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September 22, 2017



Such simplistic bullshit; these people, man, these people.


Let's note that "not listening in real-time" doesn't mean they weren't recording and replaying his phone calls.

It also doesn't mean they didn't hijack his cell microphone and spy / record non phone calls.

Also nothing about spying on anyone else at the same time (Kushner? Page?)


That is what is before us, and, more urgently, that is what is before our young; it is hard to be hopeful, but Trump does prove that the old spirit is not dead. We will see soon enough.

Posted by: squaredance | September 22, 2017 at 09:37 AM

Very true, squaredance. I talked with a friend last week and we both remembered the Florida of our youth where we had mandatory Americanism vs Communism classes. Those need to be brought back in one form or another. The teachers of said courses need to be certified and periodically reviewed. We have to stamp out the falsely contructed universe that posits leftwing vs leftwing as the respectable universe of thought. That milieu, a Communism vs Socialism craziness, brainwashes Americans into thinking the National Socialists (the Nazis) are right wing, or the Unionized Marxists (Fascists) are, incredibly, viewed as right wing.

We simply *must not* allow them to go unchallenged on the Art of Verbal Warfare / Art of Word Warfare field of battle. This has been a severely underestimated aspect of their "advance" through the academy and into our culture.


Rip, Bernie Casey, he was sort of the severe Joe Morton type (even though the latter didn't have an athletic background)

What were they not watching when they did a singleminded probing of manafort and I assume page and co, certainly not Orlando or Columbus or anchorage.

Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki

If a healthcare bill co-authored by Lindsey frickin Graham cannot get through the Senate because it's too mean, then we need a new Senate not a new bill.
I hope it dies because it enshrines O-care as only needing blockgrants to have been a great plan...from central planning.
No thanks.

Jane (Stand against the Coup)

Buckeye - re: the DNA kit. According to a friend of mind, the testers emphasize the minority stuff and de-emphasize the primary stuff. (I know that is unclear, but I can't recall how he explained it to me.) So as a blue-eyed blond for my entire life, it will be interesting to see how much black DNA I have lurking around.

The kit is still on my desk and has been for a month. I'll get to it at some point.

Old Lurker

said at TK: "You aren't a senator, so your opinion isn't of concern to me."

And right there is the crux of much of the poking back and forth of each other here lately. In that one statement is the reasoning behind rejecting (or not caring about) the concerns of all who worry about optics, momentum, promises and the Base. Trump Uber Alles.


According to a friend of mind, the testers emphasize the minority stuff and de-emphasize the primary stuff.

That is definitely my observation, too. Oh, how the libs in my family waxed jubilant over minute amounts of non-white ancestry. Amounts so utterly minute they can't plausibly be measured in any credible way given the testing apparatus, IMO.

Seems like a big scam to me.


So clockboy 2.0 was very inept thankfully:

Clarice Feldman



He pointed to a report out earlier this year that in 2008, U.S. intelligence raised concerns about Manafort's foreign consulting work to Arizona Sen. John McCain's presidential campaign.

Manafort's business partner, Rick Davis, was McCain's campaign manager. At the time, Manafort and Davis were working on behalf of then-Ukrainian Prime Minister Viktor Yanukovych. The business partners also arranged two meetings between McCain and Deripaska, the Russian oligarch who Manafort offered to brief last year.

Grassley told Wray that the circumstances that prompted a defensive briefing to McCain's campaign about Manafort's work "seem substantially similar" to the situation surrounding the Trump campaign.

Man Tran


Correctomundo. Now we need to track down EastBayJay and exdem.


White Babies as Young as 6 Months Old Are Racist


Should have used the south African translator:


Miss Marple

Old Lurker,

Let me explain this to you. Trump is who I supported. I don't think Moore is a good candidate. Who cares what I think? Certainly not the voters of Mississippi, just like they don't care about Threadkiller's. We don't have a vote.

I would not like Moore as a candidate if Mike Pence were president, or Jeb Bush.. I don't think he can win the general. And obviously, if he is opposing the Graham-Cassidy bill, which the President supports, then he is not supporting the president's policies as he claims.

I support President Trump because I agree with him. When he does something I disagree with, I will say something. I have a real fear of the Dems using the imminent collapse of Obamacare to campaign on single payer and win next year.


