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August 18, 2013

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Jane -May2014 Be there or Be Square

Really, Jane? Was that somebody sockpuppeting you on how much your health insurance costs ballooned under RomneyCare?

What are you talking about?

NK

I've always wondered about Ethan's self-conscious nervous habit about holding his hurting arm. If DD is right that Duke came up with it on his own, I wouldn't doubt that; but what was Duke conveying? a bit of internal self- doubt for the man who can show no public sign of weakness? self-hate?-- it's ambiguous which is one of the things that makes it 'genius'. I personally find more breathtaking Ford's framing of the final scene-- the happy camper 'civilized folks' leaving the brilliantly lit porch into the dark room, and fading out, leaving Ethan framed by the doorway in the brilliant sun gazing at the civilized folk who have been restored as a family and soon knowing that ther will be wedings and grandchildren, and the civilized folk will forget about the hard man who made it possible for them, maybe they WANT to forget the hard man because they didn't approve of his methods. Duke's Ethan? he rubs his arm, doesn't ask any civilized folk to say 'thank you', and goes about his own business with the satisfaction of knowing he did what was needed to be done, and to struggle with the sins he committed in getting it done. Then the door swings shut and the screen goes black. To me that framing was Ford's genius. BTW-- David Lean stole that walking into darkness framing in Lawrence of Arabia in a great Sharif-Quinn scene.

Clarice

Why is anyone talking to or hiring Steve schmidt? Why?

Jane -May2014 Be there or Be Square

I see sailor is back.

jimmyk

Jane is a peach.

Yes, or maybe even a nectarine.

I suppose we haven't had enough of a break from the disappointment of 2012, but it's only because Obama has been even worse than we imagined.

Captain Hate on an iPhone

Jane, weren't you always talking about how bad RomneyCare was as far as your premiums rising a great deal? Maybe I'll break the software with a search...

centralcal

That is what is most depressing this far out, Clarice.

Steve Schmidt still has clout with the (non-existent, mythological) Republican establishment.

All that was missing today, was a quote or two from Nicole Wallace.

Porchlight

I love Jane and Gus. :)

Danube on iPad

"Do you think they have no influence on who tries to run?"

I can't think of anyone I would like to see run who does not appear to be doing so. And un any case I don't think "they" act in concert.

centralcal

ditto, Porch.

Jane -May2014 Be there or Be Square

I certainly did Capn' and meant every word. I also don't think I was an asset to a Romney win, if that's the point you are making.

My only point was that 1. I think Christie did a good job in the schools, and 2. let's not give the liberals any more ammunition.

I have been over-ruled. I know my options.

NJJans

Marlene
When Christie ran against Corzine the papers were all for him. Even the Star Ledger endorsed him. This is the unofficial dem newspaper. Once he started after the teachers union and other budget eating entitlements, they were aghast and have been relentlessly against him. He does not enjoy good press in NJ at the moment. There is a radio station nj101.1 which is more fair and he does an Ask the Governor program on there once month. Corzine refused to do it. McGrreevy started out doing it, then refused when tough questions were used. The radio personality who handles the questions is fair and does not softball it. They have been equally hard on dem governors as repub.

Porchlight

I can't think of anyone I would like to see run who does not appear to be doing so.

Walker, perhaps? I guess we don't know yet.

Re: John Wayne, I 100% agree with Dublindave's 1:56.

Captain Hate on an iPhone

That's kind of the point I was making; more broadly that neither you nor I deserve any culpability in Romney's loss.

Porchlight

To me that framing was Ford's genius.

Yes, and he did it in the opening shot, too:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fy2-abqR8B4

Genius all around.

Dublindave

"But what was Duke conveying? A bit of internal self- doubt for the man who can show no public sign of weakness? self-hate"

So the people who built this country, who fought for it, bled for it, suffered and toiled and gave their lives to ensure that little girls came home and had a nice place to live with a loving family, sadly and ironically had no place in it.

The Duke WAS portraying insecurity- the insecurity that he didn't belong in this nice place that he helped to create. You're right, Fords framing conveys that, but it's Wayne's gesture that drives it home in such an emotionally powerful way. Yeah, I know, that sounds pretty gay but that's what the Movies ultimately about-the grinders,the toilers,the guys who fight in wars and get forgotten about. Sometimes their experiences and choices prevent them from coming back home to us.

