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August 22, 2010



I, too, seem to lack the perceptive talents of Mr Rich. Guess I'll have to stay right here then.
"Atticus Flinch"? God bless you Thom for reading thru that drivel so I don't have to.


NY Post--apparently the Moslem funders of Rauf are having second thoughts. They, too, lack Rich and Dowd's talents it seems:

"The Ground Zero imam seems to be losing his wealthy American friends.

At least one stateside benefactor of the Muslim cleric planning the $100 million Islamic center downtown appears to be running away from the project, raising more questions about how and where developers will raise the cash.

Washington, DC, power couple Samia and Abdul Huda Farouki have long supported Imam Abdul Feisal Rauf, who's leading the effort to build the controversial mosque two blocks from the World Trade Center site. But they're keeping the project at arm's length.

"We have not provided any funding for the current project or for any activity for some time," said the couple's spokeswoman.

Samia, a socialite who helped finance a controversial pro-Palestinian documentary, is still listed as an adviser to the Cordoba Initiative, the nonprofit behind the mosque.

She runs a financial services firm, and has bankrolled "interfaith" events featuring Rauf.

The Faroukis have million-dollar homes in Virginia and Colorado, where they have hosted such luminaries as Queen Noor of Jordan."

Captain Hate

The lefties are very adept at low-risk dissent against people that won't do things like cut their heads off, for example. It's the eternal back-patting and preening over it that's so amusing.


Some days, when I am feeling really devilish and decidedly un-Christian, I think what a shame that the ugly NY Times building was not located smack dab in the middle of the WTC compound back in 2001.


True, dat, Capt.

Jack is Back!

If they build the Mosque will anyone come? Only if they have a dairy bar, I'm told.


Atticus Flinch

How appropriate that To Kill A Mockingbird was one of the two books Obama bought his daughters at a MV photo op this weekend. He probably knows who Atticus Finch is, but I bet he doesn't understand how flinch, in MoDo's context, means he's not just a vacillator, but a coward.

Danube of Thought

undermine the brave forces within Islam pushing for moderation

Yeah, those brave forces are on display in their full-throated millions.

Comanche Voter

Seems to me that STFU is an all purpose response to both Mo Do and Frank Rich--a theatre critic gone to the op ed page. Frankly, Mr. Rich has let the promotion go to his head. He's in a dead heat with Paul Krugman as to who can spout the most vapid horse manure on the NYT pages---with Mo Do and Bob Herbert in the running for place and show.

Danube of Thought

I'm awfully goddam tired of being lectured about what I should think. And the people doing the lecturing seem to be consumed with hatred and contempt for the 67% of Americans who are offended by this thing.

I'm already one hell of a lot more tolerant of Islam than Islam is of me. I've gone as far as I'm likely to go, tolerance-wise, until I seem some signs of reciprocation that frankly have not been in evidence at all.


Shorter Frank Rich - support the Ground Zero mosque or the terrorists win.

Shorter Nick Kristof - support the Ground Zero mosque or the terrorists win.

i.e., support your enemies or they win.

Great thinking as usual from the NYT.

martin j smith

Its the NYT what in heckfire branded irongate lymphnodes to you expect from those "people" called "journalists " ?


Well said Danube!!!


They really need to get a Nobel Prize-winning economist into this story to help them refine their duncery.

Rick Ballard

How can we convince the NYT to keep Headchopper Hall front and center until Labor Day? I think it's a great issue for Abu "this time, you've got me" Barack to kick off the fall election campaign (adter he completes his vacation with the rest of the escherichia coli on MV, of course). It's an issue which is sure to bring back the centrist Dems currently fleeing the party as if pursued by the hounds of hell.

Go for it, Paunch!


Oh come on, something like 65% of the American people think this masque is a bad idea.

Juan Williams was turning himself inside out today on Fox trying to find a way to just blame Republicans while acknowledging the unpopularity of the GMZ.


