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January 01, 2011

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Jack is Back!

Look at the stuff I Won eats in public just to pull Moo's chain. And he remains skinny. It's all metabolism. I want to feel good when I have a burger or ice cream, so I will subscribe to any diet theory that subscribes to that need.

peter

OT, does Obama have some really radical appointments on his agenda? LUN

Anka Machines

In a world without airplanes, airplane crashes would be a rare event as well.

My body does not haul my ass to the gym, nor does it eat in moderation due to some sort of genetic programming.

My natural sloth and very slow metabolism would return me to an obese person who has trouble fitting in chairs. My brain decided that this need not be so.

Carol.Herman

Hormones and diabetes. Culprits. Very few people are aware of their hormone shifts. Or if they've developed diabetes.

Also, illnesses like cancer can make weight loss appear as if it's been chosen.

Does weight appear incrementally? Given how we start out in life: Sure. Babies are weighed each and every time there's an office visit. And, the weight, like the height, gets charted.

It's good to know there is no "normal." Agressive measuring leads people to believe there's an ideal weight. While diets tend to be failures. But they are done "to look good in a bathing suit." Or to fit into wedding attire. Doesn't take long to see that there's not only gain, but the gain, after a loss where cancer is not involved, leads to a JUMP.

The better question is to ask how and why the movie industry now defines "beauty." This wasn't true when artists were painting women ... and skinny wasn't beautiful. Before the movies, skinny probably meant hunger and/or disease.

Read away. But I don't think its worth the time of day.

Carol.Herman

The way to cure real obesity is through surgery. There are a number of procedures. But the one where I've seen people really lose weight, involves putting a band around the stomach. My accountant had it done. He went from being very heavy, to not just reducing his girth. But he eliminated his diabetes.

WIN-WIN

Donald

My upstairs water heater went out this morning before we awoke. If I posted pictures it would blow your minds.

On the bright side, I'm gonna get that bonus room work out deal I've been wanting. And ponies...

Neo

So the down and dirty of Mr. Taubes theory is that Michelle Obama is out to destroy the "diversity of body weights" that God, through his infinite unquestioned wisdom, has put upon this Earth.

anduril

Taubes' new book is a readers digest version of his big book. Here's a chapter by chapter summary of his big book that's even shorter:

http://gutsandblackstuff.com/2010/04/12/a-summary-of-good-calories-bad-calories-by-gary-taubes/

A Summary of Good Calories, Bad Calories by Gary Taubes

Nothing to do with Taubes but an eye-opener re statins:

http://www.businessweek.com/print/magazine/content/08_04/b4068052092994.htm

Do Cholesterol Drugs Do Any Good?

Taubes' blog:

http://www.garytaubes.com/blog/

Ignatz

--“In a world without carbohydrate-rich diets, obesity would be a rare condition as well.”--

Doesn't the above kind of refute everything that went before?

First, some folks are thin and active while others are fat and lazy because of their genes, hormones, metabolisms, enzymes and programming;
except that people are actually fat because of their diets stuffed with carbs.

Frau Neugierig

Obama's immediate family members on both sides were/are not skinny. It is interesting to me, though, that the half-brother from his father's other American wife is also on the slim side.

Jack is Back!

Frau,

Skinny is a Kenyan and Muslim trait. He is too skinny to have been born in Hawai'i. This is why Moo wants to eliminate obesity so these kids can all look like Muslims. I get this way when Florida wins.

sbw

As I understand it, A boss can't counsel a worker about a weight problem without running afoul of government regulations, but it appears the government is not bound by steenkin' government regulations and can actually impose draconian legislation.

My government is driving people toward a libertarian perspective that government that steals taxpayer money simply to impose its temporary legislative worldview has overstepped its bounds.

Janet

Rather, all of us are fulfilling a fixed biological mandate, just as growing children are. Our bodies have a nonnegotiable agenda, and our behavior evolves to make that agenda happen,...

I don't understand this article? It's not my fault...is that the point?
My "biological mandate" is toward sloth, but not gluttony so much. And I guess my body has a "nonnegotiable agenda" to smoke. I think I'm gonna believe the "nonnegotiable agenda" theory. I like the sound of it, & it lets me off the hook for any crap behaviors.

clarice

I predict Taubes will sell a lot of copies of his book especially now that everyone's looking at those extra 5 holiday pounds.