Obama Refers to Himself 96 Times in 18 Minute Speech

Obama even quoted himself in the speech. Via American Mirror:

Praising the Gates’ action on “climate change,” Obama said, “We can figure it out. It can be done. And that spirit, that spirit that says, to quote, I guess, myself, ‘Yes we can,’” triggered laughs and cheers from the crowd.


President Trump supports Graham-Cassidy. He wants it passed. Moore does not. Consequently, Moore does NOT support the President's agenda, regardless of what he says.

Let me try:

President Trump supports Graham-Cassidy. He wants it passed. Graham does as well. Consequently, Graham DOES support the President's agenda, regardless of what he says.

Old Lurker

MM "Who cares what I think? "

Me for one. That's why I fight with you!



Liberals Welcome Kim Jong Un to ‘The Resistance’

Examples at the (Free Beacon) link.


Miss M:

These are the Democrats in Alabama (lefty bias trigger warning):


It would take a real effort for the GOP to lose this election. Moore might be capable, but is appeal is to the group that tends to favor Trump.


Blame it on babelfish


ManTran: hmmm. Still no email. DrJ has mine, also henry from a couple months ago during the Troll Kerfuffle.
I'll go check the Spam folder...

Old Lurker

MM "I have a real fear of the Dems using the imminent collapse of Obamacare to campaign on single payer and win next year."

Now we are getting somewhere. That is a valid concern.

But so is the fear that by cementing the notion that states should send all that O'care money to DC so that DC can decide who gets some portion (after deducting the cost of supporting DC swamp critters) of it back, and in so doing cements the support of UniParty-R & L in the centrality of the Federal role in all matters relating to health and personal responsibility, we will be ensuring not just the demise of R Control (which is arguable), but the fiscal and moral demise of the whole concept of the USA.

Some of us would argue that the GOP control would not be in doubt at all if it had done what they promised to do for seven years, or if Trump had done to ObamaCare what he promised during the last two years.

And don't pretend that Graham-Cassidy fulfills either of those sets of promises.

Which brings your support for it, based on what you said, as simply an election day tactic for the election 13 months from now.


I wish general magoo was a figment of some one's deranged imagination:


But the last guy had to scapegoated for the underwear bomber.

Miss Marple the Deplorable

Old Lurker,

Of course it is! That's what I said!

Exactly how is sending the money to DC and then back to the states worse than sending it to DC and letting it be administered from there?

And Trump did HIS part on the repeal. His mistake was listening to McConnell and Ryan and their stupid plan, not to mention the backstabbing actions of McCain.

For SEVEN YEARS they campaigned on this and promised him they had something ready to go. I even heard Ryan say that to Trump on television.

What was Trump supposed to do? Unlike Obama, he doesn't operate outside the Constitution.


Appalled last thread: "Christopher Columbus did discover America, and it's reasonable to make that a holiday. It's also not totally wack for states or cities to different things"

If they had added a Native American holiday, that's doing different things.
If they removed Columbus Day, same.
It's when they rename the existing holiday that all our Moral Preening detectors jump off the scale. Then it's an obvious in-yo-face, agenda-driven guilt-trip action. And that triggers a reaction.

(I arrogate unto myself permission to respond to Apoalled, from time to time. Because Appalled truly doesn't anger or even annoy me in any way).

Old Lurker

"Exactly how is sending the money to DC and then back to the states worse than sending it to DC and letting it be administered from there?"

99.999% of the people who voted for Trump don't accept that there are only those two choices.

Miss Marple the Deplorable

Mark Knoller‏Verified account @markknoller 21m21 minutes ago

With Maine's @Governor_LePage at his side, @VP presses @SenatorCollins to support Graham-Cassidy bill. She voted no on last repeal bill.


American Liberal Berates Man in MAGA Hat, Now Faces ‘Hate Crime’ Charges!


“An American woman wanted to sit at my table. I was wearing a MAGA cap. She became visibly angry with my presence, so my friend started recording her.”

The woman then let loose with an expletive laden flood of hatred.

“You’re doing this, like to the world,” she yelled. “What the fu** is wrong with people?” She continued by calling the man a horrible human being. “What is fu**ing wrong with you? You are a horrible human being. Horrible human being,”

As the woman finally gathered her belongings and began walking away, the man can be heard saying “Liberal tolerance at hand.” Quite a mild response to the vitriol that the woman was spewing, but it sparked her to another level of fury.