NK

Ford filming Searchers-- the Searchers Wiki page claims David Lean watched the Searchers repeatedly in prepping for Lawrence; wiki doesn't mention the 'walking into darkness' shot, but I bet Lean was inspired by that. I believe in Heaven, and I'd bet Lean and Ford and talking right now about... well everything... and inspiring us to this day.

centralcal

Scott Walker:

Mr. Walker, who appeared on “Fox & Friends,” specifically was referring to the public spat between Kentucky Sen. Rand Paul and New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie, both of whom are expected to run for president and already have begun to engage in a de facto primary election fight with each other.

But by focusing too much on the 2016 cycle, the GOP could blow its chances in next year’s midterms, according to Mr. Walker.

“I think it’s too early. I think it’s a disservice to the party and the country,” he said. “We’ve got 36 races for governor next year. Twenty-two of them, including me, are [incumbent] Republican governors. You’ve got the U.S. Senate, where we’ve got a very real chance to get the majority. Keep the House, which has been doing a good job; get the Senate back. Then whomever the nominee is in 2016 has a real opportunity — he or she on the Republican side can ultimately come in and say, ‘We can turn America around.’”

sbwaters

Christie spends so much time in sucking and bluster I have yet to hear a clear expression of his principles.

Porchlight

Enjoying your commentary, Dublindave and NK.

Clarice

I seem to have passed my colonoscopy with flying colos but the post op instructions said nothing about avoiding news ike Steve Schmidt being still considered an election maven. Think I'll hit the fainting couch.

Captain Hate on an iPhone

Scott Walker sounding very Presidential there.

Porchlight

centralcal, Walker is correct, but unfortunately it's not too early for our betters in the GOP leadership to start casting around for the Next Guy. Maybe we'll get lucky and their guy won't get nominated this time.

centralcal

Yay Clarice (about the flying colors - not the fainting couch)!

NK

DD@2:43-- that's my take as well on Duke and Ford's Searchers, specifically the West. When hard men like Ethan Edwards had made the West safe from cruelty like Comanche warlords and corrupt bastards like Futterman, and little girls could safely go home to their families and have grandkids, the door was closed on the hard men and we civilized folks would rather forget what they did in our name, and we shoved them off to the side. Speaking of Ford and Wayne -- One of the great Lefty libels about 'Westerns' and Ford and Wayne in particular, was that they were ALL bigotted and showed Plains Indians as subhuman. That was a false mischaracterization. Ford's westerns in partcular treated the Indians with the same complexities as his 'white' characters. Some were noble and coragesous, some funny, some cruel. But they were people, like his other charaters.

Captain Hate on an iPhone

narc has provided regular updates of Dr Evil and Norma Desmond's efforts to weasel their way to becoming go to Repub insiders for the DeMFM.

narciso

Great news, Clarice, Nicolle Wallace was on 'the Dead Intern show' mumbling about something, I know not what, and I care less,

Ignatz

I get so sick of the 'racism' bit about the Searchers.
Ethan hated everyone at the start of the movie, including and especially himself.
The great achievement of Ford's and Wayne's was focused in the moment he can't kill Natalie Wood and we see him change not to a saint, but to a man who can accept his fate as a lonely and alone man who will probably never have what others do but who no longer hates them for it.

Clarice

Nicole Wallace..I 'd like to see her after Palin wins the senatorial race in Alaska. Maybe Sarah will take her hunting.

narciso

The gall of the woman,

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/gop-strategist-pins-down-chris-matthews-hows-hope-and-change-look-now/

NJJans

I think the Republican Party needs to be able to walk and chew gum at the same time. It is important to put the strongest effort and materiel in the 2014 congressional and governor races as Scott Walker said and, at the same time, lay the ground work and prepare for the pres election in 2016. You can bet the dems are. I do think both can be done simultaneously.

JIB

NK,

Just read in last week's Southampton Press that Pinch's estate sold his place on Gin Lane for $10.5 big ones. You can google it on maps or earth - 283 Gin Lane, Southampton, NY. Not even on the ocean but then I know all about that kind of living - replacing AC units, summer kitchens and pool heaters every 5 to 7 years.

