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April 09, 2012

Comments

DrJ

That's right, boris.

Though you example is not that good: liquid nitrogen has a density of about 0.8 g/cc, motor oil about 0.9 g/cc, fresh water of course is 1 g/cc, sea water is about 1.03 g/cc and chlorinated fresh water is also about 1 g/cc. "cc" of course is centimeters cubed. or a milliliter.

To me those are all about the same.

clarice feldman

aha--and an oz of iced tea?

Stephanie

Which produces more energy, one pound of dollar bills or one pound of cow poop?

Economic energy?

1. Is the pound of dollar bills stimulus or profit?

2. What is the velocity of cow poop?

Yeah it's getting silly round here. NTTAWWT

DrJ

I should add that any fluid that is predominantly water -- like wine, beer, Kool Aid (however you spell it), dish soap, grey water, salt water, whatever -- essentially has the same density as water.

Even scotch and vodka are not that far away from that, even though they have a lot of alcohol (ethanol).

boris

Used to handle liquid N2 a lot (MCT detectors). The lightest liquid I ever worked with.

DrJ

Try liquid helium (0.2 g.cc), as opposed to the 0.8 g/cc for liquid nitrogen.

boris

Never touched the stuff.

Gmax

Rangers put a forth HR in the cheap seats and now jump out to an 11 to 5 advantage in the bottom of the 8th. Yu Darvish about to notch his first win in the US.

Enlightened

I'm still interested in finding out if Martin was found with matches or a lighter on him. I just wonder if he left his house to get high or even smole a cigarette (left the house after Dad and his lady left, waited till dark, and away from little bro)and that's why he got paranoid when he thought GZ was watching him....

xbradtc

Never touched the stuff.

Scotch or vodka?

Lord knows, Sylvia, BB and DD are driving me to drink.

Sylvia

If Zimmerman does not testify for himself he will get convicted. We have a dead kid, GZ is the shooter. There are no good witnesses or facts to suggest that he did it in self defense other than him.

Gmax

The stupidity is especially strong with this one...

Stephanie

Now I remember why I was surprised when K expressed an interest in physics with an eye toward an ME degree. I hated all that weight/volume/density/mass stuff.

Then she mentioned that golf was physics and reminded me that I explained learning to read putts as visualizing the 'parabola' of the green and figuring out how to make the putt follow it.

Ignatz

The level of discussion of ounces etc is actually making me feel kinda smart.
Somebody should be concerned.

DrJ

Oh good lord. On which party is the burden of proof?

Speaking of proof, time for a Laphroaig. Cheers!

Sylvia

And all your Sherlock Holmes's were wrong, Reuters has an article, TM had the iced tea and skittles in a (probably plastic) bag.

DrJ

Then she mentioned that golf was physics

Kinematics, mainly. There's lots more to ME than that, of course, but one can study ME with that emphasis.

Applied mechanics, too.

Sylvia

DrJ, that is an interesting question. But with this unusual law in florida, it shifts around the concept of burden of proof. The state only has to prove that TM shot GZ. That is a slam dunk.

GZ has to prove he reasonably feared for his life. So since he is the only one who can testify about what was in his mind, he HAS to tesitfy if he wants to use that defense.

That may be why his lawyer said before GZ does not plan on using that defense.

Lennys

I don't think that filled this can of isopentane all the way.

xbradtc

Sylvia, I'd spell it out for you in small words, but you'd still not grasp the concept.

narciso

Ah Blutarski's advice to Flounder, wisdom for the ages, OT, according to that piece in the Post they were seriously thinking of casting
Chevy Chase as Otter, that wouldn't have worked at all.

Melinda Romanoff

A bullet rang out!

Why!?!

Arrest and hang!

Sylvia's play in three acts.

(Kudos to the editor.)

G'night all.