If you have reached a point in your life where hormonal shifts/metabolism and forced inactivity have made you put on pounds should you forego one of life's real pleasures--delicious food? If you knew you would die tomorrow would you?

Danube of Thought

I love to eat and drink, and so I do. I also work out like all hell to stay in shape. If I don't work out my weight goes up.

Is ther a book in there somewhere?

Frau Bretzel

I was perhaps hasty with my "other American wife." Although the date and place were mentioned in a divorce document, no record has been found for a marriage, civil or otherwise, for Stanley Ann Dunham and Barack "Wives 'R Me" Obama.

Yoo hoo! crack investigative reporters?
WickedLeaks?

jimmyk

I have an idea: Maybe it's partly genetic, partly choice. Like practically everything else.

andyisxmilmail

Genetics like the cloners.thats why we're fatt existence.The cloners also make and hear,so they go after bodies like luciferians thats why.

Neo

The New York Times did a piece a couple of years ago about a government study where most of the participants lost 20 or more pounds in the first few months, but, as the 2 year study came to an end, virtually all of the participants had regained all the weight back.
The theory was that there was a "natural weight" that your body seeks.

Carol.Herman

Back in the old days you didn't live long enough to get lung cancer. People barely made it to 40. And, back then, too, childbirth killed about half the women. Either at first. (Like Cinderella's mom. Or after having a whole bundle. One a year. Never reaching menopause.)

As to cancers and smoking, Christopher Hitchens has been diagnosed with cancer. (Esophagus, I believe.) Big smoker. Big drinker.

Besides, cancer is only "killer #2." Killer #1 is still heart disease.

If you've smoked for a long time, and you stop, you can reverse damage in some places in your body. But not in others.

As to these books, if you're not carrying one, you're lighter. By definition. You're not carrying the weight of the book.

There's also studies that show cigarette smoking reduces Alzheimer's. But those who smoke in bed? They can go "up" anytime, they're smoking. But they fall asleep, first.

Today, a pack of cigarettes costs almost $6. If that doesn't break habits, it certainly breaks the bank! The money you spend adds up. Faster than it used'ta.

maryrose

I totally agree with the premise of this book. It's all in the genetics. Food and exercise choices can keep the body toned and healthy. My prescription-don't go to doctors . I'm soon to be 61 and have never taken any medication. I eat vegetables, enjoy a beer or an occasional drink sometimes. I don't smoke but grew up with a 2 pack a day 40 year smoker.My sister has a high metabolism but has cholesterol problems. My other sister has diabetes. The Rose gene tends to roundness as my daughter knowsyet my son and one brother who is more Slovenian is thin as a rail just like my grandfather so go figure.A good book is "Eat This Not That"

Neo

There seems to be more rumblings connecting "high fructose corn syrup" with diabetes, but I question the increase usage of caffeine.

After years of Coke and Pepsi, I now have no effects from caffeine. Before I had to give up regular Coke and Pepsi, I sometimes had to have one just to sleep well.

maryrose

Neo:
I have the same thing with Diet Coke. I can drink it anytime and never have trouble sleeping.

Neo

Now I drink Sprite Zero .. no sugar, low sodium, no caffeine, with a hint of citrus taste

MayBee

What about Asian diets, which always have rice as a staple?

Janet

Yeah Frau @ 6:54...seems like the family was half scared of Obama Sr.. Stanley left immediately, & didn't return to Hawaii until he left.

and jimmyk - I have an idea: Maybe it's partly genetic, partly choice. Like practically everything else. Exactly.

Danube of Thought

Will anyone step forward to defend Big Ten football? What defense could possibly be offered?

