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March 24, 2012


Danube of Thought

Minus 18 at Raz today.

Tied with Romney.



Is there any hispanic outrage in Florida?


Not that I can tell, local Minitrue is keeping
the 'two minute hate' alive, with the washed out mugshot, and the garbled 9/11 call.


From that web page, this seems significant: "Zimmerman’s statement was that he had lost sight of Trayvon and was returning to his truck to meet the police officer when he says he was attacked by Trayvon."

If so, he was following Martin but did not confront him. Zimmerman's claim is essentially an unprovoked attack by Martin.


Perhaps the MSM interest in the story has as much to do with guns as race.


--" It has been reported that Trayvon Martin was on a ten-day suspension from school, but those records have been kept from the public."--

Records kept from the public? He really is a splitting image of Obama.


Just another canvas on which to paint one of their most popular fairytales.


Spitting image?

Spit and image?

Danube of Thought

Now an eyewitness says he saw Martin on top of Zimmerman, beating on him. (Can't link.)


Santorum needs to wise up.


Now, Jane you know full well, that's not what he meant,


Uh oh Calypso Louie and Al and Jessie check your voicemails, it seems an eye witness made make your rhetoric seem rash, ill considered, self-serving and ridiculous.

Perhaps the post racial President can point out the poor behavior here? I cant hold my breathe all that long btw.


The police know, but we don't.

Well, juvi records are automatically sealed. The only institutions that can get acess to them are law enforcement and the military (for enlistment eligability). Don't exspect to see those records unless the family choose to release them.


DoT, I listened to the 911 calls last night and I believe one of the callers said the same thing.

OT: Reason has the 4 strongest arguments for overturning Obamacare just in case you don't want to spend the rest of your life reading the briefs. http://reason.com/archives/2012/03/24/4-best-legal-arguments-against-obamacare

Danube of Thought

Are you people aware of this program called "Brzilian Bum Bums" on the Idea Channel?


Amid the rush of loud outrage and vocal protest from the parents of Trayvon Martin and their supporters the silence of one character in this tragic tale has been deafening: George Zimmerman, the free man who shot Martin and alleges self-defense. His attorney, Craig Sonner, finally spoke out to Anderson Cooper last night, and had few answers but one accusation– his client has a broken nose and a laceration on his skull, and that was “an injury done by Trayvon Martin.”

Sonner noted to Cooper that his client seemed fine save for a “considerable bit of stress” natural to his situation, but admitted that “y conversations have been by telephone.” He did not know where Zimmerman was but assumed he was “still in the area” and hadn’t fled the country. He had surprisingly little to offer Cooper about the facts of the case; asked what Zimmerman had told him about what transpired the night Martin died, he said “he should have made a statement to police at the time, I believe he did,” and said he “did not discuss the details,” and they would be privileged even if he had.

mediaite.com ...


Here is a link to the story being carried by the Brits. It says an anonymous witness now says he saw Martin on top of Zimmerman beating on him:


Please, please, please, don't throw me in that tar barrel.

Calling Uncle Remus.


"Perhaps the MSM interest in the story has as much to do with guns as race."

I think it has everything to do with the election and Florida. I think racial tension in the country has not been worse since the 60's. Electing Obama really helped that problem, didn't it?


Zimmerman's attorney says his client has a broken nose that was caused by Martin. Still sound like a thin happy go lucky skittles eating teen out for a lark?


Waaaay OT. MelR. I watched the zerohedge stephanos video. Every word is true..... I bet you didn t know that the greeks saved the world from hitler in1941!
Anyway... Best line.. Greece has a problem? No! Germany has a problem... You loaned us the money!


Captain Hate

Too bad Breitbart isn't still here to bang on the MFM for pimping this story by witlessly thinking they'd found a white on black item and reporting it as such. Now we have idiots like Stedman's black panther thug issuing dead or alive statements, for which there will be no negative consequences.

Just effing wonderful.



It's not what he meant? What did he mean?


