We Had To Tax The Retirement Plan In Order To Save It

Duncan (He can't be Sirius) Black, the econ degree holder formerly known as Atrios, explains in USA Today that baby boomers face a retirement crisis which can only be solved by raising both taxes and Social Security benefits. Really:

Recent and near-retirees, the first major cohort of the 401(k) era, do not have nearly enough in retirement savings to even come close to maintaining their current lifestyles.

We need an across the board increase in Social Security retirement benefits of 20% or more. We need it to happen right now, even if that means raising taxes on high incomes or removing the salary cap in Social Security taxes.

People want need (!) a more generous retirement plan and they want need someone else to pay for it! Hmm, one might have thought that means-testing of Social Security benefits would tie in here somewhere, if Social Security is really going to be re-imagined as a full welfare program for the elderly. And I assume that even though the cap on taxable earning may be removed, the cap on benefits will not be.

Fuzzy math is a key part of the argument:

According to the Center for Retirement Research at Boston College, the median household retirement account balance in 2010 for workers between the ages of 55-64 was just $120,000. For people expecting to retire at around age 65, and to live for another 15 years or more, this will provide for only a trivial supplement to Social Security benefits.

Hmm. Assuming a zero real return, $150,000 spent evenly over fifteen years is $8,000 per year. And what are Social Security benefits?

And that's for people who actually have a retirement account of some kind. A third of households do not. For these people, their sole retirement income, aside from potential aid from friends and family, comes from Social Security, for which the current average monthly benefit is $1,230.

Well, $1,230 per month is about $14,760 per year. Is $8,000 really a "trivial" supplement to that amount? Would $8,000 be a "trivial" supplement to double that amount, i.e., $30,000 per year? I encourage folks who think so to make a trivial donation here.

Moving the goalposts on the objective of Social Security is also part of the 'logic':

If the consensus is that we need policies in place to ensure that the vast majority of people have at least a comfortable retirement, then we need to adjust our current failing policies. Expecting people to save sufficiently for their retirement, even if those savings are subsidized by our tax code, is unrealistic.

"At least a comfortable retirement"? The long-stated goal of Social Security is to keep the elderly out of poverty, not necessarily living in comfort. Let's flash back to 1939:

"It is impossible under any social insurance system to provide ideal security for every individual. The practical objective is to pay benefits that provide a minimum degree of social security—as a basis upon which the worker, through his own efforts, will have a better chance to provide adequately for his individual security." -- From the Report of the Social Security Board recommending the changes which were embodied in the 1939 Amendments.

In other words, if people want comfort, they can get it on their own dime.

Finally, we are treated to a long exposition explaining that college grads and advanced degree holders are burdened with debt, so how can anyone be expected to save for their own retirement? The suggested answer is to raise taxes on someone else.

One might think that focusing on policies that promoted growth and employment would be the way to secure our future, but evidently, taxing the rich is the only way forward. In Atrios' world.

To be fair, this is a dreadful time to be retiring, with both housing prices and 401(k)s wiped out by the Great Recession. But raising Social Security benefits and taxes indiscriminately and forever is an overreaction, and a misdirected one.

Comments

[maryrose]

I love how Rand Paul tells it like it is. There is a lot of the old man in him. People are shocked because they are so unused to hearing the truth.

[NK]

TC-- yes since WeatherChannel and AccuWeather went show biz, there is the huge hype factor these days.

[henry]

were you in Ct in 78 or 79 for those big dumps?

Yes to both. Excellent skitching and snowball fights.

[hit and run]

I was out all day yesterday, and The List is not happy with me for bringing this a day late.

HAPPY BIRTHDAY JIB!!!

[Manuel Transmission]

NK, I worked on a test site at the mouth of the little river below South Lyme right on the shore the year before. It was so cold that ice was sloshing on the little beach along the tracks. We were supposed to do a repeat the next year, but were snowed in back in Cowlumbus. Our new home there had drifts up to the eaves.

[sbwaters]

NK, I might not have published the location of the Drone base, either, and I don't get penny from Saudi Arabia.

That is not to say I wouldn't accept a visit from Saudi authorities. Heck, we even hosted people from Florida.

That drone attacks occurred is news. Where the base is located may become news, but it is not necessarily so.

"The public's right to know" is a phrase those who want something use to bamboozle you.