Ignatz

--What defense could possibly be offered?--

Most of em weren't offering much offense either.

larry

Cancer isn't the only way smoking can kill you. I know a guy 70 who smoked 2+ packs per day for about 50 years. Guy has only the last 20% of lung capacity remaining due to emphysema and C O P D. It took 45 years to go from 100% to 60%, but only 2 more to go from 40% to 20%. Physical activity compensated to some degree for many years, but peripheral artery disease (also primarily caused by smoking) popped up about 12 years ago, so golf, fishing, yard work, etc. have tapered off to zero. Now the guy needs a femoro bypass because he can't walk out of his shadow, but can't get one because his lungs make him a bad surgical risk. Please don't feel sorry for the guy. He knows full well he and he alone is responsible. I'm posting as a precautionary tale. My dear departed second wife had very similar health/smoking issues and was swept away 11 years ago this week by the flu.

MarkO

Big Ten Football: politically correct. Love them Texas Christians.

Drinking coffee often makes me sleepy. What's up with that?

Is this just another free will attack? Or, does it double as an excuse to prevent the application of what will we have left free?

If I don't run or bike or play tennis, I really love to eat ice cream. Any questions?

MayBee

I love Big Ten football. Today was dreadful for us

Rob Crawford

My totally unsupported thoughts:

A high-fat, high calorie diet is no big deal if you're physically active. UNFORTUNATELY so many people have lives that are far from physically active, and we've actually been discouraging activity among kids.

Jim Rhoads a/k/a vjnjagvet

In general [sic], generalizations like the theory described in the Taubes' book can be relatively worthless for any one person.

About thirty years ago, I went to an extended family reunion and was surprised to see that the majority of the men in the family had broad shoulders, no neck, and a bald spot in the back of their heads. Most were also thick of body and were under 5'8". At that point, I had the terrible feeling that I was doomed because I looked just like them.

Flash -- my body shape hasn't changed much since then in spite of trying a plethora of diets, and running, swimming and other aerobic exercise three or four days a week. For the past three years my congestive heart failure has greatly diminished my exercise. Nonetheless, my weight and body shape has stayed about the same. Go figure.

sammy small

Like everything else connected with aging, I have noticed that overeating gets easier with age. It seems that the "full" signal from the brain is operating at half speed. About 10-15 minutes later, it can really become noticeable.

But why are there so many third and half pound burgers nowadays when they all used to be quarter pounders 20-30 years ago.

Charlie (Colorado)

My natural sloth and very slow metabolism would return me to an obese person who has trouble fitting in chairs. My brain decided that this need not be so.

One of the predictions I could have made the instant I saw this topic come up was that there would be a zillion comments that reveal they neither had read Taubes' book nor have any understanding of the biochemistry.

It's nice to see someone bring in a Descartian mind-body dichotomy, though.

MarkO

Tonight, The Little Sisters of the Poor rose up a struck the formerly Big Ten. Gordon Gee was and is a fool.

clarice

Why don't you explain it to me, Chaco?

daddy

I am confused.

This UK Science story says humans are getting consistently stupider because ">http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-1343093/Human-brain-shrinking-20-000-years.html"> our brains have been steadily shrinking for the last 20,000 years.


Why have our brains gone on a diet but not our bellies?

Charlie (Colorado)

Ah, hell.

Look, medically almost the only thing controversial in Taubes' book is the final conclusion, and that only because there has been an "information cascade" *very* much like the "climate change" crusade to make people believe that it's evil self-indulgent Americans who could make it all better if only they were Better People who are at fault.

The one paragraph summary would be this: people aren't fat because they eat too much and don't exercise enough, they eat too much and don't exercise enough because they're fat.

In more detail, it's something like this:

(1) something happens (I'll hit that in a second) that up-regulates the amount of fat the fat cells "want" to store. ("Want" in quotes because the teleology is a convenient way to say it, even though cells don't make conscious decisions.)

(2) when your body is trying to satisfy the demands of the fat cells, it can do so two ways: eat more, exercise less. Extensive experimentation shows that both of these happen, at least in mouse models, and while it's harder to experiment on people, there is a lot of evidence that fat homeostasis is lots more complicated than the usual "slovenly slacker" model.

Sammy, the probable explanation for the bigger meals etc is that now that people have been upregulated, they need more food to satisfy the fat cells.

(3) That up-regulation can be fought by semi-starvation; the evidence is just massive that semistarvation can't be sustained by more than 2-5 percent of the population. Traditional dietary approaches to obesity have about a 1 in 20 remission rate.

