last plane to DC from Dallas before the rest of the DC flights were cancelled. So even if the airports are open Saturday, they're going to be short of planes.

Jim Ryan

I am beginning to think that this guy is a phony.

Just beginning? OMG. I'm smarter than Nat Hentoff! My wits are quicker than his - on the order of years quicker.

Rick Ballard

Wouldn't Lieberman have tried to be home by sunset today? I would think that we would know for sure by now if he actually headed for CT. He also wouldn't be showing up tomorrow until after sunset unless it was an emergency of some sort. Will they send Franken to convince him that it's an emergency?

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