Cake-Baking Overload

The WSJ has more than exhaustive coverage of the Supreme Court arguments on wedding cakes and gay marriage.

The WSJ does leave me in suspense here:

Chief Justice Roberts returns to an earlier hypothetical: must, say, a nonprofit like Catholic Legal Services, affiliated with a church that views same-sex marriage as sinful, agree to represent a gay couple suing Masterpiece Cakeshop, simply because they offer other legal services to the public?

Or what about a college affiliated with a church that holds such views, asks Justice Alito. Must they provide same-sex couples access to the married student dormitory?

Mr. Cole says, in essence, that while a church or other “core” religious institution may be exempt, a college would have to offer such housing. For support, he turns to the late Justice Antonin Scalia’s opinion in Employment Division v. Smith, a 1990 opinion rejecting a claim that members of the Native American Church could not be penalized because they used peyote, a sacrament in their faith that nevertheless was illegal under state law.

Hold the phone - the Religious Freedom Restoration Act (RFRA) sailed through Congress in 1993 in order to undo Smith. That law got a lot of recent attention following the Supreme Court ruling legalizing gay marriage. So why no mention in the story?

Ahh! Because in 1997 the Supreme Court ruled (City of Boerne v. Flores) that the RFRA applied to Federal law but was an over-reach relative to state law. Some states, not including Colorado, have passed parallel state law but for cake-bakers in Colorado RFRA does not provide a path to protection.

Comments

[Jane]

Hey - am I really first?

[Dave (in MA)]

Jane Won

[Jane]

Oh good. Hey Dave have you read Howie Carr's book on the Kennedy's? Mr Marlene convinced me it is not to be missed.

[Comanche Voter]

One of the standard (if not particularly attractive) photos at weddings is one of the bride or groom stuffing wedding cake into their partner's face.

I wonder just where a wedding cake is stuffed at a gay marriage?

I know just where I'd like to stuff a wedding cake at a ceremony where one or another gay activist has singled out a florist or cake maker for legal torture.

[Dave (in MA)]

No, Mr. Luddite doesn't publish e-books and I don't buy paper books anymore if I can get away with it.

[Dave (in MA)]

The baker should have baked a cake with "Leviticus 20:13" in icing.

[Threadkiller]

But[t] gay-rights advocates were equally eager to make the case about “David and Charlie,” the same-sex couple who went to Mr. Phillips’s shop, and for whom they chanted periodically outside the court Tuesday. David Mullins made the closing pitch for himself and his side, saying that Mr. Phillips had effectively denied him the cake based on his identity after “we told him it was for us.” He also emphasized the personal effects to him of what he considered to be discrimination, saying that “we were mortified” and that while he was embarrassed to admit it, “I cried, Charlie cried.”

Rectum? Damn near killed him.

[Dave (in MA)]

A baker whose position on the SSM issue matches the one publicly stated by the Mulatto Messiah until May 9th, 2012 is Literally Hitler.

[Jane]

Can someone explain to me why people are so opposed to moving Israel's capital to Jerusalem?

[Threadkiller]

I wonder just where a wedding cake is stuffed at a gay marriage?

Pound Cake

[Dave (in MA)]

Because the "Palestinians" claim it's their holy land.

[Threadkiller]

Bundt Hurt

[Duda: Progressive and loving it!!]

Wow! So the Republican party is really going all in on a child molester.

Dang!

One thing Rapey Roy has done for me is...I used to look at holier-than-thou Christians spouting nonsense about Ghosts impregnating young girls on behalf of a god and yada yada yada the God's Son would grow up and be sacrificed so that the God could cleanse humanity of it's sins and blah blah blah blah blah...

...Well,I used to listen to these fruitcakes and think to myself "You really don't believe this nutty crap,do you?"

Now I know that all along they didn't and that they simply wanted to have power to push people around.

[Rapey Johnny Iconyerz]

I stand with duda! I hope he gets my spot in Congress. He reminds me of me in my youth!!!

[Threadkiller]

http://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/2017/12/05/media-elite-laughed-at-2008-roast-sending-matt-lauer-s-pervy-behavior.html

Wow.

[Beasts of England]

'I wonder just where a wedding cake is stuffed at a gay marriage?'

Uh...

[Threadkiller]

Trump was at that Roast listening to all these fools brag and carry on.

[mad jack]

jane: david bernstein had a post at instapundit this afternoon that explained the Jerusalem hypocrisy rather well.