[maryrose]

TC:
I agree. People are bored and want some weather excitement. The worst ones always catch us by surprise. I laughed at a recent article describing the corridor from hell between Buffalo and Cleveland that cuts through Erie ,Pennsylvania. Every skier knows that on Kissing Bridge, Holiday Valley and Peek-N Peak trips you run the risk of the great "white out". Dunkirk and Fredonia are the worst areas and many a hardy soul has been forced into a motel until the next day.Winter can be brutal, but it is lovely to look at and behold.

[maryrose]

JIB:
Happy Birthday to one of my favorite JOM posters. I hope you had a wonderful day with Frederick{who looked darling in that St. Nick costume} and the rest of your lovely family.

[rse]

henry & nk-

My college roommate in 78 and 79 was from Cumberland, RI. Her parents sent pictures of having to exit the house through second story windows.

HB JIB!

[maryrose]

sbw:
Obama tries to hide everything to make himself look better and hide who he really is. You guys may laugh at TK but eventually we are going to see those Occidental records and his phony papers will be exposed. Even on Benghazi, no matter how much money they were paid or how mant threats were issued,that many people with a secret can't keep quiet forever.
speaking of great new shows;try "The Americans" at 10:00pm on Weds. on FX. About 2 KGB soviet spies in the 70's A husband and wife team. Shades of 24 for excitement.

[Jane: Mock the Media]

OH Wow JIB, we missed your birthday.

So tell us all about it!

[jimmyk]

There is a lot of the old man in him.

I like what I've seen, but I hope there's not too much of the old man in him, i.e. the wacky isolationist antisemitic part.

[Thomas Collins]

Happy Birthday plus one, JiB!

[sbwaters]

maryrose: Obama tries to hide everything to make himself look better and hide who he really is.

I quite agree about the nefarious Obama.

There is quite enough to criticize those who pass themselves off as journalists without reducing the head of steam talking about where drones land and take off.

[jimmyk]

I was in MA for the blizzard of '78. As I recall, it should have been the downfall of Dukakis, as he was harshly condemned for his handling of it, including the fact that he more or less declared martial law for a week. Unfortunately, or perhaps fortunately, he came back to resounding defeat and embarrassment against Ronaldus Maximus.

[sbwaters]

Hey, JIB! Happy birthday!

[matt]

Happy Birthday, JiB!

[Captain Hate]

I was surprised that Greta was involved in Scientology too. Although, according to book, once in its very hard to leave.

Like most cults.

[maryrose]

jimmyk:
I recall in 78 getting a week off of school because of the cold and blizzard -like conditions.
As for transparency, I say we need to know as much as possible in order to determine if the War on Terror is effectively being waged. Hiding info just weakens our high alert mentality. This is the discussion we should be having. Not dumb guns and fear mongering about sequester. I notice all folks are reminding people that sequester was a Bammy creation.Good for them.Stay strong republicans. This is our moment to actually get spending cuts.

[Threadkiller]

Even TK laughs at TK, maryrose. :-)

Happy Birthday JIB!

HR 444 REQUIRE A PLAN ACT House Chamber, Washington, D.C. February 6, 2013

Mr. Speaker:

A family that earns $27,000, but spends $36,000 and has run up a credit card debt of $165,000 is on the brink of financial ruin. Proportionally, that’s exactly where our federal government is today.

If that family were to see a credit counselor, the first thing he’s going to tell them is, “We have to sit down and draw up a budget.”

That family’s going to have to make some difficult choices. It may take several years to work its way back to solvency.

But our Senate has not passed a budget in nearly four years and our President has offered only entirely un-serious budgets that continue to spend recklessly and never balance.

This bill simply requires that if the President can’t balance the budget this year, he tells us how long it will take and what needs to be done to do so.

We would expect that from any family. We should demand it from our government.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jvpwLISxgNE

[AliceH]

Just to say it, that Rand Paul video is "old" - it was uploaded to Youtube on Mar 10, 2011.

Also - HB JIB!

[centralcal]

Happiest of birthdays, JIB!

Greta a Scientologist? Good grief!

[Threadkiller]

http://obamareleaseyourrecords.blogspot.com/2013/02/obama-addresses-fellow-kenyans.html

[NK]

The '79 Blizzard hit Baltimore, then clipped southern jersey eastern LI, and SE Ct/RI. not nearly as widespread as '78, and not nearly as many people affected, but in my college town everything shut down for a day, then quickly melted. On the Blizzard day, we dove off the third floor dorm rooms into the 10-15 ft snow banks that were higher than the 1st floor windows. When that snow bank was trashed, one young man moved to a different bank and dove in. The Steel dumpster was in that drift. Severely broken leg-- the ambulance corps made up a splint and we rigged up a sled and dragged him 4 miles to a local hospital because the local roads were impassable, and the University Hospital was out-- for obvious reasons. He was admitted and the ER took pity on us and didn't call the cops. Ah, good times, good times.

