Obama Quit In Afghanistan

Tear out the front page! Here is a shocker from former SecDef Gates, as reported by Bob Woodward:

In a new memoir, former defense secretary Robert Gates unleashes harsh judgments about President Obama’s leadership and his commitment to the Afghanistan war, writing that by early 2010 he had concluded the president “doesn’t believe in his own strategy, and doesn’t consider the war to be his. For him, it’s all about getting out.”

Leveling one of the more serious charges that a defense secretary could make against a commander in chief sending forces into combat, Gates asserts that Obama had more than doubts about the course he had charted in Afghanistan. The president was “skeptical if not outright convinced it would fail,” Gates writes in “Duty: Memoirs of a Secretary at War.”

So Obama was sending our young men and women off to a meat grinder with no real confidence in the likelihood of success. How like Lyndon Johnson.

Here is the NY Times version:

Obama Lost Faith in His Afghan Strategy, Book Asserts

In His New Memoir, Robert M. Gates, the Former Defense Secretary, Offers a Critique of the President

By THOM SHANKER

WASHINGTON — After ordering a troop increase in Afghanistan, President Obama eventually lost faith in the strategy, his doubts fed by White House advisers who continually brought him negative news reports suggesting it was failing, according to his former defense secretary Robert M. Gates.

In a new memoir, Mr. Gates, a Republican holdover from the Bush administration who served for two years under Mr. Obama, praises the president as a rigorous thinker who frequently made decisions “opposed by his political advisers or that would be unpopular with his fellow Democrats.” But Mr. Gates says that by 2011, Mr. Obama began criticizing — sometimes emotionally — the way his policy in Afghanistan was playing out.

At a pivotal meeting in the situation room in March 2011, called to discuss the withdrawal timetable, Mr. Obama opened with a blast of frustration — expressing doubts about Gen. David H. Petraeus, the commander he had chosen, and questioning whether he could do business with the Afghan president, Hamid Karzai.

“As I sat there, I thought: The president doesn’t trust his commander, can’t stand Karzai, doesn’t believe in his own strategy and doesn’t consider the war to be his,” Mr. Gates wrote. “For him, it’s all about getting out.”

I wish these two could agree on the timing of Gates' insight - per the Times, the "all about getting out" moment was March 2011; per Woodward,

...by early 2010 he had concluded the president “doesn’t believe in his own strategy, and doesn’t consider the war to be his. For him, it’s all about getting out.”

Well. I was saying the same thing back in September 2009. Activate the auto-quote:

Briefly, I think Obama escalated in Afghanistan for political show - he wanted to back his famous 2002 anti-Iraq war speech about not being opposed to all wars, just dumb ones with some suitably fierce rhetoric, so he campaigned on the notion that we had to abandon Iraq and win on the real battlefield of Afghanistan, despite the many obvious obstacle to success....

[A]s of January 20 2009 the US had better chances for something like a victory in Iraq than in Afghanistan, but Obama has remained committed to pursuing the lesser chance.  For now - who doubts that the anti-war left will turn on the Afghan adventure and Obama will be quick to blame Bush and turn with them?

And again in July 2010, which may or may not have put me ahead of Gates in ruminating about Obama's goals in Afghanistan:

Plenty of progressives are wondering what happened to that nice lefty they voted for, and are wondering when his inner dove will fly forth.  Believe me, plenty of righties are wondering the same thing.

My official editorial position is that if we had Lincoln in the White House, the Afghani equivalent of George Washington in Kabul, and Generals Marshall and Eisenhower peering at maps of Kandahar, we might still lose in Afghanistan.  Gen. Petraeus is a great general and a great American, but he is not partnered with Lincoln and Washington.

Conversely, we might be lucky enough to win even without a President committed to victory, but I don't think it is worth the chance.  It's too late now, but it would have been better if Obama had never escalated the war.

Yeah, Obama lacked commitment to victory in Afghanistan, and in a subsequent post I noticed that the sun rises in the East (and the sky was blue!). There is no way it took Gates until March 2011 to figure that out.

CAN WE IGNORE A SWIPE AT HILLARY? From Woodward:

Gates offers a catalogue of various meetings, based in part on notes that he and his aides made at the time, including an exchange between Obama and then-Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton that he calls “remarkable.”

