Give It To The Jury

The defense rests in the show trial of the Fabulous Fabrice, the Goldman Sachs scapegoat for all the evils of the mortgage-backed securities and derivatives market.

Mr. Tourre’s legal team was visibly upbeat on Friday after Mr. Tourre finished testifying. They felt they had successfully portrayed their client as a junior cog in the Goldman machine, one of several thousand vice presidents at the big Wall Street firm and hardly the villain the S.E.C. has tried to portray him as.

The blushing virgins at aggrieved investor ACA weary me:

ACA executives have testified that had they known that the hedge fund was betting against the trade, they would not have invested in it.

However...

While Mr. Tourre was not part of Ms. Kreitman’s call with Ms. Schwartz, the S.E.C. has suggested that Mr. Tourre gave Ms. Kreitman the wrong impression about Paulson & Company’s intentions.

Four days later, ACA met with representatives of Paulson & Company and Goldman, including Mr. Tourre. Paolo Pellegrini, a senior executive at Paulson & Company, testified he told ACA at that meeting that his hedge fund was betting the housing market would crash and that it wanted the trade in question to fail.

“That was the purpose of the meeting,” he told jurors.

While helpful to Mr. Tourre, Mr. Pellegrini was an argumentative witness and in previous S.E.C. testimony has said he could not remember what was said at various meetings. That may undercut his credibility.

Even after meeting with a representative of Paulson the ACA team couldn't figure out which way around Paulson was? Either the Paulson rep was lying in the meeting (and why isn't he indicted?) or the ACA people just didn't make an effort to pin this down, and only decided the information was material when it gave them leverage in a lawsuit.

I could see the jury deciding that they're all guilty so let's convict Tourre. Or they could decide they are all guilty, so why single out Tourre?

I implore the SEC prosecutors - stage better show trials.

Comments

[narciso]

They didn't get slapped with a 'Failure to Supervise' like SAC Capital, who did they pay off.

[bgates]

had they known that the hedge fund was betting against the trade

It's not my field, but isn't making a trade while simultaneously betting against it known as "hedging"? Did the ACA think they were doing business with a lawn care company?

[NK]

MBS show trials?: if Frank Raines and Jamie Gorelick aren't defendants, I'm not interested.

[narciso]

'Shirley, you can't be serious,' NK.

[matt]

Goldman is the most corrupt company on Wall Street simply by their very nature. SecTres is a second tier management position and they have hundreds of Clarence Beeks on staff.

The operating philosophy is to game every trade and deal. I would actually prefer in some ways that they run our import export sector as they could outsmart the Chinese and the Koreans.

They're so lawyered up and lobbied up that they pretty much own the world.

[Army of Davids]

no sympathy here for ACA

institutional clients should do their own due diligence. This isn't a mom and pop investor we are talking about.

In the end it is the quality of the investment that matters. Not that Paulson was on the other side of the trade.

If there was no obvious misrepresentation of the actual investment the case should be thrown out of court and ACA should have to eat the loss for not doing its own due diligence.

There were plenty of people who saw the housing bubble for what it was. That ACA didn't and Paulson did is immaterial. That Paulson played a roll in the packaging of Abacus does not change the actual investment.

[jimmyk]

From the article:

ACA executives have testified that had they known that the hedge fund was betting against the trade, they would not have invested in it.

Do they have any evidence of that? Or is this more like next-day regrets and embarrassment followed by a date rape charge?

“I wasn’t trying to confuse anybody, it just wasn’t accurate at the time,” Mr. Tourre, who was called as a witness for the S.E.C., told jurors during one of the most damaging statements of his testimony. He quickly followed up with documents he felt should have corrected their impression, but jurors heard it did not.

I don't understand that last statement. ACA claimed the documents didn't correct their impression? Whose fault is that?

I don't really disagree with Matt about Goldman, but these are not widows and orphans complaining. They should take responsibility for their bad trades. Every derivative has someone on the other side betting the other way.

[glasater]

Exactly right, jimmyk.

