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January 08, 2011


Sara (Pal2Pal)

Oy, a Federal judge was also shot and killed according to Shep.


State Senator Lopez also told Shep that the shooter was an Afghanistan vet.

Boy I hope she's wrong. 15+ shots reported, which is very unusual. Most magazines are 14 or less.

Sara (Pal2Pal)

Ewwww, eerie, the Judge was John M. Roll. That is the same name of the doctor who delivered my son many many years ago.

Sara (Pal2Pal)

President Barack Obama: “This morning, in an unspeakable tragedy, a number of Americans were shot in Tuscon, Arizona, at a constituent meeting with Congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords. And while we are continuing to receive information, we know that some have passed away, and that Representative Giffords is gravely wounded. We do not yet have all the answers. What we do know is that such a senseless and terrible act of violence has no place in a free society. I ask all Americans to join me and Michelle in keeping Representative Giffords, the victims of this tragedy, and their families in our prayers.”

House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-CA): “It is with the deepest sadness that we have received word of the attack on Congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords, members of her staff, and her constituents. This terrible act of violence is a national tragedy, and today is a very sad day for our country. My prayers, and the prayers of all Members of Congress, go out to her husband, Captain Mark Kelly, their family, and to all of the staff and others who were victims of this horrible attack. Congresswoman Giffords is a brilliant and courageous Member of Congress, bringing to Washington the views of a new generation of national leaders. It is especially tragic that she was attacked as she was meeting with her constituents whom she serves with such dedication and distinction.”

Gov. Sarah Palin (AK): “My sincere condolences are offered to the family of Rep. Gabrielle Giffords and the other victims of today’s tragic shooting in Arizona. On behalf of Todd and my family, we all pray for the victims and their families, and for peace and justice.”

More statements here

Jack is Back!

Gunman is Jared Laughner. 22 year old white male. Could the target have been Roll? Roll was controversial for letting a lawsuit tied to immigration and the border go through. This will turn out to be totally different than what we know now or what the blogosphere is speculating on and about.

Jack is Back!

Gunman named Jared Laughner. 22 year old white male.


Probably,JIB. We could write a template for these made up reports couldn't we?

Jack is Back!

Sorry for double post. Didn't think the first one went through.

1 dead at hospital, 5 in critical and 5 others in serious. Giffords is one of the critical and the medico is giving her a positive recovery. Child is the one dead at hospital. Giffords shot one time and through & through (went through the brain.)
BTW, this is not that unique or rare.

Jack is Back!


Funny, on all the boards - only speculation and wild acusatons but hardly any prayers or condolences or consideration of the people who were wounded, killed or the 9 year old child that was killed. Weird how we forget how fragile life is and why we need to be close to our loved ones each day because you just never know when your time is up. May God bless all who were affected by this but for crying out loud forget the politics. It is very likely it had nothing to do with this.

Jane the hostage taker

It's Jared Loughner (in case you know him). Another person has been arrested.

Jack is Back!

Loughner is one strange kid. Here is his YouTube productions. LUN

Speculation is that he is a GLPer. Big time conspiracy site.

He is one sick puppy.


What is a GLPer?


What is a GLPER?

Not much politics, here.  Which means anything can be made of him.

Ordinary, intelligent, schizophrenic.

Jack is Back!

God Like Productions - Big time conspiracy site. LUN

He is going to turn out to be mentally ill like the guy who asked Rather what the frequency is.


Godlike Productions, seems to b e a conspiracy site like Info Wars or Prison Planet, 'out where the buses don't run'

Surely she's sedated now, though.

The surgeon reports that she is responsive to commands. That's big league good news.

Jack is Back!

He is going to turn out to be more like UnaBomber than a Palin acolyte. If anything, reading his writings he is more anarchist than right-wing or Tea Party. In fact, his writings remind me more of Olberman than Beck.

Looney, unfortunately and not political unless you think someone who wants to burn all flags is political.


Ann on the other thread says the video has him burning the American flag.


Tammy Bruce Tweet:
The shooter seems to be a flaming psychotic, yet now a Republican on CNN says 'talk radio' needs to realize words have an impact. Amazing.


From JiB's link to his webpage, here's what he lists as his favorite books:

"Animal Farm, Brave New World, The Wizard Of OZ, Aesop Fables, The Odyssey, Alice Adventures Into Wonderland, Fahrenheit 451, Peter Pan, To Kill A Mockingbird, We The Living, Phantom Toll Booth, One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest, Pulp,Through The Looking Glass, The Communist Manifesto, Siddhartha, The Old Man And The Sea, Gulliver's Travels, Mein Kampf, The Republic, and Meno."