Insp C

Reuters idea of investigating is giving the Martin (aka No Limit Nigga aka the Perp aka the Attacker) legal team a call.

xbradtc

GZ has to prove he reasonably feared for his life. So since he is the only one who can testify about what was in his mind, he HAS to tesitfy if he wants to use that defense.

He doesn't have to take the stand to show that. The defense need only show the evidence contained in the police reports, including his prior statements to the police, and physical evidence either collected or noted by the police.

Rick Ballard

"GZ has to prove he reasonably feared for his life."

No, you abysmally stupid cretin, he does not have to "prove" any such thing. The prosecutor has to prove that a man laying on his back, screaming for help, with an assailant pounding his head on concrete, did not have reason to fear imminent harm or death.

DrJ

But with this unusual law in florida, it shifts around the concept of burden of proof.

No, it does not. Why am I doing this?

Sylvia

Wrong xb, that is hearsay. I know about hearsay because not too long ago I looked it up.

Hearsay for the most part is recounting that can not be cross examined.

narciso

We have surpassed this level of absurdity,


http://orangecow.org/pythonet/sketches/piranha.htm

Rick Ballard

"Why am I doing this?"

Your bozon shields are down. I finally have mine up but I know I lost a bunch of neurotransmitters.

Sylvia

rock, you need evidence to support that. And no one saw them on concrete.

jimmyk

The level of discussion of ounces etc is actually making me feel kinda smart.

For some reason, "Who's on first?" comes to mind.

My recollection is that one fluid ounce is the volume of one ounce of water at some specified temperature. I'm vaguely remembering 4 degrees Celsius. But as DrJ said, just about anything we'd likely to be carrying around is almost entirely water.

Threadkiller

I'm out too. 12oz are calling.

Goodnight.

Sylvia

Sorry not rock, rick. Or did I mean dick?Not sure.

xbradtc

Wrong xb, that is hearsay. I know about hearsay because not too long ago I looked it up.

Hearsay for the most part is recounting that can not be cross examined.

You're arguing that police reports are hearsay?

Would you kindly explain then, why they bother taking police reports? Since, per your determination, they are inadmissible?

Ofc. Smith can testify to the report he made, what he heard GZ say, his actions, any evidence he collected. The prosecution can elicit testimony from him, the defense can them rebut any testimony from him, and/or solicit further testimony from him.

Have you ever even watched Law and Order?

Stephanie

((Why am I doing this?))

Preparations for the house elf convention for S.P.E.W.???

Nite narc...

Soylent Red

Hi Sylvia! Where have you been hiding? Mr. Hit and Run and I have missed, missed, MISSED you!

Sylvia

No xb, evidence is not what you heard someone else say they did. There has to be a "hearsay exception", and those are strict. You can use that type of stuff to impeach a witness's credibity though.

Ignatz

--Wrong xb, that is hearsay. I know about hearsay because not too long ago I looked it up.--

Stop, Tom, you're killing me.

Gmax

Yu Darvish has as many wins as the entire Yankees pitching staff. YU Rock...

Ralph L

Sea water should be denser than fresh at the same temp, but I heard there's cold fresh water at the bottom of the Black Sea, suggesting it was once a lake.
and an oz of iced tea?
Sugar-free tea should be very close to water--fake sugar is very light. HFCS or sugar-sweetened should increase the density a bit over water.

My company sell both powdered and pelletized lime, both in 40 lb bags. The powdered feels heavier when you lift it because it's closer to Sylvia than bubu in density.

Sylvia

Look up hearsay, you might be surprised. Even memos written by the defendant aren't allowed.

The thinking is, you don't know the frame of mind of the person saying or writing it. They could have been joking at the time, or making up a story to impress someone, etc.

narciso

I think this sums up the situation, nicely, hence the Python and Princess Bride references, and don't make me go Zoolander;


http://theothermccain.com/2012/04/09/in-case-you-havent-noticed-yet-everybody-recently-went-crazy/

Ralph L

Have you ever even watched Law and Order?
That show made lawyers of us all.

