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November 23, 2013



It's off topic but you'll be happy to know your favorite charity Wal-Mart is encouraging employees to donate canned food to OTHER WM associates might enjoy some Holiday cheer.

Humbugs everywhere want you to share from your abundance.


whitehat, You make no sense.


RNC? That is more a whacko bird op, just like the Walker Recall petition online db.


This would be simple to do. I'd recommend adding the insurance companies and phone numbers, too. Then ask why a gov't website is needed at all.


--proposed premium changes will be public --

I keep seeing this, but it wasn't true this year. Did anyone see anything before October 1? I don't mean rumors or projections or predictions - I mean the actual rates by plan.

In Missouri, they didn't even release the names of the Insurance Companies who were participating until one or two days before enrollment began.

Republicans can still campaign on rate increase possibilities, networks getting even smaller, and what not - but I truly don't know that the actual State-regulator-approved rates-by-plan will be available before the election.


Anyone know where to download the Bronze, Silver, Gold and Platinum data by zip code? If so, I'll look into setting this up.

(Yeah, sure, like the gov't would allow someone to post such data online.)

Account Deleted


I received my cancellation letter, which included a BOzocare offer at a minimal increase of only 70%, on September 16th. The timing decision by insurers will be gamed and tested by their marketing departments with an eye to relations with the state insurance commissioners. I anticipate later announcements in the stinking Blue Hells than in Free States.

The legislatures in Free States should consider bills requiring insurance commissioner to publish the rate increase requests upon receipt.


Rick: the timing of your cancellation letter was due to compliance with the 90-days notice regulation. Apparently, my state doesn't have that long a lead time. I got my not-really-a-cancellation letter requiring me to take one of 3 actions: enroll in new plan by 12/15/13 (7 weeks lead time); enroll in new plan by 2/15/14 (15 weeks lead time), or mail in a policy application -- really a renewal with altered start date -- (2 weeks lead time).

Extraneous: I haven't found actual raw data for download, but if it's anywhere, you'll possibly find it here: http://www.valuepenguin.com/ppaca/exchanges


BTW, when I was working and enrolled in an employers group plan, every year I'd be taking vacation time for at least half if not all the open enrollment period. I'd adjust my vacation plans a week or two earlier or later each year trying to avoid that, but it's like they set the dates for my region (big company - they staged enrollment over 3 months) after finding out when it was least convenient for me. :(

Jane-Rebel Alliance1

Great Ex. Once you get started let us know what we can do, and where to contribute.


I don't think anything other than ballpark figures were available at all until quite recently.
CA's site didn't have them and when I talked to my insurance guy just a few days ago he said he could finally get me an actual quote, as of the night before.


This is the piece I was talking about in the other thread,


So, IBM was one of the contractors, who lost out in the bidding,


I have a suggestion that would be both simple and devastatingly effective, and is right out of the Alinsky playbook. Find three or four worst case examples of real people who have been adversely affected because of Obamacare--like the family with a kid who has leukemia and could now die because he's no longer covered under his dad's employer plan. Or the beloved mother of four who has stage three breast cancer and has just lost her doctor. Or the struggling single mom who's working two jobs to make ends meet and who's deductible went from $2,000 to $6,000 dollars a year. Put their sad--and scary--stories into a commercial, with a tag line at the end that says, "On November 15th, 100 million people will be losing their current health insurance plan and their doctors, because of Obamacare. One of them could be you." Then personalize it by naming the incumbent Democrat Senator or Congressman up for re-election who voted for Obamacare. Or, if he wasn't in Congress at the time of the vote, tie him to the fiasco via association with the party who wants to take away your health insurance.

Run it nationally and scare the every loving s**t out of people. Like LBJ's daisy ad.

Stephanie on kindle armchair QB Statue of Liberty FTW

I've got an insurance estimator that calculates for multistate ages 1-85 for multi insurance companies and multi plans already (smoker/nonsmokers, too). Change the tables and company names et voila.

My broker puts it out but I've never bothered yo look 'behind the scenes' to see if the code is accessible. It's written in excel

I can copy it and email if it is to anyone who wants 75% of the work done.


woot! That Penguin site identifies each state's "rating areas". So, now I know for a fact that if I move 10 miles East or 15 miles North I'll be in a "better" health insurance pool. Not that I plan to move anytime soon, but it's a data point to consider.


