NY Times Stands Its Ground On "Stand Your Ground"

More catnip for Upper West Side progressives - the NY Times contemplates the muddled outcome of Florida's Michael Dunn trial and stands by their position that "Stand Your Ground" is the root of the problem:

Florida Self-Defense Law Complicated Jury’s Job in Michael Dunn Trial

JACKSONVILLE, Fla. — In failing to acquit or convict Michael Dunn on the most significant charge — the premeditated murder of a teenager in a dispute over loud music — a jury on Saturday may have run headlong into the breadth and reach of Florida’s contentious self-defense law.

In their 30 hours of deliberation, the 12-member panel wrangled with a question that cuts to the heart of all self-defense claims: How does a juror know when using lethal force is justified, where nothing is straightforward, memories are hazy or contradictory and perception counts as much as fact?

Yeah, yeah. Meanwhile, we continue to eagerly await Times coverage of the Roderick Scott shooting of Chris Cervini. A synopsis:

Scott was asleep on the couch in his home.  At 3:00 in the morning he heard a disturbance outside, looked out the window, and saw three teenagers trying to break into his car.  Shoving his gun into his waistband, he went outside to see what in hell was going on.

He caught one Christopher Cervini, then 17, in the driveway across the street.  With Cervini were his cousin, James, and their friend Brian Hopkins.  They were busily rifling through the neighbor’s car when Roderick Scott confronted them.  These teenagers, you see, are (in Cervini’s case, he was) petty criminals.  They were working their way through all the cars in the neighborhood in order to find things to steal.

The teens had also been drinking earlier in the evening.  A toxicologist’s report confirmed that Christopher Cervini was legally drunk at the time of his death.

Scott confronted the three teens, felt threatened, and shot Chris Cervini twice (once in the back), killing him. He was charged with homicide and eventually acquited:

Roderick Scott took the stand in his own defense, explaining that he “looked outside the front door to see what was going on,” identifying “three individuals walking out of [his] driveway.”   He “intended to go out and stop the criminal act or detain them.”  He then chambered a round in his weapon.  “I had no idea what was going on,” he said, ”so I had to protect myself.”  He was, he testified, aware that he was outnumbered, and that is key to this issue as a self-defense scenario.  When outnumbered, even if those facing you are unarmed, you are generally justified to use a force multiplier — a weapon — to defend yourself.

“I wanted to stop them before they could get away,” he admitted. “We live so far away, they would have been gone before police got there.”  When Scott told the three teenagers that he had called the police, Christopher Cervini broke from the group and ran at him, shouting either, “I’ll get you” to Scott or “I’ll get him” to his fellow thieves.  Scott fired two shots in response.

One might wonder how this became a self-defense case at all. George Zimmerman was pilloried for leaving the safety of his car; surely the Times wiil excoriate Scott for leaving the safety of his home. With a gun. With a round chambered. Surely the Times will argue that this shows clear murderous intent and they will deplore the crazy state law that let this killer walk.

Or not. The killing took place in 2009 in, believe it or not, upstate New York. The Times has never mentioned this case. And FWIW, Mr. Scott is a black man with "the build of a football player" and Chris Cervini was white.

Yet for reasons we can only imagine Times editors and columnists have felt no oligation to ruminate and pontificate on New York's crazy self-defense law.

 

Comments

[MaryD]

The closed minded hypocrisy at the Times boggles the mind. I gave up on them years ago.

[MaryD]

Typhus ate my brilliant first comment. To recap, I gave up on the hypocrites at the Time years ago.

[MaryD]

Grrrrrr, a pox on Typhus

[sygmund fraud]

Zimmermanz PTSD is forcing him, against his will, to live off his family. He's a 'scapegoat' and appropriately traumatized from his act of will and cop-like conviction.

It's difficult being alive and free.

[Marlene]

Happy Birthday Gus! MaryD, is it a beautiful sunny day in the mountains? Sunny and cold here.

[MaryD]

Hi Marlene, yes, it's a beautiful day with bright sunshine and a cloudless sky. Snow tomorrow, but only 1-3". Then a thaw.

