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August 23, 2010

Comments

narciso

Right, that's on par everything else you've been wrong about in the LUN

daddy

BBC had a good round table of Muslim scholars just after 9/11 wherein they were trying to decide if Muhammed himself had authorized and participated in 26 or was it 27 offensive Jihad's during his lifetime.

I went with the guy thinking it was 27 Offensive Jihads orchestrated by the Prophet, (my bias) but thats because I thought that scholar seemed to know his s*&t pretty well.

So I guess organizing and participating in 26 or 27 Offensive Jihad's exactly equates to Jesus throwing the moneychangers out of the Temple "for turning the place into a den of thieves", and also for saying that in the last days it will be so awful that if a man has 2 cloaks he should sell 1 for a sword for protection.

Obviously exact equivalence between the 2 marvelous religious leaders and their statements and actions, so naturally we should look elsewhere than the text to figure out what the hell motivates Jihadi's in their Jihad's against the Koran's specifically named enemies: "Jews, Christians, Pagans, Infidels and Unbelievers."

Maybe it's cartoons. Anybody know if Constantinople or India or Egypt or Libya or Tunisia or Spain or Sicily or Southern France or Malaysia or Indonesia or the Philippines was big into Muhammed cartoons?

Matthew Crandall

BunkBlaster, that noted defender of non-violent anti-abortion Christians, should read one the MANY MANY books chronicling the attacks of libs and MSMer's on Christians and Christianity... at the LUN.

Jim Ryan

your spelling is generally much better than that

Rick, I think Ignatz merely fat-fingered "prog" rather than misspelling it.

Ignatz

I considered the alternative Rick, but decorum prevented it.
Besides I've always like prig in reference to a goof like bubu;
prig (prig)
noun;
1.a person who is annoyingly smug in his or her moral behavior, attitudes, etc.
2.a person who is annoyingly fastidious about rules, small details, etc.

jimmyk

I think Ignatz merely fat-fingered "prog"

I thought Rick had in mind mistaking "g" for "ck".

From Narciso's link on the Polish plane crash:

"Polish Radio RMF has reported that one of the Russian-made black-box recordings contains a 16-second gap."

Has anyone seen Rosemary Woods lately?

Ignatz

--Yes, and our last two interventions to overthrow mullahs and dictators have turned out so well, haven't they?--

If you're speaking of Iraq and Afghanistan Ledeen has never advocated such an intervention in Iran, so your response is nonsense.

--What could possibly go wrong by helping to foment chaos in an out of the way place like Iran, with no strategic resources? That could never come back to bite us in the ass, could it?--

Gee yeah. They might start financing terrorists or try to build a nuke or pledge to destroy the great satan or something.

DrJ

daddy, check your email.

cathyf
...an out of the way place like Iran, with no strategic resources...
Yeah, it's really good that oil is not at all important to the global economy and there has never been any occasions when oil producers have manipulated supplies for strategic political reasons.
anduril

Right, that's on par everything else you've been wrong about in the LUN

Beautiful, narciso. Diana West, the Neocon expert on Polish affairs. And let's look at her two sources:

Fakt:

Like Bild and other tabloid press products, Fakt has been subjected to criticism concerning its style of journalism from media watchdogs. Twice so far, the Association of Polish Journalists awarded Fakt with its "Hyena Of The Year" award for "particular unscrupulousness and neglect of the principles of the journalistic work ethic": In 2004, Fakt had published a photograph showing the nude dead body of a murder victim; in 2005 it had published the photo of an innocent person with the caption "This sex offender is at large".

A sample cover:

And then there's Nasz Dziennik:

Nasz Dziennik ("Our Daily") is a Polish daily newspaper, published since 1998. It is considered conservative, patriot, and traditional Catholic. Part of a media empire founded by Fr Tadeusz Rydzyk, the owner of Radio Maryja[1][2], it usually leans towards right oriented and patriot-Catholic parties.

Let's see... Fr. Rydzyk, Radio Maryja... Wasn't Rydzyk and Radio Maryja rather critical of the now martyred President Lech Kaczynski? Oh, yeah...

Stir over priest's 'anti-Semitic remarks'

Father Tadeusz Rydzyk, 62, allegedly called the Polish president, Lech Kaczynski, a "swindler" who had bowed to pressure from the Jewish lobby to compensate people for property lost during and after World War II.

The comments came to light last week after the weekly magazine, Wprost, published excerpts and subsequently a tape, from a private lecture it said the priest gave to students at his media centre in Torun, northern Poland.

In it, Fr Rydzyk, reportedly criticises Mr Kaczynski for his subservience to the Jewish lobby.

