Sunday Morning Open Thread

Tyler Cowen on immigration - you want them coming over that wall.

Frank Rich may be overestimating his influence with his target audience, but he hopes to drive a wedge between Tea Partiers and Republicans.  It is hard to square his months of fear-mongering about the Tea Party with this:

But whatever Tuesday’s results, this much is certain: The Tea Party’s hopes for actually affecting change in Washington will start being dashed the morning after. The ordinary Americans in this movement lack the numbers and financial clout to muscle their way into the back rooms of Republican power no matter how well their candidates perform.

And he just noticed?

Finally, some Times coverage of Jon Stewart.

Comments

[Ignatz Ratzkywatzky]

--Ignatz, when my great-grandfather Anton came over in 1900, he kept speaking Hungarian (and German, and Czech, and Slovak -- the Austro-Hungarian Empire was pretty durn polyglot) and planned to go back to Szalgotarjan as soon as he got rich on the amazing wages in the US.--

Well first, did he come here illegally?
Second, I assumed that it was clear I was making a general statement which did not preclude exceptions to the rule.
Third, since the rest of the family came through Ellis Island, his family seemingly fits in the first group I mentioned not the second.

[Threadkiller]

Rove is the only ">http://www.peoplesworld.org/uncovering-the-real-arnold-schwarzenegger/"> Kamikaze I know of that flies into his own ship and lives!

”Schwarzenegger flew to Washington and visited the White House last April 10. He met with Karl Rove, George W. Bush’s chief political strategist. A White House spokesman said that Schwarzenegger “dropped by to talk about an after-school program … and to see what he could do to support U.S. troops overseas.” When reporters asked about the meeting, Rove said with a straight face, “politics were not discussed.”

Rove flew to California just before the recall was certified for the ballot. The San Francisco Chronicle reported that Rove met at the Bohemian Grove with “the Republican hierarchy, especially those close to former Gov. Pete Wilson” and signaled that the White House “would favor Schwarzenegger.” Within hours, Rep. Darrell Issa (R-Calif.) who had poured nearly $3 million of his own car alarm fortune into the recall, tearfully announced he would not seek the governorship.

Ever since, Rove and other GOP power brokers have been pressuring the other Republican candidates to remove themselves from the recall race. Bill Simon soon withdrew, as did Peter Ueberroth. The heat is now on Sen. Tom McClintock to step aside to avoid splitting the GOP vote.”

Back to my armchair.

[Threadkiller]

Sorry for the double post. I did not see the first one. :-(

[mockmook]

When armchair Kamikazes on the right decided that his antipathy to a deeply flawed Christine O'Donnell cancels out a lifetime still dedicated to getting Republicans elected.

Posted by: JM Hanes | October 31, 2010 at 03:50 PM

But why antipathy?

I thought this was his analyst hat.

Also, did he bother to look into the allegations against her (pretty trivial stuff, anyway), or was he only going on what the MSM reported?

Hey, did you hear that Rove was almost indicted? I heard it in the MSM. Bush drove drunk. When have you heard Rove's condemnation of THAT? Laura killed a man. Have we heard Rove's condemnation of that?

Spare me this clean toga BS.

[JM Hanes]

Captain Hate:

Oh please. I had to suck it up and vote for McCain too. It was like, shall I slit one wrist or two? You shout, I lecture, but I'll defer to Ogden">http://www.westegg.com/nash/o">Ogden Nash:

If you convinced me
And I convinced you,
Wouldn't there still be
Two points of view?

[Threadkiller]

More Nash,

Good wine needs no bush,
and perhaps products that people really want
need no hard-sell or soft-sell TV push.
Why not?
Look at pot.

[Sue]

I just looked at the transcript of the back and forth between Rove and Hannity that seems to have started all of this. I'm pretty sure Rove was voicing his disappointment in what he felt was a sure-fire republican pickup into a probably isn't going to happen moment. I agree he should have kept those thoughts to himself, but I'm not going to throw him out of the club because he said it. He has worked very hard to get non-establishment republicans elected.

