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March 03, 2012

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Danube of Thought

I believe she's a slam-dunk public figure. I'm not sure an "opinion" defense would hold water in these circumstances, but I never tried (or even litigated) a defamation case. My recollection is that if you establish the defamation, damages are presumed, and it's up to the jury.

matt

Actually, she would probably have been expelled up until the early 1970's for moral turpitude or a transgression of her acceptance to the Law School.

There was a time when modesty, chastity, and following the teachings of the Church were integral to the education of a Catholic student of any kind and when catholic and other religious educational institutions would enforce the rules.

rse

clarice-

You beat me to it. I tend to think asking to testify and then being criticized over the nature of your testimony and its implications takes her into Sullivan.

She would have a hard time arguing she is not a public figure on this issue.

Old Lurker

DoT "Millions of American women have their contraception measures covered by insurance. Does that mean they are asking to be paid to have sex?"

But DoT at the moment those folks are receiving those by virtue of insurance coverage they bargained for and paid premiums to receive, in effect using their own money for the pills. This gal wants the Feds to force her Catholic institution to give them to her for free and against their own interests.

Ignatz

--My recollection is that if you establish the defamation, damages are presumed, and it's up to the jury.--

There is slander per se such as a simple factual (but false) statement that someone has committed a felony or has otherwise committed morally repugnant acts. In slander per se the defamation is assumed from the statement itself and doesn't have to be established.
Such a statement would be "Susan Fluke is a prostitute."
I'm highly doubtful, regardless of her status as a public figure, that the way Rush couched his characterization of her could be characterized as a statement of fact rather than opinion.

A Casual Observation

Worthy of a repost:

More moral confusion, and self-important and cowardly mincing out of the "Creek of Obtuseness" and his amen corner I see.

Here is a hint: That is not a river, and the fluid within it is not water. Best that yonder you go a have a look, or rather, a sniff. It is quite another substance altogether.

Rush was right. If the so-called "Catholic Law school" had any stones they would dismiss her at once. Once upon a time when they were actually a Catholic institution with a Catholic mission they would have done so.

To hold that abortion is an assertion of "freedom" is to depart completely from any considered and civilized notions of what "rights" and "freedoms" actually are. One expects, one demands better from an institution such as Georgetown.

Georgetown should be ashamed of itself. All Catholics should be up in arms at its behavior, and the perverted and warped goals that Georgetown has set before itself.

RL in fact did not go far enough in his characterization. She properly should be additionally denounced as a liar, a hypocrite, an opportunist, an apostate and a political operative. She is also a spoiled brat. She is hideous to behold--the very face of feminism.

The sheer decadence of it: A randy, addled, dishonest, self-adsorbed, self-indulged feminist nincompoop and would be "Lawyer" flouting her sexual immorality--and that is just what it is, sexual immorality--as somehow some mantle of high moral conduct, a conduct which is "threatened" by the very idea that she should at the very least bear the cost of it herself.

On top of this she wittingly or unwittingly is being used as a pawn to distract "the people" from the brutal assault on their pocket books, moral and social beliefs, faith,liberties, institutions and their very civilization by the most vile and traitorous people in the nation.

That this person was even brought before the congress to engage in this gross and degrading agi-prop shows how immoral this country and its federal legislature have become. That the POTUS felt it politically expedient and desirable to call her up and commiserate with her shows that we as a nation are not just degraded and confused but wildly morally depraved. Can you imagine this sort of spewing out of a Georgetown student even 30 years ago?

That pipsqueaks like DoT think that this enables them to indulge in such bizarrely self-important behavior as deploring someone like Rush, who is after all telling the truth, shows just how mindlessly unexamined are the "beliefs" of some of the so called "conservatives" on JOM.

It is bizarre and, in the end, morally corrupt to assert that by stating the truth we "open ourselves up to attacks" and therefore we should deplore and despise those who would state the truth. Of course, the whole point of this sort of nonsense is to blunt opposition by having them think twice about uttering what is obviously and simply true. If telling the truth is "assaulting the freedom of women", then, by all means, let the assaults begin. If we lose the election because of it, then there is little left of value to honorably win.