Enlightened

Sylvia - STFU unless you have facts.

Per TRAYVON'S LAWYER

"What do the police find in his pocket? Skittles," Crump said. "A can of Arizona ice tea in his jacket pocket and Skittles in his front pocket for his brother Chad."

For the last time satop making shit up you moron.

DrJ

I heard there's cold fresh water at the bottom of the Black Sea, suggesting it was once a lake.

Possible, but unlikely unless there is a source of fresh water at the sea bottom. Diffusion and thermal mixing would eliminate the higher salt concentration of the sea water layer. The fresh water layer is otherwise not stable with time.

xbradtc

Sylvia, I can only say you have badly misunderstood what is hearsay, and what is direct evidence.

Ignatz

--Look up hearsay, you might be surprised. Even memos written by the defendant aren't allowed.

The thinking is, you don't know the frame of mind of the person saying or writing it. They could have been joking at the time, or making up a story to impress someone, etc.--

What the hell did I spend that $200,000 on attorneys defending us, when all I needed was to have sylvia buy a copy of Hearsay for Dummies?

Sylvia

Yes, and you morons thought there were NO Skittles and Iced Tea. For days you went on and on about it. What other lies did you swallow form the right wong propganda sites?

Damn Tom you hate it when I post on here. You're afraid I'll blow your cover arent you? Aww, poor thing. I won't tell.

Ignatz

*Why* the hell....

Sylvia

And besides a plastic bag of the stuff could have been put in his hoodie pocket too.

Enlightened

Moron again:

"And no one saw them on concrete"

Because most lacerations on the back of the head are caused by grass.

"You are literally too stupid to insult"

Thank you Hangover.

xbradtc

Yes, and you morons thought there were NO Skittles and Iced Tea. For days you went on and on about it. What other lies did you swallow form the right wong propganda sites?

I've never cared particularly if he had them or not.

It's immaterial to the case.

Sylvia

No one saw them on concrete at the time of the shooting. They were on grass.

And who's to say his injury was caused at that time, and not say five minutes before he saw TM when for example he could have tripped while chasing him. My point is without his testimony, it is not evidence.

Enlightened

Sylvia - Can you just try and comprehend what you read?

1) We never said he did NOT have skittles and tea. We said the POLICE HAVE NOT SAID he had skittles and tea. The police have still not confirmed that.
2) Martin's attorney said there were skittles and tea. The police have still not confirmed that.

Can you comprehend the lowest common denominator of 1 and 2 above? And if you can, how do you get "can of tea, skittles and plastic bag in his hand or can of tea in plastic bag in his pocket"?

Sylvia

Enlightened I got it from Reuters. And I would think what stuff would be found on TM would come from the coroner not the police, I would think. Anyway, I quote Reuters, I would think they have sources.

And no you all said it was there at all. Revisionist history here.

jimmyk

In any case, whatever we said about skittles and tea was tongue-in-cheek, since as xbradtc said, whether or not he was carrying them is irrelevant. At least in my case the "skittles and tea" were just emblematic of the misinformation floating around. And still floating around, at least in sylvia's mind.

Enlightened

"And besides a steaming plastic bag of the stuffshit couldshould be have been put in hisSylvia's tin foil hat hoodie pocket too"

That's about all I can take and I know Clarice is armed and lurking....

Enlightened

Ok one more:

Without waiting for police to arrive, Crump said, Zimmerman confronted Trayvon, who was on the sidewalk near his home. By the time police got there, Trayvon was dead of a single gunshot to the chest.

In my neighborhood, SIDEWALKS are made of CONCRETE.

bgates

Skittles in his front pocket for his brother Chad

What kind of a guy buys Skittles for his brother and then eats them himself, as Wee Davy's Second Sight confirmed happened indisputably?

xbradtc

In my neighborhood, SIDEWALKS are made of CONCRETE.

Oooohhh! Mr. Fancy 1% lording it over us 99%'rs.