He writes: “Hillary told the president that her opposition to the [2007] surge in Iraq had been political because she was facing him in the Iowa primary. . . . The president conceded vaguely that opposition to the Iraq surge had been political. To hear the two of them making these admissions, and in front of me, was as surprising as it was dismaying.”

Wow, Hillary's opposition to the surge was political? Just like her support of the AUMF in 2002 was political. Which makes this genius wrong twice.

As a timesaver, future writers might just want to list the decisions Hillary made that were not political. Put them in the World's Shortest Books collection.

LATE ADD: Per The Fix, I am on the expressway to Obvious Street:

How Bob Gates’s memoir could haunt Hillary in 2016

By Chris Cillizza

In a new memoir of his time as secretary of defense in the Obama administration, Gates writes: “Hillary told the president that her opposition to the [2007] surge in Iraq had been political because she was facing him in the Iowa primary. . . . The president conceded vaguely that opposition to the Iraq surge had been political. To hear the two of them making these admissions, and in front of me, was as surprising as it was dismaying.”

...

Opposing the surge was cast by many political observers as a sign to the left that she had evolved since her vote for the use-of-force resolution earlier in the decade.

At one level, Gates's allegation is not at all surprising. Politicians factor in politics when making decisions? Gasp! And they occasionally adjust their policy positions based on the changing winds of public opinion? Double gasp! (Also worth noting: Gates praises Clinton at other points in the memoir, lauding her as "smart, idealistic but pragmatic, tough-minded, indefatigable, funny, a very valuable colleague, and a superb representative of the United States all over the world.")

But, remember this is Hillary Clinton we are talking about.  And, the criticism that has always haunted her is that everything she does is infused with politics -- that there is no core set of beliefs within her but rather just political calculation massed upon political calculation.

It's nice to see this getting attention, then.

 

Comments

[Miss Marple]

NK, I think this explains a LOT of people in Washington. The fact that the president is an American-hating, Islamic-sympathizing Marxist is something from bad movie plots or comic books.

They have been in denial for quite some time.

It's possible Gates wrote the book to wake them up.

[narciso]

But W as evil/idiot makes perfect sense to them.

[Miss Marple]

Captain Hate!

I see that Giffords husband is now going to throw her out of planes. She's going to skydive on the 3rd anniversary of her shooting, live on The Today Show.

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

Narc-- yes it does make sense to them. They are all mentally il, and living a lie. Yes it makes sense to them.

Miss M-- that's why I want to read the book. Personally, I'm most interested what Gates has to say about Benghazi.

[narciso]

Paddy Chayesfsky, was left screaming from the great beyond.

[Jim Miller]

The Gates book is a big story? Not at the Seattle Times, apparently. I just checked their index for today, and it doesn't appear at all.

For some time I have been arguing that you can understand them if you assume that they are trying to comfort the Seattle area's comfortable leftists. That explains the stories they cover, the stories they omit, and the slant that you can find in almost every political story.

Credit where due: Hyper partisan Seattle PI columnist Joel Connelly did a review of the book. (The PI still exists on line, and sometimes has better coverage than the Times.)

[Captain Hate]

I see that Giffords husband is now going to throw her out of planes. She's going to skydive on the 3rd anniversary of her shooting, live on The Today Show.

I hope he didn't pack the 'chute. What an embarrassment with which the idiots at 30 Rock are complicit.

[Extraneus]

White House disputes Gates memoir claims

[jimmyk on iPad]

"Those people were gullible *and* knew no more about Obama than what they heard a speech or read in the paper. Gates is a guy who saw this buffoon up close for an extended period of time."

True, and conversely, many of us knew instinctively that Obama was a fraud from the get-go.

I can think of two explanations for Gates working with Obama. One, a belief he could do damage control; two, personal ambition. As for his assessment of Obama, without reading the book (and we can't trust the NYT) it may be just a pro forma compliment before ripping him to shreds. And who knows what his "political advisers" were telling him. They may have said "Close down Gitmo immediately," or similarly. Remember who his advisers are.

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

Personal Ambition(?)-- Gates agreed to stay in his existing position as SecDef, when asked by Obummer. It wasn't as if he sought out the job. So under those circumstances it looks more like Gates agreed to stay to insure there was at least one adult in the room. That said, reading the book will reveal more about Gates' thinking.

[narciso]

My fishwrap didn't even bother with it, either, two much doubleplusungood entirely to deal with.