Once upon a time, pre-Obama, I was one of those "throw the bums out we don't need no stinkin' RINOs" conservative. I have seen the results of throwing the bums out. It hasn't been pretty. If we have to stomach a few RINOs to rid ourselves of Pelosi/Reid leadership, then I am more than willing to stomach them. I would love to have that DE seat sown up with Castle. I will love it even more if O'Donnell pulls it off. We are not dealing with a president who will track to the right to keep the polls in his favor. We can't afford to let him have leaders in Congress who think likes he does.

[Threadkiller]

Sue,

Would you stomach Dede Scozzafava or Charlie Crist?

[Sara (Pal2Pal)]

Going back to my earlier reference to Berlinski/Thatcher - it was pointed out how Thatcher first made her bones when she said it was time for "mealy-mouthed" politicians to get out of the way.

Isn't that pretty much the message from the Tea Party? A message directed at both parties and is scaring the heck out of the so-called political elite (of both parties).

The American electorate is sending a message that they too are sick of the mealy-mouthed, let's go along to get along (and save our jobs) crowd. Any doubt? Chris Christie! The poster boy for anti-mealy-mouthism and on nearly everybody's wish he'd run in 2012 list, even though he has said no.

[Captain Hate]

Quoting Ogden Nash because you stepped in it? No; give me the deep flaws of O'Donnell that makes her a terrible candidate compared to Coons (or Biden for that matter) or admit that you bought into the Rove/MFM garbage.

[narciso]

Well we've seen the result with Jeffords, Specter and the wannabe Crist, no matter how you placate them, they ultimately turn, now
they become insufferable for the other side, but that's not our concern. Cap n Trade, that
Kirk shares, and the Leviathan that was the
DISCLOSE act were the final straw for those
who were wobbly on Castle, you can add the 'independent' Chaffee who will b e haunting
Providence it seems

[Sara (Pal2Pal)]

Charlie Crist

Charlie Crist has said he will caucus with the democrats, so no I wouldn't vote for him.

[Sue]

Sue,

Would you stomach Dede Scozzafava or Charlie Crist?

If it gave us the majority, why not? Instead of Reid running the agenda, it would be McConnell. I wouldn't stomach them as my representative, but if their constituents can stomach them, then I'm pretty much into the if they have an R after their name, then bring them on. Does that mean I want them to win? Hell no. Does that mean I'm going to fret because they aren't conservative enough for me? Hell no. Not many in the northeast are going to be conservative enough for me.

[Threadkiller]

A crusader's wife slipped from the garrison,
And had an affair with a Saracen;
She was not over-sexed,
Or jealous or vexed,
She just wanted to make a comparison.

[daddy]

Hundreds of comments behind but just for info, Sarah Palin saying Corrupt Bastards may be in reference to political chicanery that was going on in Juneau before she came up and helped clean house. There was a political in group of Legislators who called themselves the Corrupt Bastards, and they actually had baseball caps with a logo made of something like CB. It is probably on Google or on Wiki, and when I just heard Miller on Neil Cavuto he made mention of that as possibly being Sarah's reference.

Back to the comments.

[JM Hanes]

Threadkiller:

"Rove is the only Kamikaze I know of that flies into his own ship and lives!"

LOL!

mookmook:

"Spare me this clean toga BS."

I'm hardly the one with the litmus test in my pocket here. I'll just sit back in my own armchair and wait to see if the folks who will blame Rove if O'Donnell loses can bring themselves to thank him for almost singlehandedly getting Angle elected, if she wins -- and boots the majority leader to the curb.

[Threadkiller]

--"If it gave us the majority, why not?"--

Would it be a majority? Both have shown themselves to side with the dems when it suits them. Why do you think they would side with you?

[Sara (Pal2Pal)]

Via Althouse:

Ask whether the Democrats can win one for the Sorensen. Ted Sorensen, JFK's brain, has died at age 82. He held the title of special counsel, but Washington reporters of the era labeled him the president’s “intellectual alter ago” and “a lobe of Kennedy’s mind.”