Bruce

Sylvia - not sure what state of mind has to do with memos. In any case, it is entirely possible that Zimmerman could not get into evidence the contents of his interview with the police back at the station. But, it is less clear when it comes to his statements while at the crime scene. There, they may be able to argue present sense impression and/or excited utterance. It depends, of course, on what was actually happening at the time.

narciso

Alright 'am I the only not on crazy pills; here who ' that's a rhetorical question,

windansea

will someone with a good scale please weigh a 20 oz can of Arizona tea please, any flavor will do

while you're at it, weigh a bag of skittles too

If the hoodie does not sag the hearsay is in the bag

xbradtc

BTW, Sylvia, under your understanding of hearsay, Zimmermann's own admission to shooting Martin would be inadmissible.

narciso

Meanwhile back at the ranch:


http://netrightdaily.com/2012/04/big-government-is-making-boeing-a-bad-actor/#ixzz1rZ8271NW

narciso

A very cynical gesture on the Russians part;


http://hotair.com/archives/2012/04/09/van-jones-these-libertarians-certainly-are-extreme/

Doc

The density of water is 62.4 lb/cubic foot at 4 degrees celsius. 1 cubic foot equals 957.506 fl ounces. Doing the math for 20 ounces gives you approx 1.3 lbs for a can of water.

I couldn't find the specific gravity(the ratio of the density of a liquid to the density of water) of tea but suffice to say that containing solid tea particles and sugar and being close to freezing(zero degrees Celsius)adds an insignificant amount to the density and therefore, the weight.

MJW
BTW, Sylvia, under your understanding of hearsay, Zimmermann's own admission to shooting Martin would be inadmissible.

In words I never thought I'd say, I believe Sylvia may be right. A police report is hearsay, and a defendant can't have his cake and eat it by taking the 5th, but introducing his uncross-examinable testimony through hearsay. Hearsay statements by a defendant are always admissible against him; hence Zimmermann's own admission to shooting Martin would be admissible by the prosecution.

xbradtc

MJW, then wouldn't the rest of the statement as to the circumstances of self defense be admitted as part and parcel?

I mean, if he said, "I shot him in self defense." you can't just admit the "I shot him..." part and leave the rest out.

bunkerbuster

Cboldt and I agree on one thing, at least: The Martin murder is ``politically useful no matter what.''
If Zimmerman is arrested and tried, the wingnutosphere, Fox and talkradio all end up wearing their caterwauling about probable cause like an imbecile omelet on their faces. If he's found guilty, all that's left of their ``argument'' is the bombastic bigotry, name calling and hallucinations about what is and is not in evidence.
If Zimmerman isn't arrested and the special prosecutor presents to the public a case that is no more compelling than the Sanford PD's, large segments of the country will spend the next few months raging against the miscarriage of justice in which a teenager is shot dead and the event is deemed unworthy of a full investigation, including the autopsy of Martin, drug test for Zimmerman and on and on and on…
Conservatives could respond to this by calmly pointing to the additional investigation done by the special prosecutor and the inevitable absurdity of stand your ground laws in cases like these. But they wouldn't. Instead, they'd respond just as they have already, with a barrage of hateful, classically bigoted characterizations of Afro-Americans, a blast of white-power paranoia about Afro-American political power and "AA hires'' in the news media and a crescendo of conspiracy theories about how only corrupt, insane, evil power mongers would insist that a white man gunning down a 17-year-old Afro-American has to do anything more than say it was self-defense and have someone say they saw the two fighting.
If Zimmerman isn't charged and the special prosecutor does present evidence that the case was investigated as fully as possible under the circumstances, the rage will die out quickly, but conservatives will get no political benefit, because the fact will remain that a special prosecutor was necessary in the first place, because the initial investigation was woefully inadequate and didn't include the autopsy of Martin, drug test for Zimmerman and on and on and on…
Politically, it's win-win-win for liberals and a loss so richly deserved by the identity conservative bigots who are so resentful and intellectually insecure, they can't even learn to dog whistle their hate…

bunkerbuster

Actually: it's win, win, draw, in terms of the politics...

