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December 23, 2018

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Tom Bowler

Good morning!

Account Deleted

President Trump isn't alone. I stand with him.

Tom Bowler

Great Pieces, Clarice! It's been so rare for anyone to mention, or even notice, the pervasive, all encompassing, 24/7 media assault on conservative America, never mind to describe it so well! Excellent job!

sbwaters

Doesn’t it always happen? I responded to MM on the previous thread and, as a courtesy, won’t duplicate.

Alison

Posted a pro Jordan Peterson comment to previous thread and Typepad ate it. Grrr...

sbwaters

TK: He unfortunately wasn't allowed to be an egghead this go around and has bee permanently banned from our side. I guess

Thank you for your excellent google-foo, TK.

Peterson was eggheadish insofar as he assumed both sides were playing by the same rules. Nah-uh.

For the left, dignity is a weapon to use on others; certainly not anything you apply to oneself. He also misunderstands that for the left, compromise is surrender.

If he honestly believed Kavanaugh would retain his dignity by resigning, or that true compromise was possible, he misunderstands Washington politics, and, on this subject, deserves to be ignored.

Thank you, TK, for substantiating my recollection.

clarice

I imagine the NYT has dozens of people close to Trump insiders, don't you? Speaking of media nonsense, here's a long but amusing Lileks piece linked by Insty about a Guardian article on Olive Garden:http://web.archive.org/web/20030416020456/http:/www.lileks.com/writings/screed/olivegarden.html

This is the kind of crap that feeds anti-American feelings in Europe and it's all pervasive. When German friends who regularly visit the US try to explain the bias to their German friends it falls on rather deaf ears. I remember when they invited a couple over to visit here with them and laughed when they were astonished to see how beautiful the US was,, how good the food, and how cultured it can be (Sarasota) with opera,, symphonies, bookstores, They think we all eat our meals at McDonalds and sit around watching crap on TV and applauding rambo.

MissMarple2

Alison, and others who have had typepad eat links:

I accidentally discovered that if I type in a comment along with the link, typepad will take it. All you have to put in is something like "I agree with this" or "Here is something interesting."

There are several blog sites that typepad doesn't like. Because I do so many links, I one day posted one with a comment and after I hit "post" I thought "Oh, nuts, that site won't show up." But it did!

So, if you are linking to a site which you are unsure about, try my trick and see if it works.

Account Deleted

Globalist journalism. Leftist American journalists believe Leftist European journalists who believe Leftist American journalists .....

Quoting each other to "prove" points.

Poison, poison, poison,....

Narciso79

Morning all, I defer in part with the general criticism of counterinsurgency it comes from galulas insights he gleaned from fighting in Algeria, then as now the political will to win as demonstrated by degaulle outstripped the resources the French had to offer.

MissMarple2

sbwaters,

It is helpful to remember that Peterson is a Canadian who teaches at the University of Toronto. I imagine he is sadder but wiser about American politics after being attacked for some innocuous comment he made.

With US politics, Peterson hasn't lived through 20 years of this leftist attack politics the way we have. I still believe his pushing young people to understand the satisfaction from being personally responsible, telling the truth, and taking care of family members is very valuable.

One of the things I found most interesting was his discussion of why people in gangs behave the way they do is that they have a "be in the now" mentality in which they don't see a future. Therefore, they try to grab everything they can (by illegal means) and behave with little concern for their own safety or survival. This is why they are so dangerous and one of his motivations in trying to change that type of thinking.

This is also why I mentioned yesterday that you cannot depend on these types of kids to become self-motivated. Sure, a very few will, but the majority, without intervention, will siply careen through society causing all sorts of harm until they either end up dead or in prison.

MissMarple2

A word from @ReaganWorld who saw his father keep HIS end of the deal and the Dems betraying the deal. @realDonaldTrump is doing the right thing by holding firm and not getting sucker-punched. #standfirm https://t.co/9Q1Hza2MDk

— Gov. Mike Huckabee (@GovMikeHuckabee) December 20, 2018

Link goes to a tweet by Michael Reagan.

