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January 06, 2011

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Jane (sit on the couch or save your country)

Happy birthday to the sweet sixteener!

bunkerbuster

Annals of Aggressive Irrationality
Jonah Goldberg edition

``For years, we’ve heard how the peaceful religion of has been hijacked by extremists.''

No one's been hearing that, because no one, other than wingnuts, has been saying that. Not one acknowledged authority on Islam has ever made such a claim, be they conservative, liberal, moderate or of unidentifiable ideological origin. Besides which, it's ludicrous on its face. How could any single movement "hijack" an ancient, much splintered, multi-ethnic, multi-national, multi-regional religion of 1.5 billion people.
It is both sad and revealing that wingnuts cling so preciously to the absurd shibboleth that the violent minority defines the peaceful Islamic majority.
Rather, the claim scholars and other informed observers of Islam make is that fake religious gangsters ATTEMPT to hijack Islam. Not that they have succeeded.
Goldberg apparently knows this and is so utterly disdainful of his reader's intelligence, he actually resorts to unabashedly feigned ignorance to cloak a bigoted assertion: ``What if it's the other way around?''
Note he doesn't say, ``I think it's the other way around." or "The evidence shows, it's the other way around." or, even, "Maybe it's the other way around.'' No, he's so certain his readers are morons, he actually feels he can get away with using "What if" to lead to an assertion that Muslims are bad people.
Goldberg's rhetorical bigotry is indistinguishable from plain old hate-mongering, like asking:
``What if the Pope's a Satan worshipper?"
``What if George W. Bush is taking payoffs from the Saudi monarchy?"
``What if DoT's a child molestor?"

Who needs facts, were just "asking questions.''
This formula is perhaps the most salient journalistic contribution of Fox News Channel. "We're just asking questions.''


busted flat.

OK, you can stop the compressions.
==========

Porchlight

Who needs facts, were just "asking questions.''
This formula is perhaps the most salient journalistic contribution of Fox News Channel. "We're just asking questions.''

Actually I think Andrew "Trig Truther" Sullivan has the patent on it.

cathyf
"Journalist does not understand the subject they are writing about."
Sorry to be hopelessly pedantic, but how about "Journalist does not understand the subject being written about."
clarice

Toby Harnden at the Telegraph says Daley forced Gibbs' removal and suggests Jarrett may be the next to go.

Ignatz

--Democracy cannot function below a certain level of economic equality because money can buy power, even in a democracy.--

And yet liberals think giving the government more and more of our money every year (more of our power) is a benign, even highly beneficial, idea.
Bill Gates has $50 billion in assets, but all levels of government take in around $5 TRILLION PER YEAR.
Liberals aren't concerned about power being exercised over others; they just want to ensure they are the ones exercising it.
Libertarians and conservatives correctly prefer to starve the beast that has the power.

Ignatz

--``For years, we’ve heard how the peaceful religion of [Islam] has been hijacked by extremists.''

No one's been hearing that, because no one, other than wingnuts, has been saying that.--

Bubu is back in the running with cleo for stupidest comment of the year.

Jim Ryan

Okay, I'm that jerk. The sticker should say, Journalist does not understand the subject he is writing about.

Yes, that's me. Prehistoric man. Archie Bunker. Here "he" is genderless, that's my story and I'm sticking to it against the onslaught of modern life. I stand athwart history getting plowed over by it like a Hostess Hoho underneath a Mack truck doing 80mph.

the subject being written about

Can't do it. The passive voice is a worm that destroys the brain (a must read, especially for your college kids.)

So, yes, I am that guy: completely incorrigible jerk.

MayBee

You are right though, jerk.

MayBee

Toby Harnden at the Telegraph says Daley forced Gibbs' removal and suggests Jarrett may be the next to go.

Wow.
If Jarrett goes it will be the first real signal that Obama is actually interested in governing the country, rather than just being president.

Threadkiller

Liberals aren't concerned about power being exercised over others; they just want to ensure they are the ones exercising it.