MJW

I think that if the prosecution introduced some of the statement, they'd probably have to allow the full statement, or at least enough to avoid putting it into a false light. If instead they had one of the officers testify that Zimmerman admitted the shooting to him, I don't think they'd have to admit any of the police statement. I'm just speculating, though.

xbradtc

BB.

If Zimmerman isn't charged and the special prosecutor does present evidence that the case was investigated as fully as possible under the circumstances, the rage will die out quickly, but conservatives will get no political benefit,

Here's a fundamental difference in our views. Most folks on the right aren't arguing for Zimmermann for political benefit. We genuinely feel the media circus about this was drummed up. Standing up for the legal rights of an American needs no political benefit. It is the duty of all Americans. There's a balance between granting the state sufficient powers to effectively provide police services, and still protect the rights of the individual. You, however, seem to see this starkly as a matter of either the left wins, or the right wins. While I do believe that there are some on the political left who are exploiting this for their gain, I don't believe the majority of people on either side are doing so.

As to the autopsy, there has been no information released as to how or to what extent the autopsy was performed. However, if FL is like the other 49 states, some post mortem was done in the case of an unnatural death. Just because they haven't released the results to you doesn't mean it didn't happen.

As to drug testing Zimmermann, absent probable cause to believe he was under the influence of drugs or alcohol, the police would not be able to compel a test.

Doc

BB,

That's some impressive wishful thinking.

You forgot to mention the possibility of the SP not charging GZ while finding the Sanford PD's investigation to be sufficient and revealing the exculpatory evidence that hadn't been publicly released yet.

Mark Folkestad

Geez, I'm finding it hard to keep up with all the threads, especially with all the steaming piles of troll crap clogging things up.

One fluid ounce, in the American system, is 1.043 avoirdupois ounces. Whether or not Martin had any Arizona Iced Tea, we don't know if it was in a can or bottle. I can only remember seeing it in a bottle. I can't see how tea or Skittles is pertinent. Those alleged purchases were only brought up by Martin's family to "prove" that he was only innocently returning from the store with goodies. As if the "child" couldn't find something sweet to eat and drink in the house, to avoid a long walk in heavy rain.

Bruce

BTW, Sylvia, under your understanding of hearsay, Zimmermann's own admission to shooting Martin would be inadmissible.

Based on the federal rules (don't know how close Florida tracks them), the prosecution might be able to get Zimmerman's interview in as an admission of a party opponent, and, thus, not actually hearsay. But, that would open them up to the claim of incompleteness, which may let the defense introduce the rest of it, or at least a good chunk of it.

Police reports are hearsay. The problem is that they are rarely called on it. If you have the full rules of evidence available, you can cause them some grief on the stand when they start reading from their reports. There, you actually have double hearsay, with the first hearsay being the report, and the second being their reading of it. So, if you object to their testimony as hearsay, you may be able to talk the judge into not allowing them to read their reports on the stand. What they have to do then, is read their reports, put them down, or have them taken away, and they have to testify based on their memories. They can then ask to see them again to refresh their memories. The idea is that they can refresh their memories as often as necessary, but must testify from memory, and not from their reports directly. Now, lower level courts may sometimes cut corners here to expedite their dockets, knowing, at least in their minds, that cops are always completely honest.

Mark Folkestad

Hey, trolls. Why do you ignore the fact that the Martin-Zimmerman death match was a scuffle between two Democrats? In keeping open minds regarding Zimmerman's innocence, we are supporting a citizen's rights, not a conservative's or a Republican's rights. In Sylvia's other big pet peeve, the Duke lacrosse case, many of us became regulars here because of it, due to our belief in the basic tenets of our judicial system, and we didn't give a damn what party each player identified with or how much money each player's family had. We wanted justice, the same as now.