MissMarple2

Hey, sbw! Thanks for re-tweeting this! Ari Fleischer has really been a good defender of many of the President's policies:


Ari Fleischer
‏Verified account @AriFleischer

If Ds think a wall is racist, wasteful and won’t make us safer, what do they want to do with existing walls? Do they support tearing down the wall between Tijuana and San Diego? The problem is the Ds won’t compromise. Walls were fine - until Trump wanted one.

MissMarple2


Senator John Cornyn
‏Verified account @JohnCornyn
8m8 minutes ago

“If you want to open the government, you must abandon the wall,” Schumer said on the Senate floor yesterday. I know POTUS said he would own it originally, but now this is looking like Schumer/Pelosi own it by refusing to negotiate in good faith. I think they actually like it.

MissMarple2


Donald J. Trump
‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump
28m28 minutes ago

The only way to stop drugs, gangs, human trafficking, criminal elements and much else from coming into our Country is with a Wall or Barrier. Drones and all of the rest are wonderful and lots of fun, but it is only a good old fashioned Wall that works!

sbwaters

you cannot depend on these types of kids to become self-motivated.

They need to have enough tomorrows under their belt that consequences begin to matter.

Mrs. sbw deals daily with children of lost parents, trying to save them from the same fate. She reminds them they are responsible for making their own good choices, not anyone else.

Jack is Back (Again)!

This is the view we had last night from our upper terrace as dusk was breaking and a full moon was rising out of the sea horizon.

The iPhone doesn't develop the deep orange-red color that was present.

MissMarple2

Mick Mulvaney goes inside border wall negotiations and a timeline for agreement, says the ball is in Democrats' court https://t.co/dyXzzEFTNO @FoxNews #AAG

— All American Girl (@AIIAmericanGirI) December 23, 2018

Link goes to a 13-minute interview with Mulvaney on Fox News Sunday.

He is excellent at articulating the Presient's policies and is willing to push back, which is good.

Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki

The biggest problem with Petraeus's COIN theory is why it is so celebrated; the idea it can or should be employed equally everywhere.
It forgets the first rule of war = win.
The definition of winning almost everywhere in the ME and in other countries who have learned from the ME and especially those with no history of legitimate government, is to blow them to smithereens and leave them to their fate. If they act up again you make rubble upon the previous rubble.
You cannot COIN certain cultures and therefore you cannot defeat certain cultures if we define victory as leaving behind us a stable, friendly country.
If you have to spend ten, fifteen, twenty or more years standing on the throat of the locals, you are not waging war but building an empire. And, because of our halfwitted scruples, an empire we don't get the advantage of exploiting in return for our blood and treasure keeping the local assbites from killing each other.

Jack is Back (Again)!

Then this morning having breakfast on the terrace, we watched Space X send up a Falcon 6 GPS satellite out of LP 40 at Cape Canaveral.

https://www.kennedyspacecenter.com/launches-and-events/events-calendar/2018/december/rocket-launch-spacex-gps-iii

Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki

--They think we all eat our meals at McDonalds and sit around watching crap on TV and applauding rambo.--

Stupid Eurotrash...it's BurgerKing/Taco Bell, crap on the internet and John Wayne.

Another Bob

“on this subject, deserves to be ignored”

Thanks sbw, was going to post similar for TK.

Peterson ventured too far out of his lane there.

sbwaters

Nice pic, JiB. Mrs. sbw and I enjoyed these:

IMG-7572

and

IMG-7574

Catsmeat

Hey, narciso, what did you find particularly wrong with the new Mary Poppins? To my mind, it altered and sweetened the books no more than the original did--though adding in some vague Christianizing (not in keeping with P. L. Travers's sympathies, which were Buddhist if anything)...I do get very tired of expecting children to be satisfied with the explanation of death which says, effectively, "she's still in our memories...that will have to do"--after all, the script posits as a puzzle about the dead mom, "where did she go"? I kept thinking she was caught in the Royal Doulton bowl, but, nope, she was really dead after all.

CH, you made me laugh about Gibbon. Maybe George III was right: "Always scribble, scribble, scribble, eh, Mr. Gibbon?" I've never tried to read any of it, so I applaud you!

sbwaters

And, yeah, that is ice on the lake. But the temperature was tolerable w/coat and blanket.