"You know that it's about giving $65bn," to the Jews, he allegedly said. "They will come to you and say 'give me your coat. Take off your pants. Give me your shoes'," the magazine reported.

Interesting bedfellows you keep, narciso, you and Diana West. Imagine what the reaction would be if I were to quote these sources as authority for ANYTHING. You'd be calling me, what was that term you used not long ago? JEWBAITER? Yes, I think that was it, wasn't it?

As a matter of fact I'm aware of tension over the investigation, but until I learn of irregularities from more reputable sources, I'll hold my fire. The most recent word I've seen--which came out days before Diana West's article--is that the requested documentation was in fact handed over: Russia gives plane crash evidence to Poland. But that's an AP report. Maybe you're waiting to get the word from Diana West via Radio Maryja.

anduril

cathyf, you're as dumb as a box of rocks.

anduril

They might start financing terrorists or try to build a nuke or pledge to destroy the great satan or something.

Things that our "allies" Pakistan and Saudi Arabia would never do.

Danube of Thought

Anyone object to banning Islam outright

Much as I would like to see that entire stupid and murderous religion disappear, the notion that it could be "banned" is extraordinarily stupid,

Two questions that won't go away:

--Why should the US have a policy of outreach toward Islam, but not toward any other religion?

--Why are the borders of Islam bloody?

Are the resident Islamophiles lacking in the courage to respond? It would seem so...

jimmyk

Anduril, you may want to think about why it may be hard to tell when you are being sarcastic. Saying Iran has no strategic resources actually sounds more sane than some of your other rants.

I don't always agree with cathyf, but dumb she ain't.

Ignatz

--cathyf, you're as dumb as a box of rocks--

You owe cathy an apology.
I purposely didn't comment on that phrase of yours because it was unclear what you meant. Your grammar caused the misunderstanding. It still isn't clear if you meant we would be fomenting chaos with no plausible strategic resources of our own to bring to bear or if you were being a sarcastic smart ass about their strategic resources.
Prig is an all purpose word.

PD

No one is copying her style. Have you seen anyone else trying to copy her?

Why, yes. I wear a belt every day.

Though not to cinch up my boobs.

PD

No one in the U.S. mainstream media attacked peaceful, moderate Christians over those murders.

Methinks you need to visit BK to offset your stupid.

bunkerbuster

From wikipedia:
``The Catholic Church saw new opportunity with the arrival of the National Socialist Workers Party Nazi Party. Since most of its chief leadership was overwhelmingly Catholic, and most of its rank and file were in agreement with the Catholic Church's philosophy on woker justice, the Papacy pushed decisive support through the Catholic Centrist and Conservative Parties into backing Hitler as Chancellor. Hitler was quick to pay back this key support when upon coming to power, he immediately started negotiations with the Church on a concordant. However, in the long run, the reality was a curtailment of the Church's power.
``On 30 January 1933, Adolf Hitler was appointed Chancellor. On 23 March 1933, his government was given dictatorial powers through an Enabling Act passed by all parties in the Reichstag except the Social Democrats and Communists (whose deputies had already been arrested). Hitler had obtained the votes of the Centre Party, led by Prelate Ludwig Kaas, by issuing oral guarantees of the party's continued existence and the autonomy of the Church and her educational institutions. He also promised good relations with the Holy See, which some interpret as a hint to a future concordat.''
The rest, as they say, is history. Hitler and the Nazis were Christian in name only. While their use of religion as a camouflage for gangsterism is undeniable and the tactic translates directly into the methods of bin Laden and his ilk. They are Islamic only by their own measures. The vast majority of Islamic leaders and lay Muslims condemn not only bin Laden's views and tactics, but his claim to represent Islam.

Crandall: any examples of mainstream media types smearing Christians? Or are you just making that up?

glasater

In the not good news department:

Mexican military kills U.S. motorist at checkpoint

Sorry I missed the earlier fun... And bunkerbuster--go to bed. Give it a rest.

pagar

A new massacre by followers of Religion of Peace.

Extraneus

If we had only reached out to al-Shabab.

Jane

Wow - Of all the people I might be inclined to call stupid, Cathy is nowhere on that list. I guess that says quite a bit about you anduril.

DebinNC

Charlie Gibson smeared Sarah Palin in her first national interview by claiming she'd stood in her church and said God was on our side in Iraq. ABC edited the accompanying video, removing the context which showed she was actually quoting Abraham Lincoln on the importance of our being of God's side.

bunkerbuster

DoT asks: ``Why should the US have a policy of outreach toward Islam, but not toward any other religion?''
The U.S. should have a policy of outreach to all religions, as long as those policies do not involve things like spending public money to promote one religion to the exclusion of another, eg school prayer and so on, per the Constitution.