Danube of Thought

Which witness will testify that GZ approached TM?

Which witness will testify that TM was drinking iced tea?

Which witness will testify that TM was eating Skittles?

MJW

Bruce makes many good points, particularly that the police report could almost certainly not be entered except through the testimony of the officer that prepared the report. Under the federal rules of evidence, statements made by the defendant to a witness aren't considered hearsay, but I'm pretty sure under common law rules of evidence they're considered admissible hearsay. Also, there's an exception for "public records" in the FRE, but it specifically excludes police reports in criminal cases.

Manuel Transmission

Come on you guys. I know the weight issue is a silly distraction, but y'all are making it a lot harder than necessary. I think it was TK way up thread that said "a pint's a pound the world around." The imperial system got us a long way before the froggies messed it up with all those units that have no 'human' perception base units. Being a measurement engineer, I am 'bilingual' in this realm. :) (Teasing DrJ, here.)

Back in the stone age before pocket calculators, if you couldn't define and solve a problem with a pencil and paper and then pick up your slide rule to get an answer to within about two significant figures, you transferred to the business school. The entire space program up at least through Apollo was done that way. And it wasn't until that screwup on Mars a couple decades later that anyone botched a conversion. Primarily, because before that, you had a solid gut calibration about all the numbers.

The point? Rarely does anything need (or actually have) more than two significant digits. So oz's and oz's are all the same with anything f'ing close to water. As soon as you peel back the onion a layer and try to get clever, you run up against stupid stuff that puts you in the weeds like whether the the machine that filled the can (or bottle) was on spec and what was the tolerance on that. Blah, blah ...

To switch topics for a moment, I think the above discussion has a great deal to do with the AGW mess. Most of those clowns pissing our tax money away couldn't find their asses with both hands.

/rant

Nytol

MJW

Now I realize I missed the obvious. In many of the police shows I've seen, the suspect is given a pad of paper, and told to write down what happened. I assume such statements can be entered into evidence by the prosecution, since they, unlike an officer's written report of the suspect's statements, are only one level of hearsay. Do I assume correctly?

Sara (Pal2Pal)

The advertising dept. of a major newspaper [used to be] is a frantic place just before deadline on a Friday afternoon. Ad reps going crazy trying to get all their Sunday copy into the basket with a half dozen callers waiting to be dealt with and not happy. One late Friday afternoon, one of our ad reps suddenly stood up and at the top of his lungs, screamed into his headset, "I can't believe I actually have to get on the Freeway and know you are out there next to me at 70 mph. God save us all!" Needless to say, the whole room of over 100 went deadly silent. Then outrageous laughter followed as we all agreed it was a scary thought. That is how I feel in reading Bunker, DubDave and Sylvia's comments.

bunkerbuster

Given the unrelenting attempts here at JOM to make the Martin murder/shooting case about how scary Afro-American men are, how terribly oppressed white identity conservatives are in America and how awful it is that the most popular news media outlets hire Afro-Americans, it's hilarious that those very same permanently aggrieved victimologists would attempt to fault liberals for reaping the low-hanging political fruit the wingnutosphere has borne in this case...

Sara (Pal2Pal)

Why is this a conservative vs liberal question regarding this case? Zimmerman is a registered Democrat, Martin too young to vote at 17. Where is the politics here? Fox was very much against Zimmerman at first. Judge Jeanine Pirro was quoting all the stuff the Martin family was flooding the airwaves with and taking it all at face value. When did it become conservative vs liberal? I don't get it.

Sylvia, do you really think the testimony of the witness who saw GZ on the sidewalk being beaten by TM is hearsay? And you do realize that it is up to the prosecutor to prove his/her case and not the other way around?