Celebrating as was mentioned here before, the days getting longer as we approach Spring.

Threadkiller

I fully agree that Peterson should be ignored on this subject.

What SBW said yesterday was that he was interested in Peterson until Peterson "jumped the shark" on what turned out to be this one subject.

My comment afterwards was of the "baby and the bathwater" variety. At the time Peterson tweeted his stupid theory I was taken aback by how many people kicked him to the curb.

sbwaters

Because of your reference , TK, I am willing to kick him back.

I suspect, by kneejerk reaction, I visioned him in a turtleneck saying “billions and billions”.

Captain Hate

Thank you, Catsmeat. In addition to his narrative style, he also illustrates the perils of the autodidact taking a deep dive in uncharted territory in which his default mode is prior concepts being reinforced.

Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki

Funny reference, SB. :)

Alison

I am very impressed by Peterson. I forgive him for the Kavanaugh comments. He's not a politician, he's a clinical psychologist and impressive intellectual (to me). His book 12 Rules for Life is really helping people.

I love his videos on his Youtube channel and his interviews with the media and with like-minded podcasters. He is fighting the good fight against the radical left and their political correctness, identity politics, cultural Marxism and their push for equality of outcome.

If you rejected him over the Kavanaugh comments, please give him another chance. :-)

boatbuilder

That Thales/Declination opinion that Hoyden linked to is about as good a response to the foolishness of Jordan Peterson (who I otherwise admire and respect) on the Kavanaugh nomination as any I can come up with. (And I remain unmoved by Peterson's long explanation, which only doubles down on the idea that somehow the left can ultimately be persuaded by truth or nobility or sacrifice. They don't care.)

Maybe Peterson has been willing to take on the lefties in his own realm in part because he really doesn't understand just how much they hate him. Seems odd that he is all about facing truth but he is strangely naive about political truth.

MissMarple2

For all of us who love the old tales:

https://freebeacon.com/culture/home-for-christmas/

Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki

That Lileks column clarice linked was entertaining and spot on.
Euromeatheads keep coming over here and whining that Americans don't think Europe is all that important anymore.
In typical meathead fashion they think their whining demonstrates our provincialism when in fact it illustrates their decline into mere provincehood and self inflicted irrelevancy.
They'll never have the honesty or even self awareness to just admit their biggest concern is they may at some point become so irritating and small that we won't come bail their bacon out of another one of the savage, internecine bloodbaths they come down from their cultured, ancient, haughty perches to perpetrate on each other occasionally or we'll refuse to save them from the self inflicted dhimmihood and Russian dominance their "migrant" lunacy and demographic freefall are inevitably leading to.

Eurotrash of the world unite! Or don't. Nobody else really cares anymore.

Tom R

The revisionism criticizing Petraeus and COIN is disappointing. COIN was the foundation for Petraeus’s Surge strategy in Iraq. It worked and was the reason the Iraqi insurgency was defeated. It was working so well that I assume it’s the main reason Obama intentionally lost the peace and withdrew US troops out of Iraq.

One of the key tenets of COIN is that you can’t win the war against an insurgency until you win the hearts and minds of the civilians. That should be fairly obvious and non-debatable. How you go about winning the hearts and minds is obviously different for each country/culture where the insurgency is occuring.

MissMarple2

And because I happened to follow the link on the previous article:


The Oxen
By Thomas Hardy

Christmas Eve, and twelve of the clock.
“Now they are all on their knees,”
An elder said as we sat in a flock
By the embers in hearthside ease.

We pictured the meek mild creatures where
They dwelt in their strawy pen,
Nor did it occur to one of us there
To doubt they were kneeling then.

So fair a fancy few would weave
In these years! Yet, I feel,
If someone said on Christmas Eve,
“Come; see the oxen kneel,

“In the lonely barton by yonder coomb
Our childhood used to know,”
I should go with him in the gloom,
Hoping it might be so.

Source: 1915

Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki

That Lileks column was also from 2003 but if anything is more relevant now.

