The Dubious ObamaCare Insurance Waiver Finds Some Support

The NY Times reports that some states have rejected the ObamaCare "if you like your [non-complinat] plan you can keep it" waiver, but others have taken it up:

Of the 13 states that have so far said they will allow consumers to renew canceled plans, all but four are led by Republican governors and have generally been opposed to the new health care law. Of the eight that have said they will not carry out the policy, six are in Democratic-led states, many of which have actively worked to put the law into effect and have argued that allowing such an extension could undermine its success.

This odd detail suggests that, in some states which allowed early renewals to dodge the law, the problems are less than critics had feared:

Many states with low numbers of such cancellations were those that had let insurers temporarily avoid the law’s requirements by offering early renewal of existing plans. Those renewals allowed people to keep their existing plans though next year. The goal was to smooth the transition for consumers, commissioners in those states said.

“It turned out to be a good decision,” said Mike Chaney, the insurance commissioner in Republican-led Mississippi, who said fewer than 500 people in his state received notice of discontinued policies because he encouraged the major insurers to offer the option of renewing for an additional year.

...

For the states that choose to go ahead with Mr. Obama’s proposal, regulators and insurers must quickly work out tricky logistical details like approving rates for the coming year and working to return customers to their computer systems.

Some state insurance commissioners in states that were already allowing early renewals said they had a head start.

In Kentucky, which has generally embraced the health care law and has said it will carry out Mr. Obama’s proposal concerning canceled policies, regulators have already reviewed rates for insurers that offered renewals of their noncompliant plans. Therefore, they expect the process for state residents whose policies were canceled — about 280,000 of them — to be fairly straightforward.

“All of that regulatory due diligence that we had to do, we’ve already done it,” said Sharon Clark, the state’s insurance commissioner. “I feel for some of my colleagues who are having a much more difficult time than I am.”

However, we should expect price increases:

Still, there is no guarantee prices on those old plans will not also rise. Blue Cross Blue Shield of North Carolina announced Tuesday that it had filed documents with the state, which has said it will work to carry out Mr. Obama’s plan and allow about 230,000 customers to renew their noncompliant plans. But it also said that those customers would see rate increases of 16 percent to 24 percent.

The Times runs another ObamaCare mini-scare:

Keith Cruickshank, who lives in the San Diego area, got a cancellation notice from his insurer, Kaiser Permanente, and said the new policy he found in the state marketplace for himself, his wife and their son would cost an additional $4,000 or so a year.

“We support Obamacare, but are being singled out because we are healthy and earning above the subsidy level,” Mr. Cruickshank said. If given the choice to renew his old plan, he says he would.

If they are above the subsidy level they should be grateful for the chance to help those less fortunate. In fact, isn't it great that Obama is giving so many moderately successful people an opportunity to display their philanthropic side, rather than just trying to tax the truly rich?

FWIW, using this Kaiser Family Foundation subsidy calculator for California, it appears that the subsidy cut-off for the three member family described is about $80,000 per year. Soak the rich!

A silver plan costs $7,509 per year. There is not enoiugh info to compare deductibles, max out-of-pocket, or networks. Hey, buying insurance is complicated!

 

Comments

[Beasts of England]

How am I supposed to keep up?

[Jack is Back!]

BoE,

Do you subscribe to YelllowHammer.com?

Iron Bowl is looking more and more like the game of the year:)

[Jeff Dobbs]

If you like your up, you will be able to keep your up. Period.

[daddy]

Good Morning! 2 degrees F this AM and cold Brrrr.

Just got a nice note from Sandy Daze, giving me some tips on Military Tricare Medical Insurance in the course of which Sandy adds this:

Have been unable to post to JoM for a few days, using all of the usual tricks, dumping cache, changing name, email addy etc,

If anyone has any suggested fixes, please post 'em since Sandy is silently lurking.

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

Hello Sandy D!

[clarice]

wish I knew daddy and sandy. The ways of mighty Type Pad are mysterious.

[Jack is Back!]

SD,

Close the browser. Restart the computer. Sign in as "guest" or create another account "TyphusPirate". For website in the comment box use www.typepad.com.

