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February 28, 2011



Speaking only for myself, I cannot wait until you and Glenn get off this health kick and into something we all (especially Jane and except Janet)can relate to--vice, corruption, you know , the fun things in life.

Dave (in MA)

There's nothing Nietzsche couldn't teach ya 'bout the raising of the wrist.

Danube of Thought

Eight weeks, 28 pounds, South Beach Diet. Also available to discuss natural-born, Cryptoinomicon, you name it.

Rob Crawford

Socrates himself was permanently pissed!


buzz off, DoT. We don't reallywant to hear about it.


Well, 28 pounds is a lot to gain. I hope he had room. The Blue Demons seem to have put on weight, although Kyrie is feeling better.

Charlie (Colorado)

Next, radium watches come back.

Jack is Back!


Did you do the Trappist mode (no alchohol for 1st 2 weeks)?

That is what holds me back from going the full monty.


"Hey! I know something about vice", she hacked between gulps of coffee, as the smoke hovered around her head.


Btw, something that really does neither, was Rove's NY Magazine profile, by Joe Hagan, with
photo by Andre Serrano, (yes that Andre Serrano) it really does give some measure of the man


I have a question on proper Martini nutrition and etiguette:

Last night I was buying, so I took my 2 co-workers (Patrick the Catholic kid from Arizona State, and Patrick the Catholic kid from Arizona---don't get me started) to the bar of Morton's SteakHouse on the 4th Floor overlooking HongKong Harbor.

Beautiful view BTW.

Anyhow, ordered a Martini. I don't know squat about Martini's, but the good bartender made me a gin Martini, "straight up", in the traditional Martini glass. He took 2 pitted green olives on a thin plastic skewer and put them in the glass and that was that. Tasted like lighter fluid, but after half the glass was empty surprisingly it tasted just fine, and then you munch on the olives at the end. Yum.

The 2 Patrick's each had a "dirty Martini", vodka, and wound up putting olives with blue cheese-stuck in the hole into their glasses.

I tried that trick with my second Martini, but it seemed what with all the blue cheese stuff floating around, to mildly subtract from the flavor of the lighter fluid my taste buds had previously surrendered to. And while sipping it I suddenly felt a tad embarrassed with the second concoction, as if I was suddenly in a Cowboy bar and had egregiously ordered something sweet and fruity with a little umbrella in it. That realization bought on a momentary cold sweat. Yikes.

Did I do wrong? Did I do right? Is there a preferred Martini drinking style and etiquette beyond which Jeeve's would insist no man should go? Or is it okay to just dump all sorts of s#*t on a skewer into the kerosine to make the thing go down smoother?



That Which Does Not Kill Me Makes Me Stronger

Not sure that's true. Sometimes, that which does not kill me makes me a basket case the rest of my life because of the horrible experience that I can't forget.


Thata girl, Janet..Someone has to hold up standards around this place.


After Jackie Chan and Owen Wilson swapped bath bubbles in High Noon, I don't think anybody has to worry about the "cowboy" impression in China. If you got drunk you did it right.

Danube of Thought

daddy, I'm no expert on this--well, actually, if there is such a thing as a Martini expert I think I could qualify--but I think the whole notion of the "dirty" Martini, which I take to mean adding a little olive juice, is an abomination and should be punished by time in the little-ease. As for what kind of condiments you add, it's a matter of personal choice, and it's a very nice trend that nowadays most servers will inquire. One or two olives, or a cocktail onion, or a twist of lemon are all OK for me. Suit yourself, but to the extent it is anything other than something to munch on after you drain the glass I think it detracts from the sublime magic of the drink.


The first half of Nietzsche's maxim is essential:

From the military school of life - What does not kill me, makes me stronger.

Sara (Pal2Pal)

Who cares when it is CADBURY EGG TIME!


I would suggest you try a Bombay sapphire martini, straight up with a very small dose of vermouth applied in the proper way, lightly rinsed around the lower 1/4 of the glass and then dumped.

A better class of lighter fluid if you ask me. "Dirty" martinis are just that, and all the other weird concoctions they label as martinis are simply mis-labeling.

Ms. Charles and I often tease Asta with the bleu cheese filled olives, for which she has a craving....

Thomas Collins

Have three scoops of rum raisin ice cream at about 3 pm. It's a great appetite suppressant. You won't be tempted to load up on carrots, lettuce and broccoli at the salad bar.