[Captain Hate]

Exactly, TK; Miss Marple's thoughts have been confirmed. And everyone else look like scummy liars.

[Frau Aufmarsch]

Matt's wife must not have attended the 2008 roast.

[Extraneus]

Matt's wife wasn't attending much, apparently.

[Janeprobably about 10 minutes after getting there]

Thanks MadJack.

Is it possible to pu a last page link, or has that changed/?

[boatbuilder]

As the father of a gay child I am in favor of letting gays live the way they want to live and letting cake makers and churches live the way they want to live. There is bigotry (some of which is apparently acceptable to certain posters here) which I believe has no place and there is principled belief, which I believe that both gays and those who either can not or will not accept gays will just have to learn to live with. That is how our country is supposed to work.

[Miss Marple the Deplorable]

Threadkiller,

Indeed he was, filing it all away for future use.

This is one reason why the media is horrified: Jeb Bush wouldn't have known about this stuff. Donald Trump did.

I am convinced they also bragged to him personally and are now horrified by what he remembers.

[Captain Hate]

Dear God, check out the Village Voice account of Lauer's roast:

https://www.villagevoice.com/2008/10/24/matt-lauers-roast-tom-cruise-katie-couric-and-3-hours-of-dick-jokes/

And even they wouldn't touch Gilbert Gottfried's comments.

[Miss Marple the Deplorable]

Big news from Indianapolis, of interest to daddy:

http://www.wibc.com/news/local-news/fedex-plans-upgrade-indy-hub-create-hundreds-jobs?utm_content=buffer9b245&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer

[Frau Aufmarsch]

Ext - wife Annette Roque just took a kid or kids with her upon leaving him and heading back to the Netherlands. Hope she gets a ton from the creep.

[boatbuilder]

The Lauer roast makes the pussy tapes seem rather quaint.

[Account Deleted]

All of Lauer's taste seems to be in his mouth. His wife is a beauty. Here's to hoping she lands on her feet and never has to see that turd burping fool ever again.

[Account Deleted]

That first article about the roast was quite enough, CH. What a total gross out. Katie Couric? She strikes me as being more asexual than corn.

[Miss Marple the Deplorable]

boatbuilder,

I have a gay nephew. When he married his now husband, he realized we Catholics in the family would be conflicted, so they went to San Francisco to get married. I found that to be a very considerate and loving decision.

They are present at all family events, and the way this works is they don't bother us about the Church's position, and we don't bother them about their relationship. We love them both and want the best for them.

I am convinced that it is something genetic which cannot be helped. My nephew didn't admire Superman or Batman; he dressed up as Wonder Woman at the age of 5.

What I really wish would happen is that someone would do a definitive study about this. The problem is abortion; a lot of gays don't want that research done because they fear people would abort babies determined genetically to be gay.

[Miss Marple the Deplorable]

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2017/12/05/russia-banned-from-2018-winter-olympic-games-in-south-korea-over-doping-scandal-ioc-announces.html

I don't know if this story was covered earlier today. Sorry if this is a duplicate.

[Miss Marple the Deplorable]

Joe Concha‏Verified account @JoeConchaTV
10m10 minutes ago

Tune to the Ingraham Angle tonight at 10p as we discuss today's act of media malfeasance & that 2008 Matt Lauer roast from which we have received more than two dozen reports of individual acts of perversion SO profound & disgusting that decorum prohibits listing them here...
================================

Joe Concha is the media reporter for The Hill, which I have noticed has dropped some of their leftist orientation lately. I find that very interesting.

[Extraneus]

I hate that apologizing for posting something someone else had already posted. Who has the time to see every post? And even if they did, maybe they skipped it the first time. Post away,for god's sake!

[Beasts of England]

My nephew's third album has been released on Spotify. Just search my last name and he'll show up. The newest album cover is blue. Tracks 4, 7, and 10 are my favorites. He wrote them all, plays all of the guitar parts, and does the lead vocals. It was recorded at my brother's analog studio. Enjoy!!

[Miss Marple the Deplorable]

Extraneusm

So, should I apologize for apologizing? LOL!

OK, I won't do it anymore.

[Account Deleted]

I especially enjoy the humble apologies for infringing upon my valuable time with the double-postings. For shame. /sarc

[Janet 🚬]

That Village Voice link shows you who they really are. It's like seeing Zombie's photo essays on the Folsom St. Fair & some of the gay events in Calif..
Sad & vulgar & depraved.

