Calling For An Islamic Reformation - Game Change, Or More Cheap Talk?

Glenn links to a Roger Simon post about a potentially dramatic moment in Egypt:

Egypt’s President Abdel Fattah al-Sisi made an extraordinary speech on New Year’s Day to Cairo’s Al-Azhar and the Awqaf Ministry calling for a long overdue virtual ecclesiastical revolution in Islam.  This is something no Western leader has the had the courage to do, certainly not Barack Obama, despite his Muslim education.

Accusing the umma (world Islamic population) of encouraging the hostility of the entire world, al-Sisi’s speech is so dramatic and essentially revolutionary it brings to mind Khrushchev’s famous speech exposing Stalin. Many have called for a reformation of Islam, but for the leader of the largest Arab nation to do so has world-changing implications.

The translation of the speech is presented by Raymnd Ibrahim, who apparently follows these things. I know virtually nothing about the likelihood of an Islamic reformation, but I do know that Raymond Ibrahim also presented this in Human Events on Dec 18:

‘MUSLIM REFORMERS’: FOREVER TALKING THE TALK, NEVER WALKING THE WALK

Due to its rarity, it’s always notable whenever a top Islamic leader publicly acknowledges the threat of Islamic radicalism and terror. And yet, such denunciations never seem to go beyond words—and sometimes not even that.

...

In fact, this sort of equivocation is typical of ostensibly moderate leaders and institutions throughout the Islamic world. Consider Egypt. One of the most appealing characteristics of President Sisi has been his outspokenness concerning the need for a more modern, moderate Islam. 

For example, months before Sisi was elected president, I reported/translated the following:

During his recent speech at the Dept. of Moral Affairs for the Armed Forces [in January 2014], Gen. Abdul Fateh al-Sisi—the man who ousted former President Morsi and his Muslim Brotherhood in response to the June Revolution and who is seen as the nation’s de facto ruler—declared that “Religious discourse is the greatest battle and challenge facing the Egyptian people, and pointed to the need for a new vision and a modern, comprehensive understanding of the religion of Islam—rather than relying on a discourse that has not changed for 800 years.”

Sisi further “called on all who follow the true Islam to improve the image of this religion in front of the world, after Islam has been for decades convicted of violence and destruction around the world, due to the crimes falsely committed in the name of Islam.”

As with the pronunciations of Bahrain’s crown prince, so far so good.  Yet what has Sisi actually done about renewing Islamic discourse since becoming president?  “Absolutely nothing,” says one prominent Egyptian journalist.  Speaking recently on his popular TV show, Ibrahim Eissa said:

What is the position of the Egyptian government concerning religious radicalization among the religious parties?  And now I specifically refer to the position of President Sisi concerning this matter.  Five months have passed since he became president, after his amazing showing at elections.  Okay: the president has, more than once, indicated the need for a renewal of religious discourse….  But he has not done a single thing, President Sisi, to renew religious discourse.  Nothing at all.

Talk may be cheap but rewarding, however, since continued Western aid may be one outcome of this moderate rhetoric.

 

 

 

Comments

[Threadkiller]

New thread?

"Sen. John Barrasso (R-Wyo.) said on Sunday that House Majority Whip Steve Scalise made a “grave mistake” in speaking to a white supremacists in 2002."

http://itk.thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/228438-gop-senator-scalise-made-grave-mistake

I wonder if taking the racist approach is simply the Tea Party using the "hecklers veto" to remove the House leadership that pushed for such a crappy, pro-Obama, end to the House session.

[Shurma Bave.]

Fatwah incoming
Fuels fear for head and shoulders.
Droning for dandruff.
==============

[RickB]

"Talk may be cheap but rewarding, however, since continued Western aid may be one outcome of this moderate rhetoric."

TM,

What do you see as the source of funds? EUtopia is currently engaged in calculating the cost of holding onto a profligate Greece (followed by Spain), with Germany adopting a "we can live without 'em" stance at the moment. Morsi was BOzo's choice, I don't foresee BOzo making a request for aid. Russia is a bit short at the moment and Egypt has nothing which China wants.

Venezuela, Argentina and soon Brazil are rattling beggar's cups and I find it difficult to identify a source capable of fulfilling all needs.

[Captain Hate]

Don't you need a centralized hierarchy before you can call for a reformation?

[rich@gmu]

Posted by: Captain Hate | January 04, 2015 at 12:51 PM -

that is part of the problem but the Egyptian government has had its fingers in shaping the religious outlook and religious authorities for some time. think of it this way-Sisi is looking to jump off the tiger without getting eaten.

Egyptian military authorities gave a wink and a nod to radicalism, and in wanting to keep religious authorities contained, military authorities gave them some official power in things like the education ministry and various state run media outlets. Ooops-especially when they have to import about half its food and travel and tourism is their major industry.

[Sandy "I Stand with Walker 2016" Daze ن]

The example of Mustafa Kemal Atatürk may be instructive.