Now, the next question is what up-regulates the fat cells? The answer to that has been known for years: insulin. And what leads to greater insulin release? Simple carbs -- sugar, grains, and so on.

Taubes' hypothesis, which he supports very strongly from the primary literature, is that increased amounts of simple carbs in the diet lead to the upregulation of fat cells by means of increased maximum insulin levels.

Charlie (Colorado)

Nonetheless, my weight and body shape has stayed about the same. Go figure.

Exactly. There is a feedback mechanism at work there.

Charlie (Colorado)

Clarice, is my 10:46 a decent start?

I get cranky about this because it's like arguing about climate change: the crypto-Puritans, finally, don't look at the evidence, don't much care about the evidence, because they prefer the explanation that People Are Just Bad. Carbon dioxide or carbohydrates, the actual effect comes out the same; it's just deciding which version of Original Sin you focus on.

clarice

Thanks, Chaco.

bgates

What defense could possibly be offered?

None that I can see. It must be terribly disappointing for those teams and their boosters. I mean, to have such high expectations, and then make so many mistakes and miss so many opportunities - and often against demonstrably mediocre opposition....

Of course, I don't have to explain what that's like to a Chargers fan.

daddy

If anyone is interested in the kind of ads they show on ESPN in Guangzhou China, here's what they've been running during half-time and timeouts of the Bowl Games.

Its called ">http://www.espnstar.com/game/"> Mizzie and The Fraggot. Can't tell if it's a mainland China or a Taiwan ad, but its in decent English, so I'm guessing Taiwan.

Charlie (Colorado)

What about Asian diets, which always have rice as a staple?

MayBee, there are apparently at least two others things at work there: the first is a genetic component. Asians don't seem to be as likely to develop insulin resistance as Europeans do, which means they don't suffer insulin spikes as much as we do. The second is straight-out calorie restriction: traditional asian diets are low in total calories because they have trouble getting enough food.

It's telling, though, that as asians begin to have sufficient food supplies, they quickly develop increasing levels of obesity and also the obesity-related metabolic disorders like type 2 diabetes.

(Another) Barbara

Thank you, Charlie. I've been a Taubes groupie since reading "Good Calories, Bad Calories when it was initially published and it changed my life and my body. Dramatically. Trouble is, all of us have been so misled about what constitutes good nutrition and how the metabolic system works, that it is just not worth the effort (and often the scorn) to explain to one's friends and family. Good for you! I've been reading these posts all day and gnawing almost through my lower lip (excellent protein!) while sitting on my hands. Fat and cholesterol are good for you! And delicious, and you will never feel the hunger pangs that accompany most diets. Now I'm going back to the kitchen and eat some more fat. I used to be plump, guilty and hungry, but haven't been for years.

Charlie (Colorado)

Which reminds us

Did you know that tapeworm eggs used to be sold as a weight-loss remedy?

Charlie (Colorado)

(Another) Barbara, I know what you mean: I went off "white stuff" when I read GCBC and promptly lost 50 lbs, stopped wanting to nap in the afternoons, and had to go off statins because my total cholesterol had gotten dangerously low.

I've been eating too much white stuff since I had my fake heart attack in July (had an esophageal spasm and erosive esophagitis, amazing how similar they can seem) and I gained back a lot.

At least now I know what *actually* works.

Charlie (Colorado)

Here's an interesting thought for y'all -- I'm going to finish Taubes' book and write something about diet and original sin, I might was well see if I can get paid for a rant.

Since roughly the 70's, we've been told (for any number of reasons, from cholesterol to environmental concerns to animal rights) to eat less meat, less fat, and more grains. And, sure enough, on average people no eat less fat and exercise more than they did in the 60's.

When did obesity become an issue?

maryrose

bgates:
I imagine being a Chargers fan is akin to being a Cleveland Browns fan. We used to at least have the Cavaliers with LeBron but alas the king has left the building. Oh well there's always the draft and I especially love March Madness.

MayBee

Yeah, Charlie, but that doesn't really fully answer the last statement about carbohydrate rich diets. The carbohydrate-rich diet staple of rice has not created obesity in Asia.

maryrose

Chaco:
Thanks for explaining the book in a succinct manner.You seem like someone who is smart but doesn't suffer fools gladly.

