Comedy is Not Pretty

For anyone who has been laughing too much today this NY Times analysis of political comedy by Jason Zinoman should bring the clouds right back into your life. Why, he wonders, is political comedy not moving the needle of public opinion?

At the Rally to Restore Sanity in 2010, Jon Stewart delivered a funny political speech to a crowd of his fans on the mall in Washington, D.C. He praised reasonableness, compromise and the virtue of working together with our opponents. Insanity however proved resilient. Last month, he told an audience that it was an error to mistake cultural power for real power, adding: “I, being a part of that machine and mechanism, do feel oddly culpable.”

For Mr. Stewart, who more than anyone elevated the political stature of the late-night talk show, to make such a concession is jarring. But it fits the mood right now, one defined not by the army of his television successors but by the Australian stand-up Hannah Gadsby. Her ferocious special “Nanette” tapped into a growing cultural anxiety about the limits of comedy. She skewered the nature of jokes, arguing that because they inevitably lead to incomplete stories, they evade difficult truths.

And in the Age of Trump:

In the past year or so, there has been a backlash to the growing role of comedy, and as with nearly every cultural trend these days, Donald J. Trump has something to do with it. He became famous in part because of comedy institutions; he was a fixture on roasts, late-night talk shows and Howard Stern. But once he ran for president, comedians obsessed about him as much as cable-news hosts did. Despite the endless internet headlines trumpeting how this host eviscerated him or that comic destroyed Mr. Trump, none did. This clarified what comedy could accomplish.

On her new Netflix series, Michelle Wolf, a veteran of “The Daily Show,” brilliantly satirized the self-importance of current comedy, skewering the entire genre of righteous political humor that Mr. Stewart gave birth to, mocking its ineffectuality while breaking down the hack conventions of a bit that always ends with the same Trump insult. “Writing jokes is hard. It’s really hard,” she said. “You know what’s easier? An earnest plea.”

Where Ms. Gadsby suggests that jokes obscure a comedian’s ability to tell the full truth, Ms. Wolf argues that the imperative to go viral with a sincere insult has gotten in the way of being funny.

I love a mystery - what's going ? A suggested explanation - blame MeToo! (That is as close as he comes to making a joke but I think he is serious):

Then there were the many comedians accused of sexual misconduct. Their private behavior was often at odds with their public profile, and since audiences put more stock in the authenticity of a comic’s constructed stage persona than, say, a fictional character in a play, attitudes toward comedy grew darker.

OK, blaming MeToo is bold, so points for that. 

And on to the deeper 'explanation', or at least the start:

But the best way to understand this new skepticism about comedy is as a corrective to the wildly romantic and expansive view that has been ascendant for decades but is, historically, an anomaly. A dominant theory of jokes for most of Western civilization, superiority theory, as it’s now called in academia, rests on the idea that laughter has an abusive core, that ridiculing something else makes us feel better about ourselves. This is why Aristotle wondered if certain kinds of jokes (or “jesting” as he called it) should be banned.

But starting perhaps with Norman Cousins’s 1979 memoir, “Anatomy of an Illness as Perceived by a Patient,” which described how a steady diet of the Marx Brothers and “Candid Camera” helped cure himself of a possibly fatal disease, a new optimism about humor emerged. Studies about the benefits of comedy proliferated. You can find articles claiming laughter lowers your blood pressure, reduces stress and anxiety, burns calories, boosts your immune system and even diminishes your chance of heart disease and dementia.

I know that I am just a troglodyte knuckle-dragging old white guy but I am not seeing a contradiction between lower blood pressure and reduced stress on the one hand and feeling better about yourself on the other. Nor would it occur to me that most of the late-night assaults on Republicans are about something other than inducing a feeling of superiority in the audience. C'mon, the Desolation of Smug has been a liberal shouting point for a while. And yes, its funny to think that comics, some of who once prided themselves on being transgressive, might now simply be functioning as outriders for the PC Police. 

Well. Might it be that two decades of comedy with a 'conservatives suck' punchline still amuses the choir (and helps keep them in line, as do the Twitter mobs) but no longer changes minds? Unexplored territory! Although to be fair, Mr. Zinoman does link to Michele Wolf (Yes, of White House Correspondents Dinner infamy) and her bit about the stale, formulaic Trump-bashing that is the life blood of late night comedy. She won't get there but right now it is conservatism that's transgressive.