“I do not fu**ing tolerate fu**ing, fu**ing racist!” she yelled. “You’re a horrible fu**ing human being and I hope you go home and feel fu**ing ashamed of yourself!”

“For what?” the man asked almost begging the unhinged lunatic woman to continue her collapse into insanity.

“For fu**ing being a fu**ing racist you fu**ing human piece of sh**!” This concluded her rant, threw a drink at the man, and stormed out of the bar. As she left Bjerrekær can be heard calling after her, “I think that is definitely illegal there. You should stop that person! This is assault!”

Video at the link.


In a WSJ letter this morning, Alan Blinder is butt hurt over Graham-Cassidy. It has that going for it anyway. Granted it is nowhere near a repeal of ACA.

Jim Eagle

I just completed the 2nd most intrusive goverment survey: The American Community Survey (Census). Basically, I told them to F**k off, none of their business my income, my wife's income or whether Frederick has trouble climbing stairs.

I told them if they wanted to find out our household income and any dividends, profits, income to ask Lois Lerner.

Really, they are asking more invasive questions than Comey asked Curb Dive.

Thomas Collins

OL, Graham-Cassidy doesn't harden the "Federales as sugar daddy" cement any more than the present state of the crystallization process. If anything, Graham-Cassidy slows down the crystallization so that in subsequent years the sledgehammer work wouldn't be as difficult. Under the current state of our politics, the sledgehammer work isn't happening for many years. Even if President Trump serves eight years, there will still be plenty of sledgehammer work to be done after he leaves office.


WaPo on the sure farce of next week's FBI ceremony to welcome Director Wray.

Old Lurker

Continuing my loving picking on MM:

"And Trump did HIS part on the repeal. His mistake was listening to McConnell and Ryan and their stupid plan...For SEVEN YEARS they campaigned on this and promised him they had something ready to go...What was Trump supposed to do?..."

More progress. You admit Trump was wrong to give Ryan & McConnell rope, but until now the argument has been that had he not done that he would have looked bad.

The Trump I expected was the Developer Trump who never took a promise from an important subcontractor for granted without putting on his boots, going to the job site, and making them prove they could deliver before he bet the ranch on some project. The Trump I voted for would have smelled the rat and called it out for all to see from Day 1 (we all saw it). The Trump I voted for would have been living in the Bully Pulpit warning that nobody in Congress was working to rip ObamaCare out by the roots.

By waiting until the damage was done, then clapping for the stupid-stupid-stupid piece of legislation pooped out by the House, then putting all his chips on the Senate passing something better so it could all be fixed in Conference, he walked right into the political disaster he has on his hands right now.

I, for one, will not accept that Graham-Cassidy is a pig of a fig leaf.

Thomas Collins

Destiny and Tatiana wouldn't dream of being taken care of by their sugar daddies as well as many current state governors expect Uncle Sam Sugar Daddy to take care of their states.


How many Senators are for Trump's filibuster rule change agenda? Hmmm.

Personally, even though I have no influence in The Executive, The Legislature, or Mississippi/Alabama, my opinion is that Trump's main goal is for the Senate to embarrass themselves again while he remains a non-obstructionist.

If they pass the G-S HalfassCare he wins, and if they flunk, he wins.

"Time for the rule change, Mitch!!"

Old Lurker

will not accept that Graham-Cassidy is NOT a pig of a fig leaf.



City councils are known for their preening skills. They can't fill the potholes, so they do this stuff instead. However, this is an issue for the people of Tulsa to deal with -- if this is what they want, fine.

You notice that DiBlasio has had to take several stances on the NYC Columbus Day. You don't go irritating the Italian-American community there.


They're gonna call you back, Jack, and then come to your house if you don't give them something over the phone. There's a legal threat, too.

I explained to the guy who called me that I didn't think the gov't had the right to certain personal information and I wasn't providing it. Dared him to have me arrested.

After that, he was willing to take answers like "Not applicable." Seemed like a nice enough guy.


I should add that you might not receive the same treatment since I didn't return the survey even after it was sent to me twice, the second time with the threat.

Thomas Collins

OL, under the current composition of the Senate, Graham-Cassidy is as good as it gets. Developer Trump going to the Congressional job site would have worked as well as a developer telling subcontractors to use straw sippy cups to clean a Brownfields site.