[Captain Hate]

Top Men: http://twitchy.com/2014/02/16/coincidence-im-sure-amanda-carpenter-notices-something-strange-about-sunday-shows-coverage-of-ted-cruz/

[MILSPEC has many meanings]

Is there no end to the takers crowding into bread lines?

http://money.cnn.com/2014/02/17/news/economy/military-food-stamps/index.html?iid=Lead

[glasater]

HBD, Gus ♫¸¸.•*¨*•♫♪

[narciso]

Stand your ground, didn't apply, Corey is still an idiot and Alvarez remains clueless. the reverse is also true.

[narciso]

Cruz doesn't want to play in their reindeer games.

[Truthbetold]

Plamegate “journalist” dis-owns book!

Murray Waas, up until now, was thought to be the "author" of the book titled United States v I. Lewis Libby. However, recent developments have Waas claiming that he did not write or edit the book. In-fact, Waas, in an effort to distance himself from the book (that names him as author and editor) has stated, that he only wrote the introduction for the book. Disowning the rest!

Waas further shared that Philip S.Turner the editor/publisher of the book, approached him to be involved in this project. A project that would ultimately be described as an 'instant' book by the Washington Post.

http://illinoispaytoplay.com/2013/10/29/plamegate-journalist-dis-owns-book/

[narciso]

the quality of reporting is uniformly clueless;

http://legalinsurrection.com/2014/02/syrian-peace-talks-end-as-expected-with-total-failure/#comments

[Extraneus]

This idiot should be banned.

[Extraneus]

Guess who's giving Rand Paul advice now.

Romney: Keep focus on Hillary’s record at State

[narciso]

Yes, because they played by the same roles, in the House of Cards, they have obliquely portrayed the Adelson matter, having him be an associate of the President's confidante, there are intimations of a specoal prosecutor,

[Truthbetold]

`Instant' Book Coming on Libby Trial

NEW YORK -- Talk about an "instant" book. Within two hours of I. Lewis Libby's conviction Tuesday for lying and obstruction of justice, a publisher announced plans for a paperback release about the trial of Vice President Dick Cheney's former chief of staff.

"Like the published reports from the 9/11 Commission and the Iraq Study Group, the CIA leak case warrants a definitive book based upon the Libby trial record," Philip Turner, editorial director of Sterling Publishing's Union Square Press imprint, said in a statement.

"The United States v. I. Lewis Libby," which will include testimony and original reporting, will be edited by investigative journalist Murray Waas of the National Journal, a weekly magazine. The book is scheduled to be released in April as a paperback original, with a first printing of 75,000.

Libby was convicted of lying and obstructing an investigation into the leak of a CIA operative's identity. The verdict culminated a nearly four-year investigation into how CIA official Valerie Plame's name was leaked to reporters in 2003.

The trial revealed how top members of the Bush administration were eager to discredit Plame's husband, former Ambassador Joseph Wilson, who accused the administration of distorting prewar intelligence on Iraq.

In 2004, when he was editor-in-chief of Carroll & Graf, Philip Turner also published Wilson's "The Politics of Truth: Inside the Lies That Led to War and Betrayed My Wife's CIA Identity."

(An earlier version of the story said Wilson book was published by Sterling Publishing. )

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/03/06/AR2007030600903.html

[Jim Eagle]

Michael Dunn has been revealed by neighbors, ex wives, co-workers, and friends to be a bit of a loose cannon and self-absorbed bully.

His defense based on seeing a 4 inch barrel of a gun was pretty weak tea. But everyone down here couldn't see pre-meditated 1st degree murder. That was a typical Corey over-reach.

[narciso]

I can see why the times didn't like the grayness of the series, the confidante is a buffet type industrialist, a long time Dem donor with big investments in China, with ties to both parties, so the mud tends to stick to everyone,

[clarice]

I believe in the latest case, the NYT ought to look up "premeditation" along with "stand your ground". Maybe they're getting their legal advice from Holder and Obama's classmates. Try Fordham grads fellows.

[Stephanie VIP shhhhh its fight club]

Conflation as usual, Clarice. If you can confuse the muddle you can reshape their thoughts on SYG and turn the tide against it.

[matt]

3 on 1 at 3:00am is bad odds any way you look at it. B&E is, I believe the same for a car as for a home.

So the crux of the case would seem to be whether excessive force was used. Had the defendant not had a gun, what would the outcome have been? From the facts it seems he was being assaulted. Excessive force?

One of the issues with armed confrontation is that in most states experts recommend shoot to kill. This is what the po.ice are instructed to do. Deadly force is deadly.

