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March 21, 2011


L!ink U!nder N!ame.

Cats With Thumbs.


The bird people aren't daft on this topic


The American Bird Conservancy generally supports the development of wind energy

-pick one.

Thomas Collins

So let's spend federal money we don't have and issue nannyish regs. on forcing cat owners to prevent Tabby from taking out a few birds. I'll bet Mayor Bloomberg is having regs. prepared already.

We are on the way to being a September 10th country if nonsense like this gets traction. Too bad the world is a September 11th world.


The American Bird Conservancy generally supports the development of wind energy

When did hobbies become so political?
Buy some binoculars, enjoy the bird sightings, & leave the rest of us alone.


Go cats, Go! Survival of the fittest.
Maybe it's just nature's way of getting rid of the crappy slow bird species?

Mice with bazookas.

It's just awful the slaughter among the mice, too.


Don't forget chipmunks. We had to throw water on our cat to get her to drop Chip or Dale from her mouth.


Thanks for the cats with thumbs links. I put it on FB.

Charlie (Colorado)

Cats With Thumbs.

I LOVE that video. Thanks for reminding me, it goes on Tatler too.

Flying Squirrels with UAVs.

Baby Rabbits with Bombs.


If we continue to let cats weed out the crappy slow birds...then only quick ones will remain...& who knows how fast they will become through evolution. Maybe they will become jet planes? If non-living matter can become living matter...can it go the other way too? Hmmmm I wonder....


Let's see, the bird people are perfectly content to destroy logging over their beloved spotted owl, but just want the pretendergy wind industry to be "bird smart."

Can anyone identify a possible reason for such inconsistency?


In Chee-Lay there is a certain type of Chee-Layean cat, know as The Leopardus colocolo.

I would have thought that since Chee-Lay is our close Latin America link, that the Chee-Layean Kitty Cat would have walked across the border and been all over Mehico and Ah-Merika, but I guess maybe Chee-Lay is not that close, no?


I think all feral cats should be taken out and shot.
Wait, they're already out so that just leaves.....


Obumbler: Always in the wrong place at the wrong time.


Dwight Schrutte from "The Office" would disagree with you about the feral cats issue.

Jim Rhoads a/k/a vjnjagvet

Is there an American Mammal Conservancy that decry the slaughter of bunnies and other mammals -- yes even cats and chihuahuas by predatory birds like Hawks, Falcons, Eagles, Owls and the like? I think not.

Rob Crawford


I've been considering joining in the "varmint league" at my range. During the winter, they use silhouette targets: a groundhog, 2 prairie dogs, a crow, and a cat.

(Summer months the targets are just bullseyes.)


Oh my! The birds have a different story in mind, TM.


I'd say the conservancy needs to rethink its two positions, wouldn't you?
Interesting how eco madness seems to work lacunae into the brain.


I didn't read the thread. Are people advocating that windmill blades touch the ground to cut down on the number of cats?


Why is there no discussion of Land Sharks?

Agent J. (formally known as "J"..

Just how many damn birds would we have if something did not kill them?

Or cats, for that matter.

Mark Folkestad

This may "ruffle some feathers", but I'll shoot any cat outside. Survival of the fittest, weeding out the ones too slow or stupid to avoid my air rifle pellet or .22 bullet. I like cats, as house pets.

Rick Ballard


It actually makes sense - bird blenders are totemic wards against the CO2 Monster in the Watermelon religion. Domesticated cats are unclean due to contact with two leggers and thus slightly less equal in Gaia's all seeing eye. Thus, while a domestic cat has a higher value than an unborn black baby, it has a much lower value than a bird which in turn has a much lower value than a bird blender totem.

It's impossible to argue the complete idiocy involved in building bird blender totems with a Watermelon believer due to the fact that the CO2 Monster is never, ever seen in the vicinity of a totem.

It's really perfectly logical. To a Watermelon.

Janet CEO Redneck Beauty Salon Inc.

I think all feral cats should be taken out and shot.

When I was a kid in South Texas a feral cat pelt would bring 50cents. Where the pelts of anything were pretty lousy, a feral cat pelt was really low, but the guy would buy them.
umm...or so I heard....

I've been considering joining in the "varmint league"

I LOVE the name! Hahaha...I'll have to work that into my Redneck Beauty Salon. :)


With world bird population estimates of 200-400 billion, we would apparently have between 200.5-400.5 billion birds if it weren't for our friends, the cats. That is, at the end of this year.


DrF claims that he is married to this cat.