Jim Rhoads a/k/a vjnjagvet

Charlie: Is the bottom line that a Big Mac without the bun is a pretty good meal after all?

jimmyk

And, sure enough, on average people no[w] eat less fat and exercise more than they did in the 60's.

When did obesity become an issue?

What exactly is newsworthy in this argument? Any number of people have been pointing this out for more than 30 years since Atkins's first book came out. Granted there are some cranks like Ornish who insist on low-fat diets, but the whole carbohydrate-insulin spike story, and the recognition that substituting carbs for fat was a big mistake, has been kicking around for a long time.

daddy

The">http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-12071424">The Real Caveman Diet

Danube of Thought

Are you a fat guy, Charlie?

Danube of Thought

"I don't have to explain what that's like to a Chargers fan."

When the Dan Fouts squad lost to Cincy in the Ice Bowl, I made the switch from fan to observer.

Danube of Thought

Ohio State president Gordon Gee:

"I do know, having been both a Southeastern Conference president and a Big Ten president, that it's like murderer's row every week for these schools. We do not play the Little Sisters of the Poor. We play very fine schools on any given day."

Right. You play Michigan, Penn State, Michigan State, Northwestern and Wisconsin, all of whom lost by an average of more than 20 points today.

Manuel Transmission

It's telling, though, that as asians begin to have sufficient food supplies, they quickly develop increasing levels of obesity and also the obesity-related metabolic disorders like type 2 diabetes.
Charlie--right on!

At any given lunch or dinner in China, one or two guys are Type 2. Not fat, but definitely scarfing the carbs. Sweet drinks, fruits, dumplings, noodles, rice, corn!

Jim Ryan

Dr. Gabe Mirkin was all over this a dozen years ago. His bottom line: eat wheat berries prepared in your crock pot. Time-release carbs. No insulin spike, not desire to snack two hours later. Eat very little flour products, potatoes or rice.

This was also his prescription for irritable bowel disease, the symptoms of which are highly exacerbated by flour products, potatoes or rice.

I don't feed my kids a starch in their dinners, figuring they eat a lot of starchy crap during the day. I only serve meat, vegetables and fruit for dinner. They're fit as fiddles.

BR

My New Year's Resolution:

And to laugh a lot!

PaulY

I think the ad was from Hong Kong, as HK was in the ad

Ralph L

I just turned 50, I'm 6'2", and 6 years of lifting weights has pushed my weight up to 160 after many years around 145.

Just wanted to make some of you ill.

Of course, I still look like a geek.

sbw

JR, are there such things as oat berries? I love steel cut oatmeal.

Janet

Eat very little flour products, potatoes or rice.

It really does seem to work. About the only bread we eat now is called Ezekiel Bread. (based on Ezekiel 4:9)

Jim Ryan

Holy mackerel, Ralph. My weight went up from 145 to 160 about ten years ago, due to weight lifting (brutal labor and pumping iron.) I stand every inch of 5'6".

Danube of Thought

"I nevah, evah eat fried foods – I wouldn't touch it. I wouldn't look at it. Gimme a peach or a plum or a nectarine."

--The 2,000-year-old man

Jim Ryan

"Jesus? Yes, I knew Jesus. Jesus was a good boy. But a messiah?"

--The 2,000-year-old man

Ignatz

--I just turned 50, I'm 6'2", and 6 years of lifting weights has pushed my weight up to 160 after many years around 145.--

Holy smokes Ralph, hope you don't live in a windy area.
I'm 6'3" and 215 and people still call me skinny.

Jim Ryan

Ruh roh. This is very bad news for fans of big government.

The main conclusion one arrives at the analysis is that CO2 has not a causal relation with global warming...
[SNIP]
the main effect is the CO2 increase in the atmosphere due to temperature rising.... The anthropogenic wasting of fossil fuel CO2 to the atmosphere shows no relation with the temperature changes even in an annual basis. The absence of immediate relation between CO2 and temperature is evidence that rising its mix ratio in the atmosphere will not imply more absorption and time residence of energy over the Earth surface.