[NK]

Happy Birthday JiB!!

[marlene]

Happy Birthday,JiB!
Re: the snowstorm.I've lived in NH/Maine all my life and can't remember such hype about the weather.
Re:Richard III... British historical novels are my guilty pleasure and I've been reading about the Wars of the Roses.Now that was a family feud!
Henry Tudor married Elizabeth of York and she held deep bitterness for her uncle Richard killing her young brothers,the princes in the tower. So the Tudors were never going to give Richard III any historical forgiveness.

[Dave (in MA)]

'78 was different because it was 2'+ on top of almost another 2' that we got about 10 days earlier and hadn't melted.

[AliceH]

I think it was the winter of '80/'81 that had the hugest monster snowfall in Wisconsin. I was elsewhere that year, but my parents mailed a photo to me. It was completely white, but they added arrows noting "this is the mail box", "this is the car", "this is the house". Heh.

[henry]

Happy Birthday JIB!

[pagar]

Happy Birthday plus 1, JiB!

[NK]

'79 Storm-- President's Day: this website has a sat photo-- sneaky storm, clipped NY City, but Eastern LI and RI got hammered. Upstate NY and Central NE probably only got flurries. jack may remember this if he was in Southampton.

[AliceH]

maybe it was '81/'82? Dunno. I don't have "weather memory".

[Dave (in MA)]

Excellent skitching and snowball fights.

I never heard that term before. I looked it up and apparently it was what we knew as "skidhopping".

[Jim Eagle]

Dank u hier aan allen.

Thanks to all here. Nothing special yesterday. Chicken Cordon Bleau, Tortellinis and Carvel Ice Cream cake. Some Billecart-Salmon to wash it all down. Then a couple of episodes of Dad's Army before bed:)

We went to a Mardi Gras Buffet Dinner the evening before and all that great Cajun food (Oysters Bienville, Etouffe, Crawfish pie, Jambalaya and Gumbo) was just so filling we couldn't conspire to do anything but something simple last night.

Here is something from DeStandaard in Antwerp to put a smile on your face. "A Surprise Birth at Antwerp Zoo". A beautiful Simian mother and new born. Worth the visit.

Its a mutslanggoer, which even Mrs. JiB has no idea what that is but it has something to do with snakes since slang is Flemish for snake.

[NK]

daveinMa-- '78 down on the Coast-- we had 15" in the first storm THEN the next week an ice and rain storm that melted and refroze everything, then another week later that 2FT Blizzard. Wild.

[Rob Crawford]

I recall in 78 getting a week off of school because of the cold and blizzard -like conditions.

That winter there was ice in the dog's water dish -- in the kitchen.

Pipes froze. But that happened something like every other winter; our house predated the Civil War.

Bottles of Pepsi froze and cracked in the laundry room.

In '79 there was more ice than snow, at least to my recollection. That is admittedly shaded, as that winter I had both of my feet in casts, and my mother had to help me navigate a sheet of ice between the car and our front door when I got back from the hospital.

[NK]

Link to '79 Storm: http://www.hurricanes-blizzards-noreasters.com/79blizzard.html

[Dave (in MA)]

I wonder if Mini-Me has picked out his sweaters yet?

[sbwaters]

Back in my day we had the blizzard of '66.

[NK]

January '78 the Midwest cold wave made the front page of the NYT. The St Lawrence Seaway froze over, and Great Lakes shipping was frozen in port.

[Captain Hate]

There was a blizzard in Cleveland, I forget what year it was except basing it on where I was living, it had to be in the middle 70s; it was January 77 at the latest. Anyway it wasn't so much the snow as the wind which sounded like a giant vacuum cleaner outside.

Btw, did any of you guys know that Herman Caine has a talk radio show? He sounds ok but definitely not like a credible Presidential candidate. But not as bad as the JEF...

[Rob Crawford]

The press is covering up another leftist terror campaign:

News regurgitator Bill Handel is reporting on the KFI radio show that news outlets have been specifically told to post a “redacted” version of the manifesto, in order to protect the names of the police men and women targeted by the murderer – I will replace that portion with police names with the redacted version to protect them. However, it must be noted that the redacted version ALSO doesn’t have the Obama and liberal references.