This video was around last year and most websites take on it was it showed Pelosi is about redistribution of wealth. My take is a little more cryptic; it is about creating a class that will never be wealthy.

">http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2010/10/18/pelosi_need_to_address_fairness_of_ownership_and_equity_in_america.html"> Pelosi: Need To Address "Fairness" Of "Ownership and Equity" In US


"We're talking about addressing the disparity of income where the wealthy people continue to get wealthier and some other people are falling out of the middle class when we want to bring many more people into the middle class. But that disparity is not just about wages alone, that disparity is about ownership and equity. It's all about fairness in our country," House Speaker Nancy Pelosi said to the United Steelworkers on Monday.

"...we want to bring many more people into the middle class."

They never talk about bringing people into the "wealthy class." They keep that one for themselves.

I prefer a classless society. But not in the sense that Pelosi exudes.

Rob Crawford

Sorry to be hopelessly pedantic, but how about "Journalist does not understand the subject being written about."

How about, "WARNING: Journalist at work. Facts and understanding will be thin."

Extraneus

I'd take it as a signal that he wants to be president for another term, nothing more.

Appalled

bunkerbuster:

I think you assume that people and religions are fundamentally decent, and that speaks well of you. (This may be the first and last time anyone says that at this blog, so treasure the moment.)

But --

Islam, at its current stage of development, does seem to have a lot of subgroups that devote themselves to noxious fanatacism that represses people and hurts people. Algeria is very different from Iran which is very different from Pakistan. But all three countries have problems with a virulant form of the religion.

This is certainly not the whole of Islam. Islam in India, in Indonesia, in Bosnia is fairly easygoing. The Black Muslim movement in the United States often sounds peculiar to Chrisitians, but is not advocating the stoning of women. And Malcom X, in his autobiography, describes how his visit to Mecca had the effect of moderating his radicalism.

However --

It is fair to say "wtf" about certain aspects of Islam, which is something I think Goldberg's article does. And I think prejudice against Muslims will continue to find a ready audience, so long as violence and intolerance are such a large part of what large portions of the Muslim world does.

Jim Ryan

Thanks, MayBee. I can carry on, knowing that somewhere, someone still believes.

Captain Hate

If Jarrett goes it will be the first real signal that Obama is actually interested in governing the country, rather than just being president.

*snort* good one Maybee.

Jim Ryan

that speaks well of you.

It speaks well of a child. Adults should face evil. Failure to face evil has cost millions of innocent lives. It is a deplorable character flaw.

Chubby

((If Jarrett goes it will be the first real signal that Obama is actually interested in governing the country, rather than just being president))


It's a tacit admission that he is in way over his head. A ventriloquist's dummy in search of a ventriloquist, he found Daley. Daley will be his master. Daley says get rid of Gibbs and Garret and Obama asks, How high?

anduril

bb, I agree with your remarks re income equality, and I suspect Kaus would to.

Too bad you didn't read Goldberg with an open mind. Everyone knows I'm no Neocon, but if a Neocon says something sensible, why should I reflexively disagree?

It's pointless to argue the facts--for years we've been hearing that Islam itself isn't the problem, it's just violent extremists who are unrepresentative of the religion as a whole. You can find the same meme at both lefty and Neocon sites.

As I said, Goldberg's point is not dissimilar to the point that B16 made some years back, except Goldberg doesn't enunciate it quite as clearly. You can find a transcript of B16's remarks at this Neocon site: When even the pope has to whisper.

B16's point was simply this: Every religion that undergoes a reform typically does so by an appeal for a return to its basic principles, usually those contained in "holy" writings of some sort--Torah, Talmud, Bible, Koran, etc. This is exactly what has happened with Islamic reform movements. The problem is, the Koran preaches violent and intolerant Jihad and also denies a role for independent reason. Thus, self proclaimed Islamic reform movements have typically exalted violence against both non-Muslims as well as Muslim "blasphemers," and such movements also suppress intellectual inquiry such as that that the early schools of Muslim thought adapted from the Syrian Christians. This is all historical fact.