Dot queries: ``Why are the borders of Islam bloody?''
They aren't. In fact, they are considerably less bloody than some others.
The major-league mayhem of our era has been perpetrated by non-Muslims, from Stalin's terror, to Hitler's Holocaust, Mao's ``great'' murderous leap and the Khmer Rouge's ``Year Zero'' killing fields.

World War II, the death-toll champion, started among nations that defined themselves formally or informally as Christian, with exception of Japan, which arguably entered well after the war among Christian nations had started.

Just today, the NY Times front page observes that the murder rate is higher in Venezuela than in Iraq. I suspect it's higher as well in Mexico and Colombia, as well, compared with the Saudi Arabian border and, even, occupied Palestine. Yet only a bigot or ignoramus would blame Catholicism.

Given the record, and DoT's naked assertions about violence being inherent to Islam, shouldn't the surprise be that the biggest massacres are the work of non-Muslims? How is that this terribly violent religion has been so outdone in mass murder by Christians, atheists and Confucians?

I'm sure DoT is aware of these facts. Yet he feels compelled to rigorously ignore them, perhaps in the expectation that the Campaign of Hate against Muslims is loud enough to make his risible claims about Islam being notably "bloody" seem plausible to some.

Muslims have far more often been the victims of mass murder, rather than the perpetrators. Though this has almost nothing to do with what it says in the Koran and much more to do with the post-colonial syndrome that afflicts so much of the Third World, in particular countries with vast mineral resources available to enable the entrenchment of kleptocracies like Saddam's regime, the Saudis and even Iran's nominal theocracy. These kleptocracies inevitably compel rivals inside and out and competition for clients, such as the U.S. and Russia, further fueling conflict, while suppressing economic and political development at home.

Indeed, some of the very worst actors in the Middle East have successfully used Islam to camouflage their gangster deeds, and even more directly and to a greater extent than the Nazis and Ku Klux Klan have used Christianity to conceal theirs. And to the extent that Islam can be bent to that use, it of course shares some tangential portion of blame. The pattern remains, though: far more innocents are killed by non-Muslims, who have had 13 centuries to bring mass murder, but have yet to do so in anything like the numbers of their Christian, atheist and nominally Confucian neighbors.
When we do the math, it’s obvious. The “bloody borders” belong to Christian, atheist and Confucian countries, not Muslims.

cathyf

anduril, one of the things about using sarcasm to make a point is that other people might use sarcasm when agreeing with you.

*smooches*

bunkerbuster

Still waiting for an example of someone in the U.S. mainstream media claiming that Christianity at large is responsible for abortion murders. I'm guessing there are none. I'm certain I've never seen any.

DebinNC

Wow - Of all the people I might be inclined to call stupid, Cathy is nowhere on that list.

That comment was so astoundingly and obviously wrong, it makes one wonder why someone (who's not stupid imo) would post such a thing?

boris

IF: Nazis == Jihadists
THEN: Moderate muslims == Compliant Germans

IF: KKK == Jihadists
THEN: Moderate muslims == Compliant southern whites

When genuine moderate muslims of the non-compliant persuasion claim the mosque would serve jihadists ends, bubu refuses to entertain their authority. Does bubu speak for "moderate muslims" ??? No, bubu speaks for carp.

It seems that in the Middle East the compliant persuasion is still the majority.

Jane

Can you imagine bubu defending Christians or Christianity?

I can't.

Old Lurker

Perhaps the stupidest post in a long time:

"cathyf, you're as dumb as a box of rocks."

We would all hope the be as dumb as Cathy.

Melinda Romanoff

Jane-

He just uses whatever tool is appropriate for the meme, no need to be consistent, other than conservatives can't belong because....(fill in made up fact here).....

[place ad hominem argument here}

[use name, and add insult here]

{ed. note- sometimes this format gets the name and insult first, but not as often. It is a disguise for a lack of imagination, other than the occaisional bouts of projection.}

Rob Crawford

When genuine moderate muslims of the non-compliant persuasion claim the mosque would serve jihadists ends, bubu refuses to entertain their authority. Does bubu speak for "moderate muslims" ??? No, bubu speaks for carp.

Bubu is a moral, intellectual, and emotional infant.

PD

Muslims have far more often been the victims of mass murder, rather than the perpetrators.

Indeed. The majority of al Qaeda's victims, for example, are other Muslims.

Not sure how that helps your point.

Rob Crawford

PD -- why are you arguing with the idiot? He's already made it clear that facts are less important to him than protecting his self-identity as a preening leftist.

Melinda Romanoff

Rob-

PD is suffering from cheesehead syndrome, usually starts at the end of August, but clears up by Labor Day.