Mansion trash that think they are the educated, refined ones.
It is hard to believe they look down on & mock God-fearing Americans.

[Dave (in MA)]

.

[Miss Marple the Deplorable]

Tucker has seen the light!

Tucker Carlson‏Verified account @TuckerCarlson
3m3 minutes ago

This is how secret police start, when law enforcement agencies decide to do the bidding of politicians, rather than pursue impartial justice on behalf of the public. Let's nip this nightmare in the bud right now. #FBI #Tucker @FoxNews

[Captain Hate]

That first article about the roast was quite enough, CH.

One of my points in linking it was to point out that it's been out there in the public domain for nine years so anyone wondering about all the shock about Lauer ought to be wondering why he drew the short straw. And boatbuilder's comment is spot on; when there was all this caterwauling about the pussy tape, this was out there waiting to be pointed out. I guess Trump realized, correctly, that enough voters wouldn't care.

[Clarice Feldman]

It's probably just me, but if I were a good baker I'd make it clear that I would not put little figurines of any sex or writing on my cakes--just tasteful decorations. Anyone who didn't like that was free to get their cake at KMart or something.

[Dave (in MA)]

Bags of apples are measured in Pecks.

Bags of peckers are measured in Lauers.

[Account Deleted]

The Lauer crowd reminds me of a debauched college aged crowd. Arrested development. Lauer was actually standing up their crowing about the size of his pickle. And Couric laughing about his remarks about seeing her colon? Pass the self-esteem wouldja, hon?

[Miss Marple the Deplorable]

Clarice,

That would be my choice as well. I would offer floral decorations, post-modern designs and such. Anyone wanting names or figures could buy them at Michael's.

My daughter's wedding cake was all white with white roses. There was no inscription and no figurines, as she thought those were tacky.

Here's your choices: A, B, or C. No conflicts.

[Porchlight]

That would be the safe way to go, Clarice. But I'm glad there are still people out there exercising their rights.

[Account Deleted]

Just checking back, CH. Not taking issue with you posting the article. I just couldn't stomach any more. Your point is well-taken.

[Janet 🚬]

from Village Voice - " Meredith Viera more than made up for it. Lauer’s Today costar started right in with, “That motherfucker Matt Lauer,” and got a big laugh."....

"“People say he’s so prim and proper, like he’s got a stick up his ass. It’s not a stick, my friends, it’s Al Roker’s dick.”

After showing some slides from Beijing, with Lauer and Roker prancing in tights, she added: “Let’ just say Al puts the ‘meat’ in ‘meteorologist.”"....

Meredith Viera ...she gets highlighted in women's magazines all the time.

[Porchlight]

Guise, it's different when Hollywood does it because they're not running for President! Duh.

[Beasts of England]

Do we have a ruling on all those designers who won't work with Melania? I'll bet they have a storefront somewhere. Public accommodation, amirite?

[boatbuilder]

Thanks, MM. In my son's case all I can say is that (while I am biased) he is one of the most fundamentally decent, courageous and honest people you could hope to meet, and that his coming to terms with being gay was extremely difficult for him (even though his family and friends were extremely supportive). It was not a choice.
I love him very much and I want him to be happy. I am grateful despite the excesses that the culture has changed radically about acceptance of gays over the past decade. I understand that not everyone feels that way and that is something that we have to live with.

[narcisoyea]

They don't appreciate her deft touch;

https://www.weaselzippers.us/366493-two-muslim-men-suspected-of-conspiring-to-murder-prime-minister-theresa-may-with-a-bomb-are-arrested/

[Miss Marple the Deplorable]

This will no doubt irritate Old Lurker, but I am going to post it anyway:

https://twitter.com/ThomasWictor/status/938215694344249344

Wictor thinks Admiral Rogers is feeding info to the leak killers.

[Dave (in MA)]

Jane, typepad changed something and last page links no longer work, nor do the narcisolator features that find the last page or bring you directly to a post from the sidebar.

[narcisoyea]

3now this interesting:

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-deutsche-bank-shareholders/german-watchdog-investigates-deutsche-bank-shareholder-hna-paper-idUSKBN1DY2LZ?il=0

[GUS]

What if I asked a gay baker, to make me a cake with a SWASTIKA on it?? What would the objection be.

[Captain Hate]

Meredith Viera ...she gets highlighted in women's magazines all the time.