And on the SAC hedge fund confugalty that narciso referenced - Maria Bartiromo intimated on a show the other day that the S.E.C. might be going after Steve Cohen because he's a conservative and supported Mitt.

But not word one regarding Corzine.

[narciso]

A travesty of two mockeries of a sham:

http://porzioproperty.pbnlaw.com/2011/06/fabulous-fab-still-the-only-target-of-sec-investigation-into-goldman-sachs-mortgage-trading-operatio.html

[maryrose]

I bet Turbo Timmy has loads of info about what was happening at the time this went down. I agree with NK. Raines and Gorelick are getting a pass here.

[narciso]

I had to go far back;

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-03-23/goldman-s-tourre-travels-to-rwanda-while-awaiting-trial.html

[NK]

Agree with jimmyk and AoD about the ACA trades.

TomM-- is it raining at your vacation spot? lots of posts!

[NK]

Corzine and Raines/Gorelick never indicted, and we get GS/SAC show trials-- if there were ever a question that this is the most immoral DOJ since RFK ran the joint....

[narciso]

So why wasn't Pellegrini indicted.

[NK]

2 miles uptown from Mon. Tourre's trial, an appellate court upholds the large soda ban. Suck on that Bloomie. I am quite surprised, for 4 years I can't win a case in that court against any government regulation: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-07-30/ruling-striking-new-york-large-soda-limits-upheld.html

[jimmyk]

I think you left out a word there, NK. It upheld the block of the ban. Good news.

[Captain Hate]

Those courts just don't recognize the benefits of the paternalism of Nanny.

[narciso]

I don't get it, do we need a decoder ring;

http://dealbreaker.com/tag/paolo-pellegrini/

[NK]

jimmyk-- thanks yes-- the INJUNCTION AGAINST Bloomie's ban is upheld on appeal.
Yes, courts rolling back NannyState rules is always good. But why is it that only rational rules get rolled back? The cost to Taxpayers from welfare/medicaid/SNAP types using foodstamps to but 40oz Dr Peppers and Cuban Pork sandwiches is huge, both for the direct food subsidy and the Medicaid cost for diabetes and high blood pressure treatment. But ideological anti-fracking and other anti-business rules are never rolled back. Sigh.

[NK]

The Dems can and will be beaten by conservative Pols waving the "Detroit" banner. Obamanomics = Detroit. Run on that platform and win. http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2013/07/29/why-obama-doesnt-dare-speak-about-detroit/

[narciso]

It is no business of any mayor to ban foodstuffs, what part of that do you miss.

[MarkO]

Why does Gorelick always get a pass? Does she know something?

[Porchlight]

Does she know something?

With her being a Clintonista of long standing, I would imagine so.

[Captain Hate]

SMOD may be on the way!

Chunk of Sun Headed Toward Earth at 2 Million Miles an Hour http://foxnewsinsider.com/2013/07/30/chunk-sun-headed-toward-earth-2-million-miles-hour

[NK]

Strangely enough a not so bright trial judge and the uselesss Appellate Division First Dept got this right. This is a State Legislature health and safety issue, not a Mayoral pet peeve-- so the courts were right to enjoin Bloomie. That said, I am not happy to grossly subsidize the medical costs for medicaid/SNAP types which result from them scarfing down 40 Oz Dr Peppers and Mountain Dews.

[NK]

Gorelick?-- she's a Capo de Regime of the Dem gangster organization. Untouchable to the current DOJ.

[narciso]

I think he's just teasing;

http://www.foxnews.com/science/2013/07/29/spacecraft-sees-giant-hole-in-sun/

[MarkO]

I think Gorelick is personally responsible for 9-11 and that Sandy Berger destroyed that evidence.

Remember, JFK head shot from the sewer.

[jimmyk]

"That said, I am not happy to grossly subsidize the medical costs for medicaid/SNAP types which result from them scarfing down 40 Oz Dr Peppers and Mountain Dews."

NK, there are about five embedded assumptions in that statement that range from questionable to dubious. I leave them as exercises for the reader.

[matt]

here in California there is a foie gras mafia now. Not that I eat it very often, but the state banned it because it was such torture of the geese. They're nasty creatures and as far as I'm concerned I could care less.