Yes, this is a total fustercluck, no wonder they were giving us the 'spring surprise' from Whizzo Chocolates.

Miss Marple

AliceH, My interest would be in whether or not as someone in zone 13 I could use a hospital i Zone 11, which is 1 mile north of me, while the closest hospital in zone 13 is 15 miles south.

This is theoretical as I am on Medicare, but someone should investigate that. For my county it would upset a lot of people if they cannot use the major Indianapolis hospitals and instead had to go south to a second tier hospital.


Three guys from a web company in CA have already done this, by zipcode:



if you were a Republican attack dog you'd prolly be too busy planning amnesy and attacking the tea party to think about anything else


Good question, Miss Marple. I'm not sure of that - I've had the WORST time trying to get details on what is in/out of network - screens just hang there spinning and it's been doing that every time I've tried for over a month now.

I did just verify my moving 10 miles east would result in my lowest-premium Silver plan premium dropping from $528/mo to $442/mo, and highest priced Silver plan drops from $950/mo to $784/mo.

So, by living in a poor rate area with higher-than-average percent of medicaid/medicare population, I get to pay an extra $1 or $2,000 a year. So I can be poorer, too. Like my neighbors. Sounds about right.


Sarah P. requests we all watch this excellent Cavuto, on Obama's Alinsky Fox-Hate pogrom:


Miss Marple

My afternoon includes a student art exhibit which granddaughter is in, so must get ready to leave.

Take good notes, everyone!


Wonderful, Miss Marple.


Incoming! Instapundit link to the thread...



You should be able to extract your insurance database interfaces from here: http://www.thehealthsherpa.com/


Looks like there's another Insurance Company (the 3rd one) participating in the MO exchange now - it wasn't there a couple weeks ago.

Oh well. Only 751 have enrolled in the state so far, so it's not like a huge number of people were denied the opportunity to see ALL their choices.

Danube on iPad

I think this delay is a 12-gauge shotgun blast to the instep of the Democratic party. It ensures that every man Jack and woman Jane in America will be focused - laser-like, natch - on the forthcoming rates. And plenty of those rates will leak out, and the rumor mill will grind most fine. The election will be about health insurance premiums. And those premiums, because of 2014's underfunding, will be horrific. Dumb.

Danube on iPad

How you feeling, Steph?


When you've lost Joe Nocera, you wonder why you cared?

Belial Issimo

This is a great idea. Set up a Kickstarter for the amount of funding it would need. I'd donate.

Army of Davids


So many different ways to pound Democrats on ObamaCare. All they can do is find ways to delay the pain. But it is coming. Delaying it only means it will be worse.

They deserve every bit of the beating coming their way.


if you were a Republican attack dog you'd prolly be too busy planning amnesy and attacking the tea party to think about anything else.

Jojo nails it.



Account Deleted

"And those premiums, because of 2014's underfunding, will be horrific."

Perhaps. I can't quite game out what happens if the fat drunkards who constitute a large portion of the marginal income folk with preconditions who are eligible for subsidy decide to wait until health care is as free as their BOzophone before signing up.

The progressive prole killers want the drunken fatsos under the care of Dr. Ezekiel Emengele very badly in order to liquidate them in an orderly fashion but they may not climb on the cattle cars voluntarily. Their refusal would sweeten the poisoned pools and eliminate justification for premium increases.

We're not going to know anything with certainty until after the free rider window of opportunity closes on March 31.


Man w/ $5million House (no mortgage), 3 kids in private schools, forced onto medicaid due to "low income". And he's not happy.


In my head, I hear the President saying "You'd think they'd be thanking me. That's what you'd think."

Man Tran on iPhone

Just heard a rumor that the JEF wasn't getting any of the Seattle commie-progs to cough up $32k for his fundraiser. Price down to $20k.

Hopefully, Jim Miller can confirm.

Stephenie: glad that your ordeal is over. Safe recovery.