Comments

[narciso]

Shirley he can't be serious. Stewart practiced sycophancy in parallel perhaps in the times of the egyptians.

[----peter]

Can I really be second when I haven't been able to keep up for weeks? This is a sign from heaven.

[narciso]

Plant the flag Peter, dos deus vein

[Waffle Tom]

Nice post. Did you find the pony underneath?

[henry]

That isn't funny.

[narciso]

Of course he did:

https://babalublog.com/2018/07/27/surprise-in-addition-to-kissing-king-rauls-derriere-and-enabling-iranian-a-bomb-production-obama-funded-a-terrorist-group-with-links-to-al-qaeda/

Carrying over from the last thread, there was an election in 58, the idiots on the 7th floor deemed Andres after I insufficiently authentic so Fidel was enabled.

[lyle]

Comedy relies on elements of absurdity, irony, parody, satire, juxtaposition, timing, and cultural relevance in varying degrees. All these elements are in turn dead or dying due entirely to the [redacted] humorless Marxist left. Thanks, progtards.

[maryrose]

Seinfeld, the Marx Bros,, Richard Pryor,early Eddie Murphy and Chris Rock were funny.
Gene Wilder also as well Bob Hope, Jonathan Winters and Steve Martin.
Martin Short honorable mention.

[narciso]

It's not merely dead, it's gone zombie, I've seem the progression of yentas like behar and what's the appropriate parallel for Maher go from yuck tucks to idiots on the public stage.

[lyle]

Great point, narc. I am happy to be corrected.

[Rocco]

Thanks again maryrose, Ralph L and deb. I'm glad you're back deb.

[GUS]

Stalin wasn't really into comedy.
Liebowitz/Stewart isn't funny, he's angry.
Why are these FULL COMMIES so angry???
No control. Their ideology is comedy.

[lyle]

I’m a little, no—a lot behind—Rocco but if congrats are being extended for something good happening in your life, then please accept mine as well.

[clarice feldman]

These people are formulaic, not very smart and certainly not funny. Groucho Marx was smart. Stewart, Maher--not really.

[narciso]

Carrying over from the last thread:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/politics/1979/08/08/thatcher-heeded-advice-on-africa/e4241b35-c17c-4f9d-80cc-3eb0895459db/?utm_term=.1d4d2b4471d8

Yes it's like that trek episode with Melvin
Helli and the childten

[narciso]

An althouse thread about George Carlin, reminded me of this great Irish comedian the late David Allen, which they used to broadcast late on public tv in the 80s. He fired all the barrels and his sketches were irreverent, in other words he is just too crime think for today's triffids

[DebinGA]

Thanks, Rocco.

[clarice feldman]

Wow--FBI collaborating with the discredited SPLC:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UghQoQhan2M

[narciso]

This was perhaps some of his lightest material:

https://youtu.be/BkLehNtJCQw

[narciso]

Comedy that isn't funny, it's just scream therapy and a cry for help.

[narciso]

Oh good grief the odious John Martin is vouching for Eisenstein, from one big on to another.

[Jim Eagle]

Political comedy? Two words: Mort Sahl

He could read a sentance out of the NY Times, and just his tone would make it hilarious. I think he was the first non-profane, critical political comedian. Back then, Steve Allen, Joey Bishop, Jack Paar, and Johnny Carson were considered wits. Allen especially with his man-on-the-street schtik. He gave us Don Knotts, Tom Poston, Bill Dana, and Louis Nye.

Their cultural appropriation, such as Dana's "My Name is Jose Jiminez", today would flounder on the rocks of PC and micro-agressoion. Poston not remembering his name would cause outrage among mental illness activists.

It wasn't until the Vietnam War, IIRC, where the left demanded Nixon, and his tribe be made fun of, birthing political comedy as we know it today. I think that was the timeline but could be wrong.

