Politicizing The CIA

The NY Times headlines a topical pro-Hillary revelation in a new book by a former CIA official and buries a pro-Bush tidbit.

First, getting us ready for Hillary:

Ex-C.I.A. Official Rebuts Republican Claims on Benghazi Attack in ‘The Great War of Our Time’

By David Sanger

WASHINGTON — The former deputy director of the C.I.A. asserts in a forthcoming book that Republicans, in their eagerness to politicize the killing of the American ambassador to Libya, repeatedly distorted the agency’s analysis of events. But he also argues that the C.I.A. should get out of the business of providing “talking points” for administration officials in national security events that quickly become partisan, as happened after the Benghazi attack in 2012.

The official, Michael J. Morell, dismisses the allegation that the United States military and C.I.A. officers “were ordered to stand down and not come to the rescue of their comrades,” and he says there is “no evidence” to support the charge that “there was a conspiracy between C.I.A. and the White House to spin the Benghazi story in a way that would protect the political interests of the president and Secretary Clinton,” referring to the secretary of state at the time, Hillary Rodham Clinton.

But he also concludes that the White House itself embellished some of the talking points provided by the Central Intelligence Agency and had blocked him from sending an internal study of agency conclusions to Congress.

Yeah, whatever - IMHO the Republicans should move past Benghazi and focus on the broader question of Hillary's role in the bizarre "plan" to topple Qadaffi with no credible plan to replace him.

And speaking of what might be thought of as a lesson of Iraq (Wasn't winning the war with no plan to win the peace Bush's mistake?) the Times has this Iraq flashback:

Mr. Morell is gentle about most of the politicians he dealt with — he expresses admiration for both Mr. Bush and Mr. Obama, though he accuses former Vice President Dick Cheney of deliberately implying a connection between Al Qaeda and Iraq that the C.I.A. had concluded probably did not exist. But when it comes to the events leading up to the Bush administration’s decision to go to war in Iraq, he is critical of his own agency.

Mr. Morell concludes that the Bush White House did not have to twist intelligence on Saddam Hussein’s alleged effort to rekindle the country’s work on weapons of mass destruction.

“The view that hard-liners in the Bush administration forced the intelligence community into its position on W.M.D. is just flat wrong,” he writes. “No one pushed. The analysts were already there and they had been there for years, long before Bush came to office.”

 

Comments

[Ben]

I agree his lack of follow through is not that negative Ig. Walker has fine qualities which do not disqualify completely. Is he ready for National political politics and the requisite compromises he must make? I doubt it.

[Jim Eagle]

Porch,

"Swamp" comes from the job of "Swamping out the bar after it closes"; IOW's mopping up. A lot of those FB shrimp are caught right off my place on the beach. We get up to 12 boats at a time out there like gems on a necklace.

Obama and Hillary's banker, Llyod Balnkfein is being sued by a guy working on his Bridgehampton estate for falling off a scaffold. Welcome to the old Hampton construction accident scam, Lloyd. Of course, he has better lawyers but I see an immediate payoff.

http://www.27east.com/news/article.cfm/General-Interest-Southampton/105475/Goldman-Sachs-CEO-Sued-By-Contractor-After-Working-At-Bridgehampton-Estate

[narciso]

Condolescences, janet. Great news jimmy.

[Threadkiller]

http://www.dcclothesline.com/2015/04/09/former-doj-official-to-appear-before-supreme-court-and-provide-proof-obama-admin-is-registering-illegal-aliens-to-vote/

[Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki]

Charlie Hebdo frog dude; there's "no comparison" between us and that Texas cartoon event.
He's right of course.
In civilized France the cartoonists get massacred.
In wild west Texas the terrorists do.

[Ben]

Texas Toast is not an apertif'. Close that border or miss dessert.

[Ben]

Jesus Christos iggy. Shall we defame every muslim with gasoline flames to incite the negative meme on all muslims?

Have you heard of the Golden Rule?

[lyle]

NRO quoting CNN on the security officer ventilating the two jihadis it TX:

He had a .45-caliber Glock pistol, a much less powerful weapon than the rifles used by the attackers, who have since been identified by federal law enforcement officials as Elton Simpson and Nadir Soofi.

