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May 15, 2010

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Danube of Thought

This serves to remind me that I am old enough to recall when the three sports that dominated the sports pages were baseball, boxing and horse racing. During the fall you got college football thrown in. The NFL, NBA and college hoops were niche sports at best.

I don't know what it all means

Clarice

Synchronized swim and skating pairs, DoT.That's what it means.

And you are going to love it.

bgates

I'm old enough to recall sports pages....

Gmax

Yeah yeah yeah and you walked uphill both ways to school at least 8 miles in the snow! Speaking of that, the latest climate scare is now Global Cooling!

nathan hale

Warning, this a very NSFW take (in language)
on Brook's latest column on the British elections, you can delete if it's too strong

Captain Hate

you can delete if it's too strong

Why would I delete something that is oozing with contempt for RINOs; hell, I just bookmarked it. Between that and reading that Wanda Sykes show has been cancelled, I'm a happy camper.

nathan hale

I never quite found the point of the UK joining the EU, didn't history since 1066,
leaving out 1688 tell them nothing

Pagar

As I understand the situation, the UK govt has relieved themselves of all responsibitity for any governing decisions in the UK, since all orders come from Brussels. Just collect paychecks and be responsible for nothing.

Danube of Thought

I guess I left out hockey, but nothing has changed about hockey. Then as now, it has been followed by a very small crowd of mullet-wearing Canadians and a few American dopes.

Go Lakers.

Clarice

Thank you for not smoking--Megan McArdle notes that studies shows as we get healthier the longer term health costs for the elderly increase.

bgates

Online I had seen the Arizona governor's commercial where she shows Obama yukking it up about border security before scolding him that it's no laughing matter, and I thought, "it's amazing how conservative elected officials can be out West in rock-ribbed red-state Goldwater country".

Just now I saw a tv commercial for the guy running to be governor of swing-state Florida (which went Obama by 3%), and it's as close to the Arizona commercial as an Obama speech is to a Deval Patrick speech - same clip of the irresponsible President at the start, same chiding tone from the Republican. No mention of the Democratic candidate for governor, either.

Clarice

Interesting--all the conservative toughies are women..We're all Maggie Thatcher now.

Clarice

Some jerk at the Telegraph (UK) has an article about how Sarah's support is now wobbly..Heh, I should have such a wobbly career.

He sites her use of Facebook and twitter as childish. Didn't the press praise Obama for using ll these new fangled ways to reach the voters directly?Didn't Reagan get the word out on his radio show?

Pheh.

Ignatz

--and a few American dopes--

Hey! I'll admit I'm not the brightest but dope seems a little excessive.
I'll take any sport where it is always a question whether more teeth will be lost than goals scored, over the NBA prima donnas and the bores of summer, who manage to make a season which seems to last a decade or more somehow fit within 8 months year after year.

matt

Sarah is losing me because of Fiorina, frankly...Carly is as incompetent as they get. Another California celebrity vanity candidate....

Clarice

**Cites**

Pagar

The link about living longer has some interesting comments.

1st one--"Unhealthy people tend to die, and dead people represent huge savings"

Ann says Obama Sucks!

Matt:

Sarah is loyal! Fiorina was on the McCain/Palin straight talk express and the two of them became good friends.

I am not going soft on Palin for being loyal and a good friend. Besides Fiorina beats Boxer any day of the week and has the best chance at winning.

Just saying.

facebookprivatesoff

They screwed up so bad they'r e not sure how to get out. They really can't.

O didn't hire one of the those net roots people. In fact, he said how he dislikes them and they turn on him. Coward.

bgates

I am not going soft on Palin for being loyal and a good friend.

Finally someone willing to bring back a sense of chumminess to government. Hey, maybe if she's elected in 2012, she could bring George Tenet back to run CIA.

I had thought Palin's appeal was that her loyalty was directed towards her constituents and their principles.

Captain Hate

I don't know if it's been mentioned on another thread but Il Douche shilling for LeBron James going to Chicago is a *really* dumbass thing to do considering Ohio is a swing state and something like this will catch the "muddle's" attention. Not to mention how wonderfully Captain Awesomeness's Olympic plug for the Windbag city was received (no offense to Mel, of course).

srp

The most qualified guy in the CA Senate race is Tom Campbell by a mile. His manner is very mild and he's a bit wet on environmental issues, but he is the only candidate who knows about and believes in the need to cut spending. His website has very specific plans on how this should be done. The beauty of TC is that he trumps the elitist credential arguments of the left while simultaneously having a platform in keeping with the popular desire to rein in excessive government. I would have preferred that he stay in the governor's race, because I think we really need him in that job, but he got run out by Whitman's zillions of dollars.

Ann says Obama Sucks!

Photobucket

GO SUPER SAVER!

Pofarmer

Some jerk at the Telegraph (UK) has an article about how Sarah's support is now wobbly..Heh, I should have such a wobbly career.

He sites her use of Facebook and twitter as childish.

Uh, huh, They ignore and belittle her at their peril.

Finally someone willing to bring back a sense of chumminess to government. Hey, maybe if she's elected in 2012, she could bring George Tenet back to run CIA.