I'm already one hell of a lot more tolerant of Islam than Islam is of me. I've gone as far as I'm likely to go, tolerance-wise, until I seem some signs of reciprocation that frankly have not been in evidence at all.

This administration has done more to narrow my tolerance than anything else in my lifetime. I just hope it is reversible.


The Political Version of Jersey Shore; The U.S. Congress. LUN

tea anyone

I did a small amount of research as to how many mosques are in the U.S. today as compared to 2001 and I came up with these figures.
A study in 2001 states that there were 1209 mosques in America. Today the best I could find is an estimate of about 2000. That is an increase of about 800 new mosques. If Americans are sooooo Islamiphobic then how is it that only this one proposed mosque very close to Ground zero is being questioned and asked to relocate?
I think a 70% increase in mosques in 9 years would indicate amazing tolerance on Americans behalf especially given the history of events.


Ditto what Jane said.

Jim Rhoads a/k/a vjnjagvet

What is the motivation for denigrating 65% of the public when it is taking the perfectly reasonable position of backing the 9/11 victims' families over an Imam of questionable loyalties.

What advantage can the minority (but elite) position possibly be for the welfare of the nation?

I wish they'd explain that.

Robert Bell

"how do we persuade Afghans that we will stand up to the Taliban in their village if we won't stand up to a Victory Mosque in our village?"

To be clear, the unspoken assumption here is that you have pretty precise data on the perceptions and internal motivations of people from a very different place and culture. One can easily imagine three (among a huge number of) different hypotheses:

1. Allowing the mosque construction is an indication of lack of resolve on the part of the US.
2. Forbidding the mosque construction is an example of anti-Islamic sentiment in the US, and Afghans would face discrimination if they came here, so why cooperate with the U.S?
3. Afghan villagers don't really care about what happens in the US when considering support of the Taliban.

How would we know? Focus groups? Polling?

Even if we could know what people thought with near certainty, would that be a good reason to make a public policy decision on the mosque?

As Dan Drezner pointed out last week, I think this sort of reasoning is problematic at best ... (http://drezner.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2010/08/16/you_know_what_let_the_terrorists_win)


How do you win Muslim hearts and minds in Kandahar when you are calling Muslims every filthy name in the book in New York?

How do you does the American military win Muslim hearts and minds in Kandahar when you are calling Muslims the American military every filthy name in the book in New York?


I don't think we can win Muslim hearts and minds. Then they would be infidels according the Islam.


"Even if we could know what people thought ..."

Pretty sure any sane and rational Afghans are aware the reason the US invaded and made war in Afghanistan was because of 9-11. Pretty sure any sane and rational Afghans would grant the US might be a little sensitive about an Islamic Victory Mosque at the 9-11 location. After all, even cartoons are enough to send their sensitivities into orbit.


First off, as to these fantasies about “the brave forces within Islam pushing for moderation” and the “hearts and minds” we could be winning, I have to object for lack of foundation. In other, more useful words, before I can begin to follow the argument, I need facts on which the argument, theoretical as it is, could be based.
No seasoned observer could take these screeds as thoughtful pieces. They are merely repetitions of the position staked out by the mosque. These shills have now unsuccessfully gone through bigotry, religious persecution, incivility and now sedition as reasons not to oppose the building of a symbol of victory of the very forces we are fighting. These many excuses are just more of the bullying of the exceedingly bitter and bigoted left.
There is a rational basis, apart from all the opprobrium cast on the opponents, for putting the building somewhere else. But, to say that winning is losing is the adolescent whine of the denizens of the Model UN. Winning is winning. Maybe if they has won more they would know the difference.


*had* Although "has" gives the sentence a certain je ne sais quoi.


Funny how a couple of two bit hustlers like Gamal and Rauf have turned the tide against the president, the Democratic party, and the press and forced all reasonable folks to say--as DoT does=="NO MAS."

Of course we all have our ideas of how the GZM will play in the sand blown souks of the world and there is no way to be sure I suppose..OTOH 70% of Americans find this offensive and Mr. reach- out-and- bind- the- wounds Rauf is unwilling to move the darn thing a couple blocks away as a compromise.