It's more than safe to assume the writer is not familiar with the famed Glock Model 21 much less familiar with it's power at close range.

[Gentlejim]

Janet - Condolences
Jimmyk - Great news. Hope she enjoys her trip and is safe.
Sandy - Thanks for the blue light.

Next week is Police Week. Officers who died/killed in the line of duty are recognized after being added to the wall. The candlelight vigil is very moving. This year it is May 13th at 800 pm. You can register to watch online at Nleomf.org.

[Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki]

Barry has refused the most basic recommendations of the EMP commission which could substantially protect our electrical grid for $2billion.
Here's an idea; instead of rewarding the Iranians for building a bomb by releasing their assets, howz bout seizing some of those assets to protect us from the bomb they're building?

[henry]

Lyle, he brought enough gun. Then he put lead on target.

[Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki]

--Have you heard of the Golden Rule?--

Yes.
That's why I haven't responded to you.

[lyle]

Thornburg at AmSpec:

After watching Jeb Bush’s moving message to all his Mexican and Mexican-American amigos y amigas, both north and south of the “border,” I’m moved to declare, which will surely surprise most of my conservative pals, that I intend to vote for Jeb for president — of the Downtown Mexico City Rotary Club.

I think we can all get behind this!

[narciso]

they still try to appease the croc, when their arms is trapped in the jaws, what provoked the murder of Aurelie Chatelain, or have they already forgotten?

OT, the fools that downgraded Age of Ultron, well they removed all doubt,

[Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki]

A Robert Rourke reference, henry?
Very nice.

[Some Guy]

"Jesus Christos"

You stupid hypocrite and coward.

What a brave keyboard warrior you are typing and posting something LITERALLY blasphemous, safe in knowing that no Christian is going to hunt you down and kill you.

Yet you have the complete and total lack of self-awareness to turnaround and actually attempt to lecture someone else on inciting the ire of the religious.

I can't believe anyone would voluntarily make such an ass out of themselves in public.

[lyle]

He did, indeed, henry. Big, fat hollow point lead, I'd guess. LE types I know lurve that pistol. I've owned one for years. I prefer Beretta.

[narciso]

just looking out for the Folks:

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/should-we-get-rid-of-all-jews-megyn-kelly-challenges-oreilly-on-tx-shooting/

[narciso]

this is why friends don't let friends take McClatchy seriously,

http://popehat.com/2015/05/04/unusually-stupid-mcclatchy-column-gets-free-speech-wrong/

[Ben]

'That's why I have'nt responded to you.'

That's why you make no christian sense.

[clarice]

Good news, JimmyK. I know that's a load off everyone in the family's minds.

rse, sounds like a fun road trip. Again google "Hotels near GU" and you will find several at several different price points. No need to run all the way out to Rosslyn.

[lyle]

http://pjmedia.com/tatler/2015/05/05/exclusive-fbi-dhs-assessed-terror-attack-threat-to-texas-draw-muhammad-contest-as-unlikely/

Of course they did.

[narciso]

well in the words of edwin starr 'what are they good for, absolutely nothing, say it again'

[Ben]

OMG. Kelly is the worst sort of whorish black Irish. When O'Reilly can see the handwriting on Daniels Wall it makes the harridan Belshazzar's handmaiden.

[Jim Eagle]

narc,

Lets take the ferry to Havana and have a Ha-Ha Cocktail.

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/travel/fl-havana-ferry-approval-20150505-story.html?utm_content=buffer47dea&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer

[Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki]

The end of Boko Haram draws near?
No thanks to Hillary or Barry or even Moose's pathetic, embarrassing hashtag campaign.

We will see if the new muslim president, who formerly led a coup placing himself as head of state in the 80s and helped into office by Axelrod, is as diligent in killing them.

[daddy]

Just a quick epilogue regarding my daughter's health: She got the 'all clear' today

Great news, JimmyK. Blessings, and thanks for telling us. Whew.

[Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki]

--That's why you make no christian sense.--

Figured I was too subtle.
By not responding to you I am doing unto you as I would have you do unto me.

[Buckeye]

The Texas LEO who turned the jihadis into Swiss cheese is, 1) a good shot and 2) courageous.

Easier said then done considering they had body armor on (assume those reports are correct)and long guns that would put them at an advantage until close range.