Threadkiller

SBW, :-)

boatbuilder

Hey, Alison--welcome aboard. I wrote my comment without seeing yours. I didn't know much about Peterson at all until the Kavanaugh thing, which ticked me off. But he is impressive. Keep commenting.

pagar

The officer that had it right about Jihad and yet saw it all pulled from US documents was:

https://www.cnsnews.com/blog/michael-w-chapman/fmr-delta-force-commander-gen-boykin-sharia-means-destruction-us-constitution

Threadkiller

(And I remain unmoved by Peterson's long explanation, which only doubles down on the idea that somehow the left can ultimately be persuaded by truth or nobility or sacrifice. They don't care.)

Yep.

Winning hearts and minds isn't so easy..

Tom R

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/foreign-company-in-possibly-mueller-related-secret-case-heads-to-supreme-court

Any guesses on the company and what country they are from?

My guess is Uranium One and Russia.

Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki

--The revisionism criticizing Petraeus and COIN is disappointing.--

Who says it's revisionism?
Many people have said from the outset there are no nations to build there. If we have to establish a permanent occupying US force to maintain some semblance of order in the nations we have built then we can infer two principles;
1. We have not built a nation, and;
2. Even a country as rich as the US will soon be bankrupt occupying every backwater that some administration happens to spy a "vital" national interest in kicking around and occupying.

There are exceptions like South Korea, but there are a couple of noted differences;
1. It's not full of Arab tribes;
2. There is a noted lack of the poison of Islam, and;
3. They don't have an obsessive, murderous compulsion to wipe out the only actually free country in the region.

Account Deleted

~"ARE YOU NOW OR HAVE YOU EVER BEEN A MEMBER OF THE KNIGHTS OF COLUMBUS?"~

" ...anti-Catholic bigotry is coming back in the guise of progressivism.
It is hard to overemphasize how mainstream the Knights of Columbus are. Yet these Democratic senators — including Kamala Harris, who is believed to be planning a run for US president in 2020 — are demonizing the K of C for — brace yourselves — endorsing what the Catholic Church teaches."....

https://www.theamericanconservative.com/dreher/democrats-knights-of-columbus/

This bit gets me - "In written questions sent to Buescher by committee members Dec. 5, Sen. Hirono stated that “the Knights of Columbus has taken a number of extreme positions. For example, it was reportedly one of the top contributors to California’s Proposition 8 campaign to ban same-sex marriage.”"

Extreme position??...Proposition 8 WON in California. The people of California voted NO on redefining marriage. All across America, Americans voted NO on redefining marriage. State after state after state after state after state ....
The will of 'We The People' was undone by the courts & Democrat state Attorney Generals that wouldn't defend the laws of their states.

hoyden

MM, "...until they either end up dead or in prison."

If they make it to prison it'll likely be their first encounter with personal responsibility.

Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki

I love Janet's comments.

Tom R

Slight correction to my 11:05. Uranium One is now owned by Rosatom. Which is a Russia state owned company.

Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki

We're probably far past the point of this, but if we are going to keep the abomination of the idea of a Special Counsel around would it be too much to ask for it to only be invoked for a specific and narrowly defined purpose?
I suppose neither side at this point wants to give up the idea of revenge for the last SC by sending the next one forth with an unlimited, perpetual hunting license but doing so is wrong and destructive in almost every instance and in every way.

clarice

Who doesn't love Janet? OTOH if she calls pretend you are ill or she'll enlist you in a hundred do good projects, (Smooches, Janet, the heart of JOM)

Tom R

Iggy @ 11:07

Winning a Counterinsurgency war and nation building after the war are two completely separate things. The latter is always harder than the former. When nation building fails, it’s not fair to blame the strategy that won the war for losing the peace.

hoyden

Via Twitchy, "U.S. Ambassador to Germany Richard Grenell called out Der Spiegel on its fake news"

https://twitter.com/RichardGrenell/status/1076258972783525891/photo/1

https://twitchy.com/brettt-3136/2018/12/22/ambassador-richard-grenell-is-calling-out-der-spiegel-for-its-anti-american-bias-fake-news/

Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki

--The will of 'We The People' was undone by the courts & Democrat state Attorney Generals that wouldn't defend the laws of their states.--