When TM suggests "...since continued Western aid may be one outcome of this moderate rhetoric..." I think he reflects an assumption by many that Headchoppers United (i.e. the Daesh, IS , ISIS, ISIL, whatever) are not likely to receive Western funding. Then again, with this current crop, e.g. hrc calling for understanding of our enemies, who knowz....

P.S to Shurma Bave, Great one, Centurion !

[Carol_Herman]

Mubarak kept order. Made sure there was enough flour for bread. And, got ousted. It was pretty hairy going for awhile.

Usually, you get revolutions when things are going well; and a "middle class" gets restive. Which caused a crisis. And, Lara Logan got raped. Tourism has not only "dipped" ... traffic really slowed.

The Japanese were very big on trips to Egypt. But they've got their own economic crises going on now. So overall business in Egypt is not booming.

For most Egyptians Sisi is excellent news. He returned the country's stability. Mubarak was not killed by judiciary. And, the places that are truly messed up range from Libya to Yemen.

America is propping up Jordan. If we weren't Jordan would be facing street eruptions.

Israel, meanwhile, proved her point this past summer by spending 40 days in Gaza. (Did the tunnel arrays surprise you?)

Syria, so far, has seen 3 years of fighting, without letup. This regional stuff has a stabilizing effect on her neighbors, including Turkey. And, I read somewhere that the Kurds may actually gain themselves a state in that region.

Americans don't want to be involved in a "hot" war "over there." And, even the Russian people aren't hot to send in troops. (If you think Putin didn't learn from Russia's misadventure in Afghanistan, then you got to miss the picture.)

Afghanistan's major trade product is opium. Poppies. Worldwide consumption. And, America built them 8-lane-highways to bring that product to market.

Back in the days of Vietnam we built them a port that could accommodate cargo ships.

Nobody ever says thanks. Even though these things costs us much treasure. And, blood.

Now, for the good news: Drudge is headlining that Boehner is getting some opposition on his owning the House's "speakership." If Goehmer doesn't smoke, and he wins the gavel, he'll have to remove the drapes and the rugs ... just to be able to breathe. So? May luck be with us. May the Orange Lush be retired.

Obama? He's threatening to use his veto pen. That's good news for the GOP. It means the dems don't even have a raft as their candidates face re-elections.

The show must go on.

[Sandy "I Stand with Walker 2016" Daze ن]

That is, any movement by al-Sisi toward an Kemalist reordering of Egyptian society should be welcomed, imho.

Not that mao will approve, he'll probably sanction al-Sisi, but al-Sisi knows that mao has little time left in office, inshallah, and for the changes inside Egypt, as an example to the ummah, we are talking decades, if not an eternal journey toward "perfection."

That is, it won't happen overnight, but in the great tradition of community organizers,

Think Globally, Act Locally.

[Danube on iPad]

Never happen.

[BeenThereDoneThat]

AL-Sisi does Taqiyya. Al Baracka Obama does his own version of the same thing.

[Captain Hate]

OT

I ridicule ESPN all the time but I defy anybody to watch these clips with a dry eye:

http://deadspin.com/rich-eisen-hannah-storm-others-react-live-to-stuart-1677360761/all

[BeenThereDoneThat]

Al-Sisi does Taqiyya. Al Baracka Obama does his version the same way.

[Sandy "I Stand with Walker 2016" Daze ن]

Al-Sisi does Taqiyya.

They all do, particularly mao.

It may be just that for al-Sisi. We'll know better in five years. Actions, or lack thereof speak for themselves.

For now, I'm happy to have al-Sisi in power and moresi out of power.

[Captain Hate]

For now, I'm happy to have al-Sisi in power and moresi out of power.

Absolutely

[Iggy]

Positing that Al-Sisi is serious, which of the two following scenarios is more likely?
1. Islam reforms, even partially.
2. Sisi loses his head in totality.

[Danube on iPad]

God. I didn't know Scott had died.

Very sad, and way too young.

[matt]

The WSJ reported yesterday that Obama invoked some more of dat good ole executive privilege in putting the Norks on double secret probation.

The Palestinians have resorted to the nuclear option with Israel by applying for UN recognition and membership in the world court.

The Cubans respond to our overtures with a crackdown on dissidents and Bob Menendez is super pissed that he was left out in the dark.

ISIL advanced danger close to some of our advisers in Iraq but our pinpricks using Very Expensive Air Warfare seem to be well, doing something....

The Taliban is going trans-national in Pok -i-Ston and and A'stan. Amd on and on....

Remember when a couple of dozen SF's rode with the Northern Alliance in cavalry charges and defeated the Taliban?

WTF happened?

Al Sisi has a good idea and Al Ahzar is the dominant university in Koranic thought but the course of Islam was frozen first by Uthman not long after Mohammed's death and then, finally the Ummayads, but that was more stylistic.

I think Al Sisi may end up like Sadat. There are simply too many Muslims still chained back in the 14th century and the crazy runs strong.

[Miss Marple]

Sandy, I brought this up in the last thread.