[jimmyk]

NK@9:06--The explanations are not mutually exclusive. Are you the same NK who said "Just because a politician has (R) or (TP) after their name doesn't change the fact that they are a politician"? Cabinet members are politicians too.

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

CaptH-- I believe you are not a fan of the MetLife Stadium cold weather Super Bowl. I checked the 2013-2014 winter Old Farmer's Almanac (80% accurate!!!) and it has cold and stormy for weekend of feb 1-3rd-- 30s with heavy rain and snow at times.

[jimmyk]

On a more somber note, Jeff Jacoby's 16-year-old son is missing. Scary.

http://forward.com/articles/190504/frantic-search-for-missing-teenage-son-of-boston-g/

[MarkO]

Obama's just not that smart, and he's a liar.

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

Gates is not the 'politician' to whom I was referring. Not by a long shot, not by any stretch of the imagination. In fact, Gates is in your line, a scholarly academic who we were fortunate to provide public service to the nation-- in Gates' case at the CIA and WH. It is more accurate to say that Gates is an ANTI-politician. He is a patriot who saw himself as making sure that politicians of all ilk served the national interest, rather than only their own personal political interests. He did so successfully with Reagan, GHWB, and GWB/Cheney-- he failed with Obummer.

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

and he's worse than that MarkO. Much worse.

[jimmyk]

Ah, the Farmer's Almanac. I prefer Twain's version:

At the instance of several friends who feel a boding anxiety to know beforehand what sort of phenomena we may expect the elements to exhibit during the next month or two, and who have lost all confidence in the various patent-medicine almanacs, because of the unaccountable reticence of those works concerning the extraordinary earthquake of October 8, I have compiled the following almanac expressly for the latitude of San Francisco:

October 17
Weather hazy; atmosphere murky and dense. An expression of profound melancholy will be observable upon most countenances.

October 18
Slight earthquake. Countenances grow more melancholy.

October 19
Look out for rain. It would be absurd to look in for it. The general depression of spirits increased.

October 20
More weather.

October 21
Same.

October 22
Light winds, perhaps. If they blow, it will be from the “east’ard, or the nor’ard, or the west’ard, or the south’ard,” or from some general direction approximating more or less to these points of the compass or otherwise. Winds are uncertain.

etc.

http://www.laphamsquarterly.org/voices-in-time/forecast.php

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

Heh... but, but the Old Farmer's Almanac has been around since 1793, and it uses Mr. Thomas's 'secret formula' augmented with modern weather models. Kidding aside, their long range predicitions are uncannily accurate; probably they are playing the percentages, but....

[Jane on Ipad]

5 degrees here today. So cold I had to wear my coat to the airport. Hopefully said coat will remain idle and unused while I bask in 80 degree weather for the next few days.

[Threadkiller]

Maybe Gates needs to send the 9-layer pdf version over to the Whitehouse.

Then there would be no dispute.

[daddy]

Remember this from Peggy Noonan in 2012: The Case for Sending Senator Lugar Back to Washington

The most recent polls suggest Dick Lugar, the senior U.S. senator from Indiana, first elected in 1976, is on track to lose his primary on Tuesday. I hope he doesn't for a number of reasons but one big one: the Senate needs grown-ups. The entire American government needs grown-ups, from Capitol Hill to the White House to the executive agencies. This is no time to lose one.

What Washington needs is sober and responsible adults.

...if he's allowed to return, newly alive to certain conservative needs and concerns...he will be able to take what might be called a refreshed sense of where people are, combine it with a veteran's knowledge of how to move things forward, and help make the kind of progress conservatives long for.

From yesterday's Washington Examiner: GOP senator (Lugar) ousted by Tea Party challenger donates to Democratic Senate hopeful in Georgia

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

Lugar was the type of politician to whom I referred to yesterday. The exact type.

[3ipka.net]

3ipka.net
Украина анализ 3ipka.net

В США за последние 20 лет минимальная величина удельного веса передовых технологий в финансовом росте оценивалась в 15%, а максимальная – в 50%.

В данное время в высокоразвитых державах
на удельный вес новых знаний, которые воплощаются в технологиях, оборудовании, подготовке
кадров, организации производства, приводится от
70 до 85% прироста валового внутреннего продукта (ВВП)

Итак, основные тенденции развития научно-технической сферы в Украине выявились
противоположные тенденциям, которые
сложились в развитых странах. Их можно изменить
только после появления положительных изменений в самой экономике.

