Live Free Or Die Hard

John Boehner battles the right on the new budget deal.

Comments

[rich@gmu]

another new thread. posting machine Tom.

[Some Guy]

John Boehner's reaction to conservative group's reaction is ridiculous

[MarkO]

Let me say again, internecine bloodletting.

Or, anyone but Cruz.

[Jack is Back!]

I may have to hold my nose but I don't want any distractions from 404Care. As pre-pastoral Charlie Colson would say: "When you have them by the balls, their hearts and minds will follow".

We need a simple message come 11/14 and so far repealing ObamaCare has a much higher acceptance rate than the budget deal or shutting down government has with the rank and file voters especially the indies.

[Danube on iPad]

I'm with JiB. Until we get a GOP president and congress, we're simply not going to get a budget we like. Focus on the near-term hurdles.

[jimmyk on iPad]

"Until we get a GOP president and congress, we're simply not going to get a budget we like."

Factoring in the PR ineptitude and general spinelessness of the Rs, that may be so, if the only way to force a better outcome is via shutdown or the debt ceiling. If there's an R sweep in 2016 the first reform should be some sort of zero-based budgeting, so that every dollar spent has to be affirmatively passed.

[James D.]

I understand the logic behind avoiding a shutdown and a fight that will distract from the ongoing public disaster of Zerocare.

But...

Any deal that Harry Reid, Patty Murray and Zero are happy with is by definition a bad deal.

And isn't Zerocare in itself all the proof anyone could ever need that the current Dem leadership is both utterly corrupt and breathtakingly incompetent when it comes to actual governance?

Why would "reaching out" to them EVER be something to be proud of?

I know the muddle likes "bipartisanship" but at some point our side needs to start getting the message out that the Dems are not basically decent people with slightly different ideas on where the tax rate ought to be and so forth; but instead they are fundamentally dishonest people whose primary goal is to loot the public treasury to line their own pockets and those of their friends, and whose secondary goal is to enthrone themselves as a permanent aristocratic ruling class with authority over every aspect of our lives.

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

JiB-- I agree with that. And frankly, I think Boehner is just blowing off steam here at people fund raising off of attacking him. All's fair in politics (ain't beanbag), and that includes Boehner calling out 'fiscal conservatives' who in reality are just fundraising for their next mortgage or car payment. Just because someone's a political conservative doesn't mean they're not a self-serving pig. If they want to rebut Boehner and prove they are not fundraising off of this, I'd be glad to hear from them.

[James D.]

Until we get a GOP president and congress, we're simply not going to get a budget we like

I wouldn't hold my breath for one even if we do get all of that. We had one from 2001-2006, and we got "compassionate conservatism" and No Child Left Behind and Medicare Part D, etc.

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

OT-- here's just another reason to admire Ted Cruz's moxie and political instincts-- he rides with the 20 CBC members to South Africa, and debates 1 against 20 the whole way and back. Not a heavy lift for Cruz's intellect, but admirable: http://dailycaller.com/2013/12/10/democrats-gave-cruz-an-earful-on-flight-to-south-africa/#!

[boatbuilder]

Heritage and the others are "Conservative groups" whose job is to advocate their members views as effectively as possible--that is what they are doing. Boehner and Ryan are elected politicians, whose job is to advance the interests of their various constituencies as well as they can within the parliamentary system. Publicly dissing their constituents is profoundly stupid as pure political strategy. Why can't they just say--"we understand their concerns and are doing what we can to advance the cause of controlling spending within the constraints we face, and will continue to work toward that goal, blah, blah, blah." Those who want true spending control understand this. What the politicos' thin-skinned reaction says to me and those who agree fundamentally if not necessarily strategically with the "conservative groups" is that this is all they plan to do, that they value the interests and opinions of "the center" over those of 'the right"--and that "the right" should shut up. Bad politics, even if that is how they really feel.

[Old Lurker]

Ditto that, JiB.

The sad thing is he need not have said anything at all.

[Old Lurker]

And ditto Boatbuilder, too.

Carry on.

[boatbuilder]

And, NK, if their motivation is pique over self-serving fundraising by interest groups, then they are really stupid, since all they have done is dramatically improved the climate for such fundraising.

[boatbuilder]

look for some "strange new respect" for Ryan's "strange new normal."
I like the guy and I understand what he's up against, but I'm beginning to wonder...