But the fois gras foodies need their fix, and so a number of restauranteurs are defying the ban.

Personally, I am deeply opposed to the Ag Department's ban on cured European sausages and cheeses. They are actually busting chefs who dare to bring in some of these life sustaining products.

[Porchlight]

matt,

The funny thing is that the foodies, who mostly lean left, are still blaming the Bush administration for the crimes against foodies perpetuated by the current admin's Ag Dept.

[James D.]

I just got back from a mini JOM meetup. I spent an hour with the lovely and vivacious (and witty, and bubbly, and...well, you get the idea) Janet.

It was good to finally meet at least one fellow JOMer in "real life" - we actually live within walking distance of each other, as it turns out.

[Porchlight]

Perpetuated s/b perpetrated, sorry.

[narciso]

Wait what, are they trying to start a trade war?

[Porchlight]

That's great, James D. and Janet. I love hearing about JOM meetups!

[MarkO]

Manning not guilty of aiding the enemy.

[lyle]

Here, you stupid rubes:

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/07/30/govt-knows-best-white-house-creates-nudge-squad-to-shape-behavior/

You're welcome. Here's what the guv thinks about you:

"I don't know who those people are who would not want such a program, but they must either be misinformed or misguided," he said.

"The goal is to improve the efficiency and effectiveness of government by using scientifically collected evidence to inform policy designs. What is the alternative? The only alternatives I know are hunches, tradition, and ideology (either left or right.)"

I think he omitted mentioning free will but you get the idea.

Again, you're welcome.

[pagar]

"But not word one regarding Corzine."

It really seems to me that nothing being done about Corzine ought to rank close to the top of things that are currently wrong with the financial world.

[jimmyk]

The only entity that needs nudging is the government itself. Well, more like a swift kick in the a**.

[Porchlight]

Manning guilty on all other counts; acquitted only on aiding the enemy.

[twin falls]

On the 'aiding'; a lot of Journos are feeling better.

[pagar]

"Manning not guilty of aiding the enemy."

Meanwhile, John Kerry still holds an important Obama regime post. Isn't this a great country?

[MarkO]

If Obama is unwilling to say the US is at war, how can Manning "aid the enemy?"

[DublinDave]

Governor Mcrory says he'll read some of the voter suppression law he's about to sign. Mcrorry says he wants to have a cup of tea and a piece of cake and then he'll sit down and maybe.... maybe...... read a page or two of it.

Thomas Jefferson is proud of the Modern Republican party and its strength in defending Democracy.

No Republican need reply to my post; I know your heads are in the sand. I know you're scared. You should be.We're about to go to war and spread our democratic right to vote faces all over you, your families and your children.

No one's getting out of this.

[DublinDave]

Faces????...lol........feces...our human shit.......our excrement......it'll be Bobby sands for an American population....you're going to want to end this but we're not going to allow you....

[glasater]

The head of the CFTC which had oversight of MF Global is/was Gensler a Goldman alum who recused himself regarding anything Corzine.
Talk about a corrupt 'old boys network'...

[NK]

DD has the DTs. Pity.

[pagar]

Probably why John Kerry was never charged or William Ayers or Jane Fonda. Got it.

[Some Guy]

"democratic feces"

Well said. Well said indeed.

It's quite funny that even you know it's just a pile of s...

[lyle]

No one's getting out of this.

Think again, loser.

[NK]

The CFTC should have referred the Corzine matter to the DOJ AND the AttyGen should have appointed a special counsel because of the conflict raised by Corzine's financial support for the POTUS. Of course, since this Admin is like the USSR or some Third World dictatorship, none of that ever happened.

[DublinDave]

"DD has the DTs. Pity"

Here's what's great about this voter suppression fight;you're locked into it...you're not going anywhere......roflamo....

[Janet]

Back home & the JOM meetup with James D. was great! A big "me too" & "I hear ya" tenor....SO refreshing for our town.

I highly recommend JOM meetups...you have something in common from the get-go.