Too bad Breitbart isn't still here to bang on the MFM for pimping this story

We are all Breitbart!


Impassioned rant from an independent fast/furious investigator.


MarkO, you are likely correct. The issue does seem to be less than clearcut though. Not as strong a partisan plus as they would wish for.


Re-reading TM I see new gems all the time. Like this: He did not mention race yet his words did? How does that work?"
Part of me thinks that if he edited the NYT it might stop losing money. But the other part says, if the paper weren't flogging lies, who'd buy it?


The damage to Obama will be huge if this all comes out. It's the exact same thing as "The Cambridge police acted stupidly". It's critical race theory, Eric holder and all things bad about the Obama administration all wrapped up together.


I posted this on the other thread, but here is the Star Parker speech at the Stand up For Religious Freedom rally in DC. Very good.

From Deuteronomy 30 -

"See, I have set before you today life & prosperity, and death and adversity;...
So choose life in order that you may live, you & your descendants, by loving the Lord your God, by obeying His voice, and by holding fast to Him...."

Captain Hate

Impassioned rant from an independent fast/furious investigator.

Yes but I think he's making some erroneous assumptions about Zimmerman.

But the other part says, if the paper weren't flogging lies, who'd buy it?

The only people I know that still read that rag are completely in the tank for donks and don't want facts to interfere with that.


There is not a jury in the country outside of maybe one formed in the District of Columbia that would convict Zimmerman of anything, if this eye witness is the least bit credible.

Nose broken, bleeding from the back of the skull too, laying prone and suffering additional blows?

You dont need the Fla law. That sounds like garden variety self defense to me.


Related news?
Southport ct based Ruger pistol and rifle manufacturer announced quarterly sales exceeding 1M guns. They have suspended accepting new orders. Maybe zerohedge is right, go long on gold and guns short all fiat currency and sovereign debt.


I think that the president's remarks implied that the shooter was consciously or subconsciously shooting at HIM.

This was an attempt by the Obama Campaign to steer this tragedy into a narrative about the president being in danger from conservative law-and-order racist kooks.


PS so by switching to an IPad to comment my avatar changes?


OT -Sarah takes it to 'em and tells it like it is.


InstaNews. Glenn reynolds again links to TomM. Lot of man love there... How does TM reciprocate?

Instapundit also links to robert wright asking in the Atlantic does 'Bam' think he's devinely ordained? Answer... NO.. ' Bam belives he IS devine.


What did he mean?

If voters want more Obama they will vote for Obama. If voters want something different they will vote for the Nobama candidate, who is also the not-Romney candidate.

My preference list is Newt over Mitt and Mitt over Rick but ISTM that's a valid point and have said as much.


NK, on switching to iPad the auto uppercase on the first letter can switch your avatar. That plus autospell will make commenting interesting for you.


Over at the PJ Tatler, Clarice has put up:


I urge JOMers to read the Links put up by Gloria Tucci under Comment #2. A wonderful tribute to get us looking forward to our Pieces for tomorrow.
An outstanding but very depressing article at American Thinker by Jessica Rubin.

Over in the memeorandum column, consider what riots we would be seeing if the nurse had been Christian and made that statement that the Telegraph is highlighting.


Henry. Thanks for the info. Don' t know what i'd do without you. Watch that zerohedge stephanos vid-- it will take you back to soccer against niko, spiro and soterios. Several malaka bombs in it.


it occurred to me this morning that perhaps Hollywood types are so attracted to leftist politics because there is so much theater involved


Of the three candidates, I think only Newt and Mitt have not come out playing amateur judge but said wait and see. There is such a jumble of information out there it is hard to know what to think. Santorum undercut himself by playing premature judge and jury, imo. I don't know what Paul has said.


Um, ms Porch's husband is like 17 years old. Cradle robber!

Very gracious people, I bought a t shirt.

What a show!

Jim Ryan

Clarice, thanks for that link to the best arguments. It goes into the wheat, weed and Obamacare continuum that's been perplexing me.