Try putting a number in front of your new handle and a number afterwards. That seemed to work for me. Also, I can post links and photos but then out of nowhere it won't let me. That's when I just close the browser, restart the computer and change email addy and website.

[Jack is Back!]

Sandy,

Mean't to add that if the above doesn't work think about buying one of these

[daddy]

A refreshing write-up today from one of the Paleontologists in South Africa, explaining the importance and benefits of being open and honest about their Science discoveries, versus keeping them hidden for years on end.

What We Know and Don’t Know So Far

We ought to send a copy of his write-up to every ClimateGate Scientist on the planet.

[Beasts of England]

JiB - I've seen some linked articles. Something I need to investigate.

Iron Bowl insanity is sweeping the state. Seen more API car flags than I can ever remember. Haven't seen the boogs so confident since Cam-elot. They now think destiny is on their side - and they may be right.

[Beasts of England]

Sandy: Try signing up for a Typepad account and sign in through it. I've had better-than-Obamascare success in posting since doing so.

And you can get a carburetor avatar, too!

[peter]

Kudos, boe, you spelled carburetor right. One of the most commonly misspelled words along with impostor

[ipod touch pas cher]

You are so awesome! I do not suppose I have read anything like thast
before. So great to discover somebody with some orginal thoughts on this subject.
Really.. any thanks for starting this up. Thiis web site is something
that is required on the web, someone with some
originality!

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

personally, I can spell carburetor correctly because of the Brit pronunciation (Top Gear), the USA version sounds nothing like the spelling. Impost(or)... wow.. I never spell that correctly.

[peter]

from Iowahawk's twitter:

Remember that time the Bush administration argued in favor of Katrina at the Supreme Court?

[peter]

jib @ 1:13:

you left out burning sage leaves over the computer

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

Megan M, slowly --glacially-- starts letting the Progs know that ObummerCare is financially bankrupt and soon politically dead. Sad really that Bloomberg and her DC pals don't allow her to come out and simply state the facts of life-- ObummerCare will screw the Dems in '14, and turn to ashes in Obama's final 2 years, it's all good: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-11-19/wishful-thinking-can-t-hold-obamacare-together.html

[Beasts of England]

It was written out on my avatar, peter. In Italian!

[Ignatz]

I find I can spell many more words correctly now than I could just using a typewriter, pen or pencil. Can't explain it.

[Jack is Back!]

Peter, that was the point of my 1:20 post.

Interestingly, carburetor is spelled with the 'a' subbing for rhe 'e' in Dutch, French and Italian. Different suffixes of course but no 'e'. In German its a "Vergaser".

[Ignatz]

Holman Jenkins' WSJ Barrycare article someone couldn't link earlier.

[rse]

I have a new post up that talks about Unger among other things. http://www.invisibleserfscollar.com/multiple-recent-proclamations-laying-out-commitment-to-revolutionary-transformation-of-our-entire-society/

Laura-I think that was a great link on the other thread. As I have expressed it "we may not think we answer to UN in education but the UN does and the people who control the classrooms do." Rice and Powers and bo certainly do as does Arne.

[Beasts of England]

Fabbrica Italiana Carburatori
WEBER
Bologna (Italia)

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

Ignatz-- thanks for the link. Jenkins is a good man, and intelllectually honest. That makes him irrelevant right now-- right now we need fighters, down and dirty fighters who will not stop until ObummerCare is repealed-- once we have repealed the abomination, then we can be magnanimous in how to replace the healthcare finance system.

[bgates]

Kentucky, which has generally embraced the health care law and has said it will carry out Mr. Obama’s proposal

As the old saying goes, "the president proposes, a state insurance commissioner somewhere disposes, and the hell with Congress, they're a bunch of saboteur anarchists anyhow".

[Thomas Collins]

NK, when Holyfield fought Tyson in 1996 (the first fight), he fought as dirty as or at times even dirtier than Tyson did. But he also used his guile. I understand the view that repeal must come first. But I don't think that simply headbutting Obama will do the trick. Jenkins' proposal is akin to a solid combination of left jabs, right cross counters and strategic clinches. It will achieve a technical knockout of 404Care, which I happen to think is the more likely route to success than a Foreman one punch knockout of Moorer-type result (those of my friends here who don't care about or hate boxing, forgive the boxing analogies).