Here's how Joseph Fessio reports the Pope's words, and the Pope's rationale explains the phenomena that Goldberg cites:

And immediately the holy father, in his beautiful calm but clear way, said, well, there's a fundamental problem with that because, he said, in the Islamic tradition, God has given His word to Mohammed, but it's an eternal word. It's not Mohammed's word. It's there for eternity the way it is. There's no possibility of adapting it or interpreting it, whereas in Christianity, and Judaism, the dynamism's completely different, that God has worked through his creatures [emphasis added]. And so it is not just the word of God, it's the word of Isaiah, not just the word of God, but the word of Mark. He's used his human creatures, and inspired them to speak his word to the world, and therefore by establishing a church in which he gives authority to his followers to carry on the tradition and interpret it, there's an inner logic to the Christian Bible, which permits it and requires it to be adapted and applied to new situations.
Rob Crawford

Democracy cannot function below a certain level of economic equality because money can buy power, even in a democracy.

Thank God we're not a democracy.

Rob Crawford

And I think prejudice against Muslims will continue to find a ready audience, so long as violence and intolerance are such a large part of what large portions of the Muslim world does.

Is it then prejudice? Or is it prudence?

MayBee

*snort* good one Maybee.

Well...there is the possibility that it would be a desperate move for reelection.

But still, I assume the dream was that Michelle, Barack, and Mommy Valerie would be in the White House, always together. To get rid of her because she can't do her job* is a pretty drastic step, relationship wise.

(*whatever her job is. I suspect it's mostly that she does whatever she wants to do all day)

clarice

She was apparently supposed to be the WH liaison with business, MayBee.

I, too, would like to joining the movement to stamp out the passive voice, the language of idiots and scoundrels.
MOTUS has some exquisite prose this morning:

"Uncertain that future historians would be able to capture all of her many achievements as First Female Speaker of the House, and ensure that her obituary contains all of her props, she wrote and delivered her own on Wednesday"

clarice

*like to join*

Appalled

Passive voice has one use -- it allows for the avoidance of assigning of blame and responsibility. Since that is a passion of the bureaucracy, its use proliferates there.

Sometimes, I have to use passive voice in my writing to avoid insulting somebody or pointing the finger. Like many things, passive voice has a valuable use, which overuse dissipates.

Extraneus

Has this Constitution reading been the greatest thing or what? The NYT is *still* whining about it, manipulating their drones with the old 3/5 chestnut, etc. What a great move.

Tra la la la la.  I like the meter, though.

Heh, how about: 'The journalist does not understand the subject about which the journalist is writing.'

Pedantic, stilted, correct, and unhung.
===================

Janet

A ventriloquist's dummy in search of a ventriloquist, he found Daley.

Great line Chubby!

NK

Speaking of flatlining -- december Jobs report. Ugh. 113,000 Private sector jobs added-- Ick; 10,000 gov't jobs cut-- GOOD;
71,000 jobs added to Nov nice; 239,000 DISCOURAGED workers DROP OUT of the job pool HORRIFIC. To BuBu and all Left of center types (BuBu, in my view you are not a hardcore Lefty, you are a mushy Left of Center EzraKleinite who reads waaaay to much Brad DeLong) the dreadful jobs market is the result of your 3 year Keynesian experiment. The result? Epic fail. Our society needs to add about 125,000 new jobs per month to maintain employee participation. To signifigantly reduce unemployment, 225,000+ jobs have to be created. We are doing lest than half of that. Old established guys like me are fine, kids out of the house so food bills not a big deal, take the train to work so gas prices are not a big deal. The Keynesian experiment has killed new entrants into the job market, because there is no job market. Who would hire in the environment created by the Obamaniacs -- especially small businesses? we know the answer-- NO ONE. BuBu your heroes have a lot to answer for.

cathyf
Here "he" is genderless, that's my story and I'm sticking to it against the onslaught of modern life.
The problem with this in the sticker context is that these stickers are seemingly designed to be stuck on actual news stories, written by actual people. So if the byline says "Jane Doe" or "Jane Doe and Susie Smith" or "John Doe and Sam Smith" then it is grammatically incorrect.