Btw, PPP cooked up a Wisconsin poll, guess what they found out, sarc,


Yum, sounds perfect to me Matt. (Although I also like Vodka martini's, even though the traditional is made with Gin.)

TC and Janet, you both crack me up! Thanks for the giggles.

Melinda Romanoff


Somehow I just don't envision you as "thin".

No offense, because neither am I.


Matt has hit it on the head. That's my idea of a perfect martini. Three olives however. My wife who won't drink a martini gets two of them.

The first martini I ordered in WI came in a tub, had ice and was made with vodka. Big surprise for me. Vodka or Gin seems to be a regional thing.

Danube of Thought

I think the old-time Martini enthusiast would say that if it isn't gin it isn't a Martini, but for many years I have just been unable to enjoy gin while I love the premium vodkas.

Yes, JiB, I did the trappist mode for the first two weeks. Well nigh unbearable, but perhaps it made me stronger.

As a bonus, let me offer this vital tip for the outdoorsman: never, ever enter a forest without taking Martini makings with you. If you ever get lost, just start mixing one up and at least three people will suddenly appear to tell you what you're doing wrong.


That is what holds me back from going the full monty.

28 is hard to beat, but I'm down 12 for the year, 8 more to go, and I didn't sacrifice the health benefits of vino. January, I went low fat. Lost 6, but it wasn't pleasant. February, I went low carb after all the Tubbes talk - ate bacon & eggs, cheese, ribs, nuts, steak, lamb, pork, fried chicken, soprasetta, etc., to my heart's content, 3 meals a day - and lost another 6 so far. No limit to drinking involved. But no sugar, bread, potatoes, pasta, etc.

I didn't believe it, even after reading the Tubbes book, but I do now.


"but I think the whole notion of the "dirty" Martini, which I take to mean adding a little olive juice, is an abomination and should be punished by time in the little-ease."

Thank you for that DoT. My testosterone sensed as much.

"...Bombay sapphire..."

Excellent suggestion Matt. Will be taken for action!

"...three scoops of rum raisin ice cream..."

TC, How do you get that on the Martini skewer?

Thomas Collins

If you're eating rum raisin ice cream, daddy, forget the martini skewer. Just wash it down with some Bruichladdich scotch.

By the way, I see in the article to which TM linked, cherries are discussed favorably. I wonder whether this includes cherries that find their way on top of certain adult beverages.



Forget the martini, grey goose, club soda, no fruit is the way to go.

Rick Ballard


It would be more interesting to see a poll on how many Americans have made a decision never to buy another Government Motors vehicle or Government Electric anything. If the Dems thought they had a chance they would initiate a recall in Wisconsin tomorrow. I'm pretty sure Gov. Walker's response would be "bring it on" and we would see the most well funded campaign in history on his behalf.

Another Bob

Jane. Grey Goose and soda?

How dare you.


Jane, soda with Grey Goose? Shame on you.


Daddy, my preferences for martinis are as follows: strict two thirds/ one thirds proportion; gin, never vodka, preferably Beefeater or Tangeray; I personally don't find the Bombay worth the extra money. I also like to put in a drop of sweet vermouth, and I avoid the blue cheese stuffed olives for the pimento stuffed ones.


Mary, ABob,

Well other wise I would be drunk in a half hour. You guys are impressive!

Jack is Back!

daddy, DoT and matt,

I've mentioned this before here but in San Francisco, in Haight-Ashbury, of all places, is a legendary martini bar called Aub Zam Zam. The use to have a bartender/Owner who was a real ornery perfectionist when it came to the drink. He was known to ask people to leave if they asked for a "Vodka Martini", or "on the rocks". I think his name was John but his long gone and they are under new owners who are much more liberal and have things like chocolate martinis.

If the Upper Peninsula of Michigan, in the very blue collar town of Ishpeming, where the large iron ore pellet mines and taconite mills are located there is The Mather Inn. In the bar they serve you a tradional martini in a glass dubbed the bird bath. Its volume is the same as 4 martini glasses. If you drink it complete and can still stand up and walk to the bar, they let you keep the glass.

I believe Bombay Is a little over-rated according to John at Aub Zam Zam the best gin for a martini is Tanquery or Beefeaters. Me, I like Beefeaters, very dry, shaken and straight up with extra olives.

Jack is Back!

Pardon all the "clarician" typos but I am still getting use to the iPad keyboard.


