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March 31, 2015

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Marlene

An example of the Left and non-believers having the loudest megaphone is in the comment section of the Bangor Daily in response to a five part series they are reporting on this week. Maine had a strong Catholic tradition,due to the the tight knit Franco-American communities and also the Irish in larger cities,like Portland. The articles are trying to describe the cultural and demographic trends that have reduced the RCC's participation in Maine. I made the mistake of reading the comments,ugh. The few who defended their faith were overwhelmed by the negative,sneering comments. Christianity is being pushed out of the public domain,as NK mentioned. The Left,the activists,the screaming idiots are trying to discourage us. At this point,all I can do is live my life loving my family and neighbors.

Centralcal on iPad

Well, threadkiller is really a threadvirus. Hopefully, DOT gets a cure for it.

narciso

So Andy Pandy Cuomo, issues a diktat against travel to the 'Forbidden Zone' ie: Indiana, on the way to the 'worker's paradise' Cubam

Threadkiller

William Safire would like to know, Danube.

ESSAY; The Constitution's FlawBy William SafirePublished: September 6, 1987

FACEBOOKTWITTERGOOGLE+EMAILSHAREPRINTREPRINTS

WASHINGTON— I want to be a delegate to the next Constitutional Convention (Con Con II). Here's my platform: amend the Constitution to make it possible for naturalized citizens to become President or Vice President of the United States.

The present, blatantly discriminatory eligibility clause is a blot on the national escutcheon and an anachronistic offense to conscience. ''No Person except a natural born Citizen,'' reads Article II, Sec. 2, ''or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President.''

Who slipped in that nativist bigotry at the convention whose 200th anniversary we mark this month? The original intent of the Framers is, as usual, hard to pinpoint, but a letter from John Jay to George Washington shows a genesis in an obsessive concern for national security:

''Permit me to hint,'' wrote Jay, an aristocrat who later served as the first Chief Justice, ''whether it would be wise and seasonable to provide a strong check to the admission of foreigners into the administration of our national government and to declare expressly that the commander in chief of the American army shall not be given to, nor devolve on, any but a natural born citizen.''

In other words, don't trust any of them sneaky furriners to command our army. Of course, when Jay's idea was written into the Constitution, the Framers took care to exempt themselves: whether born in America or elsewhere, all were born subjects of what became ''foreign'' governments, and not until Martin Van Buren in 1836 did we have a ''natural born'' President.

As a result of Jay's xenophobia, eight million full-fledged United States citizens are today denied the opportunity to seek the highest office in the land. The three percent of our population who are Americans by choice may aspire to serve as Speaker of the House or Senator or Chief Justice, or to hold ultra-sensitive posts like Chairman of the Joint Chiefs or National Security adviser -but when it comes to the brass ring of politics, the greatest flaw remaining in our Constitution relegates these naturalized citizens to second-class status.

The ''natural born'' phrase unfairly burdens children of Americans born abroad (as it did Gov. George Rom-ney in 1968) because it casts a shadow across any candidacy: if elected, the President-elect would surely face a challenge on the born-abroad impediment in the Supreme Court.

That means Minnesota Senator Rudy Boschwitz is blocked from advancement because he was born in Berlin, and Connecticut's Senator Lowell Weicker because he was born (of American parents) in Paris. New Hampshire Governor John Sununu, whose U.S. parents were in Havana when he was born, and Vermont's Governor Madeleine Kunin, born in Zurich and naturalized 40 years ago, can forget about higher office.

Other citizens distinguished in their fields silently bridle at their political limitation. The economist and former Ambassador John Kenneth Galbraith is out as a potential President because he's from Canada; Henry Kissinger, under whom two U.S.

Presidents served, is from Germany, and Felix Rohatyn, financial savior of New York, is from Austria. My newly-retired colleague, James Reston, could never entertain secret dreams of power because he was born in Scotland, and my new Op-Ed Page colleague, A. M. Rosenthal, cannot occupy Lincoln's bedroom because he came from Canada. (My other columnist sidekicks and I are constitutionally clean but do not expect lightning to strike.) Why do we allow Jay's outmoded suspicion to dry up our talent pool and insult our most valuable imports? A reasonable residency requirement is understandable, as is the same 35-year age requirement that applies to Senators, and we were wise to limit service in the Presidency to two terms. But the dead hand of the present should not lay on the future: let tomorrow's people decide who they want to be their President. Place of birth should no longer be a barrier.