[Jane]

I may have to hold my nose but I don't want any distractions from 404Care.

That's my position too but I feel like a traitor.

[jimmyk on iPhone]

"I wouldn't hold my breath for one even if we do get all of that. We had one from 2001-2006, and we got "compassionate conservatism" and No Child Left Behind and Medicare Part D, etc."

Which is why we need as many new faces on the R side as possible. A majority of retreads will revert to business as usual.

[Jojo]

Ditto James D. Anything that delights Reid, Obama and Murray has just gotta be more favorable for them than it is for the Republicans.

[AliceH]

I've always respected Ryan as a budget wonk who is very talented at seeing outside the usual program structures and recognizing multi-layers of influence/impact to each area of change, but I've not seen much that made me think of him as either "conservative" or even a strong policy guy. Maybe he is - it's the sort of thing I can be wrong about. Just not sure where the "conservative cred" comes from that can't be more easily explained by "wonk".

[matt]

In other news, the sign language translator for Obama was actually signing in Austrian and actually said:

"if you like your dead president you can keep your dead president"

[rich@gmu]

>>>Just not sure where the "conservative cred" comes from<<<

we are so starved for leadership.

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

I know I'm repeating myself-- but if you want better budgets, elect a Repub Senate. Obummer then vetoes the Budgets, and kills the Dems in '16. Carry on.

[Ignatz]

I won't be happy with a federal budget until it resembles one from about 1924.....or maybe 1824.

[MarkO]

Mickey Kaus ‏@kausmickey

Thought: Conservatives shldnt have their budget deals negotiated by ambitious pols who want glowing profiles in MSM http://www.politico.com/story/2013/12/the-new-paul-ryan-100990.html#.Uqi8pUROpho.twitter …

View summary

[Tonto]

Off topic and more family boosterism! Thomas Sowell recommends my husband's book "Why We won't Talk Honestly About Race" (now in paperback!) for Xmas giving. And who am I do second guess Mr. Sowell?

[Danube on iPad]

"...if the only way to force a better outcome is via shutdown or the debt ceiling."

I certainly know of none.

[Beasts of England]

Damn you Thai pad!

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

Ignatz@2:32-- you're an honest man.

[MarkO]

This may be the best available deal, but Boehner did not need to defame part of his party. Even BOR can see that the GOP has no coherent plan. Is that not the responsibility of the Leadership?

[Beasts of England]

@DoT - no amount of un-cashed dividend checks could ever overcome his departure. Maybe we could get Muschamp or Kiffin...

[lyle]

How is it Ryan, putatively the brightest budget wonk in the GOP, could get outwitted by Patti Murray? She's one of the Senate's biggest imbeciles--quite a feat, I'd say considering her competition for the title.

[centralcal]

Very cool, Tonto!

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

DoT-- actully there is only one way, because the Shutdown was proven to be a political dead end in October. So between and November let's talk about nothing except Obummercare and the Debt (unless the Mullahs decide to do a demonstration detonation).

[lyle]

Just picked up my WSJ. The MFM is in full Dem sucking mode. Again.

[sbwaters]

The "Budget Deal" should be accompanied by plain English opinions signed by each representative so each can stand or fall on their own understanding of it.

First and foremost should be Ryan's explaining what he agrees and disagrees with.

"The best deal we could get" is not an adequate parsing of what has been perpetrated on us. And anyone who uses that phrase should be hounded out of office.

[jimmyk]

Two things I disliked about Ryan's presentation. First, it was phrased in terms of "cuts," which is meaningless. I want to know what total spending is relative to the previous fiscal year, and for the ten or so years prior.

Second, he played the game of distinguishing "fees" from "taxes." BS. And why should airlines and air travelers be disproportionately penalized for DC's profligacy?

[Miss Marple]

sbw,

This is a serious question. If the dems are recalcitrant on certain points, and you take the best deal you can get, then what do you call it?

[Marlene]

Boehner said out loud in public what he's been saying in private about the conservatives and Tea Party. boatbuilder @ 1:54 is exactly right.

[lyle]

Second, he played the game of distinguishing "fees" from "taxes." BS. And why should airlines and air travelers be disproportionately penalized for DC's profligacy?

Cantor was pulling the same fees vs taxes shit last night on Kudlow. As if commercial airflight couldn't get more unpalatable than it is now.