[narciso]

No that's about right, laugh in was the lead the smothers brothers were the chaser:

[narciso]

And their point is:

https://reason.com/blog/2018/07/26/amazon-facial-recognition-confuses-membe

[rich]

>>>A dominant theory of jokes for most of Western civilization, superiority theory, as it’s now called in academia, rests on the idea that laughter has an abusive core, that ridiculing something else makes us feel better about ourselves.<<<

Fox Butterfield is that you?

reading this i thought about the ST:TNG episode, "The Outrageous Okona" ... part of the episode had Data exploring comedy ...

[rich]

Anne Applebaum / Washington Post:
Maria Butina is just the tip of the Russia iceberg

and so it goes ...

[clarice feldman]

https://www.breitbart.com/tech/2018/07/27/delingpole-silicon-valley-is-killing-free-speech-only-one-man-can-save-us-now/

[narciso]

The littlest sparrow, she was following the Zoe Barnes career track.

Even out man in Havana, wears out as a miniseries,

[Catsmeat]

Thanks, MM, for the Parrish link--I love his landscapes!

I've studied comic theory for many years--but I prefer to work on the idea of comedy as a genre in terms of plots with happy endings (which don't have to be full of hoo-haws). Almost certainly most laughter comes from acknowledging painful things but safely through mockery/comic distance. And though Freud is wrong about so much, I think he's on to something what he argues that to know what someone means by a joke, just read it straight.

[Beasts of England]

Our AA ball club is returning after a few seasons in Mobile and they've announced the ten finalists for their new name. Fer realzies...

Army Ants
Comet Jockeys
GloWorms
Lunartics
Moon Possums
Puffy Head Bird Legs
Space Chimps
Space Sloths
ThunderSharks
Trash Pandas

I only have one favorite to the point I'd buy a ball cap - a nickname for raccoons. :)

[rich]

and congratulations Rocco! a wonderful achievement for your son.

[clarice feldman]

Butina's arrest is the Mueller final pratfall..Read here all about the undercover "spy":http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/ct-maria-butina-american-university-20180725-story.html

[rich]

Posted by: Beasts of England | July 28, 2018 at 01:05 PM

the Trash Pandas ... ha ... a marketing opportunity for Rocket, but since Disney fired Gunn-who knows ...

kinda like Space Sloths ...

[narciso]

Moon Possom, See there's acres of material here, but there are just too blind to see it.

[anonamom]

I think alienation of affection suits are ridiculous. People don't OWN each other . Most states have recognized that and canned this nonsense.

Posted by: clarice feldman

Attorney Feldman has obviously never witnessed what I have seen with my own eyes in the Recovery Room, when one of my (married) male partners walked in. They didn't realize I was crouched behind the computer back by the isolation room/ OMG! Can those gals (RNs) turn it on when they want to!

[Rocco]

"More enduringly than any other sport, wrestling teaches self-control and pride. Some have wrestled without great skill—none have wrestled without pride." ~ Dan Gable

This guy is tough, love him! Here's Jim Jordan wrestling the Olympic Gold Metal winner, Randy Lewis. He was 0-6 lifetime against The Great One but he's gone the distance with the best. He's a winner in my book. later

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5LmEP6C8ZHE

[anonamom]

PD in Detorit--for you. KK, you'll like it too.

https://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2016/09/26/nutritional-ketosis-benefits.aspx

[Gonna get Wurster]

The fire jumped the Sacramento River, as massive fires will do. And then there was the fire tornado. We are losing entire cities now and our president* and his party see as one of their primary goals the opening of public lands in order to extract more carbon-based fuels. If this makes sense to you, check your mailbox. There should be a check in there from some coal company.

[clarice feldman]

If you've been considering a thermomix , there's a short term double promotion going on now --zero percent financing and an Italian cookbook, pizza board, utensils until August 6 at 11:509 PST. Contact me if you have any interest or questions.

[Miss Marple]

Back from the laundromat. We washed the clothes and then boriught them home to dry in our dryer.

It's been so long sicne I have been to a laundromat that the last time I went the dryers were 10 cents for 10 minutes. LOL!

Quite an interesting mix of people - young singles, families with kids, retirees. Lots of cultures and races.

And guess what: everyone getting along nicely, helping each other out.

[Jack is Back!]

As soon as my Gumbo Filé comes in, I am making andouille sausage, chicken and shrimp Gumbo. Does the Thermomix do Jambalaya, Gumbo, Etouffee , and Crawfish Pie?