[Captain Hate]

Once upon a time, pre-Obama, I was one of those "throw the bums out we don't need no stinkin' RINOs" conservative. .

I think everybody here was cheering Scott Brown because of the message it sent despite him not being the perfect conservative candidate. You take what you can in some areas. But Rove badmouthed the primary winner in Delaware in a way that I wouldn't have done if Castle had been the winner. Sometimes the voters show more wisdom than the anointed experts; isn't that what the Tea Party is all about?

The Republican party was given a gift by the Tea Party throwing in with them. To have run as a third party would've been terrible for us. Geniuses like Rove don't get that and, by remaining obtuse to the nature of the gift they've been given, aren't worthy of it.

[Sue]

Charlie Crist has said he will caucus with the democrats, so no I wouldn't vote for him.

I was assuming he meant the republican Charlie not the indy Charlie since we were discussing republicans. If he meant the now Charlie then no, I couldn't stomach him since he wouldn't help with the majority thingy.

[daddy]

"Frau: reading Fischer's Washngton's Crossing

An excellent book! I recommend it."

sbw,

Absolutely. One of the best reads of the last few years IMHO. Can't recommend it highly enough. Fischer is great.

[Sue]

Would it be a majority? Both have shown themselves to side with the dems when it suits them. Why do you think they would side with you?

If they are republicans they count as republicans when it comes to leadership and committees. I don't expect them to side with me. I expect them to count as republicans to fire Reid and Pelosi. I thought I made that clear.

[JM Hanes]

"Quoting Ogden Nash because you stepped in it?"

Nope. It was my idea of trying to play nice. I admire O'Donnell for stepping up to bat, and braving the sleaze. I think she's a borderline doofus, and I hope she wins.

[Sue]

Geniuses like Rove don't get that and, by remaining obtuse to the nature of the gift they've been given, aren't worthy of it.

I'm really through defending Rove, but if Rove wasn't supporting any tea party candidate, I'd agree with you. He has been behind Rubio and Angle since they won. Miller too.

[Threadkiller]

--"I expect them to count as republicans to fire Reid and Pelosi. I thought I made that clear."--

You did, I missed it.

[Sara (Pal2Pal)]

Via Big Government:

The following brief statement has been released from the U.S. Senate campaign of Republican Joe Miller regarding audio posted on Big Government and Big Journalism last night:

Now the media has gone from trying to create stories to openly lying. The audio was pulled directly from the voicemail message. Nothing was altered. “Everything that was recorded on my phone is what we released without change,” said Randy Desoto.

[narciso]

I don'r expect them to hold up in any particular engagement, with regards to spending, judicial nominations or national security.

On the earlier point, I think she has made support for the mission in Afghanistan, quite
clear, as is the reliance on Chinese finance, as an obstacle to any future strategic interests

[Porchlight]

but if their constituents can stomach them

But in Castle's case, his constituents couldn't stomach him. DE Repubs voted him out and not by a small margin.

If you can't get rid of the uber-lib Repubs in this cycle (Castle was one of the worst), when can you? What would life be like with Senator Castle sticking the knife to the Tea Party every chance he gets?

Because you can be sure the media would have given him all manner of Strange New Respect as the newest, most liberal Republican in the Senate. He would have been massively courted by the Dems to jump ship, as well, and judging by his past votes (voted with the GOP 20% of the time in 2007), they wouldn't even have needed him to.

[JM Hanes]

Threadkiller:

"Would it be a majority?"

If there were any sure bets, we wouldn't be having these discussions. Folks bring a lot of different things to the table, when it comes to calculating risks & rewards.

[Porchlight]

can bring themselves to thank him for almost singlehandedly getting Angle elected, if she wins

News to me that Rove should receive "almost" all the credit for an Angle win. I would have thought that would have gone to Angle herself, or the people who elected her, but YMMV.

Look, all most of us were asking was that he STFU about O'Donnell once she won the primary.

[Sue]

Porch,

You mean he would have been the new Lincoln Chafee?

But in Castle's case, his constituents couldn't stomach him. DE Repubs voted him out and not by a small margin.