It's a seasonal thing. I suffer from it's opposite, BTW.

It's treatable, but it's way too early to start drinking.

centralcal

Good morning! Well once again we see who is lugging around a box of dumb rocks and it certainly isn't cathyf.

hit and run

Melinda:
but it's way too early to start drinking.

That's a personal choice.

hit and run

HAPPY BIRTHDAY CHARLIE!!!

May your next 20,089 days are as good as your first 20,089 days.

anduril

OK, cathyf, I've reread what I wrote and what you wrote, and I'm gonna take you at your word--you were employing sarcasm to agree with me and register your disagreement with Ledeen, Ignatz and the others. If that's the case, you get the apology others, but not you, are demanding. And I'll go further and say that, if you're agreeing that it's the height of irresponsibility to foment revolution in a strategically vital region without any well thought out and truly viable endgame, then you're welcome aboard.

hit and run

Wait. What?

"May your next...are as good as..."

Sheesh. Maybe I shouldn't have started drinking so early afterall

Rob Crawford

It's treatable, but it's way too early to start drinking.

Just declare yourself to be operating in a different time zone.

Ignatz

In just one minute[heh] of looking I found this excrescence from the Guardian heaping blame on Bill O'Reilly, Focus on the Family, Randall Terry, a priest named Frank Pavone and Lashawn Barber for abortionist George Tiller's murder last year. Of course the goalposts have already changed significantly from "no one blamed peaceful moderate Christians" to no one blamed "Christianity at large" so it's pointless looking any farther cause bubu is an "identity" leftist who is "intellectually dishonest" and will continue moving the goalposts because he'll redefine 'moderate' or 'peaceful' or 'Christian' or 'at' or 'one' or merely move on to entirely new pastures of asininity.

Clarice

Happy birthdaym Chaco!
Cathyf dumb? Brother!

Now, I oppose the mosque at GZ; I oppose the notion of making special concessions to Moslems that are ridiculous (like cabs refusing to carry dogs or liquor) and I think we ought to call Moslem jihadi, terorists, OTOH some people really are going too far. At Lucianne someone posted a story that while in Spain, Michelle made a dusk visit to the Cordoba Mosque--and the commenters are making fools of themselves. It's now a Cathedral, guys. It's an incredible site. One shouldn't miss it if near there.

This is going too far.

anduril

That comment was so astoundingly and obviously wrong, it makes one wonder why someone (who's not stupid imo) would post such a thing?

I think cathyf could explain that to you, Deb, but I'll go ahead. It's because for a long time now she's been sniping at me, provoking me to admonish her on several occasions to grow up. This all arose because cathyf intruded several times in areas in which I have actual expertise and was unwilling to listen when I politely tried to explain a few things. If cathyf now wishes to engage ideas and abandon ad hominem sniping, I'm as pleased as anyone else.

There's actually a longer history, which goes back to Jane introducing Sibel Edmunds to the forum and being warned off that topic by Clarice. I supported DOJ-OIG's assessment of Edmunds' whistleblowing:

A Review of the FBI's Actions in Connection With Allegations Raised
By Contract Linguist Sibel Edmonds

Sibel Edmonds

and was relentlessly and dishonestly vilified as a result.

Melinda Romanoff

Rob-

It's entirely related to the after-effects of drinking Lake Michigan tap water, or the Lake Superior aquifer, I can't remember which on does it. I hear it causes some to turn purple, could be myth though.

PD
(MarketWatch) -- US stocks tumbled after a report on home sales last month came in much worse than expected, falling to its lowest level in 15 years, sending an already down market reeling Tuesday.

See? They don't always use the exact word "unexpectedly"!

Danube of Thought

The U.S. should have a policy of outreach to all religi

How odd. The last two presidents, for some reason, have singled out Islam. Why do you suppose that is, Bubu?

In fact, they are considerably less bloody than some others.

The examples cited are the Soviet Union (lasted less than a single lifetime), Nazi Germany (the twelve-year Reich), and the Khmer Rouge (four years). And yet the Islamic slaughter of innocents goes on and on and on...

Japan, which arguably entered well after the war among Christian nations had started

That would be news to the people of, for example, Manchukuo.

How is that this terribly violent religion has been so outdone in mass murder by Christians, atheists and Confucians?

None of the latter has been done in the name of those religions. Islam stands alone.

Just today, the NY Times front page observes that the murder rate is higher in Venezuela than in Iraq

Were the Venezuelan murders done in the name of a religion?

Yet he feels compelled to rigorously ignore them

Try to avoid those split infinitives.

``Why are the borders of Islam bloody?''
They aren't.

Why did Prof. Huntington coin the phrase?