I had thought Palin's appeal was that her loyalty was directed towards her constituents and their principles.

I don't know the particulars of the race.

Who else is going against Boxer? This isn't somebody running for Cheney's old seat in Montana.

My wife and I went and watched Palin, and Thompson, and J.C. Watts and Kris Kobosh and a whole bunch of others speak two weeks ago. Palin's message is pretty simple. If you think you ought to, run for office. If not support those who do, volunteer, give money if you can, whatever, but, get involved. Credit her with staying involved and encouraging others to do the same. She ain't perfect,(Palin) but, she's one hell of a lot better than what we have on the stage now, and a whole lot closer to the common person.

Ann says Obama Sucks!

Come on, bgates. That's a stretch...Tenet!@#$

Pofarmer

BTW.

Palin has never been an easy cipher.

Ann says Obama Sucks!

I think this article about Palin is straight on or as RUSH says it Right ON, Right ON: Heart and soul of the right

Ann says Obama Sucks!

Photobucket
Crap, No Triple Crown

(Hey, glasater, did you take this picture? LOL)

Ignatz

--Who else is going against Boxer?--

Po,
Chuck Devore is the most conservative and would make the best senator, but he's monetarily challenged.
Fiorina is in the middle and is a bit of a loose cannon with plenty of dough.
Tom Campbell who is a social liberal and has shown a propensity to raise taxes in the past and refuses to sign a no tax pledge. He has also been struggling a bit lately with some unfortunate ties to questionable Islamists. His one saving grace is he has also shown a propensity for whacking spending. He's world's better than Boxer if my third choice amongst the Repubs.

BTW, as I'm sure you remembered right after posting, Cheney hails from Wyoming.

Thomas Collins

DOT noted:

"I am old enough to recall when the three sports that dominated the sports pages were baseball, boxing and horse racing."

Amd the highlight of the boxing shows was Edie Adams's commercials for Muriel Cigars. See LUN.

Pofarmer

Montana, Wyoming, it's all the same tuh us illiterite Midwest Rednecks.

oops.

glasater

Ann-

That's not mine--but I did get a great shot of a bull rider with his hand caught in the strap.

The bull dragged the rider around for awhile until the pickup guys took care of him.

Ignatz

Some interesting thoughts at NRO on the pumpkin* legged First Lady's obesity campaign.

*"Pumpkin" is logger slang for an old growth, heavy trunked tree.

glasater

Guess it was the clowns/bull fighters that bailed the guy out....

Pendleton Round Up 2009

nathan hale

Yeah, bgates, she wouldn't hire anyone who was lounging in Prince Bandar's pool, like Tenet. Spilius is the name of the chap in the Telegraph, who was enchanted with Obama, back during the campaign, and unlike Harnden, hasn't learned anything in two years

MarkO

To look sharp and to be sharp too.
Game of the Day and Game of the Week with Ol Diz. Usually the Yankees. Friday Night Boxing. Wrestling from the Fair Ground, starring "The Bat" or some such with a singular hold that disabled the good opponent.

Of course, the benefit of this was that we formed our own leagues, played over the line or tackle with our own modified rules and managed to avoid being coached all year by our parents or the rich parent of a rather mediocre player. I could never watch an entire Saturday game; I had to run over to my friends (or have the local operator call them) and meet for a game.

It wasn't uphill or in the snow, but it did require some incentive. But, oh, those Gilette Blue Blades seemed so cool.

anduril

A few days ago I linked the recently declassified GAO report re the suspected diversion of large amounts of weapons grade uranium to Israel by the Nuclear Materials and Equipment Corporation (NUMEC) plant in Apollo, Pennsylvania. The president of NUMEC was an acquaintance of Clarice, Zalman Shapiro.

I've done a bit more reading of the GAO report, large portions of which are still classified. It's an interesting case. As everyone here knows, I regularly defend the performance of our Intel agencies here, and the FBI is regularly made the butt of extreme criticism by Clarice and her acolytes. However, in this case I have no defense to offer for the FBI's performance (the CIA and DOE roles are a bit more complicated).

Consider:

The FBI is tasked to investigate allegations of diversion of nuclear materials, yet the FBI rejected, in 1965, DOE's express request to investigate the alleged NUMEC diversions! The FBI only began such an investigation 11 years later when it was expressly ordered to do so by President Ford. Even so, GAO judged the FBI's performance to be "less than adequate."

11 years late on an investigation of the diversion of large amounts of weapons grade uranium? What's up with that?

Here's what GAO said about why the FBI declined to investigate:

However, we were informed by a for­mer Executive Director of the Joint Committee on Atomit Energy, that the reason the Bureau did not want to get involved was twofold: ( 1) the Bureau did no t think that a diversion occurred based on the presentation provided by DOE; and (2) it simply did not like conducting investigations involving unaccounted for nuclear materials.

Here's another interesting item. It turns out that Zalman Shapiro was the sales agent for the Israeli Ministry of Defense--yet he was not required to register as an agent for a foreign power! How does that work? Go read the Foreign Agents Registration Act and see whether that doesn't look like the type of relationship that would require registration. Let's see: he's in an agency relationship with a ministry of a foreign government--duh!