BTW at best in their plans they are only planning a mosque that is two stories--all the rest is for non-religious purposes. About 10 blocks away is another mosue, small, inobtrusive and providing no trouble for its neighbors at all.

It is more than the fact of the mosque--i repeat. Even at this site, if they wanted a samll, inobtrusive place to play, I am positive the uproar would be minimal.

Live by the scimitar, die by it.

Jim Miller

Two general observations about Frank Rich:

1. When he ended his career as a theater critic, he wrote an article celebrating his efforts for the NYT magazine. In a following issue, there were three or four letters -- from theater people even I recognize -- noting factual errors in Rich's piece.

2. For a while, I was regularly writing posts criticizing Rich's columns. I stopped, mostly because he makes so many mistakes in his writing that I felt obliged to correct some of his errors in the second half of each post. (He's particularly bad with metaphors, as sloppy thinkers often are.)

I would think that frequent errors and an inability (or unwillingness) to write clearly would disqualify a person from being a columnist for our newspaper of record.

Rob Crawford

I would think that frequent errors and an inability (or unwillingness) to write clearly would disqualify a person from being a columnist for our newspaper of record.

It isn't his job to write or think clearly, or to get the facts right. His job is to comfort the ruling class.


"Afghan villagers don't really care about what happens in the US when considering support of the Taliban".

I suspect Afghan villagers know that the US left South Vietnam after promising them our protection and that hundreds of thousands if not millions of them died at the hands of the Communists because we promised the South Vietnamese our protection but failed to keep our promise.
I suspect Afghan villagers know that we promised the Iraqis our protection, but now have pulled our combat troops from their nation so they have no protection.
I suspect the Afghan villagers know that President Obama has assured the taliban that there is a date certain when we will withdraw our protection of the Afgan villagers and that all the Taliban have to do is wait.
There is no way that people who face death every day from enemy actions can be won over to our side, when we have an established record of not keeping our promises, IMO.


Aren't these the same guys who wear kaffiyehs in college to seem cool?

Jim Ryan

...stated that he wanted to put the Nazi clubhouse facility next door to the Polish-American community center in downtown Milwaukee "as a gesture of conciliation."

"We're all about building bridges. I'm a bridge-builder. It's all about conciliation. Our Nazi clubhouse needs to be next to the Polish center for that reason," Smith said. "It's like that lovely mosque in New York. That mosque is not moderate Islam. It's real Islamofascism. Rush even calls it a 'Hamasque'," Smith quipped with a chuckle. "It's great to see the Islamofascists reaching out, and we're following suit."

Meanwhile, the president, citing Constitutional Law, commented that objectors to the clubhouse location were "acting stupidly." When asked to revise and extend his remarks the next day, he said he did not support the location and that those favoring the location were "acting stupidly."


He's in a dead heat with Paul Krugman as to who can spout the most vapid horse manure on the NYT pages

An acquaintance at the coffee shop noticed the other day that I was reading Chafets' Rush Limbaugh: An Army of One, so he wandered over and asked, "I noticed what you were reading. Have you heard of a guy who writes for the New York Times, Paul Krugman? I'm guessing you're not a fan of his."

I said, "Paul Krugman, former Enron advisor, you mean?" He chuckled.

Then we chatted a bit about Krugman's belief that all problems can be solved by the federal government spending more of our money, and that if said spending doesn't solve said problems, it just means we haven't spent enough yet.


From the oh. my. god. we really need to bankrupt these fools department comes this from Ramesh Ponnuru at The Corner:

From a NYT editorial: “But many of Mr. DeLay’s actions remain legal only because lawmakers have chosen not to criminalize them.”

Where to even begin?


Chafets' book is pretty good, by the way. It's an exceedingly fair appraisal of Rush's career. He levels mild criticism of Rush now and then, but it's not reflexive like that of Rush's enemies. And he actually understands what Rush says and why. For example, he understands "I hope he fails." And he gets the Jesse MacBeth "Phony Soldier" flap and what a fraud Harry Reid was in the incident. And he gets that "Barack, the Magic Negro" wasn't Rush being racist but needling the racism of the left.