My better half was telling me the other day that wind turbines are pretty deadly to bats. Their sonar cannot discern the spinning wings.

Birds, cats, bats and bugs...Oh My!

Janet CEO Redneck Beauty Salon Inc.

Maybe the "varmint special" could be removing unwanted hair?

Josh Reiter

So, I guess taping cats to the ends of wind turbine blades is a bad idea then. mmmmkay....


You want proof of the evil intentions of cats. OK. What do they go around saying?

Mao. Mao. Mao.

Janet CEO Redneck Beauty Salon Inc.

cathyf, that video is too funny!
Captain Hate will have to add Toonces on the cat thread.


I must be doing it wrong. I use my windows to control the bird population, whether I want to or not.

And I have had 5 cats move into my house, whether I wanted them or not.

And I feed the birds and get the cats fixed.

Help me.

Mark Folkestad

Jean, I have a dear friend out in the eastern foothills of the Washington Cascades, an elderly widow. While we were talking over the phone last fall, she heard a big thump on her picture window. I suggested that it might have been a big bird like a grouse. She left me on hold and went out to check. She came back on and told me that it was indeed a grouse, and she got it just before her cats closed in. She and her daughter had it for supper.

Charlie (Colorado)

I just posted an excerpt from the newest IAEA report on Tatler.

Charlie (Colorado)

If non-living matter can become living matter...can it go the other way too?

Oh, hell, Janet, that's the easy one.

Mark Folkestad

Now if we could just genetically modify cats to target noxious creatures like starlings or pigeons or, ummmmm, liberals....


My cat is supposedly deathly ill. A month ago she was diagnosed with cancer based on a 100X normal white cell count, but type unspecified since we chose not to spend the $2G for the tests. The vet oncologist said she'd go really down-hill within a month, but it's been a month and she looks great. She still yacks once or twice a day, which is why we took her to the vet in the first place, but she eats well, runs, jumps, fights the dog and plays like ever. Either the clock's just ticking slower than they thought or they were wrong.


cathy, my cat does a lot of her best work on my fax/printer....also my apple keyboard when 'm on deadline.


Mark, thanks for that! I always know when the hawks are cruising through because of the multiple window thumps from the smaller birds trying to get out of the way.

Worse than that? Hummingbirds stuck in the screens of the porch. So far, no casualties, but a dicey business getting them unstuck. I might take it harder than they do.

Mark Folkestad

Jean, I love visiting my Washington friends' ranch. They have lots of hummingbirds, of several species. Here in Minnesota we only have the ruby-throated. The ranchers really enjoyed their grouse dinner. They are hunters, and used to watching for shot pellets, but it was a treat for them not to have to worry. Back in the Soil Bank era, when pheasants were plentiful, my mother would pull over if she saw a pheasant hit by the vehicle ahead, especially if the bird bounced off the side. After a brief inspection, the birds would often wind up in our trunk for dinner a bit later.


I've got one cat that helped me get a mole once. You go girl! Got another that, before he got lazy and beefed up, was a whiz at getting rid of squirrels. Mice and voles - all young cats get those and I'm glad they do.

All these cats and yet the birds seem to survive. In fact, near as I can tell, they are prospering in my area. No shortage of them.

Mine doesn't but friends have dogs that grab and dispatch groundhogs. Most dogs will try and get those infernal Canada geese but I've never seen or even heard of one that was successful. Fun to hear them honk and fly away though.


--This may "ruffle some feathers", but I'll shoot any cat outside.--

Of course the critters that really deserve a white hot pellet in the ass are the idiots who see no harm in filling the countryside with their benighted, infernal cats.

Mark Folkestad

Knucklehead, a Canada goose can be deadly to a dog. They can pivot their wings and the pinion can smash into their target with enough force to crush a canine skull or rib cage. Watch out for the pooches. I've taken part in special metropolitan area goose hunts designed to reduce problem flocks. Here in the Minneapolis area, some of the hunters in the special seasons use shotguns with extremely long barrels, which are surprisingly quiet.

Sara (Pal2Pal)

When we lived bordering the woods in Indiana, our cat brought home all kinds of small critters and would hide them under the bathmat in the bathtub. Her favorite was baby bats, but we had small rodents, birds, and sometimes very large bugs. She rarely killed these creatures and if you weren't paying attention and jumped in the shower, you might end up with one of them crawling over your feet or in the case of my daughter, a bat dive bombing her as she tried to escape the shower screaming like she was being chased by an ax murderer.


The visual picture I'm getting of your daughter and that bat is really frightening!