The legal repercussions these days also make it much simpler to defend. Targets use center mass as the X and hitting center mass does very bad things. Another lousy case.

I wonder if they were addicts?

[MarkO]

Steph,

I think they are simply uneducated.

[Jane]

Interesting piece by Eliana Johnson at NRO (via Insty) about how the left is fractured over proposed IRS rules.

The rules would favor incumbents forever but could potentially hurt unions so they are getting push back.

Defund the IRS!

http://www.nationalreview.com/article/371257/proposed-irs-rule-change-fractures-left-eliana-johnson

[rse]

CH & henry-

I have put up a link to an Alex Pentland interview that was posted today. He confirms that the plan is to use Big Data to redesign human society so it will be fair and equitable. He also says that what is now possible is far beyond anything Orwell imagined. And he is giddy with excitement.

I have also ordered his book.

[Ignatz]

--In their 30 hours of deliberation, the 12-member panel wrangled with a question that cuts to the heart of all self-defense claims: How does a juror know when using lethal force is justified, where nothing is straightforward, memories are hazy or contradictory and perception counts as much as fact?--

I'd venture to guess those problems face most juries in most criminal trials regarding most types of felony allegations.
It only bothers the left when a guy who shoots a criminal or a black guy might go free, as TM demonstrates with the Scott affair.
Now it sounds like Dunn was guilty and Scott was not, but what would the NYT's coverage have been had it been the opposite?

From the article regarding a person's reasonable fear for his life;

The problem, Ms. Franks said, lies, in part, with the term reasonable, which is “squishy.” One person’s reasonable is another person’s overreaction.

I presume then once SYG is struck down we will also eliminate beyond "reasonable" doubt as the standard of proof?

[narciso]

Unfortunately, Alvarez like Robles, is from down here, in part, so if the fact pattern was reversed. we know the answer,

One of the minor minions of the series, is an FBI agent, in the cyber division, who lends him as tool against the courageous but naive Washington Chronicle reporter, who threaten Underwoods future prospects.

[clarice]

"The problem, Ms. Franks said, lies, in part, with the term reasonable, which is “squishy.” One person’s reasonable is another person’s overreaction."

That's why we have things called JURIES.

[narciso]

lord what do you with these people,

[Jane]

Today is the 5 year anniversary of the stimulus bill, which everyone agrees was the worst economic disaster in the history of the country - except for Obamacare.

So Obama is going to have a celebratory rally for it tonite.

Stalin could have learned some things from him.

[narciso]

And Sheriff Slo jo will be at hand,

[narciso]

In some places, performance is considered a precondition to further employment

http://hotair.com/headlines/archives/2014/02/17/u-s-backed-syrian-rebel-army-fires-top-commander-many-considered-ineffective/

[narciso]

well maybe some salve will do:

http://hotair.com/headlines/archives/2014/02/17/new-democratic-strategy-talk-openly-about-obamacares-problems-and-how-to-fix-them/

[MarkO]

This may be where criminal procedure is going:

http://www.mindingthecampus.com/forum/2014/02/why_have_a_hearing_just_expel_.html

[clarice]

Can you picture Obama taking responsibility, narciso? HEH

[henry]

rse, another guy volunteering to rule us all. In other words a fool, but a very dangerous fool at that.

[Captain Hate]

And he is giddy with excitement.

I'm sure henry's had the same reaction that I have when a co-worker accidentally reveals his/her inner fascism.

[Jim Eagle]

BTW, the Dunn trial like the Zimmerman trial had nothing to do with SYG and neither was it offered as a defense or even partial defense in both trials.

**********************************************************************

A man received the following text from his neighbor:

I am so sorry Bob. I've been riddled with guilt and I have to confess. I have been tapping your wife, day and night when you're not around. In fact, more than you. I'm not getting any at home, but that's no excuse. I can no longer live with the guilt and I hope you will accept my sincerest apology with my promise that it won't happen again.

The man, anguished and betrayed, went into his bedroom, grabbed his gun, and without a word, shot his wife and killed her.

A few moments later, a second text came in:

Damn autocorrect. I meant "wifi", not "wife".

[rse]

henry-he brags about how the inventors of Google chrome were his students and all the personal data being thrown off.

[Jane-curling is on!]

That's very funny JIB.

Mark, it really does seem past time to leave the country.

[daddy]

Slightly OT.