However, the jihadi that was arrested in Columbus a few weeks back did some target practice with his like-minded buddies at a range that I frequent. Report by the range owner was that the were terrible shots.

Might have been the case with the 2 jihadis in Texas.

[Beasts of England]

¡Feliz Cinco de Mayo, y'all!

Think I'll go drink some tequila. Arriba!

[Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki]

--Report by the range owner was that the were terrible shots.--

Has an Arab ever won Olympic gold in a shooting event?
Not that I know of.

[Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki]

Almost everyone agrees the 2000s were a reckless period of unstable debt growth, right? And almost everyone knows what the solution to a debt bubble is; deleveraging right?
Wrong. Central bankers know better. More global debt accumulated in the last seven years since the meltdown than the seven years before it.
Rest easy; it's different this time.

[Extraneus]

nearly two-thirds of voters say they'd have reservations supporting someone as commander-in-chief with no college degree

I think it's true that this is a problem for Walker, but at a strategic moment he can mention that he'd never failed a bar exam.

Btw, I was surprised that Fiorina didn't bring this up during her recent appearance on MSNBC or wherever she was being mauled a few weeks ago for having been fired by HP. She must be holding her fire for a better moment.

Imagine Hillary rising through the ranks to take over a major corporation, or Bill Clinton or Obama. (Not that it wasn't Affirmative Action in Fiorina's case, btw, but Hillary being fired by the Watergate Committee for lacking integrity indicates that Affirmative Action couldn't have helped her in the real world as much as it did Fiorina.)

I do agree that Walker should finish his degree.

[narciso]

waxing philosophical for a bit, having forgotten the lesson of the last film, Stark is a Hobbesian, he thinks he can create a Leviathan, that won't swallow him up, a micro version of the Machine, but
one ends up with Samaritan,

[Ben]

Too funny. That's a twisted reverse-engineering of the rule to such a degree that it defies a rational response. But I salute the Faith which provides the putative City of Refuge for any who apply. Illegal aliens need not apply.

[maryrose]

Which repubs voted against the budget
Final vote was 51. 48

[Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki]

Not sure about your slip, but despite the "too funny", your sense of humor sure isn't showing.

[Jim Eagle]

ex,

I disagree. Did a college degree make Obama or Clinton a better leader? Did not having one make Truman a good leader? Inconsequential. And with college tuition loans such a burden for millenials they may sympathize with a guy who doesn't have any.

[narciso]

but of course:

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2015/05/cair-protected-texas-jihadist-elton-simpson-in-2010/

[Jim Eagle]

BTW, Joe Dunford is a Boston native and did not serve in Vietnam. I may be wrong but he may be the first JSC chair who didn't. Aa I say, I may be wrong. Someone correct me please or por favor today.

[daddy]

Bret Baire just asked the following question of us, his audience:

Bret: So what do you thing? Do you support the Trans-Pacific Trade Deal? Let me know at Facebook.com/BretBaireSR.

My answer. How the hell can we have an opinion without knowing the details of the Deal?

And Senator Mitch McConnell ought to be shot for allowing this thing to go forward without making a massive stink about the mandated secrecy from the White House. How come he's telling us what a great deal it is for America on the Senate floor? If it's such a damn great deal then why not tell us about the particulars of why it's a great deal so we can all join in knowing how wonderful it is for us all.

I am open to counter-arguments as to why these things ought to be conducted in secret, but not in this manner from this jack-hole.

[DebinNC]

What a relief that must be, jimmyk. The timing seems almost miraculous.

[Extraneus]

Did a college degree make Obama or Clinton a better leader?

Of course not. I'm taking about what most voters will think when the Dumb Republican arrow comes out of the quiver. Not like we do, that's for sure.

[Jeff Dobbs]

So sorry to hear of your loss Janet.

Glad to hear the news about your daughter jimmy.

We're staying in Georgetown beginning tomorrow. Then we storm the WH. Or something.

[narciso]

well he would have started college in '73, so that would make it unlikely for him to have served,

[DebinNC]

Has any president ignored or defied the law more than BOzo, the Constitutional Law prof?

[Skoot]

And so it begins.