The guy's murdered three people already, threatens more murders, and his "manifesto" reads like dublindave's diary.

LUN

[hit and run]

Jan 1, 1979. Dallas was in the midst of one its worst ice storms. Cotton Bowl. Joe Montana rallying ND for the win.

I obviously didn't know the future mrs hit and run then, but her parents went to the game, sat through the whole thing, and then drove back to Austin on an ice rink doubling as I-35, in a car without heat. I bet I've heard that story a couple dozen times . . . each time as if it had never been told before.

[NK]

Midwest Coldwave was January '77.. pardon.

[Jim Eagle]

In '79 I was in Midland Michigan working on the Nuke there.

But from '75 to '79 I was in Marquette MIchigan and all the talk about snow and how much doesn't even come close to that experience. I had been stationed there from '66 to '68 and can remember how the cars all had extra long antennae with red painted tennis balls on the top. This way when you pulled up to a stop sign you could look over the drifts to see if there was someone next to you.

In '75, it started to snow heavily the end of September and we never saw green grass again until the first of April. That year we got something like 156 inches (all lake effect of course). But that was nothing. Up in the Kewanaw Peninsula in a little town/city of Calumet they don't even bother to shovel the sidewalks. The tunnel through the banks, shutter the inside walls and ceilings with old wood doors and just keep on walking. Some of the houses have two front doors, one just above the other. When the snow gets piled up high enough they just start using the upper door.

Another reason I live in Florida and have no regrets:)

[Captain Hate]

HB JiB.

Yes January 77 was as cold as a lawyer's heart. I think it reached -15 F in Cleveland.

[Jane: Mock the Media]

I was working at my first post college job in '78. We were out of work for 8 days because of the storm and I was scared to death my employer wouldn't pay us and I wouldn't be able to pay my rent. I think I was making $7400 a year.

[Captain Hate]

JiB, plus in the UP you have very little sunlight in the winter. Quite the location for a liver enlargement program.

[hit and run]

All the horror stories of winters in the 70s.

Thank Gaia for global warming.

[marlene]

We lived in northern Maine for 30 years,so the winters are a blur of snow,ice and bitter cold. In 1998 there was a terrible ice storm in central Maine. The ice storm had less impact on northern Maine,but a couple of weeks later I had to drive in a snowstorm to NH for my grandmother's funeral. White knuckle driving all the way!

[AliceH]

On the other hand, early last week here it was 70 degrees. Today it will be 63 degrees. In between we had an inch of snow, and inch of ice, and a high temp in the teens.

I've lived in MO longer than I lived in WI, and yet every winter here, with 3 months of constant wildly and rapidly shifting temps, still disorients me. I'd rather have winter be winter. But brief.

[Jane: Mock the Media]

Amy just called and said every gas station in town has a line out to the street. The grocery stores were adding extra help. Everyone is hunkering down.

[Jim Eagle]

CH,

Those 'youpers' are a hardy breed. Go everywhere on their snow machine (if bars and honky-tonks are known as everywhere:). I think they drink more brandy per capita than anywhere else in America. All they talk about is ice fishing, deer season (both the in and out kind) and hockey.

I was there when the Edmund Fitzgerald went down in 75. That evening it was blowing big time. The waves on Lake Superior were crashing across Lake Shore Blvd. to the point they had to shut the road down stranding me at the plant overnight. Then we woke to the news of the sinking. Not suprised at all.

[henry]

Dave, I first heard the term from a hockey player (from Worcester) as he grabbed a bumper. Funniest was a football player who grabbed the bumper of an oil delivery truck -- it had great traction and sped off at high speed. ; )

[Jane: Mock the Media]

Defense Secretary Leon Panetta testified this morning on Capitol Hill that President Barack Obama was absent the night four Americans were murdered in Benghazi on September 11, 2012:Panetta said that Obama left operational details, including knowledge of what resources were available to help the Americans under siege, "up to us."

In fact, Panetta says that the night of 9/11, he did not communicate with a single person at the White House. The attack resulted in the deaths of four Americans, including Ambassador Chris Stevens.

Panetta said that, save their 5 o'clock prescheduled meeting with the president the day of September 11, Obama did not call or communicate in anyway with the defense secretary that day. There were no calls about what was going on in Benghazi. He never called to check-in.