I doubt many Tea Partiers list The Communist Manifesto and Mein Kampf among their favorites.

Sara (Pal2Pal)

Well it sounds like the shooter is an extremist. His favorite books, The Communist Manifesto and Mein Kampf.

Jack is Back!

Hey, Kim, knowing you to be a big cricket fan, did you read where some researchers in England are blaming Australia's loss and England's win of the Ashes on La Nina? Pretty neat.
England bowlers get more movement on the ball in humid, colder than normal conditions. Whereas if its hot and dry in Australia they don't get the same spin.


A nut job. Plain and simple. Favorite book is Mein Kampf.



Jackie Storrer, right, tries her best to figure out the clues on a giant crossword as Jared Loughner, a volunteer, stands in the background during the Tucson Festival of Books.

A pic of the fellow that I found quickly. Evidently "stuff" is being taken down quickly.

Jack is Back!


If he read any of those books I'll burn my flag. But "One Flew over The Cuckoo's Nest" was written by Ken Kesey who was probably crazier than Marx and Hitler but in a funny, funny way.


JiB - how good is "positive recovery" - alive, possibly even full recovery? That would be miraculous!

I've seen some of the alleged shooter's apparent myspace and youtube material. It's incoherent enough I can't even tell if he's angry, much less what he'd be angry at; he uses words like "constitution", "flag", and "government", though sometimes in contexts like "If you can see this bird then you will understand. You think this bird is able to chat about a government?"

It makes the reports of multiple shooters even harder to understand. I can't imagine the guy who wrote that stuff joining up with other human beings to plan so much as lunch at McDonald's.


What was that Linda Lopez, about an Afghan War Vet, again,

He was angry that the government interfered in his dreams.

He mentions a recruiting office, so he may have been trying to get into the military.

Jack is Back!


Ever go to a Starbucks in a Barnes and Noble near any college campus and note there is always some guy with a ton of books writing almost secretly in a journal, filling in every millimeter of the line and the full page - all mindless gibberish but he also has 3 or 4 volumes of notebooks full and is overly protective or his space?

That was Jared or one of his species. This is a guy who is what my dad used to call "a half a bubble off".


He does seem schizophrenic, bgates.

There was one report that someone in the group shot at him. Perhaps that's where the second shooter story originates.

The sun doesn't revolve around humanity, but the climate does.

Hey, JiB, I've watched a match or two, but big time fan isn't true. I understand no nuances, and have learned most of what I know from PG Wodehouse.

But dontcha know, man is responsible for the weather? We'll be sacrificing virgins next.

Jack is Back!

Ain't it funny how everything so far has proved to be completely false, misleading or irrelevant? This has more to go before the media drops it like a hot potato since it will turn out that this guy was just plain looney.

Obama is speaking and I wonder if he will make some stupid observation. He tells Brewer he will give her the full resources of the Federal government. Yeah, right, like he has done to secure the border.

Sara (Pal2Pal)

This is just creepy. YouTube of Jared Loughner burning flag with music screeching Let the bodies hit the floor.


Misc. info from Ben Smith on Loughner.

For what, Mr. President, for what?

He tells Brewer he will give her the full resources of the Federal government.


JiB: Obama is "rooting" for the victims.


Shepard just said he was a war vet.


Shep is a moron, if today didn't make it clear,



Since he just said that the shooter's motives may not be what they first appeared to be, his entire afternoon of rambling made it clear he is a moron.

hit and run

YouTube of Jared Loughner burning flag with music screeching Let the bodies hit the floor.

It was a video that Loughner "favorited" on his youtube channel,from what I can tell,not Loughner himself in the video.

Jack is Back!

A little levity. LUN

Sara (Pal2Pal)

Oh thanks Hit. I picked it up as a link from another site, guess I didn't read close enough.

Anyone know who "BoyBlue" of Daily Kos might be:

My CongressWOMAN voted against Nancy Pelosi! And is now DEAD to me!

Did you notice the rare bird on his shoulder?

h&r, I'll bet that is he in the video. He's lucky he didn't set the countryside on fire. It looks dry.

Jack is Back!

Could this guy be a Jehovah's Witness? His fascination with BCE tells me that he has either dabbled in it or likes to read the Watchtower. Anyone read his bio on YouTube? When did he have time to serve in Afghanistan?


Must reads:
Fahrenheit 451
To Kill a Mockingbird

Interesting read:
One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest

Of its time, needing interpretation to select useful ideas:
The Republic

Outdated Romantic:

Mein Kampf

Propaganda with unscientific popular misrepresentations:
The Communist Manifesto

Sara (Pal2Pal)

Via Talkleft:


He looks about 10 years old. Sheesh!