And our great, retired, national-secular-preacher-man the right honorable Antony Kennedy who bespied a "dignity" clause in the Constitution, hitherto obscured by the dense foliage of tropical penumbra and emanations.

jimmyk

CH, I’ve never read Gibbon, but I happen to be reading Mark Heather’s Fall of the Roman Empire. I’m only halfway through, and I’m probably oversimplifying, but it seems the pivotal event was when the Romans allowed thousands of Goth refugees (fleeing the Huns from the north) to enter by crossing the Danube. Those refugees revolted in the wake of food shortages, were joined by more Goths who spilled in, defeated the Roman forces and killed the eastern emperor Valens. Seems like border control is important.

Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki

We won the war to the extent we need to when we destroyed Iraq's military and Saddam's regime.
We were forced to fight a COIN and try to build the mess into a nation because absent Saddam, who was a horrific tyrant but a bottled up one, our true and truly dangerous enemy in the region Iran, would then have been unleashed.
If your strategy and objective are wrong, as ours were, then your tactics and the expense of blood and treasure will always be foolish and unsuccessful.
We have three vital interests in the ME; keeping the oil flowing, protecting our ally Israel and destroying our enemy Iran, none of which were served by crushing Saddam.
.

jimmyk

Ditto on Janet’s posts. She always manages to cut right to the heart of the matter.

And another great Pieces by Clarice. We are privileged here at JOM.

Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki

If only Caesar had compelled the Goths to pay for a beautiful wall.
jimmy, recent scholarship tends to the view it was Sheckius Commode-us who successfully thwarted Caesar's building plans.

hoyden

Is it fake or is it Der Spiegel?

Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki

Today's Pieces was especially cogent.

MissMarple2

👏This guy decided to play along with an 'Internet scammer'. He couldn't have predicted where it would lead him pic.twitter.com/Z1FBaiaVvO

— Larry Kim (@larrykim) December 22, 2018

Link goes to a 4 1/2 minute video, which is both interesting and inspiring.

Tom R

Iggy @ 11:33

So what is your point? The topic was the criticism of Petraeus COIN doctrine. IMO criticizing it now 12+ years after the fact as a failure is revisionism.

Petraeus was given the mission to defeat the insurgency. He developed his COIN doctrine and used it to successfully complete the mission. BTW keep in mind Senator Obama at the time said it wouldn’t work. It did and it worked quite well to the point Petraeus was called a war hero, military genius, etc

All the points you made about whether we should have removed Saddam in the first place, the challenges of nation building, etc have absolutely nothing to do with Petraeus COIN doctrine. All the problems you listed were created by politicians and diplomats.

MissMarple2


Mary Hager
‏Verified account @hagerhoo

breaking: @FaceTheNation: @CBSDavidMartin has confirmed from a senior administration official that @RealDonaldTrump is expected to order Sec of Defense Mattis to leave the job immediately and will appoint Dep Sec Patrick Shanahan as Acting Sec of Defense @CBSNews
===========================
I have no idea if this is true or if it is CBS trying to stir things up.

MissMarple2

An appropriate meme from Twitter to illustrate Clircie's Pieces this morning:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DvERHoLU8AED96I.jpg

MissMarple2

Here's the answer:


Donald J. Trump
‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump
11m11 minutes ago

I am pleased to announce that our very talented Deputy Secretary of Defense, Patrick Shanahan, will assume the title of Acting Secretary of Defense starting January 1, 2019. Patrick has a long list of accomplishments while serving as Deputy, & previously Boeing. He will be great!

jimmyk

Well, iggy, we see that those wild Scots didn't manage to bring the empire down, thanks to Hadrian.

MissMarple2

A turds view of Washington DC, right now 👇 pic.twitter.com/F25tpns8KF

— Catturd (@catturd2) December 23, 2018

Heh. Go to the link to view the photo. I would say Catturd has the same view of Washington as most of us do.

Buckeye

They think we all eat our meals at McDonalds and sit around watching crap on TV and applauding rambo.