[NK]

henry-- you Yalies and your Booola Booola hijinks! Had the "Whale" hockey rink opened when you were there?

[Jane: Mock the Media]

Neither the secretary of defense nor the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff spoke to the secretary of state during the 8-hour attack on the U.S. consulate in Benghazi, Libya on September 11, 2012. At a Thursday hearing in the Senate, Republican Ted Cruz asked both Leon Panetta and Martin Dempsey, "In between 9:42 p.m., Benghazi time, when the first attacks started, and 5:15 am, when Mr. Doherty and Mr. Woods lost their lives, what converations did either of you have with Secretary Clinton?"

"We did not have any conversations with Secretary Clinton," Panetta responded.

~ We are in the best of hands.

[Ignatz Ratzkywatzky]

--All the horror stories of winters in the 70s.--

They were largely the result of a giant high pressure ridge which parked itself over California and pushed the winter storms into Canada and then down into the eastern US.

Our 70's winters are remembered for record droughts and temperatures approaching 80 in January.

[marlene]

There was one snicker inducing moment during the Maine ice storm of 1998.Al Gore came to survey the damage and was photographed picking up a downed power line.That photo was on the front page of every Maine newspaper.The utility companies and state officials had implored people to stay away from the snapped utility poles,wires and trees. What an idiot.

[NK]

Barry the Absent-- WTF-- his people are killed -- he never calls in! Then he lies his ass off about what happened in Benghazi! Cold hearted bastard-- what an anti-American POS he is.

[jimmyk]

Henry Tudor married Elizabeth of York and she held deep bitterness for her uncle Richard killing her young brothers,the princes in the tower.

Except that many historians argue Richard didn't kill them, and that this was a myth perpetrated by the Tudors, who were concerned about maintaining their power.

[glasater]

Re Brent Bozell whom I admire greatly, is planning to pressure Mitch Mcconnell or blackmail the guy into Bozell's so-called idea or definition of good behavior by threatening to primary the Senator there in Kentucky.
That doesn't seem like a good plan to me. Mitch has been a wonderful operator thwarting Reid and Zero to my thinking...

[NK]

JimmyK-- will you be my go to guy for any 15th century English history questions?

[glasater]

Believe it was Porch who pointed out a modern day mystery novel based on that premise jimmyk but cannot remember the title.

[Jim Eagle]

marlene,

Just in case you're curious .here is a good read on jimmyk's 1:09 about the "Princes" and Richard III.

[NK]

The Storm-- here's Accu's Joe Lundberg's bottom line:

"In short, not everything is written in stone with the storm. If you want a crippling snowstorm, though, the best place to be is probably interior eastern Connecticut, interior Rhode Island and eastern Massachusetts, perhaps up to southern Maine. Most of those areas SHOULD get at least a foot of snow, and some areas may double that when all is said and done. The most likely places for more than 2 feet would be eastern Massachusetts and Rhode Island into northeastern Connecticut, but it doesn't exclude others. I think in the end it may fall a little shy of the 1978 storm, but it will be a close rival for most." Get ready Jane and TC!

[Chubby]

What difference does it make now?

... it only made a difference before the election.

I can just hear them scheming before the election: if we can just stonewall this issue past the election, then it won't make any difference

[pagar]

""We did not have any conversations with Secretary Clinton," Panetta responded."

Is there any one in the Obama regime that actually acted like they cared about those Americans killed in Benghazi while they were alive?

[henry]

Had the "Whale" hockey rink opened when you were there?

yes. Some friends tried to talk me into intramural hockey there, but I reminded them that even with a stick to lean on skating was not possible.

[Chubby]

((In fact, Panetta says that the night of 9/11, he did not communicate with a single person at the White House. The attack resulted in the deaths of four Americans, including Ambassador Chris Stevens))

and during the campaign Obama said over and over again, that as soon he heard about the situation he instructed all possible resources to be made available. So when did he hear about it

[Janet]

Happy Birthday, JiB! Lots of love to you1

Boy, Jane's Benghazi links are something....

[Manuel Transmission]

I was there when the Edmund Fitzgerald went down in 75

One of my buds was a seaman on the EF in the early '70s. It scared him so much he bailed in 74 and went to law school. To this day he thanks his lucky stars.

[marlene]

Ha,Chubby,I thought you meant the princes in the tower.(what difference does it make now?)
jimmyk and JiB, the premise of one of the novels I read is that there could have been other plots against the princes in the tower.The Yorks and the Lancasters put the "fun" in dysfunctional families.