Time: (BALTIMORE) — One of the Baltimore police officers who arrested Freddie Gray wants the police department and prosecutor to produce a knife that was the reason for the arrest, saying it was an illegal weapon.

...He argues in his motion that the knife found in Gray’s pocket — described in charging documents as “a spring assisted, one hand operated knife” — is illegal under stricter rules in Baltimore...

Yup.

[maryrose]

Unless Obummer gets more Dems his trade deal is toast
Will Fast Track enable the next Repub president to do trade deals quickly

[DebinNC]

And SA Mosby responds with classic cya

[narciso]

as usual joss is confused about the implications of her work:

http://therightscoop.com/lol-rabid-feminists-drive-joss-whedon-off-of-social-media-over-sexist-avengers-movie/

Scarlet's character's career, has made her incapable of real human connection,

[narciso]

well pronoun trouble,

on twitter, there are too many screamer, contrast to the tagline from Aliens,

[Thomas Collins]

Great news about your daughter, jimmyk. As Buckeye alluded to above, in a little over a decade she might even grudgingly acknowledge that your were correct about a few things (as my 31, 28 and 25 year olds occasionally do).

[Captain Hate]

Suffice it to say I was not surprised to read that Janet had been taking care of her father in law. She's an extraordinarily nice person even by JOM standards.

Excellent prognosis, jimmyk.

I'm very much enjoying Slick making an absolute fool out of himself. All that money and he still can't afford class.

[Jim Eagle]

DebinNC,

She is fighting an uphill fight. There will more not less LE revelations. They have her and wiil keep up on steeoids.

[Captain Hate]

Welp our local extended day care and indoctrination center extending their tin cup was the only thing on the ballot for this "special election". They've gotten so brazen that even Mrs H voted against it.

[narciso]

from some source I've come across, it was as well put together a charging document, as a Flathead op ed,

[Rick Ballard]

I won't be reading the butt cover Morell knitted for himself and the CIA "analysts" but I am a bit curious as to whether their deep and exhaustive findings included the possibility of Sisi preparing the Libyan tribes for Haftar led unification. Sisi can assure the tribes of Russian support as Russia puts Ukrainian wheat "earned" during repo operations to good use.

I wonder if Red Witch will include strengthening Egyptian/Russian ties in her list of accomplishments?

[Extraneus]

Killer who escaped Ohio lockup nabbed after 56 years on lam

Then and now pics (right-click to see what he looks like now at age 79):

Freshwaters was convicted of manslaughter for killing a pedestrian with a vehicle in July 1957, and his initially suspended sentence of one to 20 years in prison was imposed in 1959 after he violated his probation by driving and getting a driver's license, according to the marshals and old court documents they provided. He was imprisoned at the old Ohio State Reformatory before being moved to a lower-security camp near Sandusky, where he escaped in September 1959, the statement said.

His time on the lam was interrupted in 1975, when he was arrested on the Ohio warrant by the sheriff's office in Charleston, West Virginia. When the governor there refused to send him back to Ohio, he was freed and disappeared again, the marshals said.

[narciso]

'you had one job,'

http://pjmedia.com/tatler/2015/05/05/sheriff-baltimore-states-attorney-marilyn-mosby-botched-the-charges-of-2-of-the-officers-video/

[Miss Marple]

They are all begging for money, Captain Hate. Several municipalities here in Indiana have referendums over getting more money for the schools.

They are feeling the pinch from Mitch Daniels capping property taxes. You can't raise the taxes without a referendum. And guess who votes? Older voters who do not want to see their taxes go up.

Seems to me Mitch Daniels outfoxed the teachers, and left a stealth bomb which is detonating in the school budgets.

I am not unsympathetic to teachers, but when almost everyone else is struggling on lower pay, no pay, or unemployment,it is pretty hard for me to see why the teachers should get pay raises over and above their yearly increase for longevity.

[Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki]

3D liquid floors; very cool, although the last three leave something to be desired.

[daddy]

DrK and George Will tell me I am wrong about wanting to know the particulars of the TPP Trade Deal:

DrK: ...With Trade, we've always done it this way. It's the only way to get Free Trade. I think it's the right way to go.