I know. I was just surmising why Rove would be so disappointed. A sure seat versus a probably isn't going to happen seat. I don't think Rove's problem is tea party candidates. Otherwise, you would have to wonder why he is openly supporting Angle.

[Sue]

Porch,

A third-party group linked to Rove has been the most aggressive, highest-spending outside force behind Reid's opponent, Sharron Angle, launching withering attacks that have helped keep the onetime long shot competitive against Reid.

Publicly, Reid is almost daring Rove to attack him on the airwaves.

"The more money he spends here, the less he can spend other places," Reid told POLITICO at Lake Tahoe, Nev., last month.

I think this is why JMH said what she did. Rove's group has poured millions into getting Angle elected.

Read more: http://www.gopusa.com/intheloop/2010/09/karl-rove-supports-sharron-angle.php#ixzz13yWbYgo8

[Porchlight]

I don't think Rove's problem is tea party candidates.

Sue,

You're right. I am not contending Rove is anti-Tea Party.

My understanding was that he was actively working to elect Castle. It wasn't *just* that,as an analyst,he thought Castle had the better shot,although I'm sure that is true also.

Bottom line,he's a professional,and should know better. Trashing O'Donnell was destructive as well as unnecessary.

I am trying to get back to my Bocking.;)

[Sue]

Porch,

I really am through, but if he was actively supporting Castle, it was because Castle was a sure shot at winning the seat and O'Donnell isn't. But you are right, he should STFU, which I think he has.

[Porchlight]

Sue,

Thanks for the update.I know Rove's group has spent a ton of money on the race, for which he should get credit.

Still, Angle had to win the primary and she had to win the support of voters beyond the primary.If it were all about third-party money, we could buy any election in the country.

[Porchlight]

Posted by: Sue | October 31, 2010 at 05:46 PM

Sue,

We are in agreement.

[Sue]

Last comment, I think. Rove even said in his back and forth with Hannity that he was for the "republican" in every race. Not the conservative, but the republican. He is and was a party man.

[Porchlight]

Oh,and I meant,I am trying to get back to my Bocking meaning keeping track of my spacing.Not that I have somewhere better to be.;)

Though it is almost time to take the kids out trick-or-treating! Someone a few threads back asked what Robert was wearing for Halloween, and I meant to answer but forgot.He has one of these:

http://www.catacombscds.com/images/misfits/misfits_face_onesie.jpg&t=1"

It is kind of silly but someone gave it to my younger daughter so we didn't have to spend any extra money.:)

[Sara (Pal2Pal)]

I give Rove credit for his hard work, but he did diminish himself in my eyes with his O'Donnell remarks. He could have waited 24 hours to make his analysis as a wrap-up. He didn't even let her enjoy her win that night. Five minutes after the election was called he was on TV anointing her as a loser. It was unseemly, ungentlemanly, and unnecessary. Rove is held up as an icon by both left and right for his political savvy, his political genius. He knows this well, so I don't give him a pass with an excuse that his remarks were inadvertent or taken from the wrong perspective. His remarks were both mean and irresponsible. They set the tone for the rest of the media to mock O'Donnell and tag her from Hour One as a Loser. It was so in your face unfair, I'm afraid it has forever changed my view of Rove, not as a politico, but as a man.

[Mark Folkestad]

Megyn Kelly and her guest this afternoon said that it is completely untrue that Republican support has been pulled from Miller, and that no news organization had consulted the RSSC on the story.

Off topic, but my second-cousin Eric, hard-core leftist Democrat on the faculty of the University of Wisconsin-Madison, has just changed his Facebook profile photo to show him in a Halloween demon/devil outfit, complete with horns. I'm about to tell him that it is too tempting for me to demonize Dems without him helping me out this way.

[Mark Folkestad]

Oops, meant to enter "RSCC", Republican Senatorial Campaign Committee.

[Sue]

Drudge now has the story from Alaska at the top of the page.

[rse]

Porch-

Do not establish the following precedent for Halloween:

Get 2 pumpkins. One tall, one fat.

Make one humorous and the other scary.