This is frustrating: "the uninsured’s defining characteristic is their non-participation in commerce." On the contrary, Fillburn and Raich were also non-participants in commerce. Yet the Court has in fact ruled that they were indeed participants. This means to me that the Court's error - its construing Fillburn and Raich as participants - might give it grounds to rule Obamacare unconstitutional.


NK, that vid does take me back -- to working at the grinder shop for Spiro.


I believe the effort to reconcile those cases might be better expressed thusly: If a grower grows something--even for his own use--it impacts the sale of the crop.If I grow grain for my own cattle, for example, I don't have to buy it which means that there's more grain on the market and that affects its sale price no matter how infinitesimally.
Just living seems a different case.

Jim Ryan

Wait, sorry, the Court didn't say Fillburn and Raich were participants in commerce, sorry. Grr! This is extremely confusing to me. It's like this:

Screwed up thinking ruled against Fillburn and even more screwed up thinking ruled against Raich. So, how will screwed-up thinking rule in the case of Obamacare?
I have no idea. I fail to understand the case for either side. All I understand is that the Court, if is not screwed up, will overturn Wickard and Gonzales and rule Obamacare mandate unconstitutional on its face. But that won't happen.


LUN is an interview by roger simon's 8th grade daughter of Pacepa, the romanian general who defected in 1978.

It's excellent for several reasons but especially its appreciation that racism gets asserted these days so emotions will drive reactions.

I keep coming back to BO's push to "open your heart" to derrick bell. He is saying let your sense of grievance and envy and frustration with life generally drive how you hear these words.

Feel the rage. Sort of like yesterday's comments about looking like a son of his might.

Jim Ryan

In order to argue that Obamacare is a bridge too far from Wickard v. Fillburn and Gonzales v. Raich (on the grounds that Obamacare forces the individual to engage in commerce whereas Fillburn and Raich were no so forced), you have to say, "Okay, the Court was screwed up in stopping Fillburn from growing wheat for himself, but at least it didn't force him to engage in commerce." The "at least" in that sentence makes no sense to me. "Joe robs banks, but at least he doesn't pick people's pockets." ??? I am reminded of Alice's having to "reason" as the inhabitants of Wonderland did. If circles are square, then what flavor are triangles? Blech!

The more I read and think about Wickard, Gonzales and Obamacare, the less I understand how the Court could make any kind of reasonable decision if it doesn't trash all three of them.

Rick Ballard

Jim Ryan,

Schlaes covered the speed with which the Supremes can turn over the fig leaf of stare decis fairly well in The Forgotten Man. If Kennedy takes on the role of Reynolds after Roosevelt's Court packing threat, then a reversal of the Commerce Clause nonsense is entirely possible.

I'm not predicting that the Nine Ninnies will do so, just pointing out that stare decis isn't graven on stone tablets.

BTW - did you know we (the US) are broke and that BOzocare is a railroad spike in the coffin lid? The Supremes know it as well as they know that the Commerce Clause nonsense is a linchpin of tyranny.

Jim Ryan

Thank you, Rick. I'm panicking here, and you're cooling me down, as usual.

Cecil Turner

I have no real confidence in the reported facts of this case, but that's not going to stop me from speculating. If, in fact, Trayvon Martin decided to assault George Zimmerman, and got shot for his trouble, I'm having a real hard time getting outraged about it. And, contra the Sharpton crowd, that does seem to me to be a plausible scenario; perhaps it's the most plausible.

Moreover, the racial bias issue is eyeroll inducing. The reason people are nervous around black teen men is that they are grossly disproportionately likely to be involved in a violent assault. Since we're talking about homicide:

Most homicides are intraracial, but in the realm of interracial assaults (and especially those committed by strangers), again blacks are overrepresented as perpetrators, not victims:

I see the usual suspects are up in arms (predictably), but for me it just reinforces the stereotype that has an unfortunately significant basis in crime statistics reality.