America is never served by the suppression of truth in the face of Marxist and Democrat propaganda, agi-prop and direct action political fronts and machines. No, not ever served. It does not matter what parts these all hail from, and that includes Georgetown University, The Congress or that pack of narcissistic, spoiled and lecherous brats we call "feminists".

To the contrary, to even suggest such a notion is harmful to America, but in the loony, upside down pea-brained world of people like DoT this sort on nonsense is seen as the most shrewd and insightful political sagacity.

We are in the pickle we are in just because of the sniveling cowardice and moral confusion of people like DoT.

I do suspect. however, that both his anguish and the purported reasons for it are all dodges and lies.

DoT just does not like Rush because he has done something other with his life than gaze at his navel and then congratulate himself for it. Rush actually stands for something other than the self-flattery narcissists suck on in their dark corners.

DoT (and his fellow travelers) should be ashamed, but the very notion of it is beyond him. To truly know shame one has to know God, and in the inferiority of his incredulity DoT here too thinks he is superior. Too funny.

It is all of a piece. He should really be a Democrat, and no doubt if he could find a way to get on their gravy train would be one.

These are altogether the squalid furnishings of a shallow and immature mind.


Posted by: squaredance | March 03, 2012 at 01:34 PM

Bravo! Kudos! Excellente, Senor! Outstanding. Encore?

Danube of Thought

but no worse than Maher, Sullivan and Ltterman, for example, and far less that Kos and the disgusting commenters on AB's untimely death

Of course, but it's a shame to see Rush in that company. And the greatest offense, in my view, is that he has taken the whole country's eyes off the important parts of the whole controversy.

He doesn't often do stupid things, but I thought he did with McNabb and I think he did here.

Jane

Lets depose her and have her name all her sexual partners.

A better idea would be to stop talking about Ms Fluke and contraception. Let's talk about how the media sucks and what we are going to do to bring them down.

Danube of Thought

This gal wants the Feds to force her Catholic institution to give them to her for free and against their own interests.

True enough, OL--but that doesn't mean she's seeking to be paid for having sex.

Probably so, Iggy.

daddy

Playing catch up, but I see Rush has just apologized so I'll post that here for latecomers like me:

Link.

Rick Ballard

Clarice,

IMO - this episode of LawSlut - Have Ladyparts/Will Sue plays out worse for Dems than the Frost Family Flakes did. It just doesn't resonate at the weekly fill up, SNAP signup level. Uncle Bob, Aunt Sally and their kids are still living in the basement rec room and Sandra Flukes "problem" isn't on the radar screen.

Jane

Good. It's over. The economy sucks, gas prices are rising and no one wants you to talk about that.

Time to go out for a b birthday martini. Carry on.

Danube of Thought

Hysterical gibberish, picked up and re-posted by an overmatched fool.

In my opinion, squaredance is mentally unstable. ACO is just not very bright. Once again, he sank faster than an Italian cruise ship.

rse

Don't fall over from shock at the LUN stating that Warren's grandson Howard worked in the Obama White House.

No apparently it didn't have anything to do with tax rates.

rse

dot-

has he gone after anyone else but the two of us by name?

Melinda Romanoff

DoT-

Is there Another ledge with water under it?

Wow, I thought the first one was pretty rare.

pagar

Some thoughts from "Neil Snyder, who is a chaired professor emeritus at the University of Virginia.'

http://pjmedia.com/tatler/2012/03/03/sandra-fluke-has-become-the-poster-child-for-the-no-morals-movement/

Danube of Thought

"My choice of words was not the best, and in the attempt to be humorous, I created a national stir. I sincerely apologize to Ms. Fluke for the insulting word choices."