Janet CEO Redneck Beauty Salon Inc.

Oh, hell, Janet, that's the easy one.

Hahaha, that's true ChaCo! I was thinking becoming complex non-living matter. I have no excuse for missing it on a dead bird thread!


((Of course the critters that really deserve a white hot pellet in the ass are the idiots who see no harm in filling the countryside with their benighted, infernal cats.)0

attitudes toward "outdoor cats" sure have changed since the days of the classic barn cat eh?? back on the farm, the right place for a cat was outside, not in the house. They hung around around during milking time and fulfilled the useful service of keeping rats and mice out of the barn.


last week, I heard a term I'd never heard before "greenwashing" (not as in ecoologically friendly laundry but as in being brainwashed by the greenies)

I think some birds use human hair as a viable nesting material so you could donate hair from your salon to a bird lovers society.


last post was to Janet


--attitudes toward "outdoor cats" sure have changed since the days of the classic barn cat eh??--

I have nothing against barn cats; they serve a useful function.
The vast majority of outdoor cats these days however are feral or semi feral and are dumped by irresponsible people who don't want to own them and they either roam completely wild, gobbling up anything they find or live semi wild in suburbs and subdivisions and eating anything they find there too.
The people who dump them are the ones who need a kick (or a shot) in the arse.


The other day I was driving Amy's oldest to gymnastics and she asked me what my favorite "digital thing' was growing up. I explained we didn't have digital, or computers, or seat belts and everyone sat in the front seat of the car on a bench seat - thus giving her an overview of the olden days.

When she got home later that night she asked Amy:

"Did they have dogs when Auntie Jane was born. How about cats"

I feel really really old.


((The people who dump them are the ones who need a kick (or a shot) in the arse))

I agree but I think barn cats were to all intents and purposes "feral" ... wild, wandering free in the countryside, mostly shy of humans and sheltering in barns from the weather and to have their litters .. I know quite a few people who grew up on farms who are appalled by the idea of having a cat in the house

the problem today is more people=more cats, and I think that compulsory spaying and neutering of all house cats, unless they are offical breeders, could help lessen the problem

the there's the feral pig problem

Sara (Pal2Pal)

After watching the show "Hogs Gone Wild," the idea of those feral pigs scares the @%^# out of me.


500 million birds a year? In the US only, I guess. Still sounds low. 1.5 million birds a day. 150,000 birds per state per day.

At least 160 million cats in the US. Each one kills an average of 3.1 birds each year.

Now it really sounds low. I smell a cover-up.

Janet CEO Redneck Beauty Salon Inc.

"CULLING the feral animals that burp and fart their way around Australia's outback could eliminate billions of tonnes of carbon emissions, an environmental group says."

I think daddy pointed this article out awhile ago. I had the link cause my brother had a "pet" feral hog named, Don't Shoot. He worked at a hunting camp & didn't want the hunters to shoot his pet....he would spray paint "Don't Shoot" on the hog's side.

Janet CEO Redneck Beauty Salon Inc.

Here is a list of organizations that offer grants for catching feral cats...get them spayed or neutered...& then release them again.

"Feral cats are homeless cats that prefer living in the wild and are frightened of humans."

Arlington, Virginia does some of this. The birds are out of luck...

Mark Folkestad

There are feral pigs raising hell on Prince of Wales Island, west of Ketchikan. There is no limit or season. We plan on hunting them and adding them to the larder.

Pigeons have taken over cities. Many call them rats with feathers/wings. Hemingway, when he was struggling to survive in Paris as a young married man with an infant son, used to lure pigeons near him with bread crumbs he got for free from the bakery near his garret. He would wring their necks and then hide them inside his little son's blanket in the baby buggy. That tactic kept the family from starvation, and they had tasty meals. He said the only downside was picking avian lice of his baby.

Rick Ballard

Knucklehead - any osprey hatchlings visible yet?

The neighborhood cougar has eliminated the feral cat problem in my area. S/he's also eliminated the domestic outdoor cat problem, the stray dog problem and reduced the deer problem considerably. It's sort of a mixed blessing.


at least feral cats kill birds for their supper, family cats kill birds just for sport, they prefer fancy feast for supper


I think some birds use human hair as a viable nesting material

I just saw this Hummingbird nesting material the other day, and will be buying some before they get here.