Not psychotic, just crazy.  This Jarred is deeply psychotic.  Surely people noticed.

I think BoyBlue is someone else.

Jack is Back!

Anyone know the story of his visiting a recruiting center and getting upset because an officer there gave him a bible or is it the reverse?


Yeah, well for schizophrenics, the disease starts to manifest itself in the late teens and goes into full blown crazy by the early twenties. LUN

hit and run

JiB -- where'd you come up with the GLP connection? Because I've been glued to the thread on the shooting there.

And in which I found http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:EHMYwjAu6p8J:www.bollywoodsargam.com/video_todayfeaturedvideo.php%3Fblockbustermovieclip%3DmFQDJEnJkp0----Top_Secret%253A_Your_Unlocatable_Street!_(Time_%2526_Double_Blind_Grammar)_featured_hollywood_blockbuster_video.html+classitup10&cd=17&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&client=ubuntu>a link to this....

The video was taken down, but the transcript is there over on the right side scrolling. It's the same name Loughner used on his youtube channel.

You want a portion?


Classitup10 writes --> Hello, and welcome my classified leak of information that's of the United States Military to the student body and you. Firstly, I want you to understand this from the start. Did you know grammar is double blind, listener? Secondly, if you want to understand the start of revelatory thoughts then listen to this video. I'll look at you mother fuckin Anarchists who have a problem with them illegal illiterate pigs. :-D If you're a citizen in the United States as of now, then your constitution is the United States. You're a citizen in the United States as of now. Thus, your constitution is the United States. Laugh. I'll let you in on their little cruel joke that's genocidal. They're argument is appeal to force on their jurisdiction with lack of proof of evidence. Each subject is in question for the location! The police don't quite get paid correctly with them dirty front runners under section 10? Their country's alliances are able to make illegal trades under section 10. Eh! I'm a Nihilist, not someone who put who put trust in god! What is section 10 you ask? If you make a purchase then it's illegal under section 10 and amendment 1 of the United States constitution. You make a purchase. Therefore, it's illegal under section 10 and amendment 1 of the United States constitution. We need a drum roll for those front runners in the election; those illegal teachers, pigs, and politicians of yours are under illegal authority of their constitution.


It gets "better" from there.

Sara (Pal2Pal)

The news channels are making a big deal over all the "violent, rude" threats Giffords has received in the past year or so. Just so you don't lose context, all Congresscritters get threats regularly. My Congresswoman/her District office averaged one or two bomb threats per month and threats against her person or staff were weekly occurrences. She used former Navy Seals and Army Rangers as body guards wherever she went and we always had extra security for larger events. That was back in the early '90s and I'll bet that the threats are even more numerous and crazier today than they were back then.


Geez...what a thread today...

First off - On Current Topic (O.C.T. 912,234,564,879,132,678,900 which I have defined so it must be) - the kid is nutzzzz. So much for all of the earlier coverage. I also send my prayers and good wishes for the victims and their families. I also am praying for Loughner and his family.

JiB - laughed quite loudly when I saw the video you linked. Actually made Mrs. Specter come and see it.

TK - thanks for the link to the B24/B36 article. The newsreel vid was fun to watch. The production of those planes was a bit before my time....

Seahawks Score! Whoddathunk?


He could have gotten a job writing labels for Dr. Bronner's.

Where do you think I get all my stuff?

MayBee, do you have any idea how many happy hours I've spent in the tub with my Plum and my Bronner's bottle?

Jack is Back!


When I heard his name I ran it both ways since I once knew a guy named Loughner. Number one google hit was a link to a question of his YouTube site, "Is he a GLPer?". I went from there.

I have been watching GLP also. Not too bad but I think its a hangout for peepers, lurkers and jokers not the UnaBomber or Kenneth set.


From Hit and Run's link:

! Do you now have enough information to know the two wars are illegal! What is your date of time, listener? Fourthly, those applications that are with background checks break the United States constitution! What's your riot name? I'll catch you!

Really, he is pretty incoherent. Anybody trying to get a "lesson" out of this incident is barking up the wrong tree.

Jack is Back!


Sound like anyone around here? Incoherent, anti-war, etc. Just saying:)


Now, now, everyone - I know from a reliable source (Twitter) that Christiane Amanpour is rushing to Tucson. Whew! What a relief that is! Now we will get real, unbiased reporting! /snark


lol, JiB - I thought the same thing!


So another incoherent anarchist nutbag like Bedell, Stack, maybe Bishop, the Discovery
Channel shooter, yet the first instinct was
to blame the Tea Party, Sarah, and Afghan war vets in that order.