Very well done, Rush--good for you. Hard to believe, but there are a few scattered simpletons still attempting to defend the words for which you rightly felt the need to apologize. But you're a far better man than they.

MarkO

So, he let go of the ogre Sticky-hair. Now, about that birth certificate.

MarkO

I think it is absolutely absurd that during these very serious political times, we are discussing personal sexual recreational activities before members of Congress. I personally do not agree that American citizens should pay for these social activities. What happened to personal responsibility and accountability? Where do we draw the line? If this is accepted as the norm, what will follow? Will we be debating if taxpayers should pay for new sneakers for all students that are interested in running to keep fit?In my monologue, I posited that it is not our business whatsoever to know what is going on in anyone's bedroom nor do I think it is a topic that should reach a Presidential level.

boris
This gal wants the Feds to force her Catholic institution to give them to her for free and against their own interests.

True enough, OL--but that doesn't mean she's seeking to be paid for having sex.

Actually she wants the Feds to force her Catholic institution, against their own interests, to pay for them so she can have lots of sex at no cost to herself.

That's close enough for a metaphor.

A metaphor, not an accusation, not even an opinion. Nobody believes Rush thinks what he accurately stated her actions were is the legal definition of prostitution.

In his statement ...

I chose the wrong words in my analogy of the situation. I did not mean a personal attack on Ms. Fluke.
Rush asserted essentially what I have been saying all day. (see 4:32 PM)

Threadkiller

Yay MarkO!!

Janet

I guess I'm a simpleton. I can't see why anyone has to apologize to this grown woman who talked about her sex needs in front of a phony congressional panel. What a joke.

A Casual Observation

Bird Brain @ 5:35 pm

Saying its so ain't going to make it so, and it ain't going to make you any smarter, and it ain't going to make you feel any better about yourself either, you batty, old blowhard.

At the end of the day when all is said and done, you will still be a toothless, old goober nibbling on crackers by yourself, and I will be having pepperoni and sausage pizza with a babe. So eat your heart out, you squirrelly old coot.

Jack is Back!

DoT,

I am one of those simpletons. She is what Rush called her. She is a prostitute of the entrenched leftist cabal to take the heat of the Obama Regime to subject all of us to the oppression of liberal economic failurism. She is a slut of a culture that tries to trap a Catholic institution to violate their founding precepts. If Rush wants to apoligize it is for business purposes. But this carp has to be countered every step of the way because this is what the left does even now in our military which you and I have in our DNA.

Take a look around at all the changes that have taken place since you and I honorably served. The same damn thing is having in our religious and political culture. There are so many sacred cows that are now running around like on Indian highways that you risk killing yourself trying to avoid them.

Believe it or not there are men who are pricks and unrepentent rapists like Clilnton and there are sluts and prostitutes to the left wing cause like Fluke. She gets no apologize from me until she apologizes to the Jesuits for settting them up.

This is the difference in thinking between an Air Force engineer and a Naval officer:)

Ignatz

--Playing catch up, but I see Rush has just apologized..--

Thank goodness. Now we'll be spared roving bands of sluts and prostitutes rioting and shooting random radio talk show hosts.

narciso

Well we see the Memorandum, like the battlelines in perfect coordination, as the previous example of the Wasilla Network I linked above, because on our side, there are
scruples, sadly we will lose, because they
have none,

Someone of unmatched fidelity, integrity, honesty, stomp her into Oblivion, and replace her persona with some simulacrum, that's whatGame Change, is aboutbeing fed to the Inner Party and to the proles by osmosis, through People and US, and Access
Hollywood.

Threadkiller

http://www.infowars.com/jerome-corsi-breitbarts-last-contact-was-with-sheriff-joe-arpaio/

Danube of Thought

Seriously, folks, we have to inquire: has there ever, in the history of JOM, been a more exquisitely timed, thoroughgoing humiliation than the one just suffered by this sap? Oh, I know it's cruel of me, but I honestly can't stop laughing out loud.