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

ThomasC-- I am open on how to best tactically defeat ObummerCare-- Indeed I was the scold here that stressed tactics in September when the 'defund-shutdown' debate came up. That said-- Jenkins may be too clever by more than a half. I admit, I don't do subtlety well, like Frankie Five Angels in GodfatherII I don't have a head for big deals and champagne cocktails. But if the 'reform' tactic guts ObummerCare and allows the jobs market to re-start without the Statist threat, I'd be happy to support that. But, the masses have to be able to understand what's going on.

[daddy]

Ha!

Poll: 40% in Toronto approve of Rob Ford's Job Performance

Poll: CBS News has Obummer at 37% approval

[henry]

Unexpected. Illinois mailed a tax refund check (for 2009*). I told the accounting dept to cash it before they declare bankruptcy.

* No interest included (easy promise to break I guess), still waiting for 2010 on.

[Thomas Collins]

Whoa, NK. You've trumped my boxing analogies with mob movie and closing dinner beverage analogies! :-))

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

Henry-- congrats on getting blood from the State of Illinois stone.

[peter]

James O'keefe promising a little action tomorrow.. can't wait 'til tomorrow, as a young Joe Namath once said......

[Jack is Back!]

daddy,

40% is what to expect from a City where every other person has their two front teeth missing, can skate backwards faster than we can skate forward and knows a thing or two about agitation and outlandish behavior, eh?

[jimmyk]

I told the accounting dept to cash it before they declare bankruptcy.

I can beat that: My mother did some work for the city of Detroit early in the year, sent them a bill this summer and figured that would be about as fruitful as a letter to Santa at the North Pole. Somehow the check came in the mail. Can't remember if it was pre- or post- actual bankruptcy, but close either way.

[anonamom]

So the Obamas and Clintons visited John Kennedy's grave today--
think the Bushes were invited, but declined?

Me neither.
Just like the political display for MLK's March on Washington anniversary. Not a R in sight.

This guy is so not up to the job.

[AliceH]

NR Cruise May 17 updates... I'm still waffling.

[Jane-Rebel Alliance1]

As peter said:

You were warned…
James O’Keefe tweeted HHS Secretary Kathleen Sebelius yesterday warning her that another bomb is about to drop.

I can't wait.

[jimmyk]

where every other person has their two front teeth missing

I like to tell the story of pitcher Tom Glavine. Though not Canadian, he was a good hockey player, but opted for baseball because he said he "wanted to keep his front teeth." One day, on a cab ride from Laguardia to Shea, the cabbie rear-ended someone, Glavine's face hit the plexiglass, and he lost his two front teeth.

There's no escaping destiny.

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

Dear Detroit Bankruptcy Judge--

Please disregard any comments from jimmyk regarding the payment, and timing thereof, of a sum of money by the City of Detroit to his mother. There is no issue concerning the timing of that transaction constituting a fraudulent conveyance in violation of the Automatic Stay under Chap 9 of the Bankruptcy Code, or any other provision of law. Respectfully submitted, A Friend of the Court.

[henry]

jimmyk, wow. Your mother cut it close. As it stands I have 3 more chances (plus at least one more if IL lasts past March 30). The set up estimated tax payments to force a loan to the state, which they then extend at their whim.

[jimmyk]

Thanks, NK. :)

[Old Lurker]

Any word on Steph yet???

[Jane-Rebel Alliance1]

There's no escaping destiny.

LOL

[Barbara]

You can fool some of the people some of the time
All of the people some of the time
And 40 to 47 percent of the people any time, any where

[Porchlight]

Happy birthday DrJ! Can't keep up today...

[Some Guy]

Speaking of narcolepsy,

ZZZzzzz

Err... I mean speaking of narcissists, A-Roid walked out of his grievance hearing today over the “injustice of it all”.

[Porchlight]

RCP approval average hovering at 40.3. Just look at that trendline at the end of the graph. Yikes.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/president_obama_job_approval-1044.html

[Beasts of England]

daddy@2:39 - So, JEF can pick up three points by hitting the glass pipe?

[maryrose]

Happy Birthday Dr. J.!
Can't wait to hear hear what O'Keefe has on ACA.
Steph:
feel better.