Fun memories until they get too opinionated about the faces.

"But why can't you carve that one Mom? It doesn't look that hard to me. It doesn't take long to carve does it? Wht can't you save the insides? It would be fun to make it into a pumpkin pie this afternoon . . ."

Have fun.

[Sue]

Bush is throwing out the 1st pitch tonight. I'm not exactly sure what time it will be, 7:00ish.

[Jack is Back!]

Washington will not change that much as a result of the vote on Tuesday. Take it from an ex-PAC manager and lobbyist, albeit during the diamond years of Reagan 2 and Old Bush 1. What can be the best alignment that makes 2012 Broder's worst nightmare is a strong Republican House with lots of tea party partisans to keept the country club set marginalized and a weak Democratic Senate that is absolutely neutered. It will guarantee certainty to the status quo but no change that will affect business decisions. That may mean a little but positive tick in the business climate. Will Obama get credit - I doubt it because conventional wisdom among the no-longer-silent-majority will be that they stalled more big government, more taxes, more spending and gave us some certainty.

This is my two cents and I'm sticking to it.

[bunkerbuster]

There'll be a gleaming silver lining on election day for liberals like me and, even, a few causes to celebrate.
Nov. 2 is the day a sock gets crammed down the throat of Tea Partyism and its made-for-talkradio anti-tax utopianism.
How delicious it will be to see the right-wing media deal with the dilemma of how to spin the economy as the recovery gains pace. Or, likewise, how to spin the economy's failure with the GOP's hands on the purse strings, cutting Social Security and Medicare while leaving in place corporate welfare for oil and pharmaceutical companies and military spending.
Morning in America, indeed. The Tea Party's bandwagon is on track for an entertaining collision with reality.
The Reagan GOP's definitive source of power has been borrow-and-spend utopianism, ideological rigidity and co-option of white lower middle-class resentments. With the Tea Party having at least established an alternative identity for that constituency, the GOP is headed for a showdown, and it's not with the Democrats.
The fall of 2008 is still fresh in the minds of liberals like me, who knew in their gut that Obama and the Democrats swept to power not by making the sale for liberalism, but by floating on the tide of widespread disgust with the Bush team's disastrous wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and the worst economy since the Great Depression.
Voters were not in love with Obama, they were in hate with Bush.
And while we liberals were effusively basking in the schadenfreude of the credit meltdown and economic collapse of late 2007, early 2008, we should have lamented more that the collapse took the pressure off Obama to make the case for liberalism. Instead, he immediately tacked to the center, making his campaign all about competence and centrism, ie what the Bush team lacked.
It's no surprise that denialist Bush fans are happy to tell themselves they have sold America on a return to Reaganism. But I'd wager most know in their gut that the "wave" they're riding is about the Obama team's failure to fully revive the economy and the feckless status-quo escalation in Afghanistan.


From Rich:
``Typical of this smokescreen is a new book titled “Mad as Hell,” published this fall by a Murdoch imprint. In it, the pollsters Scott Rasmussen and Douglas Schoen make the case, as they recently put it in Politico, that the Tea Party is “the most powerful and potent force in America.”

``They are expert at producing poll numbers to bear that out. By counting those with friends and family in the movement, Rasmussen has calculated that 29 percent of Americans are “tied to” the Tea Party. (If you factor in six degrees of Kevin Bacon, the number would surely double.) But cooler empirical data reveal the truth known by the G.O.P. establishment: An August CNN poll found that 2 percent of Americans consider themselves active members of the Tea Party.''

Don't forget to VOTE!

[Porchlight]

Rasmussen has calculated that 29 percent of Americans are “tied to” the Tea Party. (If you factor in six degrees of Kevin Bacon, the number would surely double.) But cooler empirical data reveal the truth known by the G.O.P. establishment: An August CNN poll found that 2 percent of Americans consider themselves active members of the Tea Party.''

If you weren't a complete moron, you would see that those polls are measuring two different things.

Oh well!