Precisely, narciso. You's think that template would be worn out by now.

Jack is Back!


And that my friend is why this story will have the shortest legs since my pet Dachsund got snipped. Wait till they find an Obama-Biden bumper sticker on his car.

hit and run

the shortest legs since my pet Dachsund got snipped

According to google,that's the first time in the history of the internet that those words in that order have been used.

I applaud you.


Have we heard yet whether he was stressed out over financial problems? Or perhaps he knew some combat vets and had PTSD-by-proxy.

hit and run

Or that he was denied health insurance for a pre-existing condition before Obamacare.


--He could have gotten a job writing labels for Dr. Bronner's.--

Heh. I've wondered how an outfit that whacko can make such great soap.


And to think the recruiter wrote in "none" where Loughner was asked about "belief" - he probably took it as an insult that the guy thought he had no beliefs....


I guess the truth about him got out a bit early for that to work,MayBee..Though with Amanpour digging about in Tucson I could be wrong

Captain Hate

Shep is a moron, if today didn't make it clear

Fox has made a huge mistake letting an emotionally retarded drama queen like Perez Hilton Shemp cover breaking news. For all the griping the lefties do about the network, sometime they inadvertently land on the truth.


I guess the truth about him got out a bit early for that to work,MayBee..Though with Amanpour digging about in Tucson I could be wrong

I think those "motives" are only assigned to shooters for whom the real motive is quite obvious.

hit and run

From Ace . . . http://twitter.com/caitieparker>a twitter person who claims to know him (as a lefty)


The twitter person is fascinating. Before she knew it was an old friend, she had tweeted this:

# tcmassie Rep. Giffords was on #Palin's infamous "target" map: http://usat.ly/e4NSjp Today she was shot in Tuscon. What is the US turning into? #p2 about 3 hours ago via web Retweeted by caitieparker and 100+ others

# democracynow RT @felixsalmon Sarah Palin *literally* put a gun sight on @Rep_Giffords. See Palin's map: http://bit.ly/fLwY2g about 2 hours ago via TweetDeck Retweeted by caitieparker and 100+ others

hit and run

And since....

(read from bottom to top to go from oldest to most recent)

This is a circus. Good Morning America just called me.
less than 5 seconds ago via Twitter for iPhone

@antderosa it's loughner just checked my year book.
less than 20 seconds ago via Twitter for iPhone in reply to antderosa

@lakarune I haven't seen him since '07. Then, he was left wing.
25 minutes ago via Twitter for iPhone in reply to lakarune

@noboa more left. I haven't seen him since '07 though. He became very reclusive.
27 minutes ago via Twitter for iPhone in reply to noboa

@antderosa he had a lot of friends until he got alcohol poisoning in '06, & dropped out of school. Mainly loner very philosophical.
29 minutes ago via Twitter for iPhone in reply to antderosa

@antderosa As I knew him he was left wing, quite liberal. & oddly obsessed with the 2012 prophecy.
33 minutes ago via Twitter for iPhone in reply to antderosa

@antderosa he was a pot head & into rock like Hendrix,The Doors, Anti-Flag. I haven't seen him in person since '07 in a sign language class
35 minutes ago via Twitter for iPhone in reply to antderosa

@antderosa He was a political radical & met Giffords once before in '07, asked her a question & he told me she was "stupid & unintelligent"
37 minutes ago via Twitter for iPhone in reply to antderosa

@antderosa I can. That is him.
39 minutes ago via Twitter for iPhone in reply to antderosa

@antderosa I went to high school, college, & was in a band with the gunman. This tragedy has just turned to horrific.
43 minutes ago via Twitter for iPhone in reply to antderosa

Official I went to high school & college, & was in a band w/ the gunman. I can't even fathom this right now.
about 1 hour ago via Twitter for iPhone

Saying Jared Laughner was the gunman. Really hoping that's not the same guy I went to HS with, really good friend. Freaking out right now!!!
about 1 hour ago via Twitter for iPhone


What the heck is the 2012 prophecy or whatever that the twitter friend references?


I want to point out, once again, that Obama said not ONE public word about Pvt William Long, who was killed nor Pvt. Quinton Ezeagwula, who was injured outside an Arkansas recruiting station by a man who had trained with AlQaeda in Yemen.

Jim Rhoads a/k/a vjnjagvet

I think it is someone's prophecy that the end of the world is coming in 2012.

hit and run

2012 refers to the Mayan prophesy of doooooom!!!!


The end of Loughner's world is coming a year early,Jim.

hit and run

(btw GLP has some eeeinteresting threads about the 2012 prophecy)


MayBee, that's an excellent point. Of course, the other shootings didn't involve someone whose vote in Congress Obama needed.