Remember when Morsi fell and the Muslim Brotherhood headquarters were ransaacked? The furniture was distributed to the poor, but the FILES were carted off in boxes. There was a BBC reporter on site watching.

Then, several months later, Mrs. Morsi made some sort of comment about how Obama had been working with her husband. That story disappeared REAL quick.

Then an Egyptian paper had a story accusing Obama of being a secret Muslim Brotherhood member.

Now, the only thing I really know is that those files were carried off. The rest of this might be rumor, false accusations, etc.

But I do wonder what was in those files, and if Sisi is using them to keep aid flowing, because the first instinct of Obama was to stop aid. Then he didn't.

[Miss Marple]

Iggy,

Last night I heard an interesting story on BBC about Oman. Apparently they allow Christian churches and Hindu temples to exist. The thing they don't allow is proselytizing.

They are considered much freer concerning religious faith than almost anywhere in the Middle East.

I didn't know anything about it, but they interviewed a lot of ex-pats living there who all said the same thing.

So, there is a possibility that Islam could be reformed in Egypt. I am also sure that Sisi has a target painted on him by the nutcases, although I am sure, with the assassination of Sadat in mind, he has good security.

[Holly]

I'm off to the Cowboy game, but before I go, wanted to share an email that's circulating again. I have to remind myself that Jerry Jones does good stuff sometimes. :) BTW, I believe American Sniper is out now with limited engagements.

===================================================

Subject: Texas Goodbye
A TEXAS GOODBYE

This is why America will remain strong. We take care of our own as well as others who may not deserve taking care of. I just wanted to share with you all that out of a horrible tragedy we were blessed by so many people.

Chris Kyle was Derek's teammate through 10 years of training and battle. They both suffer/suffered from PTSD to some extent and took great care of each other because of it.

2006 in Ramadi was horrible for young men that never had any more aggressive physical contact with another human than on a Texas football field.

They lost many friends. Chris became the armed services number #1 sniper of all time. Not something he was happy about, other than the fact that in so doing, he saved a lot of American lives.

Three years ago, his wife Taya asked him to leave the SEAL teams as he had a huge bounty on his head by Al Qaeda. He did and wrote the book "The American Sniper." 100% of the proceeds from the book went to two of the SEAL families who had lost their sons in Iraq .

That was the kind of guy Chris was. He formed a company in Dallas to train military, police and I think firemen as far as protecting themselves in difficult situations. He also formed a foundation to work with military people suffering from PTSD. Chris was a giver not a taker.

He, along with a friend and neighbor, Chad Littlefield, were murdered trying to help a young man that had served six months in Iraq and claimed to have PTSD.

Now I need to tell you about all of the blessings.

Southwest Airlines flew in any SEAL and their family from any airport they flew into free of charge.

The employees donated buddy passes and one lady worked for four days without much of a break to see that it happened.

Volunteers were at both airports in Dallas to drive them to the hotel.

The Marriott Hotel reduced their rates to $45 a night and cleared the hotel for only SEALs and family.

The Midlothian, Texas Police Department paid the $45 a night for each room. I would guess there were about 200 people staying at the hotel, 100 of them were SEALs. Two large buses were chartered (an unknown donor paid the bill) to transport people to the different events and they also had a few rental cars (donated). The police and secret service were on duty 24 hours during the stay at our hotel.

At the Kyle house, the Texas DPS parked a large motor home in front to block the view from reporters. It remained there the entire five days for the SEALs to congregate in and all to use the restroom so as not to have to go in the house. Taya, their two small children and both sets of parents were staying in the home.

Only a hand full of SEALs went into the home as they had different duties and meetings were held sometimes on a hourly basis. It was a huge coordination of many different events and security. Derek was assigned to be a Pall Bearer, to escort Chris' body when it was transferred from the Midlothian Funeral Home to the Arlington Funeral Home, and to be with Taya. A tough job.

Taya seldom came out of her bedroom. The house was full with people from the church and other family members that would come each day to help. I spent one morning in a bedroom with Chris’ mom and the next morning with Chad Littlefield's parents (the other man murdered with Chris). A tough job.

George W Bush and his wife Laura met and talked to everyone on the Seal Team one on one. They went behind closed doors with Taya for quite a while. They had prayer with us all. You can tell when people were sincere and caring

Nolan Ryan sent his cooking team, a huge grill and lots of steaks, chicken and hamburgers. They set up in the front yard and fed people all day long including the 200 SEALs and their families. The next day a local BBQ restaurant set up a buffet in front of the house and fed all once again. Food was plentiful and all were taken care of. The family's church kept those inside the house well fed.

Jerry Jones, the man everyone loves to hate, was a rock star. He made sure that we all were taken care of. His wife and he were just making sure everyone was taken care of….Class. He donated the use of Cowboy Stadium for the services as it was determined that so many wanted to attend.

The charter buses transported us to the stadium on Monday at 10:30 am. Every car, bus, motorcycle was searched with bomb dogs and police. I am not sure if kooks were making threats trying to make a name for themselves or if so many SEALs in one place was a security risk, I don't know. We willingly obliged. No purses went into the stadium!

