Yellow Peril

The NY Times reports that Chinese fifteen year olds are poised to take over the world.  James Fallows has a more nuanced view:

As with just about everything concerning modern China, the results should be taken seriously. Chinese schools are full of bright and motivated students; many of them work and study exceptionally hard; most of them are aware of the make-or-break importance of tests in their own life prospects -- and by extension for the country's continued development. No doubt these results reflect something real.

But as with just about everything concerning modern China, the results should also be viewed with some distance and possible skepticism. The 5000+ students who were tested in China's biggest and most modern city may or may not be indicative of broader progress throughout the country (as the NYT story points out). Anyone who has had experience with schools and testing in China will want to know more about how these tests were administered, supervised, and scored.

They put their pants on one leg at a time and they sharpen their pencils one point at a time. 

Comments

[Engineer]

The Chinese technology industry has improved significantly in the past five years.

However they are still less efficient than the Americans and still much less innovative. Though they are hiring American technologists to work for them from abroad and offering very attractive compensation packages.

It's the undervalued RMB that gives them such a huge edge.

[MarkO]

Yeah, but the Russians beat us to the moon, didn't they?

[Danube of Thought]

No doubt Thomas Friedman will have many stupid things to say about all of this.

[Jack is Back!]

We should only test schools in Chicago that implemented the Annenberg Challenge so in about 5 years we can catch up to Aghanistan and Angola.

[Rob Crawford]

*yawn*

In the eighties, the Japanese were going to buy us. Now they've spent most of two decades in an economic slump and one of their biggest social problems are people too stressed out to come out of their homes. They're building robots to care for the elderly -- impressive, but sad at the same time.

The Chinese? Sorry, but at some point the cracks caused by their authoritarian government wanting the results of a free market are going to be so wide even Friedman will admit it. Or they'll make enough product-safety/intellectual property/general theft screw-ups that no one will want to do business with them.

Then we'll be lectured about how great India is, and how *they're* going to buy us all.

[Clarice]

I remember when the Times et al were reporting with straight faces how a square inch in downtown Tokyo was more valuable than all of Nebraska.(Or something like that)

[narciso]

Fallows having bungled the Japan story in the Atlantic, two decades, seems to raise a red flag here, so his learning curve is greater than zero.

[daddy]

Speaking of Yellow,

In a new book that I'm just about to put down because its terrible, "Why the World looks different in Other Languages," author says that Prime Minister Gladstone, reading the Iliad and the Odyssey in the 1850's,, found that the color "Yellow" was only mentioned 10 times. "Red" only 13 times, and "Blue" never. Everything was mainly stuff like "Wine Dark seas, etc."

This led Gladstone to write 2000 pages on Homer, suggesting at the end that the ancients had not developed full color vision until probably the Renaissance.

This supposedly led to the discovery of color blindness in humans.

But in the linguistic studies this led to the discovery that in the great majority of languages which did come up with full color names, historically it always was in the sequence of:

black and white > red > yellow > green > then finally blue.

But then rival Language guys fought back saying no, the real sequence has green before yellow:

black and white > red > green > yellow > then finally blue.

That green followed by yellow scenario seems the accepted wisdom now of historical language guys according to the author. Author also says that an argument can be made that human words for "Yellow" generally came from words for "Red" stuff. And he also mentions the theory that trees selected primates for "yellow" color vision, so that like bees around flowers, we could see ripe yellow fruit's, eat the fruit, them poop the seeds in new locations so new trees could grow.

In other Science news, the Japanese probe completely missed Venus today but may catch up 6 years from now when they have a chance of rendezvousing again, and Richard Black of the BBC says the Mexican minister at Cancun says we only have 3 days left to save the planet by signing on to the Cancun Global Warming Agenda.

[sbw]

Japanese probe completely missed Venus today

Because distance was measured in pounds, shillings, and pence?

[Rob Crawford]

This led Gladstone to write 2000 pages on Homer, suggesting at the end that the ancients had not developed full color vision until probably the Renaissance.

Unfortunately for that theory, Greek and Roman art was in full, glorious color. LUN for some of the SFW murals from Pompei. Lots of blues, yellows, etc.

[narciso]

Do we have a cite for that, Gladstone, who did invade Egypt and consequently the Brits didn't leave for forty years, couldn't have been that dim

[Captain Hate]

Then we'll be lectured about how great India is, and how *they're* going to buy us all.

Since that's a parliamentary government with a constitution, that is the only one that might come to pass. Although so much of their economy is "off the books" it's hard to get a good read on what the activity is at any given time.

[Charlie (Colorado)]

Then we'll be lectured about how great India is, and how *they're* going to buy us all.