A few years ago, Senator Eagleton dropped a bill in the hopper to amend the Constitution: ''A person who is a naturalized citizen of the United States and who is otherwise eligible to hold the office of President or Vice President shall be eligible to hold such offices after being a United States citizen for eleven years.''

The proposed resolution died in committee, demonstrating that the Congress is loath to rise above nativism on this issue. The other route provided by the Framers to change the Constitution is through the states and a new convention. On to Con Con II!

http://www.nytimes.com/1987/09/06/opinion/essay-the-constitution-s-flaw.html

I forget, was Safire a loon in 1987 or was it Vince Foster, much later, that did him in?

Possibly it was because he was a college dropout like Walker?

Maybe you can use a seance to alert him to your non-existent code.

DebinNC

"At this point,all I can do is live my life loving my family and neighbors."

Ditto, Marlene. And that's no small thing. I take comfort in the phenomenal growth of home-schooling nationwide and the absence of efforts to curtail it in recent years, which I ascribe to politicos knowing the hell what would immediately descend it they tried.

Threadkiller

Viruses don't get cured by lying, ccal.

narciso

evil kip chimes in, also the guy from the Scream:

http://hotair.com/headlines/archives/2015/04/01/irs-chief-to-gop-you-cant-abolish-us/

NKvirusedandback

AndyC* has really hit pitiful escape velocity. I hope Preet indicts him and ends Andy's miserable political career.

* Of course AndyC began his political career in 1977 posting signs in Queens saying "Vote for Cuomo not the homo."

narciso

I know that's your nic for the nazgul Sullivan, but since he's going back to the crypt, but what can one expect from someone who helped bring the subprime crisis while at HUD

clarice

MORE BIRTHER BS!!! Good grief.

henry

Climate Change, at least the part attributed to human activity, may be near zero. It's that science thingy showing aerosols do not reflect much heat, ergo carbon concentration creates much less heat than previously assumed. SCIENCE says no AGW, the UN & progs bitterly cling to debunked models.

Threadkiller

It was almost the thread topic, Clarice.

narciso

how can one 'fix' what isn't broken, only someone drunk on cinnamon schnapps, like that Epps character, could see something wrong in the law,

conversely it seems impossible to overhaul a wretched travisham, like Zaphodcare, because some people received their quota of chocolate rations,

narciso

I would use O'Zone, but only one other person, here, read that little known Paul theroux foray into Science fiction,

pagar

Some great comments last night by a lot of different posters.

Help steal from the government and get a free pair of tennis shoes.

http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2015/04/23_arrested_in_massive_medicaremedicaid_fraud_scheme_comments.html

Kill your unborn child and get a tax deduction!

http://weaselzippers.us/219148-irs-says-abortions-are-eligible-for-a-tax-deduction/

James D.

narciso @ 10:03

The proper response to Koskinen's comment (I would pay money for Cruz or another R to actually say it) is:

"Yes, that's true. We will need an organization to collect and administer taxes, no matter how much we simplify the tax code.

Just like everyone needs a home to live in. But when that home becomes infested with toxic mold, and termites eat away at the foundation, the only thing you can do is tear down the whole building, and rebuild from the ground up, without the termites or the mold.

You, Mr. Koskinen, are the toxic mold. People like Lois Lerner and her friends are the termites. And I think that the American people are more than ready to bring in the bulldozers and get rid of you."

Danube on iPad

It would have helped both Safire and you to have studied the constitution. Neither of you did, and it shows. The difference is, Safire wrote one ill-informed column on the subject and moved on. You have allowed it to consume you, and you inflict your obsession with it on your colleagues at this site despite numerous entreaties to stop.

What did Safire think of Calvin's case?

God knows I'm trying, Ccal. I guess this weasel can troll me at least once by calling me a liar, but I hope that's it. As I have said before, there is something very wrong with this guy.