Along the same line, why don't the states take over the mass mailing/notification process? Perhaps the governor can propose a reg/issue an order requiring insurers to notify customers of possible upcoming changes. Perhaps the state ins. commissioner can do the same. Perhaps the legislature can require such notices by law.

All in the name of consumer education/public service. TV/Radio/Website campaigns to accompany such consciousness raising, er, informed consent.

Danube on iPad

All indications I've seen thus far are that the fat drunkard oldsters are disproprtionately represented, and the younh sobers aren't showing up that much.


Man Tran, speaking of ordeals, how are you doing? Is your vision improving? Didn't want to add to your online reading challenges by emailing until you gave an "all clear" to read via computer.


AliceH, anybody on Medicaid better not be happy if htey can chose any other option. Meidcaid doesn't even cover costs of a doctor's time for an evaluation, so physicians willing to participate are few and far between, and the ones who do often limit the number of patients they see, as it essentially charity work with a huge risk.
it's not about greed--it's about keeping the lights on. Complying with all the government regs is expensive.

Steve S.

I do not understand why every White House pronouncement is not met with guffaws and/or derisive laughter.


I wonder... if one could "accidentally/optimistically" overestimate one's 2014 income to exceed Medicaid levels, buy a policy with subsidies, and then just pau back any subsidies on next year's tax return. Or... overestimate higher so as to not have any subsidies, just pay the premium oneself. Would the IRS or Govt really yank that policy that's been paid for on time and force a Medicaid enrollment by overriding provided income with actual?

One reason this has seized my imagination is that I have no wages, but I have funds. And I will not ever ever ever ever enroll in medicaid. I'd rather be uninsured.

Man Tran on iPhone


Sat with my laptop yesterday. Can see the keyboard above the bubble, but the mid range on my progressive bifocals is a little off for reading fine print on my hi-res screen. The iPhone is better for JOM and emails, but I really have to get back to project work. (Self imposed alternative to withering in retirement.)


What in the world was the guy with the five million dollar house doing within 100 miles of the obamascare website? Seems weird.



I wonder... if one could "accidentally/optimistically" overestimate one's 2014 income to exceed Medicaid levels...

I'm in this position, and like most government income-related things, they assume everyone draws a salary that is stable. Mine isn't.

If I choose to go with an exchange (and I may not) based on this year's income I would be shoved into Medicaid. OTOH, if one thing works out I would be counted as near-rich and then the exchanges are irrelevant.

And if I'm in between, I can always use SEP deductions and play with corporate earnings to get to where I need to be as far as income goes.

It is crazy that to choose a medical policy you first have to do tax planning.


Man Tran,

Great to hear! And to use a Dilbert line, "Engineers don't idle well" so I'm not surprised you want to get back to project work.


ACA works for "vast majority of people" who have no clue what workable, affordable, reasonable health insurance looks like.


Prayers for you, Manny Tranny. speedy recovery.

rick b @12:55 you put a smile on my face

Captain Hate on the iPhone

Best wishes, Man Tran.

Stephanie, I hope before watching the Mad Hatter eating grass you're tuned into the Bojangles network to watch the traditional ACC rivalry of Pitt at Syracuse.


or that powerhouse drama of Duke and Wake Forest...Duke in the lead of the Coastal Division?

good to hear Man Tran and best wishes.

Stephanie, good to see you in the comments.


What's the Bojangles network?


Duke. Clearly we've violated some NCAA rule.

On the question of Boehner jailing someone, submitted for your approval.

Jail? Jail? And who is going to stop something the NYT endorses? The point is not whether it is legal, but whether anyone can get in the way.

New York Times, 2007
This is where inherent contempt comes in. From the Republic’s earliest days, Congress has had the right to hold recalcitrant witnesses in contempt — and even imprison them — all by itself. In 1795, shortly after the Constitution was ratified, the House ordered its sergeant at arms to arrest and detain two men accused of trying to bribe members of Congress. The House held a trial and convicted one of them.
In 1821, the Supreme Court upheld Congress’s right to hold people in contempt and imprison them. Without this power, the court ruled, Congress would “be exposed to every indignity and interruption, that rudeness, caprice, or even conspiracy, may mediate against it.” Later, in a 1927 case arising from the Teapot Dome scandal, the court upheld the Senate’s arrest of the brother of a former attorney general — carried out in Ohio by the deputy sergeant at arms — for ignoring a subpoena to testify.