A good thing about being fortunate enough to get to Paris so often, is that you don't have to kill yourself trying to cram all the sightseeing into one or 2 days. So knowing I'll be back here next month I spent the last 2 days just being useless and today decided that I'd go spend an hour with one of my favorite objects in the Louvre---The Seated Scribe.

Beautiful blue skied, semi-chilly day, perfect for a long walk to the Louvre. The Scribe is hidden way back in a corner room on one of the upper floors, so even tho' your intent is simply to go straight to him and try to absorb him with a fresh, uncluttered mind, you still have to walk about a half mile inside the Louvre to get to him, and it's tough not to get sidetracked by so many interesting objects. But I had had an excellent shot of espresso and was mildly determined to do this right, and voila, there I sat 30 minutes later, resting my back and sore feet, and observing this amazing lifelike figure, who they believed was living @2,600 BC, right when the Great Pyramids were being built.

Periodically crowds would pour in and excitedly surround him, (especially a class of French Grade-schoolers and a Japanese Tour Group), so then I'd enjoy their energy and sit back on the bench and read up on everything they know about the Scribe, but then suddenly there would be a lull of 5 minutes, and it'd just be me and him in the room and I could examine him as closely as possible, get eye contact with his fascinating eyes, and just wonder how the ancient Egyptians were able to do such lifelike work, when so much that they produced over their next 3,000 years were simply stylized lifeless masses.

The Scribe is about half life sized, but a few rooms prior I had passed by a huge famous broken bust of Akhenaton, about 3 times life size, that now called for a better look:

Akhenaton was Nefertiti's husband and was the guy who overthrew the old religion for the belief in the single Sun God, then after death he got erased by the following dynasties. The incoming light was excellent, creating a fascinating shadow of his face on the wall behind, and his face and how they've made really is so different from all the other Pharaoh's from a thousand years before to a thousand years after that surround. Akhenaton's sculpted face you really could expect to see in any modern museum and it'd fit perfect.

Anyhow, that was just about enough. I'd go from one to the other, leisurely and unhurried, pondering the mysteries of ancient Egypt and what to have for lunch.

I did notice that every belly-button I saw on every Egyptian bust and God, was an "innie". There were no "outies" in Ancient Egypt. I'd probably need anonamom to explain as a Doctor if it's hard to make an "outie", but somehow the Egyptians had figured out the trick.

And I also noticed that in the carved zodiac from the Temple of Dendera, that Sirius (SOPDET) which I have always thought was The Dog Star, was apparently in the image of some bull. But Orion was easily recognizable in a tall pointy hat carrying a club, so that seemed familiar. Perhaps another visit is called for.

[21_cathy_f_in_tripep@d_prison_98]

At the time of the Zimmerman trial the legal hairsplitting really seemed to show that "Stand Your Ground" vs "Duty To Retreat" doesn't actually mean anything different in practice.

In an SYG state, you only get to stand your ground if it is legitimate self defense. In a DTR state, you only have a duty to retreat if you CAN retreat. If you can safely retreat, then it's not self defense.

In other words, semantics. Lawyers are usually a lot better at figuring out when differences aren't actually different.

[Jim Eagle]

daddy,

Are you staying in Paris or near the airport? Orly or DeGaulle?

Ever taken the wood walkway underneath the Louvre and look at the original foundation? An engineer's delight.

[Miss Marple]

daddy, Very interesting. Egyptian paintings were stylized under a prescribed code, which is why all of the figures are sideways with people of lesser importance shown smaller, with the eyes shown frontways even though the people were drawn in profile.

Their sculpture, however, was often very lifelike. The controversy (at least when I last read about this years ago) is whether the sculpting of Akhenaton was a stylistic departure or if they were lifelike portrayals based on his features, with the supposition being that he was suffering from a genetic disease which elongated his features (the name escapes me now but someone will know it, as there is debate about whether Lincoln also suffered from it).

How wonderful to go to the Louvre! That and the Seine embankment are the two things I would love to see in Paris. Also some restaurants, but on that I am not picky.

[daddy]

JiB,

Last 3 days has been in a nice hotel up Montparnasse, so it's the old left bank Roman section of town and a nice 30-40 minute walk down hill to the river. To exit the Louvre today was as long as getting to the Scribe, so that was cool to walk beneath and around all those old foundation structures. It seemed to me that a lot of the stonework in the medieval sections of the old fortress walls that I walked by were probably taken from old Roman structures and reused, as sometimes they appeared to have grooves in them that I imagines came from originally being old paving stones or old grooves for sewer works. Very interesting.