[Extraneus]

Huh? I thought the JOM style guide calls for "yike."

Btw, when times are darkest for Dem presidents, poll-wise, the slightest little bump results in ... Comeback Kid!

[rich@gmu]

damn it Beasts, I was thinking of writing that...

"There's no escaping destiny."

lol.

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

Porch- the job approval trend is fascinating; Obummer has had 3 PLUS BUMPS: 1. ObummerCare passed, and all the Legacy Media propaganda; 2. Bin Laden smoked and dumped in the Indian Ocean; 3. Post re-election-- good faith support. Otherwise, the trends are continously DOWN-- the more LiVs see of Obummer pushing Stimulus and Bush's fault, the less they like him, the more they see of ObummerCare and Gunz Grabbing and Spending, the Less they like him. What can he do to turn this around?

[James D.]

Btw, when times are darkest for Dem presidents, poll-wise, the slightest little bump results in ... Comeback Kid!

This worries me. For all that the media has been forced (both by reality, and by the mind-boggling stupidity of Zero's response to it) to air negative stories, they're still mostly good little progs who are surely hoping and praying for a chance to get back on the right side of history.

And besides that, the MSM is always looking for a changing narrative - the same story every day doesn't sell papers or ad time, so at some point, no matter what happens, they definitely will try to sell the "comeback" story.

[rich@gmu]

YIKE!!!

DOOM!!!

Ex-

I thought they started a war.

[Beasts of England]

Yikes!

[jimmyk]

JEF can pick up three points by hitting the glass

He's already done that, otherwise he'd be at 34%. Popularity created or saved.

[Jeff Dobbs]

Ext:
Huh? I thought the JOM style guide calls for "yike."

It does, it does. Of course, it also calls for people to not correct typos and to avoid apologizing.

And yet here we are.

[sbwaters]

Happy birthday, DrJ. Good health, HaterTot. And hope you are resting comfortably and in good shape, Stephanie.

Whew! Hope I haven't missed anyone while wading through the posts.

[rich@gmu]

the ECB toying with the idea of a negative deposit rate...hummm, don't think that is good.

[Jane-Rebel Alliance1]

I no longer care about Obama's ratings. What I want to see now is the complete and total demise of liberalism.

[jimmyk]

Daddy, I stole your 2:39, couldn't resist.

[jimmyk]

the ECB toying with the idea of a negative deposit rate

Buy mattress company stocks. Maybe wheelbarrow stocks later.

[Jane-Rebel Alliance1]

Obama is meeting with state Ins Commissioners at this moment. Will they cower?

[Beasts of England]

The JSG also calls for 'folk'.

[Some Guy]

Any of you legal eagles care to comment on A-Roid walking away from his grievance hearing?

Doesn’t this actually undermine his ability to pursue anything in Federal Court?

[Porchlight]

You can have "yikes" when you pry it out of my cold, dead hands. Or something.

[Porchlight]

Yes, happy news about the HaterTot, Cap'n.

Has Stephanie checked in yet?

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

A-Roid-- slimy guy with a slimy lawyer. Who knows, who cares.

[mad jack]

I'm rooting for Aroid to bleed the Yankees dry. Sorry TM.

[Beasts of England]

CNN calls ObamaCare a 'right-wing slur'.

What's our style guide say about 'fuktard'? Is it 'fuktard' or 'fuktards'?

[sbwaters]

CNN trying to dog whistle words.

[Jack is Back!]

Every thread needs a thematic photo:

[centralcal]

Little Matty Lauer (NBC) was all set to go to Wasilla - but that trip has been cancelled.

HowardKurtz ‏@HowardKurtz 42m

EXCLUSIVE: Sarah Palin cancels Matt Lauer interview to protest NBC's lack of action on Martin Bashir's slimy comments http://fxn.ws/1h3hjdE

-----

Good for Sarah! More pols on our side need to stand firm when slandered by the media and say, "no thanks."

[Carol Herman]

How many people go without insurance?

Wasn't it once a given that when you worked, your employer provided a health care plan.

And, of course, people who were self-employed, made choices;including keeping their insurance costs LOW, LOW, LOW.