Sara (Pal2Pal)

Given the unrelenting attempts here at JOM to make the Martin murder/shooting case about how scary Afro-American men are, how terribly oppressed white identity conservatives are in America and how awful it is that the most popular news media outlets hire Afro-Americans, it's hilarious that those very same permanently aggrieved victimologists would attempt to fault liberals for reaping the low-hanging political fruit the wingnutosphere has borne in this case...

You have a habit of writing very offensive things, but Bunker this takes the cake. It not only tells one lie after another, it is such a warped and disgusting view, it frightens me to think there might be others out there this twisted.

Sara (Pal2Pal)

Uh oh, the Yankees finally won one thanks to Jeter. :)

bunkerbuster

DoT rhetorizes: ``Which witness will testify that GZ approached TM?''
Perhaps the same one that will testify Martin attacked Zimmerman. We just don't know, do we. Is your point that there are no eyewitnesses? If so, why not just say that? Is that too honest an approach for you?

``Which witness will testify that TM was drinking iced tea?''
Perhaps the same one that will testify Martin threatened to kill Zimmerman.

``Which witness will testify that TM was eating Skittles?''
Perhaps the same one that will testify Zimmerman was walking back to his truck.

Sara (Pal2Pal)

Obama Campaign decides that hawking hoodies during Trayvon controversy is as tawdry as it appears. The sale is off
bunkerbuster

good thing you're not making this about politics, eh Sara?

Adjoran

There is no evidence of any tea or Skittles. Trayvon may have told his father's girlfriend's son that was what he was going for, but there was none at the scene, no receipt, no bag, and no evidence from any of the closest convenience stores of anyone dressed that way making such a purchase in the time frame.

The alleged girlfriend phone call is not considered by the police reports. Somewhere online I saw it reported her timeline didn't match up with the incident, but I can't remember where.

Immunity from civil action isn't dependent on the criminal trial judge's ruling on the use of force unless he grants a motion to dismiss. It's an affirmative defense, and if the jury believes Zimmerman, immunity from tort action would attach.

Sara (Pal2Pal)

Adjoran: I don't think that is the case. I posted a link yesterday from an American Thinker article, where the author called the store, a 7-11 I think, and learned that there is a video of a young black man purchasing tea and skittles. The police subpoenaed the tape.

Sara (Pal2Pal)

good thing you're not making this about politics, eh Sara?

How am I making it about politics? It is your hero Bambi who was going to try to profit with the hoodie sales, not me. I think the whole thing disgusting.

bunkerbuster

Sara: did it occur to you to check whether Obama's been selling hoodies with his name on them for a decade or so? Obviously not.
Now go sit in the corner and wear the dunce cap...

Sara (Pal2Pal)

It isn't how long he is been selling, Bunker. The news is that he has stopped. That amazes me, since he has done everything he reasonably can to blow this case up into some race war.

cboldt

AFAIK, the White House is still selling hoodies. The tacky step was marking the price down after Martin committed aggravated assault against Zimmerman. As though the public would appreciate a commemoration of indiscriminate violence.

Sara (Pal2Pal)

Figures.

Danube of Thought

"the rage will die out quickly, but conservatives will get no political benefit,"

We seek none.

Danube of Thought

"Perhaps the same one that will testify Martin attacked Zimmerman."

That could be Zimmerman, depending on what prosecution evidence comes in. The eyewitness who saw Martin straddling Zimmerman while the latter yelled for help would strongly support the inference that Martin was the attacker, as would the fact that Zimmerman was aware that the police were enroute, whereas Martin was not.

No one will testify that Zimmerman attacked Martin.

Danube of Thought

"Perhaps the same one that will testify Martin threatened to kill Zimmerman."

That will be Zimmerman, if necessary. No one will give contradictory testimony.

cboldt

Speaking for myself, I'd like to obtain the political benefit of thoroughly discrediting the press; and perhaps witness Zimmerman exacting money damages for the trouble they caused him through their persistent fictionalized reporting.

The comments to this entry are closed.

Wilson/Plame