James's book will be highlighted in a local storefront - http://www.amazon.com/Dream-Student-Dreams-Book-Volume/dp/1482716275/ref=tmm_pap_title_0/189-1014655-7334762

A nice idea for showcasing local talent.

[Jeff Dobbs]

I've submitted a FOIA request to the NSA to get the contents of the Janet/James meetup.

[Captain Hate]

it'll be Bobby sands for an American population

Another worthless dead mick POS? We have plenty of those.

[Some Guy]

Until the idiots in government understand that as they create laws/rules/regulations they end up only altering incentives, I have zero empathy for the prosecutors in these kinds of show trials.

Mortgages? A piffle relative the incentives that oblamacare will unleash.

Idiots.

[Janet]

You can report those that refuse to obey the 'nudge squad' by emailing - flag@whitehouse.gov.

[DublinDave]

"Another worthless dead mick POS? We have plenty of those"

Actually your're a Republican, you have no human being in your party who would die for his country.

Reagan would've shit his pants if he'd faced death for Anmerican freedom. We're Irish......we actually die for what we believe in.

Go have a cappacino and count your money...you man!

[narciso]

I do recall that Walker started spying for the Russians in '67, at the height of the war, when he gave up some of the codes we were using

[JIB]

Remember how Bobby Sands died. I can't see DuDa giving up a meal or two much less starving to death. All Sands did was extend the "troubles" by becoming an icon for further recruitment of Irish terrorists much like the Muzzies in Gitmo are trying to do with their hunger strike.

When you take a deep look at the Provo's you will find Libyan and Syrian trainers. I believe in a number of cases we (the CIA) had them spotted in training camps in Libya. We did the right thing and let the Brits know, who in turn had their SAS extinguish the vermin before they could execute more brilliant "boom" strategies on innocents around Isle's.

[James D.]

I've submitted a FOIA request to the NSA to get the contents of the Janet/James meetup.

Hit, we met at a Dunkin Donuts, so you can report us (well, me, anyway - janet didn't have anything to eat) to the nudge squad for future diet modofication as well...

[twin falls]

" who in turn had their SAS extinguish the vermin before they could execute more brilliant "boom" strategies on innocents around Isle's."

Of course you would take the position of collaborators and occupational government. It goes without saying.

[JIB]

JamesD,

Does Dunkin Donuts have a smoking area:)? Or did you sit outside?

marlene,

Have you ever been to the Stonewall Cafe in York, ME?

[Frau Kommunismus verrecke!]

NK - Stanley Kurtz takes on Obama's quiet anti-suburban revolution. LUN

[clarice]

bgates! Exacatmente!

[clarice]

Or, exactamente. (leaving Corsica. A day at sea and then Malta. Corsica is quite lovely and interesting, but hot, hot , hot and full of worn granite steps you have to keep climbing. Don't ask about the bathrooms either. You don't want to know.

[DublinDave]

"Remember how Bobby Sands died. I can't see DuDa giving up a meal or too much less starving to death. All Sands did was extend the "troubles" by becoming an icon.."

I love love love ( fair warning -I have been drinking today) when a Republican hits Wikipedia for 2 minutes to find something disparaging about an Irish "Republican").

Hey, JOM, wanna see me shut jib up? Watch this;

Jib, why was Bobby sands starving himself?

(Relax, he's not going to answer me. Once he finds out he'll slink away and cry in a corner and ask his wife to bring him a latte).

[Jane on Ipad hi there NSA]

I agree with Mark-O about Jamie Gorelik and sandy Berger.

[clarice]

matt, I understand the better restaurants in California I giving away foie gras to those who order very expensive toast and fixings..though the ban succeeded in killing the geese farms that produced the foie gras.

[DublinDave]

One more time;JIB...WHY was Bobby Sands starving himself?

List those reasons please!!!!

[clarice]

IT is spotty but I believe jury found Manning not guilty of aiding the enemy.

[twin falls]

"List those reasons please!!!!"

He approves of force=feeding Gitmo detainees. That would be his answer, if he were, you know, to answer.

[matt]

If you've been paying attention there have been major jail breaks in Iraq, Pakistan and Libya in the past few days. These are all prime jihadi target states.