Lowry of course earns his promotion to Duke & Duke exec vp, crediting Sharpton, Ytte Clausen (sic) has a good piece in the Journal, on how much a 'lone wolf' Merah
wasn't, his mother was married to a Syrian imam, his brother part of the 'Iraq case'
of jihadis, nothing to see here,


it occurred to me this morning that perhaps Hollywood types are so attracted to leftist politics because there is so much theater involved

Exactly right, Chubby.


--Lets say the boy bears some responsibility for his own death. What would the comparable blame to Z equate to, 75%-90%?--

We don't know the circumstances precisely yet so there is no way to assign blame. We can assert various hypotheticals but that's all they are.
If, as some witnesses seem to corroborate, Zimmerman was backing away from a confrontation and "the boy" attacked him and was pounding on him then it's very easy to envision 0% legal culpability for Zimmerman. There are of course other possibilities which is what investigations are for.


I was close, off by a letter or too;


My fishwrap is relating it to the Martin Anderson boot camp case, but they have to stretch in order to do so

Rob Crawford

Dana, you idiot. Being "hassled" does not excuse assault and battery.

It's Zimmerman's Jewish name that has you measuring the rope, isn't it?


Ah Spike Lee, tweeting Zimmerman's address, what could possibly go wrong.

Cecil Turner

Not hardly. Zimmerman following Martin (or even asking Martin his business) is perfectly legal. Martin is of course under no obligation to cooperate or answer.

But if Martin decides to assault Zimmerman in response, that's the root cause of the incident, and it's entirely Martin's fault.



Ben, was the greeter's action the root cause?


According to Cleo Race Theory if Z had no gun and T beat him to death it would be justifiable homicide. A slam dunk case of hoodie profiling with intent to follow.


I think the one thing we know for sure is that we do not have all the facts. Sharpton doesn't, and perhaps even the police do not yet have them all.

It would be wise to call for calm and transparency to get to the truth.Speculation helps no one at this point.



Are the happy meds working now?


"Speculation helps no one at this point.

No, but the race baiting and black anger manipulation helps the usual suspects like Sharpton, Jackson, et al, and helps Obama rouse a necessary core voting constituency.


I'm going to repeat part of my comment from the previous thread, on a part of Barry's remarks that has gotten less play:

Oh yeah, and third: Collective guilt ("All of us have to do some soul-searching..."). Why? Did we have to search our souls after the white boy was set on fire by his black schoolmates in Kansas?


We've seen this rather tragic turn of events before, a mistake, the supervising officials
are forced out, yet more often than not, the incident is deemed justified, that doesn't stop the most disreputable sorts like Luther Campbell, who so expanded the cultural universe in the early 90s, from piping up,
glorifying in his ignorance.


--Wrong Cecil..The Law looks at intent, and there was no reason for Z to feel there were any clear and present danger.--

It is impossible at this point to discuss anyone's "intent" with the minimal info we have.
What little info we do have of the incident itself tends to do exactly what Lee said, which is to corroborate Zimmerman's story.
Whether that holds up is unknowable at this point.


TK, two for you at end of page 8. LUN


I would like to contest one of the race hustler and leftist's memes regarding the inability of a poor 6'2" and 160 pound child from putting a severe beatdown on a chubby dude in his 20s.
Most athletes of that size in high school can be pretty lethal if they put their minds to it.

And since speculation is apparently de rigeuer, if it turns out Martin started pounding on Zimmerman for an innocuous query about who he was and what he was doing there, could we please have a beatdown on the race pimps for attempting to make that perfectly reasonable question seem like a criminal act when directed toward young black men?

Cecil Turner

. . . there was no reason for Z to feel there were any clear and present danger.

While Martin is pounding on him? If you posit Martin assaulted Zimmerman first, which is the hypothetical we're discussing, the danger is clear, present, and ongoing. You don't need to get beaten unconscious before defending yourself.


How did Whitey Zimmermans head get bloodied, how did his nose get broken??