Buyer is disguised as a holding company. The City people like to use holding companies and LLC's to buy their homes out here. Now, why do you think that is:)

NK

Ignatz@300-- hear hear! I wonder if Wayne was inspired in Searchers by the fact that in 1956 Lefty Hollywood, he was an 'outcast' politically. But Ford/Wayne's westerns speak for themselves-- Indians were not racial carictatures, they were story characters. In fact, if anything, Indians were primarily portrayed by Ford as Noble Adversaries-- in contrast, the enemy were corrupt white men, like government officials who ran guns and liquor to the Indians (See Fort apache and Wore a Yellow Ribbon.)

narciso

The problem about going on 'the Dead Intern show' is that they don't care about Walker's accomplishment, in fact they did everything to inpugn his efforts, then and in the future.

NK

JiB-- 'Punch's' estate, no? I don't think Arthur JR has left us yet. The 'LLC' buyer?, could be a builder who'll do a rehab, or some Hedge Fund/Hollywood type.

Captain Hate on an iPhone

You have to explain things in terms that Meeka understands which, other than the antisemitism that daddy was steeped in, eliminates post grade school topics.

Rick Ballard

I'm still trying to figure out if Dean Obama really put al Sisi on double secret probation.

I agree with Clarice - Schimdt? An "adviser" who never questioned the wisdom of setting up and staffing the ORCA GOTV campaign in Boston?

He's got as good an Ivydupe Rolodex as Rove but he's also steering from the rear view mirror. I'd much rather hear what Jason Johnson or John Drogin has to say.

JIB

NK,

My bad - head said to write punch but fingers wrote pinch. Pinch doesn't even have a place in Southampton. Don't know where he is but its not there. Punch's is not a tear-down. But then I said that about Barry Trupin's monstrosity that Calvin Klein bought for $29 million and then proceeded to tear it down and build his own carbuncle.

NK

JiB@3:21-- Klein's carbuncle-- heh.

You know what the Brits say about the rich-- they are different from you and I. (they have alot more money.)

NJJans

Rick Ballard @3:18: Yes!

narciso

And yet he doesn't even know the players;


http://www.qando.net/?p=15551

Ignatz

--But Ford/Wayne's westerns speak for themselves-- Indians were not racial carictatures, they were story characters.--

Exactly. Ford respected Indians as people not symbols and could therefore portray some as saints some as clowns and some as the devil himself, or some combination of all three, just like the rest of us.

Contrast that with some enlightened bullshit like the insipid Costner's unwatchable cardboard cutouts.

narciso

The Huntress still trumps him, in the influence game, I think he ran one candidate in 2010, he lost in Washington State,

Dublindave

It'd be a shame to be talking about the famous Ford/Wayne collaboration without mentioning one of the great character actors, Victor McLaglen.

Ironically an Englishman always playingh an Irishman, he was just amazing. From Ford's cavalry trilogy to the Quiet man, every one of his performances perfectly embodied the modern (modern for the day) man/child.

Do not leave this world without seeing an early Ford/McLaglen collaboration based upon the Irish rebellion called "The informant". You will be blown away by it, trust me.

narciso

Just like Kipling respected the Pashtun tribesman, he encountered along the NorthWestern frontier, like Lermontov did with the people of the Caucasus..

NK

Ignatz@3:26-- you are on a complete roll my man. Ford was not only a brilliant cinematographer (including filming the IJN attacks on Midway Island with his handheld 16mm camera) he was a brilliant story teller and judge of human nature-- must have been the Irishman in Ford. Modern Hollywood gives us caricatures and stereotypes, (WHITE MAN BAD! ,women and homosexuals and black/brown people GOOD!). It's a disgrace AND unwatchable, the worst of all worlds.

Dublindave

sorry....'the informer' ...shame on me.....

NK

DD-- I meant no disrespect for Victor Mc by omission. he was indeed a fab 'character' actor (he did play an Englishman in probably his most famous role-- in Gunga Din.) Thanks for the reminder about "The Informant" I haven't watched that in years-- I should Amazon it at once. That and Ryan's Daughter (another Lean classic)are two of my favorite Rebellion films.

NK

"The Informer"-- thanks for the correction, that will make my Amazon search faster.

narciso

'It's a Glitch,' just like Dick Jones said, with the ED-209'


http://twitchy.com/2013/08/20/hahahaha-lapdogs-run-cover-call-devastating-obamacare-effect-a-quirk-pic/

Ignatz

The McClaglen/Wayne donnybrook in The Quiet Man is the best fistfight in cinema history, IMO. McClaglen's fists were like a couple of Christmas hams.
Just watched The Informer on TCM a couple of months ago. Amazing portrayal of a pathetic man that we nevertheless feel sorry for.

Another underappreciated Ford gem is They Were Expendable with the Duke and Robert Montgomery.