At least Obama didn't start this one with a "shout out".


What the heck is the 2012 prophecy or whatever that the twitter friend references?

ha ha ha ha ha.
John Cusack was the star of the 2012 movie. He would be the first to blame Palin if it was a Teapartier.

Danube of Thought

First reports on these kinds of events are always wrong. Let's see what we know in 24 hours.


Just as I thought. Cusack has tweeted his approval of this, from Krugman:

We don’t have proof yet that this was political, but the odds are that it was. She’s been the target of violence before. And for those wondering why a Blue Dog Democrat, the kind Republicans might be able to work with, might be a target, the answer is that she’s a Democrat who survived what was otherwise a GOP sweep in Arizona, precisely because the Republicans nominated a Tea Party activist. (Her father says that “the whole Tea Party” was her enemy.) And yes, she was on Sarah Palin’s infamous “crosshairs” list.

Think again, Mr. 2012.


Not always wrong. In 24 hours we will still know that Shemp is an idiot.


Oh, acid drip - tomorrow will be full of the usual MFM crap. Luckily, I wised up several years ago and watch none of them.

* ABC’s George Stephanopoulos will co-anchor tomorrow’s “Good Morning America” live from the scene of the shootings in Tucson, joined by anchor Dan Harris.

* NBC’s Lester Holt is on his way to Arizona, where he will co-anchor “Today” and will contribute to “Meet the Press.”

> Earlier: Christiane Amanpour to host “This Week” from Tucson, Arizona tomorrow.

Rick Ballard

It's not commonly known but the Mayan "end of the world" prophecy for 2012 only applies if Obama is re-elected. A left leaning team of anthropologists made the discovery recently but they haven't been able to keep it secret. Pass it on.

BTW - this guy is a needle ready anarcho-nihilist. No dimcap for him.


Vultures always circle death and destruction before landing - eager to feast on the remains.

Danube of Thought

I, too, am mystified about the connection between the B-24's, B-36's and the Naval Aviation centennial. Ellyson did indeed fly out of North Island, having been taught to fly there by Glenn Curtiss. If you look at a Google map of San Diego, you'll see that North Island is actually contiguous with (and larger than) the adjacent town of Coronado. Until about the 1930's the two were separated by a shallow wetland known as Spanish Bight.

In my bank here there is a giant photo of Curtiss at an altitude of maybe 100 feet, apparently either taking off or landing, on the beach just south of the Hotel del Coronado, with the hotel looming large immediately behind him and the gawkers looking up at him.


Now hearing reports about how scared members of Congress are for themselves.

Keep in mind, other Americans are ridiculous if we get scared for ourselves by terrorist incidents. When common citizens are the target, we are supposed to carry on to prove to the terrorists that they can't harm us.


And Ace burned a whole lot of fur, with a self inflicted blaster, today,


I want the names and addresses of those people stupid enough to waste a good Sunday morning listening to those three morons filling air time with nothing.
Mr. Ballard, get those prospectuses ready, please.

Jack is Back!

My dachsund is now so short he can sit on cigarette paper. I wonder how the Sunday NY Times is going to spin this?

"Nothing here to disturb your latte, folks. Have you heard about how old the Constitution is and why its irrelevant?"

But believe me, there will be plenty of coverage on gun laws!

Captain Hate

Yes narc, Ace never fails to make a complete ass out of himself in situations like this. I don't know why I hold out hope for him to be sane since there's no credible evidence of that happening.

Jack is Back!

Ace is a country club republican in a boiler suit.


It came up in my googling of Naval Aviation, Danube, how I found out your family's contribution to history, I was reminded once, not to mention someone's surname, if it hasn't been publicly disclosed, so I don't know if I should do it in this case..


Judge Roll was young and rather cute. He probably went to the grocery store to pick up a few things. And his life ended.

Giffords is still alive and, hopefully, will recover.

Sadly, Judge Roll is with the angels. No one much wants to talk about him - does he have a wife? children? What about the nine year old child? And the others that died today?

The MFM is so narrow. So very narrow in what they think is "news."

What a damned depressing day this turned out to be.



When I was living in SD the nuclear carriers used to tie up (right term?) at North Island. My inlaws always stayed at the Hotel Del when they visited. Right next to the Hotel (going south) there is a condo complex - I interviewed Orville Redenbacher in his place there for my Master's program...


--I, too, am mystified about the connection between the B-24's, B-36's and the Naval Aviation--

Like I said upthread the B 36 was just AF as far as I know but the B 24 was used by the Navy and had its own variant:
">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PB4Y_Privateer"> The PBY4-1 and 2
Just Navalized Liberators.

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