Jeff Dobbs

Scott Walker @ScottWalker · 18m 18 minutes ago
Big announcement coming up at 10:00AM CT. Signup to hear the news first: http://hubs.ly/y0G20x0 - SKW #Forward

Extraneus

narcisolator2

Jeff Dobbs

That's not funny. Typepad just sent my comment to the naughty bin. It will appear above this one once I release it.

narciso

the earlier Babalu link, with the 'Planet of the Apes' theme, inspired that reference'

'es un manicomio, it's a madhouse'

Danube on iPad

Two of John Jay's childen were born abroad. Did he think they were not natural born citizens? Certainly the First Congress, in which many of the Framers sat, did not. (See Clement et al.)

Threadkiller

Calvin's Case can be found in Section 14 US code 1401?

That makes sense.

narciso

the LUN seems to be the theme of the day,

Searchlight Harry, accuses a candidate of a felony, and no harm no foul, they even had a spokesdrone, defending it, this Fowler character,

NKvirusedandback

henry @10:10-- so Max Planck Institute says IPCC was BSing about aerosole cooling assumptions in order to create warming sensitivity that doesn't exist? Good. But we knew IPCC has done that for 25 years, didn't we.

Threadkiller

Clement failed to recognize that Jay's children were born before the Constitution was ratified.

Please inform him, via email, of your knowledge of the so called "grandfather clause" and how it applied to Jay's children.

I would, but it is clear that I haven't studied enough.

narciso

the Vulpine one, Stephen King chimes in, on 'the Forbidden Zone'

Extraneus

Anyone check out Amazon.com today?

Marlene

henry @ 10:10,well darn. Maine's Sen.King and Alaska's Sen.Murkowski plan to start an Arctic caucus,because the ice is melting and Maine is 1,500 miles from the Arctic Circle and at the end of the Northwest Passage and blah.blah. Maine will have an economic advantage when the ice melts. The shipping,energy and research possibilities are endless. I guess *climate change* is why we're expecting an Easter week-end snowstorm. We'll be at the cabin burning lots of wood in our non EPA woodstove. :)

Threadkiller

All this arm waiving later and I still haven't seen your quote of US Code that specifies "natural born citizen."

A summary of your defense strategy:

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KAp9sFVdERQ

narciso

what could go wrong:

http://news.yahoo.com/nasa-plans-bring-boulder-moon-orbit-231007328.html

there was SMOD boomlet at the Horde,

jimmyk

Via Iowahawk:

http://www.islamicweddingphotography.com/site/#/about-us/about-us/


I eagerly await the screaming.

DebinNC

"Anyone check out Amazon.com today?"

I did. Some of my favorites for the 12 and under set are marked way down today ... Perplexus, Kanoodle, Travel Hangman, Hedbanz game and more ... I often give the Sneaky Snacky Squirrel game + a copy of Miss Suzy by Miriam Young to young birthdayers.

narciso

so more ships trapped in the ice again, reminds me of Dan Simmons's latest riff on Sherlock Holmes, he tells Henry James, that he is a figment, ut turns out not to be true, but that's not the interesting part,

Extraneus

Did you see the April Fool's webpage?

jimmyk

I don't know what the correct preparation would have been, but that's why he is an elected official with political advisers

I don't think it's so much "preparation" as it is a willingness to speak bluntly and counterattack, i.e. have the courage of one's convictions. In a war, it's a bit hard to anticipate and prepare for every contingency, but you have to know why you are fighting, and have the goal of winning with unconditional surrender. In other words, I agree with extraneus: "Impugn the motives of the agitators. Explain that religious Christians need protection from these bullies. Call out Apple and the rest for hypocrisy re: Muslims."

DebinNC

Yep: http://www.amazon.com/

I didn't linger though. Is anything amiss, other than the "retro" front page, which I just blew past?

Danube on iPad

Natural born citizenship as declared by the First Congress was not predicated on any grandfather clause, and the enactment
contained none.

narciso

remember this weasel, was one of the first to torpedo our iraq policy, never mind the fact, he
was a total failure at Centcom as AQ was rising,

http://www.cnn.com/videos/tv/2015/03/31/lead-intv-zinni-iran-deal.cnn

Dave (in MA)

DebinNC, if you go into the site, they have a new offering called Amazon Dash, an internet-of-things offering that has all the characteristics of a joke except for the fact that it's real.

Extraneus

Nah, I just thought the retro page was funny.