The FBI's initial claim was that Shapiro was in compliance with the law. Later, after President Ford's demand for an investigation, the FBI's conclusion was, well, maybe not so much:

According to the FBI agents giving the briefings, the information developed, while circumstantial in nature [it had to do with the "background, associations, and business activities NUMEC's president with Israeli government officials, agents, and citizens"], raised serious questions concerning the national Security risks posed by NUrlEC' s president.

In reviewing DOE files, we found that.during the FBI's surveillance activities, the FBI became so concerned about the security risks posed by NUMEC's president that they asked DOE whether it planned to terminate his security clearance or
stop the flow of nuclear materials to NUMEC. According to the FBI's liaison with GAO, the FBI recommended that NUMEC's operating license be taken away.

Question: Does anyone here want to defend the FBI's performance?

Thomas Collins

See LUN for Sonny Liston knocking out Roy Harris in 1960. Liston was my favorite early sixties fighter. Great punching power, and underrated balance (he could jump rope as gracefully as a teenage girl).

I can never explain Liston's two fights against Clay. Liston was a far better fighter than he showed, and far lesser lights gave Clay far more trouble than Liston did. I have no idea whether those fights were fixed, but they were not Sonny Liston at his best.

Danube of Thought

I was in Sasebo, Japan aboard a destroyer for the first Liston-Clay fight. We needed repairs and were in there for a month. Clay was a six-to-one underdog, so I bet on him with another guy with the payoff coming in Hotsie Baths, which were those sauna/steam/hot bath/massage sessions that ended with the masseuse walking up and down your spine. So I got six free Hotsie Baths while we were in there.

To look sharp, every time you shave
To feel sharp, and be on the ball
Just be sharp
Use Gillette blue blades
For the quickest slickest shave of all

Pofarmer

Just wondering if anyone has a timeline of say, the Palin Resignation, different Lawsuits, the prosecutorial misconduct in the Stephens case being revealed, Palin losing her govt vehicle, etc, etc.

Melinda Romanoff

Po-

I believe that would be the Dept. Of Daddy.

DoT-

I still have a "Safety Razor", BTW. Those blades are really hard to find. I don't use them for that, but they're still hard to find.

Clarice

From Secrecy News (and I have no more time for this horse shit)
A secret 1978 review of the episode (pdf) that was performed for Congress by the General Accounting Office (as it was then known) has recently been declassified and released. But instead of resolving the mystery of the missing uranium, it only highlights it.

The Department of Energy and the Nuclear Regulatory Commission cooperated fully with the GAO, but the CIA and the FBI did not. “GAO was continually denied necessary reports and documentation on the alleged incident by the Central Intelligence Agency and the Federal Bureau of Investigation…. The lack of access to CIA and FBI documents made it impossible for GAO to corroborate or check all information it obtained,” the GAO report said.

“Based on its review of available documents held by DOE and discussions with those involved in and knowledgeable about the NUMEC incident, GAO cannot say whether or not there was a diversion of material from the NUMEC facility…. Agents from the FBI involved in the current investigation told GAO that while there exists circumstantial information which could lead an individual to conclude that a diversion occurred, there is no substantive proof of a diversion.”

“All investigations of the alleged incident ended with no definitive answer and GAO found no evidence that the 200 pounds of nuclear material has been located,” the GAO said.
The GAO report was obtained by the Institute for Research: Middle East Policy, a group critical of pro-Israel advocacy in the U.S. See “Nuclear Diversion in the U.S.? 13 Years of Contradiction and Confusion,” U.S. General Accounting Office report EMD-79-8, December 18, 1978.

Clarice

From DOJ on who has to register as a foreign agent:

No, there are a number of exemptions. For example, diplomats and officials of foreign governments, and their staffs, are exempt if properly recognized by the U.S. State Department. Persons whose activities are of a purely commercial nature or solely of a religious, scholastic, academic, scientific or fine arts nature are exempt. Certain soliciting or collecting of funds to be used for medical aid, or for food and clothing to relieve human suffering are also exempt. Lawyers engaged in legal representation of foreign principals in the courts or similar type proceedings, so long as the attorney does not try to influence policy at the behest of his client, are exempt. Any agent who is engaged in lobbying activities and is registered under the Lobbying Disclosure Act is exempt from registration under FARA if the representation is not on behalf of a foreign government or foreign political party.


nathan hale

Well right off the top the first complaints started right before she was picked, the first
signs of the prosecutorial misconduct started
around January, more complaints continued through the spring, they forced to give up her
suburban around March (even though she had been in an accident, the previous year, and Survived thanks to the Suburban, the last straw was the ethics complaint against the
defense fund to protect against the ethics complaints, is that byzantine enough for you

Thomas Collins

See LUN for a Gillette Blue Blades commercial.

Melinda Romanoff

Clarice-

I would also note that, by that the time, the DOE was thoughtfully deprived of security efforts and the "openness" proscribed new helpful Soviet encampments.