[Marlene]

The Bangor federal building was the beneficiary of stimulus money. Hubby's Bangor office is up one street on a hill looking down on the building. It took three years and $57M to complete. New security,fire, geothermal heating and cooling systems,new windows,solar panels and new communication technology. It took a year to complete the front walkway and security entrance. We were beginning to think that the scaffolding was an architectural feature,until finally,one day it was gone. The ribbon cutting was on Jan.30. What a boondoggle. Oh,and one of those big "American Recovery and Reinvestment Act" signs in the front with the Obama logo.

[Jim Eagle]

For all my Red Sox friends:

This day in 1953 Ted Williams crash landed his F9F jet in Korea

[daddy]

is whether the sculpting of Akhenaton was a stylistic departure or if they were lifelike portrayals based on his features, with the supposition being that he was suffering from a genetic disease which elongated his features

I remember hearing that Miss M. He really is odd looking. In one of the very small works of him walking with Nefertiti, they simply looked normal and lifeless, without the exaggerated long face, but in a couple of the other larger works, his elongated face is instantly recognizable. And then considering the amazing lifelike image of his wife, who knows what to think.

[narciso]

Very cool, daddt.

[Miss Marple]

I love that statue of Nefretiti. I saw it at the museum when I lived in West Berlin. My mother had a copy she kept on the bookshelf of her office from the 1960's until she retired. I think my sister has it now.

By the way, while we are on archaeology, did you know that Henrik Schliemann, the man who discovered Troy, lived for some years in Indianapolis? He probably frequented the Rathskeller!

[Stephanie VIP shhhhh its fight club]

According to big hair guy on Ancient Aliens, Akhenaton might be the product of alien-human inbreeding.

[narciso]

Too close to the truth;

http://legalinsurrection.com/2014/02/microaggression-mania-mcgill-u-student-leader-apologizes-for-gif-of-obama-kicking-open-door/

[daddy]

Henrik Schliemann, the man who discovered Troy, lived for some years in Indianapolis? He probably frequented the Rathskeller!

Very cool, Miss Marple,

I think we need more info on who exactly that second bust in the Rathskeller Bar is actually of. I remember how Schliemann supposedly says that when he removed the golden mask of the King, that before the body turned into dust "I gazed upon the face of Agamemnon."

I need to know if we've been gazing on the face of Schliemann.

[clarice]

I had nothing to do with Akhenaton..Honest.
He had a disease called Marfan's syndrome.

[daddy]

Well, Clarice, it's not Akhenaton in that Indianapolis Bar, thats for sure.

BTW, did we ever get a final resolution on why there is a bust of Scipio Africanus in the Bar in that Charleston Hotel where General Lee slept the night before the first shots of the Civil War?

[Miss Marple]

Clarice!!!! Thank you! That is exactly right, but my brain just wouldn't bring it up.

I hate when I think I know something and the word escapes me.

[NKonIPad]

JiB -- the Bethpage Ironworks (a/k/a Grumman) should get a little bit of thecredit for protecting Ted Williams and hundreds of other aviators savedby Grumman's robust designs and manufacture of naval aircraft.

[clarice]

MM, I promise my memory is worse than yours. but to quote the wolverine about her own doings, "I use google about a thousand times a day for my research."

[Miss Marple]

Clarice, well, I suppose I could have done that, but I was lazy, plus I already have 5 screens open.

Thanks anyway. At least I know it isn't my imagination, that there was a disease they thought he had!

[narciso]

good luck with that;

http://www.latimes.com/world/asia/la-fg-drone-bases-20140216,0,2170648.story#axzz2tahehGOW

[AliceH]

In re: painting/pictorial styles and such, I seem to recall that E.H. Gombrich's Art and Illusion is a terrific source and fun read. The Amazon description:

Considered a great classic by all who seek for a meeting ground between science and the humanities, Art and Illusion examines the history and psychology of pictorial representation in light of present-day theories of visual perception information and learning. Searching for a rational explanation of the changing styles of art, Gombrich reexamines many ideas on the imitation of nature and the function of tradition. In testing his arguments he ranges over the history of art, noticing particularly the accomplishments of the ancient Greeks, and the visual discoveries of such masters as Leonardo da Vinci and Rembrandt, as well as the impressionists and the cubists. Gombrich's triumph in Art and Illusion arises from the fact that his main concern is less with the artists than with ourselves, the beholders.

