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April 26, 2011

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Ignatz

--How about the non-doubting CNNteam - did that answer really satisfy them? Did they even ask Team Obama to produce the original records?--

If your perspective is you're just saddened you weren't there to witness the little messiah's birth in the first place or at least have had a chance to bring him some gold, frankincense or blow then the likelihood you'll ask a tough question approaches nil.

MayBee

CNN's evidence:
-Abercrombie says he remembers celebrating the birth.
-A UofHawaii advisor who knew Obama when he was "a child" remembers speaking with Stanley about his birth and Maya's birth
-A woman remembers seeing a black baby in a Honolulu hospital


Come on. I'm fine believing he was born in Hawaii but that is embarrassing stuff for an investigative report.

Captain Hate

Somebody tell Jerry Rivers Geraldo it's hidden in Al Capone's tomb.

Sara (Pal2Pal)

I do not question that he was born in HI. Put simply, when SAD divorced Obama SR and married Lolo Soetoro and BHO was adopted by him in a step-parent adoption, the original birth record was sealed and a new one issued. This is SOP for adoptions. To open the sealed record, a court order is necessary.

Chubby

Sara


If he was adopted by Soetero, would not the COLB, by law, have to reflect that?

MayBee

Sarah- if that is the case, wouldn't the newly created birth record then be available to Obama?

MayBee

Sorry for the extra h.

Danube of Thought

If your theory is correct, Sara, what are its implications?

Threadkiller

--"the original birth record was sealed and a new one issued."--

How did they unseal the original record to create the COLB? Why didn't they do a COLB of the new record? Is the new record sealed?

Abraham Lincoln was a Darkie

certificate of live birth is all you get when you request BC. That's the gist of the CNN report.

But y'all just carry on to your little heart's content.

What else do you have?

Sara (Pal2Pal)

Yes, the COLB would reflect that. But we have not seen a legit COLB yet, have we? Maybee, yes it would, so that is the $64 question, isn't it? Why is he withholding it and why not just come clean and say that the only record of his original birth is sealed and after the Soetoro divorce he went back to his original name by choice, unfortunately not by law.

I'm promoting a theory that, IMHO, meets all the known facts, but it is still just a theory. I happen to think it is a good theory and better than the theory that he is hiding an out of USA birth.

Extraneus

I believe (Another) Barbara debunked that, and has received BCs for her own kids upon request. Unfortunately, I think she got pissed off and left one day and hasn't returned since.

Come back AB!

Sara (Pal2Pal)

If your theory is correct, Sara, what are its implications?

Other than having to admit that he possibly has been using his original birth name without going to court to have it legally changed back from Soetoro, I can't think of any implications. Unless...there is some legal snag about him being sworn in or signing legislation under an A.K.A.

MayBee

WHere is our AB?

Sara (Pal2Pal)

certificate of live birth is all you get when you request BC.

Plenty of people have gotten their long form. My Daughter has one for my Granddaughter, who was born in Hawaii. Another Barbara has one for her child(ren), I've seen many others posted online.

Extraneus

I like the adoption theory, since it does explain some otherwise unexplained facts, but unless Fukino is lying and the COLB was fraudulent, wouldn't the adoptive father have to be Obama Sr, since that's whose name is listed on the COLB?

MayBee

Maybee, yes it would, so that is the $64 question, isn't it? Why is he withholding it and why not just come clean and say that the only record of his original birth is sealed and after the Soetoro divorce he went back to his original name by choice, unfortunately not by law.

But then why would the AG spokesperson say he can't release his original? Because as far as the AG spokeman would know, the post- adoption long form would be the "original". No? I mean, if it's his comment we are going by- there is still a long form Obama could copy and show. His statement that Obama can't copy it still doesn't work..

Strawman Cometh

chance to bring him some gold, frankincense or blow

LOL

Danube of Thought

Given the choice of seeing his original BC or his SAT and LSAT scores and transcripts, which would you prefer?

Rob Crawford

Given the choice of seeing his original BC or his SAT and LSAT scores and transcripts, which would you prefer?

His resignation!

stan

The investigation was led by Oxburgh, Muir Russell, and Penn State.

Ignatz

This blasted idiot is destroying the country and this tripe occupies 50% of our time?

I don't care if he was birthed from a platypus's egg and adopted by Marvin the Martian, can we at some point get back to crushing his idiot policies.

Chubby

has anyone researched if children adopted in Hawaii can get, on request, when they are adults, birth certificates based on their blood parentage?