Sandy Daze
Are Sharpton and Jackson fanning this because they've become so irrelevant or are they doing this because they are angry at Obama and want to hurt him?
--Clarice, previous thread

This is my view, straight from the paranoia closet, I opened the door earlier today and this is what I see:

Voldemort and his minions will not go quietly (if at all) into the night. They can see the polls as RickB and many of us do. They saw what happened in 2010, and know 2012 will be massive.

Voldemort admires, respects and would even like to emulate Chavez, Castro, Zeleya (almost), and for that matter, Putin and Amenanutjob.

To do so he has to, as Jane and I think it was Old Timer said yesterday, start a Race War (RW). Rev Jaqueson said in Drudge headline, They're attacking us. Farrakan calls for retaliation, Sharpton is doing his hustle. What's it all mean?

This is squaredance territory, but I gotta agree with those who think the ultimate goal is to so destabilize the USA, between now and the elections, in order for Voldemort to declare the "situation too fragile to our democracy to hold elections at this particular moment and thus, elections will be suspended" (as per earlier Orzag or Bev Perdue (or was it Bev Tyson??) heh-heh it's all chicken carp to me, commented). Well, Voldemort said himself it would be so much easier if he did not have to deal with Congress, let alone the "fundamentally flawed" Constitution.

The War on Women (upper cut) did not work, perhaps the War on Blacks/RW (left jab) will move us along to the required instability. But if not, there is the economic body-blow of war with Iran to double the price of oil, creating economic disaster in the USA. Yep, in all of that the smiling devine (someone up above said so) Voldemort saying "now you know why we need green energy."

Did you hear about this happening last weekend?:

Ten people were killed and at least 39 others were wounded in shootings across the city this weekend.

Most of the victims, male and female, ranged in age from their mid-teens to 30s, with the notable exception of a 6-year-old girl who was shot dead as she played on the front porch of her home in the Little Village neighborhood.

What - ? - no calls for soul searching?? No calls that said he looks like my son/daughter/brother/sister/wife/mother/father etc. What carp.

Stand by, it will get A LOT hotter before it cools off.


Cecil Turner

B.S. Don't have to be a cop to ask someone their business. Of course they don't have to answer. (For that matter, I'm not sure they have to answer a cop.) And they can take umbrage. But assault is not authorized (and it can be hazardous to your health).


Just because some nut follows you and asks you why you're there doesn't give you the right to batter them, no matter how angry you are because you believe you've been accused by whitey of WWSWB - Walking With Skittles While Black.

Captain Hate

Did you hear about this happening last weekend

I mentioned it a few threads ago and how *shocking* it is that nobody's talking about it. It's almost like there was some coordination between a bunch of journoalists to drive the narrative.


Cecil, that's excellent. I wish you;d send it to the editor of AT as a blog.
Dan Riehl notes that the pic the papers are using of Trayvon was delberately lightened and shot in such a way as to make him seem even younger than he looked at 14 when that picture was taken.


--As it is, it was none of his goddamned business.....Anyway, don't the cops secretly hate this type of 'civilian'?--

Sure it is.
I have several times asked unknown people walking around our neighborhood who they are and what they are doing there as have my neighbors. We even ask middle aged white men that question.
And having been on the other end of the question, normal people answer it rather than pouncing on the guy looking out for his neighborhood.
The cops I know generally are very supportive of neighborhood watches.
And I'm pretty sure the left's opinion was that the cops didn't hate this type of "civilian" sufficiently.

--There goes the comity........--

Why is the comity destroyed when responsibility might be apportioned to people who make a living fanning racial flames, but not when those hustlers fan the flames with little or no evidence?

Danube of Thought

"it could have been the young man was defending himself anyway he could"

By wounding his adversary on the back of the head and breaking his nose?

We're starting to get the full Tom Wolfe now.



What sort of mileage would the regime get with calm and transparency? Although ginning up some race hate along the I4 and the southern extremes of I95 might not seem like the best of election strategies.


ABC's coverage of this last night was practically incendiary. Clearly designed to try to ignite the student vote.

Picture after picture of families posing in hoodies together or as a class or a father with his young son. Designed to have a huge visual impact.