By my count there are now 1,000 Libyan, 500 Iraqi, and 250 Pakistani prisoners now on the loose. All within one week. I really hope that our intel people are cutting through the hype to see how these are related. It speaks to a level of organization we have not seen before.

1,750 hard core criminals and jihadis on the loose in these countries is very bad news. Combine this with the mounting instability in the Maghreb and there may be some catalysis at work.

The rebels in Syria are losing. Egypt is on low boil. Tunisia is unstable. And Afghanistan is lost. WSJ had an article university students in Afghanistan leading the hard core pro - Taliban/ AQ protests and seeking to wipe out the limited human rights that women now have there.

The country is headed for disaster and Pakistan and India are fighting for control. Tick.Tick.Tick.

[DublinDave]

See here's what's happening......JIB has no clue why Sands starved himself to death.He went to a UVF site that refused to discuss Sand's demands. Now he's busy researching them..but...having trouble processing them because what Bobby wanted was as American as apple pie.

It's o.k. Jib.......Sands was a human being. you can admit it now.

[NK]

Alas-- none of that is news to me Frau. Shaun Donovan is a true believer social engineer.

[twin falls]

'Tick, tick tick'. Yeah, Iraq that noble neo-con debacle is a, surprise debacle.

Hoodathunk?

[Marlene]

Darn,lost a comment. Jack,yes we've stopped at the Stonewall Kitchen Cafe a couple of times. It is in the company store,which is always so busy,especially this time of year. I love their products. They make great gift baskets.

[Dr. Weevil]

Why was Bobby Sands starving himself? Primarily because he was a terroristic asshole and a sociopath. What secondary reasons he used to justify that particular bit of terroristic assholery is quite secondary and irrelevant.

Why does DublinDave comment here? Because of his strongly-held beliefs on political subjects? No: those are just secondary. His primary motivation is that he's a troll and an asshole, a drunk and quite possibly a sociopath, who goes looking for political excuses to deceive (if he can) and abuse others.

[Dr. Weevil]

What are the chances that 'twin falls' is a 'DublinDave' sockpuppet? If we had Ace of Spades style hashtags, we'd know. Judging from the last hour or so on this thread, I'd put the probability at 75%.

[Frau Kommunismus verrecke!]

NK, IIRC you were doubting the success of any attack on the suburbs to support the urban areas. This looks like massive herding of populations into the new, massive apartment complexes I've seen up and down the Left Coast.

[matt]

The Provos and the IRA got a lot of support from East Germany and Libya under the benevolent umbrella of the Comintern's successor. Training in Libya and Bulgaria and EG; difficult to trace weaponry.Just enough to keep Ulster under lockdown and threaten the UK.

Having had some experience with the sharp end of the IRA I despise them. Cowards and apparatchiks leading the easily led. Blowing up women and children, army bands and other soft targets.

Screw 'em.

[twin falls]

"What are the chances that 'twin falls' is a 'DublinDave' sockpuppet? "

I think we're both Molly Maguires, so if that's what you mean, yeah.

[NK]

"The Troubles" in the 6 historical Counties (i.e. Ulster Province), or the Northern Ireland-UK its legal international title, are no longer political, they are economic. Ulster is a basket case -- the Brits fund it, but don't want to anymore, the ROI citizens don't want Union with Ulster if it means taking on the economic burdens (the ROI has its own problems). So The North just sits there, a hellhole of poverty on the Dole in a stunningly beautiful landscape. Bobby Sands? Jeez, what irrelevancy-- to everything.

[Dr. Weevil]

Poor DublinDave thinks having reasonable demands makes someone not a terrorist. It's not your goal but your methods that determines whether you're a terrorist. The Unabomber's environmentalist beliefs were indistinguishable from Al Gore's, but he was a terrorist and Al Gore is not, because Al Gore has never (so far as we know!) killed someone for disagreeing with him.

Once you start killing civilians for your cause, I didn't give a damn how reasonable your cause is. That applies to the Tamil Tigers - I'm glad they lost - the Palestinians - I'm glad they're losing, and hope they continue to do so - and the IRA - I wish they'd lost.