From International Journal of Geosciences.

Ralph L

I do run around in the shower a lot. Good exercise.

Despite how thin my bones are, I've never broken one.

Jim Ryan

Hmm. Some of the commenters over there at WUWT have doubts about the article I just linked to, because the journal's publisher may not be the greatest. Other commenters defend the article. Whey can't they be in lock-step like the dogmatists are? Tsk tsk.

Anyway, from the comments over there, a sum-up for those of you whose eyes may have glazed over when wading through the counter-arguments to AGW theory in the last little while:

The lack of correlation between CO2 as a causal factor and consequential temperature rise has been increasingly obvious since 1998 when the temperature apparently started to level off with a continuing rise in CO2 level. What is baffling is why a vastly complex set of interrelated factors should have ever come to be portrayed as an oversimplified single cause /effect relationship which even got as far as a United Nations supported international seal of approval.

Burnt Weenie Sandwich

Sarah Palin has taken to assailing Michelle Obama's anti-obesity initiative on her reality show and elsewhere, while former Arkansas governor Mike Huckabee, the Republican Party's resident authority on obesity and a potential Palin rival, has been defending it from Palin's salvos. Two other possible GOP presidential contenders, Mississippi Gov. Haley Barbour and former senator Rick Santorum (Pa.), have also praised Obama's efforts.

In a recent broadcast of "Sarah Palin's Alaska," the former governor, high school basketball player and avid runner prepared s'mores (ingredients: marshmallows, Hershey's chocolate bars and graham crackers) and said the treat was "in honor of Michelle Obama, who said the other day we should not have dessert."

I assume y'all will be happy to, once again
rally to any anti-Michelle Denialisms your Tea-Bag sensitivities can muster.

Cops smell like donuts and coffee

Nearly one in nine federal judgeships are currently vacant, a vacancy rate that is leaving many courts barely able to function. Indeed, the problem has become so severe that Republican Chief Justice John Roberts used his annual year-end report on the federal judiciary to call upon the Senate to end this logjam:

Over many years, however, a persistent problem has developed in the process of filling judicial vacancies. Each political party has found it easy to turn on a dime from decrying to defending the blocking of judicial nominations, depending on their changing political fortunes. This has created acute difficulties for some judicial districts. Sitting judges in those districts have been burdened with extraordinary caseloads. I am heartened that the Senate recently filled a number of district and circuit court vacancies, including one in the Eastern District of California, one of the most severely burdened districts. There remains, however, an urgent need for the political branches to find a long-term solution to this recurring problem.

Even John Roberts sees Rethuglicans as un-American.

Cleo

I'm cranky, sorry. It's just that I only had some old shwag to smoke this morning. Plus, I hid my downers so well yesterday (because of my case worker was coming over) that I can't find them.

I was screaming at a stranger at a bar last night. Or so I'm told.

Army of Davids

Happy 2011 to all the great posters on this excellent site.

I urge you to see "Waiting for Superman" if you haven't already. A brutal documentary on the state of our decaying K-12 education system in the US.

This is a political issue that conservative, libertarian, free market principles should be given more say. It also shows how much damage teachers unions are doing to the future of our country.

It's not an act now urgent issue...but it is vitally important for long term US competitiveness and quality of life. We need to get this right.

Burnt Weenie Sandwich

"I was screaming at a stranger at a bar last night"

That's one affirmation of the assumed Tea-Bag sensitivity. Anyone else?

Supply-Sider

"This is a political issue that conservative, libertarian, free market principles should be given more say. It also shows how much damage teachers unions are doing to the future of our country."

Make China your model State.

Free market paradise and no Teachers Union

Supply-Sider

John Boehner (R-Ohio) acknowledged that he's well aware of the fact that his chamber is going to have to extend the federal debt limit. He noted that's already "made it pretty clear" to his own caucus that Republicans are "going to have to deal with it as adults."

Boehner added, "Whether we like it or not, the federal government has obligations and we have obligations on our part."

Dealing with the debt limit "as adults" doesn't appear to be going well. This morning, two right-wing lawmakers -- Rep. Michele Bachmann (R-Minn.) and Rep.-elect Mike Kelly (R-Minn.) -- reiterated their opposition to raising the debt limit on CBS's "Face the Nation."