[anonamom]

My cousins who have cottages use the laundromat in town when they are at the lake. Keepin' it real!

I'm in a house up there with a 40+ year old washer in the basement.
I ask my deceased former owner to keep it going for another season every time I use it!

My washer here is 36 years old. Way to build them Maytag!

[Miss Marple]

pic.twitter.com/E3xvdUGZqa

— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) July 28, 2018

Presidential Weekly Address in support of ICE. Video at link.

[Miss Marple]

https://www.foxbusiness.com/small-business/single-mother-goes-from-homeless-to-ceo-of-construction-company

We need more stories like this to encourage people.

[Glibertarian]

The Left has failed, Globally, to elicit the support of the Working Class. They haven’t connected the Dots for the people they putatively champion.

They see the Pillaging Rapists of conservative ilk as their advocates and such could not be further from the Truth. Progressives continue to give themselves the hot foot because their elite showmanship takes center stage. Above all they wish to be seen as intellectuals..the bane of working people.

[Jack is Back!]

If you go to MM's 1:34 Trump tweet, and read the first few comments, you will see what a Russian-bot looks like.

[Miss Marple]

https://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2018/07/nevertrump_bret_stephens_warns_dems_to_not_lose_their_marbles_in_2020.html

[Miss Marple]

Jack,

I never read the comments onhis teets. I am convinced they have programs to generate those comments, and furthermore, Twitter is complicit in it.

[Rocco]

These are a bit pricey but they're supposed to last 25 years...24 to go.

https://www.consumerreports.org/cro/washingmachines/speed-queen-washers-built-to-last

[Miss Marple]

https://twitter.com/ThomasWictor/status/1014026308295188482

Wictor found a very old article in the New York Times in which they said that Donald Trump would be our best president. Thread has pull quotes from the article.

[clarice feldman]

JiB, it does a lot of those things--best, fastest pie pastry recipes and I found at least one etouffe with crawfish:https://www.recettesthermomix.fr/recette/crawfish-etouffee-ecrevisses-a-l-etouffee-au-thermomix/

[anonamom]

Boy, if somebody had told me even ten years ago that I would be interested in this...Guess we all need a hobby!

Campari would have been perfect, anonamom! Sorry I didn't see your suggestion until a few minutes ago. I added a little Pom for color, but... :)

Beasts, my husband told me about making a Manhattan, and using a Compari ice cube--so turning it into another drink as the ice cube melts!
Doesn't that sound FABULOUS!

The ice cube is half Compari, half water.
We are going to try it.

[Momto2]

Clarice's 1:06 - How many Russian spies would have a photo of a shirtless Putin on their cell phone case?

[clarice feldman]

Here's a gumbo recipe:https://www.recipecommunity.com.au/main-dishes-fish-recipes/spicy-seafood-gumbo/dchsx5hc-7678d-350897-cfcd2-uq2hgez2

[Miss Marple]

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1023088777194037249.html

unseen1 has an important lesson about the Left. THEY ARE NOT CAPITALISTS.

This is an important thread to understand why Twitter and Facebook do what they do.

[Beasts of England]

That's a great idea, anonamom!!

[GUS]

Beasts Oconomowocs' teams are the "Coons" or raccoons. Oconomowoc is known as 5-O'S or COONIE.

My Grandfather lived in Mobile mid-career.
Home of Hank Aaaron.

They should call the team THE 44'S.

Heard it here first.

[Miss Marple]

GUS,

In no time the press would say that the team was named in honor of Obama (44th president).

I say name them the Hanks.

[Miss Marple]

https://nypost.com/2018/07/28/trumps-demise-has-been-greatly-exaggerated/?utm_source=twitter_sitebuttons&utm_medium=site%20buttons&utm_campaign=site%20buttons

[GUS]

Yes Miss M, or "the Hammers"

The Brewers rescued a dog at spring training a couples years ago, it's named HANK.

[Miss Marple]

https://www.dailycaller.com/2018/07/28/steve-bannon-rino-trump-agenda/

Bannon says we are going to have to suck it up and vote for RINOS and GOPe in order to protect Trump's agenda.

He's exactly right. If the creepy GOP candidates haven't been removed in the primaries, we have to go with them on the ticket in the fall. As long as we hold the majority in both houses, Trump's agenda will get a decent hearing and there will be no impeachment.