[Porchlight]

"But why can't you carve that one Mom? It doesn't look that hard to me. It doesn't take long to carve does it? Wht can't you save the insides? It would be fun to make it into a pumpkin pie this afternoon . . ."

rse,

Sounds like me at a certain age. ;) I love the idea of two pumpkins! We have one big one and two tiny ones (that may end up as pie) and only the big one gets carved. And damn, we better get busy...

[Threadkiller]

--"Voters were not in love with Obama, they were in hate with Bush."--

BungDuster got one right!

[Dave (in MA)]

The NFL should not hold games at sundown on Halloween.

[Sue]

--"Voters were not in love with Obama, they were in hate with Bush."--

And this explains Obama's off the chart approval ratings how? They might not have been in love with Obama himself, but they were damn sure in love with the idea of Obama.

[Sue]

Obama plays to half-full hall in Ohio. Headline at Drudge.

[Threadkiller]

--"And this explains Obama's off the chart approval ratings how?"--

Obama hated Bush. :-)

[Sara (Pal2Pal)]

For Daddy! What a complicated mess the Alaskan election has become:

The Justice Department Goes to Alaska

[Dave (in MA)]

Obama plays to half-full hall in Ohio. Headline at Drudge.

He links to the NYT. I prefer "half empty".

[Sue]

Juan Williams just said that republicans haven't made an issue about national security and the bomb threat. Well yeah, republicans aren't known for using national security to win elections. Even though democrats have accused them of doing so.

[Ranger]

But I'd wager most know in their gut that the "wave" they're riding is about the Obama team's failure to fully revive the economy and the feckless status-quo escalation in Afghanistan.

No, what I know in my gut is that Obama's failure is the exposure of his lie of being a centrist.

What got Obama elected were two promises:

"Your taxes will not go up one dime..."

And

"Net spending cuts."

And it goes back further. Peolosi and co. promised an end to the "irrisponsible deficits" of the Bush administration.

And was did Obama and Pelosi do?

They tripled the worst deficit under Bush their first year in parnership, and pushed through an $800 Billion porkfest, then shoved through a massive, budget busting Healthcare bill against the wishes of 70% of the US public.

It is Obama and Pelosi who are having the massive collision with reality, not the Tea Party.

[Sue]

I am going to go back to the 2006 elections. "Culture of corruption". Short and sweet and a media willing to help them spread it. Pelosi was going to drain the swamp. In 2008, voters in the muddle were not paying attention to Obama in the primaries. If they had been, they wouldn't have believed his general election "centrist" rhetoric. And McCain muzzled Palin in her attempt to get it out there. You have a certain portion of the electorate that woke up one day and said "huh"?

[Clarice]

Obama's election was proof that a nation can be the victim of mass hysteria. I heard otherwise sensible people swooning as they expressed their admiration and support for this nothing.

[Ignatz Ratzkywatzky]

But bubu, surely anything that goes wrong under the Republican congress will be solely because of the mess they inherited from Barry, Harry and Nancy, right?
They're just going to be trying to get the dang car out of the ditch, where the Dems left it.

[Captain Hate]

Megyn Kelly and her guest this afternoon said that it is completely untrue that Republican support has been pulled from Miller, and that no news organization had consulted the RSSC on the story.

So ABC is just making shit up from nothing? Wow, I apologize for reflexively linking Rove to this. Nothing else though. Where's Maybee to tell us what an awesome guy JAKE TAPPER is?

Porch, I'll have you know I finally rooted for Favre today and what happens: #666 gets knocked out of the game. I'd claim that I'm rooting for Miss Thomassina of the Patriots to try and get a similar outcome but nobody would believe me.

Back to the armchair...

[Dave (in MA)]

When Dems drive a car into a ditch there's usually water in it and a blonde in the back seat.

[narciso]

I guess there's a bit of confirmation bias, the way the NRSC, has been dragged kicking,
screaming, into reality, in the past

[centralcal]

Captain: You have a point about Tapper, I won't argue - just read his tweets from time to time.

However, it was Jonathan Karl that had the anonymous source for ABC's big headlines this morning - soon picked up by - who else? - Politico.

Dave: heh - no kidding!!!