Без прикладной науки, которая имеет тесные связи с производством, фундаментальные
исследования сами по себе будут неэффективны для экономики, поскольку их результатами в конечном итоге воспользуются страны-конкуренты или они растеряют
коммерческую стоимость Проблемы развития прикладной
науки в данное время во многом должны решаться уже с помощью фундаментальной науки, поскольку совершается постоянное осложнение решаемых
заданий и накапливание информации.

Необходимо обеспечить ориентацию субъектов экономики на разработку и
освоение комплексных технологий, с минимальными потерями
потенциала, которые обеспечивают согласование собственно технологии, техники и спецоборудование, организованной работы
и управления на стойкий выпуск продукции в
широком диапазоне мощностей
с одинаковой производительностью.

такую ориентацию страна может поддерживать за счет налоговых льгот и льготных условий финансирования (кредитование).

Внедрений комплексных технологий по обещающым направлениям эволюции
производственно-технологической структуры экономики будет
способствовать не только повышению эффективности производства,
но и устранения.

[jimmyk]

10 degrees in NYC. Today's "forecast"? High 25, low 21. Still not sure how that works.

[Old Lurker]

Having slept on my harsh comments on the previous threads about Gate's duty to express his concerns in public after resigning, I remain convinced he confused the role of a military officer on active duty, and that of a civilian cabinet officer serving a political role. Knowing now how strongly he disapproved of the Obama leadership, I simply cannot give him a pass for, by his silence, enabling the reelection of the guy trying to destroy the country and the constitution they all were sworn to protect.

I am sure his is a great guy with many fine qualities, but by not expressing his strong concerns, he allowed his sterling reputation to be used for political purposes to get these guys more time to do their damage.

And people died.

[Miss Marple]

For a second I thought I had had a stroke.

[jimmyk]

I agree, OL, though I don't know if his resignation however timed would have tipped the election. Regardless, the right thing to do would have been to resign, say in 2011, and come out with the book in 2012. He must have realized by 2011 that his "adult in the room" strategy wasn't working.

[narciso]

Russian spam, seriously, one interesting detail about'Company Man' a more interesting memoir is apparently Rumsfeld was more handsoff re Gitmo, then we were led to believe.

CCR and Levick, now outsourcing to Trippi's Potomac Square, did a great job of demonizing all who cared to fight the war's 'shadowy corners', with the cooperation of Soufan, McCarthy,Dannenberg, Grenier, et al

[Account Deleted]

OL,

I agree. The 600 page butt cover, written in the blood of honorable men, will never be read by me. He chose to live as a coward and paying to read about his thousand deaths on the road to the last one is not a good use of money or time.

[Miss Marple]

I wonder what Hagel is thinking. I wonder if Hagel was the offering in order to get Gates to leave.

I don't know if him resigning would have been more than a nine-days wonder if that, considering how the media went after anyone with a hint of disloyalty to Obama. It might have been nothing but a few stories chalking Gates' opinions to sour grapes from a Bush holdover.

I am hesitant to criticize Gates because we don't know what classified items he didn't put in the book. If this was what he managed to get published, I can imagine there was worse stuff we don't know about.

[narciso]

Mary, obviously, not Andrew, Rizzo does comment Thiessen's 'Hard Measures' as an middleground between Soufan and Rodriguez,
the latter dismissed Carle, as a fantasist, not worth paying attention to.

[narciso]

Sorry 'Courting Disaster' the second 404 today,

[Condi Rice]

My translation of the 9:50am:

"IN the USA, in the last 20 years, the minimum value of the specific weight of advanced technologies in the financial increase was evaluated at 15%, and maximum - in 50%.

In this time in the highly developed powers
by the specific weight of the new knowledge, which are realized in the technologies, the equipment, the preparation

It is necessary to ensure the orientation of the subjects of the economy for the development and the mastery of the packaged technologies, with the minimum losses of potential, which ensure the agreement strictly of "

Mostly garbage in garbage out type of rhethoric. If you want me to translate more let me know.

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

Are Eisenhower and Churchill's WWII histories illegitimate because they signed off on Operation Market Garden which failed at the cost of thousands of lives? Is Sakai's history as an IJN Zero pilot worthless because Japan lost? Is Cheney's autobiography a fraud becuase of flawed intel analyses? I'll draw conclusions after reading the book, but to be blunt, Gates publishing in 2012 would NOT have affected the election whatever, and second, he didn't publish in 2012 (my tentative opinion) because he isn't a craven politician, and he wants his book to be treated as serious history not a politcal hit job.