We were taken to The Legends room high up and a large buffet was available. That was for about 300 people. We were growing.

A Medal of Honor recipient was there, lots of secret service and police and Sarah Palin and her husband. She looked nice, this was a very formal military service.

The service started at 1:00 pm and when we were escorted onto the field I was shocked. We heard that about 10,000 people had come to attend also. They were seated in the stadium seats behind us. It was a beautiful and emotional service.

The Bagpipe and drum corps were wonderful and the Texas A&M men's choir stood through the entire service and sang right at the end. We were all in tears.

The next day was the 200-mile procession from Midlothian, Texas to Austin for burial. It was a cold, drizzly, windy day, but the people were out. We had dozens of police motorcycles riders, freedom riders, five chartered buses and lots of cars. You had to have a pass to be in the procession and still it was huge. Two helicopters circled the procession with snipers sitting out the side door for protection. It was the longest funeral procession ever in the state of Texas. People were everywhere. The entire route was shut down ahead of us, the people were lined up on the side of the road the entire way. Firemen were down on one knee, police officers were holding their hats over their hearts, children waving flags, veterans saluting as we went by. Every bridge had fire trucks with large flags displayed from their tall ladders, people all along the entire 200 miles were standing in the cold weather. It was so heartwarming. Taya rode in the hearse with Chris' body so Derek rode the route with us. I was so grateful to have that time with him.

The service was at Texas National Cemetery. Very few are buried there and you have to apply to get in. It is like people from the Civil War, Medal of Honor winners, a few from the Alamo and all the historical people of Texas. It was a nice service and the Freedom Riders surrounded the outside of the entire cemetery to keep the crazy church people from Kansas that protest at military funerals away from us.

Each SEAL put his Trident (metal SEAL badge) on the top of Chris' casket, one at a time. A lot hit it in with one blow. Derek was the only one to take four taps to put his in and it was almost like he was caressing it as he did it. Another tearful moment.

After the service Governor Rick Perry and his wife, Anita, invited us to the governor's mansion. She stood at the door, greeted each of us individually, and gave each of the SEALs a coin of Texas. She was a sincere, compassionate, and gracious hostess.

We were able to tour the ground floor and then went into the garden for beverages and BBQ. So many of the Seal team guys said that after they get out they are moving to Texas. They remarked that they had never felt so much love and hospitality. The charter buses then took the guys to the airport to catch their returning flights. Derek just now called and after a 20 hours flight he is back in his spot, in a dangerous land on the other side of the world, protecting America.

We just wanted to share with you, the events of a quite emotional, but blessed week.

[Bori]

Iggy,

Just what will you condider reform? That, is the question. The fact that Sisi is critizising Islam itself is some sort of progress.

[Holly]

And great pieces, Clarice.

[Captain Hate]

Thanks for copying and pasting that Holly and kudos to Jerry Jones for what he did.

This day is just full of people acting positively. Maybe this will be a great year.

[Holly]

And CH, if there's any waxing going on, I believe I'm the one doing it, and if I had more time, I would do more of it. *wicked grin* IMO, catzyf is a model of restraint, because jeez louise, the ND band kids are AMAZING! They graduate in four years, have little time to practice, and the vast majority have real majors (not music majors). They're engineers, physics, chemistry, pre-med, etc. . . .Hard to fit in band with those lab schedules. See . . . I can wax all day. :)

But I understand your point. Different strokes . . . We love you anyway.

Ok, music majors are real majors . . . . but you get my point.

[Captain Hate]

Yes I get your point and I'm glad you got mine.

Have fun at the game and may the best team win (surely the Cowboys).

[Danube on iPad]

Wonderful story, Holly. Many thanks.

"100% of the proceeds from the book went to two of the SEAL families who had lost their sons in Iraq ." After Jesse Ventura takes his cut, I guess.

Watched American Sniper last week on my niece's academy consideration disc. Very well done.

[Jack is Back!]

The largest muslim country in the world is Indonesia and whne I lived there in 1982-83 it was pretty westernized. They allowed gambling via casinos but later outlawed that. Much like in Malaysis in the Highlands where there are world class resorts and casinos. Malaysia is a predoinant muslim country.

I know that fundamentalism has increased in Indonesian (i.e. Bali bombing) but it is still pretty moderate owing more to its Asian versus Mid-east culture and sensitivity.

Reforming Wahabism is going to be a much higher mountain to climb. I don't see how you can do it without changing your stripes on Israel, Judaism and Chritianity. As well as women's equal rights. I think that is really a bridge too far for the stone-age set.

[narciso]

Asisi comes out of Military Intelligence, so unlike Sadat, he's more aware of the problem, a good deal of the problem lies with Al Azhar, the core of the umma's theological base,

Corker was very blanc mange today, Thune was not strong enough on slapping down, a notion of a higher gas tax, and you're right, clarice, the Huffington Post, made me
slip up,

[Danube on iPad]

WASHINGTON (The Borowitz Report)—Sixty-four unskilled workers will report to new jobs in Washington, D.C. on Tuesday as part of a federal jobs program that provides employment for people unable to find productive work elsewhere.