I only have my own experiences at the DoE facility where I was allowed to play (lab time) and it was all "don't ask, we have to do it this way now" kind of stuff. Things, samples, computers (which were friggin' expensive!), and such "walked" with some frequency.

It WAS the Carter years. They let me in the door, didn't they?. Taught me a lot, though.

Coolest thing I could think to keep was a Northrup Presentation Folder. I didn't want any of the "hot" stuff, I knew better.

Any way, it was a long time ago. You could have put a revolving door on some of the DoE facilities back then.

Fun to remember. Don't bother following up with me on this ever.

Dinner!

anduril

Repeat: Zalman Shapiro was the sales agent for the Israeli Ministry of Defense.

Here's a link to FARA, and anyone interested in National Security matters should read it carefully: Foreign Agents Registration Act. FARA's definition of "agent of a foreign principal" should be pretty obvious to anyone who has even a passing familiarity with agency law:

(1) any person who acts as an agent, representative, employee, or servant, or any person who acts in any other capacity at the order, request, or under the direction or control, of a foreign principal or of a person any of whose activities are directly or indirectly supervised, directed, controlled, financed, or subsidized in whole or in major part by a foreign principal, and who directly or through any other person--

(i) engages within the United States in political activities for or in the interests of such foreign principal;

(ii) acts within the United States as a public relations counsel, publicity agent, information-service employee or political consultant for or in the interests of such foreign principal;

(iii) within the United States solicits, collects, disburses, or dispenses contributions, loans, money, or other things of value for or in the interest of such foreign principal; or

(iv) within the United States represents the interests of such foreign principal before any agency or official of the Government of the United States; and

(2) any person who agrees, consents, assumes or purports to act as, or who is or holds himself out to be, whether or not pursuant to contractual relationship, an agent of a foreign principal as defined in clause (1) of his subsection.

Go ahead and read the exemptions if you want. Anyone who thinks that the sales agent for the Defense establishment of a foreign country is engaging in "private and nonpolitical activities," "activities not serving predominantly a foreign interest," or "soliciting or collecting of funds ... to be used only for medical aid and assistance, or for food and clothing to relieve human suffering" has one more screw loose than I would ever have imagined. Or maybe is being dishonest.

anduril

Things, samples, computers (which were friggin' expensive!), and such "walked" with some frequency.

Silly me. All the while I thought that when the blueprints for our nukes ended up in China during the Clinton years we really cared about the security implications--that we were raising a hullabaloo for more than just partisan political purposes.

It WAS the Carter years.

Um, 1965? That's when DOE asked for an FBI investigation. President Ford later demanded an investigation, and last I checked Ford came before Carter.

But all that is beside the main point. I wanted to know whether anyone would defend the FBI's performance, and no one seems to want to touch that one with a ten foot pole. But to show how easy I am, I'll take it either way. Is there anyone here who will

either defend the FBI's performance,

or criticize the FBI's performance?

Or is it the case that no one dares to even speak about the FBI's performance?

nathan hale

Reading Russian history and literature,is illuminating I can't say I've read all of War and Piece, but I've got enough to get the gist, and supplemented it with Zamostyin, Madariaga, Montefiore, A few things become clear, the Poles are right to suspect the czar in all but crown, the propensity for pointless wars in the Caucasus and the Eastern Balkans is rather commonplace. The latter applies to the Ottomans that Erbakan seems to think so highly of, there's a reason why they lost their empire, bit by bit, as well

Clarice

Foreign agents are clearly defined as those who represent another country in the public arena, lobbying for their position for money.

Sales agents are representing those countries in a purely commercial venture and clearly come within the exemption "Persons whose activities are of a purely commercial nature ".


I know from prior conversations with you you feel the foreign agent registration act should be read more broadly than the US govt has consistently read the law,but that's your own singular interpretation.

narciso

If one has read Riebling, and it's been awhile coordination between domestic and foreign intelligence has been informally abysmal and the Gorelick memo institutionalized this. The Patriot Act was supposed to have solved, but many of the same problems persist, from recent examples. I shouldn't really be surprised that this is
the case, considering events in the country of my birth, but I guess I am

Captain Hate

I can never explain Liston's two fights against Clay. Liston was a far better fighter than he showed, and far lesser lights gave Clay far more trouble than Liston did. I have no idea whether those fights were fixed, but they were not Sonny Liston at his best.

This is one of my favorite topics. Sonny was Mike Tyson before Iron Mike complete with inexplicable meltdowns (well, kind of...). Strangely enough, Cus D'Amato was Iron Mike's surrogate father who kept Mike on the straight and narrow while he was still alive after which Mike went off the rails; Cus was also Floyd Patterson's manager who kept ducking Sonny once he got his legal problems settled because he knew Sonny was a meat-grinder that would destroy Floyd, which he eventually did. Boxing was so mobbed up back then that it was no less fixed than professional wrestling when the time was right for a big killing bookmaking wise. That's the only excuse I can give for Sonny's performances against Clay, which were obvious tank jobs.