I was all prepared to poke fun, but I see Iggy did it far better than I could:)

Account Deleted

Tom R: was COIN deployed in the AFG theater as well? -Kev

Account Deleted

Will Shanahan have to recuse himself? :D

MissMarple2


Donald J. Trump
‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump
7m7 minutes ago

I just had a long and productive call with President @RT_Erdogan of Turkey. We discussed ISIS, our mutual involvement in Syria, & the slow & highly coordinated pullout of U.S. troops from the area. After many years they are coming home. We also discussed heavily expanded Trade.

Narciso79

Like I say, Petraeus developed it from galula who had some success in certain portions of Algeria though not Algiers proper, could ot have succeeded if degaulle had thr will possibly its distinguished from auseresses who was another junior officer who ended up training a generation in south America, who had a more brusque style this was the model followed in Brazil and Argentina but as you know it resorted to brutality more than one would like.

Tom R

https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2018/12/22/report-huber-and-horowitz-investigations-deep-state-cons-constructed-by-doj/

If Sperry is correct and that Huber hasn’t impaneled any grand juries, then who impaneled the McCabe grand jury?

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/former-fbi-official-mccabe-under-grand-jury-probe

BTW for the sake of discussion I’ll stipulate Sperry and Sundance are correct and that Huber hasn’t done jack squat to bring any of the Obama criminal cabal to justice. He is full Deep State Swamp and trying to protect them.

Why has Trump allowed himself to get manipulated and mislead by people who are supposed to be working for him? Doesn’t this reflect poorly on Trump that internet bloggers have figured out Huber is an enemy of Trump but Trump himself is apparently oblivious to it? Why hasn’t Whitaker done anything to get rid of Huber? Surely Rosenstein was in on the scam from the start. Has Rosenstein been lying to Trump for a while now about the progress of the Horowitz/Huber IG investigation? It just boggles my mind that Trump could be so clueless about this.

MissMarple2


Donald J. Trump
‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump
2m2 minutes ago

Unthinkable devastation from the tsunami disaster in Indonesia. More than two hundred dead and nearly a thousand injured or unaccounted for. We are praying for recovery and healing. America is with you!

Threadkiller

Doesn’t this reflect poorly on Trump that internet bloggers have figured out Huber is an enemy of Trump but Trump himself is apparently oblivious to it?

It reflects poorly on bloggers who suggest that Trump is "oblivious" as a pathway towards a strawman.

Tom R

KK @ 12:04

COIN stands for counter insurgency so by default some type of COIN plan was used in Afghanistan. Different country, different culture, different terrain, etc means that the same exact COIN strategy that worked in Iraq likely won’t work in Afghanistan. You have to come up with a tailored plan unique to that insurgency.

Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki

-- IMO criticizing it now 12+ years after the fact as a failure is revisionism.--

I criticized it at the time and have always questioned the wisdom or ability to make any ME territory a functioning nation-state, though I suspect Iran might have a chance.

--The topic was the criticism of Petraeus COIN doctrine.--

No. The main thrust of the topic was the foolishness of employing COIN in ME muslim countries. Since COIN did not occur in a vaccuum my comments are perfectly on topic and your attempts to limit the topic to what you want it to be are pointlessly, and I'm sorry to say, typically tedious and tendentious.

You are perfectly entitled to make some discussions very narrowly focused or very not, as you see fit.
I am likewise unconstrained, especially when the real topic I'm interested in discussing and was in fact discussing, before you entered the fray and apparently tried to redefine it, is winning wars not wasting our resources on questionable tactics.

Account Deleted

"the challenges of nation building, etc have absolutely nothing to do with Petraeus COIN doctrine. All the problems you listed were created by politicians and diplomats. "

Tom R: perhaps General Petraeus disagrees with your absolute re "COIN doctrine." In his own words from the COIN "bible", some chapter and verse.

"2. Insurgency and its tactics are as old as warfare itself. Joint doctrine defines an insurgency as an organized movement aimed at the overthrow of a constituted government through the use of subversion and armed conflict (JP 1-02).

Counterinsurgency is those political, economic, military, paramilitary, psychological, and civic actions taken by a government to defeat an insurgency (JP 1-02).

1-3. Those definitions are a good starting point, but they do not properly highlight the key paradox that insurgency and counterinsurgency are distinctly different types of operations. However, they are related,though opposing, and are two sides of a phenomenon that has sometimes been called revolutionary war or internal war.