Rob Crawford

Ah, but Chubby, no one has shown that The Won is an adult.

Sara (Pal2Pal)

Here is the quote as presented by Isakoff:

According to Mr. Isikoff’s report, though, this is what the Hawaii Attorney General’s office said about the matter:

Joshua Wisch, the spokesman for the attorney general’s office, said state law does not in fact permit the release of “vital records,” including an original “record of live birth” — even to the individual whose birth it records.

“It’s a Department of Health record and it can’t be released to anybody,” he said. Nor do state laws have any provision that authorizes such records to be photocopied, Wisch said. If Obama wanted to personally visit the state health department, he would be permitted to inspect his birth record, Wisch said.

When this was first posted, I called this guy out as a liar. But if you factor in an adoption, then what he says is true according to HI law.

Porchlight

Unless...there is some legal snag about him being sworn in or signing legislation under an A.K.A.

I believe he also registered for Selective Service as Barack Hussein Obama.

Related to the adoption theory, there is also the possibility that he had Indonesian citizenship. I think we have a right to know whether Obama was ever a citizen of another country, regardless of whether that citizenship is currenet or whether it has any bearing on his eligibility.

I also think we have a right to know if he "used" that citizenship as an adult (to apply to school, for example, or to obtain a passport). He can't be held responsible for his parents' actions when he was a minor, but he is responsible for any choices he made as an adult.

clarice

Y'know, I'm beginning to think this bc thingy is taking wings..and the more people get PO'd at BO the more they will be willing to believe he is ineligible for the office he holds.

Extraneus

Tough choice, DoT. If we could get both verbal *and* math, I'd go with the SATs. Otherwise, the LSAT that got him a scholarship to Harvard.

Porchlight

Given the choice of seeing his original BC or his SAT and LSAT scores and transcripts, which would you prefer?

If those are my only choices, I'd prefer the scores and transcripts, although I'd be worried they were fudged, to be honest.

Rob Crawford

Unless...there is some legal snag about him being sworn in or signing legislation under an A.K.A.

As far as I know, using an alias is only a problem if you do so with intent to defraud. I don't think hiding an adoption counts.

BR

CNN and NY Times carry water... pistol.

A wet attempt to preempt May 17th.

Sue

Obama Sr. came back for his one and only visit with little Barry to re-adopt him. What was going on in Indonesia at the time? Would little Barry have to have joined the military if he remained Soto's child? That Christmas visit from Sr. has some significance.

Sara (Pal2Pal)

I can't recall who posted the timeline for SAD, perhaps MJW, but SAD had to delay her trip from Indonesia to Hawaii because of a hang up getting her passport renewed. At that time, her expiring passport listed little Barack on it as a minor, I guess. But, he went on to Hawaii without her, so was a passport issued in his name so he could travel while she settled her own passport snafu? If so, what name was it issued under?

Sara (Pal2Pal)

I would like to see his records for his years in NYC at Columbia.

Porchlight

As far as I know, using an alias is only a problem if you do so with intent to defraud. I don't think hiding an adoption counts.

It may not be a legal problem, but I'm not sure Americans would be too thrilled to know that Obama ran for and was elected Pres under a false name, not to mention wrote book, hid critical biographical
information, etc. etc.

Some observers have focused on the legal outcomes of any potential discoveries about Obama's background. I think the electoral outcomes are far more interesting. "Obama knowingly lied about his past in order to be elected President" doesn't really resonate as a re-election slogan.

Danube of Thought

"It’s a Department of Health record and it can’t be released to anybody..."

One wonders about the purpose of such a record.

Sue

Obama and his mother were note in Hawaii 2 weeks after his birth. Maybe someone should ask Abercrombie how he managed to see Little Obama with his father in Hawaii?

Sue

Sorry. Not, not note.

Porchlight

I guess Abercrombie could claim to have met little Barry within two weeks of his being born, but that strains credibility. Back in those days Ann would have spent the first full week in the hospital.

BR

Right, Porch. And the mentality of those who voted for him is already one prone to blaming others, which can easily turn against him for betraying them and making them look like fools.

Sue

There is a picture of Obama Sr. at Wikipedia when he was a little boy. Obama looks like him when they were both small boys.


Abercrombie did not meet Obama with his mother and father in Hawaii. He's lying. He is the only one of the bunch that even remembers Obama Sr. dating Ann, let alone having a child with her.

Extraneus

And if that's the explanation, this is going to backfire to Obama's advantage.