Seems that's all gone, now. Cancelled plans means there are people getting sick who have no insurance at all. And, most hospitals have dedicated billing departments who go to great lengths to get a patient's bills COVERED. Medicaid is one route.

But as of today ... what's happening with the growing uninsured pool?

Did you know at doctors offices the first person you see is the receptionist. Who asks for payment. (Or co-payment.)

Oh, and if you lost your job recently, what's happened to COBRA?

COBRA was an 18-months healthcare coverage policy, that took effect as soon as you lost your job. Is that now gone, too?

Given that ObamaCare has put onerous laws on the books, come January 1st ... what parts of the population ... formally covered ... remain uncovered?

Congress, over the holidays, will be out on holiday.

Meanwhile? Accidents happen. And, people get sick. What will you see when the curtain rises on 2014?

Don't you wish the GOP had answers?

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

Oy Gevalt.....

[DebinNC]

BOzo campaigning in CO in Aug. 2012 (USA Today):

"The Affordable Care Act -- also known as Obamacare," Obama said to applause from backers at the University of Denver. "I actually like the name," he added. "Because I do care -- that's why we fought so hard to make it happen."

[daddy]

Time to start lying to the FAA again:

FAA to check overweight pilots, air traffic controllers

The FAA is instituting a new Flight Physical Parameter, Body Fat, under the reasoning that if you're above a BMI of 30, you are more liable to have sleep apnea than somebody under a BMI of 30.

The FAA has decided that evaluations (will) include employees with a lower BMI of 30.

Body mass index calculates weight divided by height. That means a 6-foot tall man with a BMI of 40 would weigh nearly 300 pounds. The same man would weigh 220 pounds with a BMI of 30.

So if I'm 6 foot tall and I weigh 220 pounds (very easy to be that weight if I'm any kind of body builder or even a lay-around in fairly decent shape), now suddenly I am afraid of the FAA Nazi's putting my livelihood in jeopardy every 6 months due to some new body fat evaluation mandate.

Here's my prediction---The FAA is going to find that the Blood Pressure readings of tons of Pilots are going to go through the roof. This mandate is going to make everybody's blood pressure go up, and high blood pressure (Hypertension) is a hell of a lot more of a serious problem than if I'm a 6 feet tall weight lifting pilot who weighs 220, and have trouble sleeping.

Dumbasses!#$%

[Jack is Back!]

Frederick and I were talking about the loose use of the word "racists" by the media and politicians. He heard some reporter or talking head using the word and wanted to know why if you say something about Obama it was "racist". I explained that there may be cases where the criticism is "racist" but the huge majority are criticism of his policies, or managment, or leadership.

He understood the difference but not why the media and press personalities seemed to use the word everyday. That I explained is called "ad hominem" attacking the person not his criticism. Like the bully at school who calls you "weird" or "stupid" because you ask good questions during social studies (true story) rather than argue the points of the question or answer.

Its tough being a parent these days. Kids have more digital influence and bias direction than I had as a kid. We didn't even have a TV until I was 12. This is one reason I have bought him Rush Revere and The Brave Pilgrims. He needs solid education of who we really are and where our values originated not something a sound bite on TV provides.

[narciso]

Carlos Slim's chimp seems to miss, that opposition to Obamacare, is in part that people wanted to keep their policies.

[Jack is Back!]

daddy,

My PT told me that BMI is totally discredited in the physical training circles. They go with BAI - Body Andiposty Index where they measure your hip circumference to height.

If this is a new rule making by FAA they should be open for comments for a period of time, right?

[Beasts of England]

BMI is a ridiculous metric. I'm 6'-4", 205; which yields a BMI of 25 - borderline overweight. Whatever...

[narciso]

This interesting profile, raises more questions then answers;

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702303309504579181962177007316

[narciso]

I know that this shouldn't be surprising at this point;

http://legalinsurrection.com/2013/11/zimmerman-girlfriend-shopping-interview-for-money-prior-to-911-call/

[Jane-Rebel Alliance1]

Matt posted something reminding us that Obama moved the Census into the WH right after he was elected in 2008. I remember it. Given the latest cooking of the unemployment numbers scandal, it all makes sense now.

I find it amazing how prepared the administration was for any kind of cheating necessary to get whatever they wanted.