Captain Hate

He's particularly bad with metaphors, as sloppy thinkers often are

You'd think an editor might be doing somebody a favor (not to mention ensuring against producing a horribly shoddy product) by keeping him from regularly making an ass out of himself; but I'd imagine the wrath of Frankie when he gets all PMSie isn't pleasant to experience more than once.


I was very heartened today to hear one of the organizers of the Victory Mosque protest refer the "the ruling class".

Lots and lots of people are paying attention.

Captain Hate

Where to even begin?

Do people even bother sending letters to the editor, knowing fully well that Pinch Shitberger's Praetorian Pussies will make sure it never makes it into print?

Frau Steingehirn

Don't miss Jim Miller's blog with his great account of a Saudi TV program "Tash Ma Tash" or No Big Deal. (Maybe a new contender for the Muslim gay bar name!) Shades of Sid Caesar and Imogene Coca.


Anyone else clicking on the Muslim ads on this thread just to get TM a few sheckels?


Do people even bother sending letters to the editor

I did for a long time (to the WaPo), & still do sometimes if my head is gonna explode. Even if they don't print it, sheer volume on a subject might open their eyes. I write the ombudsman sometimes too.


Progress (if you're for an ever-more-coercive nanny state):

Starting next year Cleveland residents face paying a $100 fine if they don't recycle, and the city's new high-tech trash cans will keep track if they don't. The new cans are embedded with radio frequency identification chips and bar codes which keep track of how often residents take them to the curb. If the chip shows you haven't brought your recycle can out in a while, a lucky trash supervisor will go through your can looking for recyclables. From the article: "Trash carts containing more than 10 percent recyclable material could lead to a $100 fine, according to Waste Collection Commissioner Ronnie Owens. Recyclables include glass, metal cans, plastic bottles, paper and cardboard."

Rich has morphed from a failed-theater critic who mistakes comedy for tragedy into a cloud-cuckoo political commentator who leaves out entire swathes of characters and plot-lines just to keep his cartoons simple enough for the Upper West Side elites to comprehend them.

Every Dem, Union Member, and independent who has thought through having a Muslim-Brotherhood sleeper-cell covert Ikhwan asset like Al-Rauf and his aide-de-camp Ibrahim Hooper of CAIR, another fellow-traveller of MB as their allies and kumbayeh partners has figured this out.

Rich should look up the word taqiyya in his google and wiki Lexus-Nexus. I think he wants to remain deceived and his suspension of disbelief matches Kristof's ignorant naivete.


"lawmakers have chosen not to criminalize them.”

Convict him anyway. It's the right thing to do. "What do you stand for, Danny... goodness or badness?"

Beyond parody.


DoT confesses: ``I'm awfully goddam tired of being lectured about what I should think.''
It must be horrible, just horrible to have to hear that people disagree with you in ways that make you feel so defenseless. Only conservatives should be allowed to tell people how to think, given they have no defense but to whine like babies when people fire back...

Frau Steingehirn

And what type of monitor does the citizen get to check that the local government actually recycles the collected waste? I'm not convinced it is at all.


bubu will never figure out how to think no matter who tries to help


Well, I just now saw Fox News Sunday. Poor Juan Williams made a complete and utter fool of himself on the panel. Talk about delusional!

Comanche Voter

Bunkerbuster, I thought you'd finally pop up here. There's nothing wrong with someone disagreeing with you. It's called a discussion with give and take and points made and points lost on each side of the discussion.

On the other hand, if Little Rooster Frank Rich stands up on a dunghill in the chicken yard and sneers down at you in full lecture mode (needs to be a big dunghill because both Obama and Krugman like to do the same thing), and tells you that if you disagree, you're either stupid or a bigot or both---well then that's not a discussion, that's a lecture. And the proper answer to a lecture is GFYself.