"I didn't want to have to divulge some of the more embarrassing details of my parents' complex and flawed relationship, but a large faction in the Republican party has backed me into a corner. For the good of the country, I provide the following details.

I, Barack Hussain Obama, was adopted by my own father. I was born in Hawaii, and I am who I say I am, but my original birth certificate is legally sealed due to the fact that I was adopted. Let me also say that I have seen it, and it shows 'UNKNOWN' in the space for my father's name. That is due to the fact that my father was unwilling to accept responsibility for my birth until I was ten years old, when he came to Hawaii and formally adopted me. My father was a far from perfect man.

Thanks, birthers. Happy now?"

Porchlight

Abercrombie did not meet Obama with his mother and father in Hawaii. He's lying.

Oh, I completely agree. I'd love to see someone pin him down on exactly when he met the newborn Obama.

Sue

Porch,

Me too, and then whip out her transcript showing she was a student at a college in Washington State at the time he claims to have socialized with Obama Sr and his little family.

Porchlight

And if that's the explanation, this is going to backfire to Obama's advantage.

Maybe. I submit that by and large, the only people who would be sympathetic to that explanation were going to vote for him anyway.

He wrote an ENTIRE BOOK about his family upbringing and the flawed man that was his father. There were many elements of the book that by his own admission were less than flattering to him, his mother and his father. Why the need to hide those particular details?

Danube of Thought

I just think this whole thing is funny as hell. If it serves any useful purpose at all--and I'm agnostic on that--it is to draw attention to what a very strange and unknown man he is.

The mysterious non-African-American woman is almost certainly Ayers's late girlfriend, whom Obama appropriated for the purpose of spicing up his fanciful narrative of himself.

A decidedly weird fellow, and not very bright.

matt

I think they should put Katie Couric on it. Oh...she got fired? damn, she coulda had a Pulitzer....

In other news, the largest firefighters union is abandoning/reducing donations to the Democrats because they are not carrying water to the sufficient degree for the union...

clarice

If only someone would slip a copy of the true doc to Dan Rather. we could all move on.

BB Key

At a recent campaign event discussing paying higher taxes, BHO bragged that he went to college on scholarships...
2008 in NC, MO claimed they only recently paid back their college loans...

Which one is lying or are they both liars?

I want all documents BC,passports, transcripts,SAT, LSAT, Scholarship amounts, tax records... we know nothing about him compared to other Presidents

Porchlight

The mysterious non-African-American woman is almost certainly Ayers's late girlfriend, whom Obama appropriated for the purpose of spicing up his fanciful narrative of himself.

Obama couldn't have appropriated Ayers' late girlfriend, because Ayers' description of Diana Oughton, so similar to Obama's white girlfriend in Dreams, is from Ayers' Fugitive Days, which wasn't published until 2001.

It is Ayers who came up with the description of the girlfriend in Dreams. If they are one and the same, it couldn't have happened any other way.

daddy

Could someone please repost that wet T-Shirt photo again?

That's the only thing that could make me want to hang around another G@# D@#$%ed Birther thread.

Rob Crawford

Obama couldn't have appropriated Ayers' late girlfriend, because Ayers' description of Diana Oughton, so similar to Obama's white girlfriend in Dreams, is from Ayers' Fugitive Days, which wasn't published until 2001.

Unless Ayers stole the description from Obama.

(running, ducking for cover)

Porchlight

Ha, Rob. But even so it would still be the case that Obama couldn't have appropriated her.

fdcol63

I want to see Obama's passport records for his trip to Pakistan and elsewhere in the early 1980's.

Sara (Pal2Pal)

I don't know where the idea that Obama SR adopted BHO comes from, but I think that is stretching it way too far.

The whole point of a shotgun marriage was to make sure the child was legitimate. No adoption would be necessary. They could have had a 5 min. court hearing and had the original name from the original records reinstated.

Besides, there is no reason to think that either SAD or the grandparents did not have a copy of the original records in their own files and could have just pulled them out to use so that little Barry could register at Punahou under his father's name, rather than Soetoro. Who would know the difference?

lyle

I want to see all the checks he's cashed from Soros. Not exactly a cheap date, huh, George?

BB Key

Sara,
I thought in one of his books Barry said he found is birth certificate in an old book when he was a kid ?

Rob Crawford

Hmmmm.... alternate theory, which I believe fits the facts.

Anyone else see the South Park episode where they revealed the secret origin of Bono?

I think they were trying to tell us the truth about Obama.