Soon after, Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-S.C.) said on NBC's "Meet the Press" that failing to raise the debt ceiling "would be very bad for the position of the United States in the world at large." Graham, however, quickly followed that by saying he's prepared to hold the debt limit hostage "until a plan is in place" for the nation's long-term fiscal challenges that meets his satisfaction.

Adults, I assume is a direct reference to the Newbies.

I smell a fight. I want a ring-side seat when heads begin exploding.

Charlie (Colorado)

Charlie: Is the bottom line that a Big Mac without the bun is a pretty good meal after all?

Yes. Burger King will even sell them that way -- ask for the low-carb version.

Charlie (Colorado)

Yeah, Charlie, but that doesn't really fully answer the last statement about carbohydrate rich diets. The carbohydrate-rich diet staple of rice has not created obesity in Asia.

MayBee, my physical copy of GCBC has gone missing, and the Kindle copy frustratingly doesn't have an index, so I can't easily gather up everything Taubes says about the asian diet, but I did dig out one other point -- a traditional Asian diet has very little refined sugar and even less fructose. These cause particularly dramatic insulin spikes.

sbw

Same old mold trolls

Charlie (Colorado)

Thanks for explaining the book in a succinct manner.You seem like someone who is smart but doesn't suffer fools gladly.

I try not to be, but I also have a problem with chronic depression and I get cranky sometimes.

diIstracting ourselves with small talk

:}a traditional Asian diet has very little refined sugar and even less fructose. These cause particularly dramatic insulin spikes.


Why is diabetes so prevalent amongst Asians?

RICE

It is a sugar depth charge that explodes into the bloodstream

Charlie (Colorado)

Are you a fat guy, Charlie?

Sometimes. I'm in that neighborhood right now; I'm 6'3 and have a 51 inch chest, so I'm never skinny, but at 240 lbs I'm pretty lean. When I used to compete in Karate I was between 215 and 230, but I did a bit of bodybuilding after that.

Right now I'm 303, which is a bit much.

DebinNC

The Amazon reviews of Taubes latest are interesting. The vegans don't just disagree with Taubes, they maniacally disagree. I wonder what % of vegans are animal rights fanatics who view meat-eaters as murderers?

Also from the reviews, Taubes only offers his eating suggestions in the last chapter, which I didn't see described. Based on his earier book, does Taubes like the Atkins plan or something allowing even fewer carbs?

Charlie (Colorado)

DOWST, type 2 diabetes hasn't been a problem in East Asia until after WWII, see here for example.

It has been a big issue for upper class Indians for a long time.

The correlation seems to be availability of sweets.

The technical measure involved is called the glycemic index; regular steamed white rice is relatively high, brown rice is lower.

Charlie (Colorado)

Deb, it's basically like an Atkins inception-phase diet: 20g of carbs or less per day, but free to eat as much meat, eggs, fish, etc as you want and leafy green veg.

DebinNC

Thanks, Charlie.

RattlerGator

Charlie (Colorado), many thanks for your honest contributions in this thread (and elsewhere). I'm going to go out and get a copy of that GCBC book by Taubes.

Bill in AZ sez it's time for Zero to resign

I took a circuitous route to Taubes "Good Calories, Bad Calories", but I blame JOM.

Someone here responded to a vitamin D question by pointing to a topic covered by this blog. Thank you, whoever that was. The vitamin D article was fascinating, so I poked around on this blog, and didn't come up for air for several days. It convinced me to get "Good Calories, Bad Calories", and I am reading it for a second time because I missed so much on the first pass.

All of us who read here are educated and inquisitive beyond what any school can do for you. Most of us understand what a hoax Globull Warming is. The parallels between the Globull Warming hoax and how the official "diet pyramid" came about are amazing, and for much of the same reasons as Charlie alluded to earlier (evil, rich, consume too much of the resources, blah blah). The standard Americn diet runs us at a constant chronic overload of insulin, and the chemistry underneath that is what makes us obese, along with causing any number of ills such as diabetes, alzheimers, heart disease, etc.