[Miss Marple]

NK, I agree with you about Gates book.

It would have been treated as sour grapes from a Bush holdover, if it even saw the light of day.

How anyone can think it would have made a difference when we saw Candy Crowley lie about what Obama said about benghazi, I do not know.

Heck, hundreds of people were warning that he was lying about the Obamacare "keep your doctor" promise, and it made no difference. And that wasn't foreign policy (which Americans mostly ignore) but about their own health insurance and pocketbooks, and they STILL voted for him!

[narciso]

We're not talking one battle, but the entire campaign after Normandy, the enemy doesn't have such scruples, I'm thinking the folks who leaked to Risen, Mayer, Priest et al, who were many of Bergen's sources as well as Packer, whereas Feith and Rumsfeld's actual evidence, was ignored, the contempt rained on Wolfowitz, as opposed to a nazgul like McNamara, who failed up.

[Beasts of England]

The JEF has, er, uh, promised 'Promise Zones' of economic activity! For the children! It's simply too stupid for me to link to - it just makes my head go splodey. WZ has the story.

Is there nothing this economic illiterate can't pivot to? What a waste.

[James D.]

I'm sorry. I have no sympathy, and no respect, for Gates.

I understand that the position he was in was both difficult and unpleasant. But it is a position he CHOSE. He sought out, for his entire career, ever-increasing positions of responsibility, where his decisions impacted the security of this country, and the lives (and deaths) of our servicemen. He has a duty to them, but more than that, he's a human being with a conscience, and a higher judge to eventually answer to. More should be expected of him than ass-covering or hoping that he can mitigate damage by being the adult in the room.

I also don't accept as an excuse that he couldn't or wouldn't see what we all knew about Obama. Even a cursory look at his history and his record was enough to know what a dishonest and awful person he was and is, and how little he had actually achieved in his life. The information was all there, and readily available. If Gates could not make himself see that, it's not a defense. It's a statement that he shouldn't have been in the position he was in, in the first place.

[Threadkiller]

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2014/01/08/Govt-offers-new-approach-to-classroom-discipline

Race to the Race.

[Account Deleted]

He's cashing in while the blood is still running. It is puerile and very naive to believe this book will not embolden the Taliban in attempts to make the exit as bloody as possible.

[narciso]

I noted some of this in McCrystal's memoir, maybe because as with the sources he used, he actually believes what the Times says about a situation, and apparently was under the delusion that they were not out to undermine
him at every turn,

[Captain Hate]

CaptH-- I believe you are not a fan of the MetLife Stadium cold weather Super Bowl.

It's been a long time since I've watched any Super Bowl, which for quite a while has been an overpriced monument to bad taste. This one might be amusing if Kraft breaks a hip slipping on the ice while trying to trot after his underaged girlfriend and hauled away nattering something incomprehensible about Putin stealing his Super Bowl ring.

[narciso]

Well that might be entertaining, in a maudlin sort of way.

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

Other than the Debt Bomb (poor janet Y will get stuck holding that one when it goes off)
US as Fossil Fuel Energy Exporter will be the BIG story for the next couple of decades. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-01-08/unforseen-u-s-oil-boom-upends-world-markets-as-drilling-spreads.html

[Miss Marple]

You know, I took a look at the bleak stadium and compared it to podunk Indianapolis ROOFED Lucas stadium and just laughed.

Everyone has to get there from places far away, unlike in Indy, where many could walk to the game. We were prepared with warming stations (which we didn't need) and roofed and heated amenities.

I am going to watch because this should prove to be a fiasco, and all of my favorite villains will get blame (Christie, Goodell, and "climate" experts).

[MarkO]

I think that in a normal election, one in which the vote was not suppressed by the IRS or the Republican candidate was afraid to discuss foreign policy, Gates book would have been important.

Not in 2012. Maybe in 2014.

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

RickB-- I don't think Gates is telling the Taliban and AQ anything they don't already know about Obummer. Hell, Obummer may have told them personally he is on their side.

[JIB]

Hope you can read this:

[MarkO]

Left out "not." --candidate was NOT afraid---

I blame the vortex.