First rule of snark is that your grammar and spelling must be perfect.

cathyf

How about:

"Warning: this journalist does not understand this subject."

No passive voice. And you could have another set for mult-author stories:

"Warning: none of these journalists understand this subject."

Janet

First rule of snark is that your grammar and spelling must be perfect.

Oh NO!!! That is terrible news for me... :(

Jim Ryan

the language of idiots and scoundrels

You will enjoy reading that Richard Mitchell book I linked to. A rollicking good read. The poor, exacting soul of a classics professor at Podunk U. toiled away in obscurity, releasing several remarkable books about good English and its importance to our lives.

Forcing every 18-year-old to read his Less Than Words Can Say would save the republic.

NK

Jarrett Out?-- Wow if true, it would be the third good thing BHO has done 1. death from above for the taliban and Jihadis; 2. signing on to tax rate extension, 3. dumping Alinskyite Jarrett. Of course he is doing that to save his sorry re-election chances. But I always welcome getting Lefies out of the government whatever the motivation.

This modern stuff has devolved.

a, extremists always like the literal. How explain the moderation that Islam underwent in the centuries following the Prophet?
===============

Threadkiller

Specter, get in on this.">http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/2011/jan/06/did-you-help-build-b-24s-and-pbys/">this. Someone needs to tell them it was a Peacemaker.


Did you help build B-24 Liberator bombers or PBY patrol planes at Consolidated Aircraft in San Diego? If so, we'd like to talk to you. We're also looking for people who worked on the B-36 Peacekeeper and the Atlas boosters.
The reason?
We're preparing to publish a story about the history of the aircraft industry in San Diego. The story will be part of our Centennial of Naval Aviation coverage. If you'd like to talk, call U-T science and defense writer Gary Robbins at 619-293-1228, or send him an email at gary.robbins@uniontrib.com

Threadkiller

DoT, I am sure you have a wealth of knowledge on the San Diego aerospace scene. Maybe you can spread it around.

bunkerbuster

``The problem is, the Koran preaches violent and intolerant Jihad and also denies a role for independent reason.''

The Koran also preaches peace, love and understanding. In fact, it contradicts itself at great length, just as the Bible and many other scriptures do.
It is nothing more than simpleton's bigotry to ignore the parts of the Koran that preach peace and love. Nor is ignorance any excuse.
The only rational way to assess the full meaning and weight of a book like the Koran is by the behavior of the vast majority of those who proclaim it as the source of their faith.
By that measure, Islam is irrefutably a religion of peace.
If Islam is doomed to violence, why, after more than 7 centuries of existence and with more than a billion followers, has it yet to match the level of mass killing and genocide generated by Christian-based cultures? Why, when we look at the simple facts of history, is not one of the biggest mass murders attributable to an Islamic culture? Not one.

This is not to suggest that Islamic cultures do not produce mass murderers and genocide because, indeed, they do. The point is rather that Christians and atheists have been much, much better at it, providing case-closing evidence that there is nothing distinctively violent about Islam or the Koran.

jimmyk

And yet liberals think giving the government more and more of our money every year (more of our power) is a benign, even highly beneficial, idea.

Just another case of the vicious cycle where a perceived problem (inequality) leads to intervention (bigger government) that makes the problem worse, leading to still more intervention, till eventually we end up like Greece.

Money only can buy power if there is someone who is enabled to sell power. Leftist ideas all amount to enabling politicians as power brokers, enriching them at the expense of the greater good.

Jim Ryan

Warning: this journalist does not understand this subject.

That'll do.

Ranger

Why, when we look at the simple facts of history, is not one of the biggest mass murders attributable to an Islamic culture? Not one.