George Will: ...Furthermore, the President is saying "Trust me, I'm a distinguished and subtle economic thinker," but this is the President who says that Airport Ticket kiosks and ATM's cause unemployment. So people say "I'm not sure we ned to listen to that." On the secrecy I think he has a point. A gray diplomat George Kennon(sp) I believe it was, said "The formula is this: the likelihood of a negotiation reaching a happy conclusion increases by the square of the number of parties involved. There are 12 nations involved in this, so it's hideously complicated. If nation 3 knows that Nation 8 has got something that it wants and that might aggravate nation 9 you can see why they want to keep this somewhat not transparent.

I remain unconvinced. Apparently, as DrK quipped at the close of the discussion, we have to pass it to know what's in it.

[Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki]

Here's one to right click;

[Ben]

"Your sense of humor" No humor intended except the tragicomedic gallows humor and as usual your dead-end is reached in record time. Thanks for the bevy of non-response responces.

[Extraneus]

Washington Post "Social Change Reporter" On Garland Shooting: "If the event was intended as bait, it worked."

If someone decides to open fire in a Planned Parenthood rally, can we also agree that the organizers intended themselves to be "bait"?

If someone starts shooting up the Sisters of Perpetual Indulgence, the gay cross-dressing attack on Christians, will the Washington Post likewise write that those shot down had held themselves out to be "bait"?

[Ben]

Remember daddy. If you oppose TPP you're a Putinista.

[Jim Eagle]

Iggy,

How'd you get a photo of our pool? I don't rememer ever posting it on FB or here.

[Miss Marple]

I have switched to Fox Business for a while. The machinations of the stock market are less upsetting than the constant drumbeat of Baltimore and Obama's comments.

Discussion on "Making Money" tonight (Charles Payne was absent) is that some stocks like Amazon are over-valued. They also point out the the pressures on the middle class are making disposable income scarcer, plus gas is going up again, so retail stocks are probably not going to perform well.

I know very little about this stuff, which is why I watch. If you disagree with this assessment, please remember I am simply reporting.

[Captain Hate]

Miss Marple, they already got a boost in revenue when the crooks in Columbus, in collusion with that goof Kasich, rolled back the homestead exemption. I still had to pony up to those cockwipes when I was out of work so my capacity for sympathy to their plight is nil.

[maryrose]

Which Senator did not vote on the budget

[Miss Marple]

Captain Hate,

My sympathies. I sure wish Mitch Daniels was still our governor. It was very peaceful here under his governorship, and he didn't do things like Kasich did.

In fact, he asked why so many Indiana schools looked like expensive university campuses. (Speaking as someone who has funded a football field with a Jumbotron scoreboard, astro-turf, and a locker room BUILDING with cedar lockers, I agree completely.

[Captain Hate]

That's Kennan, Tarhole; a big fave of the Adlai Stevenson set.

http://www.nationalreview.com/article/213940/george-kennans-new-views-william-f-buckley-jr

[maryrose]

MM I also watch Fox Business
I am finished following Baltimore
CNBC in the morning has an excellent business program
You have to put up with liberal Andrew Ross Sorkin though

[Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki]

You're shocked when someone responds with a little gentle humor to your opening of a "conversation" with the offensively illiterate non-sequitur below?

Jesus Christos iggy. Shall we defame every muslim with gasoline flames to incite the negative meme on all muslims?

You are most welcome for my bevy. Any time.

[peter]

jimmyk, relieved for your good news. Janet, prayers for your family.

[Extraneus]

I hope those floors are lit from below when they go for milk and cookies at night.

[maryrose]

Can
I totally agree
Property taxes in Rocky River are horrendous

[Buckeye]

Seems to me that if the Texas event was "bait", we need one evry week. Might be prudent to arm the security guards.

[peter]

Don't worry folks, another bottle of Nyquil he'll pass out.

[maryrose]

Should be. Captain H

[narciso]

Kennan had one brilliant insight, the continuation of Czarist power politics, through Soviet means, but he seemed to recoil from the implications of that mindset, occasionally you would have a less bad czar like Gorbachev, but few good ones,

[maryrose]

Remember folks ISiS is not the biggest threat Climate warming is the most feared event

[maryrose]

Narciso
Only thing to remember about Putin
KGB. Operative

[Miss Marple]

maryrose,

I am sitting here without the AC on and it's 80 outside. Why?