And they might. They have a real market economy, a democratic government that hasn't blown up any leaders in years, and over a billion people from which to get engineers etc.

[Charlie (Colorado)]

black and white > red > green > yellow > then finally blue.

This is somewhat screwed up by the fact that the single Japanese word "aoi" refers to what we call "green" and "blue".

[Jim Ryan]

Headline today: More People Buy Gifts for Dogs than Cats.

I dunno. My cats all give my dog lots of presents every Christmas but I don't give him any. Maybe that's, unusual, I don't know.

[squaredance]

FYI: here are the PISA test.

Here is a sample question.

(the only thing difficult about this one is stomaching the PC, Global Warming BS.)

Here are some more international tests which can also be used to make international comparisons.

These are similar to the PISA tests and, in my estimation, slight more difficult (there are also some later 12 grade tests).

Have a look. Go an take one. They are clearly reasonable tests and there can be little worthwhile argument that their results are not valid. There is nothing ambiguous here. Moreover, these tests are not difficult at all. 50 years ago few would have thought them difficult. I, fortunately, did not go to public schools, but at my schools these tests would have been met with sighs of relief--and giggling derision. We had much more difficult examinations to worry about.

I have no doubt that the Asian are doing better here or that even if we took "problematic demographics" out of the US scores the relative scores would change all that much. I do not believe for one second that we have to somehow "adjust" things or look for "context".

Given these test, which are hardly that demanding, it is glaringly obvious that any competent school with nothing but mediocre students, and, of course, engaged parents, should be able to turn out large batches of students who could ace such tests. We did this for generations here in this nation. We can do so again.

What is the magic here? what is the "cultural difference"?

This just requires hard work, discipline, standards and parental input. And communities with self respect (as opposed to "self-esteem"), respect for their civlization and nation, and, what would seem counter-intuitive these days, actual respect for the child and sober reflection on the realities that the child must face in adulthood.

That we are doing so poorly relative to Asian does not reflect on some special gifts of the Asians or anything magical or superior in their civlization. What it reflects is our collective moral and intellectual lassitude-our laziness above all in not confronting the hideous corruption of our culture that is modern "liberalism" and all the cynicism and narcissistic pathologies that come with it.

The question is: Is there yet time? Can we raise the cane up when it is in the field?

We will surely find out. It goes with out saying that we have little time left to right the matter.

[Rob Crawford]

And they might. They have a real market economy, a democratic government that hasn't blown up any leaders in years, and over a billion people from which to get engineers etc.

I suspect they will rediscover their socialist leanings soon. Or get wrecked by a war with Pakistan, or China.

Or just get drawn down into the abyss by our own slow collapse.

[Threadkiller]

India did give us Jindal.

I thought ">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JPlAMx8rtFU&feature=related"> this was the Yellow Peril.

Or was it http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t9_ozLBfTXc "> this?

[lyle]

China's problems may get exacerbated by the lack of nookie for all those young men. Years of aborting girl babies has a way of catching up with a society. That or they'll have the largest gay population on earth...which, of course, would be yet another reason for the intelligentsia to laud their "progress."

[motionview]

They put their pants on one leg at a time and they sharpen their pencils one point at a time.... and they cheat on the SAT & GRE like their life depends on it. At one point I was at Stanford, and in reviewing applications we pretty much completely disregarded overseas SAT/GRE scores.

[Mark Folkestad]

Daddy, that sounds like an excellent book to set aside. Wise choice in the end.

Maguire, I hate that old saying about putting pants on one leg at a time. Sit down and you can put both legs in at once, then stand up and pull the waist up. Of course, I never could understand "can't have your cake and eat it too" when I was younger, since "have a piece of cake" was synonymous with "eat a piece of cake". It didn't dawn on me that a person might want to display cake as an art object, or in a shrine as an object of veneration.

[daddy]

Narciso,

Source for that Gladstone stuff was in this book ">http://www.amazon.com/Through-Language-Glass-Different-Languages/dp/080508195X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1291833348&sr=8-1"> Why the World looks different in Other Languages.

In my opinion a weak read and I've given up on it at page 100 or so. Just threw it out there because of the color Yellow. Know nothing about the author. Just another book I grab at the Library and stuff in my bag to keep me awake.

[Mark Folkestad]

The color thing reminds me of the common perception among small children that color didn't exist until the Fifties or Sixties, since they see old movies and TV shows in black and white. Or the first exposure of primitive people to television, where they are not impressed by color video, but they are stunned by black and white shows, amazed that the color could be take out.

[Charlie (Colorado)]

Headline today: More People Buy Gifts for Dogs than Cats.

Giving your supervisor presents is discouraged nowadays.