And why do we suppose that Bubu has embarked on a campaign of hatred against Christianity? And it's all done in the name of defending an indefensible and murderous gutter religion that hangs homosexuals and stones adulterers...

Ignatz

And the 10 year yield is now back to mid 2008 levels, and we know what that presaged a few months later.

Danube of Thought

Minus 18 at Raz today.

Jane

There's actually a longer history, which goes back to Jane introducing Sibel Edmunds to the forum

I never introduced Sibel Edmunds to the forum anduril.

Chaco, happy birthday - and I actually divided Hit's #of days by 365 and you were still younger than me.

jimmyk

OT-Unexpected:
"Home resales dropped a record 27.2% -- nearly twice as much as analysts had expected -- to an annual rate of 3.83 million, the National Association of Realtors said. Meanwhile, inventories rose to 12.5 months from 8.9 months in June, pressuring already depressed home prices. Inventories are at their highest level in more than a decade." (from the WSJ, emphasis added)

centralcal

anybody just watch the Shirley Sherrod show with Secretary Vilsack? gag!

Rob Crawford

Ignatz | August 24, 2010 at 10:04 AM

Excellent effort, but you left out the discussion of his preening.

Old Lurker

Don't you wish the econmists would publish what they expect before the fact?

Yes, yes I know some do...but we all know that qualifier is added by the reporters for political reasons most times.

And HB, Chaco. Jane's right...you are a young'n.

Sue

Whoa! She declined the job offer. It's lawsuit time. Doesn't she have an obligation to mitigate her damages?

Clarice

I believe Sibel Edmonds worked in a highly compartmentalized operation; that she tumbled upon a counter-intel op and blabbed about things she knew nothing about which is why the Congressional investigation was quickly dropped. She might have heard what she says she heard but she had no notion of what it meant.

Period.


anduril

I never introduced Sibel Edmunds to the forum anduril.

Oh, yes, you did. I'd never heard of her until I read a post of yours drawing attention to what she had to say about Marc Grossman. You were immediately warned off the topic by Clarice, and never raised it again.

Threadkiller

There may be a reason why BB has to defend all of Islam the way he does. I think he may have studied more about the religion than he lets on.

When you look at the quote of ">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Ghazali"> Abū hāmed Muhammad ibn Muhammad al-Ghazālī , one of the most celebrated scholars in the history of Sunni Islamic thought, you realize what the thought process is to some of the most devoted followers.

” Know that a lie is not wrong in itself, but only because of the evil conclusions to which it leads the hearer, making him believe something that is not really the case. Ignorance sometimes is an advantage, and if a lie causes this kind of ignorance it may be allowed. It is sometimes a duty to lie... if lying and truth both lead to a good result, you must tell the truth, for a lie is forbidden in this case. If a lie is the only way to reach a good result, it is allowable. A lie is lawful when it is the only path to duty... We must lie when truth leads to unpleasant results, but tell the truth when it leads to good results. "
anduril

LOL! It sure didn't take long for Clarice to launch into full damage control mode!

Rob Crawford

The U.S. should have a policy of outreach to all religions...

*snort*

Excuse me -- I hadn't realized the moron was being this dishonest. Identity leftists would go ape-shit if, say, President Bush had announced a policy of "outreach" towards Christians of any denomination anywhere in the world. The only acceptable "religions" to leftists are Islam and the Green Faith -- and the former solely because it is allied with them against liberty and civilization.

jimmyk

Bubu likes to trumpet how Muslim leaders have condemned Bin Laden, but how many have condemned Hamas, Hezbollah, or more generally terrorist acts against Israel--unconditionally? He also cites polls in which a bare majority--just a majority like 62%!--condemn terrorism unconditionally. A poll of Christians and Jews in America would undoubtedly find 99%. He calls these polls "scientific", as if the responders can't say whatever the heck they want. He doesn't seem to notice that the results imply that 38% support terrorism. And polls that actually mean something, like elections, such as those in the disputed territories, give majority support to the parties favoring terrorism.

bunkerbuster

boring says: IF: Nazis == Jihadists
THEN: Moderate muslims == Compliant Germans
IF: KKK == Jihadists
THEN: Moderate muslims == Compliant southern whites

Close enough. Which is why no one blames all Southern Whites for the acts committed by the Ku Klux Klan. Instead, people blame the Klan itself. No one could credible object to Southern Whites building, say, a Bible factory, next to a black neighborhood, because of their history of being "compliant" with the Ku Klux Klan.
Likewise, no one considers that driving a Mercedes or BMW is giving aid and comfort to people who "complied" with Nazism.
In fact, both Southern Whites and Germans have an impressive track record of supporting peace and freedom and opposing bigotry and totalitarianism. Whatever "compliance" they had with the Klan and other forms of white supremacy is in no way definitive, just as the "compliance" of moderate Muslims with terrorists is not.