[GUS]

Miss M, it's easy for me. I've never been a REPUBLICAN. However I once was a Democrat, and I know that each and everyone of them is DISHONEST.

[clarice feldman]

Mom to 2, the dead give away was Butina's presence at the National Prayer breakfast.

[Frau Steingehirn]

Testing...

[clarice feldman]

JIB, Lots of jambalaya recipes--here's one:https://www.recipecommunity.com.au/main-dishes-others-recipes/creole-style-jambalaya/scpfpwwj-b474a-348269-beea0-tunal7vd

[Ralph L]

laugh in was the lead

LBJ in bed with several people: It is with a heavy heart...that I ask you...to remove your football from my pajamas.

That's all I remember from 7 y.o.

[Frau Steingehirn]

Perhaps a cleansing fireball will hit the Highland Hemorrhoid's hovel?

[Beasts of England]

This is some 4D chess for Tom R that never gets old... 🐘

https://youtu.be/j1_RzfIUVFs

[Jane]

I'm making ribs! And I make really good ribs - altho different every time cause I'm not good at following directions.

[Miss Marple]

https://www.foxbusiness.com/personal-finance/nfl-rookie-saquon-barkley-plans-to-save-entire-31m-contract

He will live off endorsement income and invest his NFL salary and bonuses.

Smart guy!

[Beasts of England]

Mmm, ribs! 😋

[GUS]

Frau the dude is mentally ill. Seriously. He's 70 years old and behaves like this.

[Comanche Voter]

So as a conservative i suck? So? Somehow I just can't bring myself to care a flying buffalo chip about what John Stewart et al think. And I'm being charitable when I say "think". Mainly they just spew--indeed I might have said 50 years ago, they just "blow chunks".

Wake me when they say something intelligent. Meantime I'll go take a nap.

[Jack is Back!]

Clarice,

I have all the old Creole and Cajun, and Coon-Ass recipes my mother and dad collected when they lived in N'olens while he was in flight training during WW2. I was surprised that your Gumbo recipe doesn't call for Filé, from the sassafras tree leaves? All the ones I have call for copious amounts of Gumbo Filé.

[Frau Steingehirn]

Test

[Miss Marple]

WWGOWGA Eph 5:11❌ replied
Jeb Bush
‏Verified account @JebBush
Jul 27

Today's news confirms that 4% growth isn't just aspirational, it's achievable through policies that unleash the power of the market. Credit to @POTUS's economic policies. To sustain this growth, we must pursue a free trade agenda and move to a merit-based immigration system.

========================

Well, well, well. I wonder what caused this change of heart.

[Jack is Back!]

jane,

Dry rubbed or wet?

[GUS]

Jack?????? A GENTLEMAN never asks a Lady that question.

[GUS]

Jane.....{{cause I'm not good at following directions.}}

That's one of the reasons we love you.

[Jim Eagle]

25 years ago on Oprah, Trump hasn't changed a bit.

https://tinyurl.com/h23qlax

[GUS]

Jack, his son Eric looks just like him. Ocassiolly-Chavez was being born about the time g this Oprah clip was made. She is witnessing THE biggest economic boom and TAX REVENUES in decades, yet her COMMIE PROFESSORS taught her the opposite.
Critical thinking skills, and Skepticism are the biggest keys to your children avoiding COMMIE GROUP THINK. Also the choices you make for your childs SCHOOLS as well. YAY COMMUNISM, where it's PUNCH AND PIE EVERY DAY!!! Mostly PUNCH.

[Beasts of England]

We see ya, Frau!! 😎

[Pinandpuller]

I think it was Olivier who told Hoffman,"Why don't you try being funny, my boy? It's ever so much easier."

[Captain Hate]

Today is national hamburger day, which I'll be grilling tonight.

Frau, did you see that I recommended The Night Circus as gratitude for The Luminaries?

[Captain Hate]

Bannon says we are going to have to suck it up and vote for RINOS and GOPe in order to protect Trump's agenda.

Like homeless people and lice, we'll never be free from RINOs.

[Pinandpuller]

GUS

It's only when you admit you are a democrat that you can seek treatment.