[MaryD]

Tonto, I had no idea who your husband is! I've read and tremendously enjoyed "I Can't Believe I'm Sitting Next to a Republican" and I have "Will Tripp, Pissed Off Attorney at Law" on my Kindle. I will definitely be getting the book on race. I love his style!

[Ignatz]

Tonto,
You mentioned Harry Stein was your hubby before didn't you?
Wonderful writer. Used to read him at City Journal too, but he's not there anymore is he?

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

east Hampton is a great writers enclave.

[lyle]

Congrats, Tonto. I've read excerpts of I Can't Believe I'm Sitting Next to a Republican.

[daddy]

Caller to the Dennis Miller Show said that he was watching the guy at Mandela's Funeral doing the phony hand signals for the deaf. He said that once he deciphered what the guy was signaling he immediately stole second base:)

[Jane]

Well done Mr. Tonto. Well done.

[cathyf]

Well, daddy, it looked like they were in a stadium. Seems only fair to play a ballgame!

[Some Guy]

the guy at Mandela's Funeral doing the phony hand signals for the deaf.

Wasn't Garrett Morris available?

[narciso,]

What struck me, is that neither Carlos Slim's scratchpad, Rupert's Gazette, or USA Today, saw fit to note the selfie that went around the
world, despite the same Gazette, had a piece on selfies, as for the Boehner deal, it's Chinatown,
Jake.

[Account Deleted]

Narciso,

It's possible John and Mitch are being driven mad by the incessant tolling of the bells.

[I R A Darth Aggie]

So, Cryin' John is going against Mitch the Knife?

[lyle]

It's possible John and Mitch are being driven mad by the incessant tolling of the bells.

Magnificent, Rick.

[grabasstic politic]

OK. It's about time we changed the ID of conservatives. 'Right' sounds too much like 'correct' and I doubt any consistency. I prefer Up/Down to Left/Right so from now on, you're Downers.

[Miss Marple]

McConnell: is he really opposing this deal? Is it because he has a primary challenger who opposes it? Or is he flying a false flag to lure in some people like Mary Landreu to vote for it, thinking it wont pass, whereupon he decides to change his mind?

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

McConnell opposing is a not so much a surprise, when it only takes 50 votes to pass the Budget Resolution. Let the Senate Dems pass this useless compromise themselves.

[Danube on iPad]

Must be an interesting guy to be married to, Tonto.

[narciso,]

just more in the chronicle of the absurd;

http://freebeacon.com/white-house-iranian-ballistic-missile-test-not-a-deal-killer/

[narciso,]

Chutzpah in another language;

http://freebeacon.com/sebelius-says-she-would-have-delayed-obamacare-rollout/

[Captain Hate]

As Stephanie pointed out, at some point the Repubs have to actually stand for something rather than not being for 404Care.

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

FreeBeacon: So the Mullahs launching an ICBM capable rocket next week, doesn't invalidate the 'deal'...hmmm.... what if the Mullahs put an inert, but otherwise functional miniturized nuke capable warhead on the rocket. Does Obummer object to that? Unfucking believable. Plus the kerry quote about praying no one gets killed by this deal, and sebelius asking for a do-over, are equally Unfucking believable incompetence and down right dangerous nature of the Obamaniacs.

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

...proof of incompetence...

[narciso,]

Those too examples, show how ridiculous is the notion of trusting anything coming from 'Patty Cake' Murray, shirley they can't be serious.

But the press performs it's dutiful Victorian gent role, as Tom Wolfe put it, trying to represent what could have been an episode of Pzych as a solemn occasion,

[peter]

The guy doing the fake sign language could do a better job of negotiating with the Iranians than Lurch

[narciso,]

Don't do anything, that will make us arrest you,
or do, it doesn't matter,

http://legalinsurrection.com/2013/12/prosecutors-to-drop-zimmerman-domestic-violence-charges/

[narciso,]

they should have a cartoon section,

http://www.truthrevolt.org//news/politico-mag-joe-biden-one-most-consequential-vps

[Captain Hate]

Maybe autocorrect changed "constipated".

[Ignatz]

--Used to read him at City Journal too, but he's not there anymore is he?--

Answering my own question-- Mr. Tonto is still at City Journal.

[Jack is Back!]