[Bori]

Daddy,

IIRC, the "seated scribe" was depicted lifelike, because he was not a "royal" who were deemed to be Gods or descendants from the Gods.

This meant that most statutes which were of the Royals or their families would have some outside features to distinguish them from ordinary Egypticians.

There have been other "lifelike" statutes, but most have been destroyed by cave-ins or grave robbers who usually got there archeologists. You can find pictures of the pieces on the internet of the realistic hands, feet and other body parts destroyed out superstition or by decree.

[narciso]

the surprise would be a contrary view,

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2014/02/university-textbook-claims-reagan-was-sexist-conservatives-are-judgmental/

[Beasts of England]

I've had a few entertaining hours reading JOM today without being interrupted by our most recent troll. How did I do this? Did I install the narcisolator? Nope. This thread reminded me that I had a bad case of Thyepad fever during the GZ trial; missing those contemporaneous comments.

The GZ Trial banter is classic! If anyone wants to see JOM at its apex, open up the wayback machine and enjoy...

[narciso]

This is the source of the first citation from that piece;

http://sowkweb.usc.edu/sites/default/files/faculty_members/curriculum_vitae/janssoncv.pdf

[narciso]

Ah, Musket Morgan, snorfle;

http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/02/16/The-evidence-against-Piers-Morgan

[rich@gmu]

Happy Birthday to GUS!!! AND A BELATED Happy Birhtday to your son.

Evening all.

[rich@gmu]

Natalie Musumeci / NY Daily News:
EXCLUSIVE: National clown shortage may be approaching, trade organizations fear

facepalm. how could we be running a clown shortage?

[Beasts of England]

lol, rich! A clown shortage? And Obama's off playing golf! Where's the leadership?!

[Miss Marple]

My brother will be thrilled. He HATES clowns like some people hate snakes or spiders.

I have to admit I am not too fond of them, between John Wayne Gacy and Stephen King's "It."

[narciso]

this is why they need to raise the minimnm wage. so we have more professioanally trained
and certified clown, snarc.

[Beasts of England]

I hate clowns, too! Hopefully, thanks to the greatness of ObamaCare, they're all off writing cowboy poetry...

[Miss Marple]

http://www.ballot-access.org/2014/02/for-first-time-in-history-democrats-wont-run-anyone-for-u-s-senate-in-alabama/

[Robin, agog]

I would just like to say that I hope that future Olympics will have a live feed channel. This morning I went to a friend's house with cable and watched the entirety of the free dance portion of the ice dance competition. Getting to see the superstars and everyone else competing gives the viewer a much greater appreciation of the sport as a whole. How can you understand the difference between gold medal caliber and everyone else unless you get to see the lesser ranked competitors too?

The Canadians were stellar and the Americans produced their usual perfect skate. I won't tell you the outcome. My friend, not a fan of figure skating, was amazed that all the western teams' coaches were Russian, which made me laugh. Since she and her husband are Canadian and are in the US because he can make a LOT more money here than at home in academia, she should understand exactly why those Russian coaches are here. A good choreographer for a top team pulls in $15-20K for a program. And Russians are great choreographers.

[Bori]

From the clown article:

"Cyrus Zavieh, the president of New York Clown Alley, a group that boasts 45 members across the New York area, said clowns can pull in up to $300 for a birthday party — but that’s hardly a financial incentive for many young people."

But, but with ObamaCare they don't have to be job-locked and choose to be clowns all they want. This is not supposed to happen.

"“Our audience expects to be wowed,” said David Kiser, Ringling Bros. director of talent. “No longer is it good enough to just drop your pants and focus on boxer shorts."

People should be satisfied with whatever the clown's artistic expression is, and stop being so demanding,snarc.

[narciso]

We snark at the idiocy of Alvarez, but she served her function, despite the fact that Zimmernam was justified, she destroyed his life, Frances Robles, used this opportunity to join her ar Carlos Slim,where she covers up more malfeasance as in with the Obamacare site,

We are perilously close to Frank Underwood's Washington, where those who speak truth to power are silence, rather literally or figuratively

[centralcal]

Robin: I am at work today, and was able to watch the entire ice dancing competition on my computer by signing on with my AT&T Uverse account. It sure beats staying up until late night to see it.