OCare put a shitload of power in the "shalls" bestowed upon the HHS Secretary.

Tom Price can probably fix more than the administration is letting on but doesn't so that OCare does indeed fall on its own weight.

Maybe Trump just needs any GOP bill to cross his desk so he can effectively fix healthcare through the existing OCare legislation while giving credit to an all Republican effort.

Just a thought.


Yes I'm in a very order 6 mood, we go to war we have, not the one we could have had.


Sorry to go off-topic, however:

Squaredance, on the other thread at 10:20, you say, in part:
"(and you seem to have been well indoctrinated by the Left--you really ought to consider how it comes to be that you spout their by now commonplace cant and propaganda about the American Indian.

"But the real point is that the Left do not really care about American Indians at all, or, for that matter, "women" or "gays" or "hispanics". They care not one bit about "Columbus Day" and who might be "offended". They are on the offensive against you."

I don't understand, if you're directing this at me (who was originally ticked off at the city council changing Columbus Day name.) If you're saying I'm well indoctrinated by the left, and spouting the left's cant and propaganda about Native Americans, a large percentage of the "drivel" now comes from leaders and spokesmen of the tribes who make the news here. I wouldn't say the left is driving them, probably a lot of it is their grievances about the past. Which, of course, is fertilized by the liberals and the left.

Anyway, I didn't understand your long post about what I said -- I know I touched on the 'white faces' on the council passing the resolution, but, I hadn't had my second cup of coffee, and I am extremely tired of political correctness (which I'm sure drives that council a great deal of the time), triggering, SJW, and the other causes fronting the left now. Also, I wasn't getting down and technical and educational, I was spouting off and pissed off.

Miss Marple the Deplorable


Both things are true. If YOU can think of a way he could have gotten them to act when he didn't even have a cabinet approved, feel free to enunciate it.

It's over and done with. We all have the benefit of hindsight, but I KNOW I heard Ryan say that. Who would have thought he would lie to the president in public and on national television?

Going to war with the leadership of the party on day one would have been suicidal. No cabinet approved, for one thing. More action from the GOPe to go after him.

Instead, he's been gathering power over the course of the year. His numbers are coming up. He's won 5/5 of the last special elections, even the one in Virginia. If he gets Strange elected, his clout will be enormous. (Yes, I am viewing that election as a part of the overall strategy for both getting his tax cuts and other things passed and winning the 2018 elections).

Miss Marple the Deplorable

Dr.Darrell Scott‏Verified account @PastorDScott 26m26 minutes ago

I think the Dems want to nominate Lil Kim as their nominee in 2020, the way they're backing him against the POTUS.


Appalled: agree. Their city council is well within bounds to be moral preening low IQ haters. JOMers are well within bounds to point it out and decry it. I think we are on the same page.

ManTran: DrJ contacted me.

JiB: "just completed the 2nd most intrusive goverment survey: The American Community Survey (Census)"

Hey, that makes me think. If I (and other conservatives) don't cooperate with Fed census, could that potentially reduce the number of Congressional seats allotted to CA? I mean, if CA gets credited for illegals maybe we can slice away at the thumb on the scale by not counting righties. There'd have to be a lot of non-cooperating conservatives but as a thought exercise... I wonder if SJWs already advocate this for Red State residents.


Trump's power is a tactical thing. I'm more concerned with excess government power at all levels. It's clear that Graham-Cassidy doesn't address that -- more a rearrangement of deck chairs.

Prospects for reducing government power grabs are slim to none with the current politicians at all levels. Even Walker just wants government to be more efficient, he doesn't do less government. Thus my appreciation of the ledge.

Miss Marple the Deplorable


Entered the country illegally and bought materials on Amazon.


Comey convocation address derailed by angry protesters at Howard University


Guess which rich actor won’t be taking in refugees after all

[P]eople were saying, ‘You’ve got a home, why don’t you house refugees?’ And we did look into it. But we had, then, a very new baby – maybe four or five months old.

Maybe people had a point. I understand why some might think I should be housing people instead of complaining about a government not doing it. But I was trying to raise awareness that we can do more as a society. Because I do feel we are able to do more than just recovering bodies.