1-4. Political power is the central issue in an insurgency, and each side has this as its aim.

The insurgent attempts to overthrow or subvert an established government or authority; the counterinsurgent uses all of the instruments of national power to support the government in restoring and enforcing the rule of law.

Counterinsurgency thus involves the controlled application of national power in political, information, economic, social, military, and diplomatic fields and disciplines.

Its scale and complexity should never be underestimated by leaders and planners; indeed, the possible scale and complexity must be understood before the beginning of any such operation. "

It seems to me, a total rube, that nation-building was the premise upon which COIN was produced.

In layman's shorthand the pitch sounded like this: "if the new Iraqi nation, minus Saddam, is going to have a chance, it's going to require a surge of 20,000 additional troops deployed to Bagdhad and surrounding areas."

The aftermath of heavy combat ops in Iraq saw continuing violence against civilians by jihadis, which put enormous strain on efforts to self-govern. al Sadr, the Iranians, and others all played a part in that continuing violence--- they also played a part in calling it off.

Was their motives for doing so based on the increased presence of American power in Baghdad?

the jury is still out.

Another Bob

“All the problems you listed were created by politicians and diplomats.”

Anyone who thinks that three- and four-stars don’t consider themselves politicians and diplomats, should ask one.

And Tom, you believe the warfighting doctrine is entirely disconnected from the postwar aims?

Another Bob

Thanks KK.

I was starting small, you just skipped over that nonsense. ;)

Tom R

TK,

Not a strawman at all. From Sundance:

What Sperry discovers is the year-long narrative around John Huber and Michael Horowitz is factually false.

That’s an assertion of fact. I simply stipulated it was correct and then made the observation it reflects poorly on Trump that bloggers like Sperry and Sundance have figured this out but he hasn’t.

Account Deleted

I guess my question, Tom R, was "did COIN function as the doctrinal underpinning for counterinsurgency ops in AFG?"

the answer you gave is consistent with my understanding of specific strategy must vary. but i framed my question poorly.

that's all for me on this.

Account Deleted

A-Bob! Yw. How you feelin today? :D -Kev

Another Bob

I’m choosing to not use neurons on certain topics for few days,

Captain Hate

Oh Baby Jesus.

I just made the mistake of watching nbc's Fake News for Sunday.

First, the entire panel is in agreement on 3 things:
1. Mueller is tightening the noose on Trump
2. Leaving Syria is Trump's Viet Nam, Katrina, and Enron. The Republican Senate will now side with the Democrats on everything.
3. Trump is all alone for Christmas. And he "owns" the shutdown, (even though he's waiting in the White House for the Senate to act).

Then, Dick Durbin comes on and says of course the Democrats are for border security. And Durbin says of course we'll fund the wall...but only if we (the Democrats) "can change the wording" for the Wall funding in the CR.

No shit, Durbin really said that.

So, and here's the good part, after Durbin, the panel fake analyzed what Durbin said. Cuck Hewitt said, right on cue, "Durbin just said the Democrats will fund the wall if they can just change the wording a little; the president should take that deal!!"

To which little Cuck Todd smiles and says, "But he won't. Because it's not really about the wall."

And that's how the ended. Cuck Todd said thanks for watching and the credits rolled.
Posted by: Soothsayer -- Fake Commenter at December 23, 2018 12:05 PM (FAOsA)

Account Deleted

you raised a good question, Tom R: who empaneled the McCabe grand jury?

-----
1. who's testified so far?

2. who's running it?

3. who's in receipt of any findings?

4. no leaks. how to account for that miracle?

5. by protocol, is WH counsel privvy to such grand jury proceedings?

6. does Comey know something about said proceedings that would explain his cocky-assed attitude and behaviors?

Tom R

AB @12:35

I guess I assumed everyone here would interpret “politicians and diplomats” to mean the President/Congress and the State Department.

Another Bob

As usual, a dodge to avoid the point.

Account Deleted

NBC news. yikes. mental flossing STAT!