[Danube of Thought]

The mention of Homer allows me to drag Keats in from left field once again:

Or like stout Cortez when with eagle eyes

He stared at the Pacific--and all his men
Looked at each other with a wild surmise

[PaulY]

I had to buy Samuelson's Eco textbook in 1967 which had charts showing how the USSR's economy would soon overtake the USA's

[Melinda Romanoff]

In Investor's Business Daily.

[narciso]

I found it on Google Books, this was after Pompeii, but before Schliemann's discovery of Troy, but it still seems daft, yet he was one
of the leading lights of the liberals

[sbw]

If it is cut off in your view, to the right of the debt commission is a little baby -- the new tea party members of Congress -- saying "Cut Spending".

[Clarice]

If you click on "open image in new window" you can see the entire, fantastic Ramirez cartoon.

[Melinda Romanoff]

Or, you click where I found it (and should have credited).

[bgates]

the common perception among small children that color didn't exist until the Fifties or Sixties

Favorite Movie Story #1: A friend dragged me along to see Titanic in a theater. We get to the scene where Leo is drawing the nude pic of what's her name in pencil. In the row behind us, knucklehead kid whispers to his friend, "Why is he drawing in black and white?" and friend answers, "Because they didn't have color back then."

Favorite Movie Story #2: Same theater, some lackluster caper movie with Sean Connery and Michael Douglas' wet-nurse. Connery reaches the point in the big heist where he has to defeat the laser-beam anti-theft gizmo. So he pulls something he's been chewing out of his mouth, sticks it on a wall, and affixes a small mirror to it. In the row behind me, bimbo turns to her friend and stage-whispers, "is that gum?"

[rse]

The poor math, science and reading instruction in the US is an inevitable result of the fact that the only people who can teach in K-12 are graduates of ed school programs and the ed schools refuse to teach the methods research shows to be effective.

It's as if the only people who could be doctors went to med schools that ignored chemistry and physiology and concentrated on leeches and bloodletting.

All of this attention on PISA in turn creates the sense that there's a crisis in the US and SOMETHING must be done.

So we enact national science and math standards that push a discovery approach instead of explanations and worked examples.

And we get roughly equal outcomes in terms of ignorance.

"Socialization of knowledge"-apparently it's as necessary a prerequisite to socialism as abolishing private property.

Wonder why most professors and teachers fail to mention that detail.

[Jim,MtnViewCA,USA]

"They put their pants on one leg at a time and they sharpen their pencils one point at a time...."
"and they cheat on the SAT & GRE like their life depends on it."
I think they are hard working, motivated and, after all, you don't always win in this world by playing by the rules.

And the schools in the US are dreadful. At one point I attended an orientation for a teaching program at a local state college. The boss of the program was forthright: Ah-nold Schwarzenegger was a Repub devil and no freakin' Christian would get into _her_ program. Our kids are being taught by PC idiots.
I find this comment persuasive:
"The poor math, science and reading instruction in the US is an inevitable result of the fact that the only people who can teach in K-12 are graduates of ed school programs and the ed schools refuse to teach the methods research shows to be effective."

Ignore these Chinese kids at your peril.

[sbw]

It does not take a comparative test to know that American education has reverted to pre-Baconian scholasticism. Every few hundred years the guilds try to preserve their lifestyle at the expense of the rest of humanity.

Read Richard Feynman's comparison of Brazilian educationists if you want another example that education and creativity are quite different.

[Rob Crawford]

Ignore these Chinese kids at your peril.

No problem.

A little less than two decades ago, a guy wrote a book titled "The Decline and Fall of the American Programmer". He predicted that the Japanese and the Indians would take over the software industry. Four years later, he had to write another one, "The Rise and Resurrection of the American Programmer".

The things he was worried about in the first book were already being tackled by people in the industry. And while that industry still has issues (some of them nearly incurable), the biggest drags on American innovation come from the government and business schools.

And, yes, the American school system sucks. We let it coast too long, assuming it was doing a decent job because most of us saw decent results from it. *THANKFULLY* most people don't get their education from the schools, even the colleges.

(*SADLY* we've let the government be taken over by people who think a sheet of paper from a school is the primary measure of a person's worth.)

[jorgxmckie]

"and they cheat on the SAT & GRE like their life depends on it."

Dukenfield's Law: If it's worth winning, it's worth cheating. [William Claude Dukenfield is better known as W.C. Fields]

[Jim,MtnViewCA,USA]

'Four years later, he had to write another one, "The Rise and Resurrection of the American Programmer".'

Oddly, I am an American Programmer.
In Silicon Valley.
My money is on "decline and fall", but perhaps I have the ant's eye view.