The new hires, who have no talents or abilities that would make them employable in most workplaces, will be earning a first-year salary of $174,000.

For that sum, the new employees will be expected to work a hundred and thirty-seven days a year, leaving them with two hundred and twenty-eight days of vacation.

Some critics have blasted the federal jobs program as too expensive, noting that the workers were chosen last November in a bloated and wasteful selection process that cost the nation nearly four billion dollars.

But Davis Logsdon, a University of Minnesota economics professor who specializes in labor issues, said that the program is necessary to provide work “for people who honestly cannot find employment anywhere else.”

“Expensive as this program is, it is much better to have these people in jobs than out on the street,” he said.

[Sandy "I Stand with Walker 2016" Daze ن]

Oman is good, so too is Jordan; so too is Kurdistan.
~~~~~~~~
I don't care so much for a permanent solution--it would be nice, but reform of whabbihibi'i'i'sm is too big a challenge. I'd settle for just some breathing room for the next decades...

At this point I would rather have 50% of something--say an al-Sisi telling the mullahs to get their $h!t together--and perhaps some of them doing so; than have nobody in authority saying anything. Is it likely that he'll have his head chopped?

al-Sisi is walking a high-wire, and there is no net below him. While we might assess his chances of success as low, should we not at least support his initiative?

Some comments seem to be of the "clean burka crowd" ilk, i.e. the islamic "faith" is so dysfunctional that nothing can be done so even if someone says something should be done, he cannot be trusted, or he will fail so why bother to support him...

JiB - not to get into a disagreement with you on islam, I don't even pass the grade in Catholicism (which is my faith) so what I know about islam can be put into a thimble, but I think you would agree that middle eastern islam practiced by Arabs, is a bit different that the islam practiced by Indonesians and Malays (let alone that of Persians).

MM - I had seen your comment on the other thread too. In my view, the connection between mao and the MB is unmistakable, this whitehouse is penetrated by the enemy. The State Department is penetrated by the enemy. The DoD has had to respond to the enemy's penetration at the executive and State, by twisting itself into pretzels across a spectrum, whether excising language, censoring leaders, or coddling double agents, a'la SoA Hassan.

Anything al-Sisi does to frustrate mao is good, imo.

[Iggy]

--Iggy,

Just what will you condider reform?--

Not sawing heads off would be a start, but frankly I don't believe it will ever reform. It seems to be more immoderate now than it was 1,000 years ago.

The basic tenets of Islam are irreconcilable and hostile to freedom, good government and neighborliness. It is spread by coercion and pressure.
I no more believe it can reform itself than Marxism can; they are both fundamentally false and malignant and both appeal to and enshrine the worst tendencies of human nature.

[clarice]

Great account, Holly, thanks.

Sisi AND the UAE have listed Hamas as terrorists outfits while the US refuses to; Sisi is working with the Israelis to cut off arms to Gaza and to clean up the Sinai,

Egypt is now in the real Arab Spring.

I can't imagine why anyone would think he's doing this for Obama's approval--it's contrary to everything this dingbat outfit stands for.

[Jane]

The new hires, who have no talents or abilities that would make them employable in most workplaces, will be earning a first-year salary of $174,000.

For that sum, the new employees will be expected to work a hundred and thirty-seven days a year, leaving them with two hundred and twenty-eight days of vacation.

Holy shit.

[Old Lurker]

I agree with JiB 2:45 and Iggy 3:13.

[clarice]

Outrageous, DoT.

OTOH as our society requires more complex skills and larger numbers of people seem unable to acquire them, what are we to do to find them jobs?

[rich@gmu]

don't vote them into congress ... think Col McSally and Col Ernst might disagree with the assessment of their skill set.

[Jack is Back!]

We had lunch at Bill's Bar and Burgers in Rock Center today. But on the East Side where white priviledge is on display at brunch they had a number of "black lives matter" disruptions.

https://twitter.com/hashtag/blackbrunchnyc?src=hash

#blackbrunchNYC

BTW, most of that white priviledge on display is a Carolyn Maloney constituency. IOW's liberal democrat Ivies.

[narciso]

therein lies the rub, the schools no longer teach the skills, their specialty is mind arson, as rse would put it,

Borowitz is a satire site, a touch less droll than the duffelbag, yet still quite plausible,

[narciso]

why is the truth so hard to get at:

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2015/01/dem-senator-menendez-obama-exchanged-innocent-americans-for-three-convicted-spies-video/

[Dave (in MA)]

DoT, NH does it right; $100/yr and no per diem.

[Captain Hate]

It's pretty bad when Menendez can be counted on to confront 404 more than the GOPe. Corker was a disappointment but I think Thune is just extremely low key/close to the vest in those settings.

[Richard]