Threadkiller

The only reason to assert that Trump may by oblivious, Tom, is because dopes that put all their faith in dumb fucks like TBeanzzzz and StealthJeff (does he still go by that name? LoL)
actually believe that they have been on the same page as Trump and the rest of us don't know jackshit.

You have no clue as to what Trump knows or what he is oblivious to. That all of your guessing is wrong doesn't reflect on him.

henry

I assume the McCabe grand jury is empaneled in DC, by local US Attorneys.

Trump is President, not dictator. His powers are constrained by Congress (which people he can get confirmed), and a civil service that cannot be summarily fired.

Trump is a CEO. He delegates and leads. He does not makes hire / fire decisions 4 layers below... department heads do that. It may not be how the military runs, but it is how the private sector functions.

Threadkiller

This is the Stealth Jeff guy, right?

Brian Cates

@drawandstrikeReplying to @drawandstrike

Trump/Sessions/Huber must be ready to start rolling out the evidence of hundreds of millions of foreign bribes factions within Russia/China/Saudi Arabia that were sent to the Clinton Foundation to facilitate the Uranium One sale, among other things.

2:34 PM - 16 Jul 2018

#oblivious

clarice

I always thought the thousands of sealed indictments related to Huber was B.S.

Captain Hate

I’m only halfway through, and I’m probably oversimplifying, but it seems the pivotal event was when the Romans allowed thousands of Goth refugees (fleeing the Huns from the north) to enter by crossing the Danube. Those refugees revolted in the wake of food shortages, were joined by more Goths who spilled in, defeated the Roman forces and killed the eastern emperor Valens. Seems like border control is important.

That certainly didn't help but the Empire was so large and unwieldy that paying mercenaries to keep the peace was a big step in the wrong direction.

Threadkiller

Apparently Trump was to dumb to think like you, Clarice. He used to be fully onboard with the 4D strategy others made up out of thin air, but now he is clueless about other stuff people may be making up out of thin air.

Narciso79

One tries to met you half way, Tom r, but one sees it's impossible. One notes that there was a similar lack of will on the British part with regard to Yemen, almost parallel to vietnam, also malaya is a moslem country no?

Extraneus

I assume the McCabe grand jury is empaneled in DC, by local US Attorneys.

Me too. And they're probably stalling for time.

Tom R

TK,

I give you credit. You are very good at moving the goalposts and trying to change the subject when you don’t want to discuss the point at hand.

You apparently don’t like it when I stipulate you and others are correct and I am wrong. I will say it once again, If Sperry and Sundance are correct about Huber, that IMO reflects very poorly on Trump. That means he allowed himself to get manipulated and mislead by members of the Deep State Swamp working directly for him.

If you want to discuss the issue discuss that point instead of changing the subject and attacking Twitter sleuths that don’t have anything to do with that point.

Tom R

Narciso @ 12:52

I have no clue what you are referring to. What exactly are you trying to meet me halfway on?

Threadkiller

If Sperry and Sundance are correct about Huber, that IMO reflects very poorly on Trump

If it is true then it only reflects poorly after the point where Trump was fully aware of it.

Trump is being lied to constantly and how he deals with it is unknown. 4Ders want to now blame Trump for being "oblivious" because they built their own false pedestal and are having a sad.

I will wait and see on this latest revelation.

MissMarple2

I read both of those Twitter posters but I find they are both too consumed with proving themselves right.

As I said before, I do not know what is going on, and Trump holds his cards close to his vest. He is NOT oblivious nor is he naive.

Tom R., I am very surprised at your position on this after months of telling us we didn't realize how smart Trump is. It seems to me that you are also deflated by not having your theory upheld.

I voted for Trump. Not Mattis, not Huber, not anyone else, including internet experts.

He is smarter than most of these Beltway geniuses. He is far more knowledgeable of how slimey creatures like Schumer operate, having moved in New York business circles since the 70's.

I am sticking with the guy I brought to the dance.

Account Deleted

MM: Does Melania know? :D

MissMarple2

Kev,

HA! You know what I meant.

By the way, anyone know when she and Barron are due back? I read on Twitter that she was going to come back and spend Christmas at the White House.

You know what would be neat? If some people caroled at the gates of the White House on Christmas Eve.

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