I still remember sawyer tipsy the morning after the last inaugural. She and george are doing their best to get bo back over the line again.

Captain Hate

I still remember sawyer tipsy the morning after the last inaugural

I think it's happy hour 24/7 for Diane.


Re Zimmerman: I think it is pretty clear that Obama is waging a war on Hispanics. And it is high time we start talking about it.

Jim Ryan

Here's how it might be a classic tragedy. Martin is having a horrible couple of years. He knows Zimmerman is no threat to him but he blows his stack and starts beating Zimmerman because he is Not Happy At All and someone is accosting him. Zimmerman is having a horrible couple of years. He can't tell Martin is not a grave threat to him because he's blown his stack because he is Not Happy At All and someone is beating him. He draws.

Captain Hate

Ah Spike Lee, tweeting Zimmerman's address, what could possibly go wrong.

Per the morons he tweeted a non-existent address, which makes sense since Shelton's an idiot and a thug-wannabee as exemplified by his ass-kissing film of Jim Brown.


If Obama had a son (whether or not he looked like Trayvon), Zimmerman would have been shot down by multiple Secret Service agents … assuming Zimmerman actually tried to stop the motorcade.


CRT tells us Martin was innocent regardless of facts and the kid in KC had it coming to him.

OT, Fleebagger won't run for reelection. What the article does not say is that the now court approved redistricting makes his senate district favor a Republican.

mark l.

the great investigative powers of the nyt,and they can't find out from a bunch of high schoolers why the kid was suspended?

I could buy the info for 20 dollar gift cert to McDonald's, at maximum.

They found out, they did interviews...
they no 'likey' the results.

they might as well bring back jayson blair.


Another fucking Jew, trying to ..

I'm not even Jewish and this made me sick.


Being "hassled" does not excuse assault and battery.

You'd think he'd be able to remember a principle which benefits him so much.


"His racial expletives on 911 recordings are going to be a big hill to climb for the defense."

Yeah, keep phucking that chicken.

Donald Douglas

Witness Says Trayvon Martin Attacked George Zimmerman: http://americanpowerblog.blogspot.com/2012/03/witness-says-trayvon-martin-attacked.html

Captain Hate

Many here don't agree. But they seem reluctant to say so, and thereby become enablers.

So what; you add nothing of value so anything that ridicules you is fine with me. Please go walking in traffic like you said you'd do.


---Another fucking Jew, trying to "make the neighborhood better" by getting all up into other people business. Hook-nosed bitch got what he deserved.----

How do we call this anti-semitism to the attention of this site's webmaster? This race war stuff is infectious isn't it?

hit and run

There have been calls to have George Zimmerman killed. I assume Obama doesn't agree. But he seems reluctant to say so,and thereby becomes an enabler.


--Many here don't agree. But they seem reluctant to say so, and thereby become enablers.--

Over time most people here have objected. If the fool wants to keep at it despite that, more objections likely encourage him; kind of like the nut you were quoting.


Asked the site manager to excise the antisemitism. Its not called for.


--enough race-baiting for you, Ig?--

I see Ben baiting and a little Anne baiting but no race baiting, unless you're counting the Rev Al and the NYT.


Where's all the concern for "civility" that erupted when Gabby Giffords and the others were shot?

Vague allusions to "targets" and "bulls-eyes" are considered eliminationist rhetoric and calls for violence on the part of the extremist right, but openly calling for someone's murder is okey-dokey as long as the people doing so are black and Dems.

Bizarro World, here we are.


--Asked the site manager to excise the antisemitism. Its not called for.--

It's apparently not genuine anti semitism but some idiot sock puppeting Ben Franklin in an attempt to discredit him with hyperbole.


Exactly, Ig,
I beg you to stop engaging these freaks, you don't and then you get miffed because they go all psychotic again after they've gotten the attention they desire,

TM has explained how hard it is to ban posters and how by using anonymizers and such they just up the game and waste his time. If you can't control yourselves, you have to swim in this shit.

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