[Danube on iPad]

But ss everyone here now knows, and TK has acknowledged, the presence of apparent "layers" in a pdf image means nothing at all. I had thought we had seen the last reference to the phenomenon, but here we go again.

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

CaptH@10:29-- OK, now that's funny.

MissM-- I agree, Lucas IMO is the best 'roofed' stadium in North America. Seattle has the best open air stadium. MetLife was terrible value, the construction cost was grossly inflated by Union and political corruption payoffs, and on an operating basis it is grossly over-priced.

[jimmyk]

LOL, JiB.

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

JiB-- heh!

Chris Rock's stand up used to include a riff that it's every parent's duty "to keep their daughter off of the pole."
Who's responsible to keep mom off of the pole?

[MarkO]

Who wants to watch a Super Bowl played in bad weather?

[Beasts of England]

I wouldn't touch that one with a ten foot...

[James D.]

MarkO, I do! Bad weather is part of football. I hope it's cold and snowing and totally inclement on Super Bowl Sunday.

[Dave (in MA)]

The AccuWeather extended forecast for the day of The Big Game predicts Cloudy and warmer 45° Lo 31° and not the blizzard that I'm hoping for. Football is meant to be played outdoors, not in a climate-controlled, Peyton-friendly room.

[Old Lurker]

Is the horse dead yet?

I see civilian cabinet officers the same way I do directors of corporations and trustees of non-profits. While some of them are appointed for their skills or money, ALL of them lend their reputations to further the goals of the institutions they serve and become sort of proxies for the public to reach conclusions about the organization.

In the case of helping a president, some civilians would say at the start, "no thanks, I do not support your agenda." It says something when a number of obvious choices do not agree to serve in an administration so the president digs deeper into the pool to find his Tim Geitner who will.

Others might think the leader and his agenda were one thing and but never come to see he was fooled. Those guys hang in and serve blissfully. Their ongoing blindness is a flaw, but not a character flaw, and history will adjust the reputation accordingly. Ask Clark Clifford while he was asked to join a bank board.

The problem here is that Gate's book reveals he was fully aware of the fatal flaws of Obama and his team and even after resigning he waited until after the election to tell the public what he thought when those who had great respect for him might have looked to his silence as support for the status quo. Elliot Richardson did it better with Nixon.

I have no idea whether he might have changed the outcome of the election, but my point all along is that by this book and its timing after the election, Gates reveals more about himself than of Obama, Biden or Clinton.

Damn shame, but there it is.

[Captain Hate]

MetLife was terrible value, the construction cost was grossly inflated by Union and political corruption payoffs, and on an operating basis it is grossly over-priced.

Shocking this happening in Jersey. This is why Fat Boy is perfectly placed there where he can grab headlines by blasting away at stuff like this while not doing a damn thing about it and getting free publicity. Outside of there NFW.

[jimmyk]

Liam Neeson talks horse sense to Jon Stewart:

“These animal activists,” Neeson continued contemptuously. “You know, ‘the horses are being treated cruelly because they are pulling a carriage around half a mile.’ I mean, these are the fittest, well-fed, best kept horses I’ve ever seen. I’m a horse rider and lover for many, many years.”

http://www.frontpagemag.com/2014/dgreenfield/liam-neeson-blasts-bill-de-blasios-anti-horse-campaign

[Threadkiller]

Until resolved, there can be no last reference.

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

I didn't see this news story this past weekend- the Boeing employees bucked the union thugs and voted YES to the contract pension concessions to keep 777X production in State of Washington, Wow. I guess the 7000 union members care more about their children and the future than their own pensions. Good for them: http://www.cnn.com/2014/01/04/travel/boeing-union-dispute-vote/index.html

[Captain Hate]

I didn't see this news story this past weekend- the Boeing employees bucked the union thugs and voted YES to the contract pension concessions to keep 777X production in State of Washington,

I saw it covered somewhere; maybe FNS although maybe I caught it passing through when Mrs H was watching NBC.

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

Good on Liam Neesom. Good on the NY Post. The first time we took our daughter on a carriage ride in Central park, she was a full-time rider; and before we got in the carriage she insisted that she check the horse for general health and 'skittishness' which would evidence poor care or abuse. She pronounce our horse fully fit and cared for. the driver thanked her for her input. Oh, she was 11yo at the time.