Captain Hate

Poor Juan Williams made a complete and utter fool of himself on the panel. Talk about delusional!

I mentioned this at AoS earlier: I think Juan gets in trouble when Brit, Kristol or the Hammer aren't on the panel because they'll call him out when he says something obviously deranged; which was what he did continually today.


Here's another entry for Clarice's scrapbook, and it's not the first time he's said it, in the LUN


I thought Williams was particularly over the bend today too. I almost think he does it for show.


Obama knew Gulf drilling ban would cost at least 23,000 jobs

He just didn't mind.


From narciso's link:

Rauf is on a Middle East tour funded by the U.S. State Department. He has discussed efforts to combat extremism, but has avoided any comments on the rancor over proposals for a mosque and Islamic center near the site of the toppled World Trade Center towers.

Er... That would be "public" comments, no?


toppled???? Sounds like a kids word...oops, they toppled over.
Just sick....

Rick Ballard

via NRO - Blumenthal The Gutless

The tenor of the piece is pro-BOzo but the author inadvertently provides some insight into the mind of a candidate with considerable background in Conn. politics who understands that there is no such thing as "safe" for a Democrat this November. I hope McMahon makes him sweat bullets and bleed dollars all the way to the finish line.


This is where I found that link, that covers much of the same ground we have today, in the LUN

JM Hanes

"...given they have no defense but to whine like babies when people fire back...

LOL! The elephant in that room, so to speak, is the world class whiner in the White House.


The sheiks must crack up when they hear this stuff.

Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf told the Al Wasat newspaper in Bahrain that the freedoms enshrined by the U.S. Constitution also reflect true Muslim values.
JM Hanes

"Let's face it this has been the toughest year and a half since any year and a half since the 1930s"
Barack Obama, May 25, 2010.


They didn't pass Smoot/Hawley this time around, although I fear Sutton/Dillinger is awfully close


...who understands that there is no such thing as "safe" for a Democrat this November.

Meanwhile, on NPR this afternoon, their 3PM lead story: "We'll take a look at one of the more vulnerable Republicans in this fall's elections."


Everyone should read: Political Reversal Down Under: Running an explicitly conservative campaign, Australia's Tony Abbott has denied Labor a governing majority.


Jane, Captain - what I found hysterical and really unusual about Juan on today's show was that the other 3 panelists AND Chris Wallace could all barely contain not only their laughter, but their outbursts at the nonsense he was spouting!

Oh yeah. Juan probably didn't watch the multiple replays of his performance today!


Someone explain the DirecTV Cowboys/Redskins "Troy Barkman" commercial to me: Why does the old guy in the wheelchair give out with the big sigh at the end?

Is he wishing he could take a whiz as easily as the dog?


The “hearts and minds” first worth winning are our own and, for the life of me, I can't find where in school it's taught.


Oh, Offthread, too much freude in my schaden, in the LUN

Thomas Collins

Bunkerbuster, because you appear to claim that you are an adherent of reasoned debate, I thought you would appreciate Professor Bainbridge's takedown of Obama's comments on the Citizens United case. See LUN (via Instapundit). What I thought you would find particularly objectionable about Obama's comments is that they make broadbrush assertions about corporate donations, which, as Professor Bainbridge points out, don't have a basis in what the impact of corporate contributions is likely to be, especially in light of the unions being freed up to make contributions. In any event, in the spirit of reasoned debate, I thought you might want to join me in rebuking Obama for what were clearly talking points comments unbecoming a former President of the Harvard Law Review and research assistant to Professor Tribe on an article applying the rarefied intellectual disciplines of higher math and physics to how judges should make decisions.

Captain Hate

cc, it even shocked me and I've been watching that dumbbell since when Tony Snow hosted the show.

Old Lurker

Toughest year and a half since 1930?

Looked at the numbers for 1937?

I kind of think the 18 months following Pearl Harbor were pretty scary.

Hiding under desks during and after the Cuban Missle crisis was pretty scary.

The Arab oil embargo was scary economically.