[sbwaters]

JiB, I think someone who abuses the word racist is a "racialist" . . .

but I think that word is tagged for something else. I don't care. Bigots who falsely accuse others of bigotry are racialists.

[narciso]

Yes, Jane we found that out, around the time, Gregg was considering taking the Commerce job.

[Man Tran on iPhone]

RSE,

As I slowly creep out of the sightless cave, I'm getting ready to order some books and CDs from Amazon and wanted to confirm whether you had decided on offering your book through your website with signed copies. One way or the other I'm getting several copies to pass around.

[narciso]

Lurch develops trace of self awareness;

http://news.yahoo.com/muslim-brotherhood-stole-egypts-revolution-kerry-200321098.html?soc_src=mediacontentstory

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

Lurch... Blind Squirrel finds nut, nothing more.

[Porchlight]

BMI is stupid. It's not even common sensical on its face. I have no idea (well, I do have some idea) how it has survived so long in the "health" industry.

[Porchlight]

I remember that too, Jane, and I remember thinking he was up to no good. Of course the supine press didn't utter a peep.

[Porchlight]

Quinny has Obama job approval at 36/59 in...Colorado.

http://hotair.com/archives/2013/11/20/brutal-quinnipiac-poll-of-colorado-obamas-job-approval-at-3659-hillary-now-trails-three-republican-contenders/

[narciso]

the journal piece, tells the tale of how a Chechen junior officer, although he has a Georgian name, ended up on the front lines of the Syrian jihad.

[clarice]

.B., Dr J!

[cathyf]

A random thought out there...

In a free market where people who buy insurance before they get sick can contractually protect themselves from freeloaders who wait to get sick before buying their insurance, a policy with a particular set of deductibles/co-pays/out-of-pocket/etc has a particular value. This value has two parts -- one has to do with the probabilities of getting sick during the year and how much the bills would be during the year. But the OTHER part of the policy value is its renewability in the face of coming down with a serious (expensive) health condition that extends into the future after the year is over. This renewal option has significant value in a legal regime where diligent insurance buyers are protected against the freeloaders who wait until after they get sick to buy insurance.

By eliminating the pre-existing condition exclusions, EVERYBODY gets the option to buy insurance in the future no matter whether they get sick or not, and they get it for free. So Obamacare inherently lowers the VALUE of every insurance policy to the policyholders (the buyers).

At the same time, Obamacare dumps all of these sick people (who gambled and lost and didn't buy insurance before they got sick) into the insurance risk pools. All of the insurance policies in aggregate must bring in enough revenue in premiums to pay the aggregate claims, and by allowing the freeloaders in to the risk pools the revenue needed goes up. In other words, this sharply raises the COST of every insurance policy.

The most fundamental law of economics is that transactions only take place when there exists a price/quantity point where the buyers value the good MORE than the price, and the sellers value the price at MORE than the good.

So Obamacare hits that from BOTH sides: the reason that the Obamacare policies are overpriced is not primarily about the coverages being bought, it's that the post-Obamacare policies no longer include a get-out-of-financial-ruin option for healthy people who get sick later. The reason that the policies cost so much more for the insurance companies to write is that they no longer protect premium-payers from freeloaders.

It looks pretty likely to me that in a post-Obamacare world the demand curve and the supply curve never meet -- there is NO price where the insurance is worth that to the buyers to buy and the sellers to sell.

So the next time you hear a comment about "overpriced Obamacare policies" remember that they are not just overpriced because of the coverages, but they are even more overpriced because they no longer provide protection against financial ruin for part of the premium price. The government has decreed that EVERYONE gets the option for free.

[Jack is Back!]

narciso,

They do share a border and he served in the Georgian army that we were training - quelle surprise!

[clarice]

Make that Happy Birthday, Dr J.

[daddy]

Dennis Miller and VDH having an excellent conversation on his radio show.

Dennis just put it nicely: I don't even start listening to anything Obama says until he gets past the "But" fulcrum in a sentence and then he starts listening because that's when Obama starts saying what he actually means and intends to do.

[narciso]

Ah, Ingraham, used to call it the but monkey,

[Dave (in MA)]

Ha,

404Care-fail.gov went down at a Cruella photo op. in Miami:
hotair link