Same here. Blonde hair (guy at the BMV asked if it was spelled gray or grey) and blue eyes. I know I have Native American and pretty sure some African ancestors. Rest is likely Heinz 57 mix of Northern European. In addition to the Cherokee, family has been here for 400 years, so lots of melting pot action:)

I was just kidding about being chicken to do the DNA spit and ship test.

pagar, a bacon, ham and sausage supporter

Rich Pletcher has this up on my FB page.
"Julie Ponzi says
My son made me cry on the way to school yesterday. A high school junior, he was recounting how much he dislikes his American history class. Why? "Because, mom. I used to really like learning about the story of our country when I was a kid in elementary and junior high. It was taught to us like it was something good. Now all they tell us is why our country sucks. I'm sick of hearing it."

History and Social studies were my favorite classes in school. The way I see it now, IMO, school would be unbearable.

Old Lurker

TC, you might be dead right that G-C is the best he can get at this stage. But if it comes, my point is that it comes with a YUGE cost to Trump.

That cost is in his base because Trump has convinced me that he likes the House Bill and he likes the Senate Bill and he will like the combination of two if that comes to be. What he has paid is that what he thought was required to make him happy with O'Care was never really what he thought...and secondly, in that regard he is just another DC player like all the others.

He is not saying, "look guys, this (crap) is in fact the best I can get from this Congress and I promise you that, should the political winds favor another go at it in the future, I will be, as I have always promised to be, there for the American People...now let's get back on that field and fight fight fight!"

He's not even going so far as to say "that sound you hear is the sound of concrete breaking around my feet". That cute quip, true as it was, cost HW Bush his reelection and gave us the age of Clinton and its spawn.

Such is the nature of bedrock issues cast aside for political expedience.

Miss Marple the Deplorable


I used to read my daughter's textbooks every year to see what they were up to. A couple of times I lodged complaints with the township curriculum director. I also used to go review the textbooks up for consideration.

I recommend everyone do this. I used to collect old textbooks for the same reason - to see how teaching the subjects has changed and also to note the decline in language. You can see a marked deterioration in the complexity of the sentences over the course of decades.

Man Tran

I asked our lovely Bulgarian guide about doing the spit test given the 2500 yr history of factions marching back and forth through all the local fiefdoms and she admitted NO WAY! The reality would be too shocking. I'm guessing she had Turk and maybe Indian blood in there somewhere.

Miss Marple the Deplorable


It is a sign of progress that this guy got suspended.


I got slapped silly by my Kindergarten teacher for calling her out on a lie.

Bet I would get in serious trouble in American History class:)


well we need an operating template, from whence price can work, this is why the miguelito lovelace (ankle biting) coverage from politico, to prematurely discredit any determination he makes,


its getting to be like irs burgers,



Sums it up pretty well... (sad)


I have found this discussion wrt Moore/Strange election and the Cassidy/ Graham bill very interesting
Here are the facts as I know them.
You can correct me if I am wrong.
Price and Ryan did have a bill they wanted do Ryan DID NOT to President Trump.
Freedom and other caucuses did not like it
The first attempt did not pass.
The second one did,
McConnell made a big deal about having his own Senate bill that was better than the the House's.
It turned out that wasn't agreeable to all Republicans and in desperation he went to the Skinny Bill which was torpedoed by Collins , McCain and Murkowski.
Now we have a chance with this not perfect bill , which I believe will pass
See President Trump's theme song- You can't always get what you want"
I would vote for Moore because he is more conservative.
I don't know that much about Luther Strange.
Just because he supports President Trump now doesn't mean he always will.
Moore can disagree with the president on this healthcare bill.
I didn't think we were down to electing yes men to the US Senate.
I have no idea if Moore will win the general and neither does anyone else.
We cannot compare this to Akin.
If Repubs come out against Moore if he wins the primary, they risk their majority.
I don't think they want to give up their primo majority perks.
We need a good candidate to represent Alabama.
Let the people there decide..


Should be did not lie


but uber is a clear and present danger,



Oh and just to rattle a few cages:
Meghan Kelly has let her hair grow out and looks better(ducking)

Old Lurker

Maryrose, now your 1:12 is just beneath you.


Miss Marple the Deplorable


It was only a matter of time until Lawrence O'Donnell's video became a meme.