[Captain Hate]

CC, I was pretty sure that Tapper wasn't the source of that bit of scammery; he may be the pick of the litter but he's still a cur sucking hind teat on ABC.

[centralcal]

No kidding, Captain.

And . . . our gal Janet has a really cute new green t-shirt! She looks FAB in it too! (oh, to be young again).

Ask her about it!

[mockmook]

JMH,

I have nothing against Rove, except he was an ass on primary night regarding O'Donnell.

His attack on her character wasn't germane to what he and Hannity were talking about.

They were discussing why she won, not what are her defects.

"I've met her, and frankly I'm not very impressed with her as a candidate"

Thanks for sharing Karl.

Curious, I've never heard Karl disparage Castle for being stupid as a box of rocks for not being skeptical of the AGW theory.

[Frau Kürbis]

--"Voters were not in love with Obama, they were in hate with Bush."--
BungDuster got one right!
--------------
Remember South Pacific?"You've got to be carefully taught"(to hate).Dubya began by being respected for his integrity and honesty.After 9/11,the Dems worked 24/7 to destroy him.The same has been done to Sarah Palin.One lib was nauseated just by hearing her name and voice.
LUN

[Elliott]

I have become far too exuberant as my prediction of a 73-seat loss for the Democrats is more and more likely to fall on the low side and my prediction of Giants in 5 hasn't yet missed the mark.

[Janet...off the couch & sportin Tea Party chic]

Great link & post Frau. I DO feel a great sadness when I see how the Dems demonize Bush. I didn't agree with all his policies, but what an honorable man.

[Dave (in MA)]

Ugh, show tunes.

[Sue]

Elliott,

You used to be a favorite of mine.

[Captain Hate]

Sue, whatever I might say or think about Rove, I'm fully in the Ranger's corner.

[Elliott]

In mitigation, they are my team.

[Clarice]

Elliott, I agree about the House.

[Sue]

Elliott,

Okay, I'll let you mitigate.

[Melinda Romanoff]

Dave-

Listen, once, to Shorty Rogers and his Giants play Richard Rogers and you'll not mind show tunes, much.

Especially arranged by somebody who trained under Woody Herman and Stan Kenton.

If you need a copy to understand, let me know, I'll burn one for you.

You will not be disappointed.

Unless you loathe big bands and jazz.

[Captain Hate]

Since this is an open thread, I'm interested in what music fellow JOMers listen to for Halloween. I make it a point to play Olivier Messiaen's "Meditations Sur Le Mystere de La Sainte Trinite" with Christopher Bowers-Broadbent playing a massive pipe organ that the stupid liners don't identify (very unlike ECM although this was a kraut import, and they usually are extremely anal about documentation); and Harry Partch's "The Bewitched".

[Dave (in MA)]

Mel, maybe I'll just stick with Trane's or some of the Miles/Evans sides.

[Janet...off the couch & sportin Tea Party chic]

Here is The Pitch (I put it on all 3 threads since everyone is spread out)

God bless W...

[centralcal]

OH. My. Gawd.

During dinner, I decided to switch over to CNN out of curiosity - how were they covering the lead up to the election.

Why, oh why did I do that?

"Boiling Point. Inside the Tea Party."

I watched for about 15 minutes as a black reporter (Travis or Tavis something or other) framed his reporting as if he were on the trail of the Mafia of yesteryear.

Their target? Christine O'Donnell. Tea Party activists. All portrayed as if they are the seamy underside of politics.

Good effing grief! No wonder CNN is in the toilet bowl as far as ratings go.

I agree with Palin (even tho' I understand her reference is Alaskan) that we are dealing with Corrupt Bastards.

[Dave (in MA)]

Janet, thanks for the link. I had to go answer the door during that. Some seemingly high school aged T&Ters showed up about an hour after the last ones.

[Sue]

OMG. Hamilton just saved us a run. Great catch.

[Frau Kürbis]

lol,Dave(MA)-watch out,recipes may be next!

"I didn't agree with all his policies,but what an honorable man."Janet,there's no Mr.Perfect.Our country could sure use a Mr./Mrs.Adequate,doncha think?The present Mr.Pfft! is not working out.