[Porchlight]

A bunch of anti establishment children who hate the military allowed 4 Americans to die. Absolutely disgraceful. Like I said, time for criminal charges and impeachment.

matt,

Not only did they allow 4 Americans to die, they abandoned the entire annex to its fate. As it happened, 4 perished, but with no security and no help sent during the firefight it could have been the entire staff of 30 plus for all they cared.

Then they never even went in to secure the area. CNN got in ten days later and found Stevens' diary still lying on his desk.

It should have ended his Presidency. Instead we have the person in charge set to receive the crown from the departing emperor.

[Beasts of England]

Great story, NK. I've read in two places the conjecture that the new mayor wants to sell the stables to developer buddies. I have no way to confirm that rumor, but it wouldn't be the most outrageous thing I've ever heard a politico doing.

[Dave (in MA)]

I mean, these are the fittest, well-fed, best kept horses I’ve ever seen

As long as nobody's feeding them Beefarino.

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

BoE-- blowing out the carriages to make his ASPCA fascist pals happy, and kicking the real estate to a big $$$$ crony will be the LEAST of Warren Wilhelm's crimes against a decent NYC. The Libs here have spoken, and now we will all be punished.

[Beasts of England]

Any idea where the stables are? I wonder how big of a parcel is involved. Not that one needs a very large footprint to have value in that locale...

[Old Lurker]

My NYC daughter was asking me why I just did commercial real estate and not residential rentals. I explained (as I did to Rick B when he asked me that years ago) that in my opinion the upside of residential rental returns was limited but the uninsurable downside was not.

True I was thinking about the asymmetrical risk of lead paint or asbestos or slippery sidewalks, but this headline today makes the case even better:

"Tenant Charged After Landlord, Father Found Nearly Beheaded in Brooklyn Building..."

[jimmyk]

It should have ended his Presidency. Instead we have the person in charge set to receive the crown from the departing emperor.

So true, and at the risk of opening up a tired subject again, the R presidential candidate opted not to make this an issue in the final debate.

[Dave (in MA)]

OL, as we recently learned from Rolling Stone, "landlords blow". Perhaps the tenant has a subscription and was merely sticking it to The Man.

[jimmyk]

OL@11:27 -- "Rasel Siddiquee was arrested early Wednesday in connection with the death of Mahuddin Mahmud, a 57-year-old businessman and father of three who was found with his head nearly cut off and his face burned...."

Presbyterians, no doubt?

[Porchlight]

OL,

My dad was a finance guy at GE for his entire career. He was Welch's numbers guy. He was set to retire when Welch left the company but Welch asked him to stay on for 18 months to help with the Immelt transition. My dad didn't and doesn't think much of Immelt, but he agreed to help out of loyalty to the company. It may have been something like that with Gates.

[Jim Miller]

NK - The second Boeing vote occurred only because the national union forced a second vote on the local. So this was an intra-union dispute, too.

The Boeing workers aren't losing a pension, as the article implies. Instead, Boeing will be phasing in a defined contribution (10 percent of their pay, as I recall) plan to replace the current defined benefit plan.

Oh, and the workers will get an immediate signing bonus, 10K, if I recall correctly.

[Porchlight]

the R presidential candidate opted not to make this an issue in the final debate.

He was gunshy after the media pounced on him for daring to criticize the admin's handling of Benghazi and Cairo immediately after 9/11/12. He should have hung tough on an important issue, but he lost his nerve. It's one reason why I think maybe he wouldn't have made such a great President after all.

[daddy]

The pretty red head FOX reporter interviewing John Bolton on Gate's new book just told us that her husband is in the Military. I'm glad to hear that. The more reporters that have any personal connection to military members the better.

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

BoE-- here's a 2009 anti-Bloomberg BIGbusiness article about the stables. The zoning rules haven't changed since then, 150,000sf developable 'FAR' for commercial/retail. Property values on the far west side are much jigher than in 2009 (thank you Ben B) If you condo it and build out raw space, the gross sell out price would be $200-300M, less land acquistion and construction costs- PLUS potential BELOW GRADE use. Highest and best use for the user? A PARKING LOT for the new far west side residential towers and the coming Midtown West office buildings! And what does this diBlasio crony own? Parking lots!!! http://mgross.com/gripebox/its-parkingtown-jake/

[Old Lurker]

I hear you, Porch, and that's why I gave Gates a pass for staying on while he thought he could help from inside. But then he saw that he could not and he left and his silence at that point is my problem.