((Many call them rats with feathers/wings. ))

yeah, I've heard that but they are actually a type of dove, beautiful birds and amazing flyers. There is no way I could ever call a bird that was cited with approbation by Christ a "rat" ... "be ye harmless as doves"

If my cat ever went after a pigeon, I'd stop her in her tracks


Pigeons have taken over cities. Many call them rats with feathers/wings.

In Venice a couple of years ago, in St. Mark's square, I was aghast at the sexual habits of the (thousands of) pigeons. I feed birds, have for a long time, and their mating rituals are quite nice and wholesome. The pigeons of Venice are anything but.


--The neighborhood cougar has eliminated the feral cat problem in my area.--

Heh. May have mentioned this before but we had a house guest who went out to her car awhile back and came back excited at seeing a "bobcat" sitting on a tarp in the yard about 50 feet from the house. When I asked her long its tail was she held her hands out about 3-4 feet apart; obviously not a bobcat.
Some of the neighborhood cats used to take shelter under the tarp and I guess our friendly lion was waiting for one to stick his head out and have a peek if the coast was clear.


Mark Twain on Cats:

1) "Of all God's creatures there is only one that cannot be made the slave of the leash. That one is the cat. If man could be crossed with the cat it would improve man, but it would deteriorate the cat."

2) "A cat is more intelligent than people believe, and can be taught any crime."

3) "A home without a cat- and a well-fed, well-petted and properly revered cat- may be a perfect home, perhaps, but how can it prove title?"

4) "I simply can't resist a cat, particularly a purring one. They are the cleanest, cunningest, and most intelligent things I know, outside of the girl you love, of course."


Abe Lincoln:

"No matter how much cats fight, there always seems to be plenty of kittens."


Just to bludgeon the point to death, the pigeon="rat" metaphor fails on another level as well. Pigeons, (doves) were a Biblically "clean" animal, acceptable as meat and as a poor man's sacrifice in the Temple. Not so rats.


Winston Churchill

"I like pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals."

Mark Folkestad

Fine and dandy, Chubby, but I'm not sure that the common feral pigeon, or rock dove, if you wish, is the same species that Christ mentioned, or that was offered for sacrifice in the temple. Holiness and cleanliness is the last thing on my mind when one of those pigeons craps on me, whether on a stroll through Manhattan or a visit to Copenhagen's main public square.


((Cats look down on us.))

cats are great managers, ever alert and very bossy

the Mark Twain quotes, lol!


(( stroll through Manhattan or a visit to Copenhagen's main public square.))

hey, while we're at it, let's eliminate seagulls at the beach ...


The other day I was walking my two dogs, who are none-too-bright even by canine standards, when we passed a porch where a local cat was sitting. The dogs have previously encountered the cat and gone nuts, as dogs do. However, the cat, who was no more than 6 feet away, was up on the porch, sitting calmly in plain view about 3 feet above the ground. The cat seemed to be aware that the dogs do not recognize that there is a world above eye level. They walked past cluelessly. The cat simply looked at me, not the dogs, with an expression that seemed to say "Wow, dude. Just wow. You feed them, too?" I had to concede that the cat had a point.

Mark Folkestad

My pastor uncle and one of his parishioners were delegates to the Lutheran World Federation convention in Helsinki one year. They took a ferry from there back to Copenhagen. While enjoying the open deck, they bought hot dogs. The parishioner looked down at what he thought was spilled mustard on his lapel, and scooped it off with his finger. My uncle stopped him just before he licked the seagull poop off his finger.


((common feral pigeon))

why are they "feral"? they are wild animals who live in cities like racoons, foxes, squirrels and the like. Just because there are a lot of them doesn't make them feral. Doesn't feral imply a regression from a domesticated state?


Heh. I had a Yellow Lab who chased squirrels his whole life. Once they scampered up a tree just before being caught, he was mystified. Looked around anywhere but up. They'd simply disappeared into another dimension, as far as he could tell, like we'd be if that dimension was the fourth. I have a German Shepherd Dog now, and she sees them go up and looks up longingly after a chase. Just a slight increase in native intelligence I guess, or at least spatial IQ.


(("Wow, dude. Just wow. You feed them, too?" I had to concede that the cat had a point..))


last summer I met a lady out walking her cat .. on a pink rhinestone studded leash .. both the lady and the cat were very cute. I had been thinking about training my cat to get used to a leash so I asked her a bunch of questions like what happened when she encountered dogs. She said dogs were not a problem, it was encountering other cats that made the claws and spit come out.


--Doesn't feral imply a regression from a domesticated state?--

Pigeons in American cities are the descendants of tame pigeons.
Rock dove are not native to the US.