NK

They Were Expendable-- OK flick, but tremendous peformances from Montgomery and Wayne, especially Wayne playing the second banana extremely well.

NK

The Quiet Man donnybrook-- the dying old man who jumps out of his deathbed to watch the fight is Ford's real life father. he lived not too far from where they were filming.

Searchers cast: the young officer who Wayne goofs on and whose dad is the Troop CO in the climatic fight against Scar? the young officer is played by Patrick Wayne, John's son.

Danube on iPad

I'll never forgetvwhen Reagan was asked after a debate with Carter whether he'd been nervous sharing a stage with the President of the United States. "Nah. I've shared a stage with John Wayne."

Also, at some point, I think late in his first term, he was quoted in Newsweek about how he makes the hard decisions: "I ask myself, what would John Wayne do?" i knew exactly what he meant. Duke's characters were tough, honest, decent, fair and courageous.

JIB

Ford was born in Marlene country - Cape Elizabeth, Maine.

My favorite film by him beside all the westerns and Quiet Man (which I have in a special 50 anniversary edition - somewhere) was "How Green is My Valley" simply because I am a sucker for anything I saw as a young lad with my Mother:)

Little known fact, it was filmed not in Wales, its setting, but in San Fernando Valley, California because of the war and the bombings.

If you go to County Mayo you can visit the actual site of the fight and other scenes in Cong. In fact, a cottage industry has grown up there handling the tours:) Lots of Japanese.

Danube of Thought

So the fight was filmed in Ireland?

JIB

DoT,

Absolutely. In Cong, County Mayo. Did the tour on my own based on a friend's knowledge of the shoot because he is a film buff who collects shooting scripts and other ephemera. Did it when we were building the Coca-Cola syrup plant in Ballina. Great salmon fishing.

Clarice

How Green was my Valley was also a great film.

jimmyk

he was quoted in Newsweek about how he makes the hard decisions: "I ask myself, what would John Wayne do?"

No doubt he was ridiculed mercilessly for that.

daddy

Does the new puppy get his own Osprey?

No. Bo didn't like flying alone so they got the new dog to keep him company on Bo's Osprey.

Porchlight

I'll never forgetvwhen Reagan was asked after a debate with Carter whether he'd been nervous sharing a stage with the President of the United States. "Nah. I've shared a stage with John Wayne."

Thanks DoT, I hadn't heard that one.

he was quoted in Newsweek about how he makes the hard decisions: "I ask myself, what would John Wayne do?"

I ask myself "what would Jack Aubrey do?" Same question, more or less.

I still haven't seen The Quiet Man, if you can believe it.

NJJans

Daddy@5:08pm

Thread winner!!!

Porchlight

I get so sick of the 'racism' bit about the Searchers.
Ethan hated everyone at the start of the movie, including and especially himself.

I get sick of the racism bit too. But he didn't hate everyone - he didn't hate his family, for example. He did hate the Comanches - I maintain that was understandable given the circumstances. And he didn't hate them for their skin color, he hated them for their actions.

centralcal

I saw most of the movies you all have discussed, but I saw them more years ago than I care to mention. How do you remember so many details - is it from watching the movies multiple times and/or seeing it again recently?

Dublindave

Sure, Ford/Wayne movies aren't the most politically correct flicks to watch, but their sheer entertainment and dramatic value help you overlook their not so subtle prejudices.

And yet there's something uncomfortably spot on about their observations. In 'the Quiet man' every Irishman is an abusive drunkard who only cares about land. Irish women can't bang a man unless they respect his ability to beat the shit out of another man and they're materialistic mad. I'm sorry, but as an irishman that's a spot on account of Irish people.

In Mclintock (not a Ford movie) a few native Americans are playing politics with the US government, but the majority just want booze. Nailed it. And the finale with O'hara and Wayne suggests that all a woman needs to be happy in this world is a good beating, a good kissing, a good fondling and a slap on the ass to send her on her way (probably home to make the tea). As a progressive liberal I can tell you that that's not going to play well in front of my feminist friends, but things were like that back then. Nailed it Wayne.

Porchlight

How do you remember so many details - is it from watching the movies multiple times and/or seeing it again recently?

In the case of The Searchers, both. But in general I have to see movies several times to have a really good recall of details later.

daddy

I ask myself "what would Jack Aubrey do?" Same question, more or less.

Porch,

I really am loving that series. (Just about to finish Fortune of War.)