One of my biggest regrets is not taking the time to go out to Easthampton (15 miles away) and sitting down on the bench outside the ex-Driessens Ice Cream Parlor with tonto, Harry and the few, the proud, the Hampton Conservatives:)

However, I don't think I can convince Harry to run against Tim Bishop but Tim is in trouble this time. Even in the "manhattanisation" of the Hamptons there is big anger over 404Care plus Common Core (you betcha, if you're reading this rse). Plus Tim has an Ethics issue before that committee in the house.

This a bellweather district to watch. NY 1st. If it goes GOP then the Dems are in bigger trouble than they think.

[MarkO]

DOOM

Kathleen Sebelius ‏@Sebelius

My globetrotting friend @JohnKerry is turning 70 today, but he doesn’t look a day past 50! #JKat70

Retweeted by Jake Tapper

[Ignatz]

Entertaining story by Kemosabe which reveals some pretty disturbing behavior by Tonto. :)

[narciso,]

I had no idea, tonto was Harry Stein, I guess I should have been more observant,

Don't even try to have it make sense;

http://minx.cc/?post=345637

[Ignatz]

Tonto is Harry Stein's wife, narc.

[Jeff Dobbs]

According the style guide, you have that backwards, Iggy.

Harry Stein is Mr. Tonto.

[Ignatz]

May have already been linked but scientists discover 120,000 cubic miles of fresh water under the ocean.
That's 100 times the water humanity has used in the last 100 years.

The planet is chock-a-block full of natural gas and petroleum, it has steadfastly refused to warm for fifteen years and now its cup runneth over with fresh water.

How long before the environmentalists get sick of being made into fools by Gaia and they declare Mudda Earth an enemy of the state rather than a big lump of dirt to worship?

[Ignatz]

Ugh, hit.

[rich@gmu]

>>>Posted by: NK(withnewsoftware)<<<

YIKE!!!

guess you got to your upper limit.

In re: Iran that is is pretty much standard behavior re: non-proliferation...saw the same thing all through the 90's...a partial agreement, lie it is working, another round of talks, announce an improved agreement

[narciso,]

How anyone can look at a hurricane or a tsunami, and conclude we are the prime actor on the planet, is a sign of arrogance,

[rich@gmu]

>>>How long before the environmentalists get sick of being made into fools by Gaia and they declare Mudda Earth an enemy of the state rather than a big lump of dirt to worship?<<<

maybe we could offer them all one way trips to mars.

[Gmax]

the Dems are in bigger trouble than they think.

Actually, Cueball Carville has already told them how deep the tapioca is, and only the terminally naïve a la Debbie Does America, failed to catch the drift of a - 11 shift in sentiment.

The amazing thing to me so far, is that the revolt in the Senate has not spilled out into public view. I don't expect it to be contained behind closed doors much longer.

A challenger in Omaha to the Republican congressman, unannounced his candicy today. That was a district Obama carried in 08 so that ought to buttress the obvious.

[Jane]

Tom Price on Special Report talking about his alternative health care plan and the newly passed budget. I found him impressive.

[narciso,]

Well we have the same idjit as JiB, would put it,

[narciso,]

in charge of the agreement, Wendy Sherman, of the Albright and Berger ship,

[BB Key]

Iggy. Great link I sent it to all my acquaintances that are still married :)
Tonto you and your partner were well paired until surrounded....what do you mean we Kemosabe ?

[Extraneus]

Didn't Harry Stein quote me from here in his book? Why, I believe he did. :-)

(Page 14 on Look Inside.)

[matt]

my greatest concern, ig, is the state of the oceans. The world is running down fish stocks far faster than they can replenish.

As a sports fisherman I've seen the illegal Taiwanese boats in the South Pacific, and they have even caught them off the Argentine coast.

Go off of Baja California and it's obvious someone's paying mordida because they are scooping up whole schools with illegal nets.

You get into an awful lot of the law of the commons as well. Many of the most valuable species are pelagic and a lot of those migration patterns touch on 10 or 12 countries sometimes.

The waste is incredible. 20-25% or more is cast overboard dead. The longliner stories are famous.

And yet the sea is our greatest source and greatest potential source of sustenance. I think God will provide in so many ways, such as the huge stores of gas & oil we're recently found, but going forward we have to be mindful of depletion. At some point there will be peak oil.