Taubes is not a doctor, but is an excellent researcher and cuts through a lot of the nonsense that has been perpetrated on us. The Dr who run the above blog has a good medical and biological understanding of the why's and wherefore's that underlie Taubes research. The two in combination are fascinating.

Go and read. It WILL change your thinking. It is not a "diet" per se. It's not Atkins, nor Paleo, though there are similarities. It is more about recognizing how and why some things are simply not good for you. On the plus side, some things that you really like, but which are currently "forbidden", are actually good for you, even required.

I am in reasonably good shape, and Search and Rescue helps keep me that way - but I have dramatically improved stamina and strength through better eating choices. I can keep up with the punk kids now.

PaulY

Priktin diet stressed complex carbohydrate as opposed to proteins, fats and simple sugars.

Charlie (Colorado)

Another interesting point about Taubes' approach is that it's pretty much exactly what used to be prescribed as a diet for type 1 diabetes, because it removes insulin spikes and thus makes it easier to regulate with injected insulin.

Porchlight

I'll join in with the folks who are planning to check out Good Calories, Bad Calories after reading this thread. Thanks for the info, all.

Jim Ryan

Charlie, I'm confused on a point. Sweets are the culprit much more than rice and flour products? I thought that rice and flour products bad calories almost as much as sweets (almost as pronounced a spike of insulin.) Can you clarify? Thanks.

larry

I'm 6' 2" and all my adult years weighed 190-195. Never had to worry about what or how much I ate, thanked G-d for such great metabolism. At any group meal, I ate the most. In '99, I was widowed and dropped to 150, bounced to 160, 32" waist. Quit smoking 14 months ago and from month 2 to 4, zoomed to 210# and 43". I cannot detect any change in my eating habits either in the loss of 40 or the gain of 50#. Currently 224# (at dr office Thursday)a lot of which is congestive fluid retention. Bought trou and belts at 36", again at 42". Next move maybe oughta buy the book, ya think? Or I could just keep buying clothes as I say goodbye to my toes.

larry

Maybe only 7 minutes left in the hall of fame career of the good Barber twin, Ronde. Saints/Bucs running now on Fox.

Bill in AZ sez it's time for Zero to resign

Jim Ryan: "Sweets are the culprit much more than rice and flour products?"

I would have to anduril this thread quote most of Taubes book to answer this with appropriate bolding and indenting, and then the pistolas would come out. Unfortunately, it is difficult to distill it down to a few paragraphs.

Refined grains break down quickly into basically glucose which causes an insulin spike. Sugar, on the other hand, is glucose and fructose, roughly 50% each. HFCS, is a bit higher in fructose, lower in glucose, more like 55%/45%.

Only glucose causes the insulin spike. This is one of the reasons some high sugar items have a lower "glycemic index" than some refined grain products, because the sugar is half glucose/half fructose, and only the glucose half drives insulin. But fructose does a lot of other things which are in some ways worse, especially in the quantities the typical modern diet imposes. Where fructose causes problems is that it is more directly involved in carrying and storing fat in the body through a bit of a lengthy process. It would be much better to read about that process from an expert either at the blog I mentioned above, or in Taubes book.

DebinNC

Dr. Harris:

Are there any real health benefits to recommend eating fruit?

No.

And I don't care what you read in the paper or read on MSN health
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Bill, that's a very interesting blog. The idea that whole wheat and apples are bad for us is almost impossible to believe...but I bet it's true. I bookmarked that blog during the Vit D discussion too, then forgot about it. Thanks for the reminder.

(Another) Barbara

Someone here responded to a vitamin D question by pointing to a topic covered by this blog. Thank you, whoever that was.

You're welcome, Bill. I had often wondered whether any of the JOMers who had followed my link to PaNu had read any further and had been at all persuaded.

Mama proud!

Yes, Good Calories, Bad Calories is so densely loaded with information that it's a demanding read, but oh so worth it. I keep a copy close by and open it at random every few days, re-reading paragraphs, sections and chapters. It's difficult to see people mock Taubes without studying his evidence. I believe he likely understands human metabolism better than anyone on the planet. Wish I could buy a copy for everyone here. Happy New Year.

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