[21_cathy_f_in_tripep@d_prison_98]

Really? Dropping trou is the first act he thinks of for a birthday party?

[narciso]

The latter is utterly pragmatic, the Southern Borgia has no grand ideological vision, he eschews both clean energy and the anti military bill that Cruz and Paul endorse in real life,
as power is his sole objective

[Robin, agog]

What's a Uverse account? My friends are sweet, but I sure would like to watch at home.

[narciso]

It's the expanded Comcast service,

[rich@gmu]

narciso@545

ha. yea, posted it to the wrong thread.

[narciso]

Oops, that would be Xfinity,

[Miss Marple]

I thought Uverse was the At&T thing. I am on Comcast/Xfinity and we do not hae Uverse.

[centralcal]

ATT Uverse = cable tv, wifi/internet, phone (not cellular)

[narciso]

well back on his head;

http://hotair.com/headlines/archives/2014/02/17/bashing-bill-clinton-over-the-lewinsky-affair-makes-the-gop-look-desperate-and-out-of-control/

[Robin, agog]

centralcal, who did you like more - the Canadians or the Americans?

[Extraneus]

I was appalled by the girl in the sidebar at narciso's 3:42.

I will not post her picture here, nor do I recommend googling "appalled at or appalled by."

[Robin, have hammer and plan to bash away]

I plan to bash Bill Clinton about his womanizing as much as possible to anyone who will listen if Hillary is the Dem nominee AND they pull that war on women crap.

[Extraneus]

Why should Romney, or Rove for that matter, care if Rand Paul commits a faux pas by attacking Bill Clinton's lack of character?

[narciso]

Personally letting four men, die in the Libyan desert, is more pertinent, but we are told 'what difference does that make,

[narciso]

just more category error;

http://weaselzippers.us/174402-dunn-verdict-fuels-calls-to-change-florida-gun-law/

[Extraneus]

I would like to ask Rove and Romney on national TV why it's inappropriate to point out the immorality of a prospective first husband. Would it be ok to do so if a male candidate had a $10 hooker for a wife?

#waronwomen

[centralcal]

Robin - not sure. The phone rang twice during the Canadian's performance, which distracted me and doesn't allow me a fair opinion. No phone or interruption during the US team's performance, which I thought was flawless.

[jimmyk]

I plan to bash Bill Clinton about his womanizing as much as possible to anyone who will listen if Hillary is the Dem nominee AND they pull that war on women crap.

I would emphasize Hillary's enabling and excusing of his behavior, and not just the "womanizing," which suggests something much more benign than occurred with Katherine Willey, Juanita Broderick, Paula Jones, and Monica Lewinsky. It was an early example of "What difference does it make?" which should have been more of a warning.

If Hillary is the candidate, the spotlight must be on her, not her husband.

[Steve]

GOLD MEDAL FOR USA!
Meryl Davis, Charlie White win USA's first Ice Dancing Gold medal at Sochi Olympics 2014

http://commoncts.blogspot.com/2014/02/meryl-davis-charlie-white-win-usas.html

[narciso]

they didn't ask abour divining and hisruptcy;

http://hotair.com/archives/2014/02/17/study-democrats-more-likely-to-think-astrology-is-scientific-less-likely-to-know-earth-revolves-around-the-sun/

[Stephanie VIP shhhhh its fight club]

The 10 am feed has shown all of the figure skating live since the start. I record it and watch it during the overnight rerun of the primetime show. They also show some of the CC, ski jump, aerials and other stuff live on the non major network feeds. Particularly the 5 am feed and 8 am feeds.

Interestingly the 10 am live skating gets you Tara Lupinski and Johnny Weirdo but the evening feed of the same skate has Scotty Hamilton and Tracy whatshername doing the commentary. Been interesting to note the differences.

Btw Costas is back tonight. YUCK.

[Jane-curling is on!]

Robin,

They all made me nervous. Other than the last Russian pair (I saw the final four) they all seemed flawless.

It's very interesting to watch people excel at a sport that you have no clue how it is done.

As I think about it, it's more interesting to watch a sport that you do know how it's done and can thus appreciate it more.

[Captain Hate]

I don't think anybody is suggesting that Slick's predatory behavior should be the only attack point on Rodham. God knows she has so many weaknesses that the HMS Pantsuit should be taking fire from every direction.