[NK]

Barry-- has lied his ass off about everything Benghazi since 9/11-- who the Jihadis were, what happened, what he did. Clearly, he was chooming in Vegas and knew nothing on 9/11-12, and has been lying about everything ever since.

[derwill]

This administration is beyond incompetent--they're like characters in a Monty Python skit. The next four years should be fun to watch as they bumble about and end up collapsing the world economy and starting WWIII. And what's truly sad is that those leading the GOP are just marginally better.

[jimmyk]

"JimmyK-- will you be my go to guy for any 15th century English history questions?"

If you like, NK--I know as much about it as Chuck Hagel knows about defense.

[Captain Hate]

Mitch has been a wonderful operator thwarting Reid and Zero to my thinking...

I've been almost a lone moron @ AoS who's defended McConnell for the reason you mention. I think he's done a far better job as minority leader than Boehner has done as the Speaker of the House.

[Captain Hate]

Is there any one in the Obama regime that actually acted like they cared about those Americans killed in Benghazi while they were alive?

This is the one thing that's been sadly lacking from any accounting by these apparatchiks. Maybe the JEF and Rodham figured that since they blamed it on a video and invited Powell when the coffins returned that those humanitarian acts made them immune from any criticism of not caring about the people who were in the coffins.

[NK]

derwill-- this Benghazi thing is orders of magnitude worse than incompetent-- it's monstrous;

CaptH-- I agree with that-- McConnell has been better using his Senate minority than Boehner has used the majority in the House, particularly 2009-2010 when Mcconnell was at bare filibuster minority.

[Jane: Mock the Media]

The way Congress gathers information - in 5 minute segments is as inefficient as humanly possible - and probably by design.

[NK]

HildaBeast and JEF used Powell like a merkin at Andrews AFB in front of those flag draped coffins. Powell should be ashamed of himslf-- he isn't-- but he should be.

[Captain Hate]

NK, whenever Reid would start supporting the JEF's lies about his "Jobs Bill" and why Congress wouldn't hold a vote for it, McConnell called his bluff every time.

[marlene]

The Bangor Daily News informs me that they use National Weather Service information,so they won't be using a name for the storm.The Weather Channel names storms,FYI...this one is Nemo.The Weather Channel list of storm names that weren't used included Gandolf,Khan and Draco.

[Porchlight]

jimmyk, glasater,

The Daughter of Time by Josephine Tey is the mystery novel based on Richard the III. The story concerns a modern detective who is laid up after an injury and out of boredom, begins researching the Richard III story. It was written back in the early 1950s but is still fresh as a daisy.

http://www.amazon.com/The-Daughter-Time-Josephine-Tey/dp/0684803860

This and two of Tey's other novels (Brat Farrar and The Franchise Affair) rank in my top ten mystery novels of all time. They're that good.

Not much has been written about Tey, but in my estimation she must have been a closet conservative. This comes out especially in The Franchise Affair where there is some political content. She was involved in the theatre and ran in lefty circles so that's why I think she kept her views so private.

[glasater]

That's the book and many thanks for getting the title and author 'cause I sure couldn't begin to remember enough to do a search, Porch.

Did read the book "Daughter of Time" at your recommendation and it is wonderful! Will keep it in the stack for a re-read.

Happy Birthday, JIB. My wine recommendation for you that is a good, gulpable, red wine blend called Hot to Trot by a winery named 14 Hands. Horse theme there and very reasonably priced.

[bgates]

There was one snicker inducing moment during the Maine ice storm of 1998.Al Gore came to survey the damage and was photographed picking up a downed power line.That photo was on the front page of every Maine newspaper.The utility companies and state officials had implored people to stay away from the snapped utility poles,wires and trees. What an idiot.

Come 2000, Gore beat Bush in Maine 319,951-286,616. So.

I'd like to fault all these Dems for their stupidity, but they're all billionaires, so it seems to be working for them.

[Porchlight]

Welcome, glasater! I'm glad you liked it. I'm fixing to reread it soon after all this Richard III talk. :)

[Manuel Transmission]

a good, gulpable, red wine blend called Hot to Trot by a winery named 14 Hands

We swill that stuff out here on our rock all the time. Good call glasater.

[glasater]

Thanks, MT. There's another Walla Walla wine called Radius that's a red blend and is very good also and priced right.

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