Let's stop stumbling and get this reformation tango right. Islam has had an is suffering the Wahhabi reformation for centuries. What is needed as a counter-reformation. Saudi bribery in gold and black gold are the bulwarks that protect and advance Wahhabism. Most of the media has or wishes to be bought, and hence casts a blind eye to the documented history or the Wahhabi suppression of traditional Islam that preceded the reformation, and suppresses any moderation and return to tradition. The ubiquitous destruction of architectural heritage throughout the Islamic world is a "monument" to Wahhabi suppression of genuine traditional Islam.

[narciso]

there should something more than a yip:

http://legalinsurrection.com/2015/01/rising-islamism-falling-oil-threaten-to-disintegrate-nigeria/

six month a year from now, they will realize this,

[Jack is Back!]

Sandy, that was my point in re Mid-east Arab Wahabism versus more moderate southeast Asian Islam (less those crazy assholes in Pakistan). No disagreement at all.

At least in Indonesia, Women can drive. I call them the Italian version of muslim femininism - pretty girls on Vespas. The Indonesians and Malays worry substantial more about China and the Chinese than they do radical Islam.

[James D.]

DoT @ 2:57

It's satire.

What's depressing is that not only is it completely believeable with today's FedGov, it's a dead certainty that there are far more stupid, and far more wasteful, programs out there for real.

[Miss Marple]

Sandy,

Thanks for your comment on my post.

Its getting harder for Obama to conceal his intentions. I hope people in higher places have figured it out.

[narciso]

this is certainly proof we have been through a wormhole:

http://libertyunyielding.com/2015/01/04/passion-olive-trees-settlers-pelt-u-s-diplomatic-personnel-west-bank-video/

Suharto unlike Zia and even Mubarak really did try to keep the Brotherhood in check,

[narciso]

this is the other author of the Perfect Latin American idiot opining:

http://babalublog.com/2015/01/04/only-one-winner-in-obama-casstro-deal-cubas-apartheid-dictatorship/

[Captain Hate]

Ok, if Mike Brown fires Marvin Lewis, can Andy Dalton be salvaged as a QB capable of winning a playoff game. Both of them seem like good guys but their playoff records are terrible.

[Iggy]

The only jobs program that employs unskilled laborers that would be worth $174,000 per year would be one that issued automatic rifles to the dopes and turned them loose on Capitol Hill and Pennsylvania Avenue.
That cost/benefit ratio could save us trillions.

[Iggy]

The problem with moderate Islam or the older more traditional Islam is that even it, at best, is authoritarian and unfree.
There is no liberal, liberty supporting Islam and it's hard to see how any reformation could ever get there considering the foundation it starts with.

[narciso]

true, that's why I brought up the original Mohammed Ali, who bottled up the Wahhabi djinn in the nejd, for a generation,

http://www.cfr.org/indonesia/jemaah-islamiyah-k-jemaah-islamiah/p8948

[Jack is Back!]

narciso,

We are going to dinner in a short hour with Mrs. JiB's college classmate who is a Nigerian doctor here in New York. I am going to bring up that 3:38 Legal Insurrection peice and get his take. He's a "Prince" of a fellow, if you get my drift:)

[daddy]

Yippee! The Cowboys Game is streaming live on my computer.

On TV I have 64 channels but no NFL.

[Jack is Back!]

Because you are in France, daddy. They should be getting ready for 6 nations Rugby which BTW is worth gertting tickets to if you are in the UK or France when one of the matches is on.

How about thos Lions. Unintimidated.

[Jack is Back!]

Cowboys are firing on all 2 cylinders now like a burned out Citröen.

[Extraneus]

I haven't ever seen one of these reformers try to refute the words of the Koran, or say that those violent words are outdated and should be stricken.

We've all seen the pictures of university students in Egypt from the 60s, 70s and 80s up to today. A few decades ago, Iran was a modern country. Islamic countries today are more radical and backward than they were just decades ago.

Throughout history, whenever Islam got too powerful, it had to be beaten back.

I'm happy to read Sisi's comments, but I think it more likely than not that things will escalate as Islam becomes more powerful and, perhaps in our lifetimes, they will be beaten back again; i.e., nuked.

[Sandy "I Stand with Walker 2016" Daze ن]

Lions' #90 Ndamukong Suh is a thug of the worst sort, irredeemable. His measly one-game suspension for trying to cripple Rogers was lifted in lieu of a fine. bfd. Suh should be permanently suspended.

[Sandy "I Stand with Walker 2016" Daze ن]

Cowboys are firing on all 2 cylinders now like a burned out Citröen.

Who knew !?! I thought most Citröens only had two cylinders. HA.

The Cowgurlz--?--prepare to be disappointed.

Saying that, I'd rather them than the Lions.

[Jack is Back!]

Reggie. Lions take it 99 yards after a stupid Boys penalty on the punt.

14-0.

That Citrôen just lost a cylinder.

[Extraneus]

I do have a happy Muslim holiday story.

There's an older guy at work named Mohammad. We all call him Mo. Nice guy, but I've always looked at him with something of a jaundiced eye.

Anyway, I ran into him at a Christmas party at a bar near work, and he appeared to notice my surprise that he was drinking a beer.

"I'm not a good Muslim," he said with a sheepish smile.