I was more surprised by her than anyone. For the record, none of that was really surprising to me except for the falseness of the images they present to the public.

[Bake until you pop.]

Butter, from the stash in the freezer, on cornbread and banana bread. The bananas weren't even overripe so that was delicately flavored.

[I am not a protected class.]

Well, Gus, Nazis aren't a protected class.

[narcisoyea]

Alto made a similar point, Gus from the link on the last thread.

[Captain Hate]

Admiral Rogers is the pivotal player in all this.

[GUS]

What if a black employee of PAPA ADOLF'S PIZZA, refused to deliver a pizza to the ROBERT BYRD FEDERAL COURTHOUSE in CHARLESTON WV???

[Porchlight]

Hi kim! Was just thinking about you today.

Gays are not a protected class in every state. And why does their protectedness trump more fundamental rights?

[Duda: Progressive and loving it!!]

"I am convinced that it is something genetic which cannot be helped"

That is exactly what I think every time I read one of your posts.

Someday who you love will be about as provocative as what flavor ice cream you prefer.

As for "Christian Cake boy"...I bet he supports Roy Moore.

[Sew, what's now?]

Hi Porch; shabbas X six months for me. A switch in time saves nine.

[Supremes, you could look it up or roll the dice.]

Gays are protected under federal law because gender is a protected class. I'm in the presence of a trained legal mind.

[Captain Hate]

Kim, what's shaking besides the banana bread before it's fully baked? Good to read you.

[narcisoyea]

Cue the various ways, strykers seatmates offend themselves in airplane, seppuku hanging hand grenade.

Savage was more annoying than usual today, first he was upset with the embassy moving, then he had agitate over the monument redesignation

[Janet 🚬]

the falseness of the images they present to the public.

Yeah.
They create a false public image trying to make themselves seem "good", while they promote a false image of all of US as somehow "bad".

Behold the loser crew that calls US racists, misogynists, haters,....

[Clarice Feldman]

WTF?https://www.wsj.com/articles/trumps-deutsche-bank-records-subpoenaed-by-mueller-1512480154

[narcisoyea]

Well technically sexual orientation,

Supergirl went back to good old fashion destruction to get all the sappy sentimentalism out of the way.

[Captain Hate]

Why would Savage oppose the embassy move? It was a campaign strong suggestion if not a promise. Levin had been worried the State apparatchiks would dictate against it.

[jimmyk]

A good outcome would not only be for SCOTUS to rule in favor of the bakers, but also to establish that "public accommodation" does not extend to customized one-off ("bespoke" is the pretentious term) products or services. And to reaffirm that states can't pass laws that infringe on religious freedom.

[Yoncats in paradise enow.]

The ents have shaken the leaves from the trees.
Full glory falls to the ground.
Cats dash after sycamore leaves,
Such prey they could but pray.

[narcisoyea]

He saud OT would make the situation more unstable, his got this new book out 'god faith and reason' so I guess he is trying for parity.

[Janeprobably about 10 minutes after getting there]

Thanks Dave.

This was not a case about "gay rights" but a case about free speech. A lot of gays would not support the gay plaintiffs if they knew the facts. A win would hurt gays who just want "equality" rather than help them. Hopefully the court gets it.

[What I learn I soon forget, or better, ignore.]

Sexual orientation is enveloped by gender. Supreme Court struck down a state law saying that sexual orientation can't be a protected class.
It's under gender discrimination. Same for trans stuff.

[Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki]

The idea of any "protected class" is anti American and anathema to the constitution and equal justice before the law.
It's sickening and a blight on the legal profession.

[Jack is Back!]

Now is the time for Jerusalem. The Saudi revolution said as much.

[Roy Orbison 'In Dreams'.]

Dream on jimmyk.

[Porchlight]

That's so.....reasonable, jimmyk.

[Captain Hate]

I really like the telepathic meta on The Flash tonight because he could know what Caitlin was planning. I'd rather he stuck around than stretch boy.

[Janeprobably about 10 minutes after getting there]

Boatbuilder, as I'm sure you know, your son is the kind of guy that changes people's minds, and that's how it should be. I've often said that 5 minutes after you meet Amy (or Mary) you forget they are gay because they are such incredible people. I would have missed out on so much in my life if I was anti-gay.

[Clarice Feldman]

From the latest wSJ on the DB subpoena:Deutsche Bank executives and lawyers had been expecting a demand for information from Mr. Mueller’s team as the special counsel investigation progressed, according to people close to the bank. As Mr. Trump’s primary lender in recent years, Deutsche Bank this year faced repeated document requests from Democratic lawmakers scrutinizing the administration’s ties to Russia.