[GUS]

Capn, on the way back from Chicago, after the gig last night. We stopped at WHITE CASTLE.
Technically they are HAMBURGERS. There is a White Castle in Wisconsin at Kenosha. 77cents @.
My wedding anniversary, and I'm buying Mrs Gus White Castle sliders. But, I did give her my "autograph".

[Jim Eagle]

Like homeless people and lice, we'll never be free from RINOs.

CH,

And most of them are on the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence. All except for Tom Cotton. Why?

Because they are bought. and paid for by the Deep State, you know, the one that doesn't exist.

[Miss Marple]

GUS,

When I was in high school they opened a White Castle on my side of town. Before that (1965) all of the WC joints were in poor areas, but people would drive to their sites to get them.

The football players used to meet in their parkinglot and have contests to see who could eat the most! I used to be able to eat 6, but now I am down to 4 and that is pushing it..

[Pinandpuller]

Clarice

I am, of course, NAL. Are there laws out there that protect two parties to a contract from third party interference?

I mean, in baseball you aren't just automatically a free agent but that doesn't mean your team owns you.

[Jim Eagle]

GUS,

When I was at Cincy, I would frequent the WC on Victory Parkway. Closer to Xavier than Cincy but the closest one. I think I lived on them. Back then you could get a bag of 10 for $1.00. There is something about the taste of a WC that is damn close to addictive.

[clarice feldman]

JiB, then add it. I haven't made gumbo in years, but when I made it, I did add file.IIRC it is a thickener.

[clarice feldman]

Pin, I'm racing out for a while--there's a concept called tortious interference with contracts. Here's a quick primer:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tortious_interference

[Captain Hate]

Speaking of sliders, Earl Weaver used to tell sports writer Terry Pluto: "Hey Pluto, I love reading your articles on the crapper; they loosen me up" followed by manic laughter.

[GUS]

Lovely Miss M and Capn. Not to be overly emotional, but yesterday was one of the most wonderful days in my marriage in many years. My Sis in law, who I adore, texted Mrs G and I early in the morning touting our GOLDEN ANNIVERSARY (akin to the golden birthday thing) 27th anniversary on the 27th. The golden anniversary is 50 years. GOD WILLING. Anyway, it was a hectic day with business, my pick up in the shop, etc. I had a GIG, and my Mrs was being so so good about THAT on our ANNIVERSARY.
I bought her a very nice cranberry chicken salas for the drive TO ...Evanston Il, and the show.
Everything went like clockwork, and the night was sublime. So naturally, being hungry after dancing to the Smithereens, and having played guitar and having sung for our set, I was in need of something other than another IPA. We got out of the venue pretty quickly, and it's less than an hour to Kenosha. Stopped for gas, and ...OH LOOK HONEY!! A White Castle next door. I ordered 7 age old traditional White Castle sliders. On I-94 20 MINUTES later, wifey asks it I'd like the LAST ONE!!!
She ate 3 as fast as I did. GREAT EVENING.

[Abadman]

White Castle and Cincy

Do you remember Cincy Little Kings?

Think it came in 8, 7oz bottles

Good cream ale, wonder if it's still around

Genesee cream ale was also tasty when in upstate NY

[Captain Hate]

Congrats, Gus. Mrs. H has a lifelong craving for McD's regular hamburgers. I can't explain it.

Abadman, lots of Beer Advocate sots still drink Genny cream ale. I haven't for a while but they used to be a staple.

[Buford Gooch]

https://www.upi.com/Health_News/2018/07/26/Researchers-find-way-to-unblock-aging-brain-vessels-improve-memory/6951532609990/?utm_source=sec&utm_campaign=sl&utm_medium=12

[Buford Gooch]

Dammit! Wrong link.

https://www.beermenus.com/beers/6864-little-kings-cream-ale

[GUS]

I remember the LITTLE KINGS.
We also had.....WARM BLATZ SHORTIES up here.

Capn, Earl Weaver was quintessential OLD SCHOOL.

I think Lou Pinella copied Earl's act.

With the PATHETIC MLB REPLAY CRAP, thenre is nearly ZERO, Manager histrionics. Ralph Houk, Billy Martin, Earl Weaver, Sparky Anderson, Harvey Kuehn, on and on and on. And the tobacco juice flying... Don Zimmer.......