"Ah, well, nobody's perfect," I replied, smiling likewise.

At which point, he began to regale me with a tale of his favorite wine store, and its great prices and selection. He rattled off a bunch of his favorite reds and their prices, all in the $20 to $30 range.

I'm no Eric or Beasts, and no little of the great wines of the world.

Next day, he emailed me a list of maybe 20 wines and their prices. I took a ride to this store and picked his top two choices, which my Christmas Eve guests loved, thanks to a Muslim guy named Mohammad.

[Sandy "I Stand with Walker 2016" Daze ن]

Coinkydink, had a dog I called Mohammed.

[Sandy "I Stand with Walker 2016" Daze ن]

Daddy,

I guess you are not getting the Kate Upton commercials for "Game of War"

Much better than the cowboyzzzzz...

[daddy]

had a dog I called Mohammed.

Makes me wonder how Thomas Lifson's story might have come out if he had named his dog Mohammed.
Did you hear the one about the editor, two dogs, and 25 Muslim girls?

Lifson's story reminded me a lot of my sad story about being in Penang and observing the woman in the Bhurka wanting to interact with the young non-Muslim child, but her Black Bhurka being so frightening it made him scared and crying, and she then sank back in her seat with evident sadness unable, because of the stupid rules of her religion, from being able to joyously interact with another of God's good creatures.

[Another bob]

A number of years ago, I found myself in a nightclub at 3 AM in a Muslim country, drinking with quite the number of Muslims. An enjoyable time had by all.

My disappointment is these Muslims are not speaking out and acting against the lunatics.

[Lazybusy]

I have not seen any comment yet on an article in the NYT, titled, Is life better in Red States?, by Richard Florida. I'm not able to link. He disdain toward and arrogance for the red states is palpable. His bottom line is, it's only fair for the red states, who live within their means, to help pay the high cost of the blue states because they export their brilliance to them.

[Eric in Boise]

I'm no Eric or Beasts, and no little of the great wines of the world.

You might be confusing me with lyle, one of our other Idaho denizens. He's an oenophile; I'm just a beer guy. :)

There is no liberal, liberty supporting Islam

No there's not, and that's why the expression "There may be moderate Muslims, but there is no moderate Islam" sums things up well.

[FTL]

My disappointment is these Muslims are not speaking out and acting against the lunatics.

Even if they did, the leftards possessing the deathgrip on communication to the masses would never allow their stories to see the light of day.

Do you want to know how to free these oppressed from their oppressors? Silence the western left. It is the western left who provide the lunatics their power.

[Beasts of England]

@Lazybusy: I read that article. As a Southern red stater, that shit makes my blood boil. My hometown has one of the highest concentrations of college graduates and engineers in the country. The idea that we have to import talent from the blue states is insulting. The NYT just can't help but to disparage us shoeless rednecks...

[Extraneus]

I thought all Idahoans had wine cellars.

[Beasts of England]

@Extraneus: my local wine merchant is a Muslim. He has a very refined palette, too - I trust his selections.

[daddy]

Sandy,

I'm getting the Kate commercials via this NFL stream! And this may be heresy, but is it just me or is that white warrior outfit of Kate's accentuating a bit of premature plumpness in her jowls? Much like Muslim attire, I don't think the Warrior Queen outfit becomes her as much as wearing a whole lot less does.

[Eric in Boise]

Nope. That's a myth.

We all have potato sheds.

[henry]

Stafford returns to normal.

[Iggy]

--is it just me--

No. I thought that was a very unflattering commercial.

[Danube on iPad]

Which states are people leaving, and which states are they going to?

Next case.

[Iggy]

There are millions upon millions of wonderful nominal and secular muslims.
That not only doesn't change the nature of Islam itself it demonstrates its malignancy.

[daddy]

I missed the last 2 or 3 games where supposedly the CowBoys played marvelous, so to me they are simply playing like normal.

I'm down now at the fancy Hotel Bar and having the BarTenders look over my shoulder at the Cowpokes. They have no idea who Detroit is, so naturally they are pulling for the Cowboys. Big screen here is nothing but boring soccer highlights.

My trip got revised 3 times, so now I am on crummy Hotel standby duty for 2 days, and that means I can't leave the room phone for the next 2 days between the hours of noon and midnight, and I can't drink from 4 AM until midnight. Ughh:)

The instant the clock struck midnight I dashed downstairs to the Bar with my streaming laptop, and I'm doing my best to catch up suds-wise. Grrrr.

[Beasts of England]

Well, DoT, it's because the red states are moochers and use their low tax base - caused by not spending enough on education and social safety nets - to lure the blue state corporations and citizens away. Seriously. That's the idiot's argument.

[Captain Hate]

Back from a two week vacation, nothing says "hard work" like taking a road trip to deliver crap sammiches:

http://weaselzippers.us/209914-rested-from-vacation-obama-will-preview-state-of-the-union-on-three-city-swing/