Accessing and controlling the extraction of that water is going to be a huge challenge, and the ecosystem is/was until recently in relative balance.

And more mysterious, how did it get there? How are we finding massive shale fields, perhaps around the globe? I think the geology and the paleontology is going to get even more interesting.

The more you know, the more you realize what you don't know.

[DrJ]

matt,

The world is running down fish stocks far faster than they can replenish.

Did you know that the pounds of fish that are farmed per year exceeds that of beef? That's where the future is, for the bulk of the fish supply.

That's not to ignore the fishing violations. Fresh and wild fish will become more scarce and expensive.

[Annoying Old Guy]

Anything that delights Reid, Obama and Murray has just gotta be more favorable for them than it is for the Republicans.

Hmmmm, weren't all of them delighted over POR-care? (Pelosi-Obama-Reid-care).

[narciso,]

True, Matt, but why the focus on Hubbard's peak, a decade ago, why did Matt Simmons go along with it, the geography of the whole fracking landscape is interesting, part of our previous unknown knowns,

[Danube on iPad]

"Go off of Baja California and it's obvious someone's paying mordida because they are scooping up whole schools with illegal nets."

The Japanese long-liners have applied enormous fishing pressure off Baja.

[Tonto]

Hey, fangs a lot, Ignatz, for posting that one! We had a huge tag sale early this last summer, of all our stuff from storage. Nothing went back into the house. All my best books are now in Tucson (better for books than high-humidity East Hampton), but I think we're going to bail on AZ in the next few years.

Mr. Tonto is still with City Journal and working (as always) on another book. His father (also a writer) was working until (literally, really literally not the Sean Hannity or Curtis Sliwa extravagant use of the word) until the day he died -- at 98. As a matter of fact Mr. Tonto's last conversation with his father was a political back and forth. My father-in-law was an old commie (literally!) and was horribly distressed by his son's move to the right. Which Harry has written about a lot. Andrew Breitbart told us that his book (How I ...etc.) was one of his major influences on his move right.

Probably TMI but what the hey! Two glasses of wine into the wind.

[Ignatz]

--At some point there will be peak oil.--

Yes but that peak keeps retreating faster than a French army spotting a Hun.

Not sure what the solution is for overfishing;
Mandatory vegan diets for all lefties?
A nuclear exchange between Japan, Taiwan and China?
Territorial limits of 2000 miles?

[rich@gmu]

Tonto-

have a third...pours wine. Had no idea. wow.

[Tonto]

Extraneous -- that is you, of course, on page 14. The paperback might have different pagination!

[rich@gmu]

ownership rights to the fish in water.

[rich@gmu]

looked and couldn't find it...

[Ignatz]

Easy there Tonto. Me no want heap trouble with feisty squaw full of firewater.

[narciso,]

Apparently not, then again dealing with Patty Murray, and losing;

http://therightscoop.com/mark-levin-do-republicans-not-understand-that-the-whole-damn-thing-is-going-to-collapse/

[Captain Hate]

My first mistake is forgetting Tonto is a she... Kudos to Mr Tonto.

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

what is the opposite of rose colored glasses?

[governing is HARD]

Boner just wasted his Viagra.

""Speaker Boehner's real problem here isn't with conservative groups like FreedomWorks, it's with millions of individual Americans who vote Republican because they were told the GOP was the party of small government and fiscal responsibility," Matt Kibbe, the president of FreedomWorks, said in a statement.

Kibbe went on: "Once again Republicans, led by John Boehner, are working with Democrats to increase spending yet again on the taxpayers' tab while promising 'savings' down the road. We know how this movie ends. How can leadership credibly promise spending cuts later, after agreeing to a plan that rolls back the sequester savings promised two debt increases ago? There's a predictable pattern here."

At a press conference Wednesday, a visibly angry Boehner said conservative groups who oppose the two-year budget deal stuck by Rep. Paul Ryan (R-WI) and Sen. Patty Murray (D-WA) are "using our members and they're using the American people for their own goals. This is ridiculous." Moments earlier, during a closed-door meeting, Boehner told House Republicans that the well-funded and influential organizations "aren't acting out of principle, and they're not trying to enact conservative policies. They're using you to raise money and expand their own organization," he said, according to a source in the room.

[narciso,]

blood spattered like Moe Green!

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-12-11/santelli-stockman-blast-festering-fiscal-budget-deal-betrayal