The Democrats lacked Republican support to compel Deutsche Bank to provide the information. Deutsche Bank lawyers have said U.S. bank-secrecy rules prohibited the lender from revealing details about its clients or their business with the bank without a subpoena or other formal request from Congress.

Deutsche Bank faces ongoing questions about a series of Russian trades that have been scrutinized in multiple investigations in the U.S. and Europe, including in a still-pending U.S. Justice Department probe. The Democratic U.S. lawmakers wanted the bank to detail any ties between those trades or other Russian financing and anyone connected to Mr. Trump, his family or advisers.

—Erica Orden, Rebecca Ballhaus and Peter Nicholas in Washington contributed to this article.

Write to Jenny Strasburg at [email protected]

Corrections & Amplifications
An earlier subheadline said a subpoena from special counsel Robert Mueller’s office requested data and documents about President Trump’s accounts. The subpoena concerns people or entities close to Mr. Trump.

[Janeprobably about 10 minutes after getting there]

Jimmy, you got it just right.

[Jack is Back!]

Off to bed. Same cold but better. Mueller seems out of control and I hope Jeff Sessions can sleep at night. We are watching a coup de stat right under our noses. So much for the hallowedConstitution.

Slaap lekker, if you can. Tomorrow? Who cares anymore?

[Catsmeat]

Good heavens, catching up is hard. RG, I am so sorry about your mother and will pray for her and your family. Kev, you are so right that it's a good thing to know the first name of the person you are praying for. Doris! In its day, the name bespoke elegance and Attic restraint.

There's been an upsurge among the young chic to use old and I thought certainly discarded names of the past in naming their young, as I know several Henrys, Neds, Millies, Hazels and the like (these are all people under four years old--their parents are English graduate students). When the namers get to Mildred and Gertrude, well, then, there we will be! I have a fondness for the minions' names: Dave, Stuart, Phil, Jerry, Carl (in other words, likely names of electricians ten years older than me--and I like such people).

[Janet 🚬]

from October -

Gay coffee shop owner kicks Christians out of cafe, goes on vulgar rant — it was all caught on video

http://www.theblaze.com/news/2017/10/07/gay-coffee-shop-owner-kicks-christians-out-of-cafe-goes-on-vulgar-rant-it-was-all-caught-on-video

[henry]

"The subpoena concerns people or entities close to Mr Trump."

Hillary was close, but no cigar, in the election.

[Dave (in MA)]

Is this pretty how it went today?

Reuters: Mueller subpoenas Trump bank records
Bloomberg: Mueller subpoenas Trump bank records
Sarah: Nope
WSJ: Yup
WSJ: Well, sort of

[Captain Hate]

Maybe I spoke too soon...

[narcisoyea]

If you started subpoenaing Deutsche bank, for dodgy transaction 1) the Chinese would likely object 2) you would be there till Easter 3) the bank might tipple over like Guam.

[Miss Marple the Deplorable]

I am heading to bed early,

I an running errands tomorrow with my sister as driver. Therefore, I need to go to bed early so I can do links and then get ready.

Nytol!

[jimmyk]

I don't really follow Savage, so I don't know what's behind his thinking on the embassy move. As far as I know, the only argument against it is that it will make the Palis mad. But it's not like they aren't mad all the time anyway, so I don't get it.

I suppose the move could be held over them as a threat, in order to extract some kind of concession, but they have zero credibility for keeping any kind of promise.

[Skoot]

"Jimmy, you got it just right."

Concur. I read the petitioners brief this afternoon and that's essentially the argument. The cake is not typical "goods and services." It stands apart. They're going to win. Trump/Gorsuch court will get it right.

Breaking: Federal gun charges for Garcia-Zarate

[narcisoyea]

When you've lost sasse:
https://mobile.twitter.com/dcexaminer/status/938217951995531264

Well you wonder why you bothered.

[-peter]

I'm with boatbuilder. Hear hear.

[Captain Hate]

Is there something they can charge Garcia-Zarate's attorney with?

[narcisoyea]

Being an ass hat in public, maybe he could hated a heart to heart with Jamiel Shaw.

[Clarice Feldman]

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/gop-preps-contempt-resolution-for-top-fbi-doj-officials-after-missed-monday-deadline/article/2642550