9-11 and Anthrax were scary.

Totally self centered fool, this guy.

Jim Miller

Frau Steingehirn - That was a fun article from the Telegraph, wasn't it?

And a little encouraging, coming from Saudi Arabia.


Toughest year and a half since 1930?

If so, it's Obama who's made them that way.



"(NewsCore) - The only known American soldier in Taliban captivity is training fighters in bombmaking and ambush, according to information reported Sunday from one of his captors and the Afghan intelligence agents working to free him.

Private Bowe Bergdahl disappeared from an American military base in southeastern Afghanistan in June 2009. Last week, one of his captors was interviewed, shedding light on a case that has baffled U.S. military officials.

A Taliban deputy district commander in Paktika province said the 24-year-old American had converted to Islam in the months after his capture. He said Bergdahl, from Idaho’s Sun Valley, had trained Taliban fighters in bomb-making and ambushing convoys.

“When I saw him for the second time, he had totally changed. He had a beard and he treated all of us very respectfully. He seemed very relaxed in our company. He was no longer scared,” said the commander, who called himself Haji Nadeem."

Reach out

Thomas Collins

Ah, yes, the geopolitical balance with respect to the matter discussed in the LUN will be affected by whether we make nice to the Mohammedans pushing the GZM. Washington, Hamilton, Jackson, Lincoln, Grant, Mahan, Eisenhower, Marshall, LeMay, Abrams, Reagan, all of our military and political strategists of the past pale in comparison with maximum grand politico-military strategist Frank Rich.

Thomas Collins

And how nice it is that Frank Rich wants to have the conditions most conducive to a military success in Afghanistan. Where would our country be without the NY Times op ed patriots always thinking first about our country's success on the battlefield.


They can build a mosque at ground zero when there is a synagogue in Mecca.


DOT--As a Connecticut voter, I'm not wild about Linda McMahon (Ahnold in a skirt, as far as I can tell), but Blumie is, was, and will always be a pure cardboard cutout of a politician. He stands for absolutely nothing--except the unsullied goodness of Richard Blumenthal.
So--Go Linda!


TM--The true shame in all this is that you have to post to your own stuff to reference the "strong horse" case. Which should be painfully obvious to all, but for some reason seems apparent only to the vast majority of the American electorate (and the politicians, R&D, who are beholden to them) and billions of muslims worldwide, and not to our self-appointed lecturers in the press corps (or Bloomberg-but he is a truly special case).


I had been following the Private Bergdahl case for a while, since it began, he's based
out of Ft. Richardson, there had been reports
he had taken up the Taliban beard, but the notion that he has actively turned against his
own countrymen is quite disturbing

Danube of Thought

DoT confesses: ``I'm awfully goddam tired of being lectured about what I should think.''

Why does this dope think that's a "confession?" When the line is drawn in the sand and I am on one side and Frank Rich, Joe Conason, Ellis Hennican and all the usual saps are on the other side, I feel utterly triumphant. In this American war of ideas, I am clearly on the winning side, and they have lost. Tough cheese.

And it'll all be remembered on November 2.

Danube of Thought

Poor Juan Williams made a complete and utter fool of himself on the panel. Talk about delusional!

He appears to be a very nice guy and a well-bred gentleman. The problem is, he's painfully stupid, and his stupidity often embarrasses his colleagues.


I found two videos of the Williams panel on Fox..He did say he thought the economy was improving which is preposterous. what else did he say?

I agree with DoT's analysis of him and I will always have a soft spot for him, During the Anita Hill hearings some outrageous testimony was taken from former Yale classmates and he said n the post,"They gave proof of the saying that yale law school has ruined more good black minds than crack."

For that alone, he gets some affection from me.


Tom asks: How do we persuade Afghans that we will stand up to the Taliban in their village if we won't stand up to a Victory Mosque in our village?''

Afghan: Why do you oppose the construction of a mosque?

JOM: The Koran demands terrorism. All true Muslims are terrorists, so the mosque is obviously an insult to the victims of terrorism.