[DublinDave]

I told you I could shut JIB up.

I tell you people alot of things and you never believe me.

[Frau Kommunismus verrecke!]

Dr. Weevil, if it smells like it, it probably is.

[twin falls]

Natch; cuz there's so many precautions in Gaza to prevent women and children from being vaporized by IMF. Your selective perception is showing.

[Dr. Weevil]

It would be very easy for the residents of Gaza "to prevent women and children from being vaporized by IMF": all they have to do is stop trying to vaporize Jewish women and children with rockets carefully placed among their own women and children to increase their own casualties and win the sympathy of morons.

[Frau Kommunismus verrecke!]

Obama's "smart war" in Afghanistan is a raging success and more than qualifies him for a second Nobel peace prize.

[NK]

Or more importantly, if the cowardly Hamas types stopped using women and children as shields when they fire rockets at Israeli women and children....

[Porchlight]

I believe twin falls is Dana Gilbert Ward. After many years of reading JOM, his style is easy to spot.

[narciso]

Here's a piece about that era;

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2798055/posts

[jimmyk]

True, Porch, but let's not dignify Dana's posts with the word "style." Kind of like referring to Harry Reid's "personality."

[narciso]

As well as this piece;

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/northernireland/8425593/Libyan-arms-helped-the-IRA-to-wage-war.html

[twin falls]

"The law passed by the Continental Congress on July 30, 1778, declared that it was the “duty of all persons in the service of the United States, as well as all other the inhabitants thereof, to give the earliest information to Congress or other proper authority of any misconduct, frauds or misdemeanors committed by an officers or persons in the service of these states, which may come to their knowledge.”

It was passed unanimously in response to a whistleblower, Marine Captain John Grannis, who presented a petition to the Continental Congress on March 26, 1777, to have a commander of the Continental Navy, Commodore Esek Hopkins, suspended after he tortured British sailors who were captured."

[JIB]

DuDa,

First, I have more Irish in me than your phony pedigree. I probably know Ireland geographically and culturally better than you even if you are Irish. I knew Bertie Ahern on a very personal and business basis as I know Enda Kenny the same way. My mother was born in Tuam and my family on her side still reside there.

Bobby Sands was a confused young terrorist who with his mates made the Maze at Long Kesh the hell hole it became not because the British ran it that way.

They deserved every thing they got. Remember the OWS guy who was defecating on the police car? Well that is what Sands and his crew of terrorists did in their own man-made pig pens. See, setting off bombs and killing innocent children and soldiers and coppers is not a crime to the Provos - it is a political action and they deserve to be "political" prisoners not some common ordinary Irish criminal.

But the real gall is the Provos and the IRA using "religion" as their proxy for fighting a war of leftist ideals against those of a parliamentary democracy was laughable. The fact that so many Irish-American Catholics got suckered into giving them money to buy more and more arms and chemicals for bombs was tragic.

And DuDa, Bobby Sands was a POS just like every member of the terrorist organization known as the Provisional IRA. I could care less why he starved himself to death. That's the problem with terrorist they always have some phony excuse In my opinion, Thatcher should have declared a war on them much the same way we did with Al Queda. Gone in and wiped them out with a full surge of British military. The world would be better off.

[NK]

JiB @ 3:06 just about covers The Troubles.

[Dr. Weevil]

I think Bobby Sands being a POS is what DublinDave finds attractive. In his 1:26 comment with its 1:28 correction, he fantasizes aloud about spreading his "feces", his "shit", his "excrement", all over us (meaning Republicans), our families and our children, forcibly and without end ("you're going to want to end this but we're not going to allow you"), and without any exceptions ("No one's getting out of this").

Even if he was drunk when he wrote all that, sobering up will hardly suffice to make him a normal human being. He needs professional help, and he needs it urgently. Whether a psychiatrist or an exorcist would be more useful is not quite clear.

[OldTimer]

Just so, JIB,just so.

[anonamom]

I've wondered for quite some time why people respond to duda.
Is there some reason you reinforce his presence?