[Frau Kürbis]

Yes,Fischer'sWashington's Crossingis so enjoyable and moving.I hadn't meant to read it now but looked at the first page last night and couldn't stop.I have Albion's Seed" so I already knew the skill of the author.

[PD]

I think she's a borderline doofus

Okay, but that's just a restatement of what you said before. What we're wondering is *why*? Why is she deeply flawed?

Her knowledge of the Constitution? She's certainly more up on that than Coons. The witch thing? Irrelevant. The masturbation thing? Also irrelevant, that's not going to be the subject of any legislation.

[PD]

off

[Barbara]

Thank you, Janet! We sure miss W!

[bunkerbuster]

The data are in: conservatism is not sweeping the nation any more than liberalism is. Throw-the-bums-outism is what's sweeping the nation.

[daddy]

Have to make the comment that I love Show Tunes, especially Show Tunes by Richard Rodgers.

To buttress my point, in that outstanding video we have of our P'UK playing an amazing jazz sole tune, it happens to be "Blue Moon", a Rodgers and Hart Show Tune from 1934. Here's our ">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wvU0743MDOg"> Man, showing how its done.

[daddy]

Janet, great link.

Thank you so much for that.

[Clarice]

Well, bubu, the bums is Dems.

From the Washington Examiner (Freddoso)

I mentioned the other day that early voting numbers were not looking good for Florida Democrats. Well, early voting is now finished, and they don’t look much better, according to GMU Professor Mike McDonald’s tally. In fact, they look terrible. Here is the updated chart:
Party 2010 2008 2006
Dem 36.5% 45.6% 43.6%
Ind 14.3% 17.1% 15.4%
Rep 49.2% 37.3% 41.0%
Yes, you’re reading that right. Republicans are outperforming 2008 by 12 points.
Already, 2.2 million votes have been cast — perhaps not half of what will be cast overall, but not too far from it. And bear in mind, this is a state with 4.6 million registered Democrats and only 4 million registered Republicans (plus 2.2 million independents). Something big might be happening down there — it’s at least clear that the state GOP has been working on its early vote operation.

[daddy]

Great stuff Clarice!

Keep it coming.

[mockmook]

it’s at least clear that the state GOP has been working on its early vote operation.

Posted by: Clarice | November 01, 2010 at 12:28 AM

I think he means Obama has been working to improve GOP early voting.

[bunkerbuster]

``the bums is Dems.''

Indeed, from Nov. 2, the bums, apparently, will be Republicans. and does anyone really believe the electorate will suddenly be in a "let's give them time to fix things" mood?

By 2012, the economy and Afghanistan will be much-improved, or the swing voters will again be throwing the bums out. And if the economy and Afghanistan are on the right track by then, Obama's a shoo-in...

[Danube of Thought]

In the fourth quarter of 2009 GDP grew at a 5% rate. Credit Bush, or credit Obama?

In the third quarter of 2010 GDP growth had dropped to 2%. Blame Bush, or blame Obama?

[bunkerbuster]

Glad you asked, DoT. A little basic math might help you answer that.

But before we get to that, let's indeed credit Bush with the 5 percent growth in 2009. Though probably not for the reasons you think.

As you may know, quarterly GDP is measured versus the year earlier period. And what happened in the the fourth quarter of 2008, with Bush's borrow-and-war economy in the deepest of doo doo?

That's right, GDP shrank 6.8 percent!! I'm guessing that's the worst quarterly economic performance since the Great Depression. I could be wrong on that, but this much is certain: with the previous year's GDP plunging, even mild growth gives a big bounce, like 5 percent, in the year-later quarter. Thanks Bush!

And as for the 3Q of 2010: 2 percent growth is the best 3Q performance since 2007. It's also better than the 1.9 percent 2007 annual figure and well above the 0 percent growth for 2008 and, gasp, way above 2009's contract. Yep, let's put that in Obama's column, you better believe it.

Stick to insults and homoerotica, DoT, leave economics to people who can count.