Have any of you guys seen the documentary "Standing in the Shadows of Motown"? A lot of my buds raved about it when it was in the theaters and I should've seen it on the big screen but I was like "WTF, I'm listening to improv and can't be bothered with this pop stuff that I know all about anyway". Well, I was right about what it's about but a complete a-hole about just how well this is done, featuring unknown musicians (except, strangely enough, when Motown toured the UK at which point they had fans who knew who they were) although I always knew that the Motown house band was the schizznit. It's just a whole lot of fun from start to end about unknown musicians who anonymously created the music for a generation.

anduril

Foreign agents are clearly defined as those who represent another country in the public arena, lobbying for their position for money.

Wrong. The definition purposely leaves out any reference to compensation, recognizing that some foreign agents are willing to act for free. And yes, there have been convictions of people under FARA for failure to register, even though they were not receiving compensation. FARA also, helpfully, defines "political activities" and that definition doesn't specify that compensation must be involved:

The term "political activities" means any activity that the person engaging in believes will, or that the person intends to, in any way influence any agency or official of the Government of the United States or any section of the public within the United States with reference to formulating, adopting, or changing the domestic or foreign policies of the United States or with reference to the political or public interests, policies, or relations of a government of a foreign country or a foreign political party;

So, if you're in an agency relationship--and Zalman Shapiro was the sales agent for the Israeli Ministry of Defense--and engage in any of those activities--whether or not you receive any compensation--then you have to register. Is there anyone who imagines that some one engaged in processing nuclear materials for the US government wouldn't be attempting to influence the US Government? In the normal course of business he would have to be doing so. That's fine, but what's suspicious is a person like that who also serves as the sales agent of a foreign power that is seeking to develop a nuclear capability. No wonder DOE thought he should register.

Anyway, I thought you said you didn't have time for this "horseshit"? Is there anything I can trust you on?

I know from prior conversations with you you feel the foreign agent registration act should be read more broadly than the US govt has consistently read the law,but that's your own singular interpretation.

What I know is that you've repeated this particular lie many times, but it remains a lie. I have consistently urged that FARA be enforced impartially and rigorously according to the letter of its text. Nor are you able to point to any statement I have ever made to back that lie up. Because it is a lie.

anduril

coordination between domestic and foreign intelligence has been informally abysmal

Worse than that, it's also been uniformly abysmal.

Clarice

You are correct that compensation is not an essential feature, but lobbying in the public arena, not engaging in commercial activity is the hub and I stick to that reading which is clearly supported by the DoJ. Indeed, I expect there'd be some constitutional question is sales agents for foreign countries with whom we were not at war with had to register with the US govt.

hrtshpdbox

"That's the only excuse I can give for Sonny's performances against Clay, which were obvious tank jobs."

Another theory, besides the easy one that Liston threw the fight for a mob payday or to satisfy his own gambling debts, or the even easier one that Liston was past his prime and out of shape, was that Nation of Islam surrogates were threatening Liston and successfully intimidating him.

You mention Motown, which dovetails pretty nicely with one of the more interesting aspects of Liston's story for me personally (I collect records): Liston cut a 45 just three days before he died, "I'm A Lover" on Palomino records. Again, he probably did it as vig on a debt. Record "books" at 3-t0-5 thousand dollars, but it's got to be worth even more as I've never seen a copy sold (nor have I heard it, and who knows - it might be great!). If there's ten copies of it on the planet, I'd be surprised.

narciso

From Pearl Harbor on, that was the subject of Wedge, Hoover sought to guard specially his prorogative in Latin America, hence many of
the top people in the division, were exFBI, the leak to Trohan,alleging the 'Gestapo' which foreclosed the OSS's fortunes, the McCarthy era, through to Iran Contra and the Ames case

Clarice

Come again, narciso?

anduril

You are correct that compensation is not an essential feature

Oh, gosh, and here I was worried.

lobbying in the public arena...is the hub and I stick to that reading which is clearly supported by the DoJ.

DoJ doesn't get to change laws, and FARA states that "political activity" is:

any activity that the person engaging in believes will, or that the person intends to, in any way influence any agency or official of the Government of the United States or any section of the public

It needn't be public. Suppose someone owns a company and they have an agency relationship with a foreign country, and they take a US government official to lunch and try to influence him--and they're not registered and don't reveal the agency relationship. Suppose they wanted China to launch satellites for us, which might conveniently go astray. And later the agency relationship come sout. Not a problem? B.S.! And don't anyone try it yourself.

And, yes, I know that that would be a major problem.

anduril

And in my example I presume the person is acting out of ideological conviction, not for money.

narciso

Which part about the FBI leaking to TRohan of the Chicago Tribune, or the predominance of bureau personal in the West Hemispheric division of the CIA.

Clarice

How could you represent the Defense Ministry as a sales agent without disclosing the relationship? Say the defense items fell off a truck?
Was there any claim Shapiro concealed the agency?


Any cases of the DoJ prosecuting a sales agent for a foreign govt for failure to register as a foreign agent when the DoJ 's own website says they are exempt?

Captain Hate

Nation of Islam surrogates were threatening Liston and successfully intimidating him.