1. To save money, as I am on a tight budget.
2. I am enjoying the warmth after so many months of being cold.

[Jeff Dobbs]

I haven't been following along all that closely - but from what I've read, I haven't heard anyone saying the MSM has been pushing the "fears of backlash against peaceful Muslims" in the wake of the Garland shootings.

I mean, you'd think, if ever there was a place ripe for some serious backlash . . . it'd be Texas.

Did that meme die at some point and I missed the funeral?

[daddy]

Team Legal,

At the end of this Baltimore fiasco, if the knife proves to be illegal, and the exemption to "seat belt the perp" proves to exonerate some if not all of the accused cops, can they file suit against Baltimore, or Baltimore City Officials, and sue the pants off them for wrongful prosecution?

On a different front, I am watching Lou Dobb's do a great commentary going after the President and his lying, knee-jerk cries of racism in Baltimore in his Letterman appearance:

Lou Dobbs: ...For the President of the United States to resort again to the politics of racial exploitation is utterly damnable, because it again victimizes the people pif Baltimore who have suffered far too long in the city's corrosive corruption. Racial exploitation and the racial politics of the Left have become nothing more than transparent rationalization of failure. And neither the leaders of the City of Baltimore nor our President can hide their responsibility for the decades-long devastation of what once was one of the coin try's greatest cities. And that Mister President, is the Truth, that you said you wanted.

Please Roger Ayles, give this guy a better timeslot.

Lou closes the segment with a couple quotes, the famous one from Maggie Thatcher about running out of other people's money, and then this one from Churchill:

"Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery."

[Miss Marple]

Well, Hit, I can't backlash any farther than I already have.

I wish they would all leave the country.

We don't know who are peaceful people and who aren't (and I have this sneaky suspicion the peaceful ones are simply cowardly). I realize this is not the approved attitude amongst the powers that be, but that is how I feel.

[Miss Marple]

daddy,

I was watching Lou Dobbs, too. Very refreshing truth-telling.

Excellent job of transcription!

[sbw]

Walker should finish his degree

Hell, no!

If those who think so have degrees and don’t realize that a degree doesn’t guarantee an education, then they didn’t get an education before they got their degrees.

Sort that one out.

[Jeff Dobbs]

I remember when the left was so very fond of Niemoller.

First they came for the Muhammed cartoonists........

[narciso]

a typical backlash scenario was in the Siege,'98, Larry Wright, future Looming Tower author, took the second Blind Sheikh plot and posited a reaction to such a plot, internment camps for Arab Americans, of course there was the extra fillip that the plot was set in motion by what we would later call a rendition of said Sheikh, who they would make an Iraqi

[clarice]

I love that, Iggy.

[daddy]

Iggy,

Your future home link about electronic liquid floors reminds me of Ray Bradbury's classic short story "The Veldt."

[maryrose]

S BW
I actually understood that
I refuse to get air conditioning because it costs too much

[narciso]

well that's being too charitable:

http://www.bloombergview.com/articles/2015-05-04/obama-s-flawed-logic-on-hardliners-in-u-s-and-iran

[Miss Marple]

maryrose,

I grew up without air conditioning. I can take the heat until it gets very hot and humid (90's). If I were here by myself, I probably wouldn't turn it on until July.

However, my daughter is in AC all day, so she really can't take the heat, especially at night. I will probably have to turn it on in the next day or two, at least in the evenings.

I sort of like the summer warmth with the windows open, so you can hear the birds in the morning. It reminds me of my childhood.

[narciso]

why you can't have nice things:

http://althouse.blogspot.com/2015/05/the-destruction-of-wisconsin-supreme.html

[anonamom]

Janet, my condolences. What a gift you gave your father-in-law and your husband.

And congratulations James! Jimmy K--pickles.

Ig, no worries about the economy--my youngest was at a lecture "somebody named Christina Romer" gave at his university last week, and she said this time it really, really is different.

[Jane]

Daddy,

That's the exact same thing I said (out loud I think) when he asked that question.

How many people in this country didn't finish college. We have Steve Jobs, Bill gates and a few others I'm pretty sure. It doesn't bother me in the least. I guess it all depends on how he frames it.