Afghan: If that's true, then I too am a terrorist. Why do you want to give me money and weapons? Why would you trust me to help you and not stab you in the back? Are you not aware I'm a Muslim?

JOM: Obama is a Kenyan or Indonesian!! Communist!!! Secret Muslim agent!!!! Wait till November!!!!!

Afghan: Calm down. Have a drink of water. Are you running a fever?

JOM: I am so tired of people telling me how to think.

Afghan: Given that you have invaded my country and, after that fact, are asking for my help, it only stands to reason that you would care to hear my opinion. If you can't stand to hear my opinion, why are you willing to give me money, weapons and intelligence support?

JOM: Troll! Soros plant!! America hater!!!

Afghan: With all due respect, the Imam is a Sufi. The Taliban consider him an apostate. He is more directly their enemy than you and I are. Imam Rauf has never supported the Taliban, whereas we have a history of helping the Taliban get started fighting the Russians. In fact, the Imam is touring the Persian Gulf countries now, explaining why Muslim values are consistent with American values. We're paying him to do that. Haven't you heard?

JOM: Sorry, I only watch Fox. They keep saying the mosque is a victory for the Taliban, terrorism and Wahabism. If you don't get your news from Fox, you're an unhinged moonbat liberal Soros plant communist. Plus, you're a bigot because you call conservatives names.

Afghan: How is it a victory for the Taliban to have a community center that allows co-ed swimming, a culinary school open to the public, including men and women and a memorial to the victims, not the perpetrators of 9-11?

JOM: Why do you insist on preening? Can't you see it causes me such pain to have to defend myself? I am the morally superior one here, so I should never have to have my views challenged, let alone belittled. Name-calling, belittlement and assertions of moral superiority are fine for me, but not for you. When someone responds in kind to my ad hominem and claims of moral and intellectual superiority, my feelings are badly hurt. And if you hurt my feelings, that is proof you don't want to get along with me and if you don't want to get along with me, you must hate America.

Afghan: Just send me the money, and we'll see how it goes.


For your next skit, bunker, you should try modifying an Abbott and Costello favorite. I think you would call it "Who's on Last" though.


The history of the Finley Park, Al Hijira in Falls Church, the Quds in Hamburg, the one in
the Lahore suburb of Muridke where the 7/7 bombers prepped, that one in my neck of the woods, rightly give us pause

Tom Bowler

TM, you forgot the shorter Dick Cavett - support the Ground Zero mosque or the terrorists win.

You'd think there was some kind of a list, you know?


Clarice, time has passed and I have had dinner and cocktails, so Fox News Sunday has kind of melded into the background of my memory.

I, too, find Juan a usually balanced liberal on some subjects, less balanced on others, so I am not picking on his performance today, just to pick on him.

If my memory serves me right, however, he was uncharacteristically in a state of denial on many subjects. The GZM was all Republican opposition driving the message. No matter what polls were cited, no matter what the other panelists said or even the host, Chris Wallace, he would NOT be persuaded that it was anything but Republicans (and, yes, that is his actual description) who were flogging this issue. A nationwide poll indicating 70% opposition? Republicans.

Now, I don't remember everything else, but it was basically that same answer no matter what the subject. Obama's dropping poll numbers? Republicans. The economy? Republicans. Bad employment numbers? Republicans.

I have never seen him quite this unhinged before. Not only were the other panelists doing eye rolls, snickering and trying to talk over him, but so was Chris Wallace. That is how bad it got.

Danube of Thought

I'd like to inquire of all those who encourage a policy of "outreach" to Islam: why Islam?

Should the U.S. not have a policy of outreach to Buddhism? To Hinduism? To Judaism? To (mirabile dictu) Christianity?

Why is it sound policy to foster "outreach" to this one religion, whose adherents comprise but one fifth of the world population, to the effective exclusion of all others? Is there something, well... different about Islam? What, pray tell, might any such difference be?