I'm not sure I buy into that because that was before Clay, who was as dumb as a plank, joined those bow-tie clad lunatics. I've heard the hypothesis that Sonny never ran into anybody as batshit crazy as Clay who couldn't be intimidated, which I give a 50% chance of being right. Sonny's "training" was total bullshit because I've heard more than one account that in the middle of sparring sessions his wife or some loose trim would show up and they'd do the twist in the ring instead of working out.

Palomino sounds like a regional label; was that out of Philly? I doubt that it's any good at all, or even horrible enough to be a laughable curio, because there'd be some urban legend aspect to it. Although I give you a lot of credit for even knowing about it.

Clarice

Here is the exact relevant language of FARA --don't overlook the AND in the first section:

c) Expect [Except] as provided in subsection (d) of this section, the term "agent of a foreign principal" means--

(1) any person who acts as an agent, representative, employee, or servant, or any person who acts in any other capacity at the order, request, or under the direction or control, of a foreign principal or of a person any of whose activities are directly or indirectly supervised, directed, controlled, financed, or subsidized in whole or in major part by a foreign principal, and who directly or through any other person--

(i) engages within the United States in political activities for or in the interests of such foreign principal;

(ii) acts within the United States as a public relations counsel, publicity agent, information-service employee or political consultant for or in the interests of such foreign principal;

(iii) within the United States solicits, collects, disburses, or dispenses contributions, loans, money, or other things of value for or in the interest of such foreign principal; or

(iv) within the United States represents the interests of such foreign principal before any agency or official of the Government of the United States; and

(2) any person who agrees, consents, assumes or purports to act as, or who is or holds himself out to be, whether or not pursuant to contractual relationship, an agent of a foreign principal as defined in clause (1) of his subsection.

(d) The term "agent of a foreign principal" does not include any news or press service or association organized under the laws of the United States or of any State or other place subject to the jurisdiction of the United States, or any newspaper, magazine, periodical, or other publication for which there is on file with the United States Postal Service information in compliance with section 3611 of Title 39, published in the United States, solely by virtue of any bona fide news or journalistic activities, including the solicitation or acceptance of advertisements, subscriptions, or other compensation therefor, so long as it is at least 80 per centum beneficially owned by, and its officers and directors, if any, are citizens of the United States, and such news or press service or association, newspaper, magazine, periodical, or other publication, is not owned, directed, supervised, controlled, subsidized, or financed, and none of its policies are determined by any foreign principal defined in subsection (b) of this section, or by any agent of a foreign principal required to register under this subchapter;

narciso

Kind of like this fellow, in the LUN, or Ray Close or Charles Freeman, or well you get the picture

Melinda Romanoff

Sheesh, I was just relating my personal encounters with the DoE and when they took place.

As far as the FBI, the office in Chicago is so corrupt, no original investigations arise from that office, nor have they since Hoover's time. All follow on investigations must be conducted by outside personnel. They are not used as witnesses in court, no depositions, nothing.

I'm sure everywhere else they are as pure as the driven snow.

Clarice

DOJ reports no prosecutions of sales agents EVER under FARA even before the 196 amendments which narrowed its scope..

It says:
"The oft-amended Foreign Agents Registration Act of 1938, as amended, is the foundation for requiring the registration of, and disclosures by, "agents of foreign principals," as defined, who are engaged in "political activities" as defined, or other defined activities of a quasi-political nature, and who are not exempt. It covers most lobbying, advertising, public relations, and fundraising for "foreign principals" as defined, that is not of a commercial nature, or performed by Embassy officials. The Act requires agents to make periodic public disclosure of their identities, agency, activities, receipts and disbursements. Disclosure of the required information facilitates evaluation by the government and the American people of the statements and activities of such persons in light of their status as foreign agents. The news media are the greatest users of the information filed under the Act, and give it further publicity, usually without attribution. Other agents, commercial firms, students and academics, in that order, are also major visitors to the Department's public office.


http://www.justice.gov/usao/eousa/foia_reading_room/usam/title9/crm02062.htm>FARA

Pagar

Tom Campbell is the most qualified.

Others see it differently.

"Campbell, as has widely been written, is a far left progressive posing as a Republican."

hrtshpdbox

"I'm not sure I buy into that because that was before Clay, who was as dumb as a plank, joined those bow-tie clad lunatics."
Well, Ali "revealed" he was a member right after Liston I, but he'd supposedly been attending meetings for some time with his older brother.

"Palomino sounds like a regional label; was that out of Philly?"
Unlikely; in Nick Tosches book "The Devil and Sonny Liston" there's mention of Liston cutting a record in a Las Vegas recording studio. The particulars ("I'm A Lover", b-side instrumental, Palomino 4904), I got from a collector's site. Purely anecdotally, someone who's heard it described it as "not bad".

narciso

I wonder why there's Arabic spam on the previous thread, that's something new

Melinda Romanoff

Well, I hope I have a quieter Sunday, as I hope for all the rest of you noisemakers.

G'night all.

Ann Maggie Thatcher

Narciso:

Glad you are back. (It felt weird calling you Nathan) Anyways that Arabic spam is creepy, I agree.

Have you seen Sarah's latest: Arizona Press Conference With Jan Brewer

I love the fact she is seen reading from a teleprompter. (In your face Obama) And it does make you wonder where all the Republican (men) 2012 candidates are on the Arizona Immigration Law. Silent as mice and losers all around.