Sara (Pal2Pal)

His school transfer records, BTW, would have been under the name Barry Soetoro, but according to all the researchers I've seen, he registered at Punahou under Obama.

In today's world of missing children, schools are very strict about documentation, but back then, they may not have even questioned any discrepancy.

Agent J. (formally known as "J"..

I am convinced that President was born, where, not sure, DGS.

The reason he does not want his BC exposed, under "Sex of birth" it has a ?

I worked with one of "them", yes he/she was an interesting study.

I boycott buying anything from the following states, NY,IL,CA..
In traveling, I have no reason to go to NY or CA.. I fuel up before I enter and then don't stop. Before WI regained some sensibility, I worried how I could get to Upper MI from Western Mo. Now all I have to worry about is being able to pay for the fuel. Sure glad I did not invest in that RV with a twin 50 gallon tanks..

Mark, I survived your new place in Alaska on Google Earth, and checked the weather..maybe good for a week or so, and I love Alaska, but one should be able to see the sun once in while... Happy birthday, sorry about the speed bumps in your path..

To everyone else this thread is the greatest, I have learned so much..thanks to all..

MayBee

I do want to know why the guy whose firm ''broke into" Obama's passport file is now in the administration.

Remember when Olbermann made that breaking news? Ha ha ha hahahha.

Sara (Pal2Pal)

BBkey: Yes, he found a BC in a book and it supposedly upset him or something.

Ann

OT,

I have linked the Eagle Cam a couple of times and I have been watching these magnificent birds everyday. It's about the only thing that has kept my spirits up.

Today Experts confirm female eagle from Norfolk Botanical Garden hit by jet

Very Sad.


Dave (in MA)


It's official. She's out in June.

bgates

Obama could file a Freedom of Information Act request to view his original birth certificate and make copies

the spokesman for the attorney general’s office, said state law does not in fact permit the release of “vital records,”....nor do state laws have any provision that authorizes such records to be photocopied

Let me see if I understand all this:

The President already released all of his records three years ago, including the record he now says he will never request.

The state of Hawaii has two kinds of birth certificates, the kind they give to people whether or not they were born in Hawaii and the kind that cannot be removed from the vault without causing the kind of bad juju experienced by the Bradys when Bobby took the tiki doll in the three-part episode at the start of season 4.

Any requests to see Hawaiian vital records are handled by Dr Fukino, whose name is very similar to the response she gives anyone who asks to see Hawaiian vital records. She has said quite clearly that "all the records that should be present are present, and likewise the contrapositive, and that's as true for Obama as for anyone else".

There is no real reason to see Obama's records anyway, because somebody has a clear memory of seeing a dark-skinned baby somewhere on Oahu (or perhaps Guam) at some point during the 60s, and the governor of the state has said he used to go to parties with Obama's mother when she would bring Obama home to the island for the weekend from the University of Washington when he was two months old.

Is that about it?

BR

Yeah, Clarice at 4:01. During CBSgate/Rathergate at Wizbang, there was a computer documents expert,
Dr. Newcomer, who proved how the CBS documents against Bush were forged.

I find this documents expert, Ron Polarik's Report very interesting. Especially that the internal computer data of the COLB which was provided by the Obama campaign, shows it was made with Photoshop.

Appalled

clarice:

Y'know, I'm beginning to think this bc thingy is taking wings..and the more people get PO'd at BO the more they will be willing to believe he is ineligible for the office he holds.

I think that is the key to so much that passes for scandal these days (the truthers, the birthers, the Trigsters, the Plame people). There is a group of people who want so bad to make a certain political figure disappear (like the Wicked Witch in the Wizard of Oz) that they will spend all manner of time justifying all manner of foolish speculation.

But, honestly, there is so much to dislike about Obama that I don't see the point of wasting time on things that merely appeal to the converted. I don't care that Obama has a mysterious birth certificate. I do care about his budgetary unseriousness, and his desire to legislate card check through the NLRB.

clarice

BBKey--yes..he says so on p 26 of his first "autobiography"

Janet

That Christmas visit from Sr. has some significance.

I think so also, Sue.
It is so odd that we even have to speculate on this stuff. Our news media is worthless. When Stephanopoilos was waving that green certification around saying here was the BC...well, it is sad that a 52 yr. old housewife knows more than him.
They know nothing about Obama & they make fun of those of us who want to know.
How is wanting to know the truth crazy or kooky or evil?