Every hear of the Armenian Genocide?

Even Buddhists go on massacrees.

Ranger, some people cope by lying about history. And thus does tragedy become farce.
=============

Jim Ryan

There was 911. Beslan massacre.

But, yes, the International Socialists and the National Socialists get the grand prize for mass murder.

Chubby

Warning: this journalist is not objectively reporting all the facts.

Janet

It is harder to notice the spikes in evil for the religion of Islam when the hand chopping, honor killings, & slaughter or dhimmi status of non-muslims is an every day affair.

Ignatz

--It is nothing more than simpleton's bigotry to ignore the parts of the Koran that preach peace and love. Nor is ignorance any excuse.--

What weight should we give your pronouncements on this issue since you have previously confessed to not knowing much about the Koran or Islam?
The "peace and love" verses are genrally early on while the "kill the infidel" verses occur later. It is a general Islamic principle that later verses supercede earlier ones as the great and powerful Oz Allah revealed his truth in stages to Mohammed.

Ignatz

--But, yes, the International Socialists and the National Socialists get the grand prize for mass murder.--

Jim, I believe the various flavors of socialist are also known as identity liberals.

Extraneus

The peace and love parts of the Koran refer to the treatment of other Muslims, not kaffirs.

anduril

In terms of Muslim genocide, one should read up on the history of Islam in the Indian subcontinent. The barbarism and killing was nearly beyond belief but gets little publicity in the West. No excuse for ignorance.

Moreover, slaughter of this sort violates Christian principles, but does NOT violate Muslim principles. The Koran sanctions such slaughter, especially of pagan Hindus.

Jane (sit on the couch or save your country)

If Jarrett goes it will be the first real signal that Obama is actually interested in governing the country, rather than just being president.

I don't think so. He's interested in getting elected and I bet Daley insisted on it.

Porchlight

Sometimes, I have to use passive voice in my writing to avoid insulting somebody or pointing the finger. Like many things, passive voice has a valuable use, which overuse dissipates.

Appalled, I'm sure you're familiar with Orwell's "Politics and the English Language" - your comment brought it (as well as Strunk & White) to mind.

The bureaucrats who employ me use passive voice extensively, almost exclusively. It gets old, but you're correct, it has its uses.

Porchlight

He can't get rid of Jarrett unless Daley has agreed to be his minder and decision maker. He's totally helpless otherwise.

Melinda Romanoff

Jarrett and Daley are from opposing Democratic camps in Chicago, where Jarrett is all "New Party" and Daley is the old machine (the one that works, well, sort of).

And Moochelle is "New Party" as well.

Reminds me, I need popcorn, lots more popcorn.

MarkD

So you're taking my on-call weekend, bunkerbuster?

Life is unfair, and then you die.

bunkerbuster

Ignatz asks: ``What weight should we give your pronouncements?''

If fact and reason were at your disposal, weight would never be a question. It is helpful of you to divulge that aspect of your epistemology as it persuasively explains the irrationality of your conclusions.

Either you aware of the calls for peace love and understanding that are in the Koran, or you are not. If you are not aware of them, what possible basis do you have for commenting? If you are aware of them, why would you take issue with the "weight" of my comments, since you would know they were weighted at 100 percent?

Moreover, I have cited in text numerous calls for peace in the Koran on this blog, so it's very unlikely you're not aware of them. The only conclusion is that you're being dishonest and are just too stupid to realize how easily that is demonstrated.

sbw

Jim Ryan: Can't do it. The passive voice is a worm that destroys the brain (a must read, especially for your college kids.)

Mitchell: "An education that does not teach clear, coherent writing cannot provide our world with thoughtful adults; it gives us instead, at the best, clever children of all ages."

Less Than Words Can Say: An essential read, gift, and tool. A two-by-four attention getter. A pompous bombast deflator. A clear lens. A credentialed moron detector. A backbone stiffener. A thumping good read.

Buy one used. It must be on your bookshelf.

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