Chubby

((While their use of religion as a camouflage for gangsterism is undeniable and the tactic translates directly into the methods of bin Laden and his ilk.))

uhhm, no.

The main point about Hilter and the Nazis is that they worked within the establishment with much public approval. Nazi operations were not in any way comparable to misfits holed up in isolated lawless countries and caves led by a leader everyone says or gives lip service as crazy.

The main point about Hitler is that his foolish hordes of appeasers and supporters within civilized society learned too late how badly they had been duped.

The rest of your post, as they say, is garbage.

Danube of Thought

the post-colonial syndrome that afflicts so much of the Third World, in particular countries with vast mineral resources available to enable the entrenchment of kleptocracies like Saddam's regime, the Saudis and even Iran's nominal theocracy

I suppose one should never pass up an opportunity to blame things on those nasty colonial powers (of which the US was not one), but in this instance the facts intrude horribly.

Iraq, prior to 1918, was part of the Ottoman Empire, which made a poor choice of which side to fight with in World War I. It lost, and was dismantled. Iraq was thereafter administered by the British under a League of Nations mandate. When you're on the losing side of a global conflict, bad things will happen to you, but calling those things colonialism is error.

Who colonized Iran? Who colonized Saudi Arabia?

bunkerbuster

Chub: no one claims the only relevant fact about Nazis is that they gamed religious people and used Christianity to cloak their deeds. My claim is merely that they did, just as the bin Ladenists have and that ordinary Muslims are no more responsible for that than ordinary Christians are for Nazism.

PD

More persecution and killing of Muslims:

The Taliban targeted pro-government leaders in coordinated attacks today in Pakistan's troubled northwest, killing 25 people in three bombings and suicide attacks.

The largest strike took place at a mosque in the town of Wana in South Waziristan. In the explosion, 18 people were killed.

“Apparently it was a suicide attack and Maulana Noor Mohammed was the target,” an intelligence official told Dawn. Mohammed served as a member of Pakistan's parliament and had served as a negotiator between the Taliban and the government in the past.

Over the past few years, the Taliban have shown no reservations about striking inside mosques and other religious sites [see list below]. There have been 23 major attacks on mosques and other Islamic institutions in Pakistan since December 2007, according to information compiled by The Long War Journal.

Persecution and killing by other Muslims, that is. Sadly, this is completely unremarkable in the Islamic world.

bunkerbuster

Jimmyk asserts: ``A poll of Christians and Jews in America would undoubtedly find 99%.''
Wrong again, Jim:
The University of Maryland's Program on International Public Attitudes in December 2006 conducted a concurrent public opinion poll of the United States and Iran.

One of the questions was whether "bombings and other types of attacks intentionally aimed at civilians are sometimes justified"? Americans approved of such attacks by a much larger margin than Iranians -- 51-16% (and a much, much larger margin than American Muslims -- 51-13%.

So no, the data show that ordinary Americans are a lot more supportive of terrorism than Iranians.

PD

So no, the data show that ordinary Americans are a lot more supportive of terrorism than Iranians.

And yet Iranians engage in terrorism a lot more than Americans, who conduct conventional warfare. Huh.

Rick Ballard

"Don't you wish the economists would publish what they expect before the fact?"

OL,

Some do. And some can't buy a clue, even though they own the damned printing presses. Alternatively, the fact that the problem will have a duration of 5-7 years, regardless of the actions taken by the Fed, may be so politically unpalatable that lying through their teeth is the only choice deemed available. After all, it's not as if an impeccably credentialed moron has all that many venues that offer the pay and perks to which they have become accustomed.

On the much brighter side - the collapse of the MBS/ABS/CDS idiocy will get rid of a lot of the rot in the foundation of the economy.

pagar

Narciso, that was a great link on Brennan, who has somehow supposedly become our hid our head in the sand counterterrorism expert.

There is a Pajama Media link that fits into the same hid our head in the sand Concept.

"A response to Lee Smith, who says that the former House speaker is wrong to mention sharia, since it is a “hopelessly abstract concept” and an “Orientalist fantasy.”

" The stealth scenario is slightly less preposterous — jihadis insinuating their way through our legal and political systems to slowly Islamize a credulous U.S. public degree by degree "
Apparently our so called experts think that all this Mega Mosques are harmless.

Jane

No Anduril, I didn't. You have me mixed up with someone else. Why not do a search and admit it.

And it's all done in the name of defending an indefensible and murderous gutter religion that hangs homosexuals and stones adulterers...

I never understood how people who are so intent the "rights" of gays are also so willing to see them murdered for being gay. Can you explain that bubu?