Boatbuilder, I knew a guy once who constantly called his dog stupid to the point of abuse and the dog was a nervous wreck because of it. I find with animals you get what you give. If you think of them as stupid, you'll get stupid. Beauty in the eye of the beholder and all that. I know a lot of people, and my own family too, who have taken on pets that were put down and rejected by their former owners that turned out to be wonderful animals.


I ferget... did I mention we had a fox sitting on our front steps two weeks ago? If not. We did.


Thanks Ignatz, I didn't know that.


Cats that look like Hitler.


"There are two means of refuge from the miseries of life: music and cats."

--Albert Schweitzer


After about several nights of trying to figure out why every morning we had less goldfish in the garden pond, I looked out about 11:00 pm one night and had an owl sitting on the deck rail overlooking the goldfish pond pondering which tasty fish would be good for dinner.

We had been looking for footprints, never thought of an owl. We lost all our goldfish in about 4 nights.

I have now strung fishing line from the house to the nearest tree and to the bird feeder post to hinder flying gastronomers and plan on restocking it this spring.

Cross your fingers that it works.


If you can put up a fake owl to keep away other birds, can you put up a fake owl to keep away other owls?


Ignatz, from what I am reading rock pigeons are indiginous to south and west Europe so in cities in those locations, they would not be "feral"?


Chubby--I love my dogs. And they love me. But their primary attributes are beauty, love and enthusiasm. Of which they have taken full advantage. They are sitting beside me on the sofa as I type this. No signs of nervousness.



I don't know if I buy all that "nice birds cause Jesus said so

Remember how he told how all those little children should suffer?

I was mad at him a long time as a kid about that:)


Sbw, I had a fake owl watching my pond. It never bothered other birds from eating lots of fish (herons, king fishers, owls). I put a goose decoy out on a lark, a hawk attacked it and tried to eat it's brain. Maybe I shoul switch to a windmill aerator?


Stephanie--Try one of those little windmills.


:) Daddy

Mark Folkestad

Daddy, the language changes. Think "suffer" in terms of suffrage, voting rights. A far better translation is "ALLOW the children to come unto me...."

And Chubby, it was only the doves without visible imperfections that were suitable for sacrifice. Also, I haven't had time to check it out yet, but I doubt that the rock dove/pigeon is the species native to the Holy Land.


Henry--great minds...

I have a neighbor with a large and fairly deep goldfish pond, with dozens of large goldfish (koi?). They built in a tunnel-type shelter at the bottom of the pond so the fish can hide from the predators. It seems to work.


Maybe the "varmint special" could be removing unwanted hair?

Well, now if you're talking about excess *cat* hair, duct tape works quite well.

1) Hold cat down on floor. (This is the hard part.)

2) Apply strip of duct tape to cat, lengthwise along the body. Press hard so it sticks.

3) Remove tape. Pull up end near rump, forward toward the head.

4) Examine tape and wonder in amazement how efficient this is for removing hair.

No, the cat does not enjoy the procedure. I think it's probably a tossup whether the cat prefers the tape or the vacuum cleaner method.


Good to hear Boatbuilder. I hated that little creep who abused his dog non- stop and the dog was just so unhappy and stressed. It got what it needed in terms of its physical needs but no love.

Mark Folkestad

I found one Christian source that says the dove of the Bible most likely was either the common turtledove or the bluerock pigeon. So the rock pigeon/dove that plagues our cities is not of any spiritual significance.


More Mark Twain:

1) "A man who carries a cat by the tail learns something he can learn in no other way."

2) "One of the most striking differences between a cat and a lie is that a cat only has nine lives."


((Also, I haven't had time to check it out yet, but I doubt that the rock dove/pigeon is the species native to the Holy Land.))

I would think even if they aren't they would still be considered clean because they are of the same family. Would it matter if an Angus (prolly not even bred yet) or some other kind of bullock was sacrificed? It is all beef.

Mark Folkestad

Chubby, there is a difference between being clean/Kosher for dining and being suitable for sacrifices in the temple. All of the hundreds of species of doves/pigeons in the world are clean/Kosher as food. We are talking about different species, not VARIETIES/BREEDS within a species.

Sara (Pal2Pal)

At my old house, we had herons swoop in and take up our large Koi. We lost several over several days. They also liked my turtles and managed to get two of seven. We put out a half dozen of those windsock pennants and that seemed to work. At this house, the previous owner put a fake owl on the roof and another at the edge of the pond and so far, 3 years now, we haven't lost any fish or turtles to birds.

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