Dave (in MA)

Maybe - even funnier was the Olby freakout where he Worst Person In The Worlded Twitter over the fact that they let someone open a Twitter feed in his name, not knowing that it was his own company.

Rick Ballard

Extraneous,

Deb in NC (where is she?) has posited the possibility/probability of a sympathy blow back regarding the nature of whatever Obama is hiding as well. There is validity to the point but I believe that the potential for sympathy is greatly mitigated by the damage which Obama has done and is doing.

I claim no insight into what moves the Fuddle to start feeling strong sympathy for the slow bunnies but I don't believe that their sympathy extends to anyone feeding their little bunnies to the fox for his own benefit.

Trump's The Hunt for Red Obama seems a reasonable risk to me. I have doubts to the existence of SAT or LSAT scores - the President's life appears to be a series of waivers mixed in with early destruction (or betrayal) of adversaries. His deep intellectual limitations are glaring now only because of his position. He's not getting dumber, he's just never been very intelligent.

Janet

Besides, there is no reason to think that either SAD or the grandparents did not have a copy of the original records in their own files and could have just pulled them out to use so that little Barry could register at Punahou under his father's name, rather than Soetoro. Who would know the difference?

Maybe the Indonesian name made it harder to get into Punahou....whereas an African ancestry would be an easy way in. It was the Sidwell Friends of Hawaii.

fdcol63

We should ALL be concerned with the circumstances surrounding Obama's birth, his BC, and his childhood. They are ALL serious issues.

1) The US Constitution is specific about who is and is not eligible to become POTUS. It's important that someone meets these criteria for a number of reasons.

2) Obama can not be held responsible for the circumstances surrounding his birth or childhood, but they are critical because these factors have all shaped who he is, his perspective about the world, his relationships with others, and his core beliefs about America. To think otherwise is naive, and to ignore the consequences of these factors on his fitness for office, his conduct as POTUS, or the effect on the country would be a dereliction of our own responsibilities as citizens.

Porchlight

But, honestly, there is so much to dislike about Obama that I don't see the point of wasting time on things that merely appeal to the converted.

Okay, but the press won't cover the other stuff. "We" can focus on whatever we like, but thanks to the media non-coverage of other subjects harmful to Obama's re-election chances, the Muddle will neither know nor care.

If in the rare instance (as with gas/food prices or unemployment), they do care, the media will facilitate the Democrats in their blaming of Republicans.

MayBee

But, honestly, there is so much to dislike about Obama that I don't see the point of wasting time on things that merely appeal to the converted. I don't care that Obama has a mysterious birth certificate. I do care about his budgetary unseriousness, and his desire to legislate card check through the NLRB.

I can top that! I care about all of these things. Plus some.

Ignatz

--Could someone please repost that wet T-Shirt photo again?

That's the only thing that could make me want to hang around another G@# D@#$%ed Birther thread.--


Sorry Maybee, but I was raised to always do what my daddy told me. :)
And now I promise to stop.

Elliott

I, Barack Hussein Obama, was adopted by my own father. I was born in Hawaii, and I am who I say I am, but my original birth certificate is legally sealed due to the fact that I was adopted.

[email continues]...This unusual situation has caused me untold inconvenience as I attempt to establish my rightful claim to $2 billion held in accounts around the world, from the snowy streets of Zurich to the Peak of Hong Kong (over which the workers' blood-red flag at last flies), from the deserts of Dubai to the cornfields of Iowa...excuse me, as I was saying, the unexpected difficulty I have encountered in satisfying these cautious, retrograde institutions as to my bona fides, my trials lo these long years...

My speechwriter could go on forever, but let me be clear. I've heard a lot about your commitment to a cause greater than yourself, your willingness to do whatever it takes when the moral arc of the universe wants to sit up and sock it to someone, and of course your discretion. Look, I could no more let the birthers win than I could Colonel Khaddafi. You're the guy everyone tells me can do this, and frankly, I happen to be in position to do something about that Burn Notice. So why don't we help each other Mike? [end encrypted transmission]

Your Uncle Daddy

I don't give a hoot about the birth certificate. I want to see his medical records, his college and post baccalaureate transcripts.... and I want to see every passport he holds. Aren't these standard fare for vetting a presidential candidate? Or any political candidate for federal office? These have to be furnished for routine state and federal jobs. As an employee of the State of Illinois, I had to furnish proof of citizenship, all of my transcripts, including high school for crissakes.

Hopefully, one of the fifty states will not allow him on the presidential ballot.

He's hiding something important. Time to pay the piper.