Had your Dad thought Immelt was a crook robbing shareholders, I know he would have blown the whistle.

Just today JPM agreed to pay $2.1B for allowing Madoff to operate through JPM accounts even though JPM had been warned that Madoff was up to no good (and had they not been warned but turned a blind eye, why did they pay up?). I am sure if Bernie had been using the First National Bank of Nigeria, many investors would have stayed home.

[Porchlight]

JiB,

Thanks for the Retronaut link! I stumbled on the site awhile back but I didn't have the time to take a good look, so thank you for the reminder. Super cool. I am firmly convinced I was born in the wrong decade.

[Specter]

We're pulling out of Afghanistan in 2014? My son just informed me that he is being deployed there 30 days from now....I guess it could be a 9 month deployment. He is regular Army.

[daddy]

I am going to watch because this should prove to be a fiasco, and all of my favorite villains will get blame (Christie, Goodell, and "climate" experts).

Captain and Miss M,

On the plus side, if it is freezing to death for this years Super Bowl, we may finally get a Half Time Show where there's no "Wardrobe Malfunction."

[Porchlight]

Good points, OL. Company loyalty should only go so far.

[Dave (in MA)]

jimmyk, it could have been the Presbyterians, or he could have been inspired by Eddie Murphy.

[Threadkiller]

A local radio host just dumped this on me. I have to say Olbermann got it right.

"Keith Remembers The Life Of A True Role Model: Jerry Coleman ..."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t-OHPjIsisI

Very well done.

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

OL-- you should be able to quickly find online the depostion of Noreen Harrington in the Bankruptcy Trustee clawback suit against Wilpon/Katz. They started a hedge fund with Peter Stamos, Harrington was Stamos' chief investment officer at the time. Harrington did the due diligence on the existing Wilpon investments, and she raised red flags abou the Madoff acccounts. She told Wilpon that in her opinion they were either Ponzi non-trades or inside trading. Since I read that Harrington deposition I have refused to go to Citifield. They all 'knew' Madoff was a crook, but they worked very hard to not leave any evidence that they 'knew'. I'm quite certain JPM engaged in that same type of plausible deniability.

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

Godspeed to young Specter.

[daddy]

Thanks JimmyK,

Great to hear an actor talking sense.

JiB, Love the homework assignment:)

And Specter, best of luck to your son with our prayers and wishes.

[Beasts of England]

That's ever so slightly higher than I was thinking, NK. Maybe I'd get rid of those poor mistreated horses, too! ;)

[Miss Marple]

Drudge says Trump is going to New Hampshire.

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

Trump going skiing? whadda jerk he is.

[boricuafudd]

About that Boeing vote it seems not everyone is happy with the vote.

http://blog.al.com/breaking/2014/01/4_washington_state_union_membe.html

[Miss Marple]

NK, I am only reporting what Drudge said.

We have serious problems in this country, and while I do not discount that a non-politician might make a credible run at the presidency, I cannot help but think Trump is in it for the publicity and ego-stroking. (I have noticed he seems to re-tweet every single "Mr Trump please run for pre" tweet that he gets.)

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

"I cannot help but think Trump is in it for the publicity and ego-stroking"

You would be correct. But you use your midwest manners in describing Trump. In NYC parlance he's an egomaniacal prick.

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

The Boeing vote-- I didn't know that the national union ordered the member vote. I did know that the local thugs valued their personal pensions more than union jobs in State of Washington, obviously the national union was more worried about dues from members, than the members pensions, because w/o the new deal Boeing would have moved to a right to work state. Unions at this point are almost completely self-serving for the Thug leadership.

[Ignatz]

Trump is one of the high functioning mentally ill.

[Old Lurker]

What? You don't think he's in it for money too?

[NK(withnewsoftware)]

He's obviously in it for the money, has been since conception. but at this point if you gave Trump the option of money or ego stroking, I do think it would be a tough call for him.

[Jim Miller]

A little more on the closeness of the second Boeing vote: On the first vote, the contract lost by 67-33. On the second vote, the revised contract won 51-49.

I haven't seen the numbers but, according to one article I saw, there was lower turnout for the second vote.

So, yes, there are some members who are unhappy with the result, and there is some effort to have the second vote invalidated. (I have no idea whether there is any chance that effort has any chance of succeeding.)