"We're all Maggie Thatcher now"... you betcha, Clarice!

narciso

Just about Ann, even Marco and Jeb, they're not Presidential but still leadership have been hemming and hawing, and this has allowed
Charlie some breathing room. Hoe goes it in Ohio

Danube of Thought

Sonny used to describe his pre-boxing career by saying "I found things before people lost 'em."

narciso

Meawhile back at the ranch, the Times is acting like itself again, along the lines
we were discussing earlier, in the LUN

aliasomee

$950-million Teacher and Leader Innovation Fund. 2 billion for dept Education. A raise hidden in Innovation funding. The new pork buzz word. It's really overseas military contractors...........

Captain Hate

Ali "revealed" he was a member right after Liston I, but he'd supposedly been attending meetings for some time with his older brother.

I can believe that but Liston 1 took part in Maine, no? I think a bunch of bow-tie clad blacks would be highly conspicuous in that setting, although probably held in higher regard by the locals than les Quebecois. However Sonny wasn't the brightest bulb on the tree...

Captain Hate

took part == took place

AL

“…as we get healthier the … health costs… increase.”

Can you frigging imagine it could be other way?

AL

“…weapons grade uranium…”

…is essential to start plutonium breeder reactor.

Once on line, such reactor (like in Dimona, Israel) produces huge amounts of military-grade plutonium necessary to build compact nuclear weapons, and also so called “military grade uranium” used to spike plutonium nukes into fission-fusion-fission superbombs.

From late 60-s, there is nothing US possibly can aid Israel to enhance Israel nuclear arsenal. Israelis have it on line by their own.

Janet

Secure the Border - Support Arizona.

LUN A GatewayPundit article with link to an online petition. The video ad is great.
www.securetheborder.org

I know I am starved for brave leadership, so here is a brave leader...Gov. Brewer and the citizens of Arizona.

Jane says obamasucks

Hi Guys!

We are back! The trip ended with my spending 8 hours on a packed plane sitting in the middle of 5 people with the kind of BO that makes you want to throw up.

Other than that, except for sickness, bad weather and losing my voice for 6 days (so far) it was fab!

Captain Hate

Welcome back Jane. Sitting on a plane amidst some heavy reekers is *not* a good way to fly. You should've gone and asked one of the stews if you could've sat on one of the little fold-down chairs back in their area; I did that once on a flight back from Delhi, nobody stunk it was just too goddamn hot in the cabin. They were very cool about letting me do that.

Clarice

Jane, welcome back !

Janet

Welcome home! Extortion because of tire inflation sounds like something that could be coming to America soon....isn't correct tire inflation one of the big "green" things we are suppose to be doing? Well....glad you and Caro are home safe and sound.

Captain Hate

Guess who Case Western Reserve University is having as their graduation speaker today? Perky Katie!!!! I wonder if she'll be blunt with the grads and say "Good luck to you because there's nothing effing out there thanks to me and my fellow idiots pounding that Hope 'n Change nonsense". What a horrible choice even by commencement speaker dismal standards. Although maybe she'll start drinking early and do one of those slutty dances she's known for. That would be memorable.....

Thomas Collins

See LUN for an interesting discussion of the two Liston-Clay fights (the first of which was held in Miami Beach, Florida, and the second of which occurred in Lewiston, Maine). The author argues that neither fight was fixed, but that (i) Liston, supplied with wine and women by a mobster friend, didn't train properly for the first fight, and (ii) Liston took a dive in Lewiston, but not as part of a fix.

I would recommend the article even for those who are not fans of boxing. It is written well, and gives a sense of that time period, in which, as DOT mentioned above, boxing was one of the big three sports.

Welcome back, Jane and caro!

Captain Hate, how are things among Cleveland fans? We Bruins lovers are still in shock (moaning about blowing a 3-0 series lead and a three goal lead in the last game has dominated the talk shows in the Boston area).

centralcal

Good morning.

Welcome back, Jane.

Oh, and welcome back, Narciso!

Janet

Yeah Captain....I think it was the grind! Hah

LUN is a sickening editorial from the WaPo today. "Why Elites Do Belong On The Supreme Court". Nothing new really...

From the article - "So now you are responsible for choosing your leader. Do you want someone like you or someone better than you?"

Maybe this nitwit could define "better" for us. One standard I'll adhere to from now on is that I will want someone "better" than him.

peter

TC, have you read the Sonny Liston bio by Nick Toches? Makes you wonder if he was murdered.

peter

How much of this fantasy is credible? Excerpt from the New York Slimes business section reviewing a book by Jonathan Alter:
(begin quote)

By HARRY HURT III
BARACK OBAMA demonstrated his economic prowess at an extraordinary White House meeting several weeks before he was even elected president. As Jonathan Alter tells it in “The Promise: President Obama, Year One” (Simon & Schuster), this breakout performance occurred at a Sept. 25, 2008, confab requested by the Republican presidential candidate, John McCain.