But because of the movie I always have Maturin looking like the guy in the flick and acting all Charles Darwiny. Related to that, in the throne room I've been reading Darwin's Personal Diary from the Beagle these last few months. Last night I came across a beautiful little paragraph of his, written at age 23, on the evening after he and 14 year old Midshipman King returned to the Beagle, following their final hike from his very first layover exploring in the forests of Brazil. I am amazed at what he notices and how sharp he is as an observer and thinker at such a young age:


17 March 1832:

Took a farewell stroll with King: the evening was bright & exceedingly clear; not a breath of air moved the leaves; every thing was quiet; nothing could be better adapted for fixing in the mind the last & glorious remembrances of Bahia. — If to what Nature has granted the Brazils, man added his just & proper efforts, of what a country might the inhabitants boast. But where the greater parts are in a state of slavery, & where this system is maintained by an entire stop to education, the mainspring of human actions, what can be expected; but that the whole would be polluted by its part.

That sounds very Stephan Maturin to me.

marymary

I'm just about to dip my toe into the Aubrey-Maturin series.... just as soon as I finish watching the rest of Sharpe, also set in the Napoleonic Wars but with Wellington in Portugal/Spain/France, and starring Sean Bean. I highly recommend it - and it's free on Youtube.

Ignatz

-- But he didn't hate everyone - he didn't hate his family, for example.--

Perhaps I should have said he was mad at the world. We're certainly given the sense he envied his brother's family and home and coveted his brother's wife.

You gotta see the Quiet Man, Poerch. It's not the typical schmaltzy romantic flick but it's harder to think of one more full of romance.

NK

Ignatz-- I agree-- Ethan Edwards is mad at the world for having his youth stolen by the Civil War, and not having a family, is the bottom line of Ethan's obsession and near madness.

Quiet Man, is another troubled man, this time the prize fighter who killed an opponent in the ring. He gets to his ancestral home, and quickly falls in love with a woman-- in the USA, no problem, marry for love live happily ever after. In Ireland, the social customs and conventions threw up road blocks that ran through a thick headed Irish Donkey Victor Mc. Out of love for his woman, the Quiet Man figures out a solution that he gets the woman, and she keeps her 'honor'. It's Ford's knock on medieval Irish mores, that are trumped by true love. Wayne dragging O'Hara through the countryside for a good loving? well that just 'tis. Go with it-- it's a movie.

daddy

Marymary,

As everyone else forewarned me, it is definitely worhwhile to go to your local library and have a copy of these 2 books at hand when you attack the first Aubrey/Maturin book:

A Sea of Words--Lexicography for Aubrey/Maturin

Harbor's and High Seas--Aubrey/Maturin Atlas

Watch out for the second book tho' as it has spoilers if you read the text instead of just looking at the maps.

marymary

Thanks, daddy. My local library is not ... robust. The staff there is still passive-aggressive about all these darn computers and such the kids are bringing in and stringing their cables across the floor from the wall outlets and such and complain about having to use them themselves even though they updated the card catalog already. We supposedly have a regional e-book system now, but it doesn't look like they've gotten much past the Twilight and Game of Thrones series yet.

I'll just stick to my usual method of dragging out all my own reference books and hitting google every 20 minutes. If it gets too thick, I've added your recommendations to my amazon wish list and will just have to buy them.

Patriot4Freedom

marymary - Thanks for the tip about the "Sharpe's Rifles" movies set in the Napoleonic Wars !

Those are some terrific stories. Glad to know they are now free to watch on Youtube.

Anyone who hasn't seen them yet would be well-advised to check them out, IMHO.

Porchlight

marymary,

You will absolutely love O'Brian. I am on my second voyage (as the fans say) right now and I am right in the middle of The Far Side of the World, which is the one on which the movie is most closely based.

Do get the recommended atlas and lexicography, but be warned! The atlas contains inadvertent spoilers.

And yes, daddy, Maturin is very Darwin-y in the film, but it is also part of the novel's plot. Absolutely agree about the Darwin passage you quoted.

I definitely plan to read the Sharpe's Rifles series as well as the Ramage and Hornblower novels. If I ever stop reading O'Brian, that is. I may not do that.

Porchlight

You gotta see the Quiet Man, Poerch. It's not the typical schmaltzy romantic flick but it's harder to think of one more full of romance.

Thanks, Ignatz. I will. I think I will just go buy it right now from Amazon - no reason to wait.

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