[Eric in Boise]

I can't drink from 4 AM until midnight.

What are the current FAA regulations regarding "bottle to throttle" time, daddy? I believe it used to be 24 hours; is it still?

[James D.]

Lazybusy @ 5:48

Richard Florida is a mendacious, vapid, self-entitled clown whose words have less than no value. He ought to be skinned alive and fed to rabid dogs.

His view of the future, as expressed in one of his previous nasty, dishonest screws, is for our society to have a tiny elite of "creatives" (people like him) with a huge servant class who are only fit to run their errands and see to their dry cleaning (people like us). He can go f--k himself.

And this is reason #12,003 why I no longer read anything in the NYT.

[James D.]

"Screeds" was what i meant to write, not "screws". Darn iPad keyboard!

[jimmyk on iPhone]

DoT @2:57, Borowitz hasn't been funny since he was in college. Doubt he would have written that in 2008 when Ds won big.

[daddy]

I can't imagine why anyone would think he's doing this for Obama's approval--it's contrary to everything this dingbat outfit stands for.

I concur Clarice,

I was going thru my mind trying to figure out what reasons, if any, that Sisi might be saying this stuff if he didn't believe it, and it struck me that he sure didn't say it to please Obama, since as you say it's contrary to everything this dingbat...stands for.

I also don't believe he said it to appease the UN, since they're made up of the same radical MB supporting morons as Obama.

He's put his head on a chopping block by his statements, so I can't see who he can expect to get offsetting kudos' from for saying this, so I have to conclude that he's saying it because he believes it to be true, or in the best interests of his country, probably both.

[Iggy]

So how much did that flag they picked up cost Jerry Jones?

[Beasts of England]

Almost as much as the check to the Lion's punter. :)

[jimmyk on iPhone]

"I thought all Idahoans had wine cellars."

Those are bomb shelters.

[Extraneus]

That was clearly interference.

[Another bob]

They make fun of Hochuli, but picking up that flag - after the referee accounced the penalty - and with no explanation - looks really fishy.

[daddy]

Eric,

For us it is 8 hours bottle to throttle. That doesn't mean you can do 10 shots of tequila up to exactly 8 hours because you'd still be snockered 8 hours later and definitely in violation. We still have to show up and be prepared to blow a zero on the random breathalyzer test at any time, and/or to deliver a clean urine sample, so the 8 hours means you can have a reasonable amount of alcohol up to 8 hours prior, and you'll be clean and sober and good to go at showtime.

I think 8 hours is the minimum per the FAA and different airlines can increase that number. When I was at Northwest it was 12 hours.

There's slop time built in to our 8 hour rule, but also common sense is called for. We usually do 8 hours prior to pickup, which adds a couple more hours into the equation. In general if you're going to do a bender, you ensure you've got 24 to 36 hours off, and you stick simply with beer or wine, not hard stuff.

I usually do between 1 or 2 random drug tests per year, and over the last 20 years I can only recall 2 guys out of our 4,500 that I know of who failed the random test and both got canned.

[Beester near Detroit]

It is fishy but hey it's against Detroit. After all Suh is a 'thug' though he's more educated and better spoken than most of the players on the field. Sheesh, he can't even walk to the sidelines without some QB trying to trip him :). The NFL wants 'america's team' to win and the refs got a gentle reminder.

And Kate dies look a bit zaftig in the gamer ads. Though teen boys won't complain.

PS: Go Buckeyes!

[PDinDetroit]

I said at the start of the Cowboys - Lions Game that the Officiating Crew was suspect and thought they would cost the Lions the game (not a normal crew - a hodgepodge). Picking up the flag just confirms my suspicion. Even if the Lions pull off a win, I will refuse to watch NFL Games for at least the rest of the season.

I have never written to the NFL to complain, but now I will.

[PDinDetroit]

Chris Christie rooting for the Cowboys just makes it complete why I would not vote for him.

[Eric in Boise]

Thanks for the info, daddy.

[NKonIPad]

So my southernfried chicken, mash and cornbread dinner doesn t seem to have poisoned the family. The overnight brining kept the chicken moist, but adding salt to the dredge made it all too salty. That plus the oil being too hot too start were the only flaws. The mash and cornbread were delish. I ll do better next time I make it.

[jimmyk on iPad]

PDinDet, I think they got the refs from the 1972 Olympics basketball final.

Still, Detroit didn't help matters with the fumble and the shank. A bad 4th quarter all around.

[Beester eff the refs and jerry jones]

So sorry Kate-does (not dies) I'm more annoyed at the refs and the league than I realized.

[NKonIPad]

Suh is an adjudged dirty player, IQ has nothing to do with it.

[Beester eff the refs and jerry jones]

No reversed penalty, no shanked punt. I'm ordering a Packers stocking hat.

In any case, back to happier thoughts. Happy new year to all you JOMers. Thanks for the wit, intellect, insightful commentary, personal stories (except Maria Callas) that you've shared. Lurk button back on.