Captain Hate on the iPhone

Bojangles == ACC Network. They always have a Bojangles logo on the game summary.

Beasts of England

Lots of new user names today! Have they read and initialed the style guide and technical manual, hit?


I'm feeling about the same as yesterday, DoT. I was hoping to reduce the happy pills but I made it about 9 hours and took one.

I'm glad MT is doing better. I can't imagine having vision issues. Scary!

CH, I watched the MissSt game on the 'Peachtree' network today.

I refuse to subscribe to those two teams as part of the ACC... And yes, the mad hatter is on my TV now.


Hey, healthcareNOTgov.com is available!

I think the sheerpa and valuepenguin already got this together, though.

Maybe a name change would interest one of them.


For my county it would upset a lot of people if they cannot use the major Indianapolis hospitals and instead had to go south to a second tier hospital.

The beauty of ObamaCare Miss M, is that in future they'll all be second tier hospitals.


Stephanie, so good to see you posting. Don't worry about taking the happy pills. Your body will let you know when it's tired of them, and you will throw away the leftover ones.



All I can say is I'm pulling for you like everybody else. Wow. What an ordeal. And I'm also pulling for your hubby who I can certainly understand if he fells like strangling the surgeons.

Danube on iPad

Oregon departs the Top Ten.

ManTran, do you have the teflon buckles on both eyes? Did both detach at the same time? Was trauma involved?

Jeff Dobbs

Lots of new user names today! Have they read and initialed the style guide and technical manual, hit?

What difference, at this point, does it make?

JOMers abuse the style guide with more fervor than Obama does the Constitution.

Stephanie on kindle armchair QB Statue of Liberty FTW

Thanks Mary and everyone for all the support.

It's not the happy pills themselves so much as the side effect- as my grandmother used to say "I'm strutted "

Jeff Dobbs

Yay Stephanie.

You have always been my favorite. Don't tell the others.

Man Tran on iPhone


Don't know about the buckles. My bad eye happened nine years ago with effective loss of vision, because I never bothered to get a fresh lens. (Damage from the laser.) This one was done correctly from the beginning, so it may only accelerate the aging of the lens slightly. Right now, there doesn't seem to be any clouding.

In neither case was trauma involved. Apparently it's a roll of the dice. Found out a friend had the problem in his 30s the same as his father.

On a related note, a buddy who was at NASA Langley in the mid '60s was doing some experiments with one of the very first pulsed lasers and ended up needing some (safety?) eye exam along with his tech. The tech had detached retinas and they fixed him with a laser. Had no idea they were tinkering with medical apps that early.


On good authority I understand Obama personally put pressure on Dems to vote for the nuclear option because he wants to dump Sebelius and is afraid of protracted confirmation hearings and inquiry into Obamacare.Time to put full pressure on vulnerable Dem Senators to vote against dubious nominees like Pillard and = against procedures and executive appointments which amount to tyranny.Countervailing squeeze is needed.


I think I saw that in the Journal, Clarice, along with Mel Watt, meanwhile, we were too enthusiastic that the French would hold the line,

Jim Rhoads f/k/a vnjagvet

The hits just keep on coming. The Rodent strikes again.

Jane on Ipad hi there NSA

Interesting Clarice, although it seems to me there is a risk to firing Sebelius. Who will he blame?


There's always Bush, Jane Where there's a will, there's a way.


On the road for a week beginning tomorrow. Stay well and Hppy Thanksgiving if I miss you before then.


Attack Dog? Surely you jest. Those pussies don't know attack dogs. They're still afraid of looking like meanies. Even if they opposed Dems with the ferocity devoted to Tea Party-ites, they'd still be pussies compared to the Alinsky clones.


Today's pieces:http://www.americanthinker.com/2013/11/reid_drops_nuclear_bomb_and_his_party_will_rue_its_fallout.html


@ 11:35 p.m. on 11/24/2013:
Now take WEEAL men. They go
on blogs and call those wascally
Wepublicans pussies, anonymously.

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