Sue

BB should link to the poll he is citing using the word "intentionally". It isn't there.

Jane

Rick I just got a very weird spam email from someone using your name.

Sue

http://www.worldpublicopinion.org/pipa/pdf/jan07/Iran_Jan07_quaire.pdf>Here is the poll.

It does say intentionally. I missed it the first time.

Continue reading the questions after that one. Seems it depends on the meaning of intentionally. And who you are targeting.

Threadkiller

--“Which is why no one blames all Southern Whites for the acts committed by the Ku Klux Klan.””--

">http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn?pagename=article&contentId=A20730-2002Dec6&notFound=true"> Lott Decried For Part Of Salute to Thurmond

And from">http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/story?id=101153&page=1"> ABC

”The director(Spike Lee), famous as a provocateur, said he had no proof that Lott was affiliated with the Ku Klux Klan, but that his Dec. 5 remarks praising Thurmond made him a good candidate for the racist organization.

They just blame the conservative whites that aren’t tied to the Klan. And forget about their party members who ran the Klan.

cathyf
I hear it causes some to turn purple, could be myth though.
Wait just a minute I'm confused! I thought it caused people to turn green on one side and yellow on the other, or blue on one side and orange on the other?
anduril

No Anduril, I didn't. You have me mixed up with someone else. Why not do a search and admit it.

I have a very clear recollection of the incident. It was the first time I ever heard of Sibel Edmonds, and you were excited because you thought you had discovered a new angle on Marc Grossman's involvement in the Libby thing. If I didn't have such a clear recollection I wouldn't be asserting it. If anyone can find it, I'd appreciate it. What caught my attention at the time was the way Clarice immediately jumped in (just like today) to tell you to drop it because here sources (which I took to mean, "Richard Perle") told her that Edmonds was unreliable. That's when I did some research and found that, to the contrary, OIG determined that she had been reliable and had been retaliated against. And that the FBI had been wrong in ignoring her whistleblowing.

Chubby

(( My claim is merely that they did, just as the bin Ladenists have and that ordinary Muslims are no more responsible for that than ordinary Christians are for Nazism. ))

your ludicrous comparison doesn't work; Nazism and Christianity don't share the same scripture and are not the same thing at all so why would anyone but an overreaching simpleton blame Christianity for Nazism? However bin Laden and moderate Islam are all Muslim, and they all share the same scriptures.

Threadkiller

Cathyf, don't tell Melinda. It actually changes the color of certain body parts. I saw it on Discovery.

Threadkiller

--"why would anyone but an overreaching simpleton blame Christianity for Nazism?"--

Please see my 10:35.

Jane

I have a very clear recollection of the incident. It was the first time I ever heard of Sibel Edmonds, and you were excited because you thought you had discovered a new angle on Marc Grossman's involvement in the Libby thing.

Your "very clear recollection" has confused me with someone else. So perhaps your recollection isn't that clear at all.

Jack is Back!

Here in Florida it is primary day and after voting I went our local Veteran's Muster meeting. There we had a guy on the committee who is 90 years old, plays golf each day and bocce on Wednesdays and Saturdays. He is a surviving member of the Battle of Attu in 1943. For you young'uns out there that was the only land battle fought during WW2 on American soil (and don't give me that crap about Alaska being only a possession like Guam and American Samoa). We have decided to have him speak at our Muster on 11/11/10 along with a young Air Force vet of 2 tours in Iraq and 1 in Afghanistan. We're also trying to get someone down from NAS Jax, especially from HS-7 since they fly their Seahawks by us every day keeping the russkie subs at 200 miles off shore.

But what I wanted to mention is that primary days are usually yawners at my precinct polling place. Not today. The parking lot was filling up pretty fast at 0800hrs and people were waiting in line to vote. And we have a 2 week early voting window in Florida. Also, we are starting to see more and more NOPE bumper stickers and especially the "01-21-13 End of an Error" window stickers on cars and vans that still carry remnants of Obama/Biden stickers. It appears us "intolerants" are inching closer and closer to the changelings.

anduril

I don't think so. I have a good memory for stuff like that.

Jane

Clearly you do not, or you would have proven it.

cathyf

Well in Illinois at least drinking water comes pretty much from 4 sources:

-- deep-aquifer wells, which are slightly radioactive (pico-curies per liter)

-- shallow wells, frequently tainted with agricultural runoff

-- river water (mostly Mississippi -- they don't call the Illinois River the "Metropolitan Sanitary Canal" for nothing)

-- Lake Michigan, turning purple is a small price to pay.

Melinda Romanoff

cathyf-

That's why I wasn't too sure about which aquifer was involved.