The meeting was a calculated gambit by Mr. McCain to prove his leadership abilities after the collapse of Lehman Brothers. But the book says that when Mr. Obama asked, “What do you think, John?” Mr. McCain feebly joked his way out of an answer, saying, “I’ll just listen.”

Later, Mr. Alter says, Mr. McCain acknowledged that he had not yet read a three-page outline of the controversial $700 billion bailout plan by Henry M. Paulson Jr., then the Treasury secretary.

President George W. Bush was “poorly informed and detached,” the book says. But Mr. Obama, who had read Mr. Paulson’s plan and copious amounts of related material, stepped into the breach. He gave a cogent overview of the crisis and declared that the Democrats were close to agreement with Mr. Paulson on a deal to approve the bailout.

When he was done, Mr. Alter reports, “a Republican sitting some distance down the long table whispered to a pair of Democratic senators, ‘Everyone here is ready to vote for Obama, including the Republicans.’ ”

The anecdote is one of scores of compelling insider accounts in “The Promise,” an impressively reported, myth-debunking and timely combination of journalism and history.

(end quote)

Ok,just by a show of hands, how many of you JOMers believe this tripe?

Jane says obamasucks

It sounds like the beginning of the Obama rehabilitation act of 2012.

Janet

My hand is down and I'm running for a bottle of Pepto-Bismol.

anduril
As far as the FBI, the office in Chicago is so corrupt, no original investigations arise from that office, nor have they since Hoover's time. All follow on investigations must be conducted by outside personnel. They are not used as witnesses in court, no depositions, nothing.

With due respect, Melinda, are you out of your mind to be saying that? I mean, what you're saying is demonstrably false. I know this but I certainly won't waste time on statements that are so patently absurd.

jimmyk

“…as we get healthier the … health costs… increase.”

Can you frigging imagine it could be other way?

Especially when you could flip it around: As we spend more on health, we get healthier. Imagine that!

Janet

From the editorial I linked earlier - "Obama's handlers use sports to humanize a brilliant man."

I think you are right Jane ....a rehabilitation. Cogent, reads copious amounts, brilliant...these are the words we will read, but our eyes will show us a incoherent, dull narcissist.

Janet

LUN a 36 second video of Nancy Pelosi showing the madness of Congress.
Hey quit your job and we will pay for your health care!

Janet

I wish she would quit her job to pursue art.

daddy

Glad to have you safely back Jane and waiting for the after action reports.

The Alter/NYTimes stuff is propagandistic horsecrap start to finish. I believe nothing they write. Nothing.

anduril

My challenge was and remains for someone to either 1) criticize or 2) justify the FBI's performance in the NUMEC case.

Was there any claim Shapiro concealed the agency?

That's not my claim or suggestion. The point of being required to register is that it puts the world on notice not only publicly but legally. It's one thing to hire a guy who happens to be a sales agent for the defense establishment of a foreign government to handle weapons grade uranium, but from a legal standpoint it's quite different to hire a person in that capacity who has been required to declare himself to be an agent for a foreign government.

DOJ reports no prosecutions of sales agents EVER under FARA

This may well be true, since most sales agents confine themselves to strictly commercial activities. This was not the case with Shapiro, who was also a well known Zionist. Moreover, the investigation raised serious doubts about the extent of his agency relationship--his "background, associations, and business activities NUMEC's president with Israeli government officials, agents, and citizens." IOW, the investigators came to believe that his agency relationship was not strictly commercial in nature and, in particular were concerned about his relationship with Rafi Eitan, whom Shapiro invited to Apollo with other Israelis:

an Israeli politician and former intelligence officer. Today he leads Gil and is a former Minister of Pensioner Affairs. In the past, he was in charge of the Mossad operation that lead to the capture of Adolf Eichmann. He served as an advisor on terrorism to Prime Minister Menachem Begin, and in 1981 he was appointed to head the Bureau of Scientific Relations, then an intelligence entity on par with Mossad, Aman and Shabak. Eitan assumed responsibility for and resigned over the Jonathan Pollard affair, and the Bureau was disbanded. From 1985 until 1993, he was head of the government's Chemicals company, which was expanded under his leadership. After 1993, he became a businessman, noted for several large scale agricultural and construction ventures in Cuba.

Now, why would an intelligence officer for Israel, a country actively seeking to develop and expand its nuclear weapons capabilities, want to visit a plant that processed weapons grade uranium and was run by an ardent Zionist? Not enough other responsibilities to occupy his time, no ongoing threats to Israel outside Apollo, Pa.? No, I'm drawing a blank...

don't overlook the AND in the first section:

Not likely that I would have, since I already provided the definition of "political activities," which is one of the four listed categories of activities that will require registration. As I said, Shapiro was more than just a businessman, and if you take a look at some of the listed activities there's a high degree of probability that Shapiro engaged in several of those activities.

But, the technicalities of FARA aside, I'd still like some opinions on the adequacy of the investigation. The GAO called it "less than adequate," and cited several glaring shortcomings, with which DoE concurred. Does anyone want to support GAO's conclusions and pile on in criticizing the FBI, or does anyone want to defend the FBI?

The comments to this entry are closed.

Wilson/Plame