Threadkiller

Rush should've had a beer with her. Isn't that a substitute for an apology?

daddy

Just got to the link to Steyn's latest on the previous thread wherein he says that part of our Afghan strategy is the following:

"...more bulk orders of the bestselling book Three Cups of Tea, an Oprahfied heap of drivel extensively exposed as an utter fraud but which a delusional Washington insists on sticking in the kit bag of its Afghan-bound officer class."

Unbelievable. Last week I read Karakauer's Three Cups of Deceit in which he shows what a complete fraud that book is, and angrily admits that as a Lefty himself he wishes it was true but it ain't and that the local Afghan's laugh at and are angry at the BS Mortenson spouted about them in that book. If our Pentagon is ordering that pile of self-rightious fictional garbage to be included in our troops brain bags, then time to clean house in whoever is pushing that BS down from topside. Unfortunately it'd probably wind up back at the desk where the buck never stops.

matt

It looks as if the gay marriage proponents are using a variation of Alinsky's "Pick the Target, Freeze It, Personalize It and Polarize It." LUN

Gmax

Arent we glad sluts and prostitutes worldwide dont have a prophet and a holy book containing his words? Otherwise the head chopping and riots would be neverending right now...

MarkO

daddy, I started off the day with the genial and traditional salutation offered on a Duke/UNC showdown day, GTHC, but no one replied.

Have I angered the White Phantoms?

Seriously, I have my doubts tonight, as I did in CH. We've not been good at home. Strange season.

Danube of Thought

Rush asserted essentially what I have been saying all day

When did you say his choice of words was not the best? (I don't think you're using "metaphor" quite correctly.)

Janet and Jib, neither of you is a simpleton--far from it. And neither is Rush.

"She is a prostitute of the entrenched leftist cabal to take the heat of the Obama Regime..." But Rush didn't use any qualifiers, and he used the term with its ordinary meaning of sex for money.

MarkO

Oh, and daddy, I have a secret weapon.

clarice feldman

This is so preposterous there are no words:

" During a discussion series on Monday at the Woodrow Wilson International Center for Scholars in Washington, D.C., speaker and activist Kavita Ramdas argued that contraceptives should be part of a strategy to save the planet, calling lower birth rates a “common sense” part of a climate-change reduction strategy. (Snip) Ramdas told The Daily Caller that the research shows “empowering women to time their pregnancies” and avoid unwanted births would reduce carbon emissions between 8 to 15 percent globally."

Daily Caller

A Casual Observation

Oh, I know it's cruel of me, but I honestly can't stop laughing out loud.

Posted by: Danube of Thought | March 03, 2012 at 05:56 PM


Is that why ypu're whining and calling fot reinforcements?
I'll attribute your lameness to that generation gap thingy.

MarkO

Hell yes, Clarice, what about a round of the Spanish Flu? Talk about reducing carbon emissions.

A Casual Observation

* you're *

Danube of Thought

I will be having pepperoni and sausage pizza

Figures.

I'll be having a Martini.

Gmax

I used to think the moron otherwise known as ACO was Anne, but now it seems to me that its the featherman. Remember who is constantly accusing others of sockpuppeting, which a tell for his projection.

A Casual Observation

Asshole @ 6:10 pm

daddy

Yippee! It's Jane's BirthDay!

Happy Birthday Jane. (Just found out during catch-up)

In honor of your Birthday I think I am going to go to Carl's Jr and order the Kate Upton special.

I will be in the Jeep and besides my 2 dogs I'm also dog-sitting Grizzley (the neighbors Golden Retriever), so I don't quite know if I'll be able to slide around upside down in the front seat like Kate, but I'm still hoping I get The Southwest Patty Melt vapors.

Anyone else eaten one yet in honor of Jane's BirthDay?

Gmax

laughing hysterically @ 6:13

A Casual Observation

Yeah, I can tell. Snappy come-back, asshole. Snappy.