I have decided that what with all the valuable suggestions coming in from everybody now, (DoT, Matt, TC, Jane, Peter, harrijf, etc) I should probably print this thread out and simply try, in order, each and every JOMer's recommendation on this thread as I spot an empty barstool.

It's the least I can do.


okay, peter, I am drinking Brandy Manhattans right now, so my brain is not functioning optimally, perhaps, but could you please explain the two thirds/one proportion thingy to me?

(For instance, I mix 2/3 Brandy to 1/3 sweet vermouth.)

What 2/3 and 1/3 are you referring to for the Martini?

Sara (Pal2Pal)

Oh dear, Me: just a plain ol' Long Island Ice Tea.


making Asta jump for the olives is the best part of it all.

As to Bombay, that's where a Costco membership comes in handy.

I will never forget being in the steakhouse at the Intercontinental in Hong Kong with a Chinese friend who "owned the place". I had thought he was celibate, but he started out with martinis, we trekked through 2 amazing bottles of Bordeaux with a first class dinner, and finished up in the cigar bar closing the place, me discoursing on the evils of candidate Obama at the time.

The next morning I woke up to a tossing and turning room. It wasn't me, really. It was the worst damn typhoon that had hit the place in 10 years. Utterly black at 9:00 in the morning.... road signs blown down; the ones rooted by the Brits in good concrete, not the new Chinese stuff.....double decker buses blown out to sea.....The Star Ferry shut down.....I considered it an omen.

It seems so long ago now. The cigar bar was, I believe, closed by the Hong Kong Health Fascists. My friend is back on the wagon. And Obama is in the White House.....

I shall go home and console myself with a true martini, perhaps....



It's 10:40 in the morning here and I'm just heading out the door to take the bus to Stanley Market for some shopping stuff. Unfortunately have to stay sober since tonight we're off to Osaka, but weather looks beautiful and most importantly, Warm. And yes, the room was tossing and turning, but that was due to the Martini adventure last night, not typhoons. Zia Gin!

Melinda Romanoff

Yikes, Sara, no round about warm-up beverages for you.

I suppose it's a decent enough painkiller when you only have to order 1.


I guess this shouldn'r be a surprise, except for the brazen nature of it, in the LUN


It would be more interesting to see a poll on how many Americans have made a decision never to buy another Government Motors vehicle or Government Electric anything.

I'm one.

Hey, I don't drink, so there wasn't much else on this thread for me to respond to!


When I was slinging drinks years ago a fellow walked into the bar and ordered a Crown Royal and coke. Since I worked with an "old time" bartender he poured a shot of Crown and separately coke over ice leaving enough for the shot. He maintained he wasn't going to commit the crime of combining the two. Let the customer do the damage...


I'm another and I'm shopping for cars now. Pretty much down to a Ford Fusion or a Hyundai Tucson. The daughter gets my Mustang convertible when she graduates (2004) and I'd buy another in a heartbeat if it came with 4 doors and a larger trunk. Until then, I'm looking at trunk size and cozy features - not new, unless I get a really good deal like 0% financing which Ford IS offering right now.

It's hard to get excited about buying a heavily depreciating asset for $35-40K when I'm looking at buying a 2 BR condo near the beach for the same dollars. Plus, it should appreciate and has tax advantages.

Frau Steingehirn

Red, tart Montmorency cherries, either dried or in concentrate, are the ticket and some cancer patients swear by them. I'm probably the only one here who really enjoys TM's health alerts.

Rick Ballard


You're not the only one. I enjoy them from the viewpoint of watching the health Lysenkoism self demolish and with the hope that TM's pieces increase the amount of skepticism with which pronouncements by lab coated credentialed morons describing the elephant on the basis of a hair from its tail should be greeted.

Painting with statistics is much more art than science.


I was always under the impression that Asta was a boy, not a girl. Or did you mean that it was Ms. Charles who was begging for the olives?

Straight gin tastes better than vodka, imho. But if you are going to drink vodka, then I think that a vodka tonic on the rocks is a very nice drink.


Rick, I read a fascinating theory a couple of years ago about women whose maternal grandmothers didn't get enough to eat during the second trimester of their pregnancies with their mothers. They show significantly higher rates of obesity than cousins whose mothers were in the womb before or after the famine.

Looks an awful lot like Lysenkoism -- except that the eggs that provide 1/2 of your genetic material were formed during the 2nd trimester of your grandmother's pregnancy with your mother.

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