Danube on iPad

Study this:

https://fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/R42097.pdf

narciso

apparently Yeargh Dean, doesn't like the deal, either, probably from Morning Joke,

narciso

I find in saffire's list, maybe two candidates, that might be worthy, John Sununu and the late Abe Rosenthal, no not Kissinger, he fracked up things pretty badly for a generation,

Danube on iPad

"I still haven't seen your quote of US Code that specifies 'natural born citizen.'"

You've seen abundant authority, over and over again, that the term "citizen at birth" is synonymous with it. You have never refuted any of those authorities. In fact, because they are so inconvenient (read: fatal) to your argument, you ignore them altogether.

Extraneus

Sens. Schumer and Durbin at odds over Democratic leadership position

“So much for a neat, orderly succession. Sen. Charles E. Schumer (D-N.Y.) and Richard J. Durbin (D-Ill.) were at odds Tuesday over the future of the Democratic whip position, just days after Minority Leader Harry M. Reid (D-Nev.) triggered a leadership shuffle with his retirement announcement. Durbin's office said Schumer vowed to support Durbin staying on as whip, the No. 2 position in leadership. Schumer's office said he made no such assurance…According to Durbin's office, Durbin and Schumer came to an agreement during that chat in anticipation of Reid's announcement. ‘The two senators agreed to support each other, Schumer for leader, Durbin for whip,’ said Durbin spokesman Ben Marter. ‘They shook hands. That was the interaction.’ But Schumer spokesman Matt House denied that his boss agreed to back Durbin for whip. ‘That never happened, and they know it,’ House said.”
Marlene

narciso @10:38...in mid-March two ferries were stuck in ice up to 25 ft. thick between Cape Breton and Newfoundland.
Today is the usual start of open water fishing here,but the diehard ice fishermen are still out on Sebago Lake (Maine's largest).

Danube on iPad

I'm gonna declare victory--neither McCain nor Obama (nor anyone else) has been declared ineligible, neither Cruz nor Jindal will be--and stop righthere.

With apologies for having contributed to the clutter.

narciso

I figured as much, there is no perspective on these things, as for Yeargh's factotum, Trippi, he must be flacking the Mullahs somehow,

Threadkiller

Jay's children were born before the First Congress convened. They fell under the grandfather clause:

No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that office who shall not have attained to the age of thirty five years, and been fourteen Years a resident within the United States.

Does your study guide tell you that the First Congress's Naturalization Act was prior to the adoption of the Constitution?

You might need a better source.


Threadkiller

Abundant sources but nothing within US Code itself.

Hence, a lie.

Dublindave

AND...it begins. Apparently there have been Business's all over Indiana ringing into to local radio stations and going on local tv saying that this new law gives them cover to refuse,as one local business owner stated "fags".

From AP:"A family that owns an Indiana pizzeria reportedly said Tuesday that the state's new "religious freedom" law protects their right to deny some service to gay couples.

Crystal O'Connor, whose family owns Memories Pizza in Walkerton, Ind., told local TV station WBND that their Christian beliefs would prevent them from catering a same-sex couple's wedding.

“If a gay couple came in and wanted us to provide them pizzas for a wedding, we would have to say no,” O'Connor told the news station.

Both O'Connor and her father, Kevin, told WBND that they supported the Religious Freedom Restoration Act signed into law Thursday by Gov. Mike Pence (R). After widespread backlash from the business community, Pence called for legislation to clarify that the law does not allow businesses to deny service to anyone.

O'Connor told WBND that she doesn't believe the law allows for discrimination or specifically targets gays.

But her father suggested that the family shouldn't be punished for refusing to cater same-sex weddings if they were asked to do so.

"That's a lifestyle that you choose," Kevin O'Connor told WBND. "I choose to be heterosexual. They choose to be homosexual. Why should I be beat over the head because they choose that lifestyle?"

The family later clarified for the news station that they would not deny service to a same-sex or non-Christian couple who came to eat at the restaurant"

Threadkiller

Abundant authorities...

Old Lurker

Getting harder and harder to find the Pony isn't it?

Dublindave

I don't know if i'm more disgusted by the idea of discrimination or Pizza being eaten at a wedding.

The catering kind of betrays the mindset,doesn't it? If you order Pizza for your wedding then you're probably going to be redneck homophobe.