MayBee

I'm beginning to think you guys like that picture more than Ann's Michelle Obama fashion pics.

Sara (Pal2Pal)

Speaking of college records, this is interesting:

Hmmm: Harvard Adopted Affirmative Action Policy For Law Review Well Before Obama Matriculated There

daddy

Bless you Iggy!

I am amazed how quickly folks can turn attention to this Birth Certificate Controversy. I'm still so all breathlessly on Pin's and Needles awaiting the imminent release of John Kerry's DD214 that I can't yet deal with this new topic.

Your Uncle Daddy

Who are the dancing tarts in the photo? The fat girls in white choney-wear, I say dip em in chocolate and call em Dovebars. What is that tripe?

Sara (Pal2Pal)

fat girls?

MayBee

Well, most of us met here while trying to figure out the Valerie Plame thing. So it makes sense that we are "trying to figure things out" kinds of people.

Danube of Thought

"Which one is lying or are they both liars?"

The two accounts are not mutually exclusice.

"I want all documents BC,passports, transcripts,SAT, LSAT, Scholarship amounts, tax records... we know nothing about him compared to other Presidents"

I think there are number of presidents for whom we don't have some or all of those things.

Dave (in MA)
I'm still so all breathlessly on Pin's and Needles awaiting the imminent release of John Kerry's DD214 that I can't yet deal with this new topic.
He only promised on the Tim Russert show he'd do that 2277 days ago. What's your damned rush?
BB Key

OT but worth it: Josh Gerstein at Politico:

Holder DOJ decides not to prosecute former DOJ Atty. Thomas M. Tamm who admitted leaking the terrorist survalience program to the NYT... speculation as to why this decsion was made.... Tamm was a mole hired by DOJ in 2000 when Holder was Deputy AG

Sue

Is Ron Paul really the candidate of choice of the TEA Party? ABC radio news has been announcing all day he has filed for exploratory yada yada and he is the candidate of choice for the TEA Party? If that is true, I am not going to be associated with the TEA Party.

Janet

As an employee of the State of Illinois, I had to furnish proof of citizenship, all of my transcripts, including high school for crissakes.

Exactly. Think of all the Americans involved in sports that have to show their kids BC. It is insanity that we have to speculate about Obama's life.
...and I think the great muddle that aren't political junkies will "get" the National Enquirer like fraud of Obama's made up narrative. Just like James Frey, or the Three Cups of Tea guy, or Edwards... Obama's official narrative is a lie.

clarice

Great, Elliott!!!

Porchlight

Is Ron Paul really the candidate of choice of the TEA Party?

No. It's ABC radio news, they can't find the mike with both hands.

Dave (in MA)

One of the Dancing Tarts is the heiress to the Cronkite throne.

Sara (Pal2Pal)

DOT: I just do not understand your cavalier attitude, being Navy and all.

My husband's step-father was born in Russia in 1908 and came to America at the age of 9 mo. with his parents. He and his parents and siblings all became American citizens, yet when my husband was undergoing a background check for a very high level security clearance, we had to produce documents and affidavits regarding his step-father. My husband had been in the military three years and spent a year in a combat zone by the time his mother married his step-father and yet the FBI considered it critical to establish that the man had no ties to the Soviets, even though they did not even exist at the time of his parents coming to America and becoming citizens in 1909.

Sue

Obama has sworn he has had no other names, when he was licensed by the State of Illinois to practice law. If it is determined he was legally adopted by his stepfather and was legally Barry Sotero, he will have lied under oath. Not that that matters to democrats or anything, but there you have it...why Obama doesn't want anyone to know his stepfather adopted him.

Sue

Porch,

I know it is ABC News Radio, but you can bet that everyone listening to ABC News Radio thinks Ron Paul is the candidate of choice to the TEA Party. They have said it. All. Day. Long.

Sue

Does POTUS go through a security clearance?

Porchlight

True, Sue. Maybe that's their way of trying to get regular people to ditch the Tea Party.

Sue

Porch,

It would work for me, if I thought it was true. I'd vote for Huckabee before I voted for Paul.

Porchlight

Does POTUS go through a security clearance?

I don't think so. The parties are supposed to vet their candidates; if they fail to do that, the media is supposed to. Once elected, that's it. No one's going to void the election over a security clearance, so why do one?

Yet another reason why this stuff is important.

Sue

Somewhere today they were talking about a Trump/Huckabee ticket. If that happens, someone just go ahead and shoot. Okey dokey?

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Wilson/Plame