Jane

So what can we do about Obama's failure to separate church and state by funding all those overseas mosques. Apparently he is not funding any churches. Obviously the guy couldn't care less about the constitution - So what are the remedies?

pagar

"worse than expected"is not unexpected. I expected that would be the case.

Chubby

ok TK, overreaching simpletons AND deliberate dissemblers.

Rob Crawford

The main point about Hitler is that his foolish hordes of appeasers and supporters within civilized society learned too late how badly they had been duped.

No, the main point about Hitler is that you cannot trust a state -- any state -- with that much power.

No one was duped by Hitler. Some may have fooled themselves into believing he didn't mean everything he said, but no one was duped. His policies were -- and are -- extremely popular with the American left.

But why discuss Hitler? Because his fellow socialist is attempting to distract us?

the post-colonial syndrome that afflicts so much of the Third World

Oh, God. Is there anything more racist than the leftist "post-colonial" dogma? How many generations have to pass before people are responsible for their own actions?

Jane

Oh, God. Is there anything more racist than the leftist "post-colonial" dogma? How many generations have to pass before people are responsible for their own actions?

You nailed it Rob. The left preaches that minorities are not capable of being responsible for themselves, which is about the most racist thing I've ever heard.

Chubby

((No, the main point about Hitler is that you cannot trust a state -- any state -- with that much power.))

other states can teach us that same lesson; the Hitler experiment contains some special lessons all its own

((No one was duped by Hitler. ))

don't you think the German people were duped into believing Hitler's promise of restored glory? that is how he rose to power

((But why discuss Hitler? Because his fellow socialist is attempting to distract us?))

because I believe it's a good idea to clear up false analogies


anduril

Clearly you do not, or you would have proven it.

That doesn't follow at all. Searching internet forums isn't easy, especially since I figure this had to go back to early 2006 or late 2005, at least. Nor do I claim to be an expert in searching. I haven't been able to find the first instance of "Sibel Edmonds" on JOM. I get back as far as 03/2006, when she's already an established topic.

If anyone can help, that's fine. Otherwise I'll stick with my clear recollection.

Maybe cathyf can help.

Jane

don't you think the German people were duped into believing Hitler's promise of restored glory? that is how he rose to power

I think it was the promise of a restored economy.

PD

The left preaches that minorities are not capable of being responsible for themselves, which is about the most racist thing I've ever heard.

Apparently it's okay to be racist if you couple it with the promise that if they agree to become wards of the state and vote for you, you'll take care of them. Which is even more racism, and more than a little suggestive of a slaveowner mentality.

Jane

Anduril, once again proving she is full of shit.

Rob Crawford

don't you think the German people were duped into believing Hitler's promise of restored glory? that is how he rose to power

How were they duped? He did take Germany from economic ruin to ruling most of Europe. That they failed to consider how the rest of the world would react is their own damned fault.

Extraneus

Very difficult to sift through the comments sometimes.

Here's an interesting thing.

Rights panel 'deeply concerned' about France's treatment of Roma or Gypsies

Europe's top human rights watchdog accused France on Tuesday of stigmatizing Roma people by blaming them for crime and expelling them from the country.

The panel, the European Commission against Racism and Intolerance, has repeatedly cautioned France about racism against Roma, also known as Gypsies, and urged the country to respect the rights of migrants from the minority.

[snip]

This summer French President Nicolas Sarkozy announced a crackdown on Roma as part of a larger "war" on delinquency. The practice of giving each Gypsy a few hundred euros (dollars) and flying them to their Romanian homeland is widely seen as discriminatory.

In recent weeks, French police have dismantled dozens of illegally installed Gypsy camps and flown the dwellers to Romania.

~12 million Mexican illegals? We could give them each $25,000 and still have "stimulus" money left after flying them back. That's $100K for a family of four.

Rob Crawford

The panel, the European Commission against Racism and Intolerance, has repeatedly cautioned France about racism against Roma, also known as Gypsies, and urged the country to respect the rights of migrants from the minority.

Gotta wonder how well the Roma do at respecting the rights of the majority in France.

Danube of Thought

No one could credible [sic] object to Southern Whites building, say, a Bible factory, next to a black neighborhood

If it were built in a black neighborhood in which 3,000 innocents had been slaughtered in the name of Christianity they would surely object, were it not for the fact that the blacks themselves are quite likely bible-reading Christians. If everyone living in the area of Ground Zero were Mohammedan, they would probably welcome the mosque.

You have really tied yourself in knots, Bubu, and it's a lot of fun to toy with you.

[Note to JOMers: Come on. Is this kid Bubu for real, or is one of you playing a huge joke by lobbing all these hanging curveballs?]

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Wilson/Plame