Pizza at a wedding.......and the owner said it like it happens all the time....pizza at a wedding.......and red solo cups ya'll.........chex cola.........and maybe cause it's a special occasion gator will order wings.......would Bobby-jo,the bride get first dibs on the pizza???????

NKvirusedandback

God bless the O'Connors. The statute will free them from the torment of some Lefty bureaucrat shoving something down their throats that offends their religious convictions. The Law wouldn't be needed if the State didn't use its power to tyrannize the religious. But it does so here we are. Homo party planners can send their business somewhere else. As it should be.

narciso

those words you are using:

http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/charm-minister-zarif_905832.html

the Bush administration saw through Zarif, but the trapper keeper duo, Flynt and Leaveritt, didn't and had to pout all over the place,

Jeff Dobbs

Anyone watching out for what Walker's big announcement at 10 central is/was?

henry

Nothing on the local twitter feeds yet Hit.

Neo


LOL

narciso

I see him like Krasin, the very urbane Soviet counterpart to the likes of Sidney Reilly, in the early days of the Revolution, as opposed to the oafish boors like Molotov that Stalin would employ,

Beasts of England

Now that hit had identified his posts before the verbiage, do we skip over his differently than we skip over TM's, or is it the same process?

Jeff Dobbs

Oh, I see Walker updated twitter.

Scott Walker @ScottWalker · 12m 12 minutes ago
America needs big, bold leadership & that's why I'm supporting Coach Ryan & the @BadgerMBB Saturday.- SKW #AprilFools

Emphasis mine.

henry

Although the Rolling KidneyStones will be at Summerfest, that broke earlier this morning.

narciso

just like two generations later:

http://www.iran.org/tib/krt/strobe.htm

narciso

and more relevant to events in the Donbass today:

http://www.wnd.com/2000/10/4276/

Beasts of England

And I see that King Putt is going to sign an EO on 'global warming'. Is this the same fuktard who, along with the First Wookie, took seperate flights from DC to LA on the same fucking day a few weeks ago? I'm starting not to like that guy...

On a happier note, it's going to be 77 degrees today and my happy ass is about to hop on the Subterfuge and spew some of that trace gas into our fragile ecosystem. Hope nobody burns up due to my selfishness. Maybe I'll purchase some indulgences when I get back. :)

Marlene

Sorry,Moosehead is Maine's largest lake,not Sebago.

DebinNC

http://whitehouse.tumblr.com/post/86008389518/the-shake-shack-slide-before-sitting-down-for-a

Official White House photo from BOzo's visit to Shake Shack last May to talk about "transportation funding". Repeat: not April Fool joke and still on the official BOzo WH site.

maryrose

Now Asa Hutchison is getting heat over Arkansas bill

Threadkiller

Getting harder and harder to find the Pony isn't it?

Maybe hit can start a new thread.

:-)

narciso

just mean 'you're over the target' maryrose, they don't have to worry about these things in China, where the churches are conveniently underground,

Beasts of England

C'mon, DublinDave - everybody know that the bride always has sooks on the pizza at the reception. And on her special day, she doesn't even have to write her name on her red Solo™ cup with a Sharpie™. That's how you know it's a high class affair...

Thomas Collins

I guess I'm in the minority here on the guest thread start notification issue. I'd be happy to have to guess whether it was TM or H&R who started the thread. And it would be fine with me if either one, in the posts, denounced the ideas put forth in the thread starter. Then I could wonder whether H&R or TM were practicing self-denouncement!

Besides, a JOM thread starter is a metaphysical form. Whether it's TM or H&R who actually does the typing, it's a higher intelligence responsible for the thread starter.

Beasts of England

Sooks is the proper Southern term for 'dibs', by the way.

Did I mention that it's gonna be 77 degrees today? 😎

narciso

the Rodham crew, along with Manbearpig, was all over that last link, re Russia,

DebinNC

Reuters: ""Negotiators have a tentative agreement on the rough outline of a possible public statement on the progress they have made so far that would also highlight areas of disagreement, diplomats close to the talks said."

Not a joke but laugh-worthy.

Jim Miller

hit - You can get to NYT articles by searching with Bing. When you get to the articles that way, it doesn't seem to count against your monthly quota, which I think is 10 articles. (And you often can choose to link to the articles in other newspapers.)