Iamboredandweneedtomoveon

A woman has sex with 100 men and she is called a slut. A man does the same thing and he is called a homo.

boris

"When did you say his choice of words was not the best?"

4:32 ... Then perhaps Rush is incorrect to suggest that asking the government to make other people pay for her to have lots and lots of sex makes her a prostitute.

Wikipedia ... Metaphor and analogy both work by bringing together two concepts from different conceptual domain ...
Rush says analogy, I used metaphor. Apparently closely related.

Also at 11:39 ... Rush didn't shout at her like ... Jane you ignorant slut! (as in personal attack)

Also at 1:00 PM ... suggesting a multiple choice answer is not calling her anything.

So yes, I have been making the Rush points all day. You have been exaggerating and making false accusations.


Ignatz

--Anyone else eaten one yet in honor of Jane's BirthDay?--

The object of that sentence seems somewhat ambiguous. :)

matt

clarice;

perhaps they can sell that particular pile of steaming horse manure to all of those families in India and Africa and the Middle East and yes, even China, who are changing the global demographic so alarmingly.

Gee, those are the same people most responsible for all of the global warming too. How did that all work out?

Captain Hate

I posited that it is not our business whatsoever to know what is going on in anyone's bedroom nor do I think it is a topic that should reach a Presidential level.

But we have a President who never fails to sink to the occasion. He could've taken the high road on this and said "We should be discussing more important things"; but that's the path never taken by the community activist.

clarice feldman

If we discussed more important things, he'd be packing to leave in January.

daddy

Screw free coffee:

It seems to me that if we're going to have to pay for students so that they can have unlimited sex without consequences, then we best also be paying for the beer that's going to make other students all look like 10's by closing time, so that they can take proper advantage of those free contraceptives.

Grad school, here I came!

Captain Hate

He probably will anyway...

daddy

Okay, Tip Off in 20 minutes.

I have to take the 3 dogs out shortly so that I can get back in time for the last few minutes of the game.

I will have the headsets on during the walk cranked up to "11", so I just want everyone to know that if I get eaten by a bear or stomped to death by angry moose, blame it on Coach K.

Go To Hell Dook!

Good luck MarkO...and the horse you rode in on:)

MarkO

Bless you daddy. There's nothing like Duke Carolina.

Janet

from Porchlight's 2:13 link -
"Thomas Paine once wrote, “He who dares not offend cannot be honest” and as far as I’m concerned, that’s what Andrew Breitbart was all about."

Rush was honest about that woman too. We (conservatives) better start getting comfortable with offending some people. We've been quiet & polite for too long...& look where our country is now.


clarice feldman

About those stupid paleodiets--From Smithsonian Science:

"

Researchers from George Washington University and the Smithsonian Institution have discovered evidence to debunk the theory that Neandertals’ disappearance was caused in part by a deficient diet–one that lacked variety and was overly reliant on meat. After discovering starch granules from plant food trapped in the dental calculus on 40-thousand-year-old Neandertal teeth, the scientists believe that Neandertals ate a wide variety of plants and included cooked grains as part of a more sophisticated, diverse diet similar to early modern humans.

Danube of Thought

"You have been exaggerating and making false accusations"

Sure. And you've been apologizing for Rush all day.

He said that her behavior made her a slut, a prostitute. That is not a metaphor. If you believe it is, we'll just disagree.

PaulV

Clarice, Any chance the Progressives want to bring back forced sterilization of the underclass? They did it before.

Danube of Thought

I do believe that asking to be paid for sex makes one a prostitute. I don't believe that she was asking to be paid for sex. Rush said she was.

Danube of Thought

"A metaphor expresses the unfamiliar (the tenor) in terms of the familiar (the vehicle). When Neil Young sings, 'Love is a rose,' 'rose' is the vehicle for 'love,' the tenor. (In cognitive linguistics, the terms target and source are roughly equivalent to tenor and vehicle.)"

Apply this formulation to what Rush said.

boris

"He said that her behavior made her a slut, a prostitute."