Miss Marple the Deplorable


Thomas Collins

Hard to argue with your analysis of the current situation, OL. I think where we disagree is on the issue of what is realistically obtainable at the moment. Who knows, you may convince me and I'll be squatting on your ledge before you know it.

By the way, I think the concrete remark was made by then California Guv Reagan when he went back on his campaign promise to oppose a payroll withholding system for California income taxes.


won't be like that Katherine heigl vehicle, but still, then again how did paula zahn do,


common man

Charlie Gasparino seems to have gone totally around the bend...


Sorry to be so far behind...

Harking back to Porch and Jane on DNA testing, DNA testing is really at the infant stage at this point. For consumers it's of some value, for the companies it's a big opportunity to build their databases and make money while they do it.

That said, people make of it what they want. If I had had some of this information when I was 20 would it have changed the way I lived? Maybe, but I this point I can go yes, yes, yes to the susceptibilities disclosed.

As far as ancestral findings, I came out 100% European including accurate identification of a rather small ethnicity unknown to the testers.


Megyn Kelly: ‘Donald Trump Did Not Make Me, I Made Me’

Old Lurker

TC, I am willing to concede to you what is realistically feasible at the moment.

But don't pee on my shoes and tell me it's raining.

Maybe Reagan said it before about the concrete thingy, but Bush sank himself with "Read my lips..."


what difference does it make,



The 1:22 link leaves me wondering how such a dolt because the chief justice.

Miss Marple the Deplorable

It's an elected position, TK, and he is good at framing himself as a martyr.

Miss Marple the Deplorable



Personally having studied Spanish history, if the Catalans want to be free they should be.
I was also in favor of Scottish independence.
I was kidding of course.

Old Lurker

:-) MR I know

Old Lurker

" if the Catalans want to be free they should be. "

I feel the same way about Californians...


I agree with TC.
I don't know if I am ready for Lurker's Ledge at this juncture.


It's an elected position, TK, and he is good at framing himself as a martyr.

Kinda like Trump.


So do I

Miss Marple the Deplorable

Steven Portnoy‏Verified account @stevenportnoy 5m5 minutes ago

BREAKING: McCain says in statement, "I cannot in good conscience vote for the Graham-Cassidy proposal.


There is nothing in President Trump that conjures up the idea of a martyr.
Hillary as martyr- every single day of her life.

Miss Marple the Deplorable


Neither you nor I can vote in that election.

I am done talking about it. I will watch the rally tonight to see what President Trump has to say.


Then we need Collins to vote yes.
She will gets tons of money to use as governor for healthcare.
What is wrong with her.
Also salt in the wound: McCain being shot down was part of the Viet Nam saga last night.

common man

McCain, Paul and Collins are now all reported as "no". Can we get on to tax reform and rate reductions.

I would never have voted for any of the three well before this debacle. But unless we get more non squishes in the Senate, there is really no way to pass anything on HC that I would even consider to be acceptable.

Frau Kotzig

Surprise! Queasy was not allowed to share his wisdom with the students of DC's Howard University. They will not know how to duplicate his easy success by just listening--and following orders. Shouldn't Comey be home writing his own "What Happened" book for more easy big bucks?


McCain... any reason given? (as in no bribes for himself)

common man

Something about his conscience.


Common man:
Any chance of their changing their minds?

Miss Marple the Deplorable


I can't find a story yet. I think, therefore, I will ascribe the motive to petty revenge and a willingness to stop Trump for the Swamp.

When the story pops up I will post it.

Frau Kotzig

The last I saw Paula Zahn, she was standing in the rain, wearing a plastic poncho during a minor storm in NYC.

common man

Paul NFW

Collins extremely consistent and wants to pander to Dem and Indys in a run for Governor

McCain Ugh


I was unable to vote in 49 states during the 2016 General election either.

But I was right about what would happen outside of California.

That link was a hatchet job. Plain and simple.

Claiming that Moore can fool a bunch of simpleton Alabamians isn't much of a defense.


McCain says in statement, "I cannot in good conscience vote for the Graham-Cassidy proposal.

Find the flaw in the sentence above.

Captain Hate

Shorter McCain: Graham should've known I'd stab him in the back.

Janet 🚬

Apparently you are NOT done talking about it if you pass around links that tear Moore down.

Republicans are the worst at ripping up their own people.

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