For instance, you can probably get to that Krguman column by going to Guy Benson's reply, selecting some text from Krugman, and then pasting it in the usual search box.

You can do the same thing with Google, of course, but I prefer Bing because (1) it isn't as close to a monopoly and (2) its news searches are better designed than Google's.

Danube on iPad

"Does your study guide tell you that the First Congress's Naturalization Act was prior to the adoption of the Constitution?"

No, it tells me that (1) the First Congress, and the Framers, had no objection at all to the children of Americans born abroad being natural born citizens, and (2) both understood that the congress had the power under the naturalization clause to specify who would be included (among many other things).

There was no grandfather clause when Jay wrote his letter to Washington.

When you haven't studied law you don't know how to read it. That's causing you no end of grief. But at this point, if you can't refute the many cited authorities for the propsition that "natural born citizen" and "citizen at birth" are synonymous, and you can't find a single authority that says otherwise, your side is going to lose every single case it brings on this issue. And why not? You have a perfect record so far.

narciso

Sounds like Sir Humphrey Appleby put out that statement, also probably not fake,


http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/deal-or-no-deal-the-iran-talks-have-borne-fruit/2015/03/31/6c89b71e-d7e4-11e4-8103-fa84725dbf9d_story.html?wprss=rss_opinions


Jane


Meet the Men Behind Hillary Clinton's Private 'Spy Network'


http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/whos-behind-hillary-clintons-secret-spy-ring_901675.html?utm_campaign=Washington+Examiner&utm_source=washingtonexaminer.com&utm_medium=referral

Jane

I think Don Surber nails the religious freedom issue:


http://donsurber.blogspot.com/2015/04/forget-gays-it-is-religious-freedom.html

narciso

Tyler Drumheller was the one who insisted Iraq had no nuclear program, supposedly because of his network, forget the 500 tons of yellowcake at Tammuz 16, Goss pushed him out, and he went into business, with another loud skeptic, William Murray and Col, Hunt among other,s

narciso

so who wanted the notion that the attacks in Libya were being provoked by a video, and by Qaddafi loyalists,

Threadkiller

What the First Congress givith a subsequent Congress taketh away or do you deny that the language of the First Naturalization Act was rendered useless after 1795?

When you have studied law do you get to pretend that there is a specification enshrined in US Code when no such language exists?

No wonder the Country is so F'd up.

Was the US Department of State's Foriegn Affairs Manual written by people who studied the law? Or is it the work of low level button pushers?

Jeff Dobbs

new thread

maryrose

Arkansas bill to be amended before Asa will sign
it
Trivia Hutchison was one of the Impeachment lawyers in the House during Clintons fall from grace

Rick Ballard

Speaker Boehner and Majority Leader McConnell (via Senator Cotton) have provided an excellent example of the use of political power in restraining King Merde. I doubt they will receive much aclaim for the achievement (after all, they didn't scream and holler or make any loud but wholly ineffective noise) but the sanctions against Iran remain in effect and the means by which they spread Mahometan poison are thereby limited.

Threadkiller

CNN guy pronounced Asa as Ace. I thought it was A-saw.

DebinNC

Good reminder, Rick. Even the WaPo editorial board agrees and asks why Iran would keep future promises with sanctions weakened when they've ignored the current "biting" ones. Sanctions will likely be even more "biting" when Congress returns in 2 wks to vote on two pending bills.

Threadkiller

There was no grandfather clause when Jay wrote his letter to Washington

And Jay's foreign born children were had already been born.

Speaking of that letter, did you ever diagram the sentence?

Threadkiller

-were

Extraneus

Arkansas governor calls for changes to religious objection bill criticized as anti-gay

Hutchinson said he wants the Legislature to either recall the bill or pass a follow-up measure to make the proposal more closely mirror a 1993 federal religious freedom law.

I don't get it. A perfect opportunity is being squandered. Worse, they're encouraging the bullies.

Wimps.

henry

Tell Jane we're busy wrapping her package for this weekend..

sometimes I pass along messages where I have no idea what it is in reference to. given this came from IL, I think some lurker type may have access to a weather machine and is planning snow in Sturbridge.

Janet

Jane's Surber link at 11:40 is great.

The comments to this entry are closed.

Wilson/Plame