Mostly my points have been addressing your exaggeration, not apologizing. I heard the radio statement and took it as metaphor, not a personal attack. He said "she did X, what does that make her?".

Well doing X is not anybody's legal definition of prostitution so blinders of some sort are required to turn that into an actionable accusation. Doing X is comparable to prostitution metaphorically speaking and I say everybody hearing that who listens to Rush, even occasionally, gets that.

Danube of Thought

MarkO, do you want me to take the shirt off?

Danube of Thought

"suggesting a multiple choice answer is not calling her anything"

He didn't suggest a multiple choice answer. He gave the answer--slut--and then amplified it with a near-synonym (prostitute). (I've heard of multiple choice questions, but never until today have I heard of a multiple choice answer.)

Doing X is everyone's definition of prostitution, where X is asking to be paid for sex. Rush falsely said she was asking to be paidfor sex.

cathyf

Happy birthday, Jane!!!!

A Casual Observation

WTF? Danube Of Dufusness is still trying to save face? LOL
Nobody can clear a room like that batty, old blowhard can.

boris

"Rush falsely said she was asking to be paid for sex"

Not quite.

“What does it say about the college co-ed [Sandra] Fluke, who goes before a congressional committee and essentially says she must be paid to have sex?

If you set yourself up as a persnickity perfectionist you should be more careful in your quotes. This way you just look sneaky.

If her point is that she can't afford the expenses associated with free and easy sexual activity, then she need other people to pay for her expenses in order to have sex.

boris

Nobody hearing "goes before a congressional committee and essentially says she must be paid to have sex” is interpreting that as a proposition or accusation of such.

MarkO

Jettison the talisman. This game was over after 5 minutes. Wow. Carolina has a basketball team. Duke could easily go out in the first round of the NCAA.

As Barkley says, it's not that you live and die by the three point shot, ultimately, you die by the three.

Frau Brust und Bahnhof

Iggy, I loved the toned arms at your 4:22. You are the best!
Eat your heart out, FLOTUS.

Barbara
Researchers...have discovered evidence to debunk the theory that Neandertals’ disappearance was caused in part by a deficient diet...the scientists believe that Neandertals ate a...diverse diet similar to early modern humans.

Perhaps their gradual disappearance was due to government funded contraception.

jimmyk

Perhaps their gradual disappearance was due to government funded contraception.

Climate change from bbq-ing all that meat.

cathyf

Ok, I'm as usual hopelessly behind on the thread, so maybe everybody has already discussed this...

Somebody on another thread linked to an article claiming that the net-net on the contraception mandate is that insurance companies could not create insurance policies where women had to pay co-pays for contraception, and so insurance companies could not charge a higher co-pay for name-brand contraceptives as for generic. (Since all values of zero are the same.)

Writing insurance policies so that if a generic is available the insurance will only cover the name brand drug with special approval and proof of medical necessity is one of the basic tools of cost controls that have been vital to controlling healthcare costs.

So, at least for contraception, cost controls are now against the law.

Has anyone figured out whether this is just contraception or does it apply to all prescription drug coverage? Certainly Medicare drug plans control costs in this way -- are we about to see the cost of Medicare blow up now instead of having a decade?

It's what I've been saying all along, and it's just becoming more and more obvious -- this is all about destroying the legal framework which allows health insurance contracts to exist.

told ya so.

Danube of Thought

I return after an hour or so to find this:

"WTF? Danube Of Dufusness is still trying to save face?"

It's probably time to discuss, once again, the sinking of the Italian cruise ship.

But no! Instead, let's invite ACO to share with us his thoughts on the Limbaugh apology!

A fella can wait several decades to see an embarrassment like that inflicted on an adversary. Really, disgraces like that one come along only a few times in a lifetime. They must be savored. This one is being savored indeed.

narciso

That would make it the second time, that Captain Chechino, screwed up, is he Italian
for Hazelwood?

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