Let me guess: they have somehow been uniquely oppressed, not simply by the West, but especially by the U.S. (If that is indeed the reason, permit me to be so rude as to request details.)

Thomas Collins

Bunkerbuster's and Frank Rich's keen insight into the Afghan mind now put into persepctive Harvard accommodating Muslim women who would like to exercise without those icky males around (see LUN). It is all part of the US's grand strategy to get Central Asian tribal chieftains to support us against the Taliban and Taliban leaning elements of ISI!


Thanks, cc.

doT, what about outreach to those minority Christians who are being raped and pillaged from Pakistan to Egypt?


Oh, it is coming back to me now . . . before I go bed and forget again . . .

One topic was how Democrats were distancing themselves from Obama and his policies in many areas (GZ Mosque, Health Care, the economy, etc, etc) and how the DNC's only avenue of attack left was to bash Bush. Juan was adamant that Bush was the cause of all ills and that it was the exactly correct method of appealing to voters. Again, even Chris Wallace couldn't talk him down off of that ledge, though he did try.


We have an "outreach" to Islam because they tried to blow the bejesus out of us. Those in charge of our defense think that an outreach is better than a stern defense. I think not, but that is the reason our "outreach" is to Islam and no one else. Honestly, has everyone in the State Department taken an oath to be no smarter than Hillary? This is obscene. I don't mind a good argument, but so far these jokers haven't given us one. The best they can do is say, "I won."

Someone used the phrase, adoptive admission, this "outreach" scam is exactly that.

Dave (in MA)

Made this circa the first Tea Party protest in '09.

Gnothi Seauton; What you never miss.

What's wondrous about bunker is the complete lack of consciousness of the brilliant irony of his writing.

Jim Ryan

...said that he is "a Christian, of course," putting the recent skuttlebutt about his being a Muslim firmly to rest.

"Our church teaches hatred of whites and Jews, as well as an appreciation of social justice," the president said. "That makes it markedly different from Islam, which really lacks a social justice teaching informed by the progressive tradition and really has nothing against whites at all."

When asked about the difference between his faith and that of the Nazis planning to erect the clubhouse, the president was quick to point out that "Nazis do not accept blacks but do accept whites." When asked of any further differences, the president could list none, except to say, "Ours is more of an international socialism, whereas...."


Well they turned me down what does that tell you, it may have been I wasn't fluent in enough languages, but really does that seem
like the major issue, with some of the work
product you see out there

Danube of Thought

Come on, Bubu, don't be afraid: tell us whether you favor a policy of outreach to Islam and, if so, why? Do you find something very special about Islam?


Can we just start start flushing Frank Rich and Nick Kristof columns down the toilet like we supposedly did with that Gitmo Koran?

Since that NEWSWEEK flushing Koran story was a lie start to finish, yet had huge real world repercussions, how about we ban the Cordoba Mosque, but go ahead and let NEWSWEEK and the NYTIMES lie that it got built anyway.

That lie will win the necessary hearts and minds in Afghanistan since those nutcase zealots buy off on lies all the time anyway, and since the Cordoba Mosque won't be built over here, it'll win the hearts and minds of all us homegrown right wing bigoted Islamo-phobes zealots like Rush and Palin and Dean and Harry Reid etc.

Seems to me that that's a simple solution who's time has come.

I think the only problem will be in trying to convince The New York Times to willfully and consciously publish what they know to be a lie. I know it's a long shot, but I do actually think there's a one in a million chance that the reporters and editors of the Old Gray Lady might actually veer from their journalistic standards just this once, and knowingly publish a lie.


Interesting: Haven't read the comment thread yet but,

TM, am in Singapore. The ad along JOM's border where you normally see that pretty girl in the T-Shirt is replaced with Muslim.Com. It's 6 small photos of pretty Muslim girls wearing headdress scarfs, (one with I guess her friendly looking boyfriend) and info on how to click on the link to meet Islamic single girls for a lasting, meaningful relationship.

JOM